HOMEBREW Digest #2029 Mon 06 May 1996

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		Rob Gardner, Digest Janitor

  Keeping fermenter cool (Brian S Kuhl)
  Skunked beer (again and again) (Steve Alexander)
  Overkill... Say what? (Rob Reed)
  Fear, Loathing, and a tip. ("Gregory, Guy J.")
  Grain Mills (Pre-installed User)
  CABT/MIBE (Russell Mast)
  Sale of HBD. (Russell Mast)
  Re: CABT/MIBE (Russell Mast)
  Hot climate brewstores / megabrews ("Dave Hinkle")
  HBD at aob and more (Denis Barsalo)
  Wort Chilling ... Again (JIM ANDERSON)
  Good Luck (Bill and Dianna)
  HB Day (Steve Waddell)
  Brew-Rat-Chat Forums (Scott Abene)
  AoB, National HB Day, and HSA (HuskerRed)
  fetal alcohol syngrome (BOBKATPOND)
  100% O2 for aeration (Mark Redman)
  Grow Up!!! (Michael T. Bell)
  HBD handoff - *some*body has to do it (Dick Dunn)
  Building a virtual brewery! ("William G. Rucker")
  some + and - responses. ("FINLEY, BARRY CURTIS")
  remove me from list (Simon McLaren)
  Please remove me from your mailing list (Katayama Katsuyuki)
  Decoction/Water analysis (A. J. deLange)
  Alternatives to Peche Lambic (Mark Peacock)
  That ole' dingy-white magic (Cree-ee-py Boy)
  Help on Hop Horticulture! ("Clark D. Ritchie")
  New Brewing Water ("Michael S. Branigan")
  Maine Que & Brew (Kit Anderson)

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---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 03 May 96 11:27:00 PDT From: Brian S Kuhl <Brian_S_Kuhl at ccm.fm.intel.com> Subject: Keeping fermenter cool Many thanks to the one (whom I forgot) who suggested placing a fermenting carboy into a pail of water and wrapping the fermenter with a towel while letting the towel wick water from the pail. This worked very well even WITHOUT the fan blowing on it. We had a typical summer day the last two days here in Sacramento. The temperature hit 97 degrees F. (The inside temp was 84 degrees). I am now only curious about how well it will do on our hot days of 110 degrees! Should I keep the bottles cool as well, after bottling? Many thanks Brian PS: I wasn't worried; I just drank a home brew... Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 12:42:57 -0400 From: Steve Alexander <stevea at clv.mcd.mot.com> Subject: Skunked beer (again and again) Paul Rybak writes ... >Well, I'm about to beat a dead horse! When I asked if I dare take >a pitcher of lager out to my pool in <shudder> BROAD DAYLIGHT I was >advised that unless the beer was in an opaque pitcher and served in >a ceramic stein, my beer would be SKUNKED! I really do thank the >writer for the reply and I'm not making fun of the response. BUT, >what about the liters of Octoberfest beers served in Germany? Are >they drinking hopelessly skunked beer; do they really like it; do >they know what unskunked beer tastes like, or are taste buds killed >after several liters?---SORRY, just a thought. :-) They apparently don't have skunks in europe, so the light-struck aroma is referred to as a catty or civet one. Hmmm - I'm pretty sure I said that hoppy lightly colored beers are particularly skunkable and gave my experience with a hoppy ale in a summer garder as evidence. Marzen is a medium dark beer with a relatively low hopping rate, compared w/ say a Czech plzner or american pale ale. I believe I saw a lot of ceramic (tho unlidded) steins on the Octoberfest pictures I saw a while back too. In any case, what a marzen tastes like in Germany on a (likely overcast) September day is peripheral to your example. It's a matter of degree and should depend on the ambient light, the clarity of the beer and container, the hopping rate, and according to some recent posts the treatment of the iso-humulone. Up until the last year or so it was impossible to get a bottle of Pilsner Urquell or a Grolsch (both in green bottles) locally that wasn't somewhat skunked. Since you still doubt the power of nasty rodent odors and the aromatron hasn't been invented yet why don't you try a simple test ? Take an Urquell after tasting it indoors, and then leave it in a clear glass in direct sunlight for 10 minutes and see what you think. If you don't instantly sense the difference then you've either got a troubled sense of smell or else you need to bury that dead horse. Stevea Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 14:39:42 -0400 (CDT) From: Rob Reed <rhreed at icdc.delcoelect.com> Subject: Overkill... Say what? Adam writes: >Isn't using dry ice to cool wort going a little too far? I think > that it may be dangerous too. Depending on how you employ the dry ice to cool wort, it could be dangerous, but how could it be interpreted as going too far considering the widespead use of such techniques and equipment as counterflow chilling, recirculating infusion mash system (I mean George Washington didn't need no stinking temperature servo to make Porter 8<), and how about injecting pure oxygen and building up 1 quart starters from a loopful of yeast? What about homebrewers who sterile filter and then bottle under pressure and three tier half barrel brew systems. How about a 1 barrel pilot brewery with an underground pipe from the brewhaus to the fermenting room? I can only say that I am guilty of using more than one of the above... Isn't that the beauty of homebrewing, that you are only limited by your imagination and the credit limit on your charge card? Cheers, Rob