HOMEBREW Digest #3043 Sat 29 May 1999

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  Siebel response to m. comstock - subject: grist to liquor (Radzan1000)
  Mickey's (WayneM38)
  Siebel: Rising temp in secondary? ("Dr. Pivo")
  Mudgee What? ("Phil and Jill Yates")
  re : Kunze ("Alan McKay")
  Spent grain - pancakes (David)" <drussel3 at ford.com>
  re : Kunze ("Alan McKay")
  New Product Announcement (Eric.Fouch)
  Cherries (Joel Plutchak)
  Fat Tire clone (Henry Paine)
  Dr.. Pivo's HSA Show... (ALAN KEITH MEEKER)
  Czech pils w/ American Malt? ("WILLIAM R. SIEBEL")
  Tart Cherries and Brewing Safety ("Ken Schramm")
  Dextrin Malt ("WILLIAM R. SIEBEL")
  A word of thanks. ("Vintage Cellar")
  malt modification ("WILLIAM R. SIEBEL")
  Siebel answer to f l pauly - subject: hop freshness (Radzan1000)
  Thank You From Siebel (Radzan1000)
  Break Removal - Dean Fidar (Larsonjw)
  Question from Lou Heavner on Kolsches and Alts (Larsonjw)
  Question from Phil Wilcox about Ebullometry (Larsonjw)
  Multi step mash - Tim Martin (Larsonjw)

Beer is our obsession and we're late for therapy! 2000 MCAB Qualifiers: Boneyard Brew-Off 6/12/99 (http://www.uiuc.edu/ro/BUZZ/contest5.html); Buzz-Off! Competition 6/26/99 (http://www.voicenet.com/~rpmattie/buzzoff) Send articles for __publication_only__ to post@hbd.org If your e-mail account is being deleted, please unsubscribe first!! To SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE send an e-mail message with the word "subscribe" or "unsubscribe" to request@hbd.org. **SUBSCRIBE AND UNSUBSCRIBE REQUESTS MUST BE SENT FROM THE E-MAIL ACCOUNT YOU WISH TO HAVE SUBSCRIBED OR UNSUBSCRIBED!!!** IF YOU HAVE SPAM-PROOFED your e-mail address, the autoresponder and the SUBSCRIBE/UNSUBSCRIBE commands will fail! Contact brewery at hbd.org for information regarding the "Cat's Meow" Back issues are available via: HTML from... http://hbd.org Anonymous ftp from... ftp://hbd.org/pub/hbd/digests ftp://ftp.stanford.edu/pub/clubs/homebrew/beer AFS users can find it under... /afs/ir.stanford.edu/ftp/pub/clubs/homebrew/beer COPYRIGHT for the Digest as a collection is currently held by hbd.org (Pat Babcock and Karl Lutzen). Digests in their entirity CANNOT be reprinted/reproduced without this entire header section unless EXPRESS written permission has been obtained from hbd.org. Digests CANNOT be reprinted or reproduced in any format for redistribution unless said redistribution is at absolutely NO COST to the consumer. COPYRIGHT for individual posts within each Digest is held by the author. Articles cannot be extracted from the Digest and reprinted/reproduced without the EXPRESS written permission of the author. The author and HBD must be attributed as author and source in any such reprint/reproduction. (Note: QUOTING of items originally appearing in the Digest in a subsequent Digest is exempt from the above. Home brew clubs NOT associated with organizations having a commercial interest in beer or brewing may republish articles in their newsletters and/or websites provided that the author and HBD are attributed. ASKING first is still a great courtesy...) JANITORS on duty: Pat Babcock and Karl Lutzen (janitor@hbd.org)
---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 16:09:24 EDT From: Radzan1000 at aol.com Subject: Siebel response to m. comstock - subject: grist to liquor If you noticed I said a portion of the water is in the vessel, not all of it. Then if you are using North American malt you have a super abundance of enzyme. If you have all of your dry grist in a pot and pour 180F water into it, what happens to the enzymes at the initial point of contact and beyond? Will it really make much difference? Dave Radzanowski Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 16:59:03 EDT From: WayneM38 at aol.com Subject: Mickey's <<<Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 12:07:21 -0500 From: ensmingr at npac.syr.edu Subject: Mickey's Thomas D. Hamann asked about Mickey's in HBD 3040. Mickey's is made by Heileman Brewery in LaCrosse WI. It is 5.8% ABV; 158 cals/12 oz; OG 1.049, FG 1.006. This info used to be available at http://beertown.org/GABF/97breweries/brewerylist.htm , but this site is now closed. For alcohol and calories of this and other beers, see: http://www.npac.syr.edu/users/ensmingr/beer/beerdata.html . Cheerio! Peter A. Ensminger Syracuse, NY>>> Do to recent mergers/buyouts, Mickey's is soon to be, if not already, a Miller Brewing Co. product. It is my understanding that the Heileman Brewery in La Crosse WI, will be closed by next year. Wayne Big Fun Brewing Milwaukee Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 10:06:34 +0200 From: "Dr. Pivo" <irv at wireworks.se> Subject: Siebel: Rising temp in secondary? Having had such nice and succinct replies