FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
		Rob Gardner, Digest Janitor


Contents:
  Harvesting hops - why dry before freezing? (Derrick Pohl)
  Thermos MiniMash (Nir Navot)
  Pumps and CF question (blacksab)
  brewpubs (egross)
  10 Gallon Gott cooler spigot conversion - THE ANSWER ! (LT Alan D Czeszynski)
  A-B Originals (Tom Wurtz)
  All grain Starters ("Lee A. Menegoni")
  RE Irish moss (Tim_Fields_at_Relay__Tech__Vienna)
  Yeast tornado (Tim_Fields_at_Relay__Tech__Vienna)
  RE: ....extract brew coloring (HBD 1833) (aflinsch)
  "The Carbonator"/RIMS question (Tim Short)
  Light color extract (Chris Cooper)
  Hops Transplant (Jeff Bosh)
  Red Nectar / Coffee (Keith Frank)
  Lager Malt Mash Schedules (Rob Reed)
  Boiling bottle caps, repitching yeast (Jack Stafford)
  Watchout!  Long Beer Marketing Rant ("Fleming, Kirk R., Capt")
  2.5 Gallons of sweet blueberry scum in my percolator? (Russell Mast)
  SEEING RED SUMMARY (rbarnes)
  RE: dextrin malt and chewable beer (MClarke950)
  RE: Repitching & Mailorder/St Pats: (MClarke950)
  SS Keg Insulators (JJBrewer)
  Cider Question (ShoeJ)
  Open fermentation insanity ("Richard Scotty")
  extract brew coloring (joep)



******************************************************************
* POLICY NOTE: Due to the incredible volume of bouncing mail,
* I am going to have to start removing addresses from the list
* that cause ongoing problems. In particular, if your mailbox
* is full or your account over quota, and this results in bounced
* mail, your address will be removed from the list after a few days.
* 
* If you use a 'vacation' program, please be sure that it only
* sends a automated reply to homebrew-request *once*. If I get
* more than one, then I'll delete your address from the list.
******************************************************************
 
#################################################################
#
# YET ANOTHER NEW FEDERAL REGULATION: if you are UNSUBSCRIBING from the
# digest, please make sure you send your request to the same service
# provider that you sent your subscription request!!! I am now receiving
# many unsubscribe requests that do not match any address on my mailing
# list, and effective immediately I will be silently deleting such
# requests.
#
#################################################################
NOTE NEW HOMEBREW ADDRESS hpfcmgw!

Send articles for __publication_only__ to homebrew at hpfcmgw.fc.hp.com
  (Articles are published in the order they are received.)
Send UNSUBSCRIBE and all other requests, ie, address change, etc.,
  to homebrew-request@ hpfcmgw.fc.hp.com, BUT PLEASE NOTE that if
  you subscribed via the BITNET listserver (BEER-L at UA1VM.UA.EDU),
  then you MUST unsubscribe the same way! 
If your account is being deleted, please be courteous and unsubscribe first.
Please don't send me requests for back issues - you will be silently ignored.
For "Cat's Meow" information, send mail to lutzen at alpha.rollanet.org
ARCHIVES:
  An archive of previous issues of this digest, as well as other beer
  related information can be accessed via anonymous ftp at
  ftp.stanford.edu.  Use ftp to log in as anonymous and give your full
  e-mail address as the password, look under the directory
  /pub/clubs/homebrew/beer directory.  AFS users can find it under
  /afs/ir.stanford.edu/ftp/pub/clubs/homebrew/beer.  If you do not have
  ftp capability you may access the files via e-mail using the ftpmail
  service at gatekeeper.dec.com.  For information about this service,
  send an e-mail message to ftpmail at gatekeeper.dec.com with the word
  "help" (without the quotes) in the body of the message.


----------------------------------------------------------------------


Date: Mon, 18 Sep 1995 01:03:59 -0700
From: pohl at unixg.ubc.ca (Derrick Pohl)
Subject: Harvesting hops - why dry before freezing?

One o' those subject-line-sez-it-all posts.

I've been out picking hops - some I grew, some grow wild nearby beside the
railroad tracks (not indigenous, probably strayed from an old brewery or
garden or seeds falling out of train cars full of hops early in the
century).

And I'm drying them but wondering - why bother if I'm just going to bundle
them up good & airtight and freeze them anyway?  Why not freeze them fresh?
Wouldn't that preserve even more flavour?

