---

   FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
        Shawn Steele, Digest Janitor
        Thanks to Rob Gardner for making the digest happen!

Contents:
  Re: pumpkin ale ((Jay Reeves))
  First-Time Brew (Komusubi at aol.com)
  brewery size vs SI units ("Goodale, Daniel CPT 4ID DISCOM")
  Making Specialty Malts (KennyEddy at aol.com)
  german beer purity (M257876 at sl1001.mdc.com (bayerospace at mac))
  RE: Re: (Don Trotter)
  Re: Making Specialty Malts (Jorge Blasig - IQ)
  Thermometers ("Gregory, Guy J.")
  RE: Big Al... (Isabel Robles)
  Re: Boiling Over ((J. Matthew Saunders))
  Yeast Question (Ronald Babcock)
  Grain Mills (Jeff Hewit)
  King Kooker Summary ("Chuck and Grace Burkins")
  Hydrometer readings ((Christian O Miller))
  Old and room temperature Wyeast/Reinheitsgebot (Fred Waltman)
  Re: Bleach leaving a film (Renato Bugge)
  Wyeast dead in three days ? Dont think so. ("Braam Greyling")
  German Purity Law ((Torbjorn Bull-Njaa))
  CPBF (Carrick Legrismith)
  EBC color scale ((Victoria Orejas))
  Boilovers ended ("Meisner Wallie MSM GRPP US")
  Shaftbury Recipes? (Dale Smith)
  RE: Sorghum Beer (Bill Ridgely 301-827-1391 FAX 301-827-3053)
  Smoked Grains for Rauchbier (RedlackC at aol.com)
  Local Interest - Indiana (DAVE BRADLEY IC742 6-7932)
  Rheinheitsgebot/Efficiency ((MR STEPHEN D GARRETT))
  Re. US Homebrew, late harvest, Elk Mt.,applejack (Bob Waterfall)

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----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: jay at ro.com (Jay Reeves)
Date: Tue, 27 Aug 1996 16:08:21 -0500
Subject: Re: pumpkin ale

Tim & Marilyn <brokenskull at earthlink> ask how much fresh pumpkin 
to use in a 5 gallon batch. 
 
I have found that about 1 to 1.5 lbs is a good amount.  Any more 
than that and you may have a stuck runoff.  I once used 3 lbs and 
had the "runoff from hell".  The pumpkin seems to form a layer, 
that if too thick, is impermeable to the sparge flow. 
 
A word about types of pumpkin: the pumpkin sold for use as 
jack-o-lanterns are not the same type grown for eating, although 
you CAN eat it and it will taste fine.  There are ones grown 
specifically for eating and they do have a much better flavor. 
The types grown for jack-o-lanterns where I live are called 
"Big Mac" and "Jack-O-Lantern" (duh).  The one grown here for 
eating is called a "Cornfield".  It is physically smaller than 
the others -- about the size of a soccer ball.  Your local 
county extension office can tell you what's available in your 
area. 
 
What to use in beer: using canned pumpkin, IMO for beer, works just 
as well as a fresh "Cornfield"  pumpkin.  Just make sure if it's 
canned, the ingredients are only pumpkin and nothing else (no 
additives or preservatives).  I have yet to make a beer with a 
jack-o-lantern-type pumpkin, so I can't comment how they may taste 
in a beer as opposed to one made with the eating-type ...maybe next 
year I'll do that. 
 
     -Jay Reeves 
     Huntsville, Alabama, USA 
 

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From: Komusubi at aol.com
Date: Tue, 27 Aug 1996 17:30:42 -0400
Subject: First-Time Brew

Hello, 
This is my first post to HBD and I look forward to any response. This past 
weekend was my first foray into homebrewing and I have lots of questions. 
I'll start with a basic one (at least I think it's basic). My brew is sitting 
in the primary fermenter(a 6 gal. glass carboy), should I use a secondary 
fermentation and if so when should I do it? 
From what I understand to do this I will siphon it into a second carboy(5 
gal.) and then cork it with the airlock in place. Is this right? If not 
please advise, the recipe I am using is a Northern Brown Ale form a beer kit. 
Thanks 
A new brewbie 

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From: "Goodale, Daniel CPT 4ID DISCOM" <GoodaleD at HOOD-EMH3.ARMY.MIL>
Date: Tue, 27 Aug 1996 17:00:00 -0500
Subject: brewery size vs SI units

Collective, 
 
     Seeing the tag lines of some HBDs got me wondering if what 
we are calling our breweries is accurate; e.g. microbrewery, 
picobrewery, ect.  Using AB as the standard "brewery" here are 
my results. 
 
