HOMEBREW Digest #3055 Sat 12 June 1999

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		Digest Janitor: janitor@hbd.org
		Many thanks to the Observer & Eccentric Newspapers of 
		Livonia, Michigan for sponsoring the Homebrew Digest.
				URL: http://www.oeonline.com

  Good For You Brew ("Alan McKay")
  Triple fermentation (Nathan Kanous)
  Kraeusening, (Dave Burley)
  upcoming trip to (0,0,0) Rennerian (ie. Ann Arbor, MI) (Jeff)
  Thanks and No bubbles ("Penn, John")
  Re: Harvest Ale, epoxy and polyamide resins. ("Thomas D. Hamann")
  Re: suggestions for dry yeast lag time (Paul Shick)
  Re: Joy of Brazing SS Advice ("John Palmer")
  Re:Lallemand Nottingham Yeast (Matthew Comstock)
  Re: 80 IBU HopDevil clone ("Jim Busch")
  Stunned in Centerport (AKA Clinitest) (Jim Bentson)
  Sugar in Wheeler and Protz Recipes (Jim Bentson)
  Polyclar (Peter Owings)
  good head (on a glass of homebrew!!!) (Clark)

* Beer is our obsession and we're late for therapy! * 2000 MCAB Qualifiers: Boneyard Brew-Off 6/12/99 * (http://www.uiuc.edu/ro/BUZZ/contest5.html); Buzz-Off! * Competition 6/26/99 (http://www.voicenet.com/~rpmattie/buzzoff) Send articles for __publication_only__ to post@hbd.org If your e-mail account is being deleted, please unsubscribe first!! To SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE send an e-mail message with the word "subscribe" or "unsubscribe" to request@hbd.org. **SUBSCRIBE AND UNSUBSCRIBE REQUESTS MUST BE SENT FROM THE E-MAIL ACCOUNT YOU WISH TO HAVE SUBSCRIBED OR UNSUBSCRIBED!!!** IF YOU HAVE SPAM-PROOFED your e-mail address, the autoresponder and the SUBSCRIBE/UNSUBSCRIBE commands will fail! Contact brewery at hbd.org for information regarding the "Cat's Meow" Back issues are available via: HTML from... http://hbd.org Anonymous ftp from... ftp://hbd.org/pub/hbd/digests ftp://ftp.stanford.edu/pub/clubs/homebrew/beer AFS users can find it under... /afs/ir.stanford.edu/ftp/pub/clubs/homebrew/beer COPYRIGHT for the Digest as a collection is currently held by hbd.org (Pat Babcock and Karl Lutzen). Digests in their entirity CANNOT be reprinted/reproduced without this entire header section unless EXPRESS written permission has been obtained from hbd.org. Digests CANNOT be reprinted or reproduced in any format for redistribution unless said redistribution is at absolutely NO COST to the consumer. COPYRIGHT for individual posts within each Digest is held by the author. Articles cannot be extracted from the Digest and reprinted/reproduced without the EXPRESS written permission of the author. The author and HBD must be attributed as author and source in any such reprint/reproduction. (Note: QUOTING of items originally appearing in the Digest in a subsequent Digest is exempt from the above. Home brew clubs NOT associated with organizations having a commercial interest in beer or brewing may republish articles in their newsletters and/or websites provided that the author and HBD are attributed. ASKING first is still a great courtesy...) JANITORS on duty: Pat Babcock and Karl Lutzen (janitor@hbd.org)
---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 08:58:56 -0400 From: "Alan McKay" <amckay at nortelnetworks.com> Subject: Good For You Brew Greetings, As some of you know, I've been promising for some time now to brew a "Good For You" beer, brewed with the Swedish "Good For You" Muesli available at Loblaw's and Ikea. The ingredients were conducive to good beer, and I just couldn't resist the temptation of having a beer called "Good for You Brew" ;-) Good For You Brew 625g Swedish Good For You Muesli (Contains only rice, corn, wheat, oats and honey) 2 kg Hugh Baird Munich Malt 2 kg Hugh Baird Vienna Malt 700g Malted Wheat 6 kg Canada Malting 2 Row 2.5 ounces Tettnanger at 5.5 % (60 min) 0.5 ounces Hallertauer Hersbrucker (? % - will look it up) (15 min) 0.5 ounces Hallertauer Hersbrucker (? %) (5 min) 0.5 ounces Hallertauer Hersbrucker (? %) (0 min) Mashed 25 minutes at 151F, brought up to 154F and mashed another 40 minutes. Ranoff in 55 minutes. Not sure of exact volume, but I think I collected about 50 litres, with an OG of 1.052. I'll keep you all posted on progress. cheers, -Alan - -- Alan McKay OS Support amckay at nortelnetworks.com Small Site Integration 613-765-6843 (ESN 395) Nortel Networks Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 08:02:55 -0500 From: Nathan Kanous <nlkanous at pharmacy.wisc.edu> Subject: Triple