Homebrew Digest Friday, 31 May 1996 Number 2055
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FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
Shawn Steele, Digest Janitor
Thanks to Rob Gardner for making the digest happen!
Contents:
typical novice problem (Dckdog at aol.com)
Re: Decoction Mashing (r-brodeur at ds.mc.ti.com (Russ Brodeur))
new beer fridge (Julio Canseco)
Legality ("Michael T. Bell")
Thanks Shawn/Love/Melo-Nell (Bill Rust)
Mini Kegs & CO2 Cylinder ("ADAIR, BENTON E.")
Kosher Beer ("Goodale, Daniel CPT 4ID DISCOM")
Re: Decoction Mashing (dipalma at sky.com (Jim Dipalma))
Bottling Buckets ("David R. Burley")
Bottling Buckets - I don't know why! (Thomas Lowry)
Re: extraction ("Tracy Aquilla")
lager vaseline? ("John K. Sturman Jr.")
Chilling ales prior to bottling (matth at bedford.progress.com (Matthew J. Harper))
Re: Keg Transfer/Quick Connects/ (Rob Moline)
Stout Marinade (jwc at durham.med.unc.edu (John W. Carpenter))
Re: Pneumatic fittings for CO2? (bobcapl at rpnet.net (Bob Caplan))
Weight of Honey/Monty Python (skotrat)
Consipracies (Jack Schmidling)
Brewpid Stewer Trick (Russell Mast)
Fermenting in kegs (George_De_Piro at berlex.com (George De Piro))
quick disconnects, a sex change may be advisable! (Steve Alexander)
pts/lb/gal formula (korz at pubs.ih.att.com (Algis R Korzonas))
bottling buckets (stevep at pcx.ncd.com (Steve Peters))
Weizenbock/Honey (ajdel at interramp.com (A. J. deLange))
Re: Hammer Mills (Jeff Renner)
Washboard or Wood rollers for mill (Dennis Cabell)
RIMS Pump Power (Kirk R Fleming)
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----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Dckdog at aol.com
Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 07:33:08 -0400
Subject: typical novice problem
Howdy, from a first time homebrewer. I am brewing an all malt beer using
Superbrau dark, hopped and unhopped. I added Perle hop pellets and used
Superbrau yeast. The first 36 hours of fermentation were quite active but
stalled rather abruptly. I called the brewer's supply and they suggested a
hot water bath for the fermenter which stimulated some activity, they also
suggested transfering the wort to another fermenter to wake up the yeast,
which I also did. Sp. grav. was 1.026, the wort tasted like beer (much to my
relief) but was quite turbid and sweet, suggesting the obvious that it still
had a ways to go. Any help would be greatly appreciated, should I add more
yeast? House temp is 62-67 degrees, should I buy a brew belt to keep the
fermenter warm? Am I worrying too much?
Thanks,
Dean
Dckdog at aol.com
Return to table of contents
From: r-brodeur at ds.mc.ti.com (Russ Brodeur)
Date: Thu, 30 May 96 09:25:56 -0400
Subject: Re: Decoction Mashing
>From: Wallinger <wawa at datasync.com>
> When I scooped 1.25 gallon of decoct from the 8 pounds of grain and 2
gallons of water (the =
>decoct being almost all grain) and boiled it I ended up with a temp =
>increase from 122 to 136. The calcs would suggest that I only pulled 2/3 =
>gallon of 100% grain to achieve this miserable increase in temperature. =
>I infused enough boiling water to hit 142 for saccharification. My =
>second decoct was another 1.25 gallon of very thick composition, and =
>this only raised the mash to 144F!!! Could someone more experienced
describe >the thickness of a thick decoct in either subjective or technical
terms?
>
My analysis:
1. 8 qts/8 lbs = 1.0 qt/lb --> this is a bit on the low side
* The recommended water/grist ratio is ~ 1.3 qt/lb
* The lower ratio used makes it difficult to separate the thick and thin
2. Make sure to draw off enough decoct. The rule-of-thumb is supposed to
be ~1/3 of the mash. I generally decoct ~ 1/2 when they call for 1/3, just
to be on the safe side. It is far easier to cool some of the decoct to the
target temp than to raise the temp of the entire mash using unscheduled
infusions of boiling water.
3. If the "thick" decoct is "too thick", eg. a strainer is used to separate
the grist from the liquid, the decoct will not have a great enough heat
capacity to raise the temp of the main mash to the desired level. Water has
a much higher heat capacity than grain (at least on a volume basis). I
"discovered" this the hard way!
* IMHO, the ideal decoction thickness is such that there is liquid
throughout the grains, but no free liquid on top of them. This should leave
plenty of thin, enzyme-rich mash in the mash-tun.
* Of course, as conversion proceeds, the liquid/grist ratio will
increase in the decoction, especially when going from 122- 145F.
4. Boil the ! at #$ out of the decoction!!!
* I have found that even though the decoction is "boiling", or
bubbling, its overall temp is not there yet. It just "appears" to be boiling.
* I let it go at a good rolling boil for at least 10 min to ensure the
temp reaches boiling.
When I originally switched form extract to all-grain, I bought "Brewing
Lager Beer", by Greg Noonan, and immediately plunged into decoction mashing
in 10 gal batch-sizes. The 8 h+ brew days and frustrations associated with
trying to hit the desired temp finally led me to switch to simpler infusion
schedules, although I still used a mash-out decoction. I have recently
returned to decoction mashing for my lagers and German-style ales. In
particular, I find the technique advantageous to those wishing to use G.
Fix's 40-60-70 mash profile. Doing a decoction to go from 40-60 C produces
a great deal of soluble carbo's which are readily digested by beta-amylase
at the 60 C rest. BTW, almost ALL the grist must be decocted to raise the
temp from 40 - 60 C.
TTFN --<- at
Russ Brodeur (r-brodeur at ds.mc.ti.com)
Franklin, MA
Return to table of contents
From: Julio Canseco <JCANSECO at uga.cc.uga.edu>
Date: Thu, 30 May 96 09:42:06 EDT
Subject: new beer fridge
Greetings,
I will be able to acquire a brand new fridge destined for beer. Can it
be used for lagering as is without a fancier temperature control gadget?
