---

   FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
        Mike Donald, Digest Janitor-in-training
        Thanks to Rob Gardner for making the digest happen!

Contents:
  Commercial Copies ((MR STEPHEN D GARRETT))
  Mocha Java? (Dale Smith)
  Home Grown Hops... ((Aesoph, Michael))
  re: red wolf (Rscholz at aol.com)
  Wit recipe (Kit Anderson)
  1996 Capitol District Open (Fred Hardy)
  extreme beers (Eugene Sonn)
  malt revisited ("Ray Robert")
  Hugh Baird Grains: Experiences? (Mark Thompson)
  Beans and beer? (Paul Sovcik)
  AHA Styles (TheTHP at aol.com)
  Pilsner Urquell ("Brian Thompson")
  history of american beers- (PGILLMAN at POMONA.EDU)
  Water question ("Scott Rogerson")
  Alt in the USA ((Jim Layton 952-3733))
  HopDevil, cont. (Jim Busch)
  Commercial copies ("Scott Rogerson")
  IPA ((James and Tamara Williams))
  Re: Copper kettles, cous cous beer, acidifying sparge, completely cool idea          ("David R. Burley")
  Rheinheitsgebot & H2O adjmts ("William D. Knudson")
  RE: Corn/Chica (Richard Gardner)
  New Zealand Super Alpha hops (Charles Capwell)
  Re:  Alt Beer (Rich and Lori Cox)
  The IPA Thread ! ("Mark Bridges")
  1056 and culturing (Clint Weathers)

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----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: sdginc at prodigy.com (MR STEPHEN D GARRETT)
Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 14:35:48, -0500
Subject: Commercial Copies

Ed comments: 
>Periodically people request recipes for a clone of this beer or a 
>copy of that beer, and I always wonder why would you aspire to 
>make a copy of a great beer, when you could make a great beer of 
>your own.  Isn't making your own great beer what homebrewing is 
>all about? 
 
For developing ones brewing skills, I think a stronger argument can 
be made that cloning is far more effective than brewing to style 
guidelines. Find a beer with qualities that you really want in your 
own beers. Get all the information you can about how this beer is 
brewed, including other brewers recipes. When youve brewed your 
clone, you get to do a direct taste test comparison with a bottle of 
the goal beer. 
 
Isnt learning to make great beer what homebrewing is all about? 
 
Ed goes on: 
 
>for those of you out there that want to clone 
>Sierra Nevada Pale ale for instance, why don't you try to figure 
>out what it is that makes you like SNPA more than other pale 
>ales? 
 
By golly, bet thats exactly what those low-life cloners thought they 
were doing. 
 
Cheers! 
Steve 
sdginc at prodigy.com 
 

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From: Dale Smith <des at io.com>
Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 13:31:11 -0500
Subject: Mocha Java?

I recently had a Red Hook Double Black Stout made with Starbuck's (TM) 
coffee. I really enjoyed it. I have been toying with the idea of brewing 
a Mocha Java Porter or Stout which would be bittered with unsweetened 
chocolate and "dry hopped" with black coffee. Any idea about this? 
Anybody got an all grain recipe that they've actually brewed and like? 
I'd prefer something that could be ready by Christmas and wouldn't need 
to age for months. 
 
Thanks, 
  Dale 

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From: aesoph at ncemt1.ctc.com (Aesoph, Michael)
Date: 11 Oct 96 15:37:03 EDT
Subject: Home Grown Hops...

Dear Collective: 
 
 
 
 I have to bother everyone again with this question, but I lost the 
previous replies due to a network crash wiping out my mailbox.  Some 
company out there sells the rhizomes for home grown hops, could I get a 
phone number or EMail address?  TIA!!!!!!!! 
 
 
 
================================================== 
 
        Michael D. Aesoph                Associate Engineer 
 
================================================== 
 

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From: Rscholz at aol.com
Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 15:32:13 -0400
Subject: re: red wolf

Gregory King writes: 
>I stumbled across an article....that describes the development of 
Anheuser-Busch's 
>Red Wolf beer. .....The bulk of the article (maybe 85% of it) describes the 
efforts of >the A-B team to come up with the packaging (i.e. what do the 
labels look like) and >a marketing strategy for the product.  In the small 
section of the article that 
>describes the actual product development, the main point is that the barley 
>needs to be roasted in just the right way to get that red color. 
 