Reed Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 03 May 96 13:57:00 PDT From: "Gregory, Guy J." <GGRE461 at eroerm1.ecy.wa.gov> Subject: Fear, Loathing, and a tip. Fear: > On a related note, are any of you as scared as I am about the AHA taking > over the HBD? Loathing: Is there reason for fear? As a long time lurker, Rob has performed a thankless task with skill. Clearly, anyone who has done so much for so long with no tangible reward is truly an honorable man. To suggest other than pure motives for the change is outrageous. AOB will either perform as well as the past, in which case no significant change will occur; or they will not, in which case most of us will go elsewhere, and this remarkable phenomenon will pass. If this is all we have to fear, we're doing pretty well. Hold on to your towels, folks. The universe will continue. My personal best wishes to you, Rob. Sincere thanks for your efforts for the international brewing community. A tip: I'm lagering in a old corny keg. I cut off the bottom 1/2" of the out tube, and took out the valve from the in-tube. Brew magazine has a cockamamie contraption for attaching an airlock involving a whole bunch of stuff. I used, instead, a 2 inch length of 1/2" ID clear tube, into which I inserted a 3" length of 3/8 " ID, 1/2" OD tube, into which I inserted my airlock. It's acceptably rigid, and the airlock is bubbling away happily. My refrigerator does not have a dangerous buildup of CO2 in it nor does it smell, as the Brew magazine article suggested, and I am not light the 40 bucks or so for the stuff they advised. Anybody have any better ideas? GuyG4 at aol.com...Lightning Ck. Picobrewery. The only beer on tap at the Restaurant at the End of the Universe Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 13:59:53 -0000 From: Pre-installed User <dimke at montana.campus.mci.net> Subject: Grain Mills Hi all, I have been brewing more and more and as such have started to buy grain = a bag at a time. Have finally decided that it would be nice to have my = own grain mill. This way I can just brew when ever....assuming I have = the proper hops on hand of course! Have searched the FAQ's and can not = seem to find any info on these do dads. Anyway, I have seen the Phils mill and the Corona mill in the catalog = but neither impress me. The mill my local homebrew place = uses(Hellroaring Homebrew) is made by Jack S. ( Can't remember the full = last name...sorry) It is a great mill, crushes well and is easy to put = a drill on the crank shaft to speed things up a little( a lot actually). = Any opinions on these mill and any others out there that the rest of = you recommend? Where is the best place to get them? =20 TIA Private e-mail ok . =20 Will post a summary if there seem to be a lot of input. Rich and Mark Brew Partners in Kraeusen. Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 16:02:44 -0500 From: Russell Mast <rmast at fnbc.com> Subject: CABT/MIBE > From: Jim Nasiatka-Wylde <Jwylde at interaccess.com> > Subject: Chicago Area Beer Tasting > Where: LaPiazza > When: May 17, 1996 7pm - 2am > Cost: $10 Dude. I'm there. > Proceeds go to sponsor two riders who are participating in the Chicago to > Minneapolis AIDS ride, and I *think* it's tax deductable, but I ain't sure. It is almost certainly not tax-deductable. I'm no tax lawyer, but I'm pretty sure that if you receive -anything- for a donation, it's not considered a donation by the taxman. Still, how much taxes will we save from 10 bucks, eh? (I do think that if someone just donates money straight-up, outside of the 10 bucks, it might be, though.) Speaking of the 17th : A friend of mine just handed me something cut out from the Windy City Times (I think) which advertises some OTHER beer event in town, at the Bismark. Jim Kroch, Wicked Pete, Jake "the snake" Leinenkugel, some guy that looks like Dom Deluise, the professor and MaryAnn (Herman B'hoff and W. Littlefield) are all going to be there. The per person prices are running $30 at the door per event, with several events per day. (They actually range from $15-$100. I'm not gonna type in the whole schedule here.) I'm just shocked that so far no one has mentioned this yet. (The threeday special is $439, or 349 if you skip dinner on Saturday.) Most of the events are referred to as "Tasting Seminars". It runs from the 17th to the 19th. Anyone have any idea what the heck this is about and why this is the first I hear of this, from Dirk of all people. The MIBE sounds a bit hoky to me. There's one seminar called "Women in Beer". (I think women brewing is great, but I don't think it's going to TASTE different, so why have a "tasting" seminar about it?) I might go to one on Saturday afternoon, the 18th, a "Special Event" on Belgian Beers and Belgian Cheeses. (It's 2-3pm, but it's $25 freakin' bukx, man.) So what's the deal? On a final note, EVERY day is Homebrew Day as far as I'm concerned, and you're all silly as pie to be argueing about it. (And Pat, saying "But he started it!" will not work this time.) -Russell Mast Copyright 1996, Don Van Vliet Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 16:12:53 -0500 From: Russell Mast <rmast at fnbc.com> Subject: Sale of HBD. And another thing. If the AoB screw up the digest, we start another somewhere else. No problem. Unless and until they begin actually censoring the content of posts, I don't give a rat's ass who's running