Has anyone used a fridge with the thermostat it came with? Does the
inside temperature vary enough to hurt beer? The fridge will go in the
garage where ambient temperature can get pretty darn hot here in Georgia.
Comments will be welcomed.
On a separate note, for those coming to Athens for the soccer or volleball
olympics, the first brew pub has recently opened. I have yet to try the
Athens Brewing Co. but in the middle of the summer with temperatures in
the high nineties and turists dropping like flies I am sure it will be
like an oasis.
Come visit,
Julio Canseco, Architect
Physical Plant
Engineering Dept.
Ph. 706-542-7490
FAX.706-542-7630
*****UGA host to olympic soccer, volleball and rhythmic gymnastics****
*****1996*****
Return to table of contents
From: "Michael T. Bell" <mikeb at flash.net>
Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 09:09:56 -0500
Subject: Legality
Greg Ding writes,
> The owner of a small restaurant/pub wants to enter into an arrangement
> with me where he sells my homebrew, offering it as a house brand.
>
> Do any of you know if/how this can be done legally? (the restaurant is,
> in Pennsylvania if that matters)
>
> TIA,
>
In many states(disclaimer), not all, It is illegal to sell beer made at
your place of residence. You would have to brew it in the facillity that was
going to be sold and the owner would have to conform to any state
regulations concerning brewing.
Depending on your zoning, you could make your house a brewery. The
downside of this is the cost (thousands) of meeting state codes.
- --
- -mtb
beer is good food
Michael T. Bell
E- mail: mikeb at flash.net
Home: 817.468.8849
Fax: 817.468.7121
Return to table of contents
From: Bill Rust <wrust at csc.com>
Date: Thu, 30 May 96 10:22 EDT
Subject: Thanks Shawn/Love/Melo-Nell
Good Day, ey?
Looks like things are getting back to normal(?) on the ol' HBD!
Chris Cooper says:
>Secondly, I'd like to say thanks to Shawn for his diligence and work in
> moving the home of the HBD. A few bugs always show up when an information
> system is moved from one host to another but they are being resolved in
> a very timely manner! Your efforts are appreciated.
Here here! As a software developer, let me chime in by saying it's that
it's not easy to move a significant piece of software from one UNIX system
to another, considering the variety of hardware out there. Then there is
the matter of training the new administrator, and all of this without
interrupting service (so to speak). I think the transfer was handled
admirably.
Russell Mast says:
>I love you guys. No, I mean it. I really love you guys.
Fine. You can *have* my Bud Light, really!
Bryan Schwab says:
> In preperation of my first melomel I have ask;
> Is tai-tai honey an adequate choice if thats all I have available
> [13 pounds] on hand?
Shouldn't that be melo-Nell? (Get it? 'tai-tai in the wind'...)
> Why does one add the fruit to the must instead of during the secondary
> fermentation process? Is this method of adding the fruit to the
> secondary completely forbidden or can it be done successfully?
> I plan on using at least 6-8 pounds of fresh orange along with 6
> pounds of fresh raspberries without the use of any hops, but citrus
> acid will be used along with a yeast nitrient for the champange yeast.
> Would one turn this into a sparkling Melomel upon bottling by the use
> of corn sugar [ 3/4-1 cup] or leave it still?
You asked a mouthful! Usually, I add fruit first so that I can remove the
pulp/seeds/skins (whatever) after a few days, then strain and top off with
water. I have also added fruit later, but it sort of depends on the fruit.
I've seen it done with raspberries and cherries, but I hear it's *not*
recommended for raisins or very pulpy fruit. You also need to be careful
about pectin which will cloud up your final product. As far as leaving it
still or making it sparkling, that depends on the alcohol %, attenuation of
the yeast, whether or not you use campden, or some other method of
inhibiting bacteria growth (including yeast). I suggest you find a good
book on meads. There is a nice section in a book called _Country Wines_
(author unknown). For sparkling meads, I've had great success with
Papazian's method (NCJOHB).
Skol.
---------------------------------------------------------------------
| Yes, it's grain...which any fool can eat;
Bill Rust | but, for which the Lord intended a more
Master Brewer | divine means of consumption. Let us give
Jack Pine Savage Brewery | praise to our maker and glory to his
Shiloh, IL (NACE) | bounty, by learning about beer. FRIAR TUCK
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Return to table of contents
From: "ADAIR, BENTON E." <ADAIRBE at austy944a.aust.tdprs.state.tx.us>
Date: Thu, 30 May 96 09:36:00 PDT
Subject: Mini Kegs & CO2 Cylinder
I don't have a kegging system (yet) nor do I plan to use mini-kegs.
However I thought those of you who do use the mini kegs may be
interested in this info. Apparently the 'Carbonator' (used on 2 liter
plastic bottles) can be used as an adapter on mini keg taps. The
'Carbonator' can fit where the CO cartridge screws in when retrofitted
with a Grolsh gasket and then a regular kegging system's CO tank can be
hooked up.
Has anyone ever tried this? Sounds interesting for transporting
sample/party quantities of home-brosia.
please reply to the list,
TIA
-ben
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From: "Goodale, Daniel CPT 4ID DISCOM" <GoodaleD at HOOD-EMH3.ARMY.MIL>
Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 10:01:00 -0500
Subject: Kosher Beer
Dear collective,
I have a Jewish friend for whom I would
like to brew some Kosher beer. I am woefully
ignorant of Jewish dietary laws.
1. Would I need Rabbinical supervision of the
entire brewing process or would an inspection
of the ingredients be OK?
2. Could I use malt extract as it has been
already processed (I guess the malting process
for grains would be in the same category).
3. Is there such a thing as Kosher malt extract or
Kosher malted grain? Where could I get it?
4. Is there a traditional Jewish style of beer?
5. Is there a fee structure for Rabbinical supervision?
6. Would I need the Rabbi's signature on the label?
7. Is this a bridge too far for the ordinary home
brewer?
Any help would be appreciate. Private E-mail
is fine at:
goodaled at hood-emh3.army.mil
or
goodaled at n-link.com
TIA. Daniel Goodale (yes that is my real name)
The Biohazard Brewing Company
Sure its gonna kill ya, but who wants to live forever?