to my previous questions, I thought I'd chance one more that has been a mystery to me. Locally, people use old underground cellars for fermenting. In the winter this is brilliant. When the cellar is near 0C one can add a heat source, and then have everything from your chosen maximum where the heater is, to O. As summer approaches (and that otherwise wonderful time, but dreaded by brewers is soon here), there comes a point, when the heater is no longer needed, but the cellar still has different temperature regimes through it (variation in height, baffled off sections, etc).Finally there reaches a time where there is no place to move the goods after primary fermentation, that can guarantee a sustained temperature drop. This (when the secondary temp creeps up over the primary), emperically, leads to almost immediate "old barrel" flavours. This happens regardless of the yeast sort, and despite extra efforts to maintain anaerobic conditions when transferring the beer. A fully conditioned beer seems resistant to this. Since oxidation tastes of all sorts, are such a serious concern to home brewers (witness the invisable HSA and the ensuent sleepless nights), I am surprised that I have never heard "any" explanation at all about why this takes place. Locally this has become an "accepted truth" and causes not a small ammount of frantic carboy shifting in the ensueing months, but a technical explanation about just why "oxidised" tastes are created under these conditions is lacking. Got one? Dr. Pivo PS We all tend to brew fairly large volumes for the home scale (I knock off between 120-150 litres at a go, and some do twice that) that it sort of precludes the obvious "refigerator" solution. Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 21:52:30 +1000 From: "Phil and Jill Yates" <yates at flexgate.infoflex.com.au> Subject: Mudgee What? Having just returned from a trip to the bush and the town of Mudgee I have ploughed through several days of HBD to get up to speed with things. It amuses me to observe that even the Siebel folk (who were kind enough to offer their time) had to put a gentle foot down on some of the obsessive fanatics who seem to miss the whole point of brewing (at least on a non commercial basis). Let me not get into an argument here. As has been pointed out to me, my perception of homebrewing (or life for that matter) is far from the only valid one and allowances must be made for those who seek refuge in deep science. Actually just at this moment my thoughts are with the Perry family who have suffered such a tragedy. A little girl will grow up and never know her Dad. For all of you concerned I feel great sadness, as I'm sure we all do. I don't know if my tale will be of any interest to those elsewhere in the world but I have been interested in pursuing a past beer once made in the town of Mudgee here in NSW. I have found out very little about this beer, my father recalls having to drink it somewhere just after WW II when bottled beer in this country was in short supply. His comments, "bloody awful"! The beer was known as Mudgee Mud. In the contemporary town of Mudgee I learnt that originally the beer was quite good but that a change of water supply brought about its demise and hence its unfortunate nick name. My interest lies in trying to reproduce some of the earlier beers made in this country. A friend already has a brew underway which he calls CAP. For us the "A" stands for Australian and as he says, this isn't a cap you wear backwards on your head! But how does one go about producing a beer working backwards from a description of "bloody awful". Perhaps all my failed experiments -- bits of kitchen wall in the brew, a litre or two of cats pee, spin the concoction around the brewhouse and where it lands - let ferment, may just be what I am chasing after all! This will need to be a beer I can offer to an unsuspecting taster and feel sure I will get the desired response "bloody awful" Can anybody add to this and whilst you're there, are you in the mood for a Mudgee Mud? Phil Yates. Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 08:04:34 -0400 From: "Alan McKay" <amckay at nortelnetworks.com> Subject: re : Kunze Here it is : VLB+Buchkatalog&lang=&uid=SELECT-27051999-22522001&II=1111913&aktionsort= on&sortby=KT Kunze, Wolfgang: Technology Brewing and Malting Vorw. v. Weber, Richard. Ins Engl. bers. v. Wainwright, Trevor Versuchs- u. Lehranst. f. Brauerei, 1996 705 S., ca. 700 Abb. - 23,5 x 17 cm. - 1350. - Gebunden ISBN 3-921690-34-X 189,- DM Translated from German. cheers, -Alan - -- Alan McKay OS Support amckay at nortelnetworks.com Small Site Integration 613-765-6843 (ESN 395) Nortel Networks Internal : http://zftzb00d/alanmckay/ External : http://www.magma.ca/~bodnsatz/brew/tips/ All opinions expressed are my own. Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 08:11:37 -0400 From: "Russell, D. A. (David)" <drussel3 at ford.com> Subject: Spent grain - pancakes Not being a bread baker myself, but thinking what else could I do with some spent grain, I had an idea. I usually have breakfast duty on the weekends. To enhance my pancakes, I took about 1 cup of pancake batter, and added 1 tablespoon of spent grain. They tasted pretty good, more flavor, more texture. Give it a try. Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 08:15:08 -0400 From: "Alan McKay" <amckay at nortelnetworks.com> Subject: re : Kunze Oh, forgot to mention that I also did a review for the book for Brewing Techniques. You can find my original unedited version of the review on my web page at : http://www.magma.ca/~bodnsatz/brew/reviews/technology.html cheers, -Alan - -- Alan McKay OS Support amckay at nortelnetworks.com Small Site Integration 613-765-6843 (ESN 395) Nortel Networks Internal : http://zftzb00d/alanmckay/ External : http://www.magma.ca/~bodnsatz/brew/tips/ All opinions expressed are my own. Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 08:47:00 -0400 From: Eric.Fouch at steelcase.com Subject: New Product Announcement HBD- "So, as a close to the Siebel participation in our world, " Since the Siebel folks are gone, I have untied Fred Garvin. They say that when you are deprived of a sense, the other senses compensate. Well, while in sensory deprivation (hog tied and ball gagged), Fred did some thinking, which has led to the newest product offered for sale by the Bent Dick YoctoBrewery and Male Escort Service: The Beer Beauty Slide Rule Adjustamentator. Picture this: You're at your favorite Brew Pub or Micro, you look across the bar, and there she is- the most beautiful woman you have seen all night (and it's late). You've got all the right moves. You go to bed with Uma Thurman, but you wake up with Kyle Druey. The ol' "She's a ten at two, but a two at ten" syndrome. You went home with a "Six Packer" Or a "Half Caser": A woman whose outer beauty has unfortunately been judged by how many beers it would take from the sober state to make her attractive. How can such a travesty have occurred, and how could it be avoided? With The Beer Beauty Slide Rule Adjustamentator. "And don't you wanna know how it works!?" The basic problem is that the aforementioned beauty assessment was made using the familiar SAPU (Standard American Pilsener Unit), while drinking at a bar serving American Pale Ales, 14 grain ales, smokey scotch ales, and various holiday brews topping out at 8-10% ABV. Hell, six of these, and I would put the moves on Kyle myself (and I'm a staunch heterosexual, not that there's anything wrong with the alternative)! Now, you see a babe at 1:10am, you estimate her to be an "8" (on the more traditional beauty scale). You clear off a space on the bar, pull out the BBSRA, turn it on, and wait a few moments to let it warm up. Once the "Cypher" light comes on, enter the time, the perceived beauty of the intended tryst (on a scale of 1-10), the number of beers consumed and lastly the alcohol content in ABV. Pull the handle on the right side, and watch the slot machine style three window display. The number that appears (three significant figures) will be your effective SAPU conversion. Flip the BBSRA over (have a friend help you, the beta version is kinda bulky) and cross reference the SAPU along the "X" axis against your perceived beauty number on the "Y" axis. This is your adjusted beauty index, on a scale of 1 to 10, 10 being high (beautiful). Now this may sound rather cumbersome and time consuming, causing potential partners to lose interest or you to miss last call, but consider two things: You may be better off this way, or, you could plan ahead- Perform the calculations at home, before you leave: Estimate the number of alcoholic beverages you plan to consume, predetermine the acceptable adjusted beauty index you'll bed, then head for the brew pub with this number written on your hand or forehead, secure in the knowledge that your good judgement and reputation will be unbesmirched come the crack of noon the following day. And when the chicks see this number on your forehead, they will know you're not into games and pretenses, and will respond openly and warmly to your honest intentions. Hopefully, future versions of the BBSRA will have one of those little tubes to blow in for BAC, and be hyperlinked with Greenwich Mean Time, so all you'll need for proper operation is the slightest semblance of concsienceness. In keeping with the highest standard of Professionalism and Netiquette established in this very forum by one of our own (whom I'm sure has paged down by now), the low, low introductory price of the BBSRA will only