 That's 15% on the product and 85% on the marketing , if I figured it right. 
Just maybe that's why A-B sells more swill worldwide than anybody else? 
 
richard scholz 
bklyn ny 
 

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From: Kit Anderson <kit at maine.com>
Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 15:41:50 -0500
Subject: Wit recipe

>From: RUSt1d? <rust1d at li.com> 
>Date: Wed, 09 Oct 96 11:19:47 -0700 
>Subject: (no subject) 
> 
>Following is the wit recipe I built and why. Any comments would be 
>appreciated. 
> 
>Name:   Wit Christmas              O.G.:  1.049 
 
Hi, John. 
 
Your wit recipe is going to have the wrong hops for bitter and flavor. Use a 
low alpha noble hop like Tetnang. High alpha hops are OK in high gravity 
beers but will be way out of place in a delicate wit. Cascade is OK if used 
for bittering, but not for flavor. As you said, there should be a noble 
flavor, not American. So cut out the Cascade. There should be little to no 
hop aroma in a wit so cut out the 15 min and 0 min addition of Szaaz. I use 
Szaaz flowers  at 60 min and 20 min. 
 
Hoegaarden is better yeast than Wyeast. BrewTek's is the best. It tastes 
like Celis and you can bottle a week after pitching. Yeast Lab has a good 
culture as well. 
 
The coriander in secondary is very important. I'm glad you have it there. 
 
You mentioned that curacao adds citrus notes. I assume you are referring to 
the dried peel and not the liquor. It actually adds bitternes and not 
citrus. The citrus comes from the yeast. 
 
You are going to need 88% lactic acid when you bottle to adjust down the pH. 
Do it by taste instead of a meter or paper. I think Celis is 4.3 but when I 
went by that, it was too acidic. 
 
 
In any event, you will have a beer much better than the insipid Blue Moon or 
Wit! 
- --- 
 
Kit  Anderson 
Bath, Maine 
<kit at maine.com> 
The Maine Beer Page  http://www.maine.com/brew 
 

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From: Fred Hardy <fcmbh at access.digex.net>
Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 15:36:25 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: 1996 Capitol District Open

 
Just a reminder that the deadline to enter the 4th annual Capitol District 
Open is right around the corner. 
 
Entry open window for this year's competition is October 14 through 
October 29. Enter early and often. Mailed entries should be sent to: 
 
          1996 CDO 
          c/o Fred Hardy 
          13215 Poplar Tree Road 
          Fairfax   VA   22033 
 
Entry packets should be available at DC area drop off points: Brew America 
(Merrifield/Vienna), Hero's (Manassas), Brew Masters (Rockville), The Wine 
Seller (Herndon) and Barley House (Woodbridge). 
 
Two bottles per entry. Entry forms required, but no recipes. All AHA 1996 
NHC beer categories/subcategories accepted. Beer only - no meads, ciders 
or sake. AHA sanctioned, BJCP recognized. AHA bottle ID and entry forms 
are acceptable (IMO, ours are neater). 
 
Entry fees are $6.00 for 1st entry, $5.00 for the 2nd, $4.00 for the 3rd 
and $2.00 for each entry over 3. Checks should be made out to DReBS. 
 
The competition will be on Saturday, November 2, at the Hyatt Regency 
Washington hotel on Capitol Hill (400 New Jersey Ave, N.W.) in DC. 
 
Interested judges/stewards should contact Wayne Gisiger (202) 927-4234 
[week days], or (703) 256-8838 [evenings, etc.]. 
 
For official entry packets for non-DC area brewers, email your snail mail 
address to me, and your packet will go in the mail the same day. A 
self-extracting, zipped version (WP 6.1 format) is available if you want 
it emailed to you. Just let me know. 
 
