---

	FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
		Rob Gardner, Digest Janitor


Contents:
  copyright (Robert Rogers)
  Brewing before 6am... (CHRISTOPHER DIIORIO         )
  Grains of Hardness ("Joseph G. Spears")
  Grains/Bottle Inspections/Ice Beer (A. J. deLange)
  Accidental Ice Beer (Phil Slotter)
  Movement from boil to fermenter ("Thomas A. Wideman")
  Sparge arms.  Wheat beers (Paul Rybak)
  Re:Flavenoids (Debisschop)
  Dry ice for air purge & automatic sparge control (C.D. Pritchard)
  Irish Brewpubs (Ulick Stafford)
  competition anouncement (Mark Taratoot)
  Beer Engine use with Corny Kegs (Fred Brende)
  special ocasion beer (Robert Rogers)
  Re: WORT CHILLING (Eric & Carolyn Metzler)
  Priming with maple syrup (Mike Kidulich)
  Fructose Remedy (Charlie Scandrett)
  Cooper's Extract (Charlie Scandrett)
  Mini Kegging & Tuppers Hop Pocket Ale (RedlackC)
  Re: Hot Bottles-Jeff's correct! ("Val J. Lipscomb")
  Source of idophor (Al Stevens)
  Carbonator (Art McGregor)



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----------------------------------------------------------------------


Date: Sat, 20 Apr 1996 04:59:27 -0400
From: bob at carol.net (Robert Rogers)
Subject: copyright

al,

i'm not a lawyer, so i don't give legal advice, but:
yes, you have a natural copyright...
but, you can only sue if you register it.
the gentleman in question, if he is duping HBD to CD ROM is violating the
natural copyrights of everyone who posts. we could technically launch a
class action suit against him, but since none of us has any money involved
(excluding any home brewing authors, of course) it might be hard to prove
any sort of monetary damages.
i would be interested in obtaining the CD, though, since i could erase all
the old digests from my hard drive.

bob -- brewing in the buckle of the bible belt.
bob rogers,  bob at carol.net


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Date: Sat, 20 Apr 1996 07:07:47 -0400 (EDT)
From: CHRISTOPHER DIIORIO <pher at acc.msmc.edu>
Subject: Brewing before 6am...

All,

Well, I have just learned the hard way that, no matter HOW bad you want to
do it, you shouldn't brew before 6am (at least not alone).  This morning I
got up early.  Having to go to work at 7am, I thought I'd get a batch in
before I left (saving me time for another after work).  So, being obsessed,
I got up at 4am and began brewing.  By about 5:45 I was quite sleepy
(having slept only 4hrs) and was ready to pitch the batch with my first,
what I call successful, starter when, in my blurry haze, I knocked
the bottle over, spilling it all over the floor!  I saved about 20% that
didn't spill, but my "perfect" starter went all over everywhere.

My wife awoke, quite surprised, to a small tirade of cursing and anger (at
myself, not her).  She then politely told me that I should have woken her
and she "would have helped me."  Anyway, I sat and pondered, over a rare
pre-work 6am homebrew, and decided to use the 20% in conjunction with a
dry yeast I had for such "emergencies".  I'll see how it turns out.

Now, I'm not AGAINST brewing before the sun comes up, or after it is LONG
gone, its just that I recommend doing so with a partner.  In the very
least, you can have someone to complain to (and maybe even blame?, just
kidding) if your starter/wort/brew pot is knocked over.

For me, I'll be waking her up (maybe tomorrow) to see just HOW serious her
consoling effort was!

Thanks for reading this far...I'd like to nominate myself Thumduck of the
day.

Brewingly yours,

Chris DiIorio
(Boy, this homebrew in my coffee mug is Darn good, just don't tell my boss!)

BTW -- I was wearing PLAID boxer shorts, could this have been the cause?

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Date: Sat, 20 Apr 1996 07:17:45 -0500
From: "Joseph G. Spears" <aquashed at Interpath.com>
Subject: Grains of Hardness

A grain is a unit of weight equal to .0648 grams or .000143 pounds or 
1/7000th of a pound.