fermentation Curious what people know about those famous "triple fermentations" used by belgians. Do they just pitch more fresh / healthy yeast after the primary / secondary fermentations, or do they rack the beer and add fresh / healthy yeast? Thinking of doing some strange, huge fermentations this summer just for kicks. nathan in madison, wi Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 09:37:53 -0400 From: Dave Burley <Dave_Burley at compuserve.com> Subject: Kraeusening, Brewsters: Steve Lacey asks about "kraeusening", the addition of fermenting "young beer" which has just begun to visibly ferment, to carbonate a finished one. Steven Snyder in "The Brewmaster's Bible" ( a really excellent book, IMHO) says: "Rates for five gallons (US or about 19 - 20 liters for the rest of the world) equal roughly 1.5 quarts ( US or a liter) of speise for high OG beers(>1.060) [i.e. the beer added for kraeusening - DRB] and three quarts ( liters) for lower OG beers (<1.030). The amont of speise ( added fermenting beer -DRB) needed, depending on the fermentability of the malt you use, is listed below in quarts ( liters): OG* Speise Needed (quarts) 1.070 1.00-1.50 1.060 1.50-1.75 1.050 1.75- 2.00 1.040 2.00- 2.50 1.030 2.50 - 3.00 1.020 3.00 - 3.50 * OG of added fermenting young beer - DRB from "The Brewmaster's Bible", Steven Snyder p 37 pub Harper Perennial You can also check out the HBD archives for my directions on making a "Kraeusen" starter, which is a lot more convenient and predictable if you are not fermenting the same beer regularly. Contact me directly if you have a problem. - ------------------------------------- Keep on Brewin' Dave Burley Dave_Burley at compuserve.com Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 09:57:42 -0400 (EDT) From: mcnallyg at gam83.npt.nuwc.navy.mil (Jeff) Subject: upcoming trip to (0,0,0) Rennerian (ie. Ann Arbor, MI) Hi All, I am going to be attending a course at the University of Michigan in Ann Arbor during the week of July 5th through the 9th. I've already checked the online beer guides and turned up Arbor Brewing, Grizzly Peak Brewing, and Ashley's. Any advice from the local HBD readers about these, or other places? What about locally produced bottled brews to take home? Private email is probably best. Hoppy brewing, Jeff ========================================================================== Geoffrey A. McNally Phone: (401) 832-1390 Mechanical Engineer Fax: (401) 832-7250 Naval Undersea Warfare Center email: Systems Development Branch mcnallyg at gam83.npt.nuwc.navy.mil Code 8321; Bldg. 1246/2 WWW: Newport, RI 02841-1708 http://www.nuwc.navy.mil/ Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 09:56:20 -0400 From: "Penn, John" <John.Penn at jhuapl.edu> Subject: Thanks and No bubbles Thanks for the cleaning advice and sympathy on my explosive stout. No bubbles in the airlock... As for the post on a plastic fermenter that did not bubble through the airlock... I also sent this note privately but typically this just means that the seal on the lid, or more likely around the airlock, is not tight. I had this happen to me and proceeded to buy another rubber grommet for my plastic lid. When I got home I realized that it wasn't the grommet itself, but the lack of seal between the grommet and the S-shape airlock. The bottom of the S airlock was straight while the 3 piece airlock was tapered. I can push the 3 piece airlock deeper into the grommet to make an airtight seal but the S-shape airlock is straight and would not seal. Fortunately this poster noticed that his beer had fermented due to the change in gravity. The foam/krausen is another sure sign of fermentation. I have since retired my plastic bucket in favor of glass carboys but I worry about dropping one someday after reading all the posts of carboy disasters. In my case the plastic bucket was clearly infected probably due to unseen scratches. I'll keep you updated on my explosive stout. I got recommendations to just use 2 pkts. of Nottingham dry yeast for most beers and 3 pkts of Nottingham for a strong beer. I had previously seen 1 pkt / gallon for barleywines so my 9% abv stout would probably need 3-5 pkts if I hadn't already made a 1.5 gallon starter from 1 pkt of dry yeast. The starter was extra insurance that I wouldn't have a long lag time like others and myself have noticed of late with Danstar dry yeasts. John Penn Eldersburg