HOMEBREW Digest #2455 Fri 04 July 1997

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		Digest Janitor: janitor@hbd.org
		Many thanks to the Observer & Eccentric Newspapers of 
		Livonia, Michigan for sponsoring the Homebrew Digest.
				URL: http://www.oeonline.com

  Black Beers/CM3-Gambrinus (Brad McMahon)
  An Even More Affordable Conical Fermenter (jared froedtert)
  re: Bottle of ice questions (Adam Dreyer)
  Botulism thread not dead (korz)
  Pediococcus damnosus dead/asleep? ("Kerr, David")
  K'Zoo Brewing Caginess/Iced Beer/Hanssens? (Ken Schramm)
  cream ale ("Charles R. Cates")
  Bell's Beers (Randy Ricchi)
  RE:  Japanese Beetles ("Keith Royster")
  Alcohol Bitterness, ("David R. Burley")
  Rosemary Pale Ale summary ("Ted Major")
  Japanese Beetle Attack Strategy (Ken Schramm)
  fermenter question & beer story ("Myers, John")
  1997 Colorado Brewer's Festival (John Adams)
  Old Wheat Yeast (Denis Barsalo)
  Aluminum Pot (LNUSTRUK.CZLSSB)
  Kahlua Beer,  Lemon Brew (haafbrau1)
  Weyermann malts ("Braam Greyling")
  Alcohol and sweetness/Gram scales (Kelly Jones)
  Tulsa Water, Mead Question (JeffHailey)
  Mead question (JeffHailey)
  Edwin Newman/William Safire wannabe ("Kerr, David")
  Isinglass worries (Andrew E Howard)
  Colorado microbrews// no more botulism (smurman)
  Re: Japanese Beetle Blues (guym)
  Gueuze Belgians (Greg.A.Kudlac)
  Re: kahlua beer (July 03, 1997) (Sean Mick)
  Corny keg Unitank? (Sean Mick)
  Pre-chiller tubing size ("Val J. Lipscomb")
  Canning Wort again ("Alan McKay")
  La Fin du Monde ... ("Alan McKay")

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---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 02 Jul 1997 16:39:05 +1100 From: Brad McMahon <brad at sa.apana.org.au> Subject: Black Beers/CM3-Gambrinus From: "Michael R. Frank" <mfrank at ag.Arizona.EDU> >1) Just what is a black beer anyway? I've been seeing and tasting an >increasing number of these lately, and whatever they are, I generally >like them. But when I look somewhere like the AHA style guidelines (or >HBD archives, Cat's Meow, etc) there is little or no information. There >are obviously differences between something like Xingu and Portland's >Haystack Black, but are these just american (or new-world) porters? Not knowing what those commercial brands are, you have a couple of choices. If it is an ale, they could be Scottish or English Old Ales if they are not porters or stouts. But I am guessing that these are lagers, in which case they would be modeled on German Schwarzbier. Some brand names include Mather's Black Beer, Suntory Black Beer, Starobrno and Kloster Schwarzbier. Schwarzbiers have a lot of roasted malt in them and are moderately bitter (IBU 20-35) and low in sweetness. Should have a bitter-chocolate taste to it. Around OG 1.040-1.050 is fine, and alcohol is standard beer range (3.5%-5%). As for a recipe you could hack one together fairly easily. Some darker malts with lots of roasted malt, combined with German hops and German lager yeast should do the trick. >2) What is the difference between the Cat's Meow and Gambrinus' Mug >recipie collections at The Brewery website >(http://alpha.rollanet.org/)? >Do any of you find one set or the other more reliable? (some of the >directions are a bit weird at times). Is either set proctored in some >way, or are they just historical artifacts? I find the Mug easier to read as you can differentiate between extract and all-grain recipes easier. (Although converting all-grain to extract is easy). As far as I'm aware, the Cat's Meow is much more static with very few changes made. But it has hundreds more recipes. As for reliability, I can't say. Some recipes look to be very sensible and others just shouldn't be there. I don't know about anyone else, but I am not going to waste my time and money on a recipe that is basically an experiment. There are a few recipes in both databases that contain phrases like ".. next time I'll add more/less ..." "I expect this brew to ...". I don't think incomplete recipes should be published at all, but they are there, and I'd avoid them if I were you. - -- Brad McMahon "I don't hate anyone, at least ph. 0411 501 518 not for more than 48 minutes, brad at sa.apana.org.au barring overtime." C. Barkley Email me for PGP public key. Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 02 Jul 1997 11:52:04 -0400 From: jared froedtert <froedter at pilot.msu.edu> Subject: An Even More Affordable Conical Fermenter Greetings Fellow Brewers, Before sharing my experiences i must thank all of the folks out there in computer land who put this together, and to ya'll for kepping it going; this forum has got to be the best thing around as far as applying and gathering information on. Lets keep up the good work. Now...... I saw the message posted about the 'Affordable Conical Fermenter' yesterday and figured i'd post some info on my 'Even More Affordable Conical Fermenter'. I found at a garage sale this spring someone selling a couple of old items which were used in Dairy processing. This family had for sale a 10 gal. conical fermenter, real porpose i don't know since i'm not hip to the Dairy processing. It's made out of stainless steel, not the best grade since there was some corosion, but easily removed with green scrubby-pad and elbow grease. It has three slim glass windows on the side, which are removable for cleaning, so you can view the contents inside; very cool for brewing purposes. It has a brass ball valve at the to drain the vessel's contents. And it