FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
		Rob Gardner, Digest Janitor


Contents:
  Blackberry Peach Lager (Drea )
  WEB page for Portland, OR (Tony McCauley)
  Immersion chiller efficiency (Philip Gravel)
  Basement burners & Lambic Digest (blacksab)
  H2O2 for oxygenation (Aidan "Kicked in his conspiracies" Heerdegen)
  info on pubs in orlando fl (taylorts)
  re:Wow! Would you believe... ("Matthew W. Bryson")
  Breckinridge in Buffalo (WattsBrew)
  re: Prickl[y] Pear Beer (Dick Dunn)
  Faux Bottle Caps (sielinr)
  CPBF user error? (Btalk)
  No sparge for 5 gal brew (Michael A. Genito)
  Re: Prickle Pear Beer (Jeff Benjamin)
  Fermentation temp. (kdschida)
  CPBF vs. 20 cent hose ("William D. Knudson")
  exotic/unusual fruit beers (Tom Keith)
  Great reference - not just ("Michael Bonner")
  full-boil kettles, chillers, Chimay yeast (Dave Riedel)
  Specific Gravity (Tom_Williams_at_RAY__REC__ATLANTA)
  buggers/rubbermaid/software/gcbb ("Wallinger, W. A.")
  Burton salts (Rolland Everitt)
  ethching on bottles (Kenneth K Goodrow)
  Protein and pH/Wit/Wheat (A. J. deLange)
  WANT TO START BREWING (Robert James Bruce jr)
  RE MAC SS (TimFields)
  Etched botttles (TimFields)
  Tansy / Vinegar Wash (Mark Roberson)
  Brewer's Resource malt mill review (John Glaser)
  Malt kiln level, other questions (Keith Chamberlin)
  pH meters (blacksab)



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----------------------------------------------------------------------


Date: Mon, 7 Aug 95 23:48:49 EDT
From: faye at plainfield.bypass.com (Drea )
Subject: Blackberry Peach Lager

I've received several requests for this recipe via private e, so I thought 
I'd go ahead and post it to the list for all you extract brewers (both in 
and out of closet). Papazian fans may recognize the skeleton of Rocky 
Racoon's Honey Lager. I have tried to be pretty detailed, for the benefit of 
those who have never brewed w/ fruit.  As always, questions and/or 
suggestions for future attempts are welcome.

For 5 gallons:

4 lbs. Laaglander extra light dried malt extract
2.5 lbs. clover honey
1.5 oz.  Cascade hops (boiling)
 .75 oz. Cascade hops (finishing -- final 4 minutes)
2 lbs. frozen blackberries (in retrospect, I would probably go w/ 2.5 - 3 lbs.)
3 lbs. fresh peaches (peeled, pitted & lightly mashed)
1 pkg. Yeast Lab European Lager yeast

Extracts, honey, and boiling hops to 1.5 gal boiling water; 1 hour boil.
TURN OFF HEAT, allow wort to cool for a minutes (ideally to temps between 
160 &180F), and add fruit, juice and all.
Allow to steep. covered, for about 15 minutes; add finishing hops for final 
few minutes.
Pour, unsparged, into 3 gal. cold water in primary fermenter. 
Pitch yeast when cool; O.G. 1.052
After 3-6 days fermentaion, rack beer into secondary fermenter. (I had big 
problems w/ this step due to chunks of fruit clogging up my siphon, and 
ended up losing like 1/2 a gallon of beer.  Renee suggested  this solution: 
a nylon stocking as a filter -- leave it to a gal, huh?)
Then ya bottle the stuff.  F.G. 1.018 . Pretty good after 12 days, better 
after 3 weeks, delicious after a month.

The biggest flaw of this brew is the lack of clarity -- I suspect this is 
due partly to the pectin of the fruit being "set" by the heat of the wort, 
and of course to the high percetnage of gross floating things that made it 
thru my racking tubing.  If you're attached to crystal-clear beer,  I guess 
you could try additives like Irish moss or PVP -- I don't know too much 
about their use, however. The best thing is the taste (clean, tart-sweet 
fruitiness offset nicely by the Cascade aroma, and v. refreshing on a hot 
summer's day), followed closely by the glorious peachy-purple color.  Decent 
head, too (something I generally seem to have a problem getting).  Enjoy!

Drea
P.S.  Thanks for all the thoughtful responses to my Guys/Exotic Fruit Beer 
post.  I'm working on some individual responses.




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Date: Mon, 7 Aug 1995 22:59:29 -0500 (CDT)
From: afmccaul at rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu (Tony McCauley)
Subject: WEB page for Portland, OR

I'm looking for a WEB page of info on the Portland, Oregon brewing scene.  I
tried the AHA, but it's not ready yet.

