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	FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
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Contents:
  Wheat Flour Tropical Wit (craftbrewer)
  Spargers (Warren Wangerin)
  Re: Guinness, Pours, and wha wha wha what? ("Scott D. Braker-Abene")
  Re: Cornie help (Jeff Renner)
   ("Kim")
  Fermentap thing? (Kb9ve0)
  Re: Beer in D.C. ("Dan Dewberry")
  CO2 Refills (Epic8383)
  Cleveland (Rod Prather)
  Big Buck Brewery (Rod Prather)
  Re: Your post to the HBD re: Big Buck Brewery (Rod Prather)
  Nitro/CO2 pouring, Dont say sorry, Bret yeast,  Purity of Supply (craftbrewer)
  Morland's Old Speckled Hen (Rick Gontarek)
  High Output Gas Burners (Mjbrewit)
  Finally! ThunderMug Brewery [RIMS} up and running! (Wimpy48124)


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Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 17:03:11 +1100
From: craftbrewer at telstra.easymail.com.au
Subject: Wheat Flour Tropical Wit


G'Day All

Well I think you all know I'm not one to brag, BUT by crickey 
didn't I have a good brew day.  One of those days it all comes 
together. And I write this just after putting the fermenters into the 
fridge I'm that pleased.

Yes my wit was a success, lactic mash and all.  Firstly my use of 
50% wheat flour in the grist was not a fluke, (Krystal Weissen 
being my first).  Did it again, and to all those buggers waiting for 
'stuck mash', not a chance, even went smoother than my first 
attempt.

Then there's the lactic mash.  Did that 36 hours before the main 
day (5 % of the grain bill), and it went perfect. Strong smell of 
DMS when I  got it.  Tested it with the all singing and dancing 
ph meter, and perfect again, a nice 4.2.  And even the wort ph 
just before the boil was spot on. Right on 5.1, exactly where I 
wanted it.

Now to all those who offered advice about Wits and Lactic 
mashing to me about 2 months be prepared for something rare.

Thankyou one and all - I'm one happy chappy
Now I'm off to finsh my Krystal wiessen, and watch the wet set 
in

Shout

Graham Sanders

Oh

I'm that pleased I might even front SWMBO as have one of 
those rare special moments.

And I wont use a paper bag


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Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 01:01:01 -0600 (CST)
From: wewmrbeer at webtv.net (Warren Wangerin)
Subject: Spargers

Will the person who requested info on home made sparge arms please write
to me . I inadverdentaly deleted that issue & have lost his address . I
have made them successfully and are very simple .



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Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 06:07:22 -0800 (PST)
From: "Scott D. Braker-Abene" <skotrat at yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Guinness, Pours, and wha wha wha what?

Chris Swersey Writes: 

"Starting with a fresh keg of Guinness, I would put between 45 and 50
PSI using your 80% N2/20%CO2 mix, depending on your refrigerator
temp. At 40deg F, you could go as high as 53-55 psi (no higher). At
35 deg., you should be at around 45-47 psi (no higher). These
pressures are necessary to do two things. One, they maintain the
correct partial pressure of CO2 in the headspace necessary to keep
1.25 -1.3 volumes of CO2 in the beer.Two, elevated pressure like this
keeps the N2 that is dissolved in the beer from flashing off."

Chris... Commercial kegs clearly state that you should never exceed
40 PSI... pushing a commercial keg to that pressure just is not safe.
I would not recommend what you suggest. Guinness says serve between
38-42f anywhere between 30-40psi. I got that information from a memo
that is distributed by Guinness to their authorized Carbonics
dealers. 

Not trying to flame. I thought you post was excellent... Still it
lacked in the necessary plaid. 

C'ya!

 -Scott

"Sometimes quitting your job gives way to brewing" 

=====
"Life without Plaid sucks"

http://www.skotrat.com/skotrat - Skotrats Beer Page
http://www.brewrats.org - BrewRats HomeBrew Club

__________________________________________________
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Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products.
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Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 09:24:15 -0500
From: Jeff Renner <nerenner at umich.edu>
Subject: Re: Cornie help

Anthony Torrez <perpacity at hotmail.com> writes perceptively
>I hear about people using cornies as
>secondaries and cutting off the dip-tube so as not to suck up any yeast. I
>was wondering what the result would be if you left the full length tube
>intact, and after a reasonable secondary fermentation (2-3 weeks), if one
>could just siphon off a glass or two (maybe more?) of very sedimented beer,
>and essentially remove the sediment from the beer. It seems like it'd work.