has a lid which was very rusty, must not have been made from stainless, which i will probably won't use; i'll have to make one to fit. There is also a half torn sticker still atttached with the name of the manufacture "Elgin - Dairy Processing". So if you can find anybody selling old Dairy equipment, i highly recommend you check it out. This was a very excellent find, and i only paid 15 bucks, which i had to haggle to get it down from 25. So if you can find anybody selling old Dairy equipment, i highly recommend you check it out. Which leads me to something else I found out which has to do with something alongs these lines. I vistited the Lansing Brewing Co. for a couple of hours a couple of months back and ended up helping them bottle some of their brew. They still do it like we do, a bench capper and sanitized caps. Anyway, their brewing set up there was a totally retro-fitted Dairy system which the brewer customized for his uses. It's made from all high grade Stainless Steel and cost him only a fraction of the cost of a commercial brewing setup. It's very cool. Since all Micro-Brewing is just creating your product in large vessels and vasts, he found a cheaper alternative to the norm, nad fit it to his needs. So just remember you don't need to spend lots'o $$$ to make good beer, wether you're at home or in industry. You just need to know what to do and how effeciently it needs to get done, and then be a little creative and make it up as you go along, that's the art of it all; a little luck helps. BTW, Lansing Brewing Co.'s Amber Cream Ale is very, very, very good. Hopes this helps someone. C-ya......... Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 2 Jul 1997 13:42:20 -0400 (EDT) From: Adam Dreyer <adreyer at matrox.com> Subject: re: Bottle of ice questions In regards to Ken Koupal's question about his frozen beer: The beer turning ice is a simple chemistry problem that I have contemplated on several weekend nights in college when the beer was left in the freezer for a little too long. The freezing (and boiling) point of a liquid is a function of pressure. Simply put, if liquid is at a higher pressure than 1 atmosphere, it will freeze at a lower temperature than it would under ambient pressure (1 atm). This is also true for the reverse. If the pressure is less than 1 atm, the freezing (and boiling) temperature of a liquid are increased and decreased respectively. I recall an illustration of this in a college chemistry class. Water was put in a vacuum chamber a brought to a specific temperature-pressure combination that results in the "triple point" where water freezes, boils and condenses at the same time. You can apply this to your beer now. The beer was at a higher pressure that 1 atmosphere so its freezing temperature is lower that at ambient pressure. The temperature of the beer was lower that the freezing temperature at ambient pressure. So, when you open the beer, the pressure when to 1 atm, the water in the beer froze and the alcohol did not. Also, the CO2 originally in solution now is forced out causing your beer to foam and spray out. Now, the liquid could be collected sure. You actually are making ice beer since it is now of higher alcohol content. However, the result will be very flat since most of the CO2 will have escaped. This is actually a method for making apple-jack if I am not mistaken. The fermented cider is frozen and decanted several times to increase its potency. So, you would probably end up with a higher alcohol, flat beer. But that may still be worth the effort. Anyway, I hope this answers you question even if I did go off on a tangent. Cheers, Adam Dreyer Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 2 Jul 1997 13:17:21 -0500 (CDT) From: korz at xnet.com Subject: Botulism thread not dead In light of the fact that there are still people posting that it's okay to "can" wort without pressure cooking, it seems that the numerous warnings have fallen on deaf ears. I've researched this in great depth talking via email to numerous people in food science, brewing, microbiology, and toxicology and I'll summarize what I've learned: IT IS UNSAFE TO STORE CANNED STARTER WORT FOR ANY LENGTH OF TIME UNLESS YOU *PRESSURE COOK* IT TO KILL THE SPORES OF THE BACTERIA THAT CAUSES BOTULISM! YOU CANNOT TELL FROM SMELL, APPEARANCE, OR TASTE IF THE STARTER IS SAFE! DAVE MILLER'S AND CHARLIE PAPAZIAN'S BOOKS ARE WRONG ON THIS TOPIC! Sorry for shouting, but there are still those who think that because they haven't died yet, they are doing something safe. They are not. Also, canning jars are made to handle a vacuum. Regular glass jugs and bottles are *not*. You should *never* seal a container filled with hot liquid unless it is specifically made to hold a vacuum. Implosion risk is the issue here. NOW, the botulism thread should be dead (for 6 months). Al. Al Korzonas, Palos Hills, IL korz at xnet.com Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 2 Jul 1997 14:36:33 -0400 From: "Kerr, David" <David.Kerr at ummc.ummed.edu> Subject: Pediococcus damnosus dead/asleep? My pLambic has been in the secondary for about 6 weeks now. The B. Lambicus seems to have really taken root - nice, funky nose -, but the P. Damnosus (doesn't that sound so much cooler than P. Cerevisae?) hasn't done its part. The Pedio. was pitched upon racking to the secondary, SG was about 1.014 (I'll mash the next one at 156F+), and the B.Lambicus about 5 days later. I hate to resort to adding lactic acid to sour the brew out, and am willing to be patient. Do