MD Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 12 Jun 1999 00:00:08 +0930 From: "Thomas D. Hamann" <tdhamann at senet.com.au> Subject: Re: Harvest Ale, epoxy and polyamide resins. First an answer- Steve Jones asked about Lees "Harvest Ale", Michael Jackson writes in his 1997 Pocket Beer Book that this respected brewery in Manchester (U.K.) is noteworthy for its strong "Harvest Ale" ***-****, made each year from the new season's malt (Maris Otter,Yorkshire) and hops (Goldings,East Kent), and released in late November, with a vintage date. O.G. = 1120 & 11.5 ABV. What was the vintage date on your bottle? Was it filtered? and now a question- I have just made a forked racking cane so that I can run 2 sparge arms at once, the adhesive that I used was `Dextone' steel filled epoxy and contains epoxy and polyamide resins, is this adhesive going to poison me if I sparge with this glued cane? Thanks, Thomas. p.s. that Mikey Jackson fella dropped into Adelaide South Australia this week and didn't even say g'day! SNOB Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 11:03:39 -0400 (EDT) From: Paul Shick <SHICK at JCVAXA.jcu.edu> Subject: Re: suggestions for dry yeast lag time Hello all, James McCrorie and Nate Lansing have suggested solutions to the Great Dry Yeast Lag Time quandry. James suggests adding yeast nutrients to the water used for rehydration, an idea I've never considered. Nate says that aerating the chilled wort is what's slowing things down, and suggests a quick experiment to see. I'm quite intrigued by Nate's idea, because it runs contrary to what little I know of yeast life cycles (mostly from reading Tracy Aquilla's BT article.) My impression was that a large yeast mass would scarf up 8-10ppm of O2 in a few hours and emerge in much healthier condition than with only 2-3ppm O2 (where the larger dissolved O2 level comes from pure O2 aeration, the smaller just from the runoff into the carboys.) Nate, can you explain your reasoning a bit more clearly? Or if anyone else has a nice explanation for these phenomena, I'd enjoy reading it. Thanks again to James and Nate. It sounds like I need to do a lot more brewing when I get back into town in two weeks, to test both of these ideas. Paul Shick Basement brewing in Cleveland Hts OH Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 11:19:13 -0700 From: "John Palmer" <jjpalmer at gte.net> Subject: Re: Joy of Brazing SS Advice Joy Hansen had some good comments and advice that I would like to comment on: >The silver solder must be food grade! I guess this means that there's no >lead, cadmium, or chromium. Right, no lead or cadmium. (No chromium in silver solder) Look for Plumbing Solder. >To continue, SS warps badly when heated, to say the least. If the problem >with heating SS greater than 800 degrees is that the trace elements migrate, The carbon (in this alloy, an impurity) forms chromium carbides, taking the chromium out of solution, making the alloy low chromium/non-stainless in localized areas. >then, no amount of acid pacification can solve the problem? Bingo. >The entire piece must be tempered in an oven/furnace at the proper temperature. >At least, this is what I understand from my readings of class material and >"Brewing Techniques". This probably came from my article, but it is not practical. To re-solutionize everthing, you would have to totally anneal the vessel in an argon atmosphere or vacuum furnace at 2000F for about 15 minutes, cool it rapidly and watch out for distortion. >I guess that this means that the temperature of the >project must be raised slowly, yet prevent oxidation that will prevent the >joining of the stainless steel. Afterall, the purpose of the oxide surface >that forms is to prevent joining with anything! Not quite. To solder or braze stainless (300 series) you want to localize your heat (fairly easy since stainless has such piss-poor thermal conductivity) and heat and cool it Fast. I mean that you want to have the time at high temperatures at a minimum to prevent sensitization (migrating trace elements). The critical bad temperature range is 1200-1600F. The flux is what will protect the bare surface from oxides during the solder/braze, and as you say, oxidation of the surface will cause non-wetting of the solder (balls up). >It is possible to use SMAW with special rods, and MIG. Neither is practical >for the thin material involved in kettles. I agree, although MIG comes close (skill involved). >The