I've been meaning to write about this as this is exactly what I do. 
I hate to mutilate a dip tube.  I started kegging in 1/4 barrel 
Sankeys and still use both Sankeys and Cornies, and while I've since 
heard of people cutting the tubes of even a Sankey, this never 
occurred to me.  The first glass or two is indeed turbid, but then 
it's clear sailing, so to speak.  I often will rack once more to a 
purged clean keg so that I have a sediment free keg.  You have to be 
sure to stop racking as soon as you hear the keg blow so you don't 
rack over sediment.  This way I have even taken kegs to parties.

Jeff
- -- 
 -=-=-=-=-
Jeff Renner in Ann Arbor, Michigan USA, c/o nerenner at umich.edu
"One never knows, do one?"  Fats Waller, American Musician, 1904-1943


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Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 08:45:59 -0600
From: "Kim" <kim at nconnect.net>
Subject: 

>>It is plumbed in with 1/2 or 3/4 inch galvanized pipe

To my knowledge, gas is always plumbed with either black pipe or flare
copper fittings. Galvanized pipe can flake thus causing many problems.

I am using two 110,000 btu heating units from instantaneous water heater.
Had to do some creative hard soldering (brazing) to connect to .5" flare
fittings. Works like a champ. Should be able to get them from most any
plumber.

Kim Peterson



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Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 10:46:37 EST
From: Kb9ve0 at aol.com
Subject: Fermentap thing?

 I have only been getting HBD for a short while so this may have been 
discussed recently. I saw the ad for the fermentap and thought it looked 
good. I then read somewhere else that it didn't work with 6.5 gal carboys. 
Does anyone use this? Does it really work with 6.5 carboys? Any comments on 
it in general? It would seem to me to only be worth it if it works with 6.5s 
so you could have enough room to brew 5 gal batches and allow for foaming. ( 
I suppose one could brew 4 gal in a 5 gal carboy but who wants to brew less 
beer?)  
also 
I asked about secondary in a corny a while back and got lots of replies. I 
of  5/8 tubing over the gas side fitting and putting a small (don't know size 
# ) stopper and airlock right in the tubing. This works great if you cut the 
tubing so its just long enough to put over the fitting and get the stopper 
in, otherwise the airlock leans over.
Thanks and happy brewing
Andy 
Bedford IN


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Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 09:33:57 -0600
From: "Dan Dewberry" <dandew at netzero.net>
Subject: Re: Beer in D.C.

Last year we went to John Harvard's & Brickskeller.  John Harvard's Brewpub
is near a metro stop downtown (1299 Pennsylvania Ave.  tel:783-2739) and has
good beer & excellent food.  A MUST is a bar called Brickskeller.  It's in
the northwest corner of the downtown area (1523 22nd St. N.W. tel:293-1885)
near a metro stop & also has excellent food.  They have over 500 beers !
Enjoy!

Dan & Joelle Dewberry
Austin, Texas

> HOMEBREW Digest #3487              Sat 25 November 2000
>
> Date: Fri, 24 Nov 2000 07:02:57 -0800 (PST)
> From: "H. Dowda" <hdowda at yahoo.com>
> Subject: Beer in D.C.
>
> Are there any good brewpubs in the Washington, DC
> area? Will be in the NW/Georgetown area.  No car, near
> metro.
>
> Harold



____________NetZero Free Internet Access and Email_________
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Request a CDROM  1-800-333-3633
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Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 15:19:57 EST
From: Epic8383 at aol.com
Subject: CO2 Refills

     I use a fire supply company to refill my CO2 tanks, they fill by weight 
and also do the required hydrostatic testing when necessary. They're also 
conveniently located near the hockey rink, so I drop off the empty, win a 
game, and pick up the refilled cylinder on the way home.
      Gus, Long Island, NY


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Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 14:11:56 -0500
From: Rod Prather <rodpr at iquest.net>
Subject: Cleveland

I'm gonna be spending several weeks in Cleveland.  Although I am familiar with
the area I have not found an abundance of brew pubs there.  The one down on the
Flats closed shop.  Too bad, good brew.