be mentioned to serious, private inquiries. Eric Fouch C/O Fred Garvin Bent Dick YoctoBrewery, New Product Development and Launch Kentwood, MI "..but you never know, until you know." -Dr. Pivo Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 08:59:45 -0500 (CDT) From: Joel Plutchak <plutchak at ncsa.uiuc.edu> Subject: Cherries In Cherry Tree Digest #3042, Wayne <WayneM38 at aol.com> wrote: >[Montmorency] is the best of the two sour (pie) cherries that are >commonly grown here in zone 4 and 5. They both are listed at my >local nursery as "Prunus cerasus 'North Star'" [and] >"Prunus cerasus 'Semi Dwarf Montmorency.'" Fruit is red skinned >and has yellow flesh. ... >I am not sure of your growing locations and conditions, but the >genus Prunus is susceptible to a number of fungal diseases. They >need regular tending and are not a long lived fruit tree. Since we're talking cherries... There's a big cherry tree growing in my front yard. Don't know how long it's been there, and we do zero tending of it. It does sound like one of those Prunus guys, though. Makes great pies, and I've brewed with them a few times (cherry dark mild was great). How does one go about figuring out what the tree is, how old it is, how it should be tended, etc? Um, without getting obsessive about it? We've lived there three years, and it has provided a bounteous harvest the past two years under conditions of utter neglect. The year we moved in it was so sparsely fruited we didn't even realize it was a cherry tree, but we had weird winter/spring weather that year. - -- Joel Plutchak <plutchak at uiuc.edu> Cheerfully Chewing Cherries in east-central Illinois Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 09:36:43 -0500 From: Henry Paine <hpaine at iglobal.net> Subject: Fat Tire clone I'm looking for an extract receipe for a clone of Fat Tire. Any suggestions. Hank Paine Denton, Texas Henry C. "Hank" Paine, Jr. hpaine at iglobal.net Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 10:53:51 -0400 (EDT) From: ALAN KEITH MEEKER <ameeker at welch.jhu.edu> Subject: Dr.. Pivo's HSA Show... Hi. Last HBD Dr. Pive posted his conclusion (based on certain experiments he'd conducted) that HSA has NO discernable impact on the flavor of the final beer. Could you please elaborate a bit on what was done in this test? What do you mean by aerial gymnastics? Was this done during the mash/sparge/transfers or did it include the boil as well? The reason I ask is that lately I have taken to conducting my boils out of doors (thanks to Dave Humes for a great buy on a propane cooker!). The thing is that, whenever I do this there seems to be a lesser demon assigned specifically to monitoring my brewing and is charged with kicking up a tremendous wind whenever I start up the flame. I supopose the neighbors find it quite the comical sight - my brew kettle/burner surrounded by a bizzare collection of lawn furniture, trash cans, etc. acting as windbreaks. At any rate, When I do get to the stage of actually boiling I like to conduct a good roiling boil with the lid at least partially cracked, but even here, with the lid mostly on, I get the feeling that there is a LOT of exposure to the air that I wasn't getting when I boiled inside. Yes, I do understand that the solubility of oxygen is going to be very low but it won't be zero and with the wind whipping about over the boil It gets me to worrying that I'm overcoming the low solubility by vastly increasing the exposure to the air. Do you (or anyone else) have any thoughts as to what extent a good 60+ min roiling wort boil will be oxidized when there is a LOT of air exposure (remember, I'm totally losing the 'ol headspace/protective blanket of steam/whatever you want to call it in this set up and have good exposure to a continuously refreshing, fast moving air supply. How much sleep should I be losing??? -alan in Baltimore. Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 11:08:09 -0500 From: "WILLIAM R. SIEBEL" <SIEBELINSTITUTE at worldnet.att.net> Subject: Czech pils w/ American Malt? It is my belief that a brewer can duplicate or obtain a (flavor match) for most any beer style if he understands what his objectives are, how he can manipulate his brewing process to obtain specific results, and an understanding of the raw ingredients at his disposal. What characteristics of the Czech Pils are you having trouble with? If it's an increased body or mouthfeel try some unmalted barley as an adjunct ~5% for a start. Is yours too harsh or astrigent? Check your water's alkalinity. Czech water is extremely soft. And lastly many are agressively seeking to duplicate 40+ Bu's in their version. What is lost is a high amount of diacetyl in many Czech Pilsners that serves to mask this bitterness under a blanket of body building