the show. The most they'll likely do is use it as a bully pulpit, and be able to respond and react to criticism more quickly than the rest of us, but that might serve to make them better neighbors anyway. And, frankly, I think we've all grown accustomed to looking a gift horse in the mouth. Unless YOU volunteer to take over the digest, then don't complain about someone else doing so before they even have a chance to manage it. I haven't offered to take it over because it's too much time and trouble. And money - I'd have to get another e-mail account, because I don't think my boss would care for me using company resources for such an effort. (I use enough as it is.) But, if something happens to -really- screw it up, I may grumble, but I will have little grounds for complaints without making a real effort to having it moved. And besides, it's not China taking over Hong Kong so much as vice versa. -Russell Mast copyright 1996, David Wills Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 16:27:03 -0500 From: Russell Mast <rmast at fnbc.com> Subject: Re: CABT/MIBE Correction: the MIBE announcement was in New City, not Windy City Times. As commercialized as the whole thing looks, I'd bet it's also in the Reader, the Trib, even the Sun Times. But who reads those, anyway? -Russell Mast copyright 1996, Carl Phillip Emmanuel Bach Return to table of contents
Date: 03 May 1996 15:21:18 -0700 From: "Dave Hinkle" <Dave.Hinkle at aexp.com> Subject: Hot climate brewstores / megabrews All this commotion about brewing in the summer is kind of amusing to me here in Phoenix. Our "summer" is about from March through November, with the truly hot (over 100F) part being May through September. Of the two brew stores I frequent, one closes it's doors for about 3 months during the peak heat. The other is open year-round, with live demos of how to overcome the obstacles to reasonable fermentation temperatures. Water baths w/ towel-wicks and fridge controllers are all on display with staff ready to answer questions. But the store that stays open admits that most sales during summer are from the "regulars". So I guess it depends on how concerned a store is for its regular, loyal customers. It is no doubt a tough time of year to get new homebrewers. It is definitely more work for me during the summer making sure my fermenters stay in the right zone. But not too hard, since I keep the house at 82F, so we're only talking about a 10-15 degree required drop. I use a 2" thick styrofoam box I made to cover a couple carboys. Each morning, I swap one of those large "blue ice" things with one from the freezer placed between the carboys. It keeps the fermenters in the mid 60s. Just another morning ritual, like getting the paper, fresh water for the dog & cat, etc. Someday, I'll get an old fridge and a controller, but for now my $10 setup works just fine. You guys up north w/o AC, well boo hoo hoo. Guess you'll have to buy your beer, which brings me to my next topic. Barry C. Finley makes a good point about being close-minded to megabrews. If someone were to ask a _knowledgeable_ brewer how to make something similar to Coors, he'd simply tell them (not retort w/ extreme bias against such a style). When I am in- between batches, yes, I actually BUY beer. One of my choices is Henry Weinhard's Boars Head Red. It's $6-7 a _12_ pack of bottles. You can actually taste hops in it, which is pretty RARE for a $.55 bottle of beer. Sure, I'd like to drink Sierra Nevada, but the price is more than double. Maybe it also helps me appreciate my own hoppy ales more after having to wait a couple of weeks between batches now and then. And... I never met a free beer I wouldn't drink. (OK, except for a friends first batch that tasted like Listerine. But at least I TRIED it). I feel that we are teetering on beer snobery when we refuse a beer because it may not be "up to our standards". Beer is a bit like sex in that when it's good, it's REALLY good, but when it's bad, it's STILL pretty good. Sorry for the rambling, but it seems like the amount of technical articles have been waning lately. So thought y'all wouldn't mind a little fiber in your digest. Maybe the lack of atricles is indicative of a widespread summer brewing hiatus?!!! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- Dave Hinkle Phoenix, AZ Homer: "Thanks for coming to my party. Wow, you brought a whole beer keg!" Barney: "Yeah. Where can I fill it up?" - ------------------------------------------------------------------- Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 19:16:58 -0500 From: denisb at cam.org (Denis Barsalo) Subject: HBD at aob and more I am very confident that the HBD will live on for a long and happy life in the hands of the AOB. Let's not forget that this is Rob's baby and if he's willing to let it go to the AOB, then we should respect his decision. He of all people knows what's best for the HBD. Tomorrow is National Homebrew Day and I'm brewing a Bavarian Pilsner. The cold room in the basement is still around 48 to 52 degrees and when time comes to lager it for a few weeks, I can move it to a spare fridge. I started brewing in Feb of 95 and have brewed over 25 beers since then. That's an average of a batch every few weeks! I didn't stop when the summer came, I just brewed ales! I don't plan to stop this summer either. Actually, I was sort of planning on brewing a steam beer