Homebrew Digest Wednesday, 9 October 1996 Number 2222
![[Prev HBD]](/img/previous.gif)
![[Index]](/img/index_button.gif)
![[Next HBD]](/img/next.gif)
![[Back]](/img/up_level_button.gif)
FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
Mike Donald, Digest Janitor-in-training
Thanks to Rob Gardner for making the digest happen!
Contents:
Carbonating in cold storage (Alex Santic)
Re: John Adams trip report (Jason Goldman)
help for a beginner (Courville)
Bergamot (Michael Newman)
RE: The Sorghum Beer Challenge (Bill Ridgely 301-827-1391 FAX 301-827-3053)
Adelaide Sparkling Ale and Cooper's Yeast (MaltyDog at aol.com)
More bergamot ((Jeff Renner))
RE: Pilsner Uruquell (John Wilkinson)
Tea vs. beer ("Joh. van Bentum")
Gambrinus "Pale Ale" malt: (Jim Cave)
yeast starters ("Bryan L. Gros")
infusion mash ("Bryan L. Gros")
Good bye (Domenick Venezia)
(no subject) (RUSt1d?)
yeast starters ("Bryan L. Gros")
Dateline NBC ((Jeff Sturman))
Mo' Wit Q's (RUSt1d?)
bulk malt - Greensboro, NC ("Meisner Wallie MSM GRPP US")
Report on the Toronto Beer Scene (TheTHP at aol.com)
Report on the Toronto Beer Scene (TheTHP at aol.com)
Re: infected wyeast (Brian Bliss)
Raw wheat/rice hulls&oat hulls/Why Wy1056 ? (Steve Alexander)
For SUBMISSIONS to be published, send mail to:
homebrew at aob.org
For (UN)SUBSCRIBE requests, send mail to:
homebrew-digest-request@ aob.org
and include ONLY subscribe or unsubscribe in the BODY of the message.
Please note that if subscribed via BEER-L, you must unsubscribe by sending
a one line e-mail to listserv at ua1vm.ua.edu that says: UNSUB BEER-L
If your address is changing, please unsubscribe from the old address and
then subscribe from the new address.
If your account is being deleted, please be courteous and unsubscribe first.
For technical problems send e-mail to the Digest Janitor,
homebrew-digest-owner at aob.org.
OTHER HOMEBREW INFORMATION
http://www.aob.org/aob - The AHA's web site.
http://alpha.rollanet.org - "The Brewery" and the Cat's Meow Archives.
info at aob.org - automated e-mail homebrewing information.
ARCHIVES:
At ftp.stanford.edu in /pub/clubs/homebrew/beer via anonymous ftp. Also
http://alpha.rollanet.org on the web and at majordomo at aob.org by e-mail.
COPYRIGHT:
As with all forums such as this one, copyrights are retained by the
original authors. In accordance with the wishes of the members of the
Homebrew Digest, posts to the HBD may NOT be sold or used as part of a
collection that is sold without the original authors' consent. Copies
may ONLY be made available at no charge and should include the current
posting and subscription addresses for the HBD.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Alex Santic <alex at brainlink.com>
Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 02:41:13 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Carbonating in cold storage
I am planning a full-grain Bohemian Pils as my first lager. This brew is
ultimately destined to be packaged in minikegs, and I find myself
intrigued by the idea of racking to the minikegs after primary
fermentation and letting the secondary fermentation during lagering
condition the beer.
I'm wondering if its very difficult to get predicatable carbonation this
way, and if enough CO2 will be produced during, say, 6 weeks of cold
storage. I also wonder if this will prevent substances from dissipating
which will cause off-flavors in the beer. On the other hand, it's my
understanding is that this technique is sometimes used commercially and
it sounds both feasible and elegant.
Current intentions are to use the Wyeast "Czech Pils" strain and I am
aiming for an OG of 1.048 to 1.050. Those two factors should have some
relevance to the question.
I'm sorry if the info I need is in the Noonan book because I don't have
that one yet. There wasn't enough info in Dave Miller's Pilsner book to
inspire confidence.
Alex Santic
NYC
Return to table of contents
From: Jason Goldman <jason at purpur.bbn.hp.com>
Date: Tue, 8 Oct 96 9:52:05 MESZ
Subject: Re: John Adams trip report
I really hate to correct my good friend John on his trip report, but he made
an egregious error;-)
> I drive to my good friend Jason Goldman's house in Gertring (whom has
> recently relocated to Germany) on the autobahn. Although many sections
> of the autobahn are without speed limits, this section has a speed limit
> of 120km/h (I leave it as an exercise to the reader to convert to mph),
> but it is fun never the less.