you all think that adding a second, more vigorous Pedio. starter will do any good at this point? Can the new Pedio. culture thrive on the residual Dextrines in my beer? TIA- Dave Kerr "And if I swallow something evil Would you stick your finger down my throat?" - Pete Townshend Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 02 Jul 1997 16:44:30 -0400 From: Ken Schramm <SchramK at wcresa.k12.mi.us> Subject: K'Zoo Brewing Caginess/Iced Beer/Hanssens? While the "cat and mouse" game (this land is made of trousers...this land is made of mousers, and pussy cats to eat them when the sun goes down.... Firesign Theater) may have been fun, I haven't ever run into problems dealing with the folks there. I just tell them "I am a homebrewer and..." and the rest of the conversation has perenially turned very neighborly and jovial. Perhaps a better approach is to meet Larry Bell at one of the many conferences he loves to attend (and in the state of joviality he can occassionally be found in), and see if you can loose his lips. He was VERY forthcomiong with details about his "Two Hearted Ale" when he spoke at the Traverse Brewing Academy conference in 1996. And he was more than happy to discuss just about any subject when he showed up in New Orleans last year. ATTENTION AHA Personnel: Anyone know if Larry will be in Cleveland? And what he might be bringing? I will be bringing smoked turkey, lots of mead, and will be looking fo fly fishing afficianados and fruit growing answer people. As Far As the frozen beer question, The beer was in a "super cooled" state. The beer is below its freezing point at standard T & P, but the C02 pressure keeps it liquid. The solubility of the gas in the VERY cold beer is higher than in warm beer. When you open the bottle, the CO2 rushes out (There's going to be a pressure drop...Jimmy Cliff), the beer chills even further (the CO2 escape is exothermic) and the water in the beer freezes immediately, zipping through the 32 degree state change barrier in a matter of milliseconds. This will work with pop, too. The Alcohol, having a much lower freezing point, goes blasting out with the gas in the gush, although that doesn't always happen; sometimes the beer just freezes into a slush of frozen water and liquid alcohol. The rush of gas takes all of the gas soluble esters and aroma compounds with it. If you kept the H20, you'd have to collect a lot of it to be worthwhile. Al K: What Hanssens? I want a case. Schramm Systems out of balance fail. Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 02 Jul 1997 17:08:48 -0500 From: "Charles R. Cates" <CCATES at sfasu.edu> Subject: cream ale Is anyone familiar with "Jenny Cream ale"(I think the brewery is Jenny Brewering Co.;NY)I really like it, and would like to approach the taste.On the bottle it says we use a special two level fermenting process to get a brew with the flavor of an ale with the smoothness of a lager.Is anyone familiar with this two level fermentation process,or have any idea how it is accomplished. thanks Charlie Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 02 Jul 1997 22:32:56 -0400 From: Randy Ricchi <rricchi at ccisd.k12.mi.us> Subject: Bell's Beers Eric Fouch asked about Bell's Amber Ale formulation. Good question about a good beer, but what I'd like to know is what kind of hops do they use to get the INTENSE grapefruit character in their pale ale. Oh, sure, I've heard Cascade and Centennial described as grapefruity, even Chinook has been described that way, but I've used all those hops before and they are nothing like the character of Bell's Pale Ale. That is one righteous American pale ale. Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 3 Jul 1997 03:43:08 +0500 From: "Keith Royster" <keith at ays.net> Subject: RE: Japanese Beetles I think I remember hearing somewhere that japanese beetles are repelled by the smell of other dead japanese beetles, specifically if they are crushed. I know this sounds sadistic, but I've heard of people catching a bunch of them (using a trap?) and then putting them in a blender with water and spraying the resultant slurry back on the hop plants. I imagine you would want to use an old/cheap/dedicated blender for this! Ugh! Keith Royster - keith at ays.net <<< *NEW* address! at your.service - http://www.ays.net Web Services - Design & Hosting starts at $60/yr! Voice & Fax - (704) 662-9125 Mooresville/Charlotte, NC Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 3 Jul 1997 07:16:09 -0400 From: "David R. Burley" <Dave_Burley at compuserve.com> Subject: Alcohol Bitterness, Brewsters: AlK says: >Ahh, but alcohol is bitter and in high-alcohol beers some of the bitterness >comes from hops and some from the alcohol... doesn't it? = I always thought alcohol contributed a sweetness to beer as it does in wine, if anything, and can not remember a reference to it giving a bitter= response. Is there something I missed? Is this a front of the mouth (bitter1) or roof of the mouth (bitter2) response? Is there some kind o= f interaction with the hops? - --------------------------------------------- I doubt that HBD readers are any more annoyed than I am about the inserti= on of miscellaneous "=3D" signs, truncation, etc. in my contributions. I on= ly know that it is a PIA for everyone. I have tried many things, as has Pat= Babcock ( including, as time permitted, a repair of the damaged files by= hand) , to cure it, but to no avail. Finally Compuserve ( after several= questionings by me) has come across with accepting the blame. They