Brewery                                             480,000,000 g/year 
Decibrewery (10^-1)                        48,000,000 g/year 
Centibrewery (10^-2)                          4,800,000 g/year 
Millibrewery (10^-3)                                480,000 g/year 
Microbrewery (10^-6)                                    480 g/year 
Nanobrewery (10^-9)                                   0.48 g/year 
Picobrewery (10^-12)                            0.00048 g/year 
Femtobrewery (10^-15)                 0.00000048 g/year 
Attobrewery (10^-18)               0.00000000048 g/year 
 
Is this an accurate assessment?  I could be way off base here, 
perhaps it is by area inside the brewery???? 
 
Daniel W. Goodale (yes that is my real name) 
 
The Biohazard Brewing Company 
I like to think of myself as a chemical super-freak. 

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From: KennyEddy at aol.com
Date: Tue, 27 Aug 1996 18:02:47 -0400
Subject: Making Specialty Malts

Our friend Jorge needs to make specialty malts from pale malt, since that's 
all he can get.  Jorge, you certainly can do it at home, though the results 
may be different than what you'd expect from a commercial product. 
 
Two sources of info I know of are (1) a document available at The Library at 
The Brewery (http://alpha.rollanet.org/library.html) on roasting grain to 
produce brown and amber malts for porters, and (2) Randy Mosher's 
Homebrewer's Companion which covers making crystal malt at home.  The Library 
may have other info too. 
 
A search of the HBD (on-line at http://alpha.rollanet.org/hbd/HBD.html) will 
turn up some stuff on the topic as well, as it has been covered in the past. 
 Spencer Thomas just posted his search engine URL; I believe he also saves 
previous searches so if others have searched before you, that might be the 
most expeditious search route. 
 
Toasted malts (amber, brown, and just plain toasty) can be made simply by 
spreading pale malt on a cookie sheet and putting into an oven for a period 
of time.  Different temperatures and different durations will determine color 
and flavor changes.  This by the way is a great way to add a nice complexity 
to extract & specialty-grain brews. 
 
Crystal is made by soaking pale malt overnight in water (in the fridge, so it 
doesn't go lactic on ya), then heating at 150 - 160F for an hour or two (to 
enzymatically convert starch to sugar), the, raising to X deg (350?  I don't 
remember) to caramelize the sugar.  Again, time and temperature combine for 
different effects. 
 
Ken Schwartz 
KennyEddy at aol.com 
http://users.aol.com/kennyeddy 

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From: M257876 at sl1001.mdc.com (bayerospace at mac)
Date: Tue, 27 Aug 1996 17:14 -0600
Subject: german beer purity

collective homebrew conscience: 
 
i think i was wrong in stating that the reinheitsgebot stipulated malt and 
not barley.   barley seems to be in the translations i have examined. 
 
i think a different interpretation must be getting used these days, though. 
 
sorry for the misinformation. 
 
brew hard, 
 
mark bayer 

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From: Don Trotter <dtrotter at imtn.tpd.dsccc.com>
Date: Tue, 27 Aug 1996 17:39:06 -0500
Subject: RE: Re:

 
>Mike Uchima wrote: 
>So why is it that we can keep bottle-conditioned beer at room temperature, and
>still have some viable yeast in there? I suspect that most commercial bottle 
>conditioned beers (especially imports) have spent a lot more than 3 days at 
>elevated temperatures, and people still culture yeast from these successfully.
 