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From: dipalma at sky.com (Jim Dipalma)
Date: Thu, 30 May 96 11:02:28 EDT
Subject: Re: Decoction Mashing
Hi All,
In HBD #2054, Wade Wallinger writes about his first decoction mash:
>1. I developed heat and material balance equations for determining the =
>strike temperatures for each decoction. It seems to me that the heat =
>capacity of the decoction and the heat capacity of the remaining stuff =
>can be approximated by making an estimate of the volume of grain and =
>liquid pulled with each decoction. I assumed that the 'gravity' of the =
>grain was 12 pounds per gallon and water 8.3 pounds per gallon.
I'm not entirely sure we're talking about the same thing, but when I fill
a 1 gallon ziplog bag with grain, it weighs just about 5 pounds, not 12. If
you relied on this measurement, then I think you didn't pull enough for the
thick decoctions.
>2. What led me to the first question is that these equation do not match =
>what I did in reality (damn theory). I was led to believe from the =
>literature that a thick decoction should be pulled.
Absolutely. Take as little liquid as possible when pulling the thick
decoction. The mash liquid contains most of the enzymes, you want to leave
them in the rest mash.
What I do is tip the tun so the liquid runs to one side, then use a small
saucepan to scoop grain from the "high" side of the tun, ensuring I get
mostly grain with very little liquid. Once I've transferred the decoction to
the decoction kettle, I add about 3/4 gallon of boiling water to the
decoction.
The extra water helps prevent scorching the decoction (a critical point),
*and*
starts your temperature boost. I.e., adding grist from a rest mash at 115F to
the boiling water in the decoction vessel boosts the temp to ~140F
immediately.
I only need to run the decoction burner for a few minutes to get to sacc.
rest,
saving both time and propane. While the decoction is boiling, the extra water
is lost as steam, so the rest mash doesn't get too thin when the decoction is
added back.
>When I scooped 1.25 =
>gallon of decoct from the 8 pounds of grain and 2 gallons of water (the =
>decoct being almost all grain) and boiled it I ended up with a temp =
>increase from 122 to 136.
>My =
>second decoct was another 1.25 gallon of very thick composition, and =
>this only raised the mash to 144F!!! I was quite dismayed. I must be =
>pulling too thick a mash (or my thermometer is broken or my eyeballs are =
>skewed).
You definitely are not pulling enough grain, that's why you're undershooting
the target temperatures. This can be a real problem if you mash in a cooler
as I do, and can't heat the tun directly.
I just eyeball it, and pull about half the grain. If you are unsure as to
whether you have pulled enough grain, guess high rather than low. If you pull
too much, what will happen is that you'll hit the target temperature and
still have some of the boiled decoction left. Simply cool the remaining
decoction to the desired temperature, which usually takes just a few minutes,
then add it back.
>Could someone more experienced describe the =
>thickness of a thick decoct in either subjective or technical terms?
It should have roughly the same consistency as loose oatmeal. If in doubt,
use more water (not mash liquid!) rather than less. It's much easier to avoid
scorching the decoction if you have a little more water in the kettle.
>3. For those who are still with me, I am also curious about the risk of =
>HSA. I ladeled the stuff from each decoct into the mash by the (big) =
>spoonful with occasional stirring. I am concerned that I overheated the =
>remaining grain by piling up a few spoonfuls on the surface of the mash =
>before each stir. Even moreso, I am concerned that I introduced HSA by =
>ladeling the stuff in from a height of perhaps a foot. Is splotching the =
>decoct back into the mash risky behavior? Do I need protection?
Yes, this is a big problem. The boiled decoction is both very hot, and very
high in melanoidin content, two prime conditions for HSA to occur. It is very
important to transfer the decoction and combine the mashes with as little
splashing and agitation of the mash as possible. Transfer gently, and use a
folding rather than a stirring motion when combining the decoction and rest
mashes. It's also *EXTREMELY* important that the decoction and rest mashes be
thoroughly combined. If pockets of unconverted starch remain in the rest mash
due to inadequate combination, starch will be leeched into the wort during
lautering, and a starch haze will result.
Wade, I'm going to forward a copy of a handout I used about a year ago when
I demonstrated decoction mashing for the members of my homebrewing club. If
you'll read it, I think it will help answer many of your questions. Drop
some email if you still have any questions.
Cheers,
Jim dipalma at sky.com
Return to table of contents
From: "David R. Burley" <103164.3202 at CompuServe.COM>
Date: 30 May 96 11:13:39 EDT
Subject: Bottling Buckets
Dave Mercer asks why can't he add bottling sugar to his secondary and bottle
directly, being concerned about contamination possiblities from using the
bottling bucket.
First of all, the major concern when adding sugar solution for bottling is
uniformity of distribution throughout the beer. With five or ten gallons of
liquid with a density and viscosity near 1.00 and a sugar solution with a much
higher density and viscosity, getting good mixing is very difficult just by
stirring in. Adding the sugar solution to the bucket and then the beer will
ensure better mixing. You are right about possible contamination, but I think
the posssibility of oxidation of the beer ( particularly if it has been
lagered
in a carboy and is virtually still, i.e. no residual CO2) is even more likely
and perhaps even more devastating. Recently, a first time, young woman brewer
(
who had been extremely careful about sanitation, preparation, temperatures,
etc.) came to me with a problem. Her problem had all the manifestations of
improper mixing- blown bottles and flat bottles. Turns out she added bottling
sugar to the secondary and obviously didn't stir well enough. So that's the
risk you take. Oxidation and contamination with bottling buckets, non-uniform
carbonation, with the attendant broken bottles, flat beers. foamy beers, etc.,
without.
HOWEVER, I've been brewing since 1968 ( yep, before it was legalized - thanks
Blue Ribbon) and have never used a bottling bucket because of the above
problems. I use what has been largely poo-pooed in Pap's book
( I think) and by others as too labor intensive or maybe old fashioned, since
adding sugar to bottles was the old Prohibition technology. I add a measuring
spoon of cool, boiled sugar SOLUTION to each bottle and then add the beer
directly from the secondary fermenter. Adding the sugar solution takes me less
than five minutes and I don't really find it tedious. I avoid the possibility
of contamination and oxidation and I know for sure if I get an undercarbonated
bottle that "it isn't ready to drink yet ",because I know the correct amount
of
sugar has been added to each bottle.
