---

	FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
		Digest Janitor: janitor@hbd.org
		Many thanks to the Observer & Eccentric Newspapers of 
		Livonia, Michigan for sponsoring the Homebrew Digest.
				URL: http://www.oeonline.com


Contents:
  re: Kiltlifter Ale ("Jeremy J. Arntz")
  custom bottle caps ("Jimmy Hughes")
  my 2 cents (FredScheer)
  Zymurgy & AHA ("Dean Fikar")
  Re: Beer Engine Parts ("Michael Allison")
  AHA Board ("John A. Carlson, Jr.")
  Request for CAP  thoughts (Jeff Renner)
  Rust on stainless steel ("Jim Suggs")
  Kiltlifter ale (AKGOURMET)
  Re: custom bottle caps (phil sides jr)
  Re: AHA Elections (phil sides jr)
  Re: Pigs Love Their Trough (phil sides jr)
  Upsetting People And Repaying Friends ("Phil & Jill Yates")
  starting a  rhubarb (Clark)
  RevRims ("Francois Zinserling")
  RevRIMS (William Macher)


* Beer is our obsession and we're late for therapy!

* 18th Annual Oregon Homebrew Festival - entry deadline May 15th
* More info at:  http://www.hotv.org/fest2000

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Date: Sat, 13 May 2000 03:39:11 -0400
From: "Jeremy J. Arntz" <arntz at surfree.com>
Subject: re: Kiltlifter Ale

I didn't know if you checked their website: http://www.moylans.com/
but here's what is says:

KILT LIFTER SCOTCH ALE: 
Our Scotch style ale is a perfect compliment to the holiday season.
 Big, robust and bold! Often called a "winter warmer, this beer is a 
Scottish strong ale with an extremely rich and full body. It is best 
enjoyed before or after a satisfying meal and should be allowed
to warm up in order to enhance its rich malt flavors.The beginning 
specific gravity is 1.080 and the resulting beer is about 8.0% alcohol 
by volume. 

Here is also the description of the Pike Pub and Bewery offering of
the same name:

Kilt Lifter Scotch Ale

History
Scotch ale is the strongest of all "Scottish" ales. It is sometimes called
"wee heavy," or the Scottish equivalent of England's barley wines. 
Scotland's cool, damp climate is best suited to the growth of barley, 
and thus the country's brewers became accustomed to working with
minimal quantities of hops (which they were not anxious to purchase 
from England). Scotch ales are rich and malty and often accented 
with a touch of peat-smoked whiskey malt. 

Taste
Unlike the lighter "Scottish" ales, this is an authentic heavy Scotch ale.
 It is lightly hopped with a strong malt character, and a hint of peaty 
smokiness. Warm fermentation produces fruity esters and balances
 the sweet malt character.


Jeremy Arntz

Insomniac Homebrew
http://www.meditationzone.net/brewing
"You can sleep when your DEAD!"





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Date: Sat, 13 May 2000 07:56:21 -0400
From: "Jimmy Hughes" <inspector at bmd.clis.com>
Subject: custom bottle caps

How about buying some of the 3/4" round labels and printing on them, then
apply to the cap?
Haven't thought about it until now, but will probably buy some this
afternoon.
I will let you know how it works out.

Happy trails to you, 'til we meet again..............
Check out the free items, go to,
http://www.ncinspections.com
scroll down, click on the free after rebate link........
Save money, enjoy........




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Date: Sat, 13 May 2000 08:40:42 EDT
From: FredScheer at aol.com
Subject: my 2 cents

Matt:
With Ray Daniel's as Editor of Zymurgy I'm looking forward
for lot's of improvement editorial wise.
I think that the AHA  (and especially the readers of ZYMURGY)
will have now a competent Editor with Homebrewing background.
As a former longtime Editorial Advisor to THE NEW BREWER
magazine (at that time Virginia Thomas was the Editor), I can assure
you that I was never handet an article with any comments as to
what to do. I only wish that future Editors (ZYMURGY, THE NEW BREWER,
and so on), Board of Directors, Advisors, and what ever titles they have,
would have brewed several batches of beer before taking this type of 
positions. That way they would understand the needs of the Brewers
regarding what should be printed or not. I know for sure this will happening
with ZYMURGY and RAY DANIELS. I'm looking forward for lot's of
great issues of Zymurgy in the future.