Cheers, Fred 
 
=========================================================================== 
We must invent the future, else it will  |           Fred Hardy 
happen to us and we will not like it.    |        Fairfax, Virginia 
[Stafford Beer, "Platform for Change"]   |    email: fcmbh at access.digex.net 
 

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From: Eugene Sonn <eugene at dreamscape.com>
Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 16:15:55 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: extreme beers

Hello HBD, 
 George Piro mentions that he doesn't think there are good USA 
examples of Alt Bier because the true style is "extreme" and not very 
marketable.  I would agree, but think it's a more general phenomena. 
Remember the thread about Marzen/Octoberfest?  Most of the 
commercially available ones are not textbook examples of that style.  Most 
commercial brews (except for limited-run beers) are meant to appeal to the 
general consumer.  That's ok because if you like the "watered-down" 
version.  You may look for a more true-to-style version of the beer. 
 For me, homebrewing has it's major appeal because I can tinker 
with my beers until I have them exactly how I like them.  Yes there are 
pockets of the country where super-hopped beers are the norm and yes there 
are places where you can get good true-to-style beers, but when was the 
last time you had an Eisbock at a bar in the U.S.? 
 This whole post may be a showcase of stating the obvious, but I 
would appreciate if the postings on the HBD would just accept these beers 
for what they are......a way for people to ease into a new beer style. 
Maybe when we have as many breweries as there were before prohibition 
there could be a real market for these true-to-style beers. 
 
 Flame away, 
 
  Eugene 
  eugene at nova.dreamscape.com 
 
 
 

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From: "Ray Robert" <Ray_Robert at bah.com>
Date: 11 Oct 1996 16:15:35 U
Subject: malt revisited

A follow on to an earlier question re: the best malt to buy. 
 
Went to my local hb store and talked to one of the employees there re:  the 
types of malts they carried in bulk.  I was interested in Hugh Baird in 
particular (2 row).  He said he carried it, but also carried a UK brand called 
"crisp" .  He felt it had a little more character than HB malt.  I have never 
seen it discussed on the digest.  Anyone know about this stuff? 
 
Robert 
ray_robert at bah.com 

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From: Mark Thompson <markt at hpdocp3.cup.hp.com>
Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 13:20:28 -0700
Subject: Hugh Baird Grains: Experiences?

I have been lucky enough to find a source for the whole Hugh Baird 
product line imported by Great Western Malting Co.  I only have 
experience using the wonderful British Pale Ale malt and crystal (70, 
135).  I'm wondering if anyone has experience with any of the other 
varities that i see on their list. Some of these that i am interested in 
are: 
 
 HB Pilsen 
 HB Munich (I went a head and got a bag of this cause i 
have                         already heard good reports on it) 
 HB Carastan 
 HB Brown (i made a porter with this but it's not ready) 
 HB Scottish 
 HB Organic (i'm realy curious about this) 
 HB Stout (not black or roasted barley) 
 HB Vienna 
 
They also have the Great Western domestic varities: 
 
 GW Pale Ale (High Color) (This is listed in addition to 
the                                 Primium 2 row which i use all the 
time) 
 GW Munich and Vienna 
 
Any information would be appreciated.  I'll take private E-Mail 
and report. 
- -- 
*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^* 
Mark E. Thompson mailto:mark_thompson at hp.com 
Enterprise Objects Program Networked Computing Division 
Hewlett-Packard Co. Cupertino CA 
*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^* 

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From: Paul Sovcik <U18183 at UICVM.UIC.EDU>
Date: Fri, 11 Oct 96 15:27:11 CDT
Subject: Beans and beer?

 
The other night, after making a huge crockpot full of pinto beans and 
realizing that there was no way on Gods green earth I and my family could 
eat all these things before they spoil, and the last thing I'd ever do would 
be to give them to the dog, and just how DO six cups of dry beans turn into 
a full week of meals.... 
 
   That I wondered about the potential for using beans as an adjunct in beer. 
 
  I know dry beans tend to be very high in protein, and they are low in fat. 
I'm not sure about carbohydrate content though. 
 
  Are these things pure protein?  Has anyone ever investigated the potential 
for using pinto or navy or kidney or garbanzo beans as an adjunct?  Delano? 
 
  How would you mash them? 
 
- -Paul 
Paul Sovcik, Western Springs, IL 

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From: TheTHP at aol.com
Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 16:31:58 -0400
Subject: AHA Styles

Hello all ye experienced netsurfers and brewers, 
 
Ed Steinkamp makes a good point about making your own beer and your own 
reciepe's. I for one, though being new to the 
"addiction" (hobby just does't do justice), have never used a recipe I didn't 
adjust, mess in, or create on my own. Several people in many diffent threads 
have discussed AHA Style guidelines. WHere can I find these. Are they on-line 
buried somewhere in the massive depths of "The Brewery" web site? If they are 
available would someone be so kind as to tell me where? 
Thanks, Sincerely, Phil Wilcox 
ps. Im currently concocting a pumpkin ale, all advice welcome. 
******KneeDeep in Ale****** 
******Poison Frog Brewery****** 

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From: "Brian Thompson" <bthompson at mfi.com>
Date: Fri, 11 Oct 96 10:00:54 PST
Subject: Pilsner Urquell

Sorry this is so late on the thread (it takes a long time to catch up 
on HBD reading once you get behind), but I thought I'd toss my two 
cents in. 
 
