---

	FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
		Rob Gardner, Digest Janitor


Contents:
  clear beer, aeration again ("Tracy Aquilla")
  Re: Pickles & vinegar (Tom Messenger)
  re:Hose storage (maxwell)
  Attenmunster/ New fermenter (RANDY ERICKSON)
  Pickle Buckets as Fermenters (Paul Sovcik)
  vinegar contamination (Mark Taratoot)
  Storage temperature variations query ("Olson, Greger J - CI/911-2")
  Discussion of Roller Steels ("Palmer.John")
  New Wyeast strains (Chris Cooper)
  Re: Ice to cool wort, Trub (Robert Bush)
  Clear Brew/Hot Break/Pickle buckets (Brian Pickerill)
  BJCP Exam Study Guide + Sample Questions (WALZENBREW)
  Irish Ale (Mike Taber)
  Lower Than Expected S.G. (Tel 202-622-0079                    )
  neat way to clean siphon tubes (Michael Lausin)
  Malt Extract Recipe for Oatmeal Stout ("Michael A. Rice")
  Mini-Keg Dilemma (Brent Youngren)
  Re:re:Step Mash Question (Fredrik Stahl)
  RE: Is this beer good? (Douglas Kerfoot)
  Homebrew Digest #1956 (February 08, 1996) -Reply (JOHN WEATHERLY)
  Crystal at mashout? (Bob McCowan)
  On Ice Wort Cooling, Yeast Culture and Re-use (Rosenzweig,Steve)
  Re: Mexican/European Lagers ("James Hojel")
  q (Shiva Vakili)
  10th Annual Bidal Competition in Kenosha, WI (OBCTS)
  Thanks for the Great Tip! ("ADAIR, BENTON E.")



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----------------------------------------------------------------------


Date: Wed, 7 Feb 96 11:05:59 CST
From: "Tracy Aquilla" <aquilla at salus.med.uvm.edu>
Subject: clear beer, aeration again

In Digest 1955:
Marty Tippin <martyt at sky.net> wrote:
>I just bottled my latest batch last night and was astonished at how clear it
>was - usually, it takes several weeks in the bottle for my batches to get as
>clear as this one was.  
[snip]
>*My* analysis is that the manifold helped strain out a lot of the hot break
>material that normally goes into the fermenter and the absence of that hot
>break is what helped make everything more clear.

I think you've got it; less trub = faster clearing.

>The counterflow chiller should have (and, in fact, may have) produced more cold
>break material than the immersion chiller, but since I've been dumping the
>whole thing - hot and cold break - into the fermenter, I never knew the
>difference.

The CF chiller should only produce more cold break if you chill the wort to
a lower temperature than you did with your immersion chiller (which is often
the case when using CF chillers; who wants to wait 45 minutes or more for
their immersion chiller to do the job?). The final temperature reached is
really what counts; the rate of cooling generally isn't significant.  


Then merino at cynergy.com.au (Charlie Scandrett) wrote:
>Jonathon Mohn posted
>JM>On the other side of the coin, there are some who believe that aeration /
>JM>oxygenation is not required at all, especially if you pitch adequate
>levels JM>of yeast.  They argue that aeration results in longer lag times,
>as the yeast JM>metabolize the sugars aerobically.
>
>Tracy Aquilla replies
>TA>I agree with the first part of this statement, but not the last sentence.
>TA>Aeration makes the yeast grow faster and thus decreases lag time.
>
>I have found clear references in "Brewing" by Lewis and Young that aeration
>is very necessary for the assimilation of *saturated* fatty acids. From
>other references in Malting and Brewing Science I wouldn't want anything but
>traces of those left in the beer.

While this may be true, saturated FAs aren't really a big concern in the
nutrient department. Yeast can easily synthesize the required saturated FAs
and they don't need oxygen to do it. UNsaturated FAs and sterols, OTOH, must
either be provided in the medium or synthesized using free oxygen. IF the
yeast has been handled properly and at least some of the cold break is left
in the fermenter, I believe wort aeration is generally unnecessary (for
relatively low gravity beers). In fact, as you've pointed out, you really
don't want saturated FAs in the finished beer, so it's preferable to
minimize their presence in wort. This is one of the main reasons trub
removal is considered to be so important. It can decrease beer stability by
contributing to staling reactions.

>I seem also to keep reading passing references to the negative effects of
>*too fast* a ferment, caused by a combination of excess O2, excess Amino
>acids, and excess lipids? Noone explains how but it apparently produces off
>flavours at the expense of alcohol?

Extremely rapid fermentation rates are undesirable because this leads to
excessive acetaldehyde and acid excretion and thus a depression of the wort
pH (TOO low), as well as fusel and ester formation. I suppose if one had
excess AAs and excess O2 or lipids, things could get out of hand, but a high
temperature is usually the main culprit responsible. 

>Jonathon also posts,
>JM>I've recently read that worts with little trub require considerable
>JM>aeration in order to saturate with the correct amounts of oxygen.  In fact,
>JM>I've read that it is not possible to appropriately oxygenate such wort
>JM>through aeration, and that pure oxygen should be introduced.
>
>I'd like the reference for that, as I'm investigating lipids.

Me too!