Derrick Pohl <pohl at unixg.ubc.ca>
Vancouver, B.C., Canada



Return to table of contents


Date: Mon, 18 Sep 1995 11:43:15 +0200
From: diagen at netvision.net.il (Nir Navot)
Subject: Thermos MiniMash

In 1834 Pat asked (regarding my Thermos MiniMasher(tm)):
>How long do you boil this small amount of wort after
>conversion?  I've generally boiled starter DME for at least 5 minutes but
>have not used grain yet in making starters.

If you want to use a hopped wort as starter, you'll have to boil 30-60
minutes (depending on what IBU you're shooting for and the amount of hops
you use) for a non-hopped starter, a 10 min. boil will sanitize your wort.
Just add water before the boil to bring the SG to around 1.020. You can
pour the boiled cooled wort into a clean/sterile 1.5 lit. PET bottle, close
the cap, shake well and pitch.
Nir



Return to table of contents


Date: Mon, 18 Sep 1995 06:00:11 -0500
From: blacksab at siu.edu
Subject: Pumps and CF question


I'v been putting the finishing touches on what is to become my new brewery
(thanks for all the help!), and have had to accept the fact that I need a
pump (the ceilings are just too low to avoid it). My eyes start to glaze
over when I look thru the Grainger catalog, and all I can find that looks
like it will work is about $125. Am I missing something (it's happened
before), or is this what you all are paying for a servicable pump? I'd like
it to be portable so I can attach "quick-connects" to it and use it to
transfer sparge water from the boiler to the hot-liquor tank, and also to
pump hot wort thru a CF wort-chiller from the boiler (placed on the cold
side of the wort-chiller, I'll avoid HSA, no?), and, if I'm not asking for
too much, to ultimately be used in a RIMS. The model I'm looking at is on
p.2461 of the Grainger 1995 General Catalog (no. 386), stock number:2P039.
Any recomendations? Warnings? TIA.

Also, what about using the pump from a Cornelius carbonator? I only ask
because I already have one, but am not sure of the temperature rating.
Anyone had any experience with these?

There was a thread a while back about cleaning the crap from wort chillers
in general and CF in particular. Why not fill the CF chiller with vinegar
and soak overnight, that seems a lot easier than trying to snake anything
thru 40 feet of spaghetti-thin tubing. Also, now that I'm thinking about it,
why not run some sulfuric acid drain-cleaner thru it and rinse profusely.
Maybe then some vinegar? Or lye instead of acid? I realize that these
measures are not food-grade, but wouldn't repeated dilution render that
moot? I simply don't know, and maybe one of you does and can warn me against
it.  Thanks again,

                                        --Harlan Bauer     


Return to table of contents


Date: Mon, 18 Sep 1995 09:04:16 -0400 (EDT)
From: egross at emory.edu
Subject: brewpubs

I am interested in finding out the laws governing brewpubs in the various 
states.I was under the impression that Georgia's brewpub law was a bit 
harsh because at least 50% of the sales had to food items,but I was 
"informed" that all states had that particular provision by a brewpub 
aficionado.I would appreciate the facts. TIA,lee

Return to table of contents


Date: Mon, 18 Sep 1995 10:15:45 -0400 (EDT)
From: LT Alan D Czeszynski <czesz at nadn.navy.mil>
Subject: 10 Gallon Gott cooler spigot conversion - THE ANSWER !

To all of those homebrewers with a 10 gallon Gott Mash/Lauter tun - 

I spent the weekend searching for a good answer to the spigot replacement 
problem.  I plan on using the Phil's Phalse bottom with the cooler, and 
spent Friday at the hardware warehouse piecing together valves, nipples, 
adapters, etc to meet my needs.  The device was getting pretty ugly, so I 
decided to just go with a rubber stopper with flexible tubing through 
it.  

So on Saturday I went to my local homebrew store and picked out a 
stopper, and started buying some other stuff (who can spend only $0.65 at 
a homebrew store?), when the owner brought out a bin full of "bungs".  
One look and I knew I had found the Holy Grail.  These bungs are designed 
for the German Fass/Frisch 5 liter mini-kegs so you can transport/store 
beer in the keg without pressurizing it.  It is really a bung within a 
bung, because when you are ready to tap the keg, you remove a hard 
plastic insert from the bung and insert the tap/charging device.

