---

	FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
		Digest Janitor: janitor@hbd.org


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Contents:
  Covered in Soot (RBoland)
  We are not adrift (craftbrewer)
  Soot ("Bret Mayden")
  Florida Beer - Real Ale Fest ("Ray Daniels")
  RE: Soot from Propane Burners ("Max Brandenberger")
  Couple of things (p.smith)
  Dry-Hopping Technique ("Tom Williams")
  Danstar London (Home Brewer)
  Gott Coolers ("james suchy")
  Re: Soot ("Eric and Susan Armstrong")
  Problem. (Rod Prather)
  Beer on planes ("Doug Moyer")
  shameless plug (KMDruey)
  Roasted Barley Question... ("Greenly, Jeff")
  Re: Advantage of Performing a Mash-Out ("Houseman, David L")
  Simple sanitizing solution... (Cerveza Real)
  Re:Wayne Aldrich ("J. Kish")
  RE: Mashing out ("Stephen Alexander")
  re: mashout again ("Stephen Alexander")
  Re: Soot (Demonick)
  re: headspace and carbonation ("Stephen Alexander")
  Beer carried on airplanes ("Kevin Jones")


* 
* Beer is our obsession and we're late for therapy!
*
* Bluebonnet Brew-Off Entry Deadline is 2/25/01!
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JANITOR on duty: Pat Babcock and Karl Lutzen (janitor@hbd.org)



----------------------------------------------------------------------


Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2001 01:00:29 EST
From: RBoland at aol.com
Subject: Covered in Soot

Al is covered in soot from his propane burner, or concerned that he will soon 
be.  I have two suggestions.  

First, adjust (open) the air damper on your burner to eliminate as much of 
the yellow flame as possible.  Yellow flame indicates formation of slow 
burning carbon particles -- soot -- which cover everything.  Additional air 
will improve combustion efficiency, improve heat output, and reduce soot.  A 
good blue, or lighter, flame is what you want.  Stop just as the blue flame 
lifts off the burner, then close it down just a bit.  Noise will increase 
also as flame turbulence increases.

Second, talk to a professional chef or visit your local restaurant supply 
shop.  They can get you a product which removes soot from kettles, etc. like 
crazy.  You've still got to watch where the rinse water goes, but your 
equipment will be clean and bright again.

Bob Boland in STL.   


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Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2001 18:50:31 +1100
From: craftbrewer at telstra.easymail.com.au
Subject: We are not adrift

G'day all
/
Yes I am still around and more on lurk mode at the moment. 
Trying to catch up on back issues and you can tell that when 
I read this
/
Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 22:41:09 +1100
From: "Phil & Jill Yates" <yates at acenet.com.au>
Subject: A Note For The Aussies
I think it a grand idea to run a local Ozzie HBD but
let us not cut ourselves adrift from our worldwide brewing 
companions.
/
/
Now this comes from the biggest sh+t-stirer to ever fly our 
airways. here's a man ready to shove you down the dunny 
trench if you turn your back on him, and he is now all 
matey matey when everyone has left him. Oh you poor boy, you 
almost sound like the kis with the cricket bat and ball and no 
one comes out to play.
/
Now yes I can agree with Mr "I cant really brew a beer unless 
someone else does it for me" when he says
>>>>>Personally, in the last couple of years I reckon the HBD 
has been more fun than a hat full of ars_ holes. 
I take my hat off to Pat and Karl for keeping it all together.<<<<
/
And a scream it has been. Now I to take my hat off to Pat 
and Karl. I never realised in a million years how much work all 
this digesting is. You lot over there should appreciate what 
they go thru. I certainly do now since the OZ-CDB is now up 
and running.
/
Thats why people I am more in lurk mode. Its taking up so 
much of my damn time (but it has advantages too - I'm too tied 
at sleepy bow-bows time to perform for SWMBO, Thank GOD.)
/
But no peach-face, I am not addrift. the OZ-CBD is there for 
aussie to take about local issues, just as HBD does and the 
UK-Digest. Its there also to take about brewing in its simpliest 
practical form. The HBD will always be the point of reference 
when we want a scientific explaination about brewing.
/
Shout
Graham Sanders
/
oh you lot
/
Yes I will be back. Once our website settles down, I will be 
back to bug everyone. Having Phil as you reference source 
of all things Australian is like having having Bush as reference 
to all things American. yes he is one, but not all there!!!/
/ 
And earth shattering news has come to hand 
/
A new species of spider has been discovered in 
North Queensland. Now this baby is even more deadly than 
the Sydney Funnel-web, making it the deadliest spider in the 
world. 
/
yet another present i should mail to some out there.