"St. Patrick's" <stpats at bga.com> Subject: AHA Board   wrote:
>>Except for Pat Babcock who showed he's unfit because the 
>>digest didn't come out Friday morning :-)     Its a little like 
>>changing tires when the problem's under the hood.

I don't think that Pat Babcock is unfit as you posted here at the HBD.
As the JANITOR of this forum, Pat done a lot for the Homebrewing scene.
By the way Pat, are you running for the AHA Board? If so, I hope you
get elected..................and I know, you brewed beer!

Fred M. Scheer


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Date: Sat, 13 May 2000 08:04:50 -0700
From: "Dean Fikar" <dfikar at flash.net>
Subject: Zymurgy & AHA

Matt writes:

>Re: Ray Daniels and Zymurgy
>Does anyone know if Daniels has any real editorial control over what type
of
>articles will be run in Zymurgy, or is he simply handed an article and
told,
>"Make sure this is fundamentally correct"? If the latter, there is little
>reason to hope for improvement in the content of the magazine.

I can assure you that Ray is quite involved in the article selection process
and actively edits articles.  He recently asked me to write an article for
an upcoming Zymurgy on warm weather brewing which I was honored to do.  He
picked the topic, gave me a rough outline of topics he would like to see
covered, and generally coached me through the whole process.  Through the
miracle of email we passed info & edits back and forth a couple of times and
within one day of my rough draft he had edited it to my satisfaction and we
were done.  I personally am pumped about Zymurgy and the direction it is
headed with Ray at the helm.

On a related note, I must say that my experiences with the AHA have been
pretty positive.  I'm amazed to read some of the comments from long-time
members whom I respect who apparently suffered through some tough years with
the organization but most seem to agree that things have gotten better
recently.  My perspective is a little different in that I've only been a
homebrewer for a little over three years and an AHA member for about as long
so I guess I missed some of the shenanigans of the past.   I'd urge some of
the more veteran brewers who quit the AHA back in the lean years to give it
another look.  With people like Paul Gatza, Rob Moline, and Ray Daniels now
on board I can't help but think that the future is pretty good.

Dean Fikar
Fort Worth, TX



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Date: Sat, 13 May 2000 10:47:18 -0400
From: "Michael Allison" <mallison at heldref.org>
Subject: Re: Beer Engine Parts

Hello all,

Just wanted to thank everyone at the digest and my local homebrew club
(BURP) for all their help in my quest for replacement parts for my Cornelius
Beer Engine.  I thought I'd share my resources in finding the parts.

I ended up calling the guys over at Brewin Beagle out of Chicago.  They are
the North American representatives of Singleton Services in North Yorkshire
(The people who helped Pat Babcock with his parts).  I also got a very nice
email from Leon Singleton of Singleton Services saying he could track down
just about any parts I needed.  I also got a lot of useful information from
Paul Pendyke at U K Brewing.

Barry at Brewin Beagle was extremely helpful.  Instead of replacing just the
seal in my beer engine, he just sent me a reconditioned pump cylinder.
Needless to say, my beer engine is running like a charm and I can't wait to
hook it up to my new kegging system.

Thanks again.  Cheers!
Michael Allison
Washington, DC



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Date: Sat, 13 May 2000 11:58:48 -0600
From: "John A. Carlson, Jr." <jac at iex.net>
Subject: AHA Board

Dear HBD:

My name is John Carlson and I was asked by Dr. Mike Hall to be a candidate
for the AHA Board of Advisors. I have been homebrewing since ~1990 and and
very active in my local home brew club
(Hop Barley & The Aler's). I am a National BJCP Judge and judge commercial
beer as well.
I try to brew at least once a month and remain alert to what is going on in
the National Homebrew scene.

I also am the director of the Colorado Brewers Guild (the state trade assn.
for Colorado Craft Brewers). Like Louis, I am a lawyer by trade. I am
interested in promoting the return of the American Beer Culture and try to
do what I can to be an advocate for American Craft Beer.
I am also involved in the guild's annual public tasting event: The Colorado
Brewers Rendezvous. Every July about 40 Colorado craft brewers gather by
the banks of the Arkansas River in Salida Colorado to celebrate our craft
and industry. The event will take place on July 1 this year. Please stop by
if you are in Colorado.