this summer. Any suggestions for a recipe? (All-grain prefered!) What about the yeast? Denis Barsalo (in Montreal) Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 03 May 96 10:06:00 -0500 From: jim.anderson at execnet.com (JIM ANDERSON) Subject: Wort Chilling ... Again Hi all ... Just yesterday I got a dynamite deal on a used SS 10-gal. brewpot. But alas, it won't fit into my sink for my customary ice bath (combined with immersion chiller). I've thought of two options (given my apartment setup, i.e. no bathtub convenient): (1) throw ice cubes (from bottled spring water) directly into the wort, compensating for evaporation; or (2) pouring from the 10-gal. into the 5-gal. and then proceeding with my normal chilling. If (2) then I imagine I'd still put the immersion chiller into the boiling wort 5-10 minutes prior to finish, transfer the chiller first, then the still high-temp wort. Should I be concerned with aeration while still hot? (NOTE: I'm talking about 5-gal. batches.) Any thoughts, comments, suggestions? Email is fine, with my thanks in advance! - Jim Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 03 May 1996 19:40:59 -0700 From: Bill and Dianna <shewolf at sound.net> Subject: Good Luck Rob, We've only been getting the Homebrew Digest for about one week. >From what we can see you've done a wonderful job on the Digest. We hope that the AOB will do as well as you have. Thank you for putting your time and effort into promoting home brewing, and assisting the brewers with valuable information. Have a good time in Sweden! Thank you again Bill and Dianna Watt Don't worry.... have a home brew!! Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 3 May 96 21:18 EDT From: waddell at iglou.com (Steve Waddell) Subject: HB Day >Date: Thu, 2 May 96 09:13:55 MDT >From: mel0083 at mcdata.com (Michael Lausin) >Subject: Re: HBD#2026 National Homebrew Day > >All of this talk about brewing in the summer, etc. Excuse me, but National >Homebrew Day is on the 4th of May. If I remember correctly from grade school, >etc. summer doesn't start until June 21/22. That's a whole month and a half >away! Enough time to brew, ferment, bottle, and drink a whole batch of beer. >Or 2. > Seems to me that, by having HB day in may that we are being ever so PC, by being fair to our brewing brothers and sisters in South Africa, South America, Austraila, etc. Lighten up (emotions, not beer). ANY recognition is a good thing. Of course, here in Kentucky USA May 4 is Derby Day (this year), and ain't nothin else gonna get any recognition! >Besides, in most areas of the country (US of A) it doesn't get really hot until >July or August and by that time most people (if they're anything like me) >already have another batch going before the last batch runs out. So if you time >it right you can skip the really hot times of the year. > >As for summer being a time for the outdoors. Doesn't it ever rain in your >part of the country? Save brewing for a rainy day [unless of course you brew >outside. But what the heck, you can always put an umbrella over the brew pot... >:) ] Better than sitting around and watching the tube! Any thing beats the tube. June/July is just the time for brewing outside. Rain keeps the wild beasties down, but use a tarp. Umbrella is too small. - --------------------------------------------------- Steve Waddell - waddell at iglou.com It is a good thing that we don't get all the government that we pay for! - Will Rogers Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 03 May 1996 20:58:54 -0500 From: Scott Abene <skotrat at wwa.com> Subject: Brew-Rat-Chat Forums Hey everyone, I have added a list of Brewing Forums to be discussed on the Brew-Rat-Chat on a nightly basis. If you have any Forums that you would like added please email me and let me know what they are and if you would like to host them. Once again the URL of the Brew-Rat-Chat is: http://miso.wwa.com/~skotrat/Brew-Rat-Chat/ Brew-Rat-Chat Forum Schedule: Monday, 7 PM (CST): Extract brewers Forum Tuesday, 7 PM (CST): Ale Brewers Forum Wednesday, 7 PM (CST): Lager Brewers Forum Thursday, 7 PM (CST): Belgian Ale Brewers Forum Friday, 7 PM (CST): All-Grain Brewers Forum Saturday, 7 PM (CST): Trouble Shooters Question & Answer Forum Sunday, 7 PM (CST): Beginner Brewer Forum Later, Scott #################################################### # ThE-HoMe-BrEw-RaT # # Scott Abene <skotrat at wwa.com> # # http://miso.wwa.com/~skotrat # # (Skotrats Official Homebrew "Beer Slut" Webpage) # # OR # # http://miso.wwa.com/~skotrat/Brew-Rat-Chat/ # # (Skotrats Brew-Rat-Chat Homebrew Chat System) # # "Get off your dead ass and brew" # #################################################### Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 4 May 1996 07:40:36 -0400 From: HuskerRed at aol.com Subject: AoB, National HB Day, and HSA Hello Neighbor- A couple of issues I must take issue with, AoB and National Home brewers Day. I think it's great that AoB is going to devote some of it's resources to HBD. I don't think that they would stand to gain much with censorship. If something like that would happen to me, I would go through my last ten issues of HBD and extract all the e-mail address and e-mail all of you my problem, once having a large lynch mob, we would drowned AoB with the complaints. I don't expect this to happen however. Hugh Graham mentioned that Zymurgy might take