Grains per gallon (gpg) is a common method of reporting water 
analysis results in the US and Canada.  One grain per gallon equals 
17.1 parts per million (ppm) or 17.1 milligrams per liter.  

Thus water reported as 18 grains would have hardness of 307.8 mg/l.

Joe Spears, CWS-V, CI          Phone: 704-459-2426
Certified Water Specialist     FAX:   704-453-7617

Aqua Shed
3474 Duck Pond Drive
Conover, NC 28613-9458

aquashed at interpath.com



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Date: Sat, 20 Apr 1996 08:25:44 -0500
From: ajdel at interramp.com (A. J. deLange)
Subject: Grains/Bottle Inspections/Ice Beer

Shane asked about hardness expressed in grains. There are 7000 grains to
the pound, 453592 milligrams to the pound and 3.7853 litres to the gallon
so 1 grain per gallon = (1/7000)*(453592)/3.7853 = 17.12 milligrams/Liter
(ppm). The gpg numbers represent grains per gallon as calcium carbonate.

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

There has been some discussion of bottle inspections. These are avoided by
"buying" a bottle from one of the larger gas suppliers. When you need a
refill they simply swap "your" bottle for one that has been refilled at the
plant. If your bottle is out of inspection it is serviced before being put
back into circulation. The only problem with this system is that you get
grungy, beatup looking old gas bottles. If you want to keep a nice shiny
new one you have to fill it yourself or take it to someone who refills
yours (doesn't swap). Note that you rarely get 5# in a 5# bottle this way.

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

Jim Duensing asked about the process for making ice beer. Here's a
paragraph from the patent (send me e-mail if you want the whole thing).


                       BRIEF STATEMENT OF INVENTION

It has now been found that if, in the brewing process, and preferably prior
to aging the temperature of beer is rapidly reduced to approximately its
freezing point in a manner such that only a minimal amount of ice crystals
are formed, and the thus cooled beer is contacted with an agitated slurry
of ice crystals for a relatively short period of time and without
collateral concentration of the beer, the aging stage of the brewing
process can be significantly reduced, and, perhaps, even eliminated.

     The process of the present invention ensures that all the beer is
invariably subjected to the same low temperature treatment and hence is
uniformly processed.

     Moreover, the resulting finished beer is less harsh, smoother and more
mellow compared to regularly processed beer, especially if care is taken
to remove substantially all of the yeast cells emanating from the
fermentation from the green beer prior to it being treated.

(END OF QUOTATION FROM PATENT)

The mixing is done in a "crystalizer" which "forms part of commercially
available freeze concentration systems" i.e. there is some elaborate
refrigeration involved. The agitated slurry of ice crystals referred to
above is of ice crystals in beer.

This gives the basic principle. Given the homebrewer's legendary bent for
innovation I'm sure someone will come up with a way to implement the
process on a small scale. Something along the lines of an ice-cream freezer
comes to mind.

A.J. deLange   Numquam in dubio, saepe in errore!
ajdel at interramp.com



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Date: Sat, 20 Apr 1996 08:30:45 -0400
From: Phil Slotter <pslotter at ids.net>
Subject: Accidental Ice Beer

After Reading Jim Duensings request for an ice beer procedure I remember 
a litle "accident" I had a few month's ago.

I made a Bohemian Pilsner that was force carbonated to 2.5-3 volumes of 
CO2. I CP bottled half the batch and returned the rest to my lagering 
fridge which was set at 30F, a few days later I decided to try bottle 
conditioning the rest of the batch and released the gas from the corny 
keg rather quickly. When I opened the keg to prime it I had about 6" of 
ice on the top of the beer. So with a freshly cleaned spagetti ladle I 
pulled the ice from the brew and let it thaw in my bottling bucket.
The total amount of ice melted down to about 1 gallon of the 2.5 gallons 
in the keg. The remaining beer which was primed and bottled without 
incident tasted a bit sweeter and A LOT more alcoholic then the first 
bottling and the thawed ice was primed and bottled as a thin 
tasting apparently non(low)alcohol beer.
My assumption on what happened is that the release of gas chilled the 
beer even more and the foam that formed had a lower alcohol content 
allowing it to freeze. I may try this again under more controlled 
conditions.
Does this make sense?