Okay, I'll talk to that. The article I referred to was in the 1989 (I think) 
Special Zymurgy Issue. I have since gone back and it says that shipping "liquid
yeast" across country with temperatures of "100 F" during shipping will kill 
all of the yeast in just 3 days. Okay, so your rooms may not be at 10 F! ;-) As
I recall, Duff was worried about the shipping factor, and he lives _here_ in 
Texas, where un-air-conditioned-vehicles reach temperatures of well over 140 F,
so this applies. Dogs and babies die in cars every year in Texas from the heat.
:(
 
This is a special issue on yeast culturing. Sorry Dave L. I am not knocking 
your product at all. I use it every time, however, I always make a starter, 
like this issue recommends. I have seen some "packets" of yeast take 2 weeks to
grow to sufficient pitching rates. This could be attributed to the viability 
factor. I'm 100% convinced that the negative effects are caused by S&H, so I'm 
not knocking te product. IMHO, it's the best next to culturing.
 
>Well, I've got one in primary right now, so I don't actually know how it will 
>turn out yet. HOWEVER: Watch out for this stuff. You *will* have the "sparge 
>from hell". Worse than oatmeal... sets up like a big wet block of concrete in 
>the lauter tun. 
 
Two words: RICE HULLS 
 
happy brewing, 
don 

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From: Jorge Blasig - IQ <gisalb at elmer.fing.edu.uy>
Date: Tue, 27 Aug 1996 19:49:06 -0300 (UY)
Subject: Re: Making Specialty Malts

 
Ken, thanks for your suggestions. I will try to connect to the Library 
and get all the information I can get. I will surely make specialty malts 
as soon as I have this information available. 
Thanks again. 
 
 
Jorge 
 

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From: "Gregory, Guy J." <GGRE461 at ecy.wa.gov>
Date: Tue, 27 Aug 96 16:03:00 PDT
Subject: Thermometers

 
 Ken Joseph asked for info on calibrating thermometers.  George DiPiro (A 
common HBD subscriber whose kind Email I deleted already) was the only Email 
responder: the rest of the responses were on the digest.  He suggested (as 
my memory serves) that dial thermometers were only good for 1 point 
calibrations, being mechanical and linear, so take a glass of ice water 
after it has set for a while until the water and ice reach equilibrium (I 
guess I'd use an insulated cup)  and place the thermometer in the water, 
adjust to 32 degrees F (obviously, 0 degrees C) and call it good.  Another 
responder on the digest suggested measuring the temp of about 100 degree F 
water taken with a human thermometer and adjusting accordingly.  I'm going 
to do these.  The human thermometer point seems the best idea, as I assume 
human thermometers are precise, since they read in tenths of a degree 
(please, no responses on the difference between accuracy and precision) and 
presumably reasonably accurate.   The 100 degree F point is also closer to 
the mash temperatures we want, so I guess any non-linear temperature 
response should be minimized.  Maybe I'll do both. 
 
Thanks to all responders. 

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From: Isabel Robles <irobles at total.net>
Date: Tue, 27 Aug 1996 20:59:59 -0400
Subject: RE: Big Al...

> 
> Al Korzonas, Palos Hills, IL 
> korzonas at lucent.com 
> Copyright 1996 Al Korzonas 
 
What is this? 
 

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From: saunderm at vt.edu (J. Matthew Saunders)
Date: Tue, 27 Aug 1996 22:38:07 -0400
Subject: Re: Boiling Over

John writes: 
 
>Let me repeat my own method for avoiding boilovers: 
> 
>Skim the scum that forms just before it gets roiling.  This scum/film 
>covers the wort and traps air which allows it to boil over.  Skim it with a 
>strainer or spoon for a few minutes and you can leave the room for the next 
>hour and a half with no worries. 
 
This certainly works, but I think that a significant portion of that "scum" 
is hop residue.  If you skim that gook before it really gets a chance to do 
its thing, you significanty reduce the bitterness of your brew.  I usually 
push the scum to the side until the boil is vigorous enough to keep most of 
the gook under the wort's surface doing what hops do best. 
 
Cheers! 
Matthew 
 
 

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From: Ronald Babcock <rbabcock at rmii.com>
Date: Tue, 27 Aug 1996 20:59:43 -0600
Subject: Yeast Question

I have been brewing for a little over a year and have been brewing all grain 
for about 6 batches or about 2 months and have a question that I hope that 
someone can help clear up for me. 
 