some tidbit and republish them. They did this to me, but only after asking permission and offering some *beer money*. I let them publish my tip in exchange for a subscription (thanks Dana:-). If they were going to unscrupulous about, they would already be doing it. And now about NHB Day, I think fall is a better time for it if it's to get newbies interested. A friend was sorta interested a couple of months ago but has put off doing much until the fall, citing softball, camping, and his pool as being to time consuming during the summer. Another problem is boiling a couple of gallons of wort for and hour or so heats and humidifies the house. I probably wouldn't of brewed again (or until fall) after my first batch if I would have done it in the middle of August. Since I can brew outside and just bought a chest style freeze, I will be brewing all summer long, got to have that Bohemian Pilsner! - ----- A question about hot side aeration, when does it become a concern? Can HSA happen in the mash and the sparge? Or does boiling remove it's effect and only happen after the boil? Lager on, Jason Henning Big Red Alchemy and Brewing Wealth make materialism easier to bear -- P.J. O'Rourke Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 4 May 1996 08:52:45 -0400 From: BOBKATPOND at aol.com Subject: fetal alcohol syngrome from "Tracy Aquilla" <aquilla at salus.med.uvm.edu> >Nothing personal, but I'm not so sure it's "well known fact"; some say it's >merely folklore. While the perception that an occasional beer might produce >fetal alcohol syndrome is based mostly on ignorance, and I'd honestly like >to believe that the consumption of beer in moderation is good for everyone, >including nursing moms and babes, I prefer to get my facts from documented >resources. Fetal alcohol syndrome has nothing to do with nursing mothers, it is an in utero problem. Here is a quote from Harrison's "Principles of Internal Medicine" since you are such a skeptic. "Cases of fetal alcohol sydrome observed to date have occured only in children born to severely alcoholic mothers who continued to drink heavily (80 ml absolute alcohol per day) thought their pregnancy." Bob Morris Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 04 May 1996 09:00:58 -0400 From: Mark Redman <brewman at vivid.net> Subject: 100% O2 for aeration I've been using 100% Medical Grade O2 (I work in a hospital lab) to aerate my worts for quite some time now with great result. I have an "E" cylinder of O2 with a standard dual guage regulator, connected to 3/16" ID tubing and a SS aerating stone I purchased from Liquid Bread (who also manufacture their own disposable O2 cannisters). I know we have had threads before about how the fear of over-oxygenating the wort is not a worry, since Fix's original calculations of high O2 levels did not take into account that they quickly dropped down to managable levels. My question to the collective masses: Does anybody using 100% O2 vary the amount of oxygenation depending on the style, S.G., and fermenting temp? To give an example, I just brewed another all grain Sierra Nevada Pale Ale clone (yummy) that had an O.G. of 1.050, but finished with a gravity of 1.010 Since the grain bill included 3/4 lb of crystal malt and 1/2 lb of carapils malt I would have thought the final gravity would have been a little higher (BTW, I used Wyeast Chico American ale yeast with a 1 pint starter). I'm guessing that the yeast got a little too giddy from all that O2 (I could occasionally hear squeals of delight emitting from the carboy) and knocked my attenuation up to about 80%. Currently I pre-oxygenate by running O2 into the carboy until the head- space fills with foam, then repeat the process about 3 to 4 times over the next several hours. Is this more than necessary? I know if I was fermenting a doppelbock at 50 degrees I would oxygenate the hell out of the wort with no worry, but I'm guessing that normal gravity ales could probably be happy with only one long burst of O2; normal gravity lagers with 2 to 3 bursts of O2 and high gravity lagers even more. Anybody else have experience in this area? Comments? Suggestions? Financial Contributions? Thanks, Mark Redman brewman at vivid.net http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/4980 Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 4 May 1996 11:05:46 -0500 From: mikeb at flash.net (Michael T. Bell) Subject: Grow Up!!! To all concerned(you know who you are), I think some people here have forgotten what this digest is all about. STOP THE BITCHING!!!!! I think I speak for many when I say that I'm sick of reading a slamfest involving about 4-5 persons that takes up about 50% of this forum. Who cares WHEN National Homebrew Day is. Lets just be happy that there is one. Think about a new brewer looking at the digest for the first time lately. He/she would have run screaming. If you want to verbally asault each other, do it by E-mail or better yet, on the phone so it can be done with quickly. Lets talk about beer for Gods sake and not stick pins in vodoo dolls of each other. I feel much better now, mtb beer is good food Return to table of contents