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Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2001 01:55:47 -0600
From: "Bret Mayden" <brmayden at keytech.com>
Subject: Soot

Al Pearlstein posted: "Lookin' for advice on how to eliminate the excess
amount of soot produced from my propane-powered cajun cooker. "

Are the flames on your burner yellow?  If so, you don't have enough air in
the air/gas mixture being delivered to the burner.  I don't know the
specific configuration of a cajun cooker, but on any propane burner you
should have an adjustable vent on the gas line.  You start out with the vent
fully closed, light the fire, then slowly open the vent until you just
minimize the yellow flames.  Ideally, you should have nearly 100% blue
flames.  Also, crud in the gas line & burner itself can restrict the flow of
air being entrained with the gas.  I did not use my propane cooker for
several weeks during the summer, and when I  did fire it  up, got big yellow
flames & soot.  Adjusting the vents did not help.  Eventually found a spider
web blocking nearly half the diameter of the burner input tube.  Of course,
the occupant had perished, but spiderwebs are amazingly tough!  Cleaned out
the crud & all was well in brewland.


Bret Mayden
Oklahoma City




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Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2001 05:06:31 -0600
From: "Ray Daniels" <raydan at ameritech.net>
Subject: Florida Beer - Real Ale Fest

Spencer notes the finding of good beer in S. Florida at the Titanic brewpub
and puzzles over which beers said brewery might be sending to the Real Ale
Festival March 1-3 in Chicago.  Well puzzle no more!  I have checked the
deepest recesses of my whirling magnetic media domain to discover that
Titanic brewer Jamie Ray will indeed be sending his nice smoked porter as
well as a beer called "Titanic Boiler Room Nut Brown Ale."

Of course in addition to the Titanic beers, visitors to the Real Ale
Festival will find more than 230 other beers from across the country:  165
cask-conditioned and 71 bottle-conditioned (just like homebrew!) beers.
Also we have a real ale homebrew competition on Thursday night.  Volunteers
welcome.

Don't come whining to me if you miss it!

Ray Daniels
Real Ale Festival Organizer
E-mail: raydan at ameritech.net
Web: www.realalefestival.com

Don't Miss RAF 2001, March 1-3, Goose Island Wrigleyville, Chicago, IL
More than 160 casks of award-winning ale from America and Britain
It's a Firkin Great Beer Festival!



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Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2001 06:27:43 -0600
From: "Max Brandenberger" <maxb at austin.rr.com>
Subject: RE: Soot from Propane Burners

Al,

You shouldn't be getting any soot from your propane burner. Depending on the
type of burner, there should be an air mixture adjustment. You want to
adjust the air mixture until you get a completely blue flame. A yellow flame
indicates a lack of oxygen and incomplete combustion, which is likely the
source of the soot on the bottom of your brew kettle.  Additionally,
incomplete combustion produces carbon monoxide, which is VERY dangerous if
you are brewing in an enclosed area such as a garage or basement. That's
why, even if you have the air mixture properly adjusted, you should always
use a propane burner in a well ventilated area.