>yeast, like us, are basically lazy and use unsaturated lipids first. If they
>can't assimilate enough unsaturated fatty acids and sterols, they sythesise
>them with O2 from saturated ones. Cold break is another source of lipids (in
>colloidal suspension), 

I agree here, but...

without it *in a wort with low soluble lipids* (very
>important) yeast needs to use lots of O2 to assimilate saturated lipids to
                  ^^^^^^^^                   ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>synthesise unsaturated ones and sterols for cell building.

 ...are you sure about this part? Yeast can synthesize saturated fatty acids
in an anaerobic environment, as long as energy (sugar) is available. If the
saturated FAs are available in the wort, the yeast will utilize them (just
as occurs with O2), but they generally aren't required in the medium. [Or am
I missing something here?]

    Tracy in Vermont
    aquilla at salus.med.uvm.edu


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Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 08:23:56 -0800
From: Tom Messenger <kmesseng at slonet.org>
Subject: Re: Pickles & vinegar

J. Matthew Saunders replied about using (or not using) pickle buckets:
>1)  They have a strong flavour that lingers in the bucket and can create
>off flavours in your beer.
>
>2)  (This may well be my own paranoia.....) You want to keep wort (beer)
>and must (wine) away from vinegar.  Vinegar is basically the same thing as
>wine (or beer I suppose, though I've never heard of beer vinegar) but the
>beasties that convert it are different.  Those beasties will happily turn a
>lovely batch of Bitter or Stout into vinegar rather than yummy home-brew.
>
>I'm curious to hear from others in the collective as to whether my second
>suspicion is valid.  Can a pail that held vinegar be trusted?


First, I'm sure you HAVE heard of "beer" vinegar... but you probably saw it
labeled under the mysterious name of "malt" vinegar - they do that just to
throw you off.

Second, if you have any ability to sanitize your fermenting equipment, then
you have nothing to fear from vinegar - as well as the organism that creates
vinegar.  

- --------------------------------
Tom Messenger,
Los Osos, California, USA 
kmesseng at slonet.org
- --------------------------------


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Date: Wed, 07 Feb 96 12:05:02 cdt
From: maxwell at prisminfo.com
Subject: re:Hose storage

In HBD 1955 (and a fine year I might add) Ronald LaBorde wrote:


>For a long time I stored my racking hose after shaking it dry.  But
>it was really not dry.  No matter what I did, there were always drops of
>water still there.  I thought they would evaporate but days would go by 
>and the water was still there. So I must admit I was --- er, oh well, --
>WORRIED.  Sorry, but the truth hurts.  I thought that if days went by that
>some infection would somehow appear.

Well, I always recommend that you shake your hose before putting it away.  
If you want to be extra careful, you can take some tissue and dab the end 
to wick away the moisture.  Just don't let anyone else see you, it could be 
rather embarrasing.  Both methods should work nicely.  Don't forget to wash 
your hands, as sanitation is important.  If your hose is wet for several 
days, I suppose infection is possible.  Frankly, I'd be more worried about 
what people would say when they saw the wet spots.

>Then one day I was playing arround getting ready to rack, 

OUCH!  This sounds painful!  But whatever you're into is your own 
business...

I filled
>the hose and was going to connect to the racking cane and then proceed to
>rack the beer from the carboy. At that moment I noticed that I could 
>connect the racking cane and rotate the whole thing and add more water and
>completely fill the cane and hose up fully.  Then I could connect each end
>of the cane to an end of the hose.


Racking cane?  It sounds like one of those things they used on Michael Fay 
in Singapore!  You're one sick dude!  

Hey Ron!  Where yat?
;)

Sorry everyone, I couldn't resist...

Maxwell


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Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 10:35:38 -0800
From: RANDY ERICKSON <RANDYE at mid.org>
Subject:  Attenmunster/ New fermenter


Ronald asked about Attenmunster.  I too love this beer.  The little
description my beer store has on the shelf says it is a Dortmunder
(Export) style.  Helles and Dortmunder are very close in OG and IBU with
Dortmunder ranging a little higher (1.048 to 1.056, 23-29) versus Helles
(1.044 to 1.052, 18-25).

Attenmunster has a grain taste that probably requires at least a partial
mash.  This beer is very pale, you'd probably want to go with pils or light
Vienna malt. I make a pretty decent Dortmunder (IMHO) with 7 lbs of
Alexanders and one pound of Light Munich mashed at 150 degrees for 1
hour.

I do a full volume boil to reduce caramelization and use a two oz pack of
Hallertau pellets 4.6 AA (1.25 oz boil, .75 oz end-of boil) and Wyeast
Bohemian.  Yum, yum!

This is BTW, the beer with the reddish-brown label.  Dave Miller's new
book talks about another beer from this brewery (a pilsner?) with a
green label which I've never tried.  Hope this helps and enjoy.  

*************

I recently came into possession of a 13.2 gallon keg which I wanted to
use to ferment 10 gallon batches.  The retaining ring was easy enough to
remove after a little prying with a screwdriver and the tap assembly lifted
right out.  For a number of years this keg had contained a small amount
of a substance totally incompatible with brewing, Moosehead!

I hauled the keg off to the local coin-op car wash and used US $2.50
worth of quarters and got it pretty well cleaned up inside and out (no
nasty sour beer aroma).  I then did several TSP and hot water soaks and
rinsed well.

I'm a little leery about using this though, because when I tilt the keg and
shine a light inside and have a look the remaining water drops slide
_very_ slowly down the inclined slope, more like the viscosity of oil,
rather than water.  I noticed this before all my cleaning and after.  Does
anyone know what might explain this?  Does anyone know what I'm
talking about?  