Date: 4 May 96 11:07:55 MDT (Sat) From: rcd at raven.talisman.com (Dick Dunn) Subject: HBD handoff - *some*body has to do it Regarding handing off the HBD - folks may have valid concerns about the AoB taking over, but come on! Rob needs to give it to someone who will actually DO the work, not just ponder the philosophical implications. I know that Rob made a serious effort to find a new janitor, starting well before the recent "advertising" for the position in the HBD. I'd discussed it with him--since I already handle the cider and mead digests--much earlier. It turned out I wasn't going to be able to do it; I figure I lost any right to gripe about Rob's choice when I made that decision. I assume Rob chased around contacting various plausible candidates and that the general HBD appeal was the last shot at finding someone. If you don't like the choice of AoB, ask yourself why you didn't volunteer to take it on, or who could have taken it instead of AoB...if you don't come up with a good answer, well, there's your explanation. Dealing with a digest can be a lot of hassle, especially with the ever- increasing amount of twisted, misconfigured, just-plain-bad mail software and the fact that most subscribers are careless about unsubscribing or changing addresses when they move on. This makes it hard to find someone to handle a large digest like HBD. If the AoB does OK, there's no problem. If they screw up, it *is* possible to start a new digest--assuming someone cared enough to put the effort into starting and running it. - --- Dick Dunn rcd at talisman.com Boulder County, Colorado USA Turn off the tube. Hang up the phone. Get out of the car. Log off. Get out and live for real! Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 03 May 96 14:09:53 EST From: "William G. Rucker" <ruckewg at naesco.com> Subject: Building a virtual brewery! Hellllooo HBDers, I am starting up a project that I hope might find some interest in some of you fellow brewers. I have been puttering around with some ideas about building a 3 vessel brewery for myself. I have looked around at some of the commercial offerings and they just cost too much money. I have some ideas but am unsure of some of them. I-D-E-A I am going to create a web page that kind of starts with a few design features and using the HBD and private email, design a brewery that suits many tastes. Any and all help will be welcome. No suggestion too small, no comment too weak. I will display as much of the information as I can get on the web. The page should be up in a few days, in the meantime think about what we as "the digest" can do. I am going to guinea pig the final design. I will keep track of all costs and a complete material list. When completed I will provide the designs to any who wish to build it. When construction is complete, hopefully by the fall breweing season, Hi Al, we can fine tune it together and make it as good as it can be. I look forward to your help and the more participation the better. Bill Rucker brewzer at peanut.mv.com please don't reply to the address this Email is coming from. Use the one above. Thanks! Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 04 May 1996 18:40:17 EDT From: "FINLEY, BARRY CURTIS" <BFINLEY at MUSIC.CC.UGA.EDU> Subject: some + and - responses. Hello to all of my fellow brewers. I would like to let everyone know some of the responses I have received in regards to my last post about unnessecary responses and posts. Adam Rich wrote: "Just for the record, I think Coors sucks. The greatest thin about the HBD is that I don't have to worry about someone beating me up for expressing my opinion." Well said Adam, you shouldn't have to worry about getting beat up just because you express your opinion, but that was not the point of my post. I never said that I personally beat up people simply because they have a different opinion than I do. In fact, you completly misunderstood my post. It had nothing to do with me thinking Coors is a good beer or not. I guess I will simplify things for you a bit. The point of the post was to simply let people know that I am tired of reading trash posts that shouldn't have even been written in the first place. I was also trying to get people to quit putting down others simply because they don't like the same types of brews. Isn't that their own opinion? Just as you shouldn't have to worry about expressing your opinion without getting harassed, shouldn' others be afforded the privilege of asking for a receipe without having someone harass them? Enough said. Douglas King wrote: "I just wanted to think you for saying exactly what should have been said a long time ago. We don't need immature, childish responses on HBD; the bashing needs to stop." Hey Douglas, I'm glad to see that you understood what my post was about. J. Todd Hoopes wrote; "There no need to clog up the net with your profanity and protracted whining". To this all I have to say is that If I offended anyone by saying balls (maybe I said asshole too), then I am truly sorry. But I have heard much worse language from 2nd graders. Totally off the subject, I know, but I heard a preacher say GD once. But serioulsy, If my use of words truly offended anyone, I would like to apoligize. To all of you who stand behind me, I thank you very much. To those of you that don't, I did not mean to make you mad. However, I refuse to apoligize to those that think acting unadult-like on HBD is OK. If you have anything important to say to me, please don't think that I will hunt you down and beat you up for expressing your opinion. But I will post nothing further on the subject, since I have