			Phil Slotter
		Flying Goat Dog Pico Brewery

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Date: 20 Apr 96 10:10:58 EDT
From: "Thomas A. Wideman" <75710.1511 at CompuServe.COM>
Subject: Movement from boil to fermenter

I am looking for a good way to transfer from the boiling pot (10 gal SS) 
to the fermenter (6 gal. glass carboy) after immersion chilling.

I have generally been swirling, allowing to settle for a half hour or so, 
then racking through a cane into a large funnel inserted in the carboy 
mouth.  This aerates quite well and leaves almost all of the trub and 
spent hops behind -- especially when using hop plugs, where this 
technique works great.

Unfortunately, my last batch was a barleywine that used some plugs and 
lots of pellets, and boiled down to a thick gravity (1.139 -- we're 
talking pancake syrup here).  I chilled, swirled, and waited an hour, but 
the stuff was so thick and there was so much hop residue that racking 
flat plugged up after only 1/2 gallon had transferred.  I ended up 
straining the wort through sanitized panty hose (hey, it works pretty 
good, so what the heck).

Any thoughts?  Private email is fine.

Cheers,
Tom Wideman


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Date: Sat, 20 Apr 1996 12:25:22
From: PERSAND at gnn.com (Paul Rybak)
Subject: Sparge arms.  Wheat beers

I'm thinking of using either a Listerman-type sparge arm or a pan 
with holes to trickle the sparge water so as to not stir up the 
grains.  Is a device like this used throughout the process or only 
with rinse water?  My concern would be HSA so maybe the first 
runnings would not be put through this.  

Also, to anyone interested in wheat beers, I highly recommend Eric 
Warners' book 'German Wheat Beer'.  Really explains decoction 
mashing and wheat beer brewing techniques.  I've only made 7 
all-grain batches and my first attempt at a wheat turned out, IMHO, 
just GREAT!! (sorry for yellling!).    

  
Paul Rybak


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Date: Sat, 20 Apr 1996 14:36:50 -0400
From: Debisschop at aol.com
Subject: Re:Flavenoids

OK, here's the scoop on flavonoids:

What are they?  Flavonoids are a heterogenous group of several thousand
organic compunds found in plant life.  They help with plant growth,
reproduction, respiration, etc.  Their function is similar (and in many cases
probably the same as) vitamins, i. e. enzyme cofactors, etc.  They also
contribute to plant pigmentation.  I'm not sure if they're related to
melanoidins.

What do they do to us (humans)?  Flavonoids seem to have anti-oxidant and
free-radical scavenging properties.  They also influence human immune and
inflammatory systems.  There is also thought that they may tend to decrease
platelet adhesion (similar to aspirin).  This latter thought has been
strengthened by the recent publication of the Zutphen study, a large,
longitudinal study (15 years) in which flavonoid intake was inversely
correlated with relative risk of stroke. ( I haven't had a chance to read the
text of the study yet, so I cant comment critically on it right now; I have
the citation if anyone would like it.)  Black tea was the major source of
flavonoids; people who drank 4.7 cups (or more) of tea had about 1/3 the risk
of people who drank 2.6 cups or less.  Anyway, the antioxidant properties may
prevent LDL cholesterol from oxidizing and adhering to artery walls, and
antiplatelet activity helps prevents clots from forming around the
atherosclerotic plaques (and other places) in people at risk.

What are flavonoids doing in my beer?  It seems natural that these plant
compounds would be  present in a drink made from plants; as a previous
contributor pointed out, our beer is rich in B vitamins, etc. Beer and tea
are made from parts of the plants which are high in enzymatic activity, i.e.,
endosperm, leaves.   As to why dark beer contains more than light beer, good
question.  Perhaps, as the same previous contributor pointed out, beer made
from all-malt (ours), vs beer made from a high proportion of adjuncts (the
Big 3), is actually what the article meant by "darker" beer.  But shouldnt
adjuncts like corn and rice, being plants, also contain flavonoids?  Are
flavonoids and melanoidins related?  I suspect that guy at UW owes us some
answers about why darker beers contain more than lighter beers.  He should
also explain that statement about "particles called wort" being removed from
lighter beers, if in fact those *were* his words.

