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FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
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Contents:
Watering hops; Oakland (EdgeAle)
My 1961 Kelvinator ("Thomas D. Hamann")
Fermentation Ester Production/Oxygenation ("Campbell, Paul R SITI-ISEP-3")
new to kegging (Ballsacius)
Cutting Stainless ("Pannicke, Glen A.")
Re: Chillers ("Pete Calinski")
RE: problems culturing Chimay yeast ("Laborde, Ronald")
Temperature controller + fridge == true love! ("John Zeller")
Ranco Temp. Controller ("Bob Hall")
An alternative to RIMS (The Freemans)
Guinness draught, widgets etc ("Curtiss Norheim")
Agave Mead (stpats)
Re: Hydrometer correction ("Drew Avis")
Re: Cold room problem (GASNER)
Munich Musts ("Jim Busch")
Brewer or Zymurgists? ("Jeff Beinhaur")
Re: Infusion Calcs / How To Brew Hardcopy Available (John Palmer)
Hoppy Halloween Challenge ("Susan Ruud")
Wish I had thought of this ("Jack Schmidling")
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Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 01:56:42 EDT
From: EdgeAle at cs.com
Subject: Watering hops; Oakland
HBD
Two things...
1) My hops look anemic. I know they often don't produce much the first year
but they haven't even grown all the way up their rope yet. I think I am not
watering them enough (I grew up in a place where water just fell from the sky
and haven't quite got the hand of So. Cal. yet). How much and how often
should I water my hops? You can assume that they get no rain.
2) I will be in Oakland next week. Any advice from loacla about good beer
places downtown (no car) would be appreciated.
Thanks,
Dana Edgell
- ------------------------------------------
Dana Edgell
Edge Ale Brewery, Oceanside CA
http://ourworld.cs.com/EdgeAle
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Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 15:38:18 +0930
From: "Thomas D. Hamann" <tdhamann at senet.com.au>
Subject: My 1961 Kelvinator
Hi to the Collective (sound quite Soviet don't it!).
I've got a problem with my (1961 Kelvinator) beer fridge that once was
quite capable of maintaining selected temps between 0 deg C and 10 deg C.
It now never gets below 4 deg C and also fluctuates from the setting that I
would like it to stay at. Do you know if I can disable the fridge
thermostat and replace it with a Jaycar unit that i have sitting in a box
or is my fridge stuffed or is it low on refrigerant or something like that?
Is Forrest out there maybe?
thanks in advance
Thomas
(ruelps)
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 10:41:40 +0200
From: "Campbell, Paul R SITI-ISEP-3" <Paul.R.Campbell at is.shell.com>
Subject: Fermentation Ester Production/Oxygenation
Chaps,
I posted the following link previously:
http://www.breworld.co.uk/the_grist/9804/gr2.html
It relates the experiences of Shepherd Neame branching out into the
production of a Weiss Bier. The salient points to note are that they allowed
fermentation to rise from 20C to 25C and that they had a disappointing level
of ester production (iso-amyl acetate is specifically mentioned as this is
responsible for the banana aroma). This was solved by "controlling the
relationship between oxygen levels and yeast counts". What was particularly
interesting to me was that they discovered that they had overpitched in
their initial trials. This was despite the fact that they had pitched at a
rate of 0.5 million cells per ml - which is low compared to some of the
figures quoted here in the past.
Interestingly this appears to back up much of what has been discussed here,
specifically:
1) Oxygenation is essential for yeast growth with low pitching rates
2) Yeast growth results in higher ester production (so not good for "clean"
lagers)
My question on all of this would then be that if one were making a clean
lager style, should you pitch huge but NOT oxygenate (the latter to
discourage yeast "growth")? I suspected that the answer was that it probably
just doesn't matter... but maybe there could be a concern that the yeast
don't eat up all the oxygen because they don't need it for growth, causing
problems later in the life-cycle. Hmmm... CSA anyone?
My understanding on the Zinc front was that it aided healthy fermentation,
rather than affecting the growth phase, so it seems its use is consistent in
Dave's technique.
Is this where you're coming from Dave?
Paul Campbell
Gelnesk
Scotland
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 07:39:59 EDT
From: Ballsacius at aol.com
Subject: new to kegging
I have finally had it with botteling and want to take the kegging plunge. Any
help would be appreciated. Thanks in advance.