I have noticed that, and I am assuming this, when the yeast converts the 
sugars to CO2 and alcohol generates heat which in turn is increasing the 
temperature of the fermenting beer.  I see this more in my ales than in my 
lagers due to the fermentation rate.  My question is what is the best method 
of keeping the beer at the desired temp. other than overcompensating by 
reducing the ambient temp. below the desired temp. and keeping a close eye 
on the temp. of the fermenting beer.  Any suggestions would be appreciated 
as I would like to have just a little more control over one more of the 
variables. 
 
Ronald Babcock 
rbabcock at rmii.com 
 
 

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From: Jeff Hewit <jhewit at erols.com>
Date: Tue, 27 Aug 1996 23:24:13 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Grain Mills

I recall several months ago that there was a rather spirited discussion on 
grain mills.  As could be expected, everyone seemed to think that the one 
he/she used was the best.  I don't recall that the rest of us could really 
determine which one might actually be the best, if there really is a best 
one.  At that time I was not in the market for a new grain mill, and now I 
am.  While I don't like to waste money, I don't mind spending top dollar for 
quality.  It appears to me that the top two mills are the Malt Mill and the 
Valley Mill.  (I am sure that anyone who disagrees will let me know.)  Does 
anyone have experience with both mills?  If so, what's your opinion?  Right 
now, I don't think that adjustability is important, so I am leaning towards 
the pre-adjusted Malt Mill.  Have any of you bought a fixed grain mill and 
wished you had gone adjustable?  Has anyone gone adjustable and actually 
used a setting other than "standard"?  TIA for any input. 
- ---------------------------------- 
Jeff Hewit - Midlothian, Virginia 
 

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From: "Chuck and Grace Burkins" <burkins at oa.net>
Date: Tue, 27 Aug 1996 23:10:25 -0400
Subject: King Kooker Summary

Hi folks.=20 
     I'm the person who asked for information on Jet style burners 
vs. Radial style burners, and this is the summary I promised. Before 
I summarize I should mention that I received a diverse set of 
opinions (which I expected) and it seems clear that both style 
burners can be used to make great beer. As always your mileage may 
vary and probably will.  Thanks for all the input.=20 
     I received about a dozen responses, and people with negative 
impressions of the jet King Kooker and jet burners in general 
outnumbered those with positive impressions 2:1.  The pro for the jet 
King Kooker is that it is remarkably fast (7 Gal to boil in 15-20 
min.). For cons there were reports of  noise (Military Thrust?), 
inefficiency (as measured by flame color and number of batches per 
tank of propane), Soot (near universal complaint), lack of fine 
control ( though one person reported no problem with control down to 
the pilot level.). Two people reported scorching of wort, though many 
respondents specifically reported no scorching ever. One person did 
scorch a decoction, but this is probably the most scorch vulnerable 
step in brewing (Wild conjecture on my part=85 I brew ales). =20 
     It is important to realize that in the last few weeks I have 
spoken to a number of people who use the jet style cookers, make 
great beer with them, and are glad to own them. It seems that 
application of common sense and care can alleviate the problems 
mentioned above.=20 
     Finally, several people mentioned sources for radial burners. 
Sam's Club seems to have a 130, 000 BTU burner. Cabella's 
(1-800-237-4444) sells  something called a Kamp Kooker (Usual 
disclaimers=85) I'll be investigating  both sources.=20 
     =20 
Chuck Burkins, protein chemist, homebrewer,     Dedham, Mass. USA 
 

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From: comiller at juno.com (Christian O Miller)
Date: Mon, 26 Aug 1996 20:48:53 PST
Subject: Hydrometer readings

Can anyone suggest an easy way to take hydrometer readings for a bucket 
of fermenting wort without pulling the top off, sterilizing a gravy 
baster, and squeezing some into a flask? It seems like an easy way to 
get an infection. Any suggestions to private or posted e-mail. Thanks. 
 