In all these years ( has it really been almost thirty?!) I have never had a
burst bottle. Knock on wood!
Try this method, I think you will be pleased.
Dave Burley
103164,3202 or
INTERNET:103164.3202 at compuserve.com
Return to table of contents
From: Thomas Lowry <lowry at ce.pdx.edu>
Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 08:38:19 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Bottling Buckets - I don't know why!
To David Mercer,
I too have recently gone to pouring my priming sugar directly into my
secondary carboy. The first time I did it, I had various levels of
carbonation, obviously due to lack of complete mixing. I recently
bottled another batch 1 1/2 weeks ago and will start to 'crack' some of
those this weekend. I was much more careful to make sure I completely
mixed the the priming sugar in with the beer, using a long stemmed spoon
to push the dry hop bag (its a very bitter recipe for a California Common
Beer - one of my favorites!) up and down within the secondary. I too
would be interested to hear from anyone else who uses this method. If I
don't get consistent carbonation on this second batch, I will probably go
back to using the bottling bucket (unless someone else convinces me
otherwise).
Tom Lowry
Return to table of contents
From: "Tracy Aquilla" <aquilla at salus.med.uvm.edu>
Date: Thu, 30 May 96 11:39:07 CDT
Subject: Re: extraction
In Digest #2053:
Bill Giffin <billg at maine.com> wrote:
>10% of additional extract say from 30 PPG to 33 PPG
>WILL improve your beer.
Please explain HOW. It seems to me that getting 10% of additional extract
does little more than save a few pennies. Exactly how does that improve the
beer?
Tracy
Return to table of contents
From: "John K. Sturman Jr." <jsturman at coffey.com>
Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 10:47:04 +0000
Subject: lager vaseline?
This is strange...
I just brewed a lager using 6# DWC pilsener and 1.5# flaked corn.
Mashed
in at 125 F for 20 minutes, removed 1/3 decoction and returned to raise
mash to ~ 154 F and rested until conversion. Took second 1/3 decoction
and raised mash to ~ 175 F for mash out. Collected 7 gallons wort and
boiled ~ 90 minutes. Chilled and pitched 48 hour old, 18 oz. St. Louis
Lager starter into 55 F wort. Bubbles appeared in airlock after ~ 12
hours. The problem is there is a LOT of vaseline-looking stuff floating
on top of the wort in the carboy. I have brewed lots of beer, but not
many lagers, and I have never used flaked corn. The wort is already
fairly clear, and the sediment layer on the bottom is mainly hallertau
and saaz hops, but this floating gunk is absolutely amazing! LOTS of
vaseline-like stuff, sort of formed in ribbons, fibers and clumps that
(honestly) resemble brains. Has anybody experienced this? I have never
heard of it, please help...
jsturman at coffey.com
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From: matth at bedford.progress.com (Matthew J. Harper)
Date: Thu, 30 May 96 13:09:08 EDT
Subject: Chilling ales prior to bottling
I've been reading about and contemplating a lot lately about chilling down
my brews after fermentation to help settle stuff out. I tend to brew
ales (since I haven't adapted my spare fridge to do lagers yet) and was
curious
if anyone else does this.
I figgered I could rack to a secondary (maybe) and then put the carboy into
the
fridge for a day or so.
If you do this:
1) How long do you chill it for?
2) What's the maximum I should consider chilling it for before I have to pitch
extra yeast at bottling time to get the beer to prime properly?
3) Is it worth it?
Have you noticed any improvements in your beer that you can really attribute
to the process, such as clarity or less astringent tastes & off flavors?
Thanks all!
Private email or HBD is fine.
- -Matth
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From: Rob Moline <brewer at kansas.net>
Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 11:27:12 -0500
Subject: Re: Keg Transfer/Quick Connects/
>From: jltaylor at ix.netcom.com (John Taylor)
>Subject: Transfering between Kegs
>
>What is the best way to transfer beer out of a one keg into another.
>The beer is under light pressure (5-10 psi)
Prepare the receiving keg with slightly less co2 pressure than is currently
in the dispensing keg. Hok up the beer out line from the dispensing keg to
the beer out line of the receiving keg. Put co2 pressure at what you
consider normal dispensing pressure, say 12 psi, on the co2 side of the
dispensing keg. As flow occurs, simply release co2 from the receiving keg
until the transfer is complete. I always allow a few minutes, post transfer
to re-establish full pressurization, so the customers beer isn't a wee bit
flat.
>From: Marty Tippin <martyt at sky.net>
>Subject: Pneumatic fittings for CO2?
>
>Has anyone used the quick-disconnect type fittings designed for air
>compressors, etc. in a CO2 kegging system?
>My only real concerns are that a.) the fittings may not be 100% airtight and
>could leak, wasting CO2 and generally being unsafe and b.) there might be
>grease or other stuff in the fittings that I don't want in my beer. Are
>either of these problems I should worry about?
I use these fittings. New ones don't have any grease on them. The only
problem occurs when pressure differentials allow beer to flow back to them
past a sticking check valve. The female portion is usually brass, with a
ferrous steel spring with in, and the male portion is often ferrous and they
rust. I have seen all brass males, made by Dixon, but have been unable to
find them at my normal suppliers. Foxx in Kansas City has some pretty nice
and fairly cheap plastic quick connects, that have shut offs in both male
and female units.They work just fine. I also use a silicone based food grade
(for incidental contact) spray lubricant to keep the o-rings on the plastic
units in shape. The metal unit are reliably air tight, 'cept when corrosion
has occurred, andwhile disconnected. When connected, I have never had a
leak. But when corroded, they are often difficult to connect and disconnect.
If anyone knows where to find the Dixon units, please let me know. The male
unit says "Dixon DCP-20" and the female is the highest quality Q-C I ahve
ever used. Just wish I could find more of them!
>From: Pete Farrow <pfarrow at unix.sri.com>
>To make 2.5 gals, can you just halve a recipe or is there a formula/
All kinds of things change when you scale up or down, but for the relatively
modest change you propose, I would simply halve the recipe, make it, see
what it's like and then adjust accordingly. Gets a lot more problematic when
scaling up from 5 gallons to 7 BBl's!