Well it just so happens that this bung fits into the hole left by 
removing the spigot from the 10 gallon Gott perfectly (see graphics)!!
 
           | | <-----  inner cooler wall
           |_|
          _   _<-------  bevel that inner wall of cooler fits into
         | |_| |_        (just like the original gasket/O-ring)
inside   |        \  <------  soft rubber bung
cooler   |          \
         |            \
         |______________\   ____________|
                           |            | <-------- hard plastic insert
          ______________   |____________|
         |              /               |
         |            /
         |          /
         |  _   _ /
         |_| |_|
            _
           | |
           | |

3/8 inch OD flexible tubing fits snugly into the gap left when the 
plastic insert is removed.  The tubing is connected to the barbed elbow 
coming out of the false bottom, and I put a plastic ball valve in-line 
external to the cooler to control sparge flow rates.

I op-tested the integrity of the system over the weekend when I soaked 
the cooler in ~9 gallons of warm water with baking soda (to get rid of 
the plastic smell).  Result - not a drop leaked by!

IMHO, this is by far the easiest, cleanest solution to the cooler 
conversion problem.  I hope this info helps.

Alan
 
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
LT Alan Czeszynski, USN                | czesz at greatlakes.nadn.navy.mil
                                       |
  Department of Naval Architecture,    |
  Ocean and Marine Engineering         | voice: 410-293-6436
                                       |   fax: 410-293-2219
U. S. Naval Academy   Annapolis,  MD   |   DSN: 281-6436



Return to table of contents


Date: Mon, 18 Sep 1995 09:05:35 -0600
From: Tom Wurtz <tom.wurtz at Xilinx.COM>
Subject: A-B Originals


Last night I shuffled through the mail and discovered a mailing from
none other than my good friends at Anheuser-Busch. I'm subscribed
to Beers Across America, so I'm pretty sure they got my name from
there. Anyway, it's a nice 8 page glossy insert with pretty
pictures of circa turn of the century beer labels and the slogan
"The original hand-crafted beers of Adolphus Busch" on the cover.
Within the brochure it describes how AB is brewing several new beers
using the original pre-prohibition recipes. The new "old" brands
are Faust Golden Lager, Black & Tan Porter, Muenchener Munich style
Amber, Bock Beer, and Union Man's Favorite. The implication from
the text is that these beers, unlike post-prohibition beers will
not use adjuncts. Pardon my skepticism.

The insert was accompanied by an invitation to call an 800 number
to set up an appointment to go and try three of the beers (the first
three named above). So I went ahead and called the number, curious
about the event. They asked me all kinds of questions to verify
that I was going to be their target market for these new beers.
Then they asked me to come to their event during the week Oct 2-6.
Great. Bummer. I'm on my honeymoon in Oregon that week. So instead
of tasting AB's latest attempt to grab my attention, I'll be
sampling the real stuff at Bridgeport, Full Sail, etc. Awww!

Anyway, the point is that AB is definitely jumping into the micro-
market full tilt now. What do I think? Well, I'll admit that if
AB wanted to, they could generate great beers for a cheaper price
with incredible consistency. On the other hand they'll probably throw
a micro price on a beer that's about the same as Henry's.

If anybody else gets this thing and decides to go, please fill us in
on the particulars.

If anybody wants the full text of the brochure, email me. If I get
enough requests I'll send it in to the digest.

t

Return to table of contents


Date: Mon, 18 Sep 95 11:10:31 EDT
From: "Lee A. Menegoni" <lmenegoni at nectech.com>
Subject: All grain Starters

I produce starters from the trub at the end of a brewing session.   I pour 
all the crap in the bottom of my brew kettle into a gallon jug.  I top this 
off with cold water and let it sit over night to settle.  Next morning I 
have a jug with liquid on top and pariculate matter on the bottom.  I rack 
off the liquid and preasure cook it for storgae.  Since I pour the liquid 
off my starter before pitching I don't worry about the color of the starter 
impacting the final color of my 6 gallon batches.  I fone does this with 
every batch you have an endless supply of starter wort.  The gravity of 
this starter is in the 30s since most of my brews are about 50Sg points.