What are the conclusions?  Flavonoids *may* help us reduce the risk of stroke
and oxidative damage through their antioxidant and antiplatelet activities.
Of course more studies are necessary. Treat these reports with the same
credulity with which you treat the claims made of other antioxidant
coompounds.  The conservative thing to say is to get your flavonoids through
generous helpings of fruits and vegetables.  As to why some types of beer are
said to contain more than others, I believe the answer to that question lies
with Dr. Folts in Madison.  My recommendation?  Be on the safe side, drink a
glass of porter every day.

Sorry to be so long-winded, but there it is.

Stay well,
Mike

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Date: Sat, 20 Apr 96 15:00 EDT
From: cdp at chattanooga.net (C.D. Pritchard)
Subject: Dry ice for air purge & automatic sparge control

Randy Huyck <rwh0303 at hub.doh.wa.gov> wants to use dry ice to purge air from
his secondary fermenter and wonders about contamination from the condensed
water vapor and how much to use.

Dry ice can contain oil.  I'd observe the bottom of the fermenter for oil
before I transfered the brew into it.  Any oil would probably reduce the
finished brew's head.  

Dry ice in a sealed vessel makes a pretty powerful bomb.  A tablespoon full
in a capped 2 liter plastic pop bottle is said to be enough to blow the
bottle up.  Based on that, I'd *guess* 3-4 Tbs. ought to purge most of the
air from a 5 gallon carboy.  If the dry ice can be weighted, the required
amount can be calculated from pv=nrt.  Sorry I can't help more, all my tech
books are at work.
- ---------------

How does this automatic sparge control look:
                 
       +-X--------- sparge water line with solenoid valve controlled
     +-|--+             by liquid level sensors
     | |  | +<----- high liquid level sensor
tun->|-+--| +<----- low  ' ' ' ' ' ' '  ' '
     |    | |<----- sight glass (tygon tubing)
     +-|--+ |
       +----+--X-<-- wort-out line with manual throttling valve

The liquid level sensors can be built using a couple of ICs- probably
LM1830s.  I want 'em out of the tun since condensation on them might cause
false readings and I use a sight glass anyhow.  A soleniod valve from a
dishwasher in the sparge water line might work if the plastic in it is
appropriate for 170 degF or so.  If it doesn't work, a gear motor driven
needle or globe valve should work.  The level controllers would just open
and close the sparge water valve as the level in the tun rises and falls-
maybe a differential of 1/2" or so.  

I'd sure like to hear from anyone that's been tried something like this or
any critiques of the idea.  TIA!

C.D. Pritchard    cdp at chattanooga.net


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Date: Sun, 14 Apr 1996 20:47:07 +0100
From: Ulick Stafford <ulick at indigo.ie>
Subject: Irish Brewpubs

In case anyone is visiting Ireland and is interested, the country's first 
brewpub, which opened last September is Garvey's 'Biddy Early Brewery' in 
Inagh, Co. Clare (on Ennis-Ennistymon road).  It produces 'Black Biddy 
Stout', a dry Irish stout similar to Beamish.  It may be brewed with 
Pale, wheat, and roast malts, roast barley, Galena, Fuggles, and Pride 
hops, and Carageenan moss.  It is drunk by most customers of the pub in 
preference to draught Guinness and there are plans to supply other pubs 
in Clare.

Another brewpub is opening in Dublin on Parliament Street in the near 
future.  I'll update this list if there is interest and review its brews 
once I get the chance.

_____________________________________________________________________________
         Wexford Brewing Company           | Ulick Stafford, Proprietor  
 Purveyor of Advanced Homebrewing Supplies | ulick at indigo.ie
     Ballyhurst, Taghmon, Co. Wexford      | Phone/Fax: +353-53-47957




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Date: Sat, 20 Apr 1996 14:49:11 -0700 (PDT)
From: Mark Taratoot <taratoot at PEAK.ORG>
Subject: competition anouncement

Heart of the Valley Homebrewers Present:
The 14th Annual Oregon Homebrew Competition and Festival

At the Oregon Trader Brewery 
140 Hill Street, NE
Albany, Oregon 97321
(Off Street Parking Available)