CHRISTIAN MILLER 
BREWIN' IN DURHAM (Conn.) 
comiller at juno.com 

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From: Fred Waltman <waltman at netcom.com>
Date: Tue, 27 Aug 1996 22:10:12 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Old and room temperature Wyeast/Reinheitsgebot

 
Don Trotter mentions reading that the yeast in Wyeast packets were dead 
after 3 days at room temperature: 
 
I have a person experience that is to the contrary: I was doing a little 
talk on brewing at an area beer spot. I took examples of malt, hops, 
extract, etc. and an old (14 months old) Wyeast pack as a "prop." After 
the talk, everything got stuck on storage shelf at room temperature. 4 
months later (making the pack 18 months old) I came across the bag and 
smacked the yeast to see what would happen. It was noticably thicker after 
2 days and in a week was swelled to bursting. I let is sit another week 
and pitched into a batch of porter (no starter). It took about 2.5 days 
for fermentation to get going. The beer turned out fine -- no best of 
show -- but drinkable. I certainly wouldn't suggest this a standard 
procedure, but I think the yeast in those packs is pretty hardy. 
 
On the oft quoted Bavarian Purity Law: just to add to the confusion, the 
version I saw said "gersten" (barley) and not "malz" (malt). Of course, 
this was somebody's transcription. And while usage may have changed (Read 
any 16th Century English lately) I have seen recent bottles of beer with 
"gerstenmalz" under the ingredients so I am pretty sure that "gersten" is 
just barley. This thread came up a while back and someone stated that the 
actual law in effect was the "Beer Tax Law" of 1890-something and that it was 
quite long with lots of do's and don'ts -- such as barley malt only in 
bottem fermented beers. I remember talking to a German brewer who said 
that the beer to krausen a wheat beer had to be all barley when they were 
using a lager yeast for bottle conditioning. So it was a pretty detailed law. 
 
 
Fred Waltman 
Culver City Home Brewing Supply Co. 
waltman at netcom.com 
http://www.homebrew.inter.net 
"You can make better beer than you can buy." 
 
 
 

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From: Renato Bugge <renato.bugge at fysel.unit.no>
Date: Wed, 28 Aug 1996 11:53:07 +0200
Subject: Re: Bleach leaving a film

Jeff Renner wrote: 
>George De Piro wrote 
>>   That slippery feeling isn't actually the bleach, 
>>   although it is caused       by the it.  That 
>>   slipperiness is the lipids (fats & oils) in your 
>>   tissue being turned into soap by the bleach! 
> 
>More specifically, it's the NaOH, or lye, in the bleach that saponifies 
>the skin oils.  Soap is a salt of a fatty acid; in this case, a sodium 
>salt. 
> 
 
If you try to wear glowes when working with NaOH (sodium hydroxide), you will 
see that the solution is as slippery then as when on your fingers. I.e. the 
slippering effect is not caused by reaction between lipids and NaOH, but by 
NaOH itself. When NaOH is soluted in water, the ion-balancy in water is 
affected: H2O <-> H+ + OH- to the presence of more OH- ions. It is the 
excess of these ions which causes the slippery effect of NaOH between two 
surfaces. 
 
Renato Bugge 
 

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From: "Braam Greyling" <acg at knersus.nanoteq.co.za>
Date: Wed, 28 Aug 1996 12:11:25 +200
Subject: Wyeast dead in three days ? Dont think so.

Hi, 
 
> Duff at duff at tam2000.tamu.edu asks about  Wyeast that has gotten 
> heated.  I have seen an article in an old special issue of Zymurgy 
> that claims that 100% of the yeast in a Wyeast foil packet will be 
> dead within 3 days,  whan kept at room temperature. 
 
Im not so sure of that. A good friend have sent me 5 packets of 
wyeast from U.S. to S.A. via airmail. It arrived here in about two 
weeks. I have put it in the fridge immediatly but it was definitely 
at room temps for longer than about five days. The yeast were in a 
box, not even isolated very well. 
 
I have brewed with two packets with exceptional results. 
Both ale yeasts, I havent tried the lagers yet. 
 
I just think the yeast can take more than we suspect. 
 