claim that it is due to an upgrade of their MIME format and "older" MIME versio= ns respond by misinterpreting, truncating and insertion of odd signs. They offer their apologies and assure me that they are making an effort to sol= ve this problem in the near future. Don't hold your breath. They also took= a year to allow users to use a name instead a series of numbers in addresse= s and that was *after* they announced the availability of the function! S= o in the meantime, please accept my apology, as I have too many years (decades) invested in files, supporting software, etc. on Compuserve to= change now. - -------------------------------------------- Happy Independence Day! to all you Yanquis. Back on Tuesday. - -------------------------------------------- Keep on brewin' Dave Burley Kinnelon, NJ 07405 103164.3202 at compuserve.com Dave_Burley at compuserve.com = Voice e-mail OK = Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 3 Jul 1997 08:52:46 -0400 From: "Ted Major"<tmajor at exrhub.exr.com> Subject: Rosemary Pale Ale summary Thanks to all who responded to my queries about brewing a rosemary pale ale. I got several suggestions to make a rosemary tea to add at bottling/kegging time and thus carefully control the rosemary flavor, as well as responses from brewers who had add rosemary at the end of the boil with other spices. I also got a respone that suggested making and serving a Flemish stew with the beer when it was finished, which seems like an excellent idea. Here's what I ended up with: 9 lbs Briess pale malt .5 lb cara-pils .25 lb 120L crystal .25 lb wheat malt Mash at 154F for 60 mins, mash out at 168F for 10 mins, and sparge. I used 1 oz of whole Cascade (5.8%aa) for 60 mins and .5 oz whole Cascade for 30 min. I added 2 oz of fresh, destemmed rosemary for the last minute of the boil, chilled, aerated, and pitched 2 packages of rehydrated Whitbread ale yeast. OG was 1.054 At racking last weekend, there was a strong rosemary aroma & flavor with just a bit of Cascade flavor in the background. SG was 1.012 I plan to bottle after 2 weeks in secondary. Thanks to all for the advice, and also thanks to Ken Schwartz's BreWater, which allowed me to easily adjust the soft Athens tap water to approximate Mosher's ideal pale ale water profile. Ted Major Athens, Georgia Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 03 Jul 1997 09:07:03 -0400 From: Ken Schramm <SchramK at wcresa.k12.mi.us> Subject: Japanese Beetle Attack Strategy Some of the local gardening stores in the Detroit area sell a roughly 25% solution of Diazinon for use on food and other garden plants. Specifically, Franks sells a relabeled version as a house brand, ,but you can probably find the Manufacturers label at less franchise type outlets. I like the Bonide line (no compensation or relation there, just my humble opinion). It is especially helpful for use on fruit and garden crops because Diazinon is very effective against the Japanese Beetle and its larvae, and because it is not particularly persistent, and can be used closer to harvest than other more persistent chemicals. Spraying at dusk or slightly thereafter is the most effective since that is when the JB's are most active. Another more environmentally sensitive approach is beneficial nematodes, which destroy the larvae through parasitic predation. They are (much) more expensive, and won't prevent transitory damage from roaming beetles, but JB's don't have much of a range. The nematodes are sprayed onto your lawn as a liquid and need to be applied very thoroughly. This approach keeps the mite issue a non-issue. Schramm Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 3 Jul 1997 09:39:18 -0400 From: "Myers, John" <JMyers at polkaudio.com> Subject: fermenter question & beer story Howdy folks. I've been following the thread on the Affordable Conical Fermenter. I have seen things like this in plastics distributor's catalogues, and always wondered if they were appropriate for home brewing. I'd like to compare. Anybody got a web page or email address for ACF? TIA. Now I have a beer story with a mystery attached. Not Interested? Please page down! :^) Several weeks ago my wife and I participated in Sisson's Brew To Brew 5 Mile Road Race in Baltimore MD. Race day conditions were what we call a Red Flag Day: Temperature was One Million and Two (degrees F) plus 100% humidity. When I finished the race, I made my way to the free(!!!) beer vendors. Nothing but local microbrews served. Each vendor had a keg or two connected to a cold plate. He/she would fill pitchers from the tap while pouring cups of beer from full pitchers. The cups were plastic with the day's event ink stenciled on the outside, and cups were stacked upside down on the table. I got my cup of beer, said "Thanks" and turned away. Raised said cup toward my lips, and POW!!! My mouth and nose were covered with beer and it felt like a bug had bit or stung me on my lips. First I thought somebody had shot me with a rubber band, but looking around, nobody was pointing at me and laughing (I always check) or looking particularly mischievous. I resolved that I was simply crazy from the heat, and proceeded to down my beer. Got another, and POW!!!, right in the kisser again. Yeah, I know, some folks brew an electrifying product right? By this time, my wife had finished the race. She grabbed some water, and I grabbed another beer. POW!!! I told her my story, and she gave me a look of disgust mixed with pity. "You've had your head under the keg too long again!" she