Back in the summer of '91, I happened to be traveling in Europe and 
spent a few days in Czechoslovakia. The country at that time was still 
very much recovering from communism and prices reflected that. My 
friend and I managed to pick up a case of Prazdroj (as PU is known in 
CZ) for the paltry sum of $3.50. We're talking 12 half liter bottles 
for what we pay for a pint here. I thought I was in heaven. I'd never 
tasted PU before that day and I swore if I had my way I'd never drink 
another Budmilloors again. Well, I got back to America and found a few 
places that imported PU (it's much more available today) but was shocked 
at the poor quality of every single bottle I tried. The moral of the 
story? I don't drink PU in America, to this day I haven't had an un-skunked 
bottle. But by God, if you get the chance to try it fresh, you will know 
the meaning of religious experience. 
 
I was again in Prague about two years ago and made an effort to try other 
Czech beers: Staropramen and Budvar are as good, if not better, than PU. 
For those of you living in the Bay Area, Toronado in SF has Staropramen on 
tap, haven't been to try it yet, but if it's half as good as it can be, it's 
worth checking out. 
 
Brian Thompson 
SF, CA 
 

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From: PGILLMAN at POMONA.EDU
Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 14:18:22 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: history of american beers-

if anyone has, or knows the location of a collection of old recipies or 
manuals upon brewing, malting and/or distilling, i would appreciate help 
with a project in which i am attempting to establish guidelines for, 
and create modern measurements for old american styles (colonial through 
the 1880's) thanks alot 
phil gillman 
Pgillman at pomona.edu 
 
p.s. i will publish my major styles and recipies later in the year, both 
electronically and physically- 
happy brewing. 

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From: "Scott Rogerson" <rogerson at hom.net>
Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 18:23:51 -0500
Subject: Water question

I just got this information from my water company.  Can anyone give me some 
advice on where to go from here?  Anything here look real bad?  (or good?) 
 
Alkalinity            25-30   mg/l 
pH                7.0 - 7.5   mg/l 
Residual C12    1.3 - 1.7   mg/l 
Fluoride      .9 - 1.2   mg/l 
Hardness           30 - 35    mg/l 
Iron             .000 - .015  mg/l 
Manganese        .000 - .010  mg/l 
Phosphate          .9 - 1.2   mg/l 
Turbidity         .01 - .10   NTU 
 
 
Email, or HBD is fine. 
 
Thanks. 
Scott 
 
================================ 
Scott Rogerson rogerson at hom.net 
http://www.hom.net/~rogerson 
================================ 

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From: layton at sh28.dseg.ti.com (Jim Layton 952-3733)
Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 17:51:28 -0500
Subject: Alt in the USA

OK, I'll chime in. Hannen Alt is available in the Dallas, Texas area. It 
is the only alt imported from Germany that I have seen in this area. I bought 
a bottle two weeks ago to use as a standard in evaluating an alt which I 
recently brewed. The label indicated the location of the brewery, but it 
wasn't Dusseldorf. I won't bore you with the several ways in which my homebrew 
missed the mark, but I will use these observations in adjusting my next 
attempt at an altbier: 
 
   Color - Pretty dark but quite clear. Like a dark Oktoberfest. 
   Malt - Toasted malt flavor, more intensely toasty than Spaten or Paulaner 
          Oktoberfest. Might have used a darker grade of munich malt than I 
          can get around here. The finish was dry. 
   Hops - Fairly bitter, very little hop flavor. More balanced in bitter/ 
          sweet than I had expected from some descriptions of the style 
          (The AHA guidelines show a pretty wide range for IBUs). No hop 
          aroma to my nose. 
   Esters - Won't mistake this for a lager, but it was a pretty clean brew. 
          A clean ale flavor. 
   Overall - Like a dark Oktoberfest brewed with an ale yeast and a bit more 
          hops. Very tasty, but I think the specimen I had may have lost 
          something due to age or pasteurization. The malt flavor was just 
          a little less fresh than it might have been. 
 