>From: JEFFREY.T.ANDERSON at x400gw.ameritech.com
>Subject: 1.25 lb CO2 Tank
>I recently came across some 1.25lb CO2 cylinders, and no one can
>identify them. I am hoping one of you might have some insight. They are
>11 inches tall including the head valve and 3 inches in diameter.
>
>The cylinders were manufactured by Luxfer USA Limited, Riverside,
>California
Sounds like some of the specialized gas cylinders that I have seen used in
hospitals for running Aortic Balloon Pumps, and perfusion machines, etc. I
know Luxfer is a manufacturer of medical devices, the most obvious examples
being the head light units you see surgeons wear.
If the manufacturer knows nothing about them, you might keep one for a
souvenir and throw the rest away. You have already learned that one supplier
wouldn't refill it, although I'm sure that if the tank tested out fine,
there would be no reason why "I" wouldn't replace the valve assembly myself
with a unit from Foxx or Rapids.
But just because I would do it is no recommendation that you do it. But my
reasoning would be, if the tank is tested and certified to a certain
pressure standard by a reputable facility, what the hell difference does it
make what kind of valve is on the top? (Exotic and un-available threads to
prevent such a move notwithstanding.) As long as the valve is rated for that
purpose?
Actually, sounds like just the thing for sending out with kegs rather than
party pumps! Sized right, in any case.
>From: Ulick Stafford <ulick at indigo.ie>
>Dublin's first brewpub opens today (Wednesday).
Hail to Irish Brewers!
>From: Richard Gardner <rgardner at monarch.papillion.ne.us>
>Subject: Iodophor precipitate/white deposit in carboy
>
--- I found a coating
>of a milky (chalky) white deposit in the glass carboy
> Any suggestions on how to clean the carboy?
Try a caustic solution.
Rob Moline
Little Apple Brewing Company
Manhattan, Kansas
"The more I know about beer, the more I realize I need to know more about
beer!"
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From: jwc at durham.med.unc.edu (John W. Carpenter)
Date: Thu, 30 May 96 13:55:42 EDT
Subject: Stout Marinade
Sorry about the empty message yesterday, I don't know how that happened.
I'll try again now.....
I reciently made the marinade below with steaks and thought it was great.
I had some of the marinade left over, so I just used the Guinness bottle
to store the rest in the refrigerator, after recapping. About a week later
we decided to cook some hamburgers on the grill, and I thought it might be
good to mix the remaining marinade with the burger. We used about 8 oz
of the marinade in 2 lbs burger. I think they were the best burgers I've
ever eaten. The taste comes through even if you load the burger up with
lettuce, tomato, cheese, onions, or whatever.
Here's the recipe for the marinade and directions. This is by Joseph
Ascoli, executive chef of the Camden Harbour Inn in Camden, Maine. Taken
from Zymurgy(Vol 19, Number 2) Summer 1996 issue, page 30.
Enough for 1 steak, multiply as necessary.
2 cloves garlic
1 tsp shallot (3g)
1 tbsp Vidalia onion (15g)
1/4 tsp fresh tarragon (1g)
1/4 tsp parsley (1g)
1 tsp Worcestershire sause (10g)
1 tsp Dijon mustard (10g)
4 oz Guinness Stout or Samuel Smith's Oatmeal Stout (118 ml) (room temp.)
1 oz tamari (30 ml) (or dark soy sauce)
1/8 tsp black pepper, coarsely ground (1g)
1/8 tsp salt (1g)
(1) Finely chop garlic, challot and onion and place in a small bowl.
(2) Finely chop parsley and tarragon and add to the bowl.
(3) Add the Worcestershire, Dijon, Guinness, tamari and seasonings then mix
well to combine. Let stand for 30 minutes to blend flavors.
(4) Place the ribeye in the marinade and make sure it is well-coated.
Cover the bowl and place in the refrigerator for 30 minutes or overnight
if being used for a picnic entree the following day.
(5) Preheat the gas, charcoal or wood grill until the ashes are gray, thn
cook the ribeye.
(6) Place the remaining marinade in a small saucepan on the grill and
reduce it for one or two minutes until slightly thickened. Add more beer
to the marinade at this stage, if desired. Pour over the ribeye and serve.
John Carpenter - jwc at med.unc.edu
Chapel Hill, NC
**** Never Trust a Brewer with an ****
O|~~| inseam larger than his waistline. |~~|O
Return to table of contents
From: bobcapl at rpnet.net (Bob Caplan)
Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 19:17:55 -0700
Subject: Re: Pneumatic fittings for CO2?
>From: Marty Tippin <martyt at sky.net>
>Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 09:15:48 -0500
>Subject: Pneumatic fittings for CO2?
>
>Has anyone used the quick-disconnect type fittings designed for air
>compressors, etc. in a CO2 kegging system?
Marty,
I've used pneumatic quick-disconnect on the air side of kegs for 5 years.
As long as they're connected, male to female, I've never had a problem, no
air loss. Here's a kicker, I also use quick-disconnects on the beer side
when kegging to sankey kegs, and also out of a sankey to bottles for comps
or carrying. Not a hitch, if it'll hold liquid, it'll hold air.... Go for
it. BTW, I sometimes spray some WD40 on em, 'cause they often get bathed in
Iodophor and get a little sticky. Still no problem.
GOODtime Bob
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From: skotrat <skotrat at wwa.com>
Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 13:29:26 -0500
Subject: Weight of Honey/Monty Python
>Subject: Weight of Honey
>I have a honey porter recipe that calls for 3lbs of honey. The place I
>called for honey prices only sells by the pint or quart. Does anybody know
>the weight of honey?
>Ted Davidson
Ted,
African or European?
- -Scott
################################################################
# ThE-HoMe-BrEw-RaT #
# Scott Abene <skotrat at wwa.com> #
# http://miso.wwa.com/~skotrat (the Homebrew "Beer Slut" page) #
# OR #
# http://miso.wwa.com/~skotrat/Brew-Rat-Chat/ (Brew-Rat-Chat) #
# "Get off your dead ass and brew" #
# "If beer is liquid bread, maybe bread is solid beer" #
################################################################
Return to table of contents
From: Jack Schmidling <arf at maxx.mc.net>
Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 13:45:39 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: Consipracies
>From: Russell Mast <rmast at fnbc.com>
Jack, babe, give it a rest. Take it to private e-mail. Your mill works
great. Now leave some bandwidth for the rest of us to talk about
brewing.