Bob Fesmire
Madman Brewery
Downingtown,PA
Ballsacius at aol.com
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 08:49:47 -0400
From: "Pannicke, Glen A." <glen_pannicke at merck.com>
Subject: Cutting Stainless
Carroll writes of Cutting Stainless:
>There is a simple and elegant answer to the noise problem and to the
>question of blade life. Remove the central fitting and fill the keg with
>water. The water will dampen (pun intended) the noise and also cool the
cut
>area and thus prevent hardening of the SS.
Good idea. I'm not too keen about water and electricity, but I guess the
tool is far enough away. Another advantage to this is that the weight of
the water should keep the keg from "walking" while you're working on it. I
had to brace the keg with 2X4s and pipe clamps to keep it solidly in place.
Now only if I could do the same to my 1 year old...
Carpe cerevisiae!
Glen A. Pannicke
glen at pannicke.net http://www.pannicke.net
75CE 0DED 59E1 55AB 830F 214D 17D7 192D 8384 00DD
"I have made this letter longer than usual,
because I lack the time to make it short." - Blaise Pascal
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 09:35:13 -0400
From: "Pete Calinski" <pjcalinski at adelphia.net>
Subject: Re: Chillers
John Brumley asked about chilling.
I chill in two stages with my immersion chiller. First I run tap water.
Then when the rate of cooling slows because of the smaller temperature
difference, I switch to stage two. I have a bottling bucket that I load
with ice cubes and the blue ice packages (and anything else in the freezer
that doesn't have to stay frozen). I fill it with water and then run the
cooled water through the immersion chiller. I typically quit when I get down
to 60F or so.
Hope this helps.
Pete Calinski
East Amherst NY
Near Buffalo NY
***********************************************************
*My goal:
* Go through life and never drink the same beer twice.
* (As long as it doesn't mean I have to skip a beer.)
***********************************************************
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 08:52:45 -0500
From: "Laborde, Ronald" <rlabor at lsuhsc.edu>
Subject: RE: problems culturing Chimay yeast
>Date: Tue, 28 Aug 2001 17:59:55 -0700 (PDT)
>From: Rama Roberts <rama at eng.sun.com>
>
>Any suggestions? I've got a friend who is having similar problems with
>Orval yeast.
I have been having success by using Chimay bottles with the cork date no
more than three months. Wait until you see a new delivery, and just start
checking the corks until one appears.
Also, I now use a stir plate and with the young bottle date, in about 2
days I have very noticeable yeast buildup.
Ron La Borde
Ronald La Borde - Metairie, Louisiana - rlabor at lsuhsc.edu
http://hbd.org/rlaborde
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 07:15:19 -0700
From: "John Zeller" <jwz_sd at hotmail.com>
Subject: Temperature controller + fridge == true love!
On August 28, Dan wrote:
"If you are going to do this, get the Ranco Temperature Controller with the
adjustable differential (Northern Brewer, among other places, sell it). Then
just set the differential to 1 degree" (snip)
Dan,
Setting the differential to 1 degree will shorten the life of your
refrigerator compressor. The purpose of the differential is to reduce the
rate of the on/off cycles. A couple of other things I have learned from
experience. You need not immerse the temp. probe in the wort. You can
simply tape it to the wall of the refrigerator and measure the air
temperature. Yes, I know, the air temp. will not necessarily be the same as
the wort temp. but it will be very close as soon as the vigorous
fermentation slows in a day or two. The large thermal mass of the wort
keeps it's temperature very stable and changes occur slowly. The cycling of
the refrigerator, even with the differential set at 3 degrees will not
significantly influence the temperature of the wort. You can verify this by
measuring the temp of the wort directly. If you change temp. settings, you
will need allow a lot of time for the wort to adjust (24 hours seems to do
it for me). The big advantage here is keeping the probe out of the wort and
reducing the chance of contamination. Hope this helps some.