Another thought also comes to mind. If your burner has an air adjustment,
but you still can't get a blue flame, you may be using a burner that is
designed for natural gas instead of propane. Natural gas and propane burners
have different sized gas orifices to allow for the proper air/gas ratio. If
you for some reason have the wrong one, that could be the source of your
problem.

If your burner is not adjustable, then I would seriously consider replacing
it with one that is. Not only will a properly adjusted burner keep your
equipment from getting sooted up, but it will reduce the risk of a dangerous
carbon monoxide buildup.

Hope this helps!
Max Brandenberger



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Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2001 08:50:05 -0600
From: p.smith at gooseisland.com
Subject: Couple of things

A couple of thoughts on a couple of things:

RE:  Diacetyl and Czech Pilsners.

I might be wrong, but if my tasting memory serves, I have never felt
diacetyl to be a proper component of Czech pilsners (indeed, any lager with
even a whiff of diacetyl is suspect, in my mind).  During respiration, many
lager strains pickup a great deal of sulfur, but butter which remains in the
finished product is, in my view, a glaring fault.

Re:  Dextrose agar and propagation

The only thing yeast that will grow on dextrose agar is amyloytic
Saccharomyces, formerly S. diastiticus.  It will mean a super-attenuated
beer, with a host of off-flavors typical of wild yeast contamination.  Avoid
it for propagation, use it to sample for contamination.  I'd suggest YM
agar, or, in a pinch, Universal Beer Agar (UBA).  Or, if you are cheap like
me (and cannot obtain either of the above gratis), go to your local asian
food store, obtain raw agar-agar, boil 80 g/liter of wort, autoclave
(pressure cook at 15 psi/121C for 15 minutes) and voila, you have wort agar!
(it will not differentiate at all - observe colony morphologies, and
scrupulous standard sanitation/prop. practice).




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Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2001 10:00:49 -0500
From: "Tom Williams" <williams2353 at hotmail.com>
Subject: Dry-Hopping Technique

Greetings Homebrewers!

I come asking advice on dry hopping techniques.  I am an extract/steeped
specialty grain brewer, and I have been using whole hops in the secondary
for dry-hopping.  I put the hops in thin cloth bags (the ones I presently
use came from Hoptech), and they just float on top.  I think I am not
getting good utilization from these hops.

My last batch was an ale, OG=1.045, FG=1.011.  I put in 1 oz E. Kent
Goldings (plugs this time, but I usually use whole hops), 0.5 oz in each of
two bags.  I bottled this batch yesterday, and there was considerably less
hop flavor and aroma than I would have liked.  Also, the hops seemed to
still have ample flavor and aroma in them.

Before I set about solving this problem by just adding more hops, I would
like to hear from those who put the hops in the secondary loose.  I have not
done this to avoid the problem of trying to strain out the hops.  I do put
bittering hops in the boil loose, and this has worked out fine for me. I
just strain them into the fermenter, and any material that I miss usually
settles out.

Are loose hops in the secondary a big PITA?

Thanks,
Tom Williams
Dunwoody, Georgia


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Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2001 10:38:51 -0500
From: Home Brewer <cynthia.howe at sympatico.ca>
Subject: Danstar London

Rob Moline reports that my favourite yeast, Danstar London, is (going) out 
of production. A local homebrew shop has some dated 03/98 which I was going 
to let him keep, but I may have to reconsider and corner the market!

For others that are fond of this yeast, Yeast Lab A03 "London Ale" appears 
to be an identical strain, and has the added bonus of forming a firmer 
cake, which will be of interest to those who prime in bottles/kegs.

Unfortunately, Yeast Lab products are no longer easily accessible to me 
either. Does anyone know if Wyeast has an equivalent?

Cheers,

Tim Howe
London, Ontario



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Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2001 11:37:06 +0500
From: "james suchy" <grayling at provide.net>
Subject: Gott Coolers

Nathan Matta <whatsa at MIT.EDU> wrote on Fri, 09 Feb 2001 

A) plan on a separate vessel for heftier batches,
B) supplement big beers with extract, or
C) get a larger cooler and sparge slower to offset the poor extraction?