Lee Menegoni	
NEC Technologies
1414 Mass. Ave / MS 2110
Boxborough MA 01719-2298
v 508-635-6282
f 508-264-8787
LMenegoni at NECTech.com

Return to table of contents


Date: Mon, 18 Sep 95 11:32:05 EST
From: Tim_Fields_at_Relay__Tech__Vienna at relay.com
Subject: RE Irish moss

In #1834, TRoat at aol.com writes re Rehydrating Irish Moss:

>A couple months back I asked whether Irish Moss needs to be rehydrated 
>prior
>to use.  The general concensus was NO!  However, in the July\August issue 
>of
>Brewing Techniques (pg 22) the following statement was made:
>"When using Irish Moss, it is important to rehydrate the material before
>adding it to the kettle.  For a 10 gallon batch, combine 1 tbsp Irish Moss
>with water and let stand overnight or for several hours.  Add it at 
>knockout
>or within 15 minutes of knockout."

>Is this news to the entire collective since so many replied to my previous
>post that they had never heard of rehydrating IM?
I don't recall your post, but I did post a similar question some time back. 
The resounding reply was YES, ONE MUST REHYDRATE IRISH MOSS for best 
effect.  As for how long it needs to be rehydrated, answers ranged from 15 
mins to a couple of days.  Average seemed to be "rehydrate it when you 
start brewing, and add it with 15 minutes left in the boil".  This equates 
to an hr or 2 I suppose.  The overnight or several hrs mentioned in BT is, 
on average, longer than the avg of responses I got - but given the source 
I'd certainly consider it a good data point :-)

My replies suggested anywhere from 1 to 2 tsp for a 5 gal batch.  All 
reported better results from rehydrating than from using it dry.

> Also, what is the "Knockout?" 
when the heat is turned off at the end of the boil.

 -Tim
timf at relay.com


Return to table of contents


Date: Mon, 18 Sep 95 12:10:44 EST
From: Tim_Fields_at_Relay__Tech__Vienna at relay.com
Subject: Yeast tornado

Sort of a combo observation and question for the collective this morning.  
I've got a 5 gal batch of amber ale in glass primary.  Before the 
fermentation began to subside somewhat, it looked like a tornado blizzard 
in there.  Chunks and flecks of "stuff" swirling around all over.  Seemed 
to be an overall bottom-to-top movement but there was *definitely* allot 
more than simple rising going on in there!  Kraeusen rose a tad more than 
an inch.  2 dry yeasts: nottingham and windsor.  Pitched the slurry from a 
3 pt starter.  I assume I'm looking mostly at yeast as I siphoned the hot 
wort off the hot break.

This is only my second batch using glass primary.  Previously used plastic 
so I couldn't see any of the primary fermentation before.  (That's why I 
went to glass).   Is this "normal" fermentation activity for these yeasts?

Not worried at all - just curious.

 -Tim
timf at relay.com
"Beers me"


Return to table of contents


Date: Mon, 18 Sep 1995 11:53:00 -0500
From: aflinsch at njebmail.attmail.com
Subject: RE: ....extract brew coloring (HBD 1833)



in hdb1833 GeepMaley asks about lighter colors from extract brews

>no effect. Any input into how to make lighter colored brews with LME? My 
last
>batch was 5 gallons with 5 lbs light extract and 1.5 lbs honey. Color?
>Yup.....amber.
I used to have this same problem when making extract brews, it appears to be 
excessive
carmalization of the liquid malt. I was getting around it by using the 
following procedure.

1 - boil the water & bittering hops in 1/2 of the water for
    whatever time is specified in the recipe
    -- DO NOT add the malt extract yet
2 - add the malt extracts, and finishing hops, boil for whatever
    time is specified for finishing hops.
3 - increase wort volume to 5 gallons by adding cold water
4 - areate & pitch yeast.

The brews produced arent perfect, but you do get arounf the malt darkening
problem.

                                  Alex.

Return to table of contents


Date: Mon, 18 Sep 1995 10:19:20 -0700
From: Tim Short <timshort at quiknet.com>
Subject: "The Carbonator"/RIMS question

 stevep at pcx.ncd.com (Steve Peters) wrote:
<SNIP> can I fill the bottle with beer, carbonate it, put
on the old cap, and use the Carbonator on another bottle of beer?

I have been using a carbonator for about 2 months now. I use it to force
carbonate
from my corny kegs which are uncarbonated and stored as cool as possible
without a fridge. I have two, one for the bottle I am drinking, and one for
the bottle
I will be drinking. I have found oxidation (yech, wet cardboard) to be a
problem if you
take a twist off cap on after putting CO2 in, and than let the beer sit
overnight.