>
> We enjoy 2 very good beers: Spezial-Brau, a Rauchbier from Bamberg, and
> NeckarMueller DunkleWeizen, a very nice wheat beer from Tuebligen. Next
> stop is a small, very friendly pub in Boebligen for a couple of Pilsener
> Urquels (Dave Miller would be proud) and a Guinness Stout (it's not
> German but it was fresh). I am in beer heaven!!!
The weizen we drank the first evening at my house was *not* NeckarMueller,
it was Schneider Weisse from Munich. His confusion was that he drank it out
of a NeckarMueller glass (I was using the Schneider glass). As he later
points out, NeckarMueller is only available in Tuebingen.
Oh yeah, I live in *Gaertringen*;-)
Jason
jason at fc.hp.com
- -- Just trying to rub it in that I live here and you don't;-) --
Return to table of contents
From: Courville <d1c at ssd.ray.com>
Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 08:15:11 -0400
Subject: help for a beginner
Hi All,
I'm a newbie to homebrewing, only one batch under my belt, and just
attemped to brew my second batch (a honey porter). Everything was going fine
until just after I pitched the yeast (a starter made from wyeast). I use
a 5 gallon bucket as my fermenter, and when I went to close it up and
attach the airlock, the little rubber o-ring (that the airlock fits into)
popped out of the whole and into the brew. I couldn't fish it out, and I
didn't want to contaminate the brew, so I left it figuring it was
sanitized so I should be o.k. So what I did was trim down a rubber stopper
with a whole in it (the one that I used on my starter bottle) and wedged
it into the hole with the airlock attached. I then relaxed, didn't worry
and had a homebrew. Now, three days later I'm not relaxed, starting to
worry and am running out of homebrew. There is still no visible sign
of fermentation in the airlock. I suppose that means the rubber stopper
I put on may not have been air tight! Is there anything I can do at this
point, to save my batch? Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated!
Dan
d1c at ssd.ray.com
Return to table of contents
From: Michael Newman <100711.2111 at CompuServe.COM>
Date: 09 Oct 96 09:03:55 EDT
Subject: Bergamot
Daniel Goodale asked for information about oil of bergamot. Kelly Jones' reply
suggested using bee-balm or the oil extracted from it. If a remember correctly
(I am at work and my reference books are at home) the oil from this herb is
indeed the same as that used in Earl Grey tea BUT is not the source of the
flavouring used by the tea companies.
Earl Grey tea is flavoured with oil extracted from the skin of the unripe fruit
of the bergamot orange. So it might be worthwhile trying to get hold of some
dried bergamot orange skin and adding this to the boil or secondary.
Mind you bee-balm would probably be OK and may be easier to get hold of.
MICHAEL NEWMAN, Warminster, Wiltshire, UK
Return to table of contents
From: Bill Ridgely 301-827-1391 FAX 301-827-3053 <RIDGELY at A1.CBER.FDA.GOV>
Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 08:40:50 EST
Subject: RE: The Sorghum Beer Challenge
Many thanks to Mike Beck for reporting his "Sorghum Beer
Challenge" results in HBD #2221. It's good to see folks taking an
interest in indigenous brewing and expanding their horizons a
bit.
Those who live in and around the Washington, DC area may be
interested in a special "African Beer Festival" to be held at the
Brickskeller Restaurant on Nov 19-21. The program will feature
clear beers from the BB Brewery in Lome, Togo (brewers of Ngoma
Beer) as well as the "first sorghum beer in America" (well, at
least the first sorghum beer to be presented at a commercial
tasting :-)). There will also be African food, music, and dance.
Wendy and I plan to attend on Thursday, Nov 21, so if anyone on
the list would like to get together with us and talk about "beer
adventuring", we'd very much enjoy meeting you. Just reply
privately to ridgely at burp.org.
Bill Ridgely
Alexandria, VA
Return to table of contents
From: MaltyDog at aol.com
Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 09:23:03 -0400
Subject: Adelaide Sparkling Ale and Cooper's Yeast
Andy Walsh wrotes:
>George de Piro wrote
> "A friend of mine has found that yeast cultured from Adelaide sparkling
>ale is a good high-temperature performer. In fact, he's had trouble with it
>getting stuck at more conventional temperatures!" My experience too, in fact
>in their HB kits they used to warn to keep fermentation temp at about 25 C
>(? 77 F)! Last time I drank this (excellent) beer I was struck by the very
>estery character at room temp.