I volunteered to research for a friend who's heading there over Labor Day
weekend.  Any help will be appreciated.

Private responses are acceptable.  Send 'em to:

            afmccaul at ilstu.edu

Thanks and hoppy brewing.

            Tony McCauley

 .

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Date: Mon, 7 Aug 95 23:40 CDT
From: pgravel at mcs.com (Philip Gravel)
Subject: Immersion chiller efficiency

===> Doc (DocsBrew at aol.com) asks about chilling wort:

>When I used an immersion chiller, I could drop the temperature from boiling
>to about 70-75F in about 15-20 minutes.  Am I missing something?  What's the
>advantage - or the need - for stirring.

In the winter with tap water at a temperature below 50^F and using a 30 ft,
3/8" immersion chiller, I can cool to 70-75^F in about half the time.

>                                         My rudimentary understanding of
>thermochemistry (that was a lloooooong time ago!!) would say that it doesn't
>matter a bit whether it's stirred or not.  Any thermochemists have an
>explanation that says different??

Yes.  As the wort chills it forms boundary layers around the tubing.
That closest to the tubing is the coolest and that farther away is
warmest.  These boundary layers act as insulation to retard thermal
transport (heat movement).  Mechanical agigation (stirring) has the
effect of reducing the thickness of the boundary layers, thus decreasing
their insulating effect and increasing cooling efficiency.

===> Steve Peters comments about immersion chillers:

>Just for the record I used to just let my immersion chiller sit in the wort
>and chill, but I became too impatient.  I now have a counter-flow chiller
>(yippie!) but when I was immersion chilling I always gently stirred w/o a
>lid of any kind and never had an infection or HSA bite to my beers.  If you
>want to see how effective stirring is during the chill, grip the outgoing
>chill pipe with one hand, note the tempature, then while holding the pipe
>stir the wort slowly. You may have to let go of the chiller to keep from
>burning yourself!

Exactly!

- -- 
Phil
_____________________________________________________________
Philip Gravel   Lisle, Illinois               pgravel at mcs.com

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Date: Tue, 08 Aug 1995 00:26:34 -0500
From: blacksab at siu.edu
Subject: Basement burners & Lambic Digest

Sorry this is so late, I think I sent it wrongly and I'v just gotten around
to some housekeeping.

Terry Terfinko asked about the address for Lambic Digest:
lambic-request@ longs.lance.colostate.edu> --no subject, SUBSCRIPTION in the
body. I just used it about a week ago to re-subscribe after being out of
town. Be appraised that unlike this fine journal, your request will not be
confirmed and it may take a day or two to start recieving the digest.

(:DISCLAIMER: FOR INFORMATION ONLY. I DO NOT RECCOMEND IGNORING MFG's
INSTRUCTIONS:)
Harry asked about placing burners in the basement. The problems are
carbon-monoxide AND using up available oxygen. The first problem can be
solved with a good hood (think about Chinese restaurants--wok burners make
our setups look like bunsen burners) and a carbon monoxide detector; the
second can be solved by feeding the flame directly with outside air. Please
note that these problems become MUCH more accute in a tightly built,
"superinsulated" house with vapor-barrier &c. Hope this is of help.

                        --Harlan Bauer  


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Date: Tue, 8 Aug 95 18:59:30 EST
From: Aidan "Kicked in his conspiracies" Heerdegen <aidan at rschp2.anu.edu.au>
Subject: H2O2 for oxygenation
Full-Name: Aidan "Kicked in his conspiracies" Heerdegen

Kirk R Fleming (flemingk at usa.net) wrote:

| I'm certainly not a chemist, 

Well I *might* be .. but I'll deny it if I have to.

| but Kurt's suggestion that H2O2 is 'just oxygenated water' seems 
| analogous (inversely) to saying since table salt is non-toxic so 
| too must Na and Cl be non-toxic, or like suggesting ozone is just 
| oxygenated oxygen.  His concept may work but I think the reasoning 
| is bad.  No offense intended.

Well I am not sure the first analogy is all that good, but the 
second sounds ok(ish).  

Disclaimer: When people ask me if I am a chemist I generally deny 
it, and I have done my level best to forget as much organic 
chemistry as I could since learning it.  

Hydrogen Peroxide *might* do some fun stuff to the nice tasty 
organic molecules in your beer.  Under these sorts of conditions 
(sugary wort) there is a distinct possibility (via some funky 
oxygen radicals) that it could form some interesting secondary 
alcohols (which in turn are easily oxidised to ketones).  

