HOMEBREW Digest #2297 Monday, December 30 1996
Digest #2296
Digest #2298
(formerly Volume 02 : Number 017)
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Contents:
Re: Wheeler/CAMRA
Hospital O2 bottles
Also RE: Re-using Yeast
Using kegs as sparage water containers
Micrwave sterilizing
Any New Books??
Supply Stores in Washing, D.C. Area??
Pale Ale & Porter recipes
Req: Vienna lager Recipe (All Grain)
Re: Kevin Kane's Mead comment
Brewing Software
First-Time brewer
Transition to All-Grain
Coffee Stout
re: dry hop in primary; extended time in primary
re: No-sparge data
Hydrometer readings and air in the wort
Making Brewer's Best Kit Better
Assist me, quick, with dortmunder Chemistry!
No Dark Beers in Boston?
Homebrew Digest V2 #11
Kegs, mini-kegs, Co2 cylinder
Collecting sparge in a bucket -- safe from DMS?
Counter-presure bottle fillers
Need Info on Opening a Homebrew Shop
RE: Re-using Yeast
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: 27 Dec 96 11:33:27 EST
From: "David R. Burley" <103164.3202 at CompuServe.COM>
Subject: Re: Wheeler/CAMRA
Brewsters:
AlK says:
> I've been reading Wheeler's "Home Brewing - A CAMRA Guide" and I've
> run across a few questionable statements.
> "Most brewers' yeasts also require some hop products to be
> present in the wort for normal behaviour to occur."
DRB - News to me too, except this may have come from the fact that these
unhopped worts are more sensitive to bacteria and would appear to be abnormal if
infected. For just this this reason, I always use a hopped wort extract for my
starters despite the pain in the butt of keeping extract around in a plastic
container in the fridge.
> "When transferring beer into barrels or bottles it is important
> that precautions are taken to ensure that a minimum of air gets
> into solution [oxygen actually, nitrogen is all but insoluble]...
> ... if the yeast finds a plentiful supply of air [sic] it will
> revert to aerobic respiration [sic] and begin to multiply
> significantly. Not only will this produce an excessive quantity
> of yeast in the beer, but when the air is used up the yeast will
> try to adapt to anaerobic respiration [sic] again, but it may find
> a lack of nutrients on which to work and become stuck in a
> transitionary phase. Under these conditions the yeast will remain
> in suspension and could take a long time to clear down properly."
DRB - I presume this is talking about a kegging beer which has sufficient sugar
to provide conditioning in the keg. Then I think it is OK, except I don't
understand about the flocculation phenomena.
> "The presence of calcium sulphate reduces the solubility of
> undesirable carbonates."
Without consulting solubility constant table to verify this, I presume this is
referring the fact that a higher calcium content will depress the solubility of
poorly soluble calcium salts. My intuition tells me that carbonate salts are
more soluble than sulfate and that this needs some explaining to make sense of
it.
> Is this right? I thought the solubility of carbonates was a function of
> pH and that was it. It is true that you can only precipitate calcium
> carbonate if you have enough calcium available, but you need to still
> boil-off the CO2 to lower the pH and it's this pH drop, not the gypsum,
> that causes the calcium carbonate to come out of solution. Comments?
DRB - This pH phenomenon you are talking about depends on the fact that the
bicarbonate salt of calcium is much more soluble than the carbonate salt.
Adding an excess of carbon dioxide to a slurry of calcium carbonate will
dissolve a considerable quantity of calcium carbonate as the bicarbonate salt.
Boiling or changing the pH will remove the CO2 and re-precipitate the carbonate.
If the pH is dropped low enough the carbonate will decompose and the CO2 will
bubble off and the calcium salt of the acid used to lower the pH will
predominate the solubility characteristics.
> "The addition of acids to the water, such as citric acid or lactic
> acid, will also cause the precipitation of carbonates."
DRB - As AlK indicated, this is dead wrong for an excess of acid, but I suppose
if just sufficient acid were added to knock off the CO2 from the bicarbonate,
without the second carbonate one might expect to see a carbonate precipitation.
I'd like to see a real-life demo, since it is not a normally encountered
phenomenon.
> "Calcium sulphate is difficult to get into solution in the boiler,
> whereas the problem doesn't exist if it is mixed into the mash."
>
> I thought it really didn't matter... I thought that as long as you are
> not close to the solubility limit of the calcium sulphate, it will
> readily go into solution, no?
DRB - Well, the key is you are close to the solubility limit of Calcium sulfate
since it is so relatively insoluble in water. In the mash, however, the calcium
phosphate is so much more insoluble, the phosphate ion from the malt steals the
calcium from the sulfate salt and releases the sulfate ion and acidifies the
mash.