>Some points:
>- -Was George referring specifically to Coopers Sparkling Ale? This defines
>the style, but there are several imitators. I also find the yeast from the
>bottle to be a good performer at high temperatures. It can be very phenolic,
>in addition to the esters. The yeast found in Coopers kits *is not the same*
>as in the bottle. It is supplied to Coopers by Mauri Foods. And forget the
>instructions in the kits - they must be the worst in existence. I have
>spoken to the manager of the homebrew division of Coopers about this. He
>told me they say 25C just so those who live in the tropics are not put off
>about making them! 20C gives a better result.
Actually, I was the guy George was talking about. The yeast was cultured from
the dregs a bottle of of Cooper's Sparkling Ale. The first time I used it, I
tried to duplicate the spec of the Cooper's Ale, as recieved from Michael
Jackson. They seemed to be a little off (off the the top of my head, they
were about 1.045 starting gravity, and 5.7% alcohol, which would mean a final
gravity of about 1.001!) The yeast had to be roused a couple of times when
the temperature was in the low seventies, but the beer tasted great.
Second, I used it for a bitter, during the summer, and the temperature got
into the mid-80's. It performed beautifully at those temperatures, with nice
fruity flavors, and no real off flavors that I could detect. I don't think
I'd call it phenolic.
I am currently making another batch of Adelaide-style sparkling ale. I upped
the original gravity to the high 1.050's (I think Jackson's gravity reading
was before the addition of sugar, which makes up about 18% of the grist). The
fermentation was originally in the mid 60's, but went only to about 50%
attentuation before conking out. Several attempts to rouse the yeast failed,
until I moved it to a warmer room, in the mid 70's. Then the yeast fermented
out fine, finishing at about 80% attentuation at this time. I racked them
into kegs this weekend, and will see how they do latter.
I've also noticed that the yeast in the bottles that I bottle conditioned
with this yeast, in the first batch, settled out very well; the beer is very
clear. That may be why the yeast conks out early; it flocculates very well.
This is odd, because I always have trouble pouring a glass of the real
Cooper's Sparkling Ale without shaking up the yeast!
Thanks
Bill Coleman
MaltyDog at aol.com
Return to table of contents
From: nerenner at umich.edu (Jeff Renner)
Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 09:49:35 -0500
Subject: More bergamot
Sorry for the double post in HBD 2221. My machine crashed upon posting and
I thought the message hadn't gone out, so I rewrote it and sent it out
again, whereupon two confirmation messages came in. It will be nice when
the cancel article feature is put back.
Anyway, Pierre Jelenc <pcj1 at columbia.edu> added more information to mine,
then wrote:
>I bought my oil of bergamot in a pharmacy in France some years ago. I
>don't know whether it is readily available in the US, but a small bribe to
>a chemistry graduate student should be able to produce linalyl acetate
>quite readily (Aldrich cat # L280-7; CA # 115-95-7).
Bergamot oil is readily available in 15 ml bottles in heath food stores,
probably for less than $10. I mail order scents (for soap making; a great
soap scent is oils of bergamot, rosemary, lavender and sandlewood at
2:2:2:1.) from LorAnn Oils. I have only the wholesale price list in reach
right now. One ounce of bergamot oil wholesales for $12; one ounce of
artificial bergamot oil is only $2 (can you say "linalyl acetate?"). I
think retail is about 25% higher. They are at 1-888-456-7266.
- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Jeff Renner in Ann Arbor, Michigan c/o nerenner at umich.edu
Return to table of contents
From: John Wilkinson <jwilkins at imtn.tpd.dsccc.com>
Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 09:53:36 -0500
Subject: RE: Pilsner Uruquell
Kirk Fleming said:
>Now, if someone can point me to a source of draft PU in Colorado, I'd
>appreciate it! I'd really like to give this a fair shake.
I am afraid I can't point to a source in Colorado but I found one last
night in Dallas. I had a draft Pilsner Uruquell at the Flying Saucer
(no connection) in Dallas and it was great. The last Pilsner Uruquell I
had from a bottle was not good and I had about decided I no longer liked the
beer but that draft last night changed my mind. I am still leery of the
bottled PU but look forward to going back for more draft.