Thanks -- Randy
Randy Erickson
Modesto Irrigation District
Modesto, California
********************************************************************
And there I go jumping before the gunshot has gone off .....
Slap me with a splintered ruler ....  -- Alanis Morissette


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Date:         Wed, 07 Feb 96 12:33:57 CST
From: Paul Sovcik <U18183 at UICVM.CC.UIC.EDU>
Subject:      Pickle Buckets as Fermenters

  Being a dedicated plastic bucket primary guy (I too hate using blow off),
I can tell you that the main problem with pickle buckets is not the smell, it i
is the fact that they only hold five gallons, and unless you are brewing
batches smaller than this, they can cause quite a mess as a primary
fermenter.

  Speaking of this - heres a tip for all you new brewers:  before you use your
big 7+ gallon plastic primary fermenter, measure 5 gallons and mark the line
permanently (I use hot pink nail polish).  I have seen a couple new brewers
assume that the lower lip on the bucket is 5 gallons, where in reality, on mine
 it turns out to be closer to 6 gallons.

 -Paul
Paul Sovcik, Western Springs, IL            PJS at uic.edu

" If Bob Dole is elected, how is he going to raise his hand to be sworn in?"

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Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 10:56:10 -0800 (PST)
From: Mark Taratoot <taratoot at PEAK.ORG>
Subject: vinegar contamination


Matthew Saunders writes:

> 2)  (This may well be my own paranoia.....) You want to keep wort (beer)
> and must (wine) away from vinegar.  Vinegar is basically the same thing as
> wine (or beer I suppose, though I've never heard of beer vinegar) but the
> beasties that convert it are different.  
>
> I'm curious to hear from others in the collective as to whether my second
> suspicion is valid.  Can a pail that held vinegar be trusted?


Most of the vinegar used in the food industry is distilled vinegar. White
vinegar is distilled vinegar (acetic acid) that is diluted with water to a
concentration 5%.  You can not get an infection from distilled vinegar. 

Raw apple cider vinegar is another story.  Much cider vinegar is actually
cider flavored vinegar, and as such does not have any live (dormant)
organisms.  There are health benefits associated with using cider vinegar,
but you must use raw cider vinegar.  This CAN contaminate beer.  But, as
far as contamination from pickle buckets, I don't think there is any
worry. 

As far as "Beer Vinegar," have you ever eaten at a fish 'n' chips place? 
Most often they have bottles of Malt Vinegar on the tables to sprinkle on
your fried fish.  There you have it! 

- --
Mark Taratoot            "...though my problems are meaningless,
taratoot at peak.org         that don't make them go away."     
                                                         -Neil Young



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Date: Wed, 07 Feb 96 11:09:00 PST
From: "Olson, Greger J - CI/911-2" <gjolson at bpa.gov>
Subject: Storage temperature variations query


A question for the collective:

Besides increased chill haze, what are the effects of temperature 
fluctuations
on homebrew?  My beer fridge is in an unheated garage and with the recent
weather bouncing between 13F and 60F my beer is cycling between a near 
freeze
and the normal 45F (minimum setting).  Thanks

 -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Greg Olson   -- Grouchy Bear Brewery  --  Lake Oswego, Oregon
 -----------------------------------------------------------------------------

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Date: 7 Feb 1996 09:28:41 U
From: "Palmer.John" <palmer at ssdgwy.mdc.com>
Subject: Discussion of Roller Steels

Hi Group,
I guess I havent been paying close attention lately because I didnt notice this
thread until today, when Mike Cullen commented on John Parker's quote of Randy
Kay's email. Here is the original quote:

>In answer to your query, the rollers are made of steel tubing (the wall 
>thickness is approx. 1/8"). After the rollers are knurled (patterned), they 
>are nickel plated. This is not to be confused with chrome plating which is 
>not nearly as hard.
>The reason our 'first' ad and the review in Zymurgy stated that they were 
>stainless is because at the time they were.
>However, we found that using stainless was complete overkill. Even if you 
>were to run crystalized malt through the mill for years you would never 
>wear the new rollers out so why increase cost for nothing.
>The nickel plated steel is sufficiently hard because first off, the knurling 
>process is done at high speed which gets the steel (which is high in nickel 
>content) very hot, then of course the nickel plating ensures a clean, 
>extremely hard coating. The plating also ensures the rollers will never 
>rust or become pitted from oxidization.

Mike is generally correct about the difference in plating hardnesses; Chrome
plating types are generally harder than Nickel platings. The caveat though is
that the coatings are very thin, around .001 - .005 inch, so the hardness of
the plating is very dependent on the hardness of the base metal. Using a
Vickers hardness indenter to measure the hardness of the coatings alone, the
hardness of Hard Chromium Plating (vis a vis Decorative Chromium Plating) is
about 1000 HV. Dec Chrome plating is very thin, .00001 inch, and has no effect
on overall hardness to speak of.

There are two main types of Nickel plating: General Purpose (Electrodeposited)
and Electroless. The hardness of GP varies depending on the type of plating
bath but varies between 100 - 600 HV. Nominally half of the Chrome value. GP
Nickel has very good corrosion resistance.