Just a thought

Aidan [also a Mac User]

- --
e-mail: aidan at rschp2.anu.edu.au,
WWW: http://rschp2.anu.edu.au:8080/aidan

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Date: Tue, 8 Aug 95 08:31:34 EDT
From: taylorts at hweng.syr.ge.com
Subject: info on pubs in orlando fl

Can anyone tell if there are any brew pubs or good places to drink good beer
in Orlando FL..  I will be staying in the university section of town I
guess.   Any infomation would help Thanks...   Todd....

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Date: Tue, 8 Aug 95 8:34:55 EDT
From: "Matthew W. Bryson" <MWBryson at LANMAIL.RMC.COM>
Subject: re:Wow! Would you believe...

   I don't know what else you may have done right, but I invariably get a 
similar result whenever I use Edme dry " berserker" yeast. From start to 
finish of ferment in about 24-48 hours. Amazing.

   Matthew W. Bryson

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Date: Tue, 8 Aug 1995 08:52:35 -0400
From: WattsBrew at aol.com
Subject: Breckinridge in Buffalo

I will be moving to Buffalo soon and have heard that the Breckenridge Brewery
is about to open in the Buffalo area.  Does anyone out there know about when
and where this is happening.

TIA 

Bill Watt-Wattsbrew at aol.com

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Date: 8 Aug 95 07:40:09 MDT (Tue)
From: rcd at raven.eklektix.com (Dick Dunn)
Subject: re: Prickl[y] Pear Beer

Robin Hanson (Rhanson at nmsu.edu) wrote:
> In my garden I have several cactii covered with Prickle Pear fruit. When is 
> the best time to pick the fruit? They are currently red/green and about 1 
> 1/2 inch tall and 1 inch wide. 

They should be fully red, or all but a tiny bit at the base of the fruit,
before picking.  Pick using leather gloves or tongs; don't even think about
touching them bare-handed.

> Charlie Papizan has a recipe for Prickle Pear melomel in one of his books, 
> but does anyone have a recipe for a beer? How about a Prickle Pear Weiss beer?

Prickly pear has a very delicate flavor.  First, this means you need a lot
of fruit--the recipe for prickly-pear melomel published in _Zymurgy_ many
years ago called for 75 large fruit for a 5-gallon batch.  (Robin's fruit
would be described as just above "small".)  Second, it means that you can't
have any other substantial flavors or the prickly pear will get lost in the
background of the taste.  That's why it works with a melomel.  A light
wheat beer *might* work out.
- ---
Dick Dunn    rcd at talisman.com   -or-   raven!rcd    Boulder, Colorado USA
   ...Simpler is better.

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Date: Tue, 8 Aug 1995 10:18:31 -0400
From: sielinr at cris.com
Subject: Faux Bottle Caps

In #1800, Neal Christensen asked:

>does anyone know where to get custom printed bottle
>caps?  Post or email would be appreciated.

Has anyone written to Neal yet about caps? I'm interested in the cost, too,
though I'm sure it'd be prohibitively high. (My wife hit the roof when I
bought my cider keg. Yikes!) As an alternative, I'm writing a Windows
program that allows people to print logos/text to a 1-inch sticker. The
stickers fit great on the caps, and they're cheap, cheap, cheap. 

Any interest in the program (i.e., motivation for me to work faster?)



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Date: Tue, 8 Aug 1995 11:52:21 -0400
From: Btalk at aol.com
Subject: CPBF user error?

Russell M replies to Micah M's comment about inconsistancies in the air level
and CO2 level being most likely the result of user error with:
 "often "user error" says to me that the device 
was not as easy to use as it should be."

Russell, must be you have never used a counterpressure bottle filler.
They are not that easy or convenient to use. 
Good results come with a little experience. I've used my homemade version
(most like the Foxx model) for a couple years with pretty good success for
contest entries or the occasional gift beer.
They are enough of a PITA that a dozen or so bottles is my limit.
Whatever I CP fill is not going into long term storage (more than 2 months),
so I don't care if there is a little bit of air left in the bottle, as long
as the carbonation level is OK. I feel fairly confident that less air remains
in the bottle than with conventional filling methods.

User error? That's when I: forgot to turn off the beer valve and beer squirts
all over when I removed the filler, or when I forgot to turn off the CO2
valve and an entire bottle of weizen got blasted all over me, the walls and
ceiling ;)
It is my own fault for not paying attention.

I prefer the $.20 hose filler for gift or club meeting beers.

Re: lager yeasts and wheat beer. 
Traditionally the lager yeast is introduced when priming for bottling to aid
in conditioning. Not that you really need to use it...