John Wilkinson - Grapevine, Texas - jwilkins at imtn.dsccc.com
Return to table of contents
From: "Joh. van Bentum" <101765.344 at compuserve.com>
Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 10:56:17 -0400
Subject: Tea vs. beer
Daniel Goodale asked recently about tea (Earl Grey) in a beer recipe. The
Belgian brewery Lindemans uses tea in one of its beers, appropriately named
Tea-bier. The label doesn't declare what tea is used or in what quantities,
though.
Today I brewed an experimental (non-grain) tea beer. The ingredients are:
apple juice (5 liters), green tea (5 liters), sugar (1,3 kilograms),
crushed ginger root (2 grams) and yeast (Den Arsegan). In my calculations
this should produce a drink of about 5% alcohol. In taste it won't be too
complex, I think. Any input on improvements is welcome.
Thanks in advance,
Johannes van Bentum,
Amsterdam
E-mail: 101765,344 at compuserve.com
Return to table of contents
From: Jim Cave <CAVE at PSC.ORG>
Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 8:02:13 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Gambrinus "Pale Ale" malt:
Al K asks about Gambrinus malts.
Gambrinus makes two types of "Pale" malt: One they call "Pale Malt"
and the other they call ESB malt. ESB malt was developed by a request from
smaller brewers (micros) that Gambrinus make a UK ale malt substitute.
I don't have a spec. sheet from Gambrinus on the ESB malt, but have
brewed a beer made with 100% of ESB malt, and modest hopping to highlight this
malt. OG was 1.050. The resulting beer was quite good, with a residual
sweetness and a slight breadiness in the flavour. The colour was typical of
a pale ale, a little darker than red hook. Haze was very minimal, (at 6 C)
after cold conditioning. I think the colour was a little higher than most
UK malts would deliver.
Jim Cave
Return to table of contents
From: "Bryan L. Gros" <grosbl at ctrvax.Vanderbilt.Edu>
Date: Wed, 09 Oct 1996 09:44:00 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: yeast starters
Jeff described his SNPA yeast starter:
> By Saturday morning the starter had shown little, if
>any, activity. Upon inspection there appeared to be about 1/3 inch of
>yeasty sediment in the starter. Perplexed, I picked up the starter and the
>slight agitation caused the airlock to begin bubbling. I figured the
>starter was just getting started and left it alone. Later that day it was
>not showing any signs of activity so I picked it up and again the airlock
>began bubbling. I then shook the starter and it formed a thick head and
>the airlock began blooping so rapidly that the water shot out the top of
>the airlock.
I find this to be typical of starters, even from Wyeast packets. People
are used to a big head and a lot of activity in the carboy, but I find
it is hard to even detect bubbles in the first starter. When you swirled
and made a head, this is evidence that fermentation happend. The
wort was saturated with CO2, and swirling it made the bubbles form.
So the yeast must have been working to create that CO2.
I would encourage everyone to make a starter with their yeast. And
ideally, you should pitch that starter into a bigger starter. For
example, first put a cup of wort in a beer bottle and let that get
started. Then pitch that into two cups of wort in a champagne
bottle or erlenmeyer flask to build up more yeast. Especially with a
strong beer or lager. It is almost impossible to get too much yeast
this way.
- Bryan
grosbl at ctrvax.vanderbilt.edu
Nashville, TN
Return to table of contents
From: "Bryan L. Gros" <grosbl at ctrvax.Vanderbilt.Edu>
Date: Wed, 09 Oct 1996 09:43:54 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: infusion mash
>Steven Ketcham <ketcham at earthlink.net> writes:
>1.) With a single step infusion mash it seems that the idea is to add the
>cold grains to hot water so that the final temperature is somewhere between
>150-158 F degrees. Why not simply heat the grain and the water together
>untill it reaches the target temperature?
Well, that wouldn't be an infusion mash. In an "infusion mash", you
add hot water to cold grains such that the result is the temperature you
need and you mash at that one temperature. This is the easiest way to
mash and works great for things like pale ales. And it is almost the only
way to mash if you are using a cooler as a mash tun--it wouldn't work
to put the cooler on top of a burner.
You can certainly dough in at a cooler temperature and then raise the
whole mash temperture together. In fact, some people recommend you
dough in at around 40C and then raise the temp to sacchrification
range.
Once you get some experience mashing, there are plenty of variables
to play with!