Braam Greyling           I.C. Design Engineer 
Nanoteq (Pty) Ltd 
tel. +27 (12) 665-1338  fax +27 (12) 665-1343 
- ---- 24 hours in a day, 24 beers in a case ---- 
- ----     coincidence ?????                 ---- 

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From: tbn at merkur.sds.no (Torbjorn Bull-Njaa)
Date: Wed, 28 Aug 1996 13:18:27 +0200
Subject: German Purity Law

A few comments to the German Purity Law thread: 
 
The "law" was only meant to protect German beer consumers, as adjuncts etc 
have been allowed in beer for export out of Germany. As a law, this was as 
we know, adapted by several other countries as well, and was - as far as I 
am informed, in effect in Norway and Finland longer than in Germany. And may 
be in Austria? 
 
Regarding the meaning of "Maltz" it could be very interesting to have a 
German language and brewery history expert comment on this. Somewhere I have 
picked up the understanding that it was synonymous with barley malt only, 
and that there is a separate "law/ruling" etc later, which says something 
specially about wheat malt? 
 
Torbjorn Bull-Njaa 
 

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From: Carrick Legrismith <hiscope at c4systm.com>
Date: Wed, 28 Aug 1996 07:13:38 -0400
Subject: CPBF

>Bryan wrote: 
>The only real problem I have so far is how to clean the 
>thing when finished.  I really need another keg of some 
>kind of cleaner that I can hook up and run through the 
>Bottle filler, but all my kegs have beer in them.  Alternately, 
>I could use a Carbonator type cap for a pin lock fitting 
>and fill a plastic bottle with cleaner. 
 With my CPBF I just rinse it after use and shake it out before 
putting it away. Then, before bottling, I sanitize the whole thing in a 
pressure cooker for 20 minutes  at  15 lbs. I routinely bottle 10 gallons 
of beer in a little over 2 hours with my home built filler and have 
found it less of a hassle than bottle bucket and Phil's Philler, (tm). 
 
Carrick Legrismith 
Poison Ivy Brewery  
hiscope at c4systm.com 

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From: micromalta at ran.es (Victoria Orejas)
Date: Wed, 28 Aug 1996 13:44:30 +0100
Subject: EBC color scale

Does anyone have an EBC color scale for beer? I would like to have 
something like, pale,amber light, amber deep....with the degrees EBC they 
have. 
 
Victoria 
 
 

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From: "Meisner Wallie MSM GRPP US" <wallie.meisner at usgr.MHS.CIBA.COM>
Date: 28 Aug 1996 12:03:35 +0000
Subject: Boilovers ended

 
//////////////////////////////////////////////////////// 
As I keep reading about boilovers, maybe some don't know about the best way 
I've found to avoid them (aside from watching the pot every second, which 
leaves no time for cracking open another cold one). Use a huge pot, like a 
17 gallon stainless steel keg/pot. You have to either be using gas to boil 
with in the first place, or wire water-heater elements into them though, 
'cause they're not real efficient on the top of the electric range. I know 
that a lot of subscribers have picked these up at Pat's HomeBrew FleaMarket 
(http://oeonline.com/~  pbabcock/). 
 
 -Wallie Meisner 
Greensboro, NC 
\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ 
 
 

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From: Dale Smith <des at io.com>
Date: Wed, 28 Aug 1996 07:53:07 -0500
Subject: Shaftbury Recipes?

Hey Home brewers, 
 
Any Canadians out there? Anybody got a recipe for Shaftbury ESB or Cream 
Ale? I lived in Vancouver for a while and really miss the stuff. The ESB 
is without a doubt my favorite ESB. Anyone know what kind of hops, etc. 
they use? Has anyone ever obtained a yeast strain from a Shaftbury? I 
was back in Vancouver this past March and was glad to see that they were 
bottling their beer now. Of course I filled my suitcase with as much as 
I could carry. 
 
Thanks in advance, 
Dale Austin, TX. 

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From: Bill Ridgely 301-827-1391 FAX 301-827-3053 <RIDGELY at A1.CBER.FDA.GOV>
Date: Wed, 28 Aug 1996 08:53:57 EST
Subject: RE: Sorghum Beer

In HBD #2161, Terry Tegner <brewtec at global.co.za> writes: 
 
        >Although Sorghum beer was a traditionally brewed drink 
        >in the Wild Africa days, it is a foul smelling repulsive 
        >drink compared to clear beer and is only drunk by those 
        >who can't afford anything else. The recently formed 
        >brewing ind assoc in South Africa has pointedly excluded 
        >them as Sorghum beer is not considered beer in the true 
        >sense. 
 