Regards,
Bob Talkiewicz, BInghamton, NY <btalk at aol.com>


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Date: Tue, 8 Aug 1995 12:18:22 -0400
From: genitom at nyslgti.gen.ny.us (Michael A. Genito)
Subject: No sparge for 5 gal brew

I've brewed extract and extract/grain for 5 years, and have just brewed and
bottled my first all grain batch. Since I only have a 16qt brewpot and no
wort chiller, I made a 2.5 gal batch as follows:

3.5 lbs 2 row British Lager Malt
1/2 oz Hallertauer Leaf Hops (boiling)
1/4 oz Hallertauer Leaf Hops (flavor)
1/4 oz Hallertauer Leaf Hops (aroma)
One package European lager yeast (this is dry - not a liquid yeast)
3/4 cup dry malt Gold (Briess)

Put grain into picnic cooler. Add 3.5 qts 168 degree water. Close cooler and
mash (infusion) for 90 min. Test for conversion. Sparge with 2.75 gal 168
degree water. I sparged into a homemade lauter tun consisting of a bottling
bucket with spigot into which a bucket drilled with gazillion holes fit into
 - similar to the "zap tap lauter tun" described in Papazian's Joy of Home
Brewing. The liquid was drained into the 16qt brewpot. Bring to boil. Add
boiling hops. Add flavor hops 30 min into boil. Add aroma hops last 2 min of
boil. Having no chiller, I cooled by placing pot into sink of ice water and
stirring gently. Once cooled (about 20 min), I sparged into fermenter, added
yeast and capped. This fermented well about 4 days. I bottled on fifth day,
using the gold briess dry malt instead of corn sugar. I am anxiously
awaiting the results, testing to be done in about 4 weeks. I use Grolsch
bottles. The beer appears to be clearing well, and in fact appears to be
very pale in color. 

If I did not want to go to the investment of a larger cooler, brewpot and a
wort chiller, is it possible to brew a good 5 gal batch with my current
equipment? One brew supply store told me that their customers have had great
success with mashing 1 qt of 168 water for every pound of grain, and
sparging with 1 qt 168 water for every pound of grain. Boil as you would
with an extract, adding hops as desired, and sparge the boiling liquid into
your fermenter, then adding enough cold (as cold as you can get it) water to
bring the volume to 5.5 gals (1/2 gal would be lost to sediment). Has anyone
else tried this method? I'm willing to experiment, the only loss being the
cost of 8 lbs grain and maybe 2 oz hops, plus my time, which is worthless to
some. In concept, it would appear that perhaps the theory is that all the
maltiness and sugars available for fermentation would have been removed with
this sparge water. I am not sure of this. Also, I wonder if re-sparging with
the same water, in other words additional run throughs, might continue
extracting the good stuff.  Any comments are welcome. Please dont flame this
experimenter.


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Date: Tue, 8 Aug 95 10:33:14 MDT
From: Jeff Benjamin <benji at hpfcbug.fc.hp.com>
Subject: Re: Prickle Pear Beer

> In my garden I have several cactii covered with Prickle Pear fruit. When is
> the best time to pick the fruit? They are currently red/green and about 1
> 1/2 inch tall and 1 inch wide.

Wait until the fruits are completely red and just slightly soft.  They
should be moist, pulpy and sweet when ripe.  Be careful when handling,
though!  Wear heavy gloves and thoroughly remove all the small fuzzy
bumps -- the "fuzz" is tiny spines and is very annoying to get on your
skin.

As for recipes, I would use a lightly-hopped pale ale or wheat beer for
the base, then make like any other fruit beer (I add pureed fruit to the
secondary).  I'd start with one to one-and-a-half pounds of fruit per
gallon of beer.  Why a lighter beer for a base?  To let the fruit flavor
and color show through.  And prickly pear fruit is a color unlike any
other, kind of a fluorescent magenta.  It ought to be pretty impressive.

- --
Jeff Benjamin                      benji at fc.hp.com
Hewlett Packard Co.         Fort Collins, Colorado	
"Think!  It ain't illegal yet."  -- George Clinton

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Date: Tue, 8 Aug 95 9:51:07 PDT
From: kdschida at vines.dsd.litton.com
Subject: Fermentation temp.

Just a quick question for the collective.  I'm interested in brewing a sweet
stout for the first time (I've been an Ale man so far, & I'm trying to expand
my horizons), but don't know if it needs to be fermented below my temp.
capabilities.  The recipe I'm thinking of using ("Colorado Crankcase Stout"
from CatsMeow) suggests Wyeast 1028: British Ale.  Due to it being an
Ale yeast can I go up into the high 60's, or because it's a Stout recipe - do
I need to keep it colder?

TIA,

Kurt Dschida
kdschida at vines.dsd.litton.com or 76132.733 at compuserve.com

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Date: 08 Aug 95 12:43:37 EDT
From: "William D. Knudson" <71764.203 at compuserve.com>
Subject: CPBF vs. 20 cent hose

I agree with Jim Busch.  The 20 cent hose has its place its quick and easy.  But
it does not do the job like CPBF.  The test is as follows:  fill one bottle with
each technique.  Put away for a month or two, then compare.  Voila! There you
have it.  For me if I'm going to consume within a day or so, its the hose.
Otherwise its the CPBF.