Saturday, May 11th, 1996   From 11 am to 5 pm

JUDGING FOR THE 24 RECOGNIZED AHA BEER STYLES PLUS
ALL THREE MEAD CATEGORIES

The Heart of the Valley Homebrewers invite you to participate in the
fourteenth annual homebrew competition and festival, the longest running
event of its kind in Oregon.  The focus of the event will be a judging of
homebrewed beer sanctioned by the American Homebrewers Association (AHA)
and the Beer Judge Certification Program (BJCP).  In addition, the club
will host a festival to promote awareness and knowledge of various beer
styles, provide opportunities to share information about the homebrewing
craft, and encourage interaction between homebrewers in a social
atmosphere.  This years activities will include several displays, a
raffle, food concessions, and the opportunity to meet and talk with some
of the best and most experienced homebrewers anywhere! 

Entry fee is $5.00.  This year there will be NO ENTRIES ACCEPTED THE DAY 
OF THE COMPETITION.  Entries may be mailed directly to or dropped off at
the festival site or dropped off at one of our remote pick up sites.  We 
are also offering on-line entry and judge registration.


Special guest speaker:    The world renowned 
                            Fred Eckhardt


Complete details, entry requirements, rules, drop-off site locations, and 
directions to the festival are available at our web site:

           http://www.peak.org/~taratoot/fest.html

or contact Lee Smith at (541)926-2286 
 or
Mark Taratoot at (taratoot at peak.org)


- --
Mark Taratoot            "...though my problems are meaningless,
taratoot at peak.org         that don't make them go away."     
                                                         -Neil Young


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Date: Sat, 20 Apr 1996 15:04:20 -0700
From: fbrende at cris.com (Fred Brende)
Subject: Beer Engine use with Corny Kegs

Well, I just got back from the UK and sampled some very fine real ale
there.  While I was out there a kind pub owner sold me a used hand pump
beer engine for cheap.  Now that I've got it here at home I am trying to
figure out a way to use it with my Corny Keg CO2 setup.  I don't want to
use the CO2 to PUSH the beer out.  Rather, I would like to pull the beer
out with the engine, and use the CO2 to displace the beer in the keg.  I
could just put in a check valve, but then oxidation would set in...  Are
there any suggestions out there?

TIA,
Fred



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Date: Sat, 20 Apr 1996 18:49:23 -0400
From: bob at carol.net (Robert Rogers)
Subject: special ocasion beer

my dad and i go on an annual camping trip, and i want to brew a beer there
to mark the occasion. we could then start next year's trip with this year's
brew. i'm thinking of a barley wine so it will keep. since it has to be easy
to move, make, and transport i came up with:

3/4 gal water, 1 pound dry extract, 1/2 oz 7.8AA hops. boil one hour (to 1/2
gal water). cool. put into 1 gal. jug, pitch 1 package of M&F dry ale yeast.
this would then have to travel in the car about four hours back to where i live.

i would like to use about another 1/2 pound of extract, but i wonder if the
yeast would be able to ferment that much (espceially since we will both be
wearing kilts). will the sloshing in the car be bad for the wort? if i go
with the extra DME, will i need to pitch more of some other kind of yeast?
would i be much better off using a smack pack of some sort, and if so which
one and why?

tia
bob -- brewing in the buckle of the bible belt
bob rogers,  bob at carol.net


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Date: Wed, 17 Apr 1996 07:26:51 -0700
From: Eric & Carolyn Metzler <cwmetzler at telplus.net>
Subject: Re: WORT CHILLING

In HBD #2012, Barry Finley wrote:

>. . . I know that the faster the wort can be chilled, the better
the beer will be.  But How can this be done?  At the present time, I've
been filling the sink up with ice, then placing my brew pot in the sink.
This works ok but I wish to get a little more sophisticated. What
exactly is the principle of an immersion chiller and how could I go
about making one? <

	I'm too cheap to buy a wort chiller, and too "lazy" to make one 
myself.  A recent _Zymurgy_ special issue on brewing gadgets would have 
lots of suggestions.  "Phil's Phittings" is a kit of the necessary 
connectors that you could add to your own locally-bought copper tubing.
	What I do, I learned from a contributor to _Zymurgy_ a few years 
ago.  (This method might be more suitable for extract brewers who only 
have 2-3 gallons of wort concentrate boiling for a 5-gallon batch.)  I 
keep 3 2-liter soda bottles, with the labels removed, 85% full of  clean 
water in our freezer.  When my wort is about done cooking, I rinse them 
in sanitizing solution and then water, then immerse them in the strained 
wort concentrate to which I have added cool water for dilution.  Swirling 
occasionally, the temp. goes from about 100 to about 70 in 20 minutes.