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 11:01:37 -0400
From: "Bob Hall" <rallenhall at hotmail.com>
Subject: Ranco Temp. Controller
I recently dedicated a freezer for fermenting and lagering, and found the
Ranco heating/cooling digital temp. controller (Ranco #ETC-111000, Grainger
#3ZP77) on the grainger.com website. Since Grainer sells only wholesale (I
tried to order directly), I went down to the corner hardware and had them
order it for me. Price with shipping and tax was still under $60, which I
thought was a good savings. Be aware that the unit comes without external
power cords, so you'll need to open it up and follow the simple directions
for power in/load out. Since I needed an extension cord anyway it was just a
matter of cutting, stripping and attaching.
Bob Hall
Napoleon, OH
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 10:12:35 -0500
From: The Freemans <potsus at Bellsouth.net>
Subject: An alternative to RIMS
Since I use a heat exchanger rather than an element in the wort stream,
the temp is really very constant on the output side. The heat exchanger
I use is efficient enough that the wort temp out is virtually the hot
water temp in. Flow rate can be nothing but a trickle all the way to
uninterrupted and that temp stays the same. Precision Brewing Supply
makes and sells the Maxichiller I use. This is an all copper
counterflow chiller which I made into a heat exchanger by substituting
hot water from my HLT for the normal cold water needed to chill. It
simply works in reverse - heating rather than cooling. The efficiency
for either chilling or heating is near 100% of whatever liquid you run
through the thing for heating or cooling. 155 degree water in - 155
degree wort out. I tried the traditional RIMS with an inline element
and immediately decided (after many $ and much time) that I just didn't
want to do it that way.
http://www.pbsbeer.com/pbs/pbscat.html. NAYY
With an inline element any disruption of the flow will spike the temp up
to and including scorching it. Using the inline system the reaction
time for the controller must be almost instantaneous to shut the element
down as soon as the temp spikes.
I know of no reasonably priced thermocouple/PID system capable of such a
reaction time.
The whole point of the heat exchanger is to eliminate that spike in
temp. Couple that with the fact that I use a continuous mash mixer (or
stirrer if you wish) and I have a system that closely mirrors commercial
breweries. Even they have temp variations throughout the mash and
settle for "average" temperatures.
In my case the "best" location of the thermocouple is directly under the
center of the false bottom. I would think it obvious that each system
is unique unto itself and the builder must learn when to do what and
where to put what strictly from trial and error.
Just my take on the whole subject.
Bill Freeman aka Elder Rat
K P Brewery - home of "the perfesser"
Birmingham, AL
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 11:19:45 -0500
From: "Curtiss Norheim" <curtis.norheim at gets-1000.com>
Subject: Guinness draught, widgets etc
Hello all i am new to this digest and also to the home brew arena. I am
planning to start home brewing soon with the help of a long time brewing
friend. my beer of choice is Guinness Draught so I will attemp one of the
clone recipes and the kegging method.
I was wondering about the possibility of reuseing the Murphy draught bottles
with the widgets inside and a pressurized bottleing device for a convienant
mobile version. anyone tried this?
Thanks
Curt Norheim
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 12:49:38 -0500
From: stpats <stpats at bga.com>
Subject: Agave Mead
I want to thank Don Van Valkenburg at SteinFillers for he did indeed
introduce agave nectar to homebrewing. If you have never tasted this
stuff you will be amazed at the currant, prune, raisin flavors.
I would like to correct a couple of misconceptions about agave nectar.
First light agave nectar tastes nothing like corn syrup. The solids
of light and amber agave nectar are 90% fructose (fruit sugar) not
glucose (corn sugar). Fructose, glucose, and table sugar (sucrose)
have very different flavors. The light nectar is used by A-B in
Tequiza.
Secondly, agave nectar keeps just fine at room temperature. even
though it is about 76 Brix. This led many, including me initially,
to incorrectly believe it needs to be refrigerated in storage. This
is based on the fact that honey needs to be 81 Brix to keep.
However, it isn't Brix (% solids by weight) that matters but rather
the concentration (number of particles/liter). Small sugars, glucose
and fructose, make up only about 70% of honey solids compared to 90%
fructose of agave nectar. The net result is that 76 Brix nectar
must have about the same number of molecules as 81 Brix honey.
Lynne O'Connor
- --
St. Patrick's of Texas Brewers Supply
512-989-9727
www.stpats.com
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 17:59:19
From: "Drew Avis" <andrew_avis at hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Hydrometer correction
About 3 weeks ago the ever