I use a 10 gallon Gott (Rubbermaid cooler for my mash/lauter tun.  I have a
slotted copped manifold (another job whipped out by the trusty dremmel tool)
in the bottom and I made a bulkhead fitting with a full port 3/8" ball valve
and assorted hardware.

I love the 10 gallon Gott.  I can do 10 gallons of 1.055 Pale Ale with ease.
 I have done a 5.5 gallon batch of barleywine (1.100) in the same but I needed
~2lbs of DME to bring it up (my fault....sparged too fast).  All in all I get
70% efficiency routinely.  I realize this may not be optimal, but it works for
me.

A good friend of mine Craig Wolfangel (don't hold his Ohio heritage against
him) has two Gotts, a 5 and a 10 gallon.  He uses the 5 for 5 gallon normal
gravity batches (~1.055) and the 10 is used for big beers or double batches.
 He appears to get better efficiency with the 5 gallon than I would on a very
similar beer which appears to come from the taller grain bed.  

So all of your suggestions have merit.  It's up to you to decide how to go.
 I like having one multi-purpose tun that serves 98% of my needs.
  
>What is the problem with deeper grain beds?  I would
guess that deep beds suffer from compression and stuck sparges.

This may happen, but I have never had it happen even with wheat laden beers.
 It seems that the false bottom/manifold has a lot to do with it.  YMMV

By the way, I got most of the information for my tun from a website put up by
Robert Aguellero (sp?!).  My link for that site no longer works.  Robert, if
you are out there and still have this site, let us know where it is.  It was
really helpful when I constructed my tun.  

Cheers!

Jim Suchy
(I was at (0,0) Rennerian last night drinking his historical beers!)
http://www.provide.net


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Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2001 11:01:18 -0600
From: "Eric and Susan Armstrong" <erica at isunet.net>
Subject: Re: Soot

Soot is the result of TOO little combustion air for the amount of fuel being
burned.  Find a way to increase the amount of combustion air entering the
burner or decrease the amount of fuel and you should fix the problem.


Eric A.


Al Pearlstein WROTE:

Greetings:

Lookin' for advice on how to eliminate the excess amount of soot produced
from my propane-powered cajun cooker. I've all ready wire brushed the
exterior of the unit but I'm still getting a large coating on the bottom and
bottom quarter of my brew pot. I'm thinking that there must be some kind of
buildup in the line. I would appreciate any advice on how to alleviate this
messy situation.

By the way, if you happen to encounter soot on your pot, gently, AND I MEAN
GENTLY, wipe it off with a wet towel. Do not, I repeat DO NOT, try to spray
it off with your your water hose. This will cause the soot to disperse all
over your brew cleanup area. The soot is very difficult to clean up at that
point. It seems to get over everything floor to ceiling. And the first thing
I thought about after I did this was: Hey, now there's a real good Stupid
Brewers Trick.

Cheers,

Al Pearlstein
Commerce Township, MIichigan




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Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2001 12:59:25 -0500
From: Rod Prather <rodpr at iquest.net>
Subject: Problem.

This is off topic but I feel it is important.  Someone in the HBD community has
picked up a worm that is being shipped around to HBD members.  IT IS NOT BEING
TRANSMITTED VIA THE HBD.  Rather through outside emails.  The email is title
"Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs, The Real Story".  It carries and attachment
named ADWARF4YOU.EXE.  Do not open it.  If you have opened it you can find
relief at http://antivirus.cai.com/cgi-bin/ipe/connect.cgi   I have recieved two
of these in less than two weeks.  I would normally not send such a warning but I
feel this one is affecting our community specifically.  