nothing else to say about it. Barry C. Finley Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 4 May 96 23:21 MDT From: smclaren at rmi.net (Simon McLaren) Subject: remove me from list Please tell me how to remove myself from your mailling list I am possibly under a defferent address; smclaren at rmii.com Simon McLaren Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 00:01:43 +0900 (JST) From: katayama at st.rim.or.jp (Katayama Katsuyuki) Subject: Please remove me from your mailing list SIGNOFF HOMEBREW Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 00:01:52 +0900 (JST) From: katayama at st.rim.or.jp (Katayama Katsuyuki) Subject: PLEASE REMOVE ME FROM YOUR MAILING LIST SIGNOFF HOMEBREW Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 5 May 1996 09:59:00 -0500 From: ajdel at interramp.com (A. J. deLange) Subject: Decoction/Water analysis Adam Rich asked whether decoction results in "..destruction of protein, from boiling, tannin removal from the husk, and therefore cloudy and astringent beer." It does. Perhaps destruction of protein is a bit strong as the protein is not actually destroyed but rather coagulated and precipitated. This leads to one of the advantages of decoction mashing: much of the trub is left behind in the lauter tun and does not have to be removed from the kettle or the chilled wort later on. Tannins and silicates are, of course, also leached from the grain husks during the decoction boils. Some of these complex with the protein and are removed during lautering but others remain in solution. One of the major reasons for the traditional long lagering times associated with decocted beer production is to give these tannins time to complex with protein and settle out. * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * Pat Humphrey submitted a water analysis and asked for comments. There is some question in my mind as to whether this is of general enough interest to be here or if it should have been put into private e-mail. I'll post it here and you can all let me know whether I should do this in the future or not. mg/L mg/L Hardness, EDTA total 2.4 Alkalinity 251 Chloride 1.6 Fluoride 0.93 Nitrate & NO2 0.01 Sulfate 62 Calcium 40.7 Sodium 35.4 Ammonia-N 0.4 Magnesium 39.1 Potassium 1.9 (ROE) TDS at 180C 3.1? ug/L ug/L Copper 10 Manganese 15 Strontium 1400 Iron 407 Hardness Calc. 262C mg/L pH = ~6.3 The "Hardness, Total EDTA" number is a mystery. Hardness is measured by titration with EDTA. No number involved in the titration calculation comes up 2.4 for this water sample. It's total hardness is 102 ppm Calcium + 162 ppm Magnesium = 264 ppm all as calcium carbonate. This is close to the "Hardness Calc." number and probably differs only because of roundoff error. Thecalcium levels is nice but magnesium is high to the point where you may notice a sour quality to beer made from this water. The big problem with this water is the alkalinity at a whopping 251. This water will have to be decarbonated before use for anything but beers which contain a lot of dark malts. Boiling should work the problem being that you never know how much you precipitate without doing a post boil analysis. You can get hardness test kits from pet stores and you might try that. As most of the hardness is temporary, removing calcium and magnesium will take the alkalinity with it. The problem is that more calcium than magnesium will go and the former is required for mashing. Your sulfate level is already high so that replacement of the lost calcium with gypsum is not an option for many styles of beer but is OK for many ales. Calcium chloride would be a good choice as the chloride level is so low. Sodium is somewhat high but should not be a problem as chloride is so low. The TDS number does not make sense. TDS should be about 500 for this water and it is never, as far as I know, stated at 180C but rather standardized to a lower temperature where it is determined by conductivity which is the ususal case. Iron is not too bad but you may be able to taste it at this level. Iron removal equipment is available for installation in the incoming water line or you can thoroughly aerate the water and then filter it through a foot or so of clean sand. This should get most of the iron out. The strontium is a bit of a surprise but not a problem unless it is Strontium -90 which it isn't or your city wouldn't be supplying you with this water. Do you live in the mid-west? All in all this isn't the greatest brewing water. You may wish to consider installation of RO or ion exchange (anion and cation) equipment for your brewing needs but will then have to add salts to the water for each batch. A.J. deLange Numquam in dubio, saepe in errore! ajdel at interramp.com Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 05 May 1996 14:46:38 -0400 From: Mark Peacock <mpeacock at oeonline.com> Subject: Alternatives to Peche Lambic Accompanying me on business trips to Brussels, my wife developed a taste for peach (peche in Brussels) lambics. I would always stay at the SAS Hotel near the Grand Place and also just a block away from the Mort Subite beer hall. I would hit the gueze while my wife would go after the peche. Here in the US, however, my wife's taste for lambic is a bit expensive -- $5-7/bottle. I'd like to be able to brew a decent alternative without maintaining a refrigerator full of bacteria cultures unless I absolutely