said. Then we noticed a group of folks gathered in a circle, laughing and pointing at each other. A hush fell as one of the men carefully brought a cup of beer toward his pooched-out lips. I swear I'm not making this up. When the cup was about an inch from his mouth, the beer leapt OUT of the cup, splashed his face, and everybody had a good yuk. My wife and I looked at each other, and she said, "OK, but I stand by my words." Sheesh! Here's my theories: * From my physical exertion, I sweated a lot of electrolytes out and changed my personal polarity, so that when I got a beer, there was an electrical potential between brew and quaffer. The plastic cup served as a dielectric between us. Therefore my capacity for quaffing was challenged by the capacitance of the cup of brew. * The cups were the culprit, not the dielectric: When pulled from the stack, a static charge was built on the plastic cup. So how come it didn't discharge as soon as I touched it? * The hot, humid conditions coupled with my elevated core temperature formed a highly localized "Devil's Triangle" effect. Thank gawd there wasn't a flight of WWII bombers nearby. So, scientists, chemists, electrical engineers and conspiracy theorists. What do you think happened? PS: Some of you may be thinking "How can you run five miles in heat and humidity and then gulp down beer?". Practice, practice, practice... cheers, j ***************************************************************** * John Myers Polk Audio Inc. * * Mechanical and Industrial Design Manager Baltimore, MD * * jmyers at polkaudio.com "The Speaker Specialists" * ***************************************************************** Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 3 Jul 1997 08:42:23 -0600 From: John Adams <jadams at pipeline.cnd.hp.com> Subject: 1997 Colorado Brewer's Festival 1997 Colorado Brewer's Festival The Colorado Brewer's Festival was held Saturday and Sunday June 28/29 and still the best local beer festival in the state. All participating were having a great time enjoying the live music, eating good foods, taking in a cigar (new this year), and drinking the fantastic suds. This festival is held in the colorful Olde Town section of Fort Collins without and access control. Anybody and their dog is welcome to listen to the music and enjoy the food (drinking beer requires a wristband). This open atmosphere and colorful location makes the festival a success (and the beer lines long). _________________________________________________________________ Cheyenne Mountain Brewing Co. 1858 Gold Camp Amber Lager (3 of out 4) A very silky and clean beer. Smooth and extremely drinkable. Listening to "The Blues Revival" playing "Having a Good Time", with this beer in hand I was having a good time! Brouwer Brewery Brouwer Golden Pilsner (3) Slightly bitter and lightly hopped. Not as highly hopped as an Pilsener Urquel and a tad too malty. Very clean and slightly sweet finish. Redfish New Orleans Brewhouse Stonewall's Uptown Ale (2.5) Listed as a trappist-style. Slightly phenolic and astringent hop bite up front. A slight hop taste in the finish and slightly sweet. A good attempt at a style very few brew. BJ's Pizza, Grill, & Brewery Jeremiah Red (2.5) Very drinkable and clean. Hop and mild malt. Very pleasant and very drinkable. Dam Brewing Company Brew Brothers Extra Pale Ale (2.5) A middle of the road drink. Refreshing and clean but nothing special. Hoppy and slightly malty and very drinkable. New Belgium Brewing Saison (3.5 / Best of Show) Nice spicy character and a tad spicier than a Wit but not too much. Very clean, no hops and slightly malty. Ginger is apparent and very nice. New Belgium has once again produced a very nice beer and was easily the best beer I tried at the festival. Steamworks Brewing Company Lizard Head Red (3) A very pleasant ale not too hoppy or malty and finishes very clean. Extremely drinkable. Takes a little adjustment after just sampling the spicy Saison but very nice. A good everyday brew. Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 3 Jul 1997 10:51:29 -0500 From: Denis Barsalo <denisb at CAM.ORG> Subject: Old Wheat Yeast Hey gang, I usually hate asking these questions, but I guess I just need someone to say: "Sure... go ahead and use it!". I made a starter using a combination of a) A two year old Wyeast 3056 smack pack that swelled and b) Dregs from a Yeast Lab W51 beer I made last summer. The starter fermented but didn't create much of a krauzen. Actually, none! It just showed small club soda like bubbles on the surface. Now, there's well over an inch and a half of yeast and trub on the bottom of the gallon jug that I plan to pitch to a wheat beer recipe. I tasted the wort that's on top and it has an orange juice like flavor that is not really unpleasant. (I usually find most starters taste funny beacause of the lack of hops.) What do you think. Is this starter going to ruin my batch? Is this orange juice like flavor a sign of bacterial infection that is not wanted in a wheat beer? I plan to brew saturday early morning. E-mail me with your comments please. Denis Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 3 Jul 1997 11:11:15 -0400 From: LNUSTRUK.CZLSSB at gmeds.com Subject: Aluminum Pot 1). Aside from reacting with some cleaning products, is there any good reason why I should avoid a Aluminum brewpot? I located a comercial grade 24qt pot at Gordon Food Service, a resaurant supply store for about $70. I'd welcome any input. Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 03 Jul 1997 09:05:06 EDT From: haafbrau1 at juno.com Subject: Kahlua Beer, Lemon Brew As far as Kahlua Beer, I just add a shot to a mug of beer, usually an amber or dark. This is probably just psychological. I think it tastes great as a change of pace and my br-in-law agrees. YMMV. I can't wait for the post on this lemonade recipe. Around here in So. Jersey, we have something similar called One Eyed Jack. It's described as a lemon brew. Very tasty, without a tacky after-taste. Tastes very much like lemonade. That's my 2 cents for now. Don't worry, be Hoppy Paul Haaf haafbrau1 at juno.com Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 3 Jul 1997 17:18:31 +200 From: "Braam Greyling" <braam.greyling at azona.co.za> Subject: Weyermann malts Hi all, I have a couple of varieties of Weyermann malts: Pilsner Vienna Munich Caramunch2 Wheat Wheat (dark) Smoked malt. I would like some suggestions on mashing schedules for these malts. Also, if you have used some of these malts, please let me know what flavors carried through and what is the good and bad points. I havent brewed with it yet and want to make sure I accentuate the right properties of these malts. Any info is welcome Thanks very much. Braam Greyling I.C. Design Engineer Azona(Pty)Ltd tel +27 12 6641910 fax +27 12 6641393 You can taste a good beer with one sip, but it is better to make thoroughly sure. Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 03 Jul 1997 09:30:16 -0700 From: Kelly Jones <kejones at ptdcs2.intel.com> Subject: Alcohol and sweetness/Gram scales AlK writes: > Ahh, but alcohol is bitter and in high-alcohol beers some of the bitterness > comes from hops and some from the alcohol Alcohol contributes sweetness, not bitterness... Try comparing a glass of (pure) water to a glass with a few percent alcohol. - -------------------------- I was in a woodworker's shop the other day (Woodcraft Supply, many major cities have one) when I noticed a small scale, used to measure gram quantities of wood stains/dyes. It was very simple, having a clip at one end from which to hang the sample to be weighed, and a pointer at the other end to indicate the weight. It was calibrated in 1-gram increments up to 20 grams, and had a total capacity of 100g. The best part was the price: $3.50. I picked one up, the accuracy is surely sufficient for homebrewing/winemaking purposes, and will be useful for weighing out smaller quantities than my hop scale (calibrated in half-ounces) permits. Kelly Hillsboro, OR Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 3 Jul 1997 12:51:29 -0400 (EDT) From: JeffHailey at aol.com Subject: Tulsa Water, Mead Question I got the water analysis for the two plants that supply Tulsa. I posted a summary on my web sight. http://members.aol.com/JeffHailey Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 3 Jul 1997 12:54:19 -0400 (EDT) From: JeffHailey at aol.com Subject: Mead question Oops.. sent that one too soon! Now, I brewed my first mead last week. Gravity went from 1058 OG down to 0995 FG in 5 days. One thing is wrong, however. This stuff is SOUR!!!! It tastes like an infection, but I'm not sure. At this point, it is absolutely undrinkable. Should I throw it out or does it need to age? Thanks! Jeff Hailey Brewing in Tulsa, OK http://members.aol.com/JeffHailey Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 3 Jul 1997 13:18:00 -0400 From: "Kerr, David" <David.Kerr at ummc.ummed.edu> Subject: Edwin Newman/William Safire wannabe korz wrote: >There's two "b's" in Dubbel, but only one "p" in Tripel. Sorry... pet peave. I believe that it's spelled "peeve". Sorry - one nit-pick deserves another. Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 03 Jul 1997 11:19:07 EDT From: aehoward at juno.com (Andrew E Howard) Subject: Isinglass worries I decided to try using isinglass for the first time. I stirred 1 tsp. in about 1/3 cup of boiled, cooled water. It didn't dissolve, like the instructions said, but I figured that was okay. I poured it into the secondary of my current batch. Now, two days later, many of the flakes are just floating on the top of the beer. Is this normal? Should I be concerned? Thanks! Andrew Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 03 Jul 1997 10:49:29 -0700 From: smurman at best.com Subject: Colorado microbrews// no more botulism Just got back from a paid vacation to Aspen/Snowmass. Your tax dollars at work;) I tried some of the local micros, and even living in California, Colorado may be getting hit by the microbrew trend even harder than we are here. I tried the two offerings available from the New Belgium brewery (www.newbelgium.com); the legendary Fat Tire Ale, and the Sunshine Wheat. The Fat Tire is definately unique for an American produced amber ale, but to tell the truth, I wasn't that crazy about it. I would prefer either of the styles it's in-between, a Belgian ale or an American amber, to the combination. The Sunshine Wheat is a Belgian wheat beer style, and I thought it was a good beer, but maybe not great. I did like the way the citrus tastes were very subdued, but still evident. A tough trick to manage. I had the Tabernash pilsener, which I thought was very good. I don't know anything about the beer, and I'm not a great pilsener fan, but I would order this one again. My favorite was the Red Lady Ale from the Crested Butte Brewery. This was a smooth amber ale of a style that I never seem to grow tired of when done well. I also stopped at the Flying Dog Brewpub in Aspen. I had their Amber (which they