- Bryan
grosbl at ctrvax.vanderbilt.edu
Nashville, TN
Return to table of contents
From: Domenick Venezia <venezia at zgi.com>
Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 08:17:19 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Good bye
This is just a quick note to say goodbye and thank you to those who
remember me and have helped and contributed to the HBD over the last 5
years. The volume of the current HBD is simply too great for me to deal
with any longer. It's a great forum and a great resource but a little too
voluminous for me. I'm still brewing and NOT dropping off the planet so
private email and discussions are welcome.
Somebody please let me know if George Fix ever finishes his new edition
of Brewing Science :-)
Somebody please let me know if Glen Tinseth ever finishes his hop
utilization study :-)
And, please, somebody let me know if the foam-once protein thread is ever
resurected.
Thanks to you all, and I wish you all good brewing,
Domenick Venezia
Computer Resources
ZymoGenetics, Inc.
Seattle, WA
venezia at zgi.com
Return to table of contents
From: RUSt1d? <rust1d at li.com>
Date: Wed, 09 Oct 96 11:19:47 -0700
Subject: (no subject)
Following is the wit recipe I built and why. Any comments would be
appreciated.
Name: Wit Christmas O.G.: 1.049
Style: White I.B.U.: 24.8
Volume: 12.5 gallons A.B.V.: 5.0%
Grains/Fermentables Lbs Hops AAU Oz Min
Pils, German 2 Row 11.00 Centeninal 11.3 0.75 90
Wheat, Flaked 9.50 Cascade 5.5 0.50 45
Oats, Flaked 1.50 Cascade 5.5 0.50 30
Saaz 3.5 1.00 15
Belgian White Wyeast 3944 Saaz 3.5 1.00 0
Mash in 110F (43.3C) 10 mins Miscellaneous Ingredients
Boost to 128F (53.3C) 30 mins Coriander - 10 Gm In Boil
Boost to 158F (70C) 50 mins Curacao - 70 Gm In Boil
Coriander - 2.5 Gm In 2ndary
Spices at 10 mins b4 knockout.
** Reasons for what you see:
I used the curacao/coriander schedule from this recipe at the brewery:
(it's a best of show from the "spirit of belgian" comp. in '94.)
http://alpha.rollanet.org/cm3/recs/09_71.html
I went to Celis' page and read up on the hops for Celis white at:
(I was happy to see cascades...)
http://www.celis.com/beer/beer.html
I like cascades and figured using them and centennial would compliment
the curacao citrusness. I picked Saaz for flavor/aroma since the style
chart in NCJHB say 'nobel type' for hop flavor/aroma.
I am undecided if I should just buy the Wyeast Belgian White, or
if I should culture it from Hoegarrden...
- --
John Varady http://www.netaxs.com/~vectorsys/varady/index.html
Boneyard Brewing Co. "The HomeBrew Recipe Calculating Program"
"Ale today, Gone tomorrow."
Return to table of contents
From: "Bryan L. Gros" <grosbl at ctrvax.Vanderbilt.Edu>
Date: Wed, 09 Oct 1996 09:43:27 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: yeast starters
Jeff described his SNPA yeast starter:
> By Saturday morning the starter had shown little, if
>any, activity. Upon inspection there appeared to be about 1/3 inch of
>yeasty sediment in the starter. Perplexed, I picked up the starter and the
>slight agitation caused the airlock to begin bubbling. I figured the
>starter was just getting started and left it alone. Later that day it was
>not showing any signs of activity so I picked it up and again the airlock
>began bubbling. I then shook the starter and it formed a thick head and
>the airlock began blooping so rapidly that the water shot out the top of
>the airlock.
I find this to be typical of starters, even from Wyeast packets. People
are used to a big head and a lot of activity in the carboy, but I find
it is hard to even detect bubbles in the first starter. When you swirled
and made a head, this is evidence that fermentation happend. The
wort was saturated with CO2, and swirling it made the bubbles form.
So the yeast must have been working to create that CO2.
I would encourage everyone to make a starter with their yeast. And
ideally, you should pitch that starter into a bigger starter. For
example, first put a cup of wort in a beer bottle and let that get
started. Then pitch that into two cups of wort in a champagne
bottle or erlenmeyer flask to build up more yeast. Especially with a
strong beer or lager. It is almost impossible to get too much yeast
this way.