You are absolutely right. You can't imagine what a trauma it
is for me to wake up in the morning and face another day of
defending my country from the Bilderburgers, The CFR and the
Freemen. Add to that the outpouring of hate and malice
directed at two pieces of steel with nothing more than a birth
defect. Where is the Lambda Legal Defence Fund when we
need them? Skewed Roller Syndrome (SRS) is an inherited
disease and we must insist they get their civil rights.
Then, can you imagine with what a heavy heart, I impune the
wisdom of such brewing greats as De Clerck? I dread the
flood of hate mail this will generate and ponder calling
Dr Death rather than face the horror of wasting more bandwith
on trivia when I could be devoting my energy to such profound
brewing questions as "what to do when a pub shorts my pint?
You know what really bugs me?
I draw a pint from my keg and by the time I sit down with it
and a bowl of popcorn, it's not full anymore. It's the bloody
Conspiracy of Foam!
***********************
Visit our Web page for product flyers, applications info and other
totally unbiased opinions from the World's Greatest Brewer.
http://dezines.com/ at your.service/jsp/
js
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From: Russell Mast <rmast at fnbc.com>
Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 14:05:53 -0500
Subject: Brewpid Stewer Trick
> From: "Herb B Tuten" <herb at zeus.co.forsyth.nc.us>
> Subject: Stupid Brewer Trick / Repitching
> I finally discovered that the plastic wrap
> had sealed around the mouth of the 'boy and racking cane. No
> air coming into carboy means no beer coming out ! Kids, don't
> try this at home. A piece of foil works much better.
I just leave it open to the air. Unless someone is dusting the house
at the time, or smoking big stogies in the room, or you have a four year
old running around and sneezing, the short period of time you have the 'boy
opened to rack is not much to risk infection.
> Here's an easy way to repitch that I just tried. After racking to
> secondary, pour the leftover trub/slurry/sediment into some
> sanitized bottles and cap them. Put these into a fridge. Weeks
> later....
Weeks later, they explode! Happened to Jake recently. Make fer dang
sure it's done fermenting and not infected. One thing you can do to
minimize risk is to use swing-top (Grolsch, etc) bottles, and release
the top briefly every so often, to make sure it's not restarted.
What I do more often is simply wait to rack until I'm ready to brew again,
and just pour the cooled wort into the old primary without cleaning. Works
great.
> From: Steve_Rosenzweig at wb.xerox.com (Rosenzweig,Steve)
> Subject: oh no! not another grain mill posting!!
> First I need to figure some way to put the roller hardware in a new set
> of rollers: there's the first decision - best roller material . . .
Marble. (Assuming you can't afford corundum.)
- -Russell Mast,
copyright 1996 Fred Frith
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From: George_De_Piro at berlex.com (George De Piro)
Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 15:48:22 -0700
Subject: Fermenting in kegs
I read a posting about fermenting in Sankey kegs. While I have
actually not used it yet, I have prepared a keg for use as a
fermenter. Mine will be easy to scrub out by hand because I cut a
hole in the top (~9 inches across-22 cm if you're metric). "How will
you do closed fermentations in such a thing?" you may ask. Here's
how:
1. Solder 4 machine screws at each compass point around the hole,
about 1/2" from the rim of the hole.
2. Cut a piece of Plexiglas large enough to fit over the hole and
screws.
3. Drill holes in the Plexiglas so that it can be fit over the
screws.
4. Use a piece of vinyl tubing or the like as a gasket to form an
airtight seal between the keg and the Plexiglas.
5. Oh yeah, drill a hole in the Plexiglas that will fit a stopper
(for the airlock - don't want to make a bomb!)
6. After you put your cooled wort in the keg/fermenter, put the
gasket in place between the rim of the hole and the screws, slip the
Plexiglas over the screws and secure it with wing nuts. Put a stopper
and airlock in the hole and you're set.
I had a valve welded near the bottom so I will (hopefully) never have
to siphon again. Having not used it yet, I don't know if the yeast
cake will be in the way of my valve.
This fermenter will be easy to clean with ordinary elbow grease. By
the way, you shouldn't sanitize stainless steel with bleach - it's
corrosive to it. Use iodine or just fill the fermenter with some
water and boil it a while. It doesn't have to be full, the steam will
kill whatever is on the sides (notice how hot the sides get). Just
cover the hole on top with a metal lid when doing this to keep the
interior hotter.
I'm planning on using this contraption next week. I'll keep the
Digested posted (I know you all can't wait!). If anybody out there
has already done this, how did it go?
George_De_Piro at Berlex.com
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From: Steve Alexander <stevea at clv.mcd.mot.com>
Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 15:57:54 -0400
Subject: quick disconnects, a sex change may be advisable!
Regarding the use of quick disconnects(QD) for CO2 lines,
Wade Wallinger writes ...
> .... i =
>put the female on the CO2 bottle side. i then have several devices =
>outfitted with the male fitting: ....
the main line to my distribution header =
>for the kegs, a stand-alone pin-lock fitting if i want to take the =
>bottle and one keg somewhere, a stand-alone ball lock fitting for the =
>Carbonator, and a valve that i use to sweep air from the headspace of =
>carboys on racking.
The female QD fittings are closed when disconnected, open when
connected. The male QD fittings are open at all times. This is true at
least for type 'M' QDs, and I suspect for all common ones. If you are
pressurizing a keg and the QD opens either by accidentally tugging it,
or by unthinkingly opening it, then male side will be open, the female
side closed.
If this accident occurs in Wade's arrangement, with the female QD on
the -CO2 tank- side, then you save your CO2, but you are sprayed by
beer foam from the suddenly depressurized keg and have a mess to clean
up. In Wade's arrangement, you must be careful to *always* remove the
keg (pin or ball) gas side fitting before opening the QD.