I won't claim that Hannen makes the definitive altbier, but this was good. 
A homebrewed version could be better! 
 
Jim Layton 
layton at sh28.dseg.ti.com 

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From: Jim Busch <busch at eosdev2.gsfc.nasa.gov>
Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 18:30:17 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: HopDevil, cont.

Tom inquires: 
 
<The recent thread on the IPA style and the high praise for HopDevil from 
<Victory Brewing, has prompted me to try my hand at a "Classic IPA," 
 
I would first refer all interested parties to the excellent piece 
written by David Brockington on American IPAs in the current issue 
of Brewing Techniques (where you can also read some of my drivel, ;-) 
 
Note we are talking about American IPAs now.  British IPAs no longer 
exist, by and large.  They are merely versions of Bitter.  The debate 
rages, tradition, history, color, hop types, etc.  I say tradition is 
great and very important but we in the US craft brewing industry are 
expanding and redefining styles all of the time.  I didnt go about 
brewing HopDevil's precursors with the idea that I had to mimic some 
historical IPA recipe.  I made what I liked, using hops that I find 
pleasing and yes, even using that horrific bland American Ale yeast! 
I was inspired by Celebration Ale, a beer Ive always had a love for, 
but I never tried nor accomplished imitating SNCA.  While HopDevil 
is darker than most IPAs it is in range with many hoppy American ales 
being brewed today.  I dont find color or malt foundation to be a 
defect with American IPAs but I think they bring complexity to the 
brew that would not exist with a grist predominantly based on pale 
and Munich malts.  The one aspect we all agree on is a heavy obvious 
hop bittering foundation. 
 
<My request is for hopping info for a classic IPA. 
 
Classic, historical IPAs should be crafted in the veins of Brooklyns 
IPA.  Light in color and based on UK hops.  OG 16P, FG 3P or less, 
IBUs 55-70, good aroma presence. 
 
<It sounds as if HopDevil is being nominated for the definitive IPA (I can 
<forgive you for using cascades).   Can you provide me with insight, Jim? 
<Any trade secrets that Victory is willing to part with?  ;^) 
 
The general overview of the beer can be found in Daves article.  Cascades 
provide the late aroma additions while Centennials and some domestic 
Tettnang are used in the kettle.  Aim for about 50 IBUs from the first 
Centennial addition to provide the hop foundation and use additional 
hops to taste for mid and late additions.  Our grist is based on German 
malts, imported pale malt, Vienna malt, Munich malt and caramel malts. 
 
Brewing Techniques is a great magazine and I encourage all interested 
readers to go get it and see what Dave has to say.  We dont agree on 
all things stylistically but I think I agree more with what Dave has 
to say on styles than on any other widely published source. 
 
Prost! 
 
Jim Busch 
 
See Victory Brewing at: 
http://www.victorybeer.com/ 

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From: "Scott Rogerson" <rogerson at hom.net>
Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 19:48:25 -0500
Subject: Commercial copies

> From: Edward J. Steinkamp <ejs0742 at dop.fse.ca.boeing.com> 
> Periodically people request recipes for a clone of this beer or a 
> copy of that beer, and I always wonder why would you aspire to 
> make a copy of a great beer, when you could make a great beer of 
> your own.  Isn't making your own great beer what homebrewing is 
> all about? 
 
 From my perspective, trying to emulate beers that you like is a way of 
learning.  I know (for instance) that Liberty Ale is one of my favorite 
beers.  I'm smart enough to know that it's got plenty of bitter/aroma hops. 
 I know that it's dry hopped with cascades (I can read the label).  But I 
don't know nearly enough about beer or homebrewing to be able to discern 
exactly what other ingredients are used or the methods Anchor uses to make 
such a great beer.  I'm sure this will come with more experience, (I've 
only brewed 8 batches so far) but until then this is a way that I can start 
with a recipe that is _SUPPOSE_ to taste like a target commercial beer, and 
then compare it with what I get myself. 
 
> For me, the style is the key.  I may look for a great Belgium Wit 
> recipe, or an extra hoppy IPA recipe, or use the information in 
> the style gudelines and some example recipes to make my own 
> recipe, but ultimately it is my own beer, and not some clone. For 
 
 I must admit that I almost never follow a given recipe to the letter. 
Maybe this is something we all do. (?)  I think a little more of ingredient 
'x' should be added... or whatever.  Maybe our methods aren't that far 
apart. 
 