Thats about it. If elected I will try to represent the views of the
membership to the best of my ability.


Cheers,

- --John

John A. Carlson, Jr.
Voice 303-664-9096
FAX 303-665-4394
jac at iex.net




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Date: Sat, 13 May 2000 15:27:57 -0400
From: Jeff Renner <nerenner at umich.edu>
Subject: Request for CAP  thoughts

Brewers

I am writing an article on pre-pro lager/Classic American Pilsner for the
upcoming special Zymurgy issue, and solicit your thoughts on this great
style.  Brewing experience, judging experience (both as entrant and judge),
thoughts on the style, your non-homebrewing (and maybe standard comerical
beer drinking) friends' reactions when they've had it, anything else you
think I meigh like to hear about.

Thanks.

Jeff

PS - For Matt Arnold - I've been communicating with Ray Daniels on this,
which makes me feel he's really the one with the hand on the tiller.

 -=-=-=-=-
Jeff Renner in Ann Arbor, Michigan USA, c/o nerenner at umich.edu
"One never knows, do one?"  Fats Waller, American Musician, 1904-1943. 




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Date: Sat, 13 May 2000 16:38:37 -0400
From: "Jim Suggs" <suggs at pile.org>
Subject: Rust on stainless steel


So i've got a converted keg as a boiling kettle, and i'm 
starting to notice a little bit of rust inside.  This is
most probably due to harsh treatment; i'm not the kindest
person to my equipment.  I know stainless steel is supposed
to be passivated against such things.  I must have done 
something to depassivate it.

So here's the question: is there any easy way to re-passivate 
stainless?  I skimmed the article at brewery.org (it may have 
been by John Palmer, or it may not), and could only glean 
"oxidizing acids."  my personal favorite of these at work is 
nitric acid, but i don't feel compelled to bring that home and
monkey with it.

thanks,
 -suggs
corning, ny





Jim Suggs
Brewer, Centerfielder, Worker of the Thunder Broom.
suggs at pile.org
http://people2.clarityconnect.com/webpages4/jvsuggs/index.html



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Date: Sat, 13 May 2000 20:15:59 EDT
From: AKGOURMET at aol.com
Subject: Kiltlifter ale

I asked for a clone recipe for Kiltlifter ale in the last issue and sure 
enough, a HBDer pointed me in the right direction.  In the March 2000 issue 
of Brew Your Own magazine there is an all grain recipe from the brewmaster at 
Moylan's.  Can't get much better then that!

Bill Wright
Juneau, Alaska
www.gourmetalaska.com


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Date: Sat, 13 May 2000 21:22:17 -0400
From: phil sides jr <psides at technologist.com>
Subject: Re: custom bottle caps

"steve lane" <tbirdusa at hotmail.com> asks:

>I know that all of us have seen the overruns at the brew store and was
>wondering if anyone has found a source to have custom bottle caps
printed.

You would need to print millions to make it economical....

I work part-time in a BOP/Homebrew Supply Store and we are still selling
the Longshot 1996 (Boston Beer Company) overruns and have been since
1997 I think.  We buy them in huge lots so I know there are plenty left
still.

Phil Sides Jr.
Concord, NH



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Date: Sat, 13 May 2000 21:27:51 -0400
From: phil sides jr <psides at technologist.com>
Subject: Re: AHA Elections

Matthew Arnold <revmra at iname.com> wrote:

>plaid-girded Skotrat can't do it, no one can. I'm not an AHA member
currently,

Then you need not have an opinion as to who gets elected.

I don't mean to single you out Matthew, but I really do not understand
why EVERYONE reading the HBD is not an AHA member.  Has the AHA done
anything to hurt homebrewing?  Or have they done anything to hurt you
personally?  They may not be everything everyone wants them to be, but
on balance, I can't help but think they only help our cause.

Just my opinion...