Now back to our regularly scheduled beer chat.
- -- 
Rod Prather, PooterDuude
Indianapolis, Indiana


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Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2001 19:23:59 -0500
From: "Doug Moyer" <shyzaboy at yahoo.com>
Subject: Beer on planes

John Baxter Biggins <jbbiggin at med.cornell.edu> mentions:

"I have it on good authority that wrapping each bottle with a
sweat-sock (clean, I imagine) does wonders in preventing breakage."

Dirty socks will not prevent breakage? I'm not sure I understand the physics
here...

Brew on!

Doug Moyer
Salem, VA

Star City Brewers Guild: http://hbd.org/starcity

"There is a very fine line between 'hobby' and 'mental illness.'"
     ~ Dave Barry




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Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2001 19:56:03 EST
From: KMDruey at aol.com
Subject: shameless plug

I'm auctioning some brewing equipment on ebay if anyone is interested, thanks.

10 Gallon Vollrath Kettle w/3500W Electric Element (similar to a Bruheat)
http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=558768536

1.5" RIMS Copper Heat Chamber w/4500W Electric Element
http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=558772452

21.5 Quart Pressure Cooker - sterilize equipment or pcook first runnings.
http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=558779305

HLP Medium - Test for nastys as described in Fix's book.
http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=558774859

Hanna Dissolved Oxygen test kit
http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=558776857


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Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2001 22:22:26 -0500
From: "Greenly, Jeff" <greenlyj at rcbhsc.wvu.edu>
Subject: Roasted Barley Question...

Hello, fellow brewers...

	I recently found myself in need of roasted barley for the stout that
I will be making at the end of next week. I went to the local shop here in
town and asked for roasted barley, and was handed a 1 lb bag of, "Munton's
Roasted Non-Malted Black Barley." I asked the owner if this was the same
thing as the Roasted Barley specified in the recipe I'll be using; he didn't
know (it's not a homebrew shop, but a gourmet food shop with a homebrew
section) and his son, who is a homebrewer, didn't seem to know either. Well,
for $1.50, I went ahead and stuck it in the bag, but I am not quite sure
what this is, what it is for, and whether I should even consider putting it
in my stout. The kernels appear uncracked and quite black in color. So what
do you all think?

Jeff


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Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2001 21:48:21 -0600
From: "Houseman, David L" <David.Houseman at unisys.com>
Subject: Re: Advantage of Performing a Mash-Out

Kevin White says:

"The purpose of high-temperature mash-out is to fix the wort carbohydrate
profile by stopping all enzyme activity (hence the high temperature). If
you aren't that worried about the exact fraction of your wort extract that
is fermentable, then don't worry about a mash-out. Enzyme activity will
continue in the brewpot until the wort temperature reaches 185F or so,
giving you a bit more fermentables. "

Pardon me but I don't understand the logic.  One the one hand you say "The
purpose of 
high-temperature mash-out is to fix the wort carbohydrate profile by
stopping all enzyme activity (hence the high temperature)." On the other you
say "Enzyme activity will
continue in the brewpot until the wort temperature reaches 185F or so,
giving you a bit more fermentables."  

Since mashouts are typically performed in the 168oF-172oF range, and all
activity doesn't stop until about 185oF, then mashing out doesn't stop all
enzyme activity.  Rather it simply more favorably supports Alpha Amylase
rather than Beta resulting in a beer with higher dextrins, greater
body/mouthfeel.  If you sparged directly from mid 150s to a kettle over the
fire, then enzyme activity would cease sooner and without the added Alpha
Amylase action.  It would seem that the thought that a mashout stops enzyme
activity is another widespread momily.

David Houseman




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Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2001 22:44:27 -0600
From: Cerveza Real <cervezareal at prodigy.net.mx>
Subject: Simple sanitizing solution...