By the way, I have been using the Braukunst. (Disclaimer, blah, blah) I don't
find it awkward to use, especially after one important modification.  The
pre-set non-adjustable gas release valve, I found to be annoying.  It is set to
~3 pounds? This limited the choices I had for gas levels on the beer.  I think
that 3# is too low - too much foam.  I replaced this bleeder valve with a brass
spigot from the hardware store: now I'm in control ... well ... as much as I'm
ever going to be when it comes to bottling.

I take the results of the Zymurgy tests with a grain of salt.  I don't recall
how the test was conducted.  Was it multiple operators, throw out the high and
low-take the average or just the same guy?  Familiar or not, a panel test of
several plain ol' sixpack guys would be relevant.  After all how many of us are
professional CPBF operators?

I do wish that Zymurgy could have conducted the Lead content test as part of
thier review. 

Bill

"Ich kann Deutsch besser sprechen, wenn ich etwas Bier getrunken habe"


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Date: Tue, 8 Aug 95 11:49 CDT
From: nr706 at mcs.com (Tom Keith)
Subject: exotic/unusual fruit beers

>Anybody know of any recipes for beer made with exotic/unusual fruits?

I recently made a beer with dried cashew fruit that came out pretty well. I
made a basic pale ale, lightly hopped (extract, even - only a little
CaraPIls, crystal and wheat malt). At the same time I made the base beer, I
got a pound of dried cashew apples, chopped them up and soaked them in just
enough cheap vodka to cover them. I strained and added this vodka/fruit
extract to the secondary just prior to bottling. Fruit comes through, but
it's not overpowering. It took about a month in the bottle for the flavors
to come together.
One data point.

- ---------------------------+-----------------------------------------+
Tom Keith                  |  Advertising, Promotion and New Product |
Thomas Keith & Associates  |  Development for smaller companies and  |
1016 Mulford Street        |  smaller divisions of large companies.  |
Evanston, IL 60202-3317    |   Now! Multimedia and WWW development!  |
voice:  708-328-1282       +-----------------------------------------+
Fax:    708-328-2242       |         check out our Web page          |
e-mail  nr706 at mcs.com      |  http://www.mcs.com/~nr706/home.html    |
- ---------------------------+-----------------------------------------+




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Date: 8 Aug 1995 13:22:09 -0500
From: "Michael Bonner" <michael_bonner at smtpgw.musc.edu>
Subject: Great reference - not just 

Rich Larsen's query regarding the behavior of proteins in an acidic medium
reminded me of a great book I've been meaning to tell you folks about. (Sorry,
Rich, I can't answer your question, but I'm sure Harold can) _On Food and
Cooking_, by Harold McGee, is a wonderful reference on the science of cooking.
It's very readable and extremely interesting. There is a section on alcohol
which, though certainly not as complete as a brewing text, includes
information on malting and mashing of grains, basic brewing, wine making, and
distilling. There is one whole chapter on the biochemistry of food with
specific sections on sugars and proteins and their behavior during cooking,
including the browning reactions. The non-brewing stuff is fascinating as
well, including the best explanations of emulsions and foams I've ever read.
He even goes into speciation and plate tectonics - he's got electron
micrographs of ICE CREAM and MAYONNAISE, for cryin' out loud....

Oops, sorry. I'm starting to rant. Great book, standard disclaimer. Sorry
about the very tangential post, but I think it's worth it.

Michael in Chas., SC, where I have not brewed since June, and I'm jonesing
hard.


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Date: Tue, 08 Aug 1995 11:02:56 -0700 (PDT)
From: Dave Riedel <RIEDEL at ios.bc.ca>
Subject: full-boil kettles, chillers, Chimay yeast

I've been watching rec.crafts.brewing for awhile, but I am a new subscriber
to the HBD... here goes...

I am currently still brewing with extracts but I hope to move on to partial-
mash and full-mash within the next 6 months.  With an eye on this goal, I
would like to begin doing full-boil brews.  However, my casual watch for
8 gallon brew kettles has thus far come up empty.  Miller suggests a 33 quart
enamel-ware kettle as an inexpensive option, but I've not found any of this
size.  Can anyone suggest where to look?  