Phil Sides Jr.
Concord, NH




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Date: Sat, 13 May 2000 21:37:28 -0400
From: phil sides jr <psides at technologist.com>
Subject: Re: Pigs Love Their Trough

"Phil & Jill Yates" <yates at acenet.com.au> writes:

>shelves strategically placed where one can rest his beer and have a fag

>whilst chatting at the trough.

Wow!  The visual I am getting...  I don't even want to get on that train
;-)

Phil Sides Jr.
Concord, NH



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Date: Sun, 14 May 2000 20:44:21 +1000
From: "Phil & Jill Yates" <yates at acenet.com.au>
Subject: Upsetting People And Repaying Friends

>At the Burradoo Hilton there are
>shelves strategically placed where one can rest his beer >and have a fag
>whilst chatting at the trough.

These were my own words and are probably way out of date. At times I suspect
I am nearly as far out of date as Dave Burley (don't worry Dave, you and I
will be left standing to have a beer together). Someone recently mentioned
to me they were going into Sydney to see Savage Garden.
 "Must be some display of noxious weeds" I concluded. Jill burst out
laughing and told me they are a pop band. Funny how the years get away from
you. I thought it was only yesterday I was "up with things" but suddenly I'm
just a middle aged silly old fart brewing his own beer.

By "having a fag" I did mean smoking a cigarette, and I mention this to
appease those who privately noted alarm that I was inviting private emails
from half of San Fransisco.
I guess I would be pushing the point to mention that once I was a gay young
bachelor?

Now I just know I am going to get another email from James Binkowski about
"off topic" posts (James doesn't post himself, but expects me to keep him
entertained, and gets most irate when I fall short of his expectations). So
before Jimmy can jump on his keyboard, can I mention my Ayinger yeast?

A tiny little sample was sent to me in a tiny little vial of sterile water.
All the way from the USA, compliments of The Artist Formerly Known As Kap'n
Salty. It had been in transit for a few weeks before it turned up in
Burradoo and so we were unsure of it's viability. I set about reviving it in
a 200ml starter and she was up and running in no time. Now fermenting
strongly in a three litre starter, it will be used to ferment this weeks
lager. Girls of the billiard room, look out for this one!! Wes Smith dug up
the following :

>Brauerei Aying has a long-standing reputation for >excellence in beer and
hospitality. Although Ayinger >Brewery was founded in a picturesque village
25 >kilometers from Munich in 1878, the site of the Ayinger >Gasthaus
Brewery Hotel has been one of Bavaria's most >famous restaurants for more
than 500 years.

Wes has dug up a whole lot more Ayinger info. We are both keen to give this
yeast a burl (sorry, that means "a go"). Something different from our usual
White Labs or Wyeast supply.

Many thanks to The Kap'n for sending this special yeast. Speaking of sending
things, I recently mailed to Ray Kruse a little something in thanks for his
skunk oil. Ray is dubious. Reckons if and when it shows up he's gunna shoot
it first and open the box later. What's he think I'm sending?
Honest Ray, it really is a bottle of Rice Lager. Please don't shoot it
first!

I feel a bit guilty because I promised Jeff Renner a bottle of Mudgee Mud a
year ago and still haven't honoured the promise. To make me feel even more
guilty, what I had saved for him endured many months in the fridge in a PET
bottle before it succumbed to consumption. But I blame Steve Alexander for
this. He got me so revved up about oxidisation I wasn't game to send a PET
sample to Jeff that had sat there for so long. You know what? It tasted
brilliant!
Sorry Jeff. And sorry Steve, I should have mentioned I was also a bit
thirsty.

Anyway, before I encourage another email from my mate Jimmy, I shall sign
off and will report on the results of my Ayinger yeast.

Cheers
Phil
Baron and Brewer of Burradoo
Safely North of Richard Pass
Very Safely East of Dr Pivo






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Date: Sun, 14 May 2000 09:19:36 -0400
From: Clark <clark at capital.net>
Subject: starting a  rhubarb 

Hi List,

Does anyone have an idea for an all-grainer using rhubarb or rhubarb with
strawberries perhaps?  I  have a huge crop  of it this year  and  I  began
thinking that it might not be too  bad in an ale of some sort.  I  tried a
cherry-raspberry ale last year, but I let it  sit too long in the secondary
and the flavor of the fruit suffered.  My  wife  usually adds lemon or
orange zest in the mix when she makes pies.  Would wheat or honey be a good
addition to a potential batch?  I  have  a Bavarian lager yeast saved from
a boch that I would like to use before it gets too warm in the basement.
Any suggestions would certainly be  appreciated.  I  usually go with 5
gallon batches.