>
> "Calcium sulphate is alkaline and actually incrases the pH of the
> water to which it is added, but... reduces the pH of the resulting
> mash..."
>
I thought it was virtually neutral, no?
DRB - Calcium sulfate is virtually neutral. The first ionization states of
calcium and sulfate are as for strong acids and bases.
> "Dextrins are mostly non-fermentable, but also contain some very
> slowly fermentable sugars." and "Yeast continues to attack dextrins
> for many months, even years, and are therefore regarded as slowly
> fermenting sugars."
>
> Is this right? I was under the impression that "dextrins" were unfermentable
> by our cultured brewers' yeasts. S. diastaticus, perhaps, but this is not
> a desirable yeast in the average brewery. Could this just be a question of
> nomenclature? Could Wheeler have meant "oligosaccarides" when he wrote
> "dextrins?"
Some of the dextrins are somewhat slowly fermentable. I recall reading that S
Uvarum can knock down the dextrin level a little over a long time.
>
> "High mash temperatures favour the extraction of high molecular
> weight nitrogenous compounds..."
>
> Are polyphenols nitrogenous?
DRB - Not usually. and I don't think of them as high molecular weight. I agree
this sounds like protein material. Maybe it is the fact that the proteases are
sensitive to temperature and the proteins don't get broken down in high
temperature mashes, and therefore it appears that high mash temperatures are
extracting HMW nitrogenous compounds.
Keep on brewin'
Dave Burley
Kinnelon, NJ 07405
103164.3202 at compuserve.com
Voice e-mail OK
Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 13:51:54 -0600
From: Steve Potter <spotter at Meriter.com>
Subject: Hospital O2 bottles
A word of warning to those of you thinking about moving up to 6lb
hospital O2 tanks. I found one cheap, but it has cost me a lot. In addition
to the cost of the usual hydrostatic test there was an another big
surprise. When I took the bottle in to be filled, the guy behind the counter
asked if I had a perscription. It turns out that in order to have an O2 tank
filled that is equipped with a medical gas valve, a perscription is needed.
I was able to have them remove the medical valve and replace it with an
industrial valve, but I then had to replace a part on my regulator as well.
Once I get it all put together I know I will like the system, but when you
add the changes to the tank and regulator coupled with the cost of a 2
micron stone, cheap it isn't.
****************************************************
The more I learn about brewing,
The thirstier I get.
Steve Potter Madison, WI
****************************************************
Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 11:12:36 -0800 (PST)
From: Heiner Lieth <lieth at telis.org>
Subject: Also RE: Re-using Yeast
> I plan to rack an ale to the secondary, and to use
>the sediment in the primary in my next batch of ale.
<snip>
>I read in the HBD that some have had success with racking the cooled wort
>on top of sediment that remained in a freshly emptied primary fermenter.
>I use a glass carboy as my primary.
>If this is too risky, or a big mistake, if anyone can let me know, I
>would greatly appreciate it.
I've also been wondering the same thing, but I'm even more interested in the
following similar line of thinking: I don't filter; I prime with sugar. So
every bottle that I've ever brewed has lot of live yeast cells (a few
million, I guess) in it at bottling. I've been assuming that these cells die
once they run out of food, but I wonder if anyone has checked out: (1) if
this is the case, and (2) over what period of time?
In any case, I know that during the first week after bottling they live and
thrive (from the priming). So the following seems a reasonable course of
action in dealing with yeast for brewing: Let's assume that you have a
bottle of beer that you brewed using a particular yeast that you want to use
in an upcoming brew session (I'm guessing that this happens a lot for most
of you). A few days before you need the yeast, you prepare 1 cup of hop
wort (perhaps just corn sugar and water). After it's cooled to 80F you open
the beer bottle and decant off the beer (and drink it) leaving about a
quarter of the beer in the bottle. Then sanitize the top of the bottle with
alcohol. Swirl the sediment in the bottle and pour the cooled sugar water
into the bottle and attach an airlock. In a few days this should be ready
for pitching (probably pretty quickly if the beer was bottled in the past
two weeks).
My questions are:
1. Does anyone do this?
2. Does the yeast in unfiltered beer in the bottle actually die or is it
simply dormant?
...If dormant, how long does it take to "wake up".
...If it dies, how quickly does this happen and how long does it take for
95% to die.
Heiner Lieth,
Davis, California
Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 13:15:39 -0600
From: Gary Eckhardt <dcigary at txdirect.net>
Subject: Using kegs as sparage water containers
Hello all!
I'm trying to set up my GOTT cooler mashtun, and although I plan to
build a three-tier system in the future with propane burners, I want
to try things out beforehand with what I've got.