If I do a full-boil, I will need a chiller (I've been using a 'kettle in 
cold water method + add 2 gallons of cold' method).  I've read the chiller
files from ftp.stanford.edu and made note of the comments here, but I still
find myself torn between the immersion (water through coils) and the counter-
flow approach.  I'd be interested to hear your thoughts on which method might
be preferable over the long term.. ie. through my extract phase and into all
grain. (perhaps E-mail replies would be best, I'll submit a summary of results)

Lastly, I'm going to brew a Trappist-style ale next.  My large bottle of Chimay
sits patiently waiting to be consumed and its yeast revived.  For planning
purposes, I was wondering if anyone could give me an estimate on how long it
will take the yeast to revive?  In other words, how many days before I will be
able to add some sterile wort to build up a larger culture?

Thanks,
Dave Riedel
Victoria, BC

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Date: Tue, 08 Aug 95 14:07:09 EST
From: Tom_Williams_at_RAY__REC__ATLANTA at ccmail.eo.ray.com
Subject: Specific Gravity

     In HBD #1802 Sergio Escorza comments on specific gravity:
     
     > So, Am I missing something here? Water SG must be 1 at any temp
     
     I believe specific gravity is defined as the ratio of the density of a 
     fluid to the density of water at 4C.  The fluid in question could be 
     water, either at 4C or at some other temperature.  If it was water, 
     then the SG would be 1 *only* if the temperature was 4C. At any other 
     temperature, the SG of water would be something other than 1.
     
     While it is true that SG is a ratio, it is still a valid expression of 
     the density of a fluid.  In other words, the density of a fluid stated 
     as specific gravity describes it's density just as accurately as 
     stating a number of lb/cu ft, gm/ml, slugs/cu ft, or whatever, and can 
     be converted by multiplying by the appropriate conversion factor (I 
     like 62.4266 lb/cuft).  Similarly, pressure is frequently expressed in 
     atmospheres, which are just units of 14.696 psia.
     
     My apologies to the SI people.
     
     
     Tom Williams                       Raytheon Engineers & Constructors
     twilliams at ccgate.ueci.com          Norcross, Georgia, USA


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Date: 08 Aug 1995 12:03:12 PDT
From: "Wallinger, W. A." <WAWA at chevron.com>
Subject: buggers/rubbermaid/software/gcbb


From: Wallinger, W. A. (Wade)
To:  OPEN ADDRESSING SERVI-OPENADDR
Subject:  buggers/rubbermaid/software/gcbb
Date: 1995-08-08 09:37
Priority:

- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------


well, i kegged my batch of brown ale with the white stuff floating on top.
the taste was wonderful. absolutely no hint of tartness or sourness to this
batch (yet?). i dissolved 5 cambden tablets in boiling water and added to
the keg. does anyone know whether cambden tablets will actually kill
bacteria (which is what i infer from winemaking info) and if so is it ok to
dissolve the tablets in boiling water, or does the heat denature them?

i saw a 10 gallon rubbermaid cylindrical cooler for $30. model number 1610
as i recall. is this model suitable for mashing and sparging? it is sold out
of the box, so there was no reference to its ability to handle hot liquids.

"R" (with one r) asks about the value of brewing software. i use a very
simple spreadsheet to develop the recipe for a batch (og, ibu, srm), to
convert gravity readings to standard temperature, and to keep my brewing and
tasting notes. i find that this is a handy way to retain my brewing records.

And finally, our brewclub is on the internet. we have posted the newsletter
for the Gulf Coast Brews Brothers at
http://www.he.tdl.com/~murray/gcbb.html. we're located on the mississippi
and alabama gulf coast. we'll keep a calendar of club events online. feel
free to join us if you're in the area.

wawa - brewing contraband in mississippi


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Date: Tue, 8 Aug 1995 18:36:58 -0400
From: af509 at osfn.rhilinet.gov (Rolland Everitt)
Subject: Burton salts



I am hoping to use Burton salts dissolved in distilled water for
brewing my next batch of ale.  I just received the salts, but 
there is no indication of how to mix them.  Does anyone know
what weight of Burton salts to add to a gallon of H2O?


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Date: Tue, 8 Aug 1995 14:28:08 -0500 (CDT)
From: Kenneth K Goodrow <goodrow at orion.etsu.edu>
Subject: ethching on bottles


	I have had the same thing happen to my bottles, but I have an 
inkling that it is tied to bleach-cleaining them.  I  had some cute 
little 12 oz. Guinness bottles, but they have a rough looking mist of 
etching-like appearance on the inside.  I have scrubbed and clean again 
and again, but for some reason the stuff is there to stay.  I'm not sure 
it is from bleach solutions.  Does anyone know for sure?  And if so, how 
much bleach is too much and how long does it take too much to destroy 
equipment?  The white hazy stuff washes from my plastic tubing, but (if 
it is the same residue) doesn't come off the bottles.