One more thing.  I have a corny with ball-lock fittings.  The Williams
catalog states that pin lock and ball lock fittings are not interchangeable
on kegs.  I  can get more kegs real cheap, but they are pin lock.  Are the
hole sizes through the top of the keg different for each style?  Can I
change my ball lock to a pin lock by drilling out the holes if that is  the
difference?

TIA for the help.  

Dave Clark
Eagle Bridge, New York



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Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 11:54:07 +0200
From: "Francois Zinserling" <francois at designtech.co.za>
Subject: RevRims

Hi, William

I've been toying with the same idea (Reverse RIMS) for some
time now. Some benefits that I perceive are :
1. Improved heat transfer - straight RIMS has to push the heat
down into the mash, where RevRIMS would have better convection
upwards.
2. Improved flow-rates - which you have confirmed already.
3. Much smaller chance of a stuck mash.
4. Better flow around individual particles - the mash would form a
suspension of loose particles, where RIMS may cause channeling
(or rat-holing) of liquids.

No 3 is of concern : I thought the inverse may in fact be true, that the
liquid would find a straight path upwards, and not "cover all the particles"
as hoped for.

What are your experiences on this ?

Regards
ZING(ZA)



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Date: Sun, 14 May 2000 20:14:16 -0400
From: William Macher <macher at telerama.lm.com>
Subject: RevRIMS

Hi Francois and everyone,

Francois Zinserling wrote:

>I've been toying with the same idea (Reverse RIMS) for some
>time now. Some benefits that I perceive are :
>1. Improved heat transfer - straight RIMS has to push the heat
>down into the mash, where RevRIMS would have better convection
>upwards.

My guess is that as far as heat transfer within the mash tun, it is
probably about the same regardless of what direction the flow goes. But, if
you have high flow rate with a revRIMS than a conventional RIMS, then you
can input more heat per unit time into the liquid passing through your
heating chamber, and get quick temperature changes if you want them. 

>2. Improved flow-rates - which you have confirmed already.

This probably most important if you have a mash tun geometry that demands a
deep grain bed. My thinking is that if the mash tun had a large surface
area and shallow-depth grain bed, then recirculation rate would not be
limited the way it is in my converted keg mash tun, with its 16 inch diameter.

>3. Much smaller chance of a stuck mash.

At the end the flow is in the standard direction, down through the grain
bed. But since at that time as very slow flow rate is desirable, the stuck
mash does not seem to be an issue. It certainly was for me at the beginning
with normal RIMS flow direction, especially with wheat beers. 

>4. Better flow around individual particles - the mash would form a
>suspension of loose particles, where RIMS may cause channeling
>(or rat-holing) of liquids.

This seems to be true, at least intuitively. I am not sure how much
channeling actually occurs during the high flow period of a normal RIMS
since at that time the grain bed tends to compact somewhat.

>No 3 is of concern : I thought the inverse may in fact be true, that the
>liquid would find a straight path upwards, and not "cover all the particles"
>as hoped for.

My limited experience so far indicates that with reverse flow "stuck" is
still possible, but much easier to clear up if it happens. It seems that
the husks and light particles are the culprit with a revRIMS. Whaterver
tends to float, rather than sink, wants to be carried to the "false top"
and clog the holes in it, while the grains themselves tend to either stay
in suspension or fall back towards the bottom. I will have to take a better
look at this when I get time to do another batch. Almost certainly next
weekend!

>What are your experiences on this ?

>From what I see so far I am pretty happy with this revRIMS setup. It
performs, at least with respect to ability to recirculate at a high rate,
just as I was hoping my original RIMS would. Or more like, what I was
EXPECTING it to do. Digging out 20 lb. of soggy grain in order to clear a
stuck mash is not fun. I did that several different times on different
brewing days! Looks like those memories will fade fast now...

Hope this is of some help. 

Bill Macher   Pittsburgh, PA   USA



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