backside of any weld must be protected from air. Often accomplished by a purge gas (argon) on the backside. But not strictly necessary. My welds (TIG) were done without backside purge and they are fine - because I ground off the oxidation to clean metal and then scoured it with oxalic acid cleanser to get rid of free iron. Pretty easy to do really. >AC has an unstable arc that causes failure in my attempts to weld. Lots of holes. So, I just bought a DC unit that is modified for TIG touch start. Not much better than the AC so far. The >touch start contaminates the electrode and causes the arc to destabilize! The recommended setup for TIG of (300 series) Stainless Steel is DCEN or DC Electrode Negative (ie. Straight Polarity). Touch Start is not recommended because of electrode contamination. Use a lump of tungsten (or spare tungsten electrode clamped to ground) as your start block if you must. High frequency starts are recommended. >So much for welding aluminum gum wrappers together. However, I've read that TIG is the only practical way to join SS. However, BURP club member >experiences with silver soldering fittings on Sanke kegs has worked out just fine. Yep. >So, what advice can I give you? I've tried to point out that joining metals is craft learned over many years of practice and experience. Unless you are retired, as I am, and have lots of spare time to tinker, take your connection projects to a competent craftsman or a club member experienced and successful at joining SS. My fittings were TIG joined by a welder retiree working from his garage. $5 a fitting for perfection! If I ever >find success with welding SS, each weld will cost $500! Ditto. See yesterdays HBD (3054) for links to my articles on my web page. John Palmer - former International Space Station welding engineer. Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 12:10:30 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Comstock <mccomstock at yahoo.com> Subject: Re:Lallemand Nottingham Yeast In HBD#3054, James McCrorie <James at craftbrewing.freeserve.co.uk> wrote: "Scientific analysis here in UK has established that Lallemand dried Nottingham Yeast is deficient of natural nutrients. Lallemand (UK)have confirmed this and say they are working on the problem. The advice is to use a good quality yeast nutrient at the rehydration stage." I like using Nottingham dry, and I have had several quick starts using it. However, I have had one slow start. The inconsistency bothers me more than a lack of nutrients. Does Lallemand have an explanation for inconsistency, rather than a band-aid? By the way yeast nutrient often contains DAP, or ammonium hydrogen phosphate, (NH4)2HPO4. If your recipe calls for gypsum, CaSO4xH2O, this will precipitate as Ca3(PO4)2 and change your recipe. Sorry. Matt Comstock in Cincinnati _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free at yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 15:40:35 +0000 From: "Jim Busch" <jim at victorybeer.com> Subject: Re: 80 IBU HopDevil clone Rick writes: > "Bittersweet success or a Victory of my own" with an IBU of 80 > something and claiming to have come close to Victory's Hop Devil > and no one even raised an eyebrow. Am I that well respected that > everyone just wrote down the reciepe with complete acceptance? I did not go back and calculate your recipe for expected IBUs but when someone writes they made a beer with "80-100" BUs, I usually just ignore it since we all know that IBUs can only be measured after the fact. I suspect your utilization or alpha acid content of the hops are not as expected, or you like even hoppier beers than HopDevil! For the record, our own AJ did an analysis on HopDevil and came up with a measured IBU of 63. > By the way the beer is now 2 months old and just wonderfull. Glad to hear it, you are now ready to clone Old Horizontal Barley Wine, take your HopDevil recipe and brew it to an OG of around 26P. Harvest the slurry from a HopDevil clone and pitch the slurry into the Horzy clone. Should be perfect by the time our temps fall below 70F again.... Cheers! Jim Busch Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 17:59:57 -0400 From: Jim Bentson <jbentson at longisland.com> Subject: Stunned in Centerport (AKA Clinitest) Am I dreaming or are the detrimental effects of drinking my famous "Cat Vomit Steam Beer" finally appearing after one year? I am of course referring to the