I'm trying to figure out the logistics of getting my sparage water above
my mashtun, and then my boilpot below that. I'm also stuck with using
my kitchen stove (which ain't bad, BTW, been doing batches on it for
over a year and it works great). What I was thinking about was this:
The heck with gravity for delivering sparage water, I'll do it under
pressure from a corny keg, so I can place the keg at the same height
as the mashtun on a counter, and then gravity feed my wort to my boilpot
It would make things muuuuch simpler right now.
Does anyone see any potential problems with using a corny keg to hold my
sparage water (with a towel wrapped around it for insulation) and
delivering the water under pressure to my sparage arm? I had planned to
install an inline valve in the line from the keg to the sparage arm to
control the flow. Right now, with about 5psi and no valve, it makes the
arm spin around so fast I think it's going to take off.
I've tried a few trial runs with no mash and hot tap water, and it
works great, but I was wondering if there was a problem lurking
around (temperature retention, CO2 in the water, etc) that I don't know
about.
Thanks for any info!
- ---------------------------+----------------------------------------------
Gary Eckhardt | "in this day & age...music performed by
Database Consultants, Inc. | humans...hum!?" --wilde silas tomkyn
dcigary at txdirect.net | R,DW,HAHB!
gary_eckhardt at realworld.com| R^3 = "Real World. Real Smart. Real Quick."
(210)344-6566 | http://www.realworld.com/
Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 1996 13:12:43 -0800
From: "James M. Harper" <harperj at olympus.net>
Subject: Micrwave sterilizing
Have any of you Bact-T Majors done any research or testing using the
microwave oven as a sterilizing device?
Jim Harper
Sequim, WA
Better to understand a little than to misunderstand a lot.
Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 01:04:48 -0500
From: shane at cais.cais.com
Subject: Any New Books??
Are there any books that have come out lately, i.e. past three months?? Or are
there any good books coming out?? If so, any good recipes?? Thanks!
Shane Saylor, Eccentric Bard
Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 01:09:02 -0500
From: shane at cais.cais.com
Subject: Supply Stores in Washing, D.C. Area??
Could the members of the list send me a private Email or post here
the names, addresses, & hours of any stores in the Washington, D.C.
Metro Area?? Thanks!
Shane Saylor, Eccentric Bard
Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 10:33:35 -0500
From: cefa8059 at dpnet.net (Gregory Cefalo)
Subject: Pale Ale & Porter recipes
Hello to all!
Several of my colleages and I (malt extract brewers) are looking for
pale ale and porter recipes. I've perused Cat's Meow, but was wondering
if anybody out there has a favorite recipe that maybe hasn't been
published. Please send directly to my email so that Homebrew Digest
stays at a manageable size, my address is: cefa8058 at dpnet.net.
If anyone else is interested in the same collection of recipes, send me
your email address and I will forward the recipes that I receive.
Thanks in advance,
Greg Cefalo
Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 17:22:22 -0800
From: "Kelly C. Heflin" <kheflin at monmouth.com>
Subject: Req: Vienna lager Recipe (All Grain)
I'm looking for some good proven recipes for an all grain, Vienna lager.
I'm looking for a medium to full bodied, malty flavor.This is something
I'm going to try and stick with to develop a consistent. I want to end
up knowing how to make it for myself, fairly strong, and then make a
slightly lighter version for all the people that ask for a keg for a
party.
5 gallons, all grain please.
thanks in advance.
kelly
- --
Kelly C. Heflin
Kheflin at monmouth.com
Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 20:36:04 +0000
From: "John R. Bowen" <jbowen at primary.net>
Subject: Re: Kevin Kane's Mead comment
Kevin, what is "self-collected 'dark and wild' honey"? The bees
collect most of mine.
Seriously, I made a light metheglin (hopped, 10 lb honey/5 gal) with
some really dark "wildflower (clover, elm, berry, catmint, smartweed,
dandilion, apple, etc.)" honey I gathered from my hives in Nebraska
about 10 years ago. The honey was stored at RT in plastic jugs and was
highly crystallized. It was fairly dark when collected, and over the 10
years, became as dark as any I've ever seen. It also had a "chalky"
aroma and had lost quite a bit of the original floral bouquet. I melted
it out and used it with Wyeast 1056 followed with champagne yeast in the
2ndary. It finished quite nicely. The chalky taste was gone and the
color was like a slightly yellow chardonnay. I certainly wouldn't
hesitate to use a strong dark honey again.