Any suggestions????
- -- 
Rod Prather, PooterDuude
Indianapolis, Indiana




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Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 14:57:19 -0500
From: Rod Prather <rodpr at iquest.net>
Subject: Big Buck Brewery

I was in Pontiac Michigan last weekend.  This is an evaluation on a brewpub in
the Rennerian Woods.  The Big Buck Brewery.  Just walking into this place gives
the feeling as to how far brew pubs have gone.  This is a Cathedral to in house
brewing.  It's huge!  A mega-micro so to speak.  The tall cathedral ceiling and
knotty pine post and beam design gives you the feeling that a higher being
brought this place to life.  It is reminiscent of a German Bier Hall gone North
Woods.  Trophy bucks and wooden animal carvings grace the hall.

The brews?   Well, I only tried 7 of I believe 15 that they had on tap.  I
focused on the specials.  I tried the Red Bird Ale and Raspberry Wheat, both
house standards.  My choice of specials were the Belgian White, the Grand Cru,
the Porter, Unfiltered IPA and the Stout.  

The raspberry wheat and the Redbird ale were uneventful if not rather plain. 
Nice, clean but nothing to write home about.  This made me glad that I focused
on the special brews.  

The Belgian Grand Cru ABV 8% plus.  This Cru was quite tasty but lacked the
sweetness and mouthfeel that I find typical of this style.  Simply too light for
a Cru. Not really bad but off style IMHO.

The Porter was very nice. not overly hopped with distinct overtones of
chocolate.  Very nice taste with no off flavors, astringency or bitterness often
found in porters.  Clean and distinct.  Highly recommended. 

The Unfiltered IPA is quite different.  Wonderful but not a typical IPA.  It has
an cloudy unkempt appearance.  The Hopping level was excellent with a slight
nose.  A broad and bold IPA.  VERY NICE.

The Belgian Wit was my favorite.  Wonderful, with a distinct sourness yet fully
flavored.  The Saaz, orange and coriander were all distinguishable with the
coriander lingering in the aftertaste.  Excellent taste. Great balance.  Highly
recommended.

I also tried the Stout.  It was the last tasting and I was a bit on the tipsy
side.   After the six 5 oz tasting glasses of 6.5% plus ales my objectivity was
beginning to suffer.   I found it very nice and would try it again.  Like the
porter, it relied heavily on a fine balance of the dark grains.  True to an
English stout it was hearty had the increased mouthfeel and body compared to the
porter.  Wonderful flavor.  Worth a try.

If you are around one of these places, check it out.  The brewer seems to be
quite talented judging by the house specials. Kudos!!!!  A worth while
experience.  I believe they have 3 in Michigan and 1 in Texas.  The house beers
appear to be non descript, built for mass appeal of their more than adequate
flow of diners.  The specials are just that, special.....  a treat for the lover
of fine beers.   The food is very good and on par with the specials.   Skip the
onion fingers.  Try the Bruchetta.   

Once again, no affiliation, just a good brew.
- -- 
Rod Prather, PooterDuude
Indianapolis, Indiana



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Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 20:50:22 -0500
From: Rod Prather <rodpr at iquest.net>
Subject: Re: Your post to the HBD re: Big Buck Brewery

With regard to my post on the Big Buck Brewery.  I was reminded that the
Rennerian Woods and The Land of the Janitors are generally co-incidental.  
Sorry for the oversight guys.  Wish I had such a fantastic example of brewery
art in my North 40.  
- -- 
Rod Prather, PooterDuude
Indianapolis, Indiana


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Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2000 23:11:48 +1100
From: craftbrewer at telstra.easymail.com.au
Subject: Nitro/CO2 pouring, Dont say sorry, Bret yeast,  Purity of Supply


G'day All

Well I have decided to grow web feet.  Normally up here with 
the build-up to the wet we will get our thunder-bumpers for a 
couple of days, then fine weather a week or two then  the cycle 
repeats again and again til the Monsoon hits (then it susposed 
to rain).  But not this year - No well into the fouth week and its 
still coming down. A record wet is looming. 

But onto beer related matters. There was a lot of talk about 
how to get the "The Surge" in a Stout, and in fact it has 
been well covered by the posts how to do it with a gas cyclinder 
with a 80/20 mix.  But there is another way people. (Yes Nth Qld 
brilliance to the fore).  Now I'm not a great fan of stouts, or nitro 
pouring but very occasional a nitro pour is in order.  But what 
does one do when he doesn't have the gear.  Try this.