- Bryan
grosbl at ctrvax.vanderbilt.edu
Nashville, TN
Return to table of contents
From: brewshop at coffey.com (Jeff Sturman)
Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 09:43:43 -0600
Subject: Dateline NBC
My brother called me this morning and told me that last night he saw an
advertisement for Dateline NBC (the news program). One of the taglines was
something to the effect "Before you drink home brew, you had better watch
Dateline" or some such warning. My brother didn't know what day the ad was
for but he said that Dateline is on 3 or 4 times a week. Has anyone else
seen this ad? If anyone happens to find out when that program airs please
let me know, or for that matter just post it as I'm sure most subscribers
would be interested.
jeff
casper, wy
Return to table of contents
From: RUSt1d? <rust1d at li.com>
Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 11:50:28 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Mo' Wit Q's
Another question:
Which is better to use for my wit?
Flaked Wheat, Bulgar Wheat or Raw Unmalted Wheat?
Since the flaked wheat is pregelatinized would this result in a
clear wit?
If I use Bulgar wheat what preparations are needed? How 'bout Raw?
- --
John Varady http://www.netaxs.com/~vectorsys/varady/index.html
Boneyard Brewing Co. "The HomeBrew Recipe Calculating Program"
"Ale today, Gone tomorrow."
Return to table of contents
From: "Meisner Wallie MSM GRPP US" <wallie.meisner at usgr.MHS.CIBA.COM>
Date: 9 Oct 1996 16:38:09 +0000
Subject: bulk malt - Greensboro, NC
============================================================================
==========
Our last "coop" purchase of thousands of pounds of malt was so successful
that we're doing it again. Local clubs are pooling their orders and anyone
who wants to pick up in Greensboro, NC is welcome to tag along. The more the
merrier (and the cheaper). One sack minimum. Contact me via private e-mail
for more info.
Wallie Meisner
Homebrewer and notorious tightwad
(the best does not have to cost the most)
910 632 2410
wallie.meisner at usgr.mhs.ciba.com
============================================================================
=========
Return to table of contents
From: TheTHP at aol.com
Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 12:48:20 -0400
Subject: Report on the Toronto Beer Scene
The biggest difference between American and Canadian brewpubs that I found is
that Canadians aren't afraid of brewing Lagers! All of the brewpubs I visited
had their own lagers! I haven't been to an american brewpub yet that served a
lager! (Much apologies to those who do that I haven't visited. Feel free to
flame me with your locations and beer menu's. I'll do my best to stop by and
raise a pint to blow suds in your eye! ; ). My noteworthy stops in Toronto
included Al Frisco's, The Granite, and C'est What. Or.. Al Forget it next
time's, "Next to God is Granite" and C'est la vie (Trans. Oh well, whatever)
Good stuff first, moaning later...The Granite!!
WOW What a pub! Take me back to England and batter me like a haddock! They
had 5 of their beers on tap.
Top of the list is their Special (Dry-Hopped) Best Bitter! Fuggles and ahem
Cascade hops. Canadian 2-Row, imported carastan and black malts, OG 1046.
Wonderful aroma more of Cascade than Fuggles. Fresh full-bodied feel, with
the real zip of an english bitter! Best in House, and Best of Trip IMHO.
Their Best Bitter was also very good. Only lacking the freshness of aroma and
body that only dry hopping can add.
Peculiar Strong Ale was anything but peculiar. This strong english ale
nicknamed "Lunatic Broth" is wonderful. Rich in color, slight in nose and
mildly sweet to finish. I liked it-a lot! If you make it their and their out
of Special Best Bitter, skip the best bitter and start here. Yum! (OG 1056,
abv 5.6%)
Summer Ale, something for the american tourists, cask conditioned, cascade
and goldings. Canadian 2-row, Wheat, and Carastan malts. Probably Canada's
best imitation american brew.
Ringwood Ale is a new brew for them, a blonde ale. No complaints here, just
proof that they DO know how to make good light ales. Substitute torrefield
wheat and drop the carastan from the Summer Ale and their you have it. A much
better beer, no harsh dry aftertaste. A light bouquet with good balance.