 Tired of rinsing sanitizing agents? Worried about residual bleach forming
clorophenols in your bottled beer? Think your cleaning agent leftovers are
destroying your head?
In case you had not thought about it, just toss the bottles in the oven!
 Try rinsing your bottles a soon as they get served, to avoid the hassle
derived from that nice cheesy, fungus infested yeast slime. But if you get
it there, simply dump them in a tank with a bleach solution for a couple of
days and rinse with tap water. Drain the bottles and let them dry out well
to avoid salt stains from the baking. Then just place them horizontally
stacked in rows in the oven and turn it on at 230F, or just above 100C, for
20 minutes and shut off the oven. Just let them sit, because it will take a
while for them to cool down (usually well over an hour in these climates)
and this guarantees they'll be almost sterilized. Take them out and use them
as soon as you can handle them, and you can be sure they will
be fairly well sanitized.Now depending on the size of your oven you can fit
enough bottles to pack 5G's or 10G's, or you can have some basic oven custom
made for those homebrewers with larger systems. You can also use this oven
for roasting grain and malts, which are always best freshly toasted and
milled!

Merry bottling!

 Willis Carey
 Cerveza Real Brewmaster
 Mexico





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Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2001 21:50:35 +0000
From: "J. Kish" <jjkish at att.net>
Subject: Re:Wayne Aldrich

Congrats on getting rid of the bottles and going
'Draft' with your brew.  There is nothing like it.

 After siphoning the brew to the Corny, I always
bubble some CO2 backwards into the picknic faucet,
with the Corny lid loose on top. This causes lots
of foaming as the CO2 bubbles up through the beer.
 I fasten the Corny lid down over the foam. There
is no air inside the Corny now; All CO2!  Now, I
pressurize to about 20 Lbs.  In a couple days, the
beer has almost two volumes CO2, and perfect.
There is no need to shake the tank unless you are
in a hurry. (Drink your other beers)
 Now, I lower the pressure to a normal 12 psi, with
CO2 from a welding shop. It dosen't get any better!

       Joe Kish



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Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2001 02:39:19 -0500
From: "Stephen Alexander" <steve-alexander at worldnet.att.net>
Subject: RE: Mashing out

Dave Houseman writes ...

>there are two reasons to mash out,
[...]
>One is that at the higher temperature [...]
> the viscosity of the wort should be lower [...]

Yes, but the implied explanation isn't quite right. The change in flow
properties is not primarily due to change in the sugar-water sol'n viscosity
with temps, but  to denatured proteins at mashout temps.  Better flow after
the proteins are denatured.

>Second, at 168oF-172oF the Beta Amylase[BA} enzymes are
>very denatured but the Alpha Amylase is still active so you
>will produce additional dextrins [...]

Right result, but explanation ... The amount of BA activity difference after
a 1hr mash during a 158F vs 170F lauter is quite small.  Altho' MO does
denature BA faster this has very little impact. (gotta complete the E-K
series and show a numerical example).

That the temp boost causes some starch to be released from the grist and
that this starch will mostly produce dextrins is true.  I've seen studies
[WARNING - the Surgeon Genial has determined results from journals will turn
your beer to megaswill]  which measure the fermentability of wort as it is
drawn from the lauter tun.  Once corrected for gravity it becomes clear that
there are more fermentables and maltose per unit extract in first runnings
than latter runnings.  Not only does mashout decrease fermentability
slightly but sparging does too.

The reason that higher temp mashouts aren't performed is that that much
higher and you will get too much residual starch.

Also there is a foam/head retention rest temp around 72C/162F.  If you are
having head/foam problems this is IMO more important to your beer than the
few% extraction improvement or the small change in dextrin levels.

 -S





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Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2001 04:19:16 -0500
From: "Stephen Alexander" <steve-alexander at worldnet.att.net>
Subject: re: mashout again

Kevin White writes ...

>The purpose of high-temperature mash-out is to fix the wort >carbohydrate
profile

You determine the carbo profile by selecting mash times and temps.
Mashout releases an extra 3-5% extract (more with less well modified malt)
much of which ends up as unfermentable dextrins.  This extraction, is the
big difference.