As an amateur beer historian and sociologist, I feel it's 
important to respond to the opinion expressed above. Please keep 
in mind that this attitude is common amongst the white population 
of South Africa, which in general has some distance to travel in 
understanding black culture and its traditions. 
 
Sorghum beer predates western-style clear beer by a thousand 
years or so and, while certainly very different from it, is 
neither foul smelling or repulsive. Whether or not it is 
"beer" depends on your definition. Historically, beer is 
described simply as "a fermented beverage made from grain". Not 
all societies make beer from barley malt, and use of hops to 
flavor beer is a relatively recent (and European) innovation. 
 
I've had the good fortune to sample a number of indigenous 
"opaque" beers in Southern Africa ("sorghum" beer is not totally 
correct as it is only one of several grains used). All have been 
interesting, refreshing, and nutritious (much more so than clear 
beer, which provides little more than empty calories). The aroma 
is of yeast (as the beers are still fermenting when consumed), 
grain, and a small measure of lactic acid (as souring is part of 
the brewing process). The flavor is similar to yoghurt but much 
more refreshing, IMHO. 
 
I find it rather unfortunate that the black population of 
Southern Africa has slowly begun switching to westernized clear 
beer as it has become more affluent. Opaque beer has been a major 
component of the diet of the African working man for hundreds of 
years, and a bottle of Vivo (nearly as badly brewed a beer as the 
awful Castle Lager made by SAB) just isn't going to fill the 
bill. 
 
For those of us with a sincere appreciation for the indigenous 
beers of the world, statements like "repulsive", "foul smelling", 
and "not a beer" reflect an attitude of one relatively low on the 
cultural ladder. 
 
Bill Ridgely 
Alexandria, VA 
 
 

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From: RedlackC at aol.com
Date: Wed, 28 Aug 1996 09:29:14 -0400
Subject: Smoked Grains for Rauchbier

Does anyone know of a mail order homebrew supply shop that offers smoked 
grains? I'm interested in making a rauchbier but since I live in a condo 
smoking my own grains presents numerous problems as you can imagine 
(including legal ones). Any help would be greatly appreciated. Now, back to 
lurking. 
 
Thanks, 
 
Chris Redlack 
RedlackC at aol.com 

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From: DAVE BRADLEY IC742 6-7932 <BRADLEY_DAVID_A at LILLY.COM>
Date: Wed, 28 Aug 1996 14:17:16 +0000 (GMT)
Subject: Local Interest - Indiana

Sorry for this regional info: the lack of publicity leads me 
to post here about a potentially great event... 
 
 I just found out about an event this wknd which 
is probably of interest to local homebrewers (Indianapolis, IN). 
Though I lack all the details, the event is a beer tasting 
involving 25 microbreweries (regional or not?) with some 100+ 
beers to sample.  Here's the specifics: 
 
What: Microbrewery Festival 
When: THIS SATURDAY (Aug 31st) 
>2-6pm< Where: Optimist Park (near the Indy Arts Center, 67th and College) 
 Broadripple Village 
 Indianapolis, IN 
Cost: $15 advanced, $18 at the gate 
Notes: Sponsored by (amongst others) the Broadripple Brew Pub 
 Proceeds donated to the Human Society 
 Music and food too 
 
We now return to your regularly scheduled discussion of bleach... 
 
Dave in Indy 
Home of the 3-D B.B.B. 
 

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From: sdginc at prodigy.com (MR STEPHEN D GARRETT)
Date: Wed, 28 Aug 1996 10:16:57, -0500
Subject: Rheinheitsgebot/Efficiency

Michael Gerholdt quotes an English translation of the Rheinheitsgebot 
in HBD 2162, which includes: 
 
"Furthermore, we wish to emphasize that in future in all cities, 
markets and in the country, the only ingredients used for the brewing 
of beer must be Barley, Hops and Water. " 
 
Michael goes on to comment: "I do not have immediate access to a 
German version and cannot comment on whether the word translated 
"Barley" above is specific to barley, or whether it could be other 
malted grains." 
 