Kenn


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Date: Tue, 8 Aug 1995 19:36:44 -0500
From: ajdel at interramp.com (A. J. deLange)
Subject: Protein and pH/Wit/Wheat

In #1802 Rich Larsen asks about protein coagulation and pH:
This can get to be a pretty complex subject but the analogy between
coagulation of protein in the kettle and coagulation of egg white is a
valid one. Proteins are made of amino acids and the net electrical charge
on amino acids is a function of the pH. It is positive when the pH is lower
than the "iso electric point", neutral when the pH equals the iso electric
value and negative when the pH is greater than the iso electric point
value. Things with like charge repel so it seems to make sense that
coagulation would be enhanced if the wort pH were close to the iso electric
point. Another theory has been advanced that the proteins fall into two
groups with different iso electric points so that the best pH is between
these with the result that the proteins in one group are positively charged
and those in the other negatively charged. As dissimilar charges attract
this supposedly leads to enhanced coagulation.

If the electric charge theory is correct then coagulation would be impaired
if the pH gets either too high or too low and indeed Hough, Briggs, Stevens
and Young report (Vol II p 458) that coagulation diminishes below pH 5
which is about the lower limit of where we would like the kettle pH to be.

_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _

Jay Reeves asks about Wyeast 3944 (Belgian White) at temperatures in the
range 60 - 68. I regularly use this strain at 60F and get a very active
ferment (foam fills the 25% headspace in my fermenter and flows over -
messy).

_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _

Jim Dickinson asked about yeast in wheat beer: When Warner says 110 ml
liquid yeast I assume he means 110 ml slurry, not starter. That's quite a
bit. As a wild stab I'm guessing a couple million cells/ml in the beer. The
lager yeast is used only for the "Flaschengaerung" i.e. the bottle
conditioning fermentation. As such the usual considerations of pitching
levels do not apply. Remember that although you have racked off the
sediment at the time of bottling there are still quite a few cells of the
original strain in suspension. Warner even mentions that pitching the
conditioning yeast is probably surperfluous if the beer has not been
filtered or centrifuged.


A.J. deLange   Numquam in dubio, saepe in errore!
ajdel at interramp.com



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Date: Tue,  8 Aug 1995 19:49:57 -0400 (EDT)
From: Robert James Bruce jr <rb5f+ at andrew.cmu.edu>
Subject: WANT TO START BREWING

I have been reading some of the messages on this B-board and am have
become very interested in brewing.  If anyone has the adresses or
numbers of any catalogs or starter books, I would appreciate the info.

Thanks 
Bob

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Date: Tue, 8 Aug 1995 21:18:29 -0400
From: TimFields at aol.com
Subject: RE MAC SS

In #1802, Fredrik states:

>There are a few spreadsheets for MS Excel which works on the mac. 

And, a bit later, adds:

> Excel is quite expensive so if you don't have access to it
>already I wouldn't recommend it (unless you are going to use it for some
>other purpose).

These spreadsheets should be loadable by SS pgms other than Excel (tm or
whatever).  I was able to import one into Clarisworks, and it works pretty
well.  Lost some of the formatting tho, but the calcs are ok.

 -Tim
timf at relay.com

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Date: Tue, 8 Aug 1995 21:14:51 -0400
From: TimFields at aol.com
Subject: Etched botttles

in #1802, states:


>I decided to soak them for a while in a powder cleaner I got from my
>local supplier which I assume is similiar to B-Brite. Anyway, it
>appears that the bottles have been etched by the cleaner - they have
>a rough feel on the outside.

>Should I disgard these bottles ?

I had the same problem. The local brew supply shop I purchased from claimed
that the B-Brite formula had changed. They had reports of more sudsing, and
yellow lemmon-smelling crystals in the powder.  They checked with their
supplier and were told the formula HAD changed, and supplier would NOT
divulge the new recipe. My shop discontinued carrying B-Brite for now. As for
the bottles, I tossed mine into the recycling bin.

 -Tim
timf at relay.com

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Date: Tue, 8 Aug 1995 19:23:15 -0600
From: roberson at alkali.chem.utah.edu (Mark Roberson)
Subject: Tansy / Vinegar Wash


Howdy all,

    A while back someone asked about using tansy in his beer, and was warned
not to do it on account of how the plant is poisonous.  Yesterday I was looking
up one of the absinthe home pages when an interesting fact caught my eye: tansy
contains thujone, which is the principle component of oil of wormwood and is
the active ingredient in real absinthe.  The pharmacology of thujone seems too
be ill-understood, but it is reputed to be a halucinogen at small doses and a
neurotoxin at large doses.  No one seems to know exactly what constitutes
"small" or "large"; anecdotal evidence suggests that 2-4 mg thujone in 1.5 oz
150 proof absinthe produces a high different from that of alcohol alone, and
that chronic use produces disabilities which may or may not be identical with
alcoholism.