Electroless nickel is a very popular coating and can actually be heat treated
to improve its hardness, though at the expense of its corrosion resistance and
ductility. As deposited, it has a nominal hardness of 500 HV and heat treated
(400C for an hour) can have a hardness of 1200 HV. (Bear in mind though that
this temperature would cause some degree of tempering (softening) of some low
alloy carbon steels.) Coating thickness for corrosion protection are .003 -
 .005 inch. Electroless nickel coatings can be more ductile and have better
adhesion than GP Nickel. 

In conclusion, I would say Electroless Nickel plating would be the most
economical coating for knurled rollers, and would have very good corrosion and
wear resistance. Hard Chromium plating would be superior, but it would be more
expensive and overkill for the job.

Regarding knurling and nickel content of steel:
Knurling could be accomplished either of two ways: rolling or machining. The
effect of the knurling process on the properties of the steel will depend on
the steel, and there are three main classes of steel that would be used for
rollers: Plain Carbon, Low Alloy Carbon, and Stainless. The Plain Carbon type
would have only trace amounts of nickel, the Low Alloy types (ex. 4130, 4340)
contain about
zero or 1.5% depending on alloy, and the Stainless 400 series types contain
about 2% if at all, most dont have any. (The austenitic, 300 series that we
brewers love so well has 8%, but these soft steels are unsuitable for rollers.)
And, Nickel is not a steel hardener anyway, I should have stated that first.
Its function in steel is to increase corrosion resistance.

So, If the knurls are machined in using a high speed tool such that the steel
gets hot (ie. poor machining practice), then the rapid heat and cooling would
cause some degree of hardening of the surface material. But I would not like
this result as it tends to be brittle and nonuniform. Case hardening of all
these steels may be accomplished by Heat Treating with a torch or in an oven
and quenching in water. (This statement is very general, its more detailed than
this.) 
Knurling by rolling between dies would work-harden the steel to a degree and
would provide residual compressive stresses which would contribute to hardness.
But the overall hardness of the steel roller would depend on its bulk heat
treatment. 

To summarize, Chrome is harder than Nickel, Nickel is a good choice for
corrosion resistance for grain mill rollers, grain mill roller steel will not
contain appreciable amounts of nickel, and knurling via machining should not
significantly increase the case hardness of the roller because it would mean
that the machining is being done wrong. (I will revise my opinion if someone
can show me data otherwise.)

Okay, wake up everybody, and return to your normal HBD.
John J. Palmer - Metallurgist for MDA-SSD M&P 
johnj at primenet.com  Huntington Beach, California
Palmer House Brewery and Smithy - www.primenet.com/~johnj/


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Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 14:57:09 -0500
From: Chris Cooper <ccooper at a2607cc.msr.hp.com>
Subject: New Wyeast strains

Hello all, on a trip to my local home brew supplier today I got a list of the
new Wyeast strains and thought it might be of interest to the collective.  This
information came directly from Wyeast Laboratories (kind of a press release
to their retailers). So here goes:

#1335 British Ale Yeast-II  --  apparent attenuation; 73-76%
      Typical of british ale fermentation profile with good flocculating
      and malty flavor characteristics, crisp finish, clean, fairly dry,
      high floculation. 

#1318 London Ale Yeast III  --  apparent attenuation; 71-75%
      From traditional London brewery with great malt and hop profile.
      True top cropping strain, fruity, very light, soft balanced palate,
      finishes slightly sweet, high flocculation. 

#1272 American Ale Yeast II  --  apparent attenuation; 72-76%
      Fruitier and more flocculant than 1056, slightly nutty, soft, clean,
      slightly tart finish, high flocculation. 

#1275 Thames Valley Ale Yeast  --  apparent attenuation; 72-76%
      Produces classic british bitters, rich complex flavor profile,
      clean, light malt character, low fruitiness, low esters,
      well balanced, medium flocculation. 

#1388 Belgian Stron Ale Yeast  --  apparent attenuation; 73-77%
      Robust flavor yeast with moderate to high alcohol tolerance.
      Fruity nose and palate, dry, tart finish, low flocculation.

#1742 Swedish Porter Yeast  --  apparent attenuation; 69-73%
      Stark beer nordic style yeast of unknown origin, floral nose malty
      finish, medium flocculation. 

#1762 Belgian Abbey Yeast II  --  apparent attenuation; 73-77%
      High gravity yeast with distinct solventy flavor profile from ethanol
      production, slightly fruity with dry finish, medium flocculation. 
      
#2247 Danish Lager Yeast II  --  apparent attenuation; 73-77%
      Clean dry flavor profile often used in aggressively hopped pilsner,
      clean, very mild flavor slight sulpher production, dry finish,
      low flocculation. 
      
#2272 North American Lager Yeast  --  apparent attenuation; 70-76%
      Traditional culture of North American Lagers and light pilsners,
      malty finish, high flocculation. 
      
#3333 German Wheat Yeast  --  apparent attenuation; 70-76%
      Subtle flavor profile for wheat yeast with sharp tart crispness,
      fruity, shery like palate, high flocculation. 
      
#3787 Trappist High Gravity  --  apparent attenuation;75-80%
      Robust top cropping yeast with phenolic character.
      Alcohol tolerance to 12% ideal for Biere de Garde, ferments dry
      with rich ester profile and malty palate, medium flocculation. 
      