 
In Michael Jackson's "The World Guide to Beer" (on page 42) is a copy 
of the section dealing with allowed ingredients of the original 
Rheinheitsgebot in German.  It clearly states   "Gersten/Hopffen/und 
Wasser" (Barley, Hops, and Water). 
 
In the text, Jackson refers to the restriction as "*malted* barley, 
hops, and water". He goes on to say that "This was subsequently 
amended to allow for wheat beers." 
 
I'm not an expert...just reporting what I see. 
 
 
 
Also in HBD 2142 I asked a question regarding my all-grain extract 
efficiency. I did 2 batches at the same time and got 22 points on one, 
 and 29 on the other. I identified 3 potential differences in my 
technique that might have affected the efficiency. 
 
I did not get a rousing response to my post. Based on a few responses 
plus more info from another brew session this past weekend, here is 
my current thinking: 
 
1. The major difference was my paying close attention to the sparge 
temperature. (Keep it up around 170 deg.) 
2. A minor difference might be attributed to using US pale malt 
versus British. 
3. Not much if any difference in the mash time extending from 90 
minutes to 150. 
 
There were certainly several other subtle (to me) differences in my 
technique that I'm oblivious to. Just bottled the 2 batches in 
question, one was a version of the Tommyknocker Maple Brown Ale 
(recipe from Zymurgy Fall 96), and the other was a stab at Left Hand 
Brewing's Sawtooth Ale. All's well that end's well. 
 
Save the Ales... 
 
Steve Garrett 
sdginc at prodigy.com 
 

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From: Bob Waterfall <waterr at albany.net>
Date: Wed, 28 Aug 1996 10:30:31 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re. US Homebrew, late harvest, Elk Mt.,applejack

Phil Brushaber asks: 
>Does anyone know what happened to U.S. WHolesale Homebrew Supply. Called 
>their number and it seems as if they may have gone out of business (I 
>hope not). They used to sell hops for $4-$6 a POUND! USWHS used to 
>advertise in Zymurgy. 
 
I don't know if it's the same place, but U.S. Brewing Supply in Albany, NY 
(which did advertise in Zymurgy) has gone out of business.  They've moved on 
to become part owners of The Big House Brewing Co., a four-story brewpub in 
downtown Albany. 
- ---------------- 
Doug Thomas asks: 
>This year, right when my local brew supply told me to, I planted a 
>Willamette root.  I get plenty of sun (6-8 hours depending on cloud 
>cover) and I water regularly every other day.  The vines have grown 
>wonderfully (about 18 feet long) but no cones are even showing.  What 
>could have happened? 
 
I think it's pretty typical to not get any hops the first year based on my 
own and several friends' experience.  I think that the plant is putting its 
energy into establishing a root sysytem.  But I'm no botanist.  After no 
harvest the first year and a small harvest the second year, I get more hops 
than I can use now.  (Requests for free hops will be politely ignored.  My 
buddies manage to use up my surplus.) 
- -------------- 
Mark Warrington asks if anyone has seen A-B's Elk Mt product lately. 
 
I agree that it was surprisingly bitter for a megabrewery product, even too 
bitter.  I think I saw some at Shop N Save the other day but I can't vouch 
for how long it's been in the cooler. 
- ------------ 
Tam Thompson wonders if his applejack lager will clear if he uses cloudy cider:
 
My one experience with making hard cider suggests that it should come out 
nice and clear.  I used murky cider straight from the press and it produced 
a very clear hard cider (albeit somewhat vinegary).  BTW, if you buy your 
cider from the supermarket or even from the cider mill it will probably have 
preservatives that will inhibit (or kill) your yeast.  I went to the cider 
mill and asked the guy in charge to fill my bucket the next time they made a 
batch.  I didn't need to, but a few bottles of homebrew can be very 
effective in getting favors from people. 
 
 
Bob Waterfall <waterr at albany.net>, 
Troy, NY, USA 
 

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