After any reasonable mash schedule most of the BA is gone.  The 5-25%
remaining is inhibited by the maltose and limit dextrins (product
inhibition) and the rate of catalysis is reduced by the low concentration of
substrate left to act on.  If you boost the mash from say 66C to 76C for a
mashout you double the BA activity in the mashout wort and also have given
it more starch substrate to act upon.  You've also increased it's rate of
denaturation by a factor of 4 or 6 or so, which is a lot, but nearly
balances the increased activity and substrate factors.     Do the math for
this period and you'll find that the amount of maltose produced by BA in
this end-phase is similar w/ or w/o mashout.

>by stopping all enzyme activity (hence
>the high temperature).

Nah - You can get complete conversion of malt with mash-IN temps of
80C(=176F) and almost so at 85C(=185F) !!  These temps aren't enough to
shut-down alpha-amylase before conversion completes, and that's the point of
a mashout.

 -S





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Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2001 08:58:29 -0800
From: Demonick <demonick at zgi.com>
Subject: Re: Soot

From: Althelion at aol.com
>Lookin' for advice on how to eliminate the excess amount of soot produced 
>from my propane-powered cajun cooker. I've all ready wire brushed the 

Your propane/air mixture is too rich.  You need more air or less propane.  
Open the air vent to adjust the flame to all blue, or just barely tinged
with yellow.  At high flow rates you can "blowout" the flame.  If your gas
outlet hole is too big, with the air vent opened all the way you may not
attain the proper flame or you may induce "blowout".  I had to replace the
jet on one of my cajun cookers with one with a smaller hole.  You may also
be able to drill one out yourself given the proper fitting. If you decide
to go this route drill the hole too small to start with, then test it.  
You can always drill it out more.  

I have 2 different kinds of cajun cooker, rockets and ring burners.  The
cheap cast ring burners are FAR superior to the rocket type. 

Domenick Venezia
Venezia & Company, LLC
Maker of PrimeTab
(206) 782-1152  phone
(206) 782-6766  fax orders
demonick at zgi dot com
http://www.primetab.com

FREE PrimeTab SAMPLES! Enough for three 5 gallon batches. Fax, phone, or 
email: name, shipping address (no P.O.B.) and phone number. (I won't 
call. It's for UPS in case of delivery problems). Sorry, lower 48 only.



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Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2001 23:14:00 -0500
From: "Stephen Alexander" <steve-alexander at worldnet.att.net>
Subject: re: headspace and carbonation

chris buck writes ...

> I don't like the pressure-inhibition model because I'm skeptical
>about the idea that CO2 bubbles form in the bottle during priming.

One could argue diffusion instead of bubbles, but when you write ...

>[...] So high and low fill bottles should both
>reach similar headspace pressures at similar levels of carbonation.

I completely agree, but the experiments consistently don't so there is
something wrong with the explanation.


>Along the same lines, I get the impression that kegged beer
>becomes carbonated in just a matter of days - not the weeks
>it takes for a high-fill bottle to carbonate

Right.

>Which brings up yet another experiment!  The CO2 bubble model might
>be testable as follows:  high-fill two bottles then leave one upright
>and lay one down on its side.

I like it.  I'll go to the effort of bottling a couple bottles for this
purpose next weekend.

>In my understanding, if glucose concentrations fall
>below respiration-inhibiting concentrations (<0.4%) and there is O2
>available to the yeast, then they can aerobically metabolize ethanol.

Right, but my subjective analyzer (tongue) indicates that the yeast in the
overfilled undercarbonated bottle have failed to ferment all of the
fermentable sugars (sweet).  So I strongly suspect a failure to ferment is
the issue.  Why - I don't know.

>Presumably the yeast ate up all the glucose in the beer during the
>gluttonous orgy of primary fermentation.

Uhhm - yes, but on the rare occasions that I prime I use some form of
glucose rich priming sugar at about 0.6% so the glucose inhibition is back.