Alternatively, if the female is on the -keg- side when this accident
occurs, then you just lose a little CO2. The order in which you
remove fittings is unimportant, except for the potential loss of a
little CO2.
The other issue is connector cost. The male QD is about $1, the
female QD is ~$4, and as Wade points out you really just need 1 CO2
tank connection, but a number of exit side connections. It costs a bit
more but a male connector on the CO2 side can prevent a messy
mistake.
Steve Alexander
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From: korz at pubs.ih.att.com (Algis R Korzonas)
Date: Thu, 30 May 96 14:59:05 CDT
Subject: pts/lb/gal formula
Kerry asks about the pts/lb/gal formula. Well, I'll post since there's
another half to it, which I don't recall ever being posted.
To calculate how many pts/lb/gal you got, multiply the OG pts. by the gallons
and then divide by the number of pounds of grain or extract you used.
For example, if you got 5 gallons of 1.050 wort from 9 pounds of grain,
the math would be (5*50)/9 = 27.78 pts/lb/gal.
Once you know how many pts/lb/gal you are getting from each grain and
extract, you can estimate your OG by multiplying all the grains/extracts
times their pts/lb/gal values and then dividing by the number of gallons
you are making (I'm just making up numbers here):
5 pounds of M&F Pale Ale malt 5 * 28 = 140
1 pound of DWC CaraVienne malt 1 * 24 = 24
2 pounds of M&F light DME 2 * 45 = 90
----
total points 254
divided by 5 gallons 50.80
expected OG: 1.051
Al.
Al Korzonas, Palos Hills, IL
korz at pubs.att.com
Copyright 1996 Al Korzonas
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From: stevep at pcx.ncd.com (Steve Peters)
Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 16:00:13 -0700
Subject: bottling buckets
>I looked at my beer, sitting nice and
>clear in its secondary, and I thought to myself, "Self? Why are you going to
>go to all that hassle to rack this beer into a plastic bucket only to have a
>large surface area exposed to toxic oxygen and invisible critters when you
>could 'pitch' the priming sugar solution directly into the secondary, gently
>mix, then bottle directly from the fermenter. No fuss, no muss." So that's
>what I did. Did I independently arrive at a no-brainer that everyone else
>has known for years? Or is my beer ruined? Seriously, what purpose do
>bottling buckets serve if you routinely let beer clear in a secondary
>fermenter? The only positive I can conjecture is that the process of racking
Dave, I'm sure many brewers have had this idea before. I think the basic
reason you don't hear of hundreds of brewers adding the carbonating sugar to
the secondary is because what you end up with is one big bottle of carbonated
beer instead of 48 little ones. Many brewers carbonate their beer in kegs and
use something called a "counterpresser filler" to move the carbonated beer
that's under pressure in a keg, to a bottle. I did that for a few bottles once
and it was even less fun than regular bottling.
If you've added your primary sugar to your secondary your going to be a bit
unhappy when you take off the lid and most of the carbonation blows away just
like opening a bottle of soda. Much of the rest will leak out while you siphon
probably causing all kinds of fun problems. What beer you do manage to get
into the bottle won't be very carbonated at all, sorry to say.
- --
___________________________________________________________________________
_/ _/ _/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ Stephen Peters
_/_/ _/ _/ _/ _/ Web/Internet Marketing
_/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ stevep at pcx.ncd.com
_/ _/ _/ _/ S o f_/ t w _/a r e voice: (503)641-2200
_/ _/_/ _/ _/ _/ FAX: (503)641-2959
_/ _/ _/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ WEB: http://www.ncdsoft.com/
9590 SW Gemini Dr. Beaverton, OR 97008 FTP: ftp.ncd.com
___________________________________________________________________________
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From: ajdel at interramp.com (A. J. deLange)
Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 21:13:12 -0500
Subject: Weizenbock/Honey
Dave Mercer asked about Aventinus Weizenbock: I have twice tried to revive
the yeast from this beer without success. I'll note that neither bottle
tasted very fresh and will also note that this product as served in Munich
is heavenly. As for recipe formulation I strongly recommend Eric Warner'a
book on wheat beer. A weizenbock is simply a wheat beer brewed to bock
strength. How much grain you need depends on your system's efficency. You
also have a choice as to the fraction of wheat you want (I like 2/3). Be
prepared for a stuck mash. The old rule of thumb is that pitching and
fermentation temperatures should sum to 30C (I use 54/64F per Warner's
recommendation).
Ted Davidson asked about the weight of honey: apiculturists buy 12 Oz jars
for packaging 1 pound of honey. Also, the honey must be at least 82 Brix.
Thus three pounds would be about 36 Oz depending on the water content.
A.J. deLange Numquam in dubio, saepe in errore!
ajdel at interramp.com
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From: Jeff Renner <nerenner at umich.edu>
Date: Thu, 30 May 96 22:27:46 -0400
Subject: Re: Hammer Mills
In HBD 2053, Al K. asks:
>Jim writes:
>>With all this discussion of milling hasn't anyone out there read the
>new Stout
>>book and seen that guinness uses a hammer mill? These types of mills
>crush the
>>whole kernel husk and all to dust.
>
>Are you sure that we're talking about the same kind of hammer mill? If
>you look in Malting and Brewing Science (I believe that Noonan's 1st
>book may also have one) there is a drawing of a hammer mill for grain.
>It basically works by trapping grain under a revolving plate (there are
>four of them at 0, 90, 180 and 270 degrees) in a "sort-of" round bin.
>The clearance between the plate and the bin shrinks as the plate
>approaches the bottom of the bin.
>
>Perhaps there is a different type of hammer mill that Jim is talking
>about that works in a different way and does indeed crush the whole lot
>to dust?
In a hammer mill, a hammer that is attached to a shaft by a hinge beats
the grain against the corrugated wall of a cylindrical chamber. Product
fineness is adjustable by using different mesh screens that fit in the
perimeter of the mill. When the pulverized grain is small enough, it is
thrown through the screen by the hammer and the air which is blown into
the mill with the grain. Our local food co-op flour mill (The Daily
Grind - great name!) uses a hammer mill with different screens for fine
flour, coarser corn meal, and still coarser wheat meal. The local feed
mill uses the same kind of mill.
I have no idea what fineness Guinness might use.