have to. My thought is to first try a (style puritans may wish to avert their eyes) fruit wit. If she doesn't like that, I'll move to the infamous Wyeast Brett-ale yeast combo. And if that doesn't do it, I'll give up and do the whole yeast-Brett-Pedio sequential innoculation. Any thoughts/suggestions/warnings would be appreciated. Regards, Mark Peacock Birmingham, MI mpeacock at oeonline.com Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 5 May 1996 14:58:22 -0500 (CDT) From: Cree-ee-py Boy <phillip at mcs.com> Subject: That ole' dingy-white magic So quoth Pat: > Phillip: Thermodynamics and heat transfer are hardly voodoo and black > magic. Well, maybe if you don't understand them. I *understand* heat transfer and thermodynamics. I also, as an experimental physicist, understand the primacy of empirical evidence, and in Batavia throughout most of the summer, the wet t-shirt method *does* *not* *work.* It's too humid to allow much heat loss due to evaporation and too hot for the small effect it has to be enough. Maybe in Detroit one runs the risk of frozen yeast, but here you might as well wave a chicken foot at your fermenter, unless you have a basement or AC. > I take the geek thing as a compliment As any CBS member can tell you, it's not an insult. However, assuming that all or even most of the new brewers will be geeks is a bit optimistic. > - Remember: geeks are a natural resource! Only YOU can > prevent ruined batches! I find most who are not destined for geek-dom tend > towards "the bag" or "the machine" for that first batch. Most - not all. Not sure I believe that; a non-geek might read a newspaper article about brewing, or else watch "The Beer Hunter" and get the CD-ROM, with its shop listings. Heck, maybe they look in the phone book under "Brewing Supplies." Maybe they ask a beer-geek friend. All of these can produce leads to brewing equipment that never get one close to a machine or bag. Regards, Phillip Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 05 May 1996 12:21:30 -0700 From: "Clark D. Ritchie" <ritchie at ups.edu> Subject: Help on Hop Horticulture! All: I need some advice from seasoned hop cultivators out there. I was a little slow in stringing up a trellis for my hop vines this year and in the meantime, one of my vines decided to climb up the lattice work in my back yard. Well, in doing so, it became very tangled very quickly. About two weeks ago, I finally got around to rigging up a some twine for my plants and when it came time to unwind the vine that had chosen my lattice work, I accidentally snapped or broke the vine about 3 feet from its tip. No worries, I thought, so I continued to unwind the vine and later rewound it around the twine. After examining the place where I snapped the vine, I decided that I'd better just cut it off because it was going to die back anyway. So I snipped it off and let it be. Well, yesterday, I was out back examining the condition of my vines and I noticed that on that one plant, the core of the vine had disintegrated about 1.5" from where I cut it and it appears to be rotting out. The rest of the plant looks OK with big, green leaves. Now my question: does it matter if one cuts a hop vine? Better yet, does it matter where on the vine one cuts? On some plants, if you snip near a leaf or other point on the plant, it stunts its growth. Should I re-cut the vine in another location, say near the closest leaf junction? Thanks... CDR PS - I'd also like to chime in and thank Rob for all his hard work with the digest. Like so many others, the HBD has been a wonderful resource of beer-related wisdom. I look forward to future editions! Clark D. Ritchie, ritchie at ups.edu Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 05 May 1996 19:45:06 -0400 From: "Michael S. Branigan" <mikebran at ix.netcom.com> Subject: New Brewing Water Fellow Brewers.... I am in the process of moving to a new home which has a well, rather than city water I am used to for brewing, and had an analysis by a local lab as part of my pre-purchase plan. Naturally, I am concerned about the flexibility I will have for brewing different styles in the future and would like to get some opinions as to what I can expect to brew in my new home. Most of my brewing now is single step infusion all-grain using an Igloo cooler and a steam generator for mashout. Some day I plan to try multi-step mashing with this set-up as I get more experienced. Anyway, here is the test results and would appreciate any opinions or comments on what I can or cannot do with this water. Units are in mg/litre unless otherwise noted. pH = 6.8 Chloride = <5.0 Nitrate = 0.65 Hardness (as CaCO3) = 19.9 Calcium = 5.35 Copper = <0.05 Iron = <0.05 Lead = <0.002 Manganese = <0.02 Sodium = 5.50 Thanks in advance for your comments. - -- ******************************************* Michael S. Branigan E. Greenwich, Rhode Island mikebran at ix.netcom.com MikeB10468 at aol.com ******************************************* Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 05 May 1996 22:15:01 -0400 From: Kit Anderson <kit at maine.com> Subject: Maine Que & Brew The Maine Que & Brew scheduled for May 11-12 has been cancelled by the organizer. He hopes to reschedule in September and apologizes for any inconvenience. Kit Anderson Bath, Maine <kit at maine.com> The Maine Beer Page http://www.maine.com/brew Return to table of contents