Al Frisco's brewresteraunt I'll call it. Had an impressive list of beers, had
better than a half dozen wonderful english hand pumps, and only 2 of their
own beers on tap! Bummer!!! The restaurant was downstairs with a bar
upstairs. Dining was semi-formal, Excellent menu, great appetizers. Awesome
food, but small in portions. We got there about 7:45 and the wait was long
for food, so they offered to serve us the same menu if we were willing to eat
up in the bar area. Not a problem. On tap was a Continental Lager and a Honey
Wheat. Promised but not delivered were 5 or so others including a Nut Brown I
was anxious to try. The lager had an impressive head with good staying power
was a nice dark golden in color. A good Lager. Lager Lager Lager!!! Wheat
beers have never been my forte, but I had 2 of each (20oz'ers) so something
was going right! Extra light in color. Nice beer. Over all the bar makes a
better dance club than a brew pub if all they carry is 2 beers. By 9:30 the
place was packed and by 10:00 people were setting their drinks on our table.
I was ready to move on, but the ladies wanted to stay and dance. Good
ambiance, ok beers, bad selection.
C'est What, had a better selection of beers I was too tanked to try to review
them. My impression was a corporate grind em up crank them out enterprise
lacking any real substance. But that's probably not fair, it was late, my
palate was shot before we staggered in. I'd try the place again just out of
fairness.
These are just my humble ramblings, I have no association with any of the
establishments yada yada yada all opinions are my own and the result of 4
years of homebrewing, and a passion for making and drinking good beer. I'm
not a judge and don't claim to be an expert. I just love good beer!
Phil Wilcox
Jackson, MI
Return to table of contents
From: TheTHP at aol.com
Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 12:48:20 -0400
Subject: Report on the Toronto Beer Scene
The biggest difference between American and Canadian brewpubs that I found is
that Canadians aren't afraid of brewing Lagers! All of the brewpubs I visited
had their own lagers! I haven't been to an american brewpub yet that served a
lager! (Much apologies to those who do that I haven't visited. Feel free to
flame me with your locations and beer menu's. I'll do my best to stop by and
raise a pint to blow suds in your eye! ; ). My noteworthy stops in Toronto
included Al Frisco's, The Granite, and C'est What. Or.. Al Forget it next
time's, "Next to God is Granite" and C'est la vie (Trans. Oh well, whatever)
Good stuff first, moaning later...The Granite!!
WOW What a pub! Take me back to England and batter me like a haddock! They
had 5 of their beers on tap.
Top of the list is their Special (Dry-Hopped) Best Bitter! Fuggles and ahem
Cascade hops. Canadian 2-Row, imported carastan and black malts, OG 1046.
Wonderful aroma more of Cascade than Fuggles. Fresh full-bodied feel, with
the real zip of an english bitter! Best in House, and Best of Trip IMHO.
Their Best Bitter was also very good. Only lacking the freshness of aroma and
body that only dry hopping can add.
Peculiar Strong Ale was anything but peculiar. This strong english ale
nicknamed "Lunatic Broth" is wonderful. Rich in color, slight in nose and
mildly sweet to finish. I liked it-a lot! If you make it their and their out
of Special Best Bitter, skip the best bitter and start here. Yum! (OG 1056,
abv 5.6%)
Summer Ale, something for the american tourists, cask conditioned, cascade
and goldings. Canadian 2-row, Wheat, and Carastan malts. Probably Canada's
best imitation american brew.
Ringwood Ale is a new brew for them, a blonde ale. No complaints here, just
proof that they DO know how to make good light ales. Substitute torrefield
wheat and drop the carastan from the Summer Ale and their you have it. A much
better beer, no harsh dry aftertaste. A light bouquet with good balance.
Al Frisco's brewresteraunt I'll call it. Had an impressive list of beers, had
better than a half dozen wonderful english hand pumps, and only 2 of their
own beers on tap! Bummer!!! The restaurant was downstairs with a bar
upstairs. Dining was semi-formal, Excellent menu, great appetizers. Awesome
food, but small in portions. We got there about 7:45 and the wait was long
for food, so they offered to serve us the same menu if we were willing to eat
up in the bar area. Not a problem. On tap was a Continental Lager and a Honey
Wheat. Promised but not delivered were 5 or so others including a Nut Brown I
was anxious to try. The lager had an impressive head with good staying power
was a nice dark golden in color. A good Lager. Lager Lager Lager!!! Wheat
beers have never been my forte, but I had 2 of each (20oz'ers) so something
was going right! Extra light in color. Nice beer. Over all the bar makes a
better dance club than a brew pub if all they carry is 2 beers. By 9:30 the
place was packed and by 10:00 people were setting their drinks on our table.
I was ready to move on, but the ladies wanted to stay and dance. Good
ambiance, ok beers, bad selection.