Jeff Renner in Ann Arbor, Michigan c/o nerenner at umich.edu
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From: Dennis Cabell <cabell at ix.netcom.com>
Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 00:11:02 -0400
Subject: Washboard or Wood rollers for mill
>
> From: Steve_Rosenzweig at wb.xerox.com (Rosenzweig,Steve)snip
> Over memorial day, I was mentioning to my father-in-law up in Vermont
> my plans for getting into all grain brewing and that one thing I would
> need to acquire would be a mill. (I've also got him on the lookout
> for huge SS pots!)
>
> Well, he had an idea, and lo and behold, out in his barn, was an old
> wash ringer. (If it were in better shape, it might make more sense to
> clean it up, sell it as an antique, and buy a mill!)
> snip
>
> The easiest tactic I came up with is wood. I have a wood lathe - could
> I get by with lathing a set of hardwood rollers?? They may not last
> forever, but you can't beat the cost - I could make several sets at
> once and store them to replace as necessary. This also is my only
> real milling experience as I previously have just used a rolling pin
> on the counter to crush specialty grains.
>snip
Well, I guess I am not alone in this project this summer. I was going
to wait to post the final design somewhere, but I guess I will share
my results to date.
So far I have constructed my roller out of wood, but the rest of the
mill is still in my head. It is likely to be a while until I finish
because my wife will not let me run power tools after the kid's bedtime.
First, here is what I have done and then the problems.
What I did:
I turned a 3.5 inch roller about 8 inches long from black walnut.
Any hardwood should do. Hard maple would also be a good choice.
I used 8 in. scraps glued together to form a 4 x 4 x 8" block. You
definately want to use lots of peices glued together. It
makes the wood more stable to have the different grain in the
different pieces of wood (it won't warp or split if it is several
pieces glued together). My block is about 12 (yes, twelve) pieces
of wood glued together. Don't worry about glueing, a proper glue
glue joint is actually stronger than the wood itself.
For a shaft for the roller, I got a 3' long, 3/8" steel rod from the
hardware store ($3.00). This is actually enough to make 3 or 4
rollers. You could also use the kind of 3/8" bolts
do not have the threads at the top, just smooth metal. Anyway, the
idea is to bore a hole into either end of the roller then epoxy
a steel rod into both ends. One end should stick out about an
inch, to ride on the bearing. The other end should stick out
4-6" so there is room to eventially attach a crank. Speaking of
bearings, I got 2 brass sleeve bearings at the hardware store
($2.00 ea). These are just brass 3/8" ID tubes that the shaft
can ride in. I figured roller bearing were overkill for a hand
crank mill that will make 10 - 15 batches a year. A drop of motor
oil should make it last a good long time.
Problems encountered:
When I bored the holes into either end of the roller, I discovered
it is virtually impossible to get them lined up properly. You
need to turn the wood on the shaft to get a even, wobble free spin.
I do not know how to rig a convwentional lathe to do this, but
fortunately for me I have a Shopsmith and was ablle to rig it to
turn wood on the metal shaft. I replaced the lathe attachment
on the motor with a 1/2" drill chuck so that the drill chuck
can grip and drive the metal shaft. For the other end I clamped
a wood block in place, drilled a hole in it and put one of the
sleeve bearings in the hole. The other end of the shaft
then rided in the bearing. I then evened up the roller as it
spun on it's shaft. It is important to attach the drill chuck to
the short shaft, and push the long shaft all the way through the
bearing so that the bearing rides as close to the wood as possible.
this helps eliminate inadvertant wobble. If you do not have a
Shopsmith, try to find someone who does to help you turn the
roller.
If I do this again, I would have a solid shaft all the way through
the roller by epoxying the steel rod into the center of the block
of wood as I glued the block of wood together. Then simple do all
the turning on the shaft.
Next step for the roller:
Based on previous posts here, the roller should be textured (or
something) to allow it to grip the grain and pull it throught the
mill. I have not done this yet, but I plan to cut groves along
the length of the roller (parallel to the shaft). I am thinking
a hack saw blade may make good groves.
Well, that sums it up to date. hopefully I will have the body done
by end of summer and be able to report on effectiveness.
Dennis Cabell
Sterling Heights, MI
cabell at ix.netcom.com
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From: Kirk R Fleming <flemingk at usa.net>
Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 22:30:37 +0100
Subject: RIMS Pump Power
In #2053 Dion said:
> With anything other than a 70% open area false bottom, even
> 1/20hp is severely underpowered.
First, I respect Dion very much, and since he has on several occassions
helped me with my stupid questions, I owe him a great deal. But, (and
you knew this was coming), the assertion regarding pump power doesn't
make sense nor does it agree even remotely with my experience. Again,
I ASSUME BECAUSE DION SAID IT THAT IT AGREES PERFECTLY WITH HIS!
First, with anywhere from 12-25 lbs of grain sitting on a 6% open false
bottom, the wort drains out *under gravity alone* at a rate greater than
I would want to pump it with my system.
Second, if a pump can produce from 3 to 7 foot of head with a 1/25 hp
motor, that spec *defines* how much a non-positive displacement pump can
"pull" on the wort. I assert that if I put a 1 hp motor on this same
pump mechanism and turn it at the same rpm, the increased torque won't
increase the head. The goofy impeller mechanism is all played out due
to an inherent design limitation--more power won't make much difference.
Third, with a 6% open false bottom, about 14" grain bed depth, and 22 lbs
of grain, a 1/25 hp pump will fire the wort clear across the garage on a
continuous basis through a 5/8" ID tube--no brag, just fact. I have to
close off my ball valves to AT MOST 10% open (est) to maintain a reasonable
recirc rate--anything more open and there's just too much flow.
My first and third comments are simply facts--my second comment is an
opinion based on engineering gut feel. So be it. Dion's experience is
obviously different. I'd greatly appreciate any pertinent RIMS Reality
Reports (from either viewpoint), but please include false bottom *total
area* and percentage open areas. I think it's intuitive that Dion's
comments and mine *might* be consistent if we're talking about wildly
different false bottom total areas (70% open with 1000cm^2 area isn't the
same as 70% open with 100cm^2 total area from the pump's point of view, eh?).
KRF Colorado Springs
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