To avoid oxidation, one squishes the air out the release top, and than
re-inflates the bottle
with CO2, and no (well less) oxidation.

Now my question:
I am going to build a 3 SS keg system with a friend as a project.. My
friend, the engineer, wants to build a RIMS because it is more challenging
from a technical standpoint. (He also has access to a lot of the equipment
at a fairly low cost. Read free.) He is very competent so I am not
concerned (too much) about flubbing it up, but I am concerned after reading
all the FTP material available about making good consistent beer with a
RIMS system.

I am interested in the thoughts (opinions) of others.

Thanks,
Tim



Return to table of contents


Date: Thu, 19 Oct 1995 13:52:39 -0400
From: Chris Cooper <ccooper at a2607cc.msr.hp.com>
Subject: Light color extract 

Hi all,  In HBD #1833 Geep Maley asked about making a lighter colored
brew from extracts.  I just bottled a pale ale made from Alexanders
Sun Country Pale Ale (LME in a can) that is very light in color
(it is darker than a budmilcoors but so is most city water).  The
brew had a pound of cara-pils for some malt character and was 
dry-hopped and while still a little green shows good promise.

Just a side note, I've also made a couple batches of wheat beer using
Alexanders's Sun Country Wheat extract and Wyeast 3068 with very
consistent and flavorable results. (Standard disclaimer about 
affiliations with the above mentioned manufacturers)



Chris Cooper , Commerce Michigan    --> Pine Haven Brewery <--
ccooper at a2607.cc.msr.hp.com         --> aka. Deb's Kitchen <--
 


Return to table of contents


Date: Mon, 18 Sep 1995 14:00:54 -0400
From: jbosh at cais.cais.com (Jeff Bosh)
Subject: Hops Transplant

I need to transplant two hops plants and I wonder what would be the best
time of the year to do this?  A guess would tell me later this fall when the
the foliage dies back.

Jeff Bosh
jbosh at cais.com


Return to table of contents


Date: Mon, 18 Sep 1995 13:29:18 -0500
From: keithfrank at dow.com (Keith Frank)
Subject: Red Nectar / Coffee

***** From:  Bruce DeBolt *****

Red Nectar

I've only had the pleasure of tasting this excellent beer a couple of times.  
Also requested clones last year but didn't get any replies with actual 
experience.  My very qualitative recommendations would be lots of hops, 
heavy on the crystal, a high temperature mash (to increase body) and/or use 
of carpils malt or dextrin (not dextrose) powder.  This will tend to make a 
sweeter beer (balance with bittering hops) and should help with the 
thick/chewy character.

One anecdotal piece of information, a friend recently brewed a highly 
hopped American Pale Ale using 3 lbs of CaraVienne crystal (with domestic 
2-row, Cascade/Liberty hops 60/30/10 min. additions plus dry hop, Wyeast 
1056 yeast) and when I tasted it my first thought was "Red Nectar".  Haven't 
tried to duplicate it, let us know how yours turns out.  

Coffee

Never brewed with it but if you are concerned about oils and possibly 
affecting head retention use the drip method with a paper filter.  To 
compare just make coffee using a French press (no filter) vs. drip style 
with filter.  The French press coffee will have visible oil droplets on the 
surface.  Last year someone posted about paper filters removing most of the 
oil from coffee.

Bruce DeBolt
Lake Jackson, TX

Return to table of contents


Date: Mon, 18 Sep 1995 14:38:05 -0400 (CDT)
From: Rob Reed <rhreed at icdc.delcoelect.com>
Subject: Lager Malt Mash Schedules


 CHARLIE SCANDRETT <merino at ozemail.com.au> writes:

>  In step infusion mashing when you add quantities of boiling water, the 
> temperature rise is quick, allowing precise rests to favour fermentability or 
> body. The protein rest can also be skipped as per George Fix's suggested 
> 40-60-70 mash for lagers.

My recollection of George Fix's post on yield was that he favored a 40/60/70C
mash schedule for pale ale malts and either a 40/50/60/70C or 50/60/70C mash 
schedule for moderately modified lager malts.  One of the conclusions from 
these experiments was that the 40C rest was optional from a yield perspective 
when mashing moderately modified lager malt; however, a 40C rest in a mash 
consisting of highly modified malt (pale ale) produced a significant increase
in extract yield.