C'est What, had a better selection of beers I was too tanked to try to review
them. My impression was a corporate grind em up crank them out enterprise
lacking any real substance. But that's probably not fair, it was late, my
palate was shot before we staggered in. I'd try the place again just out of
fairness.
These are just my humble ramblings, I have no association with any of the
establishments yada yada yada all opinions are my own and the result of 4
years of homebrewing, and a passion for making and drinking good beer. I'm
not a judge and don't claim to be an expert. I just love good beer!
Phil Wilcox
Jackson, MI
Return to table of contents
From: Brian Bliss <brianb at microware.com>
Date: Wed, 9 Oct 96 12:21:04 CDT
Subject: Re: infected wyeast
> From: Alex Santic <alex at brainlink.com>
> Subject: Infected Wyeast package
> Jim Liddil writes
> Nothing new. Not the first time and most likely not the last.
I've had them infected before, also, but let the starter go a few days
just to make certain. I don't know if it's the nutrient, a fermentation
by-product of some of yeasts, or simply that fact that certain strains
of yeast taste foul in their own right, but I've actually made starters
with wyeast that I was thought was infected when I opened it, and the
starter (and the beer) turned out ok! Not all of them turned have
"recovered" for me, though, and I'm not one to pitch the starter if I
have the slightest doubt.
One consistent observation is that if the package swelled completely
in 2 days or less, it was always good.
bb
- ------------------------------
Return to table of contents
From: Steve Alexander <stevea at clv.mcd.mot.com>
Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 13:47:40 -0400
Subject: Raw wheat/rice hulls&oat hulls/Why Wy1056 ?
Mark Thompson writes about using wheat flour as a cheap raw wheat
adjunct substitute ...
>[...] Then i brought the
>whole thing to a boil for a few minutes. I was attempting to do the
>procedure known as double mashing.
The point of boiling an adjunct is to gelatinize the small starch
granules. In flour the granules have already been mechanically
degraded. Grits do not have the starch granules crushed. This boil
is pointless except for it's decoction-like effects on the mash.
>[...] The flour was much more difficult and probibally not
>worth the time. Flaked cost me about $.60/# and ww flour is about
>$.43/#, general purpose is $.20/$.
If you live in a place where wheat is grown, you may be able to find
raw wheat grain even cheaper. Market price on wheat is currently
around $4.00 per bushel which is under 9 cents per pound.
- ---------
Andy Walsh asks about rice hulls ...
>What's the deal with rice hulls? I want to make a 100% wheat beer. What
>proportion of rice hulls do I need? Should they be added to the mash or just
>the lauter?
As you can probably guess, rice hulls are added as a mechanical aid to
lautering and are particularly useful when mashing beers with a high
proportion of 'sticky' grains such as wheat and rye. Rice hulls are
very high in silicates according to M&B Sci. Silicates in beer can
lead to harsh flavors. For this reason I've been using rice hulls
sparingly and only adding them at mashout in my combined mash/lauter
tun.
Zymurgy and Brewing Techniques have both had articles in the use of
rice hulls in 100% wheat malt beers in the recent past. My
recolloction is that a 1 gallon volume of rice hulls (3.8liter) was
advocated for a 5 gallon (19liter) beer batch. Personally I'd start
with half as much rice hulls.
I see that William's Brewing [ (800)-759-6025, I've no affiliation ]
sells 'Natural Filter Medium, #M72' which is "washed oat hulls" for
$1.60 per pound. They advocate around 7% by weight in 90+% malted
wheat grist. They also advocate adding the hulls "before striking".
My advice is to add them as close to lautering as practical.
I have no idea what the properties of oat hulls are. If anyone can
shed any light on oat hulls phenolics, silicates etc, I'd be
interested.
- -------------------------------
After seeing 3 queries in the last HBD regarding Wyeast Wy1056, let me
add my question. Why is this yeast so popular ?
The descriptive terms for this yeast are soft, smooth, clean, neutral.
So why is a soft, bland and nearly flavorless yeast also apparently
the most popular HB yeast for hoppy ales when alternative yeasts with
wonderful character like Wy1028, Wy1098, Wy1968 and others are equally
available ?
Microbreweries are pretty much stuck with a single ale yeast to cover
a wide variety of beers and so may need a yeast with neutral flavors.
They also have to appeal to an 'average' consumer. HBers' don't have
these limitations, so why would we (make that you) have a strong
preference for such a bland yeast ?
Steve Alexander
Return to table of contents