#3942 Belgian Wheat Beer  --  apparent attenuation; 72-76%
      Estery low phenol producing yeast from small belgian brewery,
      apple and plum like nose with dry finish, medium flocculation. 
      
I would be interestd in collecting and compiling feedback from
the collective concerning your experiences with these new strains
and any addittional info.  (I.E. comercial origins, temperature
tollerance, etc.)     


Chris Cooper , Commerce Michigan    --> Pine Haven Brewery <--
ccooper at a2607.cc.msr.hp.com         --> aka. Deb's Kitchen <--
 


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Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 21:25:10 +0100
From: bush at shbf.se (Robert Bush)
Subject: Re: Ice to cool wort, Trub

Date: 06 Feb 96 17:56:35 EST
In HBD #1955 Tracy Thomason <102472.1404 at compuserve.com> wrote:


>I've heard & read that you should not pour your hot wort over ice to cool it
>before pitching the yeast, but can anyone tell me WHY?  People have told
>me >that "you just don't" but that's not the answer I'm looking for.
>I understand there can be problems with sterilization, but what if the
>water >was boiled before it was frozen?

The only reasons I can think of why not are: Pouring hot wort over ice will
of course melt the ice and the water dilutes the wort; this will increase
the volume and lower the gravity but also encourage the protein (cold
break) to remain in solution and thereby give you the opposite effect of
what you were after.

>I also read that the the faster you cool off the wort, the clearer the
>beer >will be due to the cold break effect.

True, and also the *colder* you can get the wort, the clearer the beer will be.

Robert Bush

- ----------------------------------
Kit Anderson <kit at maine.com> asked:

>I normally drain the chilled wort off the hot AND cold break. Does the hot
>break go back into solution as the wort chills?

You mean if you poured the hot break back into the wort again? If you
separate them (wort and trub) I don't see how it could go back into
solution.

===============================================================
=                        WASSAIL!                             =
=    Robert Bush                   E-mail:  bush at shbf.se      =
=    Eskilstuna, SWEDEN                                       =
===============================================================



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Date-Warning: Date header was inserted by BSUVC.bsu.edu
From: 00bkpickeril at bsuvc.bsu.edu (Brian Pickerill)
Subject: Clear Brew/Hot Break/Pickle buckets

>From: Marty Tippin <martyt at sky.net>
>
>I just bottled my latest batch last night and was astonished at how clear it
>was - usually, it takes several weeks in the bottle for my batches to get as
>clear as this one was.

Ohmigod!  Home brewed Zima!!!  :)

{snip}
>What do the rest of you think?  Did I do something right here or just get
>lucky??

Sounds like good practice to me, removing all the hot break material.  It
should TASTE better, too.

>...Baloney.  I've been using several buckets for the
>past year that were originally pickle containers and never was able to
>notice any pickle aroma or flavor in my beer.

I've had no trouble using pickle buckets, either.  I used one for a
bottling bucket, the other for a zapap after soaking with bleach and
letting them sit in the sun for a week or so last summer.  The pickle smell
was still very noticeable at that time, but it's finally completely gone.
Moral:  these are great, you just have to work with them a while, and be
patient.

- --Brian

PS.  I never had a problem cleaning carboys after using them for primaries
with blow off.  I've only done it a few times, but it rinsed right out with
dish washing detergent and warm water.  No problem.



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Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 18:17:29 -0500
From: WALZENBREW at aol.com
Subject: BJCP Exam Study Guide + Sample Questions

For those of you who are interested, I wrote a 115 page study guide for the
BJCP Exam that's now available free on the TRASH home page.  I wrote this
guide back in 1990 when I first took the BJCP exam, and I continue to use it
as a study aid when I've held pre-test study sessions for our members who
want to prepare for the Exam.

I've also included a four-page list of sample BJCP exam questions.  This
quesiton list appeared on the Net in 1994 and also in numerous homebrew club
newsletters.  I've organized them by type and included them in the same file
as the Study Guide.  Questions are a great way of studying because you can
practice handwriting answers in the same fashion as you'll be required to do
at the Exam.

Feel free to copy and distribute the Guide and the question list.  All I ask
is that the title page be included and that no money changes hands (i.e., you
can give it away but you can't sell it.)

The TRASH home page is at:  http://members.gnn.com/rcolaizzi/trash.htm

The Guide is in WordPerfect 5.1 format and has been zipped, so you'll need a
PKUNZIP program or similar to decompress it.  It'll take about two minutes to
download at 14.4K.

Please address any comments, corrections, or suggestions to me at
WALZENBREW at aol.com.

Cheers,
Greg Walz

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Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 16:46:36 -0800
From: Mike_Taber at broder.com (Mike Taber)
Subject: Irish Ale

     I received so much GOOD help with my last request for recipe help that 
     I thought I would post another request.
     
     I'm looking for a good Irish Ale. So far I'm not happy with the few 
     I've found.
     
     Since I really don't have the space to do all grain recipes, I'd like 
     to find a partial mash recipe.
     
     Thanks in advance for any help.
     
     
       - Mike Taber

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Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 20:44:03 -0500
From: Erik Larson <Erik.Larson at MS01.DO.treas.sprint.com> (Tel 202-622-0079 )
Subject: Lower Than Expected S.G.

Fellow HBDers!

On Tuesday evening 2/6/96, I started brewing a Belgian strong  
ale.  I formulated the recipe using SUDS for Windows but ended up 
with a starting gravity of 1.072 at 50 degrees F., instead of 
something near the SUDS-calculated 1.095.  WHY??