Firstly get your keg to serving temp. Then adjust the CO2 
pressure to 25 KPA. Once stable I visit a mate with a Nitrogen 
cyclinder he uses for welding.  His regulator sits at at 200KPA. 
Yes thats right I gas up my keg (with a very simple fitting) with 
his gas. (and the maths is of course a nice 75/25.  Now its 
right Nitrogen is not very soluble, so it only requires a second 
visit when the keg is say half empty. The rest of the time I use 
CO2 to push out the beer. 

And how do I get "The Surge" .  I just roll up some fine stainless 
steel wire (termite mesh) and shove it up the spout (of the tap). 
That breaks up the flow fine.

So to other poor unfortunate souls

Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2000 13:21:09 -0700
From: John Adsit <jadsit at jeffco.k12.co.us>
Subject: Speaking for others

In the last HBD, I apologized for the anatagonistic response 
someone sent to Sean's tongue-in-cheek posting.  I dared to 
speak for the group, assuming that people would have no 
problem with that.  I have been told in rather blunt fashion that 
I should not have done so.  I am therefore going to apologize for 
speaking for those of you who appreciated the antagonistic 
eponse.  I should have let you speak for yourself.<<<<<<<

John dont chicken out now mate. You did speak for the group, 
and thank God you did.  I'll back you all the way mate (as for 
the majority of HBDers).  In fact those poor sods who feel the 
need to pressure you want to have a go - well mate put them 
onto the Foreign Affairs Minister for North Queensland.  I can 
arrange a Frontal Labotomy for all those poor deluded chaps (I'm 
also the Minister of Health in case you didn't know). One last 
thing - dont apologise - sh+t I don't. You can always seek 
asylum in utopia.
 - --

>>>Date: Sun, 19 Nov 2000 23:57:58 -0500
From: "Fred L. Johnson" <FLJohnson at worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Culturing Brettanomyces lambicus

Anyone have any suggestions for the best way to culture this 
beast?  Or should I pitch the yeast into this wort with the 
undissolved calcium carbonate?<<<

Now Fred, as my plans for world beer domination with my 
Longing for a Longon Lambic are delayed, I do have time to 
comment on this one.  Firstly if you are going to use this little 
blighter (Bret) in your wort, DONT add CaCO3.  After all that 
acidity is exactly what you after in the final product.  seems silly 
to add Brett otherwise. As for storage well that depends.

If its sterile water storage of the Bret, well it doesn't need 
CaCO3.  remember the bugger is dormant, so no acid is being 
produced. But if you have yeast stored on a slant, on in a liquid 
wort for future use, well a pinch of CaCO3 is a good thing for 
medium storage. As you said, you want the yeasy healthy for the 
next batch. But it wont disolve you say.  Big deal, it just needs 
to be there to react with the acid that is produced.  It will disolve 
(or more accuately react) as it is needed. 


Now dave

Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2000 00:18:31 -0500
From: dave at freshops.com

Subject: dirtclod brown ale

As we were breaking 200 pound bales of whole hops into smaller 
packages the other day, we pulled a 2 oz. dirtclod out of the bale. 
That reminded me of the dried out chicken leg we found in a bale 
a few years ago. Metal picker parts, nuts and bolts, cigarette butts, 
hop twine, all part of life during hop harvest that occasionally end 
up in the final product. At least you can see what you've got with 
whole hops. Pellets?<<<<<<

And how bloody true this is.  Its a bit like buying take away 
chinese food.  Yes it might have the local dog mixed in but how 
can you tell (is that fried rice or fried lice). At least whole 
ingredients you can pick out the odd dead sparrow, or what 
ever.  Makes me think of that poor chap who swapped his bag 
of grain because of one expunged bird.  Then uses pellets with 
probably part his mate ground up in it. And he worried about 
what the bird would do to his beer. (bet that contaminated bag 
of grain was still used or sold)

I tell you if everyone saw what happened to get from 
planting/birth to your plate, you would immediately become 
self sufficient.

Shout

Graham Sanders

Oh

SWMBO is remarkably nice to me this morning.  She might be 
happy, but me having to actually look at her enjoying herself 
has scarred me for life.