    So, why don't you try some and get back to us on how it works ;>

    Also, I was wondering whether anyone had followed through on the
short thread about washing yeast with vinegar.  The pH would be correct
straight from the bottle, but I have been mulling over the fact that
acetic acid crosses cell membranes far more readily than mineral acides
and the larger organic acids which are more typically used in acid washes.
This may well be one of those "true but completely irrelevent" facts which
constantly mess up quasiscientific speculation.

							Hoppy brewing,

							Mark


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Date: Tue, 8 Aug 95 18:47:53 -0700
From: John Glaser <glaser at widlar.ece.arizona.edu>
Subject: Brewer's Resource malt mill review

I have received one response (positive) to my request for info on the Brewer's
Resource malt mill, from Dan Ritter. Thanks, Dan! I was looking at this mill sin
since (whoops, too bad I'm using a crappy Unix mail editor) at $89.50, it is
substantially cheaper than both the JSP adjustable malt mill and the Glatt mill,
and appears to be quite a step up from the Philmill (which I would get, except
that it appears to have no bearings, and our club mill is already quite worn.
I also find the Philmill hard to turn. Anyway, here is Dan's review:

********

I've used the BrewTek Malt Mill for four batches and it seems to work great.  I
like the quality of the crush and the thing is bombproof. Like their ad says,
you can't find an adjustable, two-roll mill for that price.  I used a set of
feeler guages to set the gaps I most commonly use and then permanently marked
the positions on the mill housing.  The mill is still new to me but so far so
good.
   Dan Ritter.

********

After asking for a little more info, I got:

********

The rollers are about 1 1/2" wide and 2 1/2" diameter. The gap adjustment is
made by loosening set screws that hold collars on both sides of the fixed roller
(the other is the"power" roller attached to the handle).  Simply rotate the
collars to achieve the desired gap.  The instructions recommend turning both
collars at the same time and approximately the same amount to avoid binding the
adjustment mechanism.  I use a set of feeler guages and mess around with one
side then the other 'till I get it right.  The ONLY minor inconvenience I've
experienced is when I get the left side of the roller adjusted to say .050, and
then the right side to .050, the left side changes slightly and I have to go
back and fine tune it. I have my favorite settings marked on the housing and I
just recheck the gap now and then. I check the gap to within a .001 tolerance so
it is possible to be very accurate.  The mill weighs a ton (good!) and when
bolted to my workbench is very solid.  The hopper is a plastic bleach bottle
with the botton cut out and holds about 3 lbs. Again, I don't have a lot of
experience with mills (I've used this mill for about 6 batches so far) but I
like the consistency of the grind and the solid feel of the mill.   Feel free to
post this.

   Dan

********

Just thought you might want to see this, in case you are contemplating a mill
purchase.

John Glaser
glaser at widlar.ece.arizona.edu

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Date: Wed, 9 Aug 1995 00:25:35 -0400
From: chamber at sunland.gsfc.nasa.gov (Keith Chamberlin)
Subject: Malt kiln level, other questions

First time poster, long time lurker here.
A couple of easy questiions, I think.  Some of y'all know me
but I've been brewing for about 9 months and doing all grain
for about 5 months, with one blue ribbon under my belt. :)

1) Why are Belgian dark malts higher kilned than English, and I 
guess American malts, although I haven't seen many American Black
or Chocolate malts.  ie Belgian Chocolate seems to be around 425
while M&F Chocolate is around 350L.

2) How is it that some people are able to respond to some posts
before the HBD is published?  Do other people get this in another
format?

3) I don't want to open up another thread about oxygenating but I
saw a new magazine, forget the name, have a question columnist
claim that you can over areate your wort but I have read in HBD
that you can't over areate.  Is there a real definitive reference?


I have some other questions but can't think of them now.

Cheers,
keith

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Date: Wed, 09 Aug 1995 00:28:04 -0500
From: blacksab at siu.edu
Subject: pH meters

I'm in the market for a digital pH meter. Anyone out there have any educated
suggestions? Caveats? Price range: $200.00 or less. I suppose I could go a
little higher if someone can offer me a compelling reason to do so, but I'd
rather not. I'm already a bad enough tool junkie.:-)

I just recieved a catalog/handbook from Omega Engineering ("The pH and
Conductivity Handbook"). Lots of really neat stuff, mostly high end, but
they have a few designed for "field-work". Has anyone dealt with them or
know anything about them?

Basically what I'm looking for is a fairly accurate, fuss-free meter--the pH
equivalent of my Fluke 33 DMM. (No affiliation with Fluke, but their meters
are excellent).

TIA.            
                        -Harlan Bauer


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End of HOMEBREW Digest #1803, 08/09/95