> and I created a recipe to suite my own needs.  I like Red Hook 
> ESB, but I don't want to clone it, how boring.  So, as I continue 
 
 Perhaps when I get as experienced as you, I won't need to ask for other 
people's recipes.  Until then... Why not cut a new guy a break? 
 
Scott Rogerson 
rogerson at hom.net 
http://www.hom.net/~rogerson/ 
 

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From: texan at mindspring.com (James and Tamara Williams)
Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 20:39:09 -0400
Subject: IPA

It's ironic that the subject of whether Bass is an IPA came up just now 
since a friend and I were discussing that very topic last weekend. 
 
I said I don't think it tastes like an IPA, but then he raised an 
interesting point. 
 
The original reason an IPA was brewed to such a high gravity and hopped so 
aggressively was to survive the long boat trip to India from England. 
 
he said: During the long trip  (several months) and as the beer matured the 
perceived hop level and body would continue to decrease until it arrived 
in India will a more traditional hop flavor and mouth feel. So is the 
definative flavor of an IPA deteremined when it was first put in the cask 
or after it arrived and tapped? 
 
Comments? 
 
Brew on, 
James 
 
 
 

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From: "David R. Burley" <103164.3202 at CompuServe.COM>
Date: 11 Oct 96 21:10:27 EDT
Subject: Re: Copper kettles, cous cous beer, acidifying sparge, completely cool idea         

> 
> From: "Christopher D. King" <king1679 at mars.superlink.net> 
> Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 08:06:15 -0400 
> Subject: Re: Why are copper kettles used? 
> 
> Copper is a micro nutrient for yeast (not sure off hand what it does but 
> can look it up if anyone is interested. If a brewery is not using copper 
> (ie. those w/ steel kettles but copper clad for looks) They either have 
> a piece of copper at the bottom or along the way before the wort cools. 
> 
Sorry, but I doubt very sincerely if the Sumerians or whoever first used copper
kettles knew very much aout micronutrients. Copper is an excellent conductor of
heat ( a must for direct firing), malleable and available. Tradition is strong 
in the artsy trades like wine and beer because small things like copper in 
beer,
oak tannins and slow oxidation of wine, etc.,(just like your mother's cooking 
is
the best in the world) are very important if not completely understood. I have 
looked into some of these modern brew kettles and never seen a piece of copper.
Where is it?  I don't doubt you, just would like to know more about it. 
- --------------------------------------------------------------------- 
 
From: Ken Sullivan <kj at nts.gssc.com> 
 
  And... what is couscous anyway? 
I asked around the office and got answers from 'pasta' to 
Morroccan Wheat.   Can it be mashed? 
 
You can mash anything, it just depends on the size of your hammer. 
 
Cous Cous is the name of the dish which can be a very spicy. In North Africa it
is generally a  thin tomato or 
 ( mutton or goat) meat gravy over a starchy preparation which is made is made 
from Bulghur ( or Bulgur) Wheat .   The wheat is cracked. steamed, dried, 
packaged and sold. Bulgur is essentially instant wheat granules ( about the 
size
of the little seed shaped pasta - Semillas ), Just add boiling water and wait a
few minutes. 
 
I know the box which contains the wheat grains says "Cous Cous" and sometimes 
"Pasta" to describe the contents., but this is a marketing gimmick. If it said 
Bulghur Wheat would you know what to do with it and buy it?  I believe the 
grains are called Bulgur. Bulgur is Turkish and makes me guess this preparation
is left over from the Ottoman Empire.  Any Moroccans or Libyans out there who 
can comment further? 
 
Bulghur should mash just fine in a mash containing 2 row or six row pale malt. 
Be sure to use a protein rest. 
- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
Saying "Pale Malt"  reminds me.  I looked through lots of professional books, 
semi-professional, and hobby books. I find that depending upon the author and 
his subject. "Pale" can be used for Pale Ale or for Pale lager/pilsner. One of 
the authors ( born in Wales and lived in the US for lotsa years), writing about
British beers used the phrase interchangably saying pale sometimes and pale ale
others.  I find that when a book contains both Lager and British beers 
discussions, "Pale Ale" is used for British beers and "Pale" or "Lager" is used
for American and European lagers. This is done to avoid confusion. I suggest we
try to be more consistent and do this. 
 