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Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2000 08:33:00 -0500
From: Rick Gontarek <rgontare at bellatlantic.net>
Subject: Morland's Old Speckled Hen

Hi All,

I just harvested the yeast sediment from a bottle of Morland's Old Speckled
hen, and I was wondering if anyone knows anything about this strain.  Have
any of you ever brewed with it, or is it similar to any commercially-
available strain?  Any  info you could provide me with would be appreciated.

Thanks,

Rick Gontarek
Owner/Brewmaster
The Major Groove Picobrewery
Trappe, PA
Rgontare at bellatlantic.net



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Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2000 11:32:12 EST
From: Mjbrewit at aol.com
Subject: High Output Gas Burners

To the individual seeking high output natural gas burners.  An obvious 
reminder.  if you will be using it indoors, do not forget to vent and use a 
high quality carbon monoxide detector.  I made a self inclosed mini furnace 
out of steel shelving brackets.  Basically, I fitted my burner and stand 
inside a shell of brackets and screwed on sheet metal to the sides 
essentially creating a mini metal box or furnace.  The entire top of the keg 
sticks out the top to monitor the boil and add hops.  I vented the box on one 
bottom side with an exhaust port (drier tubing) putting an inline fan at the 
placed in a nearby window and turn both the inline and box fan on.  This also 
vents the steam created.  My basement does not get overly cold in the winter 
even with the fan on as the steam created produces a lot of heat to offset 
the venting.  

Carbon monoxide can be a big problem.  My four stove burners created enough 
carbon monoxide once to set of my detector.  The higher the output the more 
deadly gas.  So don't forget to vent.   


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Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2000 22:12:50 EST
From: Wimpy48124 at aol.com
Subject: Finally! ThunderMug Brewery [RIMS} up and running!

    After 14 months of dreaming, planning, building, and argueing [pleading 
and whining] with SWMBO,  the ThunderMug Brewery [RIMS] is up and running. 
I've put 4 batches though it in the last week and as the more I brew with it, 
the more I get a handle on and reduce the learning curve problems. 
First the system: 
 -Two tier with three 1/2 barrels with 3 propane burners
 -Unistrut framing
 -All stainless 1/2 " piping, most from USAPIPE.com, great prices [1/2" S.S. 
ball valves about $13]
 -High temp pump, RIMS chamber, quick disconnects, and norpene hoses from 
MovingBrews.com
 -MaxiChiller from PBSbeer.com [GREAT!! chiller, but I'm still waiting for my 
180*
 -Mashmate 1600 controller from Paragon Brewing.  It was a long time coming, 
but it seems to have been well worth the wait. 

    It's like being a kid again, I want to brew on this everyday except for 
SWMBO standing in the way. Also 3 primarys and one secondary full, I guess I 
should control myself a bit! There's been a few problems {my first batch , an 
Amber ale I chilled down too far to 53 degrees, my second  was a Weizen, A 
two hour total boil, I wasn't looking in the kettle and I managed to boil it 
down from 7 1/2  to 3 gallons] and I've got to make a check list for as I go 
along to keep track of things. 
    The pump works like a dream once I figured out  what to do to pump 
boiling wort through it. After reading about the problems others have had 
pumping boiling liquids I figured that with my luck I'd be SOL!!! Anyway, the 
first time I tried different things that others said to do and nothing 
worked. I finally shut down the pump, opened the valve over the kettle, 
grabbed the transparent hose and VERY carefully [ I don't know how to phrase 
this without getting alot of grief ] !!!   I applied suction trying to create 
a slight vacuum in the piping. Whatever, it worked great. I circulate boiling 
wort through the system and the MaxiChiller for a 1/2 hour for sanitization. 
The pumps flow with boiling liquid is as good as cold liquid. Of course with 
Murphy's law I'll no doubt have problems with it next time!!!
    The Mashmate 1600 works great , the only problem I have is that I got my 
heating element from Movingbrews and it's a 4500w element [220v, I'm not sure 
what it is at 110v] but mashmate 1600 will take a 5500w element [220v which 
at 110w is 1500w]   and to get  to temps I have to turn on the gas. The 
element will hold the temps though. I bet that a hotter element would do the 
job. Also warmer weather would probably be easier on it but it's best to 
learn on colder days. Just one more factor to figure out .
    All in all a pleasure to use and for what it's worth IMHO the MaxiChiller 
and the Mashmate 1600 are well worth it. 
    Lastly, any ideas for a single fermenter to ferment 10 gallons in? I had 
planned to get some 10 gal. cornys but there aren't any out there anymore


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