Perhaps you can help me with another question. I just started a mead
with (wildflower) honey that was about half crystallized. It would
flow, and I didn't want to heat it, so I just mixed 14 lb to 5 gal,
tossed in some Campden and let it sit for 48 hours. The must was quite
cloudy, presumably from crystalline material that didn't dissolve. I
later heated some of the honey to melt it, and it became as clear as
honey usually is. I didn't try to dissovle any of the heated honey in
water, but I'm sure it would have made a clear solution. I thought the
crystallization was largely sucrose, so why didn't the crystalline
matter dissolve in the must? Has you ever seen this? Will it ever
dissolve or will the yeast enzymes get it? Will the finished mead
clear, or will I have the dreaded "Chewy mead"? Any ideas?
John
Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 1996 20:23:44 -0800
From: Lee Bollard <leeb at iea.com>
Subject: Brewing Software
- ------------7EA727B81C924
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Looking for recommendations for Windows brewing software. What works
well for you?
Requirements:
- - Calculates gravity, IBUs, alcohol, mash water volumes/temps
accurately.
- - Nice printouts.
- - Supported by developer (ie, up-to-date, 32-bit available or planned,
bugs get fixed, etc)
Looking at:
- - Brewer's calculator (good, real nice printouts, but written using
Borland Object Vision...non-standard Windows gui support...developer
has dropped it)
- - Sudsw (recipe separate from calculator... never understood this!..
looks like it's being supported and updated...)
- - Brewhaha (no calculator for gravities, ibu's etc)
- - Brewer's Workshop (maybe good... haven't played much... hasn't been
updated in over a year.. anyone been using this awhile??)
- - Brewer's Work Papers (32-bit!!... docs mention upcoming bug fixes, but
no update in over 6 months... anyone been using this one awhile?)
- - Homebrew Recipe Calculator HBRCP, by John Varady (haven't tried
yet...anyone been using this one awhile?)
- - Tinseth Excell spreadsheet
Suggestions?
I guess it would be nice if one of the brew mags reviewed ALL these
programs objectively... but that's probably too much to wish for :-)
Thanks to John Lock's Beer & Brewing Index for links to many of these
programs. (http://www.beerinfo.com/~jlock/vlib14.html#windows)
- --
- -------- Lee Bollard leeb at iea.com --------
- ------------7EA727B81C924
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Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii
<HTML><BODY>
<DT><TT>Looking for recommendations for Windows brewing software. What
works well for you?</TT></DT>
<DT><TT> </TT></DT>
<DT><TT>Requirements: </TT></DT>
<DT><TT>- Calculates gravity, IBUs, alcohol, mash water volumes/temps accurately. </TT></DT>
<DT><TT>- Nice printouts. </TT></DT>
<DT><TT>- Supported by developer (ie, up-to-date, 32-bit available or planned,
bugs get fixed, etc)</TT></DT>
<DT><TT> </TT></DT>
<DT><TT>Looking at: </TT></DT>
<DT><TT>- Brewer's calculator (good, real nice printouts, but written using
Borland Object Vision...non-standard Windows gui support...developer
has dropped it) </TT></DT>
<DT><TT>- Sudsw (recipe separate from calculator... never understood this!..
looks like it's being supported and updated...) </TT></DT>
<DT><TT>- Brewhaha (no calculator for gravities, ibu's etc) </TT></DT>
<DT><TT>- Brewer's Workshop (maybe good... haven't played much... hasn't
been updated in over a year.. anyone been using this awhile??) </TT></DT>
<DT><TT>- Brewer's Work Papers (32-bit!!... docs mention upcoming bug fixes,
but no update in over 6 months... anyone been using this one awhile?) </TT></DT>
<DT><TT>- Homebrew Recipe Calculator HBRCP, by John Varady (haven't tried
yet...anyone been using this one awhile?) </TT></DT>
<DT><TT>- Tinseth Excell spreadsheet </TT></DT>
<DT><TT> </TT></DT>
<DT><TT>Suggestions? </TT></DT>
<DT><TT>I guess it would be nice if one of the brew mags reviewed ALL these
programs objectively... but that's probably too much to wish for
:-) </TT></DT>
<DT><TT> </TT></DT>
<DT><TT>Thanks to John Lock's Beer & Brewing Index for links to many
of these programs. (http://www.beerinfo.com/~jlock/vlib14.html#windows)</TT></DT>
<DT><TT> </TT></DT>
<DT><TT>-- </TT></DT>
<DT><TT>-------- Lee Bollard leeb at iea.com --------</TT></DT>
<DT><TT> </TT></DT>
</BODY>
</HTML>
- ------------7EA727B81C924--
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Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 12:57:24 -0500
From: Rick Snide <Rick at RevolutionSoftware.com>
Subject: First-Time brewer
I have been interested in homebrewing for some time and recently got a =
book (xmas) on homebrewing entitled: Brewing the World's Great Beers - A =
step-by-step guide by Dave Miller. Does anyone have any comments on the =
quality of this book? Also, I would like to get started brewing a batch =
(my first!) on New-Year's Eve and need to purchase all the equipment and =
materials. There is a wine/beer making shop in town and I plan to =
purchase everything there. Here is the equipment Dave Miller =
recommends:
1. 5-gallon enamelware or stainless steel kettle with lid
2. Large stainless steel spoon
3. 6.5 to 10 gallon food grade plastic fermenting bucket with lid that =
takes an airlock
4. Racking tube 3/8" O.D. and 5 ft clear plastic tube 5/16 I.D.
5. 5 gallon glass carboy
6. 3-piece airlock and #6.5 drilled white rubber stopper
7. Carboy and bottle brushes
8. Bottle capper
9. Hydrometer and sample jar
10. Dial thermometer 32-212 F=20
11. Scale 0-4 oz or 0-8 oz with 1/4 oz divisions
12. Bottles
13. Fine-mesh nylon straining bag
14. Four 1-gallon jugs (glass)
If you were buying all of your equipment now, what would you add or =
subtract from this list. Are there some definite do's and don'ts in =
terms of sizes, types and brands?
Thanks in advance!
Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 1996 13:07:09 -0500
From: RitchRon at aol.com
Subject: Transition to All-Grain
I've been doing extract brewing for about 6 months now, with fair success.
I've been thinking about moving to all-grain brewing, but I've got several
limitations.
I live in a fairly small apartment with an electric stove. This presents the
usual sort of problems I've heard regarding using an electric stove for
brewing: the burners are too small for a big brew pot and temperature control
during mashing is exasperating at best. The size of the place precludes using
a gas burner indoors for safety reasons (unless it's safe to set it up next
to the fireplace, trusting the flue to provide adequate ventilation?). I do
have a small deck I could use for outdoor use, but that idea has problems;
it's very exposed to wind and airborne crud, it's unendurable during winter
cold spells and it's on the 3rd floor, presenting a possible hazard to
downstairs neighbors from boil over or sloppage. (I also don't know how my
neighbors would accept the smells....)
So: are there any electrical solutions (such as Bruheat, which I've heard
good things about) which don't take up too much space? Do any of these have
thermostatic controls (which work worth spit)? Alternatively, are there any
gas solutions which are safe to use indoors? Above all, perhaps: what's
likely to be the SIMPLEST way to make this transition?
Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 00:39:25 -0600 (CST)
From: Daniel Louis Lanicek <daniell at jove.acs.unt.edu>
Subject: Coffee Stout
I am considering brewing a coffee stout and I am wondering "How do I add
the coffee?" Do I add brewed coffee to the wort or dry-hop it with coffee
beans? I have no idea. What is the best method for adding coffee to my
stout?
- -------------------------------------------------------------------
Daniel Lanicek ------------------------ University of North Texas
"Beer is proof that God loves us."
- Benjamin Franklin
- -------------------------------------------------------------------
Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 07:45:23 -0600
From: "Debolt, Bruce" <bdebolt at dow.com>
Subject: re: dry hop in primary; extended time in primary
Just to reinforce some points made by Al Korzonas recently. I've been
using the dry hop in the primary method for three batches over the last
year with great results. Just wait until fermentation activity is slow
or stopped. At bottling put a sanitized nylon mesh bag over your
racking cane and it catches just about everything - pellets or whole
hops. No need to even attach it to the racking cane, it will tend to
collapse over it after going through the carboy neck.
I've also quit using a secondary as Al mentioned and really like this
labor saving and oxidation reducing method. I think for most brewers
this is simply overcoming a paradigm that you need to use a secondary
fermenter. I don't think it is necessary at all if you keep your
temperatures from getting too high and bottle in a reasonable period of
time. I only use glass fermenters, so keep that in mind. To date I've
bottled in 2-3 weeks with no off flavors, autolysis, or clarity
problems. Styles have been a Golden Ale (a bitter cream ale, dry
hopped), IPA, Alt, and Stout.
For many brewers a secondary is not a fermentation vessel at all, simply
a clearing vessel to drop out sediment, or a way to delay bottling with
less chance of autolysis. If your beer clears in the secondary, why
wouldn't it in the bottle? Since I switched to liquid yeast three years
ago I don't tend to get much sediment in my bottles regardless of
whether or not I use a secondary. The only clarity enhancer I use is
Irish Moss.