AlK is righter on this usage than I am on a global basis. In the US, because we
use both lager and British Pale malts we tend toward the Continental usage of 
Pale, I find "pale" means lager or pilsner malts almost always and Pale Ale 
refers to highly modified malts in the British fashion. I guess we should stop 
saying "Pale" by itself and say lager or pilsner or  "Pale Ale". 
 
I do know this.  LOTS of people have been confused by the use of Pale to mean 
both lager and british malts. 
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ 
Peter Ensminger says: 
"Sparge water pH is important.  If it is too high, it will extract 
polyphenols (tannins) from the grains into the wort and this can lead to 
an astringent beer.  One way to lower the sparge water pH is to add gypsum 
(CaSO4.2H2O).  However, for water which is highly alkaline to begin with, 
you may need to use lactic acid or phosphoric acid." 
 
In pure distilled water, CaSO4 will be nearly neutral and will not acidify 
water. If the wort exiting from the sparged grains has phosphoric acid or the  
higher protonated forms of the phosphate ion then calcium phosphate precipitate
will release the protons from the phosphate ion which will acidify the wort. 
But as the sparge becomes more dilute in wort components, the phosphates 
decrease ( which is one reason why the pH goes up) and the ability of calcium 
sulfate to acidify the sparge decreases.  Therefore, I would not recommend 
calcium sulfate as an addditive to the sparge water.  Use lactic or phosphoric 
acid in all cases to be safe. 
- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
Rick Dial has an interesting idea to avoid copper contacting the hot wort 
during
the cooling phase. 
 
"My solution seems very simple and as such must have some serious drawbacks. 
Silver solder 10-15 wraps of 1/2 " copper tubing on the outside of my 15 
gallon stainless brew 
kettle. Run the tubing dry during the boil. Blast cold water around the 
outside afterwards and 
have no concerns about copper flavors or gunk in the counterflow chiller. 
Will silver solder bond correctly to the stainless? 
Will the cooling rate be significantly slower then with my counterflow 
chiller? " 
 
1) A problem I see is that the surface area exposed to the hot stuff ( the 
boiler wall in this case) is substantially less than what you would have if the
copper tubing were inside or the wort was runnung down the middle of the 
tubing..  Heat transfer is surface area dependent so I guess you will have 
either cooler water running out the exit ( poor heat transfer efficiency) or it
will take maybe several hours to cool it off, based on a comment some weeks ago
that a coil in a boiler takes about 1/2 hour to cool to RT.. 
 
2) Copper and SS have a different thermal expansion coefficients and you may 
have separation or minicracks develop which can impede heat transfer.  It will 
unlikely be a problem over this small temperature range with the thin SS and 
malleable copper. 
 
3) I believe silver solder will adhere to both SS and copper ( based on I think
I remember doing it many years ago - but I am suspicious), but to those who 
have
done it recently, please comment. 
 
Why not try a crude test and see if the tubing wrapped around the kettle 
without
soldering will give you some  cooling.  This will be the worst rate of cooling 
you get since you will not have good contact. 
 
One solution to this surface area contact problem may be to put your kettle in 
a
thermal transfer fluid - like water.  Having direct contact is not really a 
problem and you will still have efficient cooling.  Try your setup without 
soldering, in a waterbath. 
 
Please let us know. 
- ---------------------------------------------------------------------- 
 
Keep on brewin' 
 
 
Dave Burley 
Kinnelon, NJ 07405 
103164.3203 at compuserve.com 
 
 
 

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From: "William D. Knudson" <71764.203 at CompuServe.COM>
Date: 11 Oct 96 21:48:47 EDT
Subject: Rheinheitsgebot & H2O adjmts

I seem to recall from an earlier discussion on this forum that german brewers 
are allowed certain water adjustments and this does not violate the 
Rheinheitsgebot. 
 
Bill 
 

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From: Richard Gardner <rgardner at monarch.papillion.ne.us>
Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 22:19:55 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: RE: Corn/Chica

Living here in the heart of corn country I feel I can accurately state that 
not all corn is created equal. The radio stations here even carry hourly 
corn prices! Corn these days is highly hybridized (and even genetically 
engineered to be resistant to fungus).  Besides specialty corn there are two 
basic varities: 
 - Eating corn = sweet corn (white or yellow?) 
 - Feed corn - (misnomer) - used for both feed AND corn starch & corn sugar, 
major ingredients in most human foods these days - there was an excellent 
National Geographic article on this a couple of years ago - highly recommended.
 