diacetyl, just below the concentration that would be perceived as butterscotch. The floral notes imparted by Saaz hops are a signature of this style. A yeast strain which is a low sulfur producer would be recommended. good luck & good brewing, Christopher Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 12:32:53 -0400 From: "Ken Schramm" <schramk at resa.net> Subject: Tart Cherries and Brewing Safety On the Tart Cherry front: All tart cherries are prunus cerasus, and the variety is specified in the third part of the binomial nomenclature (someone explain that one to me). All dogs are canus familiarus, and all apples are prunus malus. St. Bernards and Chihuahuas, Jonathons, Cox's Orange Pippins or Sekai Ichis get separated out by the varietal tag. If the varieties are essentially genetically identical, are cross-breedable or graft compatible (for the most part - there are exceptions here), or can be cross-pollinated, they are considered the same species. I've kind of gotten the impression that people are hoping to find out that Schaarbeeks are prunus lambicus, or something of the sort, and that just isn't going to happen. I know it takes the wind out of some folks' sails to find out that Schaarbeeks are "just another 'pie' cherry", but tarts is tarts. The variety designation becomes the crux of the bisquit. The "L." at the end of prunus cerasus var. Schaarbeek is therefore critically important, and I'd love to know what it stands for. In the case of apples and many other fruit varieties, the varietal designation can be used to sort out a specific variety that may over time have been given different colloquial names in different regions, but may, in fact, be the same variety. We might have the variety here in a germplasm repository, but not know it because we are using a colloquial name with which the ag. folks aren't familiar. The possible species name prunus agium has been bandied about, and it bears a strong resemblance to prunus avium, which is the name for all sweet cherries. It looks like a candidate for typo or mis-identification. Is there any chance that this could be the case? On the safety front: Completely aside from dropped glass carboys, another concern for brewers is the inclination to home-make burners and other devices for brewing in the home. It is purely hearsay, but my older brother recounted a story to me of a brewer who burned his house down using a homemade burner device, only to have his insurance claim rejected due to the use of a non-UL tested device for what they deemed an obviously dangerous task. Two points: a) I'd love to hear first hand the stories of anyone who might have had this experience, and b) If it is true (and it has that ring of "too strange for fiction"), how much of a savings was that home made device? The few extra bucks for a UL tested burner system, and the time to assure it's used according to manufacturers specs, seem a good insurance policy of their own. Yours brewly, Ken Schramm 50 miles East Northeast of Beer-Vana (aka Jeff Renner's beer fridge) Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 12:36:02 -0500 From: "WILLIAM R. SIEBEL" <SIEBELINSTITUTE at worldnet.att.net> Subject: Dextrin Malt This malt stuff is getting out of hand. Most of the confusion can be attributed to the maltsters themselves. The malting has no formal system in place for the classification or naming of malt products. Munich malts can be marketed as Caramel Malts, Roasted Malts as Munich Malts, and any malt type can assume any number of cute names (Victory, etc.). What is essencial for you as brewers is to inquire how a particular malt is manufactured. Once we determine how a malt is made we can assign it into one of four catagories. There are basically four catagories of malt which most all varieties would fall into. Base malt 2row, 6row etc. Munich malt (High Dried)like base malt but kilned to a higher degree. Caramel malt that has undergone a form of saccrification before roasting. This serves to carmelize the sugars rendering them unfermentable. Which is what Dextrin malt is. And roasted malts which are subjected to extreme temperatures. Cut open a kernal of Dextrin malt and you will find it to be glassy rather than mealy or flour-like. These sugars have been carmelized in production and would lend themselves to add body or fullness to a beers character. Dextrin sugars on the other hand are the polysaccarides that are too complex for yeast to metabolize. It is true that a higher mash conversion temperature will yield a wort with a higher amount of dextrin sugers. The enzymes utilized to breakdown these complex sugars becoming denatured at the higher temperatures. To Summarize, Dextrin malt does not contain starch dextrins but chemically modified sugars that are not susceptible to enzymatic