Rob Reed

Return to table of contents


Date: Mon, 18 Sep 95 12:47:38 PDT
From: stafford at alcor.hac.com (Jack Stafford)
Subject: Boiling bottle caps, repitching yeast

  One time I over-boiled my bottle caps and the little
plastic seals shrank and separated from the metal caps.
Not a distaster, but made me contemplate other sanitation
methods that do not require heat.
  Can bottle cap sanitation be accomplished with a soaking
in a mild bleach and water solution at room temps?

  I've been reading about the practice of creating yeast
starters and re-pitching.  My first experience with this
technique is going well.  I pitched the Wyeast British Ale
yeast from the foil packet to 5 gal. of a Bass Ale clone.
It took about 16 hours for fermentation to become obvious.
  Two weeks later I took the yeast dregs from the Bass Ale
clone's secondary and pitched them into a new batch of a Nut
Brown Ale clone.  Fermentation in the new batch was quite
strong after 12 hours.  From now on I'm going to use a starter
to build up the yeast population from the Wyeast foil packs.
  How many times can one repitch the dregs from the secondary
into a new batch?  I hear that yeast mutations will be present
if this is done too many times.  How many is too many?

TIA,
Jack  stafford at alcor.hac.com
Costa Mesa, CA.

Return to table of contents


Date: Mon, 18 Sep 95 14:43:00 MST
From: "Fleming, Kirk R., Capt" <FLEMINGKR at afmcfafb.fafb.af.mil>
Subject: Watchout!  Long Beer Marketing Rant


Steve Peters noted that "it isn't important for these beers to
taste any different, it's the label that counts".  My feeling
is this is true of any product in any market.  Knowing no more
about a beer than what's in an ad, pub, or magazine, etc., one
is induced to try based on a feeling/image conjured up by the
advertiser.  A good label (meaning one *you* find attractive) is
enough to get the potential customer to become a buying customer,
at least once.  If the product itself is suitably within
expectations, you may then have a repeat customer.  I tend not to
buy beers having trendy, cornball names, for example, even tho
the product may be superior (to my taste) to others not using
'cartoon' labeling.

There is no way in the world anyone will convince me that Boston
Brewing Co and Pete's are so much more successful than a 100 or
so other brewers because of their products alone.  Basic business
skills far outstrip brewing skills in determining the success of
these example brewerys, IMO.

Put your homebrew in bottles with attractive, commercial/professional
looking labels.  I'd bet the contents would be far more well received
(by nearly *any* drinker regardless of sophistication) if well-packaged, 
rather than in a non-labeled (clearly home-brewed)
bottle.

I'd also bet if you pulled the label off and recapped several bottles
of commercial beer (go for classics such as PU and Chimay) and offered
them to friends as home-brewed products, the responses would generally
be much less positive than comments on the same beer in the labeled
bottles.  Image may not influence professional tasters or very
well disciplined and experienced judges, but I believe it influences
everyone else.  [I've mixed in the factor of reputation/brand
recognition here, and in so doing have changed/invalidated the
experiment a bit, but I've made my point.]

In regard to building a solid brewpub business Spousal Unit often asks
"What would make your brewpub's beer any different than the other 100
brewpubs in Colorado?".  My answer is: the beers themselves would have
subtle, inherent differences due to formulae which would make little
or no difference in the business' success. The *real* differentiators
would be image, atmosphere and service.  Comments from professionals
who actually know what they're talking about are of course solicited!
Please don't attempt to confuse me with facts, though.  :-)

KRF Colorado Springs / flemingk at usa.net

Return to table of contents


Date: Mon, 18 Sep 1995 16:31:00 -0500
From: Russell Mast <rmast at fnbc.com>
Subject: 2.5 Gallons of sweet blueberry scum in my percolator?


> From: Mike Morgan <morgan at aavid.com>
> Subject: SWEET BLUEBERRY ALE

Lactose.  

> From: krkoupa at ccmail2.srv.PacBell.COM
> Subject: Mash Tun Percolator?
> 
> ... a good explanation why ... percolator ... isn't used in the mash tun 
> ...  Must be the temperature

I think so.

> From: GeepMaley at aol.com
> Subject: Brewpubs in Cleveland/Scum skimming/extract brew coloring
> 
> Regarding scum skimming, are you guys doing all grains or extracts? the
> reason I ask is that I brew extract and the only "scum" I tend to see is the
> cap of hop particles that forms between stirs.