Bruce DeBolt
Houston, TX
bdebolt at dow.com
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Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 10:01:17 -0500
From: "Debolt, Bruce" <bdebolt at dow.com>
Subject: re: No-sparge data
re: Ken Schwartz's post, 26 Dec.
To answer Ken's question my system is a 10 gallon Gott with a simple
copper manifold. His Batch #1 used a 5 gallon Gott with copper
manifold, Batch #2 10 gallon Gott with Phil's False Bottom. The
hardware is very similar, but not identical.
When comparing efficiencies and amount of liquid left in the tun of
various no-sparge methods I think the final temperature of the mash is a
key variable. Keep in mind the mash-out step. I don't do a mash-out, I
don't think Ken does either. Ken's numbers and mine are pretty close on
efficiency and amount of liquid left in the tun (for his Batch 1).
This is pretty amazing considering all the technique and measurement
variables possible between us.
>From Ken's message
>The disheartening thing about this is that you lose 0.5+ qt/lb of wort. This
>is much higher than Dr. Fix's figure of 0.32 qt/lb in his experiment.
I don't know what Dr. Fix does, but if he performs a mash-out this is a
significant difference. At higher temperatures the mash liquid will be
less viscous, and I assume, less liquid would be left behind in the tun
after draining.
There are so many variables here I think the best thing to do is try it
and share the info, as Ken has. I plan to continue this practice for at
least a couple more batches and will share the data (and taste tests) as
they come in. If everything is positive I doubt I will want to sparge
again. The pale ale should be bottled within a week. By the way, this
is a primary-only fermentation, dry hopped in the primary, two week
total in glass.
Bruce DeBolt
Houston, TX
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Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 10:38:43 -0500
From: "Peter J. Calinski" <calinski at worf.calspan.com>
Subject: Hydrometer readings and air in the wort
I have been following the discussion involving hydrometer readings. I had
an interesting thing happen last week that raises the question "What effect
does the air in the wort have on the hydrometer reading?" I discovered last
week that it must have a significant effect.
This is what happened. When I wash my hydrometer and the measurement tube, I
typically take a reading with just water in the tube; just for practice and
to be sure the hydrometer is still calibrated. Last week, while doing this,
I got a reading of 0.992 which was quite unusual because I always got a
reading of 1.000. Great, was the Erie County (NY) water authority adding
vodka to the water supply? Well, a little study and deductive reasoning
made me conclude that there was suddenly a lot of dissolved air in the tap
water. I decided to boil the tap water and let it cool to 60F, then take
another reading. Sure enough, the reading was now 1.000. I concluded it
was the air in the tap water. Interestingly enough, the next day, the water
was back to normal. (I remember hearing that, during the warm months, the
water authority takes the water from the surface of Lake Erie because of the
weeds at the lower levels. In the winter they take the water from the lower
levels because the surface is freezing. Perhaps I just caught them the day
they changed.) I should mention that the tap water was supersaturated. When
it came from the tap, the water was cloudy. It took a few seconds to clear
before I took the readings. I am sure it was still supersaturated.
Anyway, this raises the question, what effect does dissolved air have on the
OG reading if the reading is taken after aeration and prior to pitching? I
normally siphon from the cooled brew pot to the fermenter with the brew pot
located as high as possible and the fermenter on the floor. I hold the end
of the siphon hose as high as possible. This gives me a "head" 2 or 3
inches deep on the wort in the fermenter. I add the water to top it off to
5 Gal. the same way. My experiment above indicates the OG reading could be
off by a considerable amount (0.008 for the water experiment) if taken after
I top it off. Ideas anybody?
Also, consider the readings taken during fermentation. The wort is
saturated (and perhaps supersaturated) with CO2. At bottling time, what is
the saturation level? I suppose if the level of dissolved air remained
constant from the OG reading to the FG reading, the difference of the two
readings would still give a reasonable estimate of alcohol content. But,
matching a recipe OG or FG could still be meaningless. Perhaps some
scientific magic counting the number of O2 and C atoms prior to fermentation
and CO2 after might show it is a wash but not being a Chem. type of guy, I
can't say.
Can someone shed some light on this?
Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 10:08:12 -0700 (MST)
From: Dionysus <dionysus at dionysus.aob.org>
Subject: Making Brewer's Best Kit Better
My parents, not realizing I switched to all-grain earlier this year, gave me
a "Brewers Best" Cream Ale Kit (from LD Carlson) for Xmas. Actually I think
it was a hint to brew something that Mom and Dad want to drink. I've gotten
hints from Dad before like "You know, I really like Genesee Cream Ale". But I
digress.