breakdown. Again, there is not much analytical data to support this subject. Hope this helps, Christopher Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 29 May 1999 14:54:07 -0400 From: "Vintage Cellar" <sales at vintagecellar.com> Subject: A word of thanks. Just wanted to express thanks to both Rob Moline for setting up this wonderful opportunity and to the fine folks at the greatest brewing instituition anywhere the Siebel Institute. I hope this becomes an annual event. If not,it was certainly a privlege. Cheers! (with pint held high) Kenny Lefkowitz Blacksburg, VA Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 15:20:01 -0500 From: "WILLIAM R. SIEBEL" <SIEBELINSTITUTE at worldnet.att.net> Subject: malt modification Malt modification is loosly defined as the enzamatic or hydrolytic breakdown of material in the kernal endosperm from HMW material to simplier forms. That said I would dare anyone to compare a base malt grown and malted in North America to one from Europe and find them similar. I assume you are asking for and receiving a malt analysis with each shipment of malt. What specifications would reveal modification? Acrosphire growth, Diastatic Power, Soluble Protein, FAN, Friability? Once conversions between the different systems of reporting this information i.e. ASBC vs. EBC have been taken into account, I'm sure you'll come to the realization that German Malt in particular, and we're talking a base malt (2 row etc.) contains a higher percentage of HMW material. It is the German brewers themselves that request this low modified malt for the benefits of 1) better foam properties, 2) German brewers prefer to control the levels of proteolytic and amyolytic compounds themselves at their respective breweries. I'm sure you can find more information on this subject in the two three-ring binders you collected on your last visit to Chicago. Christopher Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 16:52:43 EDT From: Radzan1000 at aol.com Subject: Siebel answer to f l pauly - subject: hop freshness Sorry, somehow we missed your first entry. Unfortunately, I don't have any joy for you on an easy way to identify fresh hops. For brewing on your scale, you really have to be satisfied with the integrity of your brewshop owner/dealer. You could send us a sample and we could run an analysis for you. But the test would probably cost you as much as what you pay for a year's supply of hops. Get to know the person you are buying from. Ask yourself if you would buy a used car from him. Without analysis there is no real way of telling how old a hop is or if it has been properly handled and stored. Good luck. I also really don't have an answer for you on the Anchor Liberty Ale. I have never had a fresh one. By the time we get it here in Chicago it is passed its prime and has been severely abused. So I do not know the flavor you refer to. Why not contact the brewery direct? All brewers love praise and most of them are willing to talk about their product openly since they know that commercial duplication is very difficult. Again, good luck. Dave Radzanowski Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 17:53:26 EDT From: Radzan1000 at aol.com Subject: Thank You From Siebel We all want to thank you for the hospitality and the interest. Over the weekend we will be completing answers to questions as presented through Friday, so continue looking for them next week. You have kept us busy. Come see us in Chicago. Have a good holiday. Bill Siebel; Christopher Bird; Mike Babb; Lyn Kruger; Jim Larson; Joe Power & Dave Radzanowski An aside to Mike Rose: We are not planning to write another book on homebrewing. You already have plenty of "gurus" and more books than your shelves can hold. We try to keep only one topic in our classes, and that is "BREWING." We expect that the people coming to spend time with us will supply the scale. Come and see. Best to all. Dave Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 18:37:36 EDT From: Larsonjw at aol.com Subject: Break Removal - Dean Fidar It sounds like you are doing a good job of break and hop removal from the wort. Without seeing your wort or having an analytical measurement of haze it is hard to say whether break removal is adequate. It probably is. If you remove too much break, fermentation will be slowed. Not enough break removal will give a harsh beer. The easiest test you could do is to make one brew with the method you suggested and another without it and compare the two beers. Joe Power, Siebel Institute Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 18:37:35 EDT From: Larsonjw at aol.com Subject: Question from Lou Heavner on Kolsches and Alts Dear Lou, I've only tasted, never brewed, this style which is essentially ale fermented with an ale yeast but