Good luck!	--Eric W. Metzler 
		ewmetzler at mem.po.com


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Date: Sat, 20 Apr 1996 23:57:16 -0400
From: Mike Kidulich <mjkid at ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Priming with maple syrup

I am brewing a maple lager, and am considering priming with maple syrup, 
or possibly maple sugar. Does anyone out there have experience with 
this? How does maple syrup compare with, say, honey as far as priming 
beer goes? I also have 4 ounces of maple sugar (ok, I ate one piece). 
Can this be used for priming?

TIA
- -- 
Mike Kidulich
mjkid at ix.netcom.com  mjk at rfc.comm.harris.com
DNRC Minister of Home Brewing, Relaxation, and Really Cool Toys
Holder of Previous Knowledge O-

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Date: Sun, 21 Apr 1996 23:05:56 +1000
From: merino at cynergy.com.au (Charlie Scandrett)
Subject: Fructose Remedy

In recent years an Australian doctor proved the theory that ulcers were
caused by bacteria by isolating it and infecting himself, causing an ulcer
and curing it with antibiotics. 

I'm no heroic medico, but in the search for a cure to my drastic allergenic
type reaction to *some* beer, I'll try anything. 

Basically if my body doesn't like the beer (or especially wine) I'll get a
headache after three stubbies over 2 hours. (hardly swilling) The next
morning at about 9.30 am I'll throw up bile on  the half hour for 12 to 24
hours. (When I give a beer the thumbs down, I mean it from my "inner" being!)

This has lead to a two stubbies a day rule unless I am confident of my
tipple. I suspect Tannin (red wine kills me) and stale aldehydes or
trans-2-nonenal (old beers kill me) and some byproducts of higher
temperature maillard reactions. (harsh roast flavoured stouts kill me) 

I am slowly investigating all of these by brewing to minimise them and
overdosing myself with the experiment. Some experiments let me drink 6
stubbies with no ill effect and some put me in bed for 2 days!?

I was interested to read A.J. deLange's post about alcohol blocking
metabolic pathways, causing a pooling of aldehydes in the liver. (presumably)

He claimed that fructose metabolism was not blocked by alcohol and suggested
it as a hangover cure.

I have deliberately exceeded my tolerence for beer on 5 occasions since and
got the warning headache that means nausea toomorrow. On each occasion I
have consumed 3-7 heaped teaspoons of fructose in warm water with a little
lemon juice.

When the fructose dose exceeded about 4 teaspoons I have cleared the
headache in about 3-4 hours and woke up with a clear head, feeling
energetic. (wired with fruit sugar!)

I can certify that fructose works for moderate drinking! 

Thanks AJ, especially from my family who were living with a beer loving bear
with a sore head. My experiments continue.

Charlie (Brisbane, Australia)


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Date: Sun, 21 Apr 1996 23:25:26 +1000
From: merino at cynergy.com.au (Charlie Scandrett)
Subject: Cooper's Extract

Mark Montminy questioned the continued production of Cooper's unhopped extract.

To the best of my knowledge( and I talk to the brewery) they now only
produce one kind of unhopped (there were three) and it is still available in
28 kg metal pails and 1700kg "Pallecons". 

I will quiz them this week and give you the official line.

Charlie (Brisbane, Australia)


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Date: Sun, 21 Apr 1996 14:10:39 -0400
From: RedlackC at aol.com
Subject: Mini Kegging & Tuppers Hop Pocket Ale

Hello fellow Brewers,

I just have a couple of quick questions and suggestions.

I have decided to move away from bottling, but I don't have enough room for a
5 gallon keg, so I am deciding wether or not it is advantageous to move to a
mini kegging system. Does anyone have any opinions on minikegging (good, bad
or ugly). How far should one fill the mini kegs?