>So what's to stop the yeast in a bottle half-filled
>with air from chewing on the ethanol in the finished
>beer?
[...]
>Could aerobic fermentation of ethanol give enough
>extra CO2 to account for exploding bottles?

My back of the envelope calc is that if an entire bottle volume contained O2
at equilibrium w/ atmospheric (abt 2.2psi partial pressure) and all of this
was used for aerobic fermentation it would only add about 0.05 volumes of
CO2 - you wouldn't notice it as excessively carbonated.  I'm just looking at
the CO2/O2 diffs from anaerobic to aerobic fermentation.  Even if you assume
all of the molecular O2 (0.15vols at equilib) was converted to CO2 you'd
just get the 0.15 vols as CO2.  Maybe noticeable, but not vastly different
in carbonation.  I don't think aerobic fermentation can be the cause.

I'll also admit Chris, that I don't have any wonderfully satisfying answer
to this paradox either.

 -S





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Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2001 22:33:25 -0600
From: "Kevin Jones" <mrkjones at mindspring.com>
Subject: Beer carried on airplanes

I saw some articles recently on the subject of taking homebrew on airplanes.
I'm an airline pilot but when I'm not flying you will find me brewing.  I
have often taken bottles of homebrew with me on trips to give to friends and
family.  For anyone out there already thinking anything about drinking and
flying -- stop right now!  We take that very seriously and it is a rule I
have never broken, never come close to breaking and don't know anyone that
has.  Sorry for the Dennis Miller tyrant, but my job and hobby always raises
an eyebrow and it should not.   Back to the subject at hand.

The only thing I worry about when taking beer with me in my bag is
breakage.  You are allowed to bring alcohol on board so long as it is sealed
by the manufacture ( that's you!) and is not open on the plane.  The reg.
really says "No alcoholic beverages may be served to passengers other than
those provided by the carrier (airline)."  This is intended to prevent
drunk and disorderly conduct on the plane.  The airlines love it because
they get 4 Bucks a drink and 3 Dollars for AB swill.  So back to my concern,
breakage.  Put each bottle in one of your socks you are taking along anyway.
They will be clean going out (better be) and coming back...well the beer
should be gone by then.  If you check your bags with the beer, first give
them a drop test.  A waist high toss of about 6-8 feet to concrete should
do.  What you say?  The bottles will break!  If so, your packing is
insufficient.

A couple of other items.  You may have some trouble at the security
screening
 check point (the x-ray machine for checked bags).  They may ask to look in
your bag
and may want to know what's in the bottles.  Beer is ok.  They are looking
for liquids that a hijacker might try to use.  You might guess what types of
liquid that might be.  Come
to think of it, beer might work better than a gun or flammable liquids.
Instead of threatening
me with the gun, just bribe me the homebrew and I'll fly
you wherever you want to go.  Just kidding. Please don't quote me on that.

As for pressure changes, the max pressure chance in the theoretical is 14.??
psi.  If your bottle of keg has about 13 psi at serving temp, that's about
20 psi
something at room temp.  Therefore the max pressure possible is about 34
psi, no problem for a good bottle.  In reality the pressure in the
cabin/baggage compartment is about 75% of sea level pressure giving you a
bottle pressure of about 25-30 psi., again no problem.  If you are flying in
an unpressurized plane at say 8000 feet above sea level, this turns out to
be the same as a pressurized jet at 35,000 feet.

As for the State to State rules governing homebrew, I live by this rule. "It
is easier to beg for forgiveness than ask for permission".  All the
homebrewers I know are very responsible.  No one is try to skirt ATF laws or
rules.  We, as homebrewers, seem to be the only people aware of the laws
governing our hobby and we go out of our way to obey those same rules.
Those rules are left over from a time gone by, the spirit of which was never
intended to apply to what we consider -- just a hobby.

Drink Better Beer!
Kevin Jones




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