the cellaring is done following the procedures for lager beers. In- depth discussions of brewing of these products can be found in "Designing Great Beers" by Ray Daniels and "Kolsch" by Eric Warner. Both tell you that actual fermentation temperatures vary from 45 deg F up to 70 deg F and that lagering may be up to four or six weeks at temperatures from 32 to 50 deg F, depending who is doing the brewing. Carbonation is being achieved by secondary fermentation, injection and/or bottle conditioning. I would guess that finding a good set of cellaring conditions will take some trial and error until you get the flavor that you are happy with. For example, what low fermentation temperature is your ale yeast happy with? Does bottle conditioning give a beer that is superior to one carbonated under the pressure of a secondary fermentation? Regarding bottle conditioning, a charge of fresh, healthy yeast for the bottle usually gives the best results (quicker and cleaner). Did you notice a flavor change when you added fresh yeast for the bottle conditioning? I agree that the concentration of live cells and the temperature make the carbonation time longer for your lagers than for the ales that come right out of the fermenters. If the extra time is not a problem and you are happy with the taste results then keep up the good work and enjoy. Happy brewing! Jim Larson Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 18:37:31 EDT From: Larsonjw at aol.com Subject: Question from Phil Wilcox about Ebullometry Dear Phil Last week I took an Ebulliometer that we found in the Siebel archives to Old Timers Night at the District Milwaukee Master Brewers Meeting. Only 3 or 4 people there knew what it was and one of them had used it a lot when he worked in the wine industry. I had only seen one used once when the laboratory at the brewery kept telling the brewing department that the 3.5% alcohol beer was only 3.2%. Finally the brewmaster, who also spoke only in degrees Raemeur, went to the closet, dug out the Ebulliometer, and "proved" that the laboratory was giving out bogus results. If you have a mixture of only alcohol and water, you could measure the boiling point with the Ebulliometer and look up the exact concentration of alcohol as well as all of the other physical properties of the solution: specific gravity, refractive index, viscosity, etc. They will also depend on temperature, eg 25 deg C, and pressure. It is common and often necessary to correct the Ebulliometer reading for the barometric pressure which changes the boiling point. For wine or beer ( essentially mixtures of water and alcohol and "extract" ) you need two measurements to determine concentrations. The two could be the OG and the AE or the Ebulliometer boiling point and the real extract or any other pair of measurements. You then use callibration curves for your measurements to look up alcohol concentration etc. The relation you quoted ( - 0.05% alcohol per degree Plato) is a a good example of such a calibration and one that we have been looking for. I have not seen any published values of accuracy of Ebulliometric measurements but they are supposedly good enough to differentiate a 3.2 beer from a 3.5 beer. It is very likely that inaccuracies will increase as you extrapolate your calibration curves to increasingly different beer styles because of the components other than water, alcohol and extract that are present in these beers. It may be necessary to have calibration curves for each different beer to obtain the accuracy you are after. The person who used the Ebulliometer for wine said that the published curve he used was accurate for very dry wines but not very good for sweet wines. I'm not sure why the Ebulliometer was not more widely used in brewing - maybe because it is so easy to estimate the same information with two hydrometer readings. A good question and an interesting topic. Thanks for the references. JIm Larson Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 18:37:37 EDT From: Larsonjw at aol.com Subject: Multi step mash - Tim Martin Dear Tim, The advantages of a multi step mash are economic, you can recover more extract from the grains, you can use a cheaper adjunct rather than all malt, you may be able to filter better and you may be able to deal with undermodified malt better. If you don't need these advantages, don't do it. There is one flavor factor that might interfere with the flavor of your beer. The precursor of the spicy, clove - phenolic flavor in some beers like weizen is released at lower temperatures in the mash, under 120 F. If you are looking for more of this flavor in a beer, you might want to try a more complex mash schedule. Joe Power, Siebel Institute Return to table of contents
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