Has anyone tried to duplicate Tuppers' Hop Pocket Ale via a mash-extract or
extract recipe? I would be greatly interested in a recipe.

For those of you who are still stuck in the world of bottling, much like
myself, here's how you can drain your bottles more easily.If you swirl your
bottles in a circular motion a whirlpool will develop inside of the bottle
creating a smoother and faster flow as you pour out the contents. This also
works well with carboys.

On a final note. Don't throw away those boxes that you carboys come in. If
you cut off the top of the box and make a small hole in the bottom about the
same size of your airlock. You can flip the box over and use it to cover your
carboy to protect it from harmful light rays.The hole in the bottom will
allow the airlock to poke through.

I'm sure the e mini kegging topic has been covered in the past, so if
anyone's interested in responding, please feel free to correspond directly to
my E-Mail address. Thanks a million in advance for your help. I apologize if
any of my suggestions are old hat.

Best regards,

Chris Redlack
redlackc at aol.com

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Date: Sun, 21 Apr 1996 15:25:32 -0500
From: "Val J. Lipscomb" <valjay at NetXpress.com>
Subject: Re: Hot Bottles-Jeff's correct!

To All Other Bottlers:

I have been lurking for a good while, being a computer newbie. I 
was, however, driven to this post by the Hot Bottle thread and my
experience with the procedure.

In F.H. Steinbart Co. Newsletter, Spring 1987, there was an article,
that I think Jeff Frane wrote, since he was the editor, entitled
"The Basics of Bottling". It laid out the bottle baking procedure as
covered in recent HBD issues. I started doing it that way in 1987
and still do. I have never had a bottle break from it and have also
never had any bottle borne infections. I use mostly Champagne bottles, 
which fit in my oven, laying down, 12 at a time, stacked 5 with 4 on 
top of them and 3 on top of them. I start them at 250F and move them 
up to 350F after 15 minutes and leave them at 350F for 1:15. I always
let them cool in the oven, usually doing a batch at breakfast and 
another at supper. 

What I'm trying to say is, it works great and the bottles will stay okay
for up to a week (maybe more-a week is my max). 

I really enjoy the HBD and the input from people like Jeff, whom I've 
never met, practical advice can only help the hobby grow and IMHO, is
preferable to some of the more esoteric, high tech stuff. I enjoy the
the high level water and electronic equipment threads, but that stuff
is pretty heavy for the beginners and even the intermediate brewers.

Thanks for the bandwidth and to Jeff Frane for helping make my brewing
better and easier back in '87.

   Val Lipscomb 


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Date: 21 Apr 96 21:48:28 EDT
From: Al Stevens <72704.743 at CompuServe.COM>
Subject: Source of idophor

The easiest place to find idophor is at a farm supply store. It is used for
sanitizing
dairy equipment. It usually only comes in  large containers  (4 L). But that
ammount should last you a long time.


Al Stevens



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Date: Sun, 21 Apr 1996 22:03:55 -0400
From: apmcgregor at nmaa.org (Art McGregor)
Subject: Carbonator

Hi Everyone!

Just a quick question on the use of the Carbonator (TM).  I used the
carbonator the other night to fill two 2 liter soda bottles, and took them
to a soccer game to share with the team -- you know how thirsty you can get
:^)  Well, the beer was drinkable, but not as carbonated as I would have
liked it.  I suspected that might happen when I filled them, because when I
removed the carbonator to screw the soda bottle caps on, all the psi's I had
pumped in there came rushing out.  The ideal situation would have been to
leave the carbonator on, and the 25 psi of CO2 would have kept the
carbonation at a good level.  Problem is at $10-12 a carbonator, it gets too
expensive to think about filling these soda bottles to give to friends ...
and you know how many friends homebrewers have :^)  Is there some other way
to use the carbonator to charge these 2 liter bottles with CO2, or some
other simple, cheap way to charge these bottles homebrew to be gifts for
friends?  TIA!

Hoppy Brewing!
Art McGregor
(Day:  mcgregap at acq.osd.mil)
(Evening/Weekend:  apmcgregor at nmaa.org)


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