fact that Rob Moline asked Siebel about Clinitest and Joe Powers gave what I take to be a strong endorsement. I am reposting part of Joe Powers post which includes Rob's question Rob Wrote: ON THE USE OF CLINITEST SUGAR DETERMINATION KIT - WAS THIS A LEADING QUESTION? I KNOW LALLEMAND USES THE TEST ON ALL OF THEIR YEAST AND I AM THANKFUL TO THEM FOR SHARING THEIR APPLICATION. Joe Powers of Siebel answered: WE PROMOTE THE CLINITEST WHEREVER AND WHENEVER WE CAN. THE CLINITEST IS A QUICK, SIMPLE AND INEXPENSIVE MEASURE OF "REDUCING SUGAR" AVAILABLE FOR DIABETICS AT LARGER DRUG STORES. REDUCING SUGAR MEASURE IN BREWING ORIGINATED IN THE NINETEENTH CENTURY AND CONTINUES TO BE USED INTO THE TWENTY-FIRST CENTURE. THE TEST, THOUGH, DOES REQUIRE SOME INTERPRETATION OF THE RESULTS. .......... What I am STUNNED about is not a single mention about this post as of the June 7th HBD. Since no one else will say it, I will. Congratulations to Dave Burley, it seems that you were right in promoting Clinitest as a useful indicator of finished fermentation despite the severe pounding you took for maintaining that view. Anyone interested should read Joe's full post in HBD #3039 (May 25) to get the details on how to interpret the results. Again I congratulate Dave for his perseverance. I for one will certainly try Clinitest when I start brewing again in the Fall. Jim Bentson Centerport NY Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 19:46:37 -0400 From: Jim Bentson <jbentson at longisland.com> Subject: Sugar in Wheeler and Protz Recipes Recently Jon Rusko asked the following: "I recently bought the book "Brew Your Own British Real Ale; Recipes for More Than 100 Brand-Name Real Ales" by Wheeler and Prost and I had a question regarding the ingredients of the recipes listed. I noticed that many, if not most, of the recipes call for the addition of "white sugar". There is no mention of "white sugar" in the ingredient explanation in the front of the book and was wondering if this white sugar could be recipe substitution for some other type of sugar or a even misnomer? " Jon: Wheeler & Protz's other book "Brew Classic European Beers " is clearer. They state that when the refer to white sugar they mean plain ordinary everyday white household sugar (sucrose). As to cidery tastes due to sugar, W & P state : "It seems likely that the enzyme invertase, secreted by yeast to invert sucrose, is capable of producing hangovers and can , perhaps be tasted. Some authorities, however dispute this." They go on to explain that many famous beers are brewed with sugar and in some cases the sugar is justified on more than economic grounds. A strong beer such as an old ale, may be too sweet and cloying on the palate if it was an all malt recipe, and the use of some sucrose or glucose would lighten the palate. They also point out that another consideration is that some brewers in southern climes do not have ready access to low nitrogen malt and they use the sugar to dilute the nitrogen. I have used a number of W&P's recipes and have not noticed any problems with the sugar addition Jim Bentson Centerport NY Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 21:42:52 -0400 From: Peter Owings <peteo1 at mindspring.com> Subject: Polyclar I'd like to get some info on the use of Polyclar. I've done some research and have found various amounts and techniques used. I'd like some practical information before I put "plastic" in my beer! Beer Man peteo1 at mindspring.com "Remember kids...Duck and cover!" Return to table of contents
Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 21:36:06 -0400 From: Clark <clark at capital.net> Subject: good head (on a glass of homebrew!!!) Hi list, Here's one to raise a few blood pressures. Is there any practical benefit to having a thick creamy head on a glass of beer?? I poured a dunkel last week and it took four or five minutes for the foam to subside enough where I could get the whole bottle in the glass. It tasted great. I poured a pilsner a couple days ago and there was virtually no head at all. Instant gratification and it also tasted great. I can see where a thick head can make it easier to flick the occasional fly or other bug out of your glass, but other than that what is the use of a big head, or is this part of the "art of brewing". I think I smell smoke. Gotta run. Dave Clark Return to table of contents
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