There are significant sugar differences between the types of corn.  Anyone 
who has tried feed corn will tell you it doesn't taste very good - not sweet. 
 
Specialty corn would most definatley include blue corn.  Anyone that has had 
blue tortilla chips (or posole') will not ever again confuse blue corn's 
taste with the regular variety.  And let's not forget popcorn as well - 
which I've seen in colors other than pure white. 
 
All this reminds me of barley malts.  Yes, there are differences!  Should it 
be any surprise that corn can be as different as barley? 
 

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From: Charles Capwell <chas at A119018.sat1.as.crl.com>
Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 22:11:31 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: New Zealand Super Alpha hops

I recently picked up 12 oz of this hop for a cheap price at a local 
homebrew supply shop and was wondering if there were any recipes out 
there that call for this hop specifically? 
 
Also if anyone can send me *any* information on this hop(oils, flavors, 
what hops it can reply/most resembles, etc), I'd greatly appreciate it. 
 
- -Chas 
(chas at crl.com) 
 
 

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From: Rich and Lori Cox <lori at kdn0.attnet.or.jp>
Date: Sat, 12 Oct 1996 13:04:43 +0900
Subject: Re:  Alt Beer

Although not called an Alt by its maker, Grolsch Amber is described my 
Michael Jackson (in his Beer Companion book, page 150) as being very 
much in the Alt Beer style. 
 
Cheers! 
 
Richard Cox 
Okinawa, Japan 

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From: "Mark Bridges" <mbridges at coastnet.com>
Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 22:25:06 -0700
Subject: The IPA Thread !

One of the best things about our forum is the ability to discuss ideas and 
concepts and topics on a regional basis.  GO HBD GO! 
 
That said, here's my .02 on IPA. 
 
An excellent couple of articles on IPA were written by Thom Thomlinson in 
Brewing Techniques starting with the March/April issue in 1994.  I think 
any IPA fan not familiar with these articles should check them out.  Very 
informative. 
 
In my neck of the woods, my favorite version of IPA is brewed by Spinnakers 
Brewpub. With an OG from English Malt in the 1.060's, and around 60 IBU's 
of bitterness, this blonde-ish beer has a marriage of hop character and 
maltiness which is exquisite to the taste.  And also locally Swans Brewpub 
produces (only periodically, unfortunately) an IPA which is in the darker 
range of the style, strong, and benefiting from generous dry-hopping. 
Ahh, choice in premium IPA! 
 
Another HBD post mentioned Bhagwan's Best IPA from Big Time Brewpub in 
Seattle.  This beer is worth the trip to the brewpub alone (Try the Coal 
Creek Porter too).   Pike Place Brewing (now Pike Brewing in a new, nearby 
location?  Seattle brewers let us know) had an East India Pale Ale which I 
found tasty (goldings/fuggles hops ?), though lacking some IBU's.  I would 
like to try that one again, given the good reputation of Pike Place beers. 
 
In addition I would like to mention that here in Victoria we have The Great 
Canadian Beer Festival, on November 1 & 2.  The now burdgeoning B.C. beer 
scene is happening, some prominent U.S. Northwest breweries are attending 
again, and now a  Special Edition bar will feature beers from 
Central/Eastern Canada;  a good time will be had by all.  Fifth 
year.....sixth year of the festival ?  Brain cramp is starting to set in. 
 
See us at http://www.pacificcoast.net/~patkinson/GCBF.htm 
 
Private e-mail inquiries welcomed. 
 
Cheers, and Good Brewing, 
 
 
Mark Bridges 
HBD Subscriber 
Victoria, B.C. 
 

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From: Clint Weathers <clintw at echo.sound.net>
Date: Sat, 12 Oct 1996 00:35:33 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: 1056 and culturing

Does anyone else in HBD find 1056 rather tough to grab with an 
innoculation loop?  The cultures I get (except from plates, and even then 
sometimes) seem fairly liquid and tough to grab a hunkoyeast with... 
 
Just wondering, 
 
 
|  Clint Weathers                    | 
|  Rhino Brewing Company             | 
|  Nano-brewer and Yeast Rancher     | 
|  North Kansas City, Missouri       | 
|  Relax, Dont worry, Breed Yeast!   | 
 
 

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