I have experienced similar shortfalls before -- but not 
consistently.  A summary of both the SUDS recipe and brewing 
method follows; if anyone would be so kind as to offer some 
constructive criticism or analysis, I would really appreciate it.

- -----------------
Starting Gravity: 1.095
Ending Gravity:   1.024
Alcohol Content:  9.2%
Recipe Makes:     5.0 gallons
Total Grain:     12.56 lb.
Color (srm):     32.4
Efficiency:      75%
Hop IBUs:        40.7

Malts/Sugars:
3.75 lb. Light Malt Extract Syrup (Coopers)
3.75 lb. Amber Malt Extract Syrup (Coopers)
3.00 lb. Light Dry Malt Extract  (M&F) 
1.00 lb. Dark Brown Sugar (Domino)
1.00 lb. Crystal Malt 40L
1.00 oz. Black Patent Malt

Hops:
2.00 oz. Hallertauer Hers. 3.5%  60 min.  (plugs)
0.50 oz. Hallertauer Hers. 3.5%  30 min.  (plugs)
1.50 oz. Saaz              3.1%  30 min.  (plugs)
1.00 oz. Saaz              3.1%  15 min.  (pellets)
- -----------------

Brewing Method Summary:
Steep specialty malts, in grain bag, in 1 gal. of 155 degree F. 
water for 1/2 hour.  Add this wort with other malts/sugars to 5.5 
gallons of additional water in a 15 gal aluminum pot.  Bring all 
to a vigorous boil for 1 hour over a 250,000 BTU propane cooker.  
Add hops as scheduled.  Add 1 tsp. Irish moss and immerse copper 
coil chiller (to sterilize) for last 10 minutes of boil.  Remove 
from heat, cover pot and force cool, reaching 45 degrees F. in 
1/2 hour.

I was able to only rack off 4 gallons of chilled wort from the 
trub and hops, and I didn't leave a lot of wasted wort in the 
brew kettle (my boil-off rate appears rather tremendous).  To 
these four gallons of wort I added 1 quart (+/-) of a 1.040 yeast 
starter and 3 quarts (+/-) of distilled water, topping everything 
off at 5 gallons with a S.G. of 1.072  at  50 degrees F.


Thanks for all your help.
Erik Larson (erik.larson at treas.sprint.com)

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Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 20:51:20 -0700 (MST)
From: mel0083 at mcdata.com (Michael Lausin)
Subject: neat way to clean siphon tubes

Don't ya just hate the the junk that collects on the insides of your siphon
tubes and racking canes?

Go down to your local music store and get a cleaning brush for either a 
trumpet or trombone. The brushes are attached at each end of a 4-5 foot piece 
of stainless steel spring type material and work great. I got one for about $6.

Take a couple of your different sized tubes with you so you know what size of
brush to get. They'll be really tight when their dry, but move alot easier
with water.

Michael Lausin    http://www.mcdata.com/~mel0083/brewing.html
michael at mcdata.com

The opinions expressed are mine, cause I'm the one pushin' the keys...

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Date: 07 Feb 96 20:51:17 EST
From: "Michael A. Rice" <73652.123 at compuserve.com>
Subject: Malt Extract Recipe for Oatmeal Stout

I have been unsuccessful in finding a malt extract recipe for an Oatmeal Stout.
I am a beginner to brewing (4 batches) and am still learning the ropes.  I have
found several mash extract recipes for an Oatmeal Stout ,however, I do not have
the experience (or courage yet) to attempt a mash recipe.

Does anyone out there have a good malt extract recipe that I can try?  I am
currently waiting to bottle a batch of TNCJHB's "Toad Spit Stout", in which I
added 2 cups of quick oats with the other grains at the beginning.  I am curious
as to this addition.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

"Relaxing, Not Worrying and Enjoying a Homebrew in Virginia",
Mike Rice
73652.123 at compuserve.com


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Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 18:17:57 -0800
From: youngren at scn.org (Brent Youngren)
Subject: Mini-Keg Dilemma

My friends and I have just recently begun using 5 lt. mini kegs for our 
beer.  We like the idea of the kegs, but in practice are encountering 
some problems.  Yesterday morning at 4:00 a.m. my friends keg exploded in 
his hallway, was propelled to the ceiling where it knocked down a chunk of 
plaster.  Now my keg is beginning to make noises and I am afraid that it 
will soon suffer a similar fate.  We kegged on Saturday and it is now 
Wednesday, so there were only a few days of carbonating before the explosion.
We would welcome any suggestions on using these kegs that you may have. 

Thanks In Advance,
Brent Youngren

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Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 11:13:39 +0100
From: fredriks at abel.math.umu.se (Fredrik Stahl)
Subject: Re:re:Step Mash Question

In HBD #1956, Denis Barsalo writes:

<snip>

>up from 122F (50C) and eventually going to 158F (70C). This basically
>recreates George Fix's 50-60-70 schedule for well-modified grain doesn't
>it?

<snip>

>        Under which conditions would I want to use a 40C-60C-70C mash
>schedule? Is this for a specific style of beer, or for less-modified grain
>bills? How would you recommend I step the mash up from 40C to 60C? More
>water?