This kit includes: 3.3# John Bull Unhopped Light LME, 2# Light DME, Muntons
Dry Yeast, 1 oz. of a package labeled "bittering hops" pellets, 1/3 oz
package of Irish moss, 5 oz. priming sugar, and bottle caps. Actually for
extract brewers the kit is pretty complete. I though the fermentables were a
little on the weak side for 5 gallons, but plugging the ingredients into my
brewing software give an OG of 1.041, pretty much right in the middle of the
range for this style.
The hops are unmarrked as to variety or AA% so I plan on calling Carslon to
see if they can provide me any information. The instructions only call for
boiling only 15 minutes after hops addition (50 minutes total boil time) so
the bittnerness should be minimal, probably more flavor and aroma
contribution. But my setup doesn't handle pellets very well so I'd like to
substitute leaf hops. Any suggestions on what varieties/quantities may be
appropriate for the style or a Genny CA clone.
I'd like to try to improve the kit with a little specialty grain addition
(Crystal 40L perhaps?). Any suggestions are welcome.
Also since who knows when the dry yeast pack was last refridgerated, I plan
on tossing it and substituting a liquid yeast, but which one? Whcih of the
follwoing Wyeast would be appropriate?
1056 - American Ale, 1272 - American Ale II (fruitier), 2565 Kolsch, or some
other strain?
Any suggestions would be appreciated. TIA
Chuck
BernardCH at aol.com
Music City Brewers
Nashville, TN - Music City USA
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Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 10:20:27 -0700 (MST)
From: Dionysus <dionysus at dionysus.aob.org>
Subject: Assist me, quick, with dortmunder Chemistry!
Hi all,
This is my 20something brew, 3rd pilsner, 3 rd solo all-grain. I need some
chemistry help. Quickly! How do i get all these disolved solids in my brew
water, Given I still dont have results back on my city water supply
chemistry. this will be the mother of all crapshoots...
Target profile
ca+250
mg 25
na 70
cl 100
so4 280
hco3 550
Hardness 750.
My water is not all that hard I dont soften it, If anything its high in Ca+,
I always preboil it the night before...Any help would be much appreciated.
Other tips on 5 gal stove top double decoction mashing will also graciously
be appreciated.
Phil Wilcox
Poison Frog Home Brewery
Frog Eats Bass (Ale Clone) now fermenting...
Return to table of contents
Date: 30 Dec 1996 13:30:14 -0500
From: John Penn <john_penn at spacemail.jhuapl.edu>
Subject: No Dark Beers in Boston?
Subject: Time:2:12 PM
OFFICE MEMO No Dark Beers in Boston? Date:12/30/96
I hate it when I ask what dark beers do you have and the response is we have
brand X, which is not a dark beer! Spent this past weekend in Boston. In
Mama Marie's restaurant, when I asked for a dark beer they said Sam Adams so I
said OK and got a Sam Adams Boston Ale (not Lager). SAs Boston Lagers are
respectable and some of SAs specialty beers are very good but this was not
dark and not too good! Then later that night in the Bell-N-Hand bar I asked
for dark beer again and I thought they said Beck's Dark but I think they said
Pete's Winter Ale. What gives? Pete's Winter Ale is not dark, don't the
bars in Boston carry anything other than Sam Adams and a few other lighter
beers? My other peeve was attempting a brewery tour at the Commonwealth
brewery only to be turned away saying that they stopped giving public tours,
only private and they just hadn't gotten around to changing their ads yet.
I'm sure I just went to the wrong places but I came away very dissappointed in
Boston beerwise. Maybe you Boston beer saavy types can tell me where I should
have gone. Thanks.
John Penn
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Date: Mon, 30 Dec 96 10:36:51 PST
From: RHENDRY at MFOR01.FOR.GOV.BC.CA
Subject: Homebrew Digest V2 #11
To: HOMEBR5 --INTERNET homebrew at dionysus.
*** Reply to note of 12/18/96 21:03
Pleaseeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee, turn this off, I keep getting resubscibed!!
Russ Hendry, RPF
Planning Officer
Invermere Forest District
Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 14:44:07 -0700 (MST)
From: Ian Smith <rela!isrs at netcom.com>
Subject: Kegs, mini-kegs, Co2 cylinder
Waht is the best size CO2 cylinder ? 5#, 10# or 20# for someone who may
keg 5 to 10 gall per month ?
I brew 6.5 gallons of beer at a time. I have a 5 gallon cornelious (sp)
keg and was hoping to use a 5 litre min-keg (1.5 gallons) to make up 6.5
galls. I plan to put the 5 gallon keg in the basement and the 5 liter keg
in the refrigerator. That way when I draw a pint from the refrig. the keg
will be replenished from the main keg in the basement and have time to
cool before I drink my next brew. I was told that you cannot use
mini-kegs to force carbonate since they have a max pressure rating of
only 10 psi !!! Is this true and if so does anyone know of a stainless
steel vessel of about 1.5 gallons capacity that can take up to 30 psi
force carbonation pressure without exploding ?