visibly note won something at the GABF), which was "eh", and the stout, which tasted like a homebrew stout. Neither of the beers really did much for me. // I wrote: Every account I've read states that botulism is colorless, odorless, and tasteless. It is also doubtful that botulism sporolation could produce enough CO2 to raise a steel canning lid. George responded: Imagine, an organism with no metabolic wastes! Fascinating! Actually, as I wrote here a few months ago, according to Bergey's Manual (a microbiology reference book) Clostridium (the bacteria responsible for the production of Botulism toxin) CAN produce all sorts of fermentation by-products. Some of them are hydrogen sulfide and ammonia. These are pretty damn smelly. My guess is that the danger lies within a can in which the Clostridium have just begun to grow. There may be some toxin present, but there *may* not be enough other fermentation products around for your nose to detect. Just a guess. Botulism produces CO2, ammonia, and probably many other compounds, but as you note, the problem is that it does not have a chance to produce macroscopically noticable amounts. It is difficult for botulism to sporolate in the first place, and especially in a relatively acid environment, hence *IF* any toxin is produced it is a very small amount. The reaction also lowers the pH of the medium so that the sporolation by-products actually halt it's own reproduction. So the real problem is that the toxin is so lethal that extremely small amounts can cause a problem, while the by-products will still remain unnoticed. I continue: The effects Dave [Miller] is describing are associated with bacteria spoilage; a much different beast from botulism George retorts: Actually, Botulism IS caused by bacterial spoilage; the beast is the same! Now back to brewing... What I was referring to in my post was the macroscopic effects of the two, i.e. the difference between theory in a book and practice in the kitchen. Traditional bacteria spoilage is unmistakable in long-term storage, while botulism is usually not detected until the symptoms are present in whoever ingests it (i.e. it's colorless, etc.). Spoilage also causes a problem for botulism production because it can raise the pH of the medium leading to an environment more conducive to sporolation. As I said a long time ago, I'm not trying to convince anyone that it is necessary to pressure can, or anything else. I simply think everyone should educate themselves and then make up their own minds on the issue because it *is* still in contention, and it is potentially lethal. Obviously, those on the HBD who felt it was important to understand the issue have read up on the subject, and that's all I was after, so I'll try to shut-up. (Strange, we've discussed this issue for months, yet some folks think two paragraphs by Dave Miller completely clears up the problem. <shrug>.) SM Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 03 Jul 97 12:32:15 MDT From: guym at Exabyte.COM Subject: Re: Japanese Beetle Blues Richard King writes: >Date: 1 Jul 1997 16:58:45 EST >From: <RKING at VUNET.VINU.EDU> >Subject: Japanese Beetle Blues > >Lee: I know what you are going through. The little creeps are >busy destroying my beautiful vegetable garden and my remaining >hop plant. I blasted the buggers today with SEVIN, but I don't >know what else to do. I am usually an organic gardener, but I >haven't found anything else that works (Sabadilla is my main >organic spray, but it doesn't seem to do much against them). I've >heard of something called Malathian, which is not organic, that >is supposed to work, but I haven't succombed yet. Richard and Lee, I, too, am an organic gardener and, while I don't have hop plants (yet), I *do* have Japanese beetles. They love to munch on our Crepe Myrtles, River Birches, and some kind of flowering behemoth that grows at one end of my house. What's more, their grubs can destroy a lawn by gnawing on the roots of the grass. I have been using a product called "Neem Away" (from "Gardens Alive!") which is an extract from the Neem tree. It repels the beetles from plants, disrupts their desire to feed (so they starve) and, more importantly (to me) disrupts their molting and breeding cycles (fewer grubs). Additionally, I use traps (plastic ones - I got tired of the bags) to catch the adults and nematodes to kill the grubs. It is indeed very important to keep the traps away from plants that the beetles like or it will simply lure them to the plant. I have mine next to a Colorado Blue Spruce, which the beetles do not like (I believe that they will not bother any evergreen). This three-pronged approach has significantly lowered the number of beetles I am seeing this year and I am confident that they will continue to decline. All of the above products I obtained from "Gardens Alive!" but I have seen Neem at other organic gardening locations. I hope this helps anyone fighting these little imports! Guy McConnell /// Huntersville, NC /// guym at exabyte.com /// CoralReefer at compuserve.com /// "And the beer I had for breakfast wasn't bad, so I had one for dessert..." Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 3 Jul 1997 14:43:00 -0500 From: Greg.A.Kudlac at mcdermott.com Subject: Gueuze Belgians Greetings Collective! My father is a BIG fan of this style. I live in NE Ohio and was wondering if anyone out there knows where I can find some of the imported brands (or if any of them are imported?). Thanks in advance for your help! Greg Beer -- it does a body better. greg.a.kudlac at mcdermott.com Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 3 Jul 1997 12:24:20 -0700 (PDT) From: homebrew at dcn.davis.ca.us (Sean Mick) Subject: Re: kahlua beer (July 03, 1997) Someone asked: > how do I make kahlua beer? Adding coffee certainly works, especially if you are bottling the beer. Here is another approach if you are KEGGING the beer, used by one of my customers to great success: Add Sorbistat K (potassium sorbate sold in most homebrew shops) after fermentation is finished to prevent new fermentation from starting, then add Kahlua (or any liqueur for that matter) to taste, then keg & force carbonate. Not quite sure exactly how much Kahlua to add, but I know the results can be very smooth and tasty!! Sean Mick Mick's Homebrew Supplies http://www.dcn.davis.ca.us/~homebrew Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 3 Jul 1997 12:44:06 -0700 (PDT) From: homebrew at dcn.davis.ca.us (Sean Mick) Subject: Corny keg Unitank? Hello, Has anyone out there had any success with building a unitank out of corny keg similar to the one that is advertised in BT (The "Conicorn"?) That guy charges $550 or so, which I can't currently afford, and I'd like to use a 5 gallon keg anyway (He uses a 10). I simply want to weld a cone and maybe a 1 gallon cylindrical extension to the bottom. I plan to have it welded professionally, but I am wondering if anyone out there has tried such a device and can comment on their effectiveness for yeast/trub removal, "capping," etc. Also, is there a good, low cost source for a pressure relief valve that can be set for 0-30 psi and hook to the quick disconnect gas port? Private email OK, I can post results if there is interest. Thanks all, Sean Mick Mick's Homebrew Supplies http://www.dcn.davis.ca.us/~homebrew Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 3 Jul 1997 17:38:14 -0500 (CDT) From: "Val J. Lipscomb" <valjay at NetXpress.com> Subject: Pre-chiller tubing size Help, I need a techno-brewer!! I have finally given up on the idea of pumping ice water thru my homemade CF chiller. I can't find a pump that can,*affordably*,hold up to the back pressure. BTW,thanks to Ken Schwartz and William Stewart for their help in that quest. Local tap water is in the 80F range and going up, so I'll try pre-chilling the water goin to the CF. The question is,what OD soft copper would give me the most "bang for the buck"?? I'll immerse the coil in a 36 quart Igloo cooler filled with ice and water and should hope to get at least a 10-15 degree drop in water temp. FWIW,the chiller is 3/8 OD copper inside 5/8 ID garden hose. My first thought was to use 1/2OD copper as a pre-chiller,so as to keep the water pressure up.For all the brewers in these hot brewing climates, I thank you in advance for your technical input!! I really hate pitching yeast in 82F wort, but am too chicken to wait for the room temp to cool it further. I do get some interest- ingly estery ales,though. Val Lipscomb-brewing in San Antonio Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 3 Jul 1997 19:28:37 -0400 From: "Alan McKay" <Alan.McKay.amckay at nt.com> Subject: Canning Wort again In #2453 Gary Knull of Alberta suggest a method for canning wort which is known among home-canners as the "open kettle" method. I can assure you that this method has the potential to be extremely dangerous, and I strongly suggest against using it. As any good modern book on canning foods will tell you (See: "Putting Food By", ISBN: 0-452-26899-0, Plume 1991), canning food with this oldfashioned "Open Kettle Method" is no longer considered safe. Furthermore, "every carefully prepared food with a rating higher than 4.6 pH must be processed in a Pressure Canner" (PFB, p 43). This means cooking the entire mason jars in a pressure cooker for at least a half hour, preferably longer. cheers, -Alan Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 3 Jul 1997 19:17:15 -0500 From: "Alan McKay" <Alan.McKay.amckay at nt.com> Subject: La Fin du Monde ... In #2450 Jim Cave extolls the virtues of a Quebec beer La Fin du Monde. Having a good deal of inside info, let me tell you what I know about Unibroue. Firstly, and most importantly, all of their brewhouse (including the Brewmaster) are imported from Belgium. Thus all of their beers are true Belgian-style. In fact, last year their Blanc du Chambly took best in the world, beating out several Belgian Whits. (Don't remember where this competition was, sorry. But I have the info right form the horse's mouth -- the local rep is a friend of mine) Also a little story about the name "La Fin du Monde". When the Brewmaster first finalized the recipe, a name had to be found. Unibroue involves the entire staff from janitor to brewmaster to owner in these sorts of things, so for weeks they were searching for the right name to no avail. Finally one day the co-owner (a famous Quebec rock star who's name also escapes me) came in for a visit to the president. The president of course was bemoaning the fact that they had this wonderful new beer, but had no name for it no for weeks on end. He wouldn't stop complaining about it, so finally the rock star says to him (in French of course) : "But [name forgotten], it's not the end of the world" To which the president replies (also in French of course): "But it is, it *is* the end of the wolrd!" And the two immediately looked at each other, realizing they'd just found the name. cheers, -Alan Return to table of contents
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