I think you have gotten something wrong here. The idea is to use two rests
at 60C and 70C to control fermentability. For a less modified malt (i.e.
pilsener or lager malt) you need to use a protein rest at 50C because of
the high protein content. On the other hand, well modified malt has a much
lower protein content and you don't want the protein level to be too low,
or you would get a poor head. So George Fix idea is to do a low-temp rest
at _40C_ instead of 50C for well modified malt, keeping the transition time
from 40C to 60C under 15 mins. The gain of a low temperature rest is mainly
better gelatinization and dissolvability, resulting in higher extraction.

To repeat George Fix mash scedules:
Lager malt (low modification): 50-60-70C
Pale malt (high modification): 40-60-70C

I use the 40-60-70C scheme for my British ales. I usually dough in with a
little water in a bucket, giving a very thick mash at 40C. I then transfer
to the mash tun and use infusion to get the mash to 60C. The transition to
70C and to 77C for mash-out is then made with external heating. I think it
would be very hard to go through all the steps with infusion only,
especially if you want to minimize the time between 40C and 60C.

=46or lager malt and the 50-60-70C scheme you could use decoctions.

- -------------------------------------------------------------------
=46redrik St=E5hl                    Tel: int + 90 166027
Math. Dept., Ume=E5 University     Fax: int + 90 165222
S-90187 Ume=E5, SWEDEN             E-mail: fredriks at abel.math.umu.se
        *** Nemo saltat sobrius, nisi forte insanit ***
- -------------------------------------------------------------------



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Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 07:22:34 -0500
From: dkerfoot at freenet.macatawa.org (Douglas Kerfoot)
Subject: RE: Is this beer good?

>     Mike Taber writes:
> 
>     I have some beer which was brewed at least 10 years ago by my 
>     ex-wife's grandfather (I don't remember what it is. It is amber in 
>     colour, but I don't remember if it is an Ale or a Lager). I stumbled 
>     across four bottles in my dads garage (he never drank it when I gave 
>     it to him years ago).     
>     Anyhow, I'm wondering if this beer is still good. I know that some 
>     beers don't age well.
>     

This reminds me of a story told as part of PBS's Cival War series that went
something like this:  General McClellen and some of his officers debated for
a long time over the depth of a river that they wished to cross.  Finally,
in disgust, Colonal George Custer rode out to the middle of the river and
said: "General McClellen Sir, THIS is how deep the river is, Sir."

The moral?  Open one and drink it.  THAT is how good it is.

Not a flame, but do you really trust these guys more than your own senses?

Doug Kerfoot 

(I like beer)


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Date: Thu, 08 Feb 1996 06:47:07 -0600
From: JOHN WEATHERLY <WEATHJ at swt02.swt.usace.army.mil>
Subject:  Homebrew Digest #1956 (February 08, 1996) -Reply

please unscribe.


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Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 09:00:13 -0500
From: Bob McCowan <bob.mccowan at cfrp.varian.com>
Subject: Crystal at mashout?

Some brewers mash all of their grains, others seem to add the specialty
grains at mashout.  What difference does it make?  

Bob

- --------------------------------------------------------------------------
Bob McCowan                            
                                      voice:  (508)-922-6000 x208
ATG/Receiver-Protector                fax:    (508)-922-8914
CPI BMD
Formerly Varian CF&RPP                e-mail: bob.mccowan at cfrp.varian.com
Beverly, MA  01915

- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------


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Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 06:30:49 PST
From: Steve_Rosenzweig at wb.xerox.com (Rosenzweig,Steve)
Subject: On Ice Wort Cooling, Yeast Culture and Re-use

Mostly this post is in reponse to a couple of questions from Tracy 
 Thomason in HBD 1955/6:

On Ice Wort Cooling:  I am primarily an extract brewer with the 
 occasional specialty grains thrown in for good measure.  The method 
 that I have employed for the last 6 years is to boil an initial 3-4 
 gallons of water for 15-30 min (which sterilizes and pulls out some 
 chemicals, e.g. Chlorine) the day before I intend to brew.  After the 
 water has cooled to around room temp, transfer to your sterilized 
 primary fermenter (mine is a 6.5 gal carboy), cap and put the carboy 
 outside, in the garage,  or in the freezer (one good reason to love 
 living in the winter wonderland of upstate NY - you can easily chill 
 your water!).  BE CAREFUL not to freeze the bugger solid!  Monitor it 
 - some ice forming on the surface seems to be OK - and you know the 
 temp is around 32F, but a solid freeze would likely crack the carboy.  
 Then on brewday after your wort has been boiled (I use 1-2 gallons 
 plus 2 cans extract) you are ready to transfer to the primary.  

Safety Disclaimer ON!  The next step can be extremely dangerous, if you 
 are at all squeamish in nature, find another method (e.g. wort 
 chiller)!  Boiling hot wort on cold glass means at least a nasty crack 
 if not an outright explosion!  One time I did kill a carboy this way - 
 I used the wrong damn funnel - MAKE SURE you use a large funnel with 
 ridges along the neck to allow for air to escape from the carboy - I 
 used a cheapy and it allowed hot wort down the sides of the carboy.  
 (Note that I was able to save the beer in the cracked carboy by 
 slipping some plywood under it and having a friend help me lift it to 
 a countertop to siphon off to my trusty bucket!  Good beer from that 
 batch _and_ I learned something too!)  Safety Disclaimer OFF!