When I was extract only, I would get a fair bit of foam in my boils.  Not as
much as all-grain, but more than you describe.  Maybe you're not boiling 
vigorously enough?

> From: "Mike Whitehorne" <Mike.Whitehorne at qmgate.trw.com>
> Subject: REQ:  Small Batch Recipes
>
> recipes, say for about 2.5 gallons?

Just use half what you would for a 5 gallon batch.  Your results won't be
exactly the same as the recipes, but pretty close.

 -R

Return to table of contents


Date: Mon, 18 Sep 95 15:48:23 pst
From: rbarnes at sdccd.cc.ca.us
Subject: SEEING RED SUMMARY

     Thanks to all who replied to my earlier question about 'Red' beers. In 
     addition to replies posted to the HBD, I received private responses 
     with useful info. on Red Ales. In summary, the addition of approx. 1/4 
     lb. roasted barley or 1/4 lb. Belgian Special-B malt seemed to be the 
     common denominator in the formulation of a Red Ale. The addition of 
     Crystal malt (1 lb), 40 or 50L, was recommended as well, and may 
     contribute some 'redness' even without the addition of roasted barley 
     or Special-B. 
     
     Randy Barnes

Return to table of contents


Date: Mon, 18 Sep 1995 20:06:12 -0400
From: MClarke950 at aol.com
Subject: RE: dextrin malt and chewable beer 

Eric Palmer (palmer at San-Jose.ate.slb.com) wrote:
>What I can contribute is a strong recommendation for dextrin malt to
>create body, or "full mouth feel".
 
    Eric didn't mention if the beers he brewed were extract or all 
grain, I don't feel dextrin malt needs to be in an all grain beer.  
The way we run the mash should be enough to make a beer "chewy".  If 
your beers are turning out too dry, try mashing at a higher temp (155F).
    Partial-mash, use a higher ratio of grain-to-extract.  If that
doesn't do it, use the higher mash temp on the partial mash.
    Extracts sometimes do suffer from body-less beer.  Using dextrin
powder would help or you could go to a partial mash setup.

    How does everyone else feel/think about this?  I found out that
a local brewery was using this stuff and I actually thought it was
cheating! They said it was to add more body to the beer.  I feel this
can be achieved by other techniques.

ps I don't mean to pick on Eric, just kinda a hot button and I
could be way off-base here.  If so, please set me straight.   
  
Cheers,
Mike

Mike Clarke
Seattle, WA. USA
eMail: MClarke950 at aol.com


Return to table of contents


Date: Mon, 18 Sep 1995 20:06:21 -0400
From: MClarke950 at aol.com
Subject: RE: Repitching & Mailorder/St Pats: 

- ----------------------------------
>Dan McConnell writes:
>> I urge everyone to think like a probrewer, not a homebrewer.
>> REPITCH!  That's what the professional brewers do, amateurs 
>> should too. I'll get to that in a minute.

>Doug Flagg replies:
>Very good advise, BUT......

>I'm finishing up on a Pale Ale and I want to brew a Pilsner next.
>What do I do??  Use my Ale yeast dregs to brew the Pilsner.  Not!
<snip>
>I brew a different brew every time so I guess I'll just have to 
>start a new yeast every time also...

Dan was sugguesting a way to:
1) Get the most of your yeast dollar.
2) Get the desired pitching rates.  

    Mixing yeasts and styles wasn't his intention.  *Of course* you 
would use a different (lager) yeast, but it doesn't have to be "new".
You can "wash" the yeast sediment and save it for a later brew or you 
can pen it up at the yeast ranch until you are ready for it (see the 
yeast FAQ for more info.)  
- ----------------------------------
Mailorder/St Pats:
    I know this will make me flame-bait, but how about some prior planning 
on the buyer's part?   If it's important for you to brew on a certain date,
give yourself plenty of time to receive it.  It's not a big deal for me to
walk to the homebrew shop the day before brewing and pick everything up I 
need, but if you have to mail order then you had better be prepared for 
un-forseen delays.  
    Yeah, I *don't like* the bit about them giving you different mailing 
dates and when something goes wrong at the suppliers end I don't want to
hear reasons or excuses.  I want to hear an apology and I want the company
to make an attempt to make things right by me.  
    I don't think people that are in *any* business long-term will try to
deceive you or rip you off (but YMMV).  Standard disclaimers, not even 
a customer ...
- ----------------------------------