Cheers
Ian Smith
isrs at rela.uucp.netcom.com
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Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 17:12:45 -0500
From: Jean-Sebastien Morisset <jsmoriss at qc.bell.ca>
Subject: Collecting sparge in a bucket -- safe from DMS?
It's winter up here in Canada, and damn cold to brew outside, but it's
still possible (dropping a metal box over cooker and kettle). I boil
ouside, and the rest of my system is indoors. What I've been doing so far
is collecting the sparged wort in my kettle through the kitchen door. This
means keeping the door open somewhat, and in these temperatures, I'd rather
avoid this. I've been thinking of collecting the wort in a bucket indoors,
and when finished, drain the buckets in my kettle. I could then keep the
door closed. :-) I don't "mash-out" since I use a Gott cooler to mash, so
I've been wondering about DMS levels. The wort will be sitting in a bucket
for about an hour while I sparge. Can anyone see a problem with this?
Anyone else here brew at -15C completely outdoors? I wouldn't mind
comparing notes on system design. :-)
later!
js.
- --
Jean-Sebastien Morisset, Sc. Unix Administrator
<mailto:jsmoriss at qc.bell.ca>
Bell Canada <http://www.bell.ca/>
Routing and Trunking Assignments, Montreal QC.
Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 21:21:56 EST
From: Ken G Smith <sparge at juno.com>
Subject: Counter-presure bottle fillers
Anyone with advice on Counterpresure fillers? I would like to buy one
soon, but have no experience with them and don't know a good one from
bad. Any help would be appreciated. Private e-mail ok.
Ken Smith
Britten & Smith Brewing
Where the B.S. stops at the label....
sparge at juno.com
Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 22:26:46 -0600
From: Marty Tippin <mtippin at swbell.net>
Subject: Need Info on Opening a Homebrew Shop
I've got this strange urge to open a homebrew supply store here in town -
seems to me like a good opportunity to fill a void in the community and do
something I've always wanted to do (own a small business)...
Problem is, I haven't the foggiest idea how much it costs to start a shop,
where to look for suppliers, how to go about procuring startup capital, what
kind of profits to expect, etc.
If any of you kind shop owners out there would care to offer some advice,
I'd be grateful... Reply by direct e-mail if you please...
- -Marty
Return to table of contents
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 1996 23:38:22 -0600 (CST)
From: Richard Gardner <rgardner at monarch.papillion.ne.us>
Subject: RE: Re-using Yeast
You wrote:
>I read in the HBD that some have had success with racking the cooled wort
>on top of sediment that remained in a freshly emptied primary fermenter.
>I use a glass carboy as my primary.
>If this is too risky, or a big mistake, if anyone can let me know, I
>would greatly appreciate it.
This will work, but . . . you can improve on your method by "washing"
the yeast (and cleaning the carboy while you are at it of the residue that
is around the neck). The washing process I'm referring to will take about a
day between transferring the first batch, and pitching the yeast for the
second batch. What washing does is to remove the trub and old wort that you
were not able to fully transfer to the secondary. Basically, sanitize two
mason jars and lids (or equivalent containers). Pour some of the remaining
slurry from the bottom of the carboy into the jar until it is about 1/2
full. Add sanitized water to fill and put the lid on (I actually usually
use my tap water, but it is relatively sanitary; if I had well water I'd
boil it). Shake well. When you see the heavy stuff fall out to the bottem
(1 hour or so), pour off the top material into the second jar (this gets rid
of most of the trub). If there is anything floating, get rid of it first.
Top off with water again and shake to mix. Let settle overnight. Pour off
the brown fluid (beer-wort) off of the top this time, and use the yeast
(chalky white stuff) that settles out on the bottom. (You can repeat this
step several times as desired of clear up even more.) So, first time you
leave the gunk on the bottom, second time you want the stuff off the bottom.
With only a day delay to pitching, you can expect a rather explosive
fermentation given the quantity of yeast you will be pitching.
This should improve your results on the second beer since the sediment
is left behind. The disadvantages I can think of are increased chance onf
contamination, and the yeast will be a bit dormant when you pitch it, but I
still see it start fermenting within 8 hours.
Also, somewhere out there (probably on the Brewery) there is a better
set of instructions for washing yeast, including acid washes to get rid of
bacteria, but I've had good success with the above simple method.
<<<The secret to life is to die young, but to delay it as long as possible!!!>>>
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End of HOMEBREW Digest #2297