I usually put the carboy with the near-freezing water into a large 
 plastic tub, cover it with your brew towel (or better yet a big-a** 
 brew blanket), put your funnel in place - have someone hold it to 
 steady it if possible - and quickly but carefully pour the wort 
 through the funnel into the carboy.  The wort MUST NOT touch the sides 
 of the carboy - it must go directly into the center of the cold water! 
  The theory is that the cold water will absorb the thermal shock 
 rather than the glass.  For the last five years I haven't had a 
 problem with this method - and the water ratio I use seems to chill 
 the entire wort to around 70-80F immediately!  This also seems to give 
 me an excellent cold break - sometimes the wort almost looks 
 solidified!  The advantage of using the tub is that if you need to 
 further chill the wort, you can easily carry the entire setup outside 
 for a snow bath.  You then aerate your wort (I just shake the carboy 
 around in the tub), and pitch your yeast - which leads us to:

On Yeast Culture and Re-use:  I never thought to save and repitch the 
 sediment from my dry yeast batches - what was the point?  I must admit 
 that I only recently have started using liquid yeast (and I don't know 
 what took me so long!) and I am very pleased with the results!  I 
 cannot comment on yeast farming or slants (yet - wait till next 
 fall!), but I have successfully repitched the sediment from the bottom 
 of the secondary of a Wyeast Lager strain several times.  One thing 
 that I have noticed on yeast starters is that when you use the smack 
 pack to pitch into the starter, it does take a good 18 hours or so to 
 get to high krausen, but when I pitched the secondary sediment into a 
 starter, it was less than 4 hours (I was caught off guard - not ready 
 to brew - and had to pitch after high krausen - but everything worked 
 out alright).  I usually reuse only from the secondary since it seems 
 cleaner (whiter), there is much less trub, and the neck of my primary 
 is always covered in HopSpooge(tm) from the pellets I use that I don't 
 particulary want in my starter!  After I bottle or keg the brew, I use 
 some cool sanitized water (1-2 cups) to slosh around the yeast slurry 
 on the bottom of the carboy.  I boil up 1.5 cups DME in 2 cups water 
 and add to some chilled pre-boiled water in a glass gallon jug for 
 wort of around 1.040 - 1.050.  When the baby wort is at around 70-80F, 
 I reslosh the slurry (say that 5x fast!), and pitch.  Note that you 
 will probably need an odd size stopper and another spare airlock for 
 this baby brew.  The half gallon or so that results can be pitched to 
 5 gallons around high krausen with fair assurance that there are 
 plenty of little beasties rejoicing at the prospect of more food!  You 
 could split the starter to a couple of airlocked bottles as well, 
 saving them after fermentation for weeks/months in the fridge, but you 
 should repitch to a larger starter size before you pitch to a full 5 
 gallon batch.

I highly recommend getting The Homebrewers Companion as well - it is 
 truly a good companion work to TNCJOHB!

Hope that answered some questions for Tracy and any other relative 
 beginners out there!  Any questions on specifics will be gladly 
 answered either through HBD or email.

Sorry for the length, but I have been lurking for quite awhile and 
 obviously was ready to contribute!

Stephen

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Date: Thu, 8 Feb 96 15:49:34 UT
From: "James Hojel" <JTroy at msn.com>
Subject: Re: Mexican/European Lagers

In digest #1953, David mentioned a seasonal lager named "Noche Buena."  This 
beer is presently brewed during the Christmas holidays.  It is a dark lager 
with threshold residual sweetness and very neutral and smooth (thin body).  
Noche Buena translates to pointsetta (spelling??), the red plants that we 
adorn our homes during the holidays.  I was in Mexico City over the holidays 
and sampled many of Noche Buenas.

Salud,

JTH

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Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 11:07:07 -0500 (EST)
From: Shiva Vakili <vakili at pobox.upenn.edu>
Subject: q

q



- -- 
Shiva Vakili				
University of Pennsylvania Libraries			
Tel: (215) 898-4925		        	email vakili at pobox.upenn.edu
****************************************************************************


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Date: Thu, 08 Feb 96 09:54:35 CST
From: OBCTS at ccmail.ceco.com
Subject: 10th Annual Bidal Competition in Kenosha, WI

     
     The 10th Annual Bidal Society of Kenosha Homebrew competition will be 
     held on March 9  at  Brewmasters Pub in Kenosha.  Ribbons and prizes will 
     be awarded for 1st, 2nd, and 3rd in each category and for BOS and 2nd 
     BOS.  Some categories may be combined.  This competition is AHA 
     Sanctioned.  
     
     For more information or if you are interested in Judging please 
     contact Carol DeBell at 414-654-2211 or email 
     Tom(obcts at ccmail.ceco.com) or Jeff(jsparrow at follett.com).  Judging 
     will begin on Friday evening and end Saturday afternoon.  If you can 
     make either day please let us know.
     
     Tom
     
     p.s.  Hi Keith....
     


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Date: Thu, 08 Feb 96 10:08:00 PST
From: "ADAIR, BENTON E." <ADAIRBE at austy944a.aust.tdprs.state.tx.us>
Subject: Thanks for the Great Tip!


This tip work so well that I would like to repost it.
A long while ago someone suggested on the 'gest using the open door of a   
dishwasher as a bottling table.
No worry spills, no sticky floors, easy as pie cleanup, awesome!

Thanks again,
Ben

"...drinker with a running problem."

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