Cheers,
Mike

Mike Clarke
Seattle, WA. USA
eMail: MClarke950 at aol.com    


Return to table of contents


Date: Mon, 18 Sep 1995 20:26:12 -0400
From: JJBrewer at aol.com
Subject: SS Keg Insulators

HBD Crowd - 

I am in the process of building a RIMS system out of 15.5 gallon kegs. 
I plan on using King Cooker, Cajun Cooker etc. etc. to heat the 
sparge water and to do the boil. My previous experience with these
kegs and burners is that the kegs lose a lot of heat from the sides. I 
want to insulate them these two vessels using some kind of 
non-flamable material to maintain the temperature. Has anyone done
something like this?

I'm considering a wooden jacket with treated ends to reduce fire hazards,
but this seems to require possible extensive fabrication time. 

All suggestions are welcome. I will sumarize any results.

TIA

Jamey Johns (JJBrewer at aol.com)

Return to table of contents


Date: Mon, 18 Sep 1995 22:37:03 -0400
From: ShoeJ at aol.com
Subject: Cider Question

Over the weekend I was in Door County, WI and picked up a couple of gallons
of cherry and apple cider.  Unfortunately, I didnt check for preservatives.
 It had been treated with sodium benzoate.

My questions, are the wild yeast still active?

Will the preservative kill any yeast I add to the cider?

Anyone ever make a "hard" cherry cider?

Thanks in advance



Return to table of contents


Date: 18 Sep 1995 20:54:46 -0700
From: "Richard Scotty" <richard_scotty at msmgate.mrg.uswest.com>
Subject: Open fermentation insanity

Ok - It may just be that I've sampled a bit too much beer tonight, but I've
been mulling over open fermentors and wondering where I could lay my hands on
a good sized stainless steel tub type container (resturant supply house, flea
market, etc) when it struck me.

How about using a deep stainless steel sink?  These are available from a
number of sources and can be found in scrap yards, etc cheaply - in fact,
they aren't even that expensive brand new.  The deep variety could accomodate
5 gallons per side.  I would have to construct an inexpensive wooden frame to
support it and I would envision making some kind of cover for each side to
keep airborne junk out until fermentation kicked in.  I could also make use
of the drain plumbing to remove some of the trub.

So I ask the great collective - am I nuts?  Have I had too much to drink? 
All of the above?

Seriously though, I realize that these sinks aren't made of 304 stainless,
but is that an issue in this case?  Do any metalurgists out there know what
alloy these are made of?  WMBBR?

I realize that trub removal might be tough because of the relatively flat
geometry of the vessels.  Perhaps I'll give this a spin this winter when my
brewing activities are at their peak.  Is anyone out there already tried
doing this?

Return to table of contents


Date: Tue, 19 Sep 95 00:57:00 -0400
From: joep at informix.com (joep)
Subject: extract brew coloring

>>>>> GeepMaley at aol.com writes:

<snip>

 GeepMaley> On to my last request. As mentioned above, I am an extract
 GeepMaley> brewer and usually do some pre-boil specialty steeping. All
 GeepMaley> of my brews, including those without specialty grains, tend
 GeepMaley> to come out amber at the lightest. I boild between 45 and 60
 GeepMaley> minutes depending on my mood and what I am making and it
 GeepMaley> seems to have no effect. Any input into how to make lighter
 GeepMaley> colored brews with LME? My last batch was 5 gallons with 5
 GeepMaley> lbs light extract and 1.5 lbs honey. Color?  Yup.....amber.

My results with extracts are similar to yours.  You can try boiling for
less time (I know - hop utilization...) and try boiling more wort.  If
you're starting with 1.5 gallons of water, consider 2.5 gallons.  This
will help the brew come out lighter.

 GeepMaley> Thanks,

 GeepMaley> Geep Plano, TX

joe.
+-----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
| Joe Pearl, Sr. Sales Engineer, Informix Software, Inc.                      |
| 8675 Hidden River Parkway, Tampa, FL, 33637 813-615-0616                    |
| Opinions expressed are solely my own.                                       |
+-----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
| The basis of optimism is sheer terror. - Oscar Wilde (1854-1900)            |
+-----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

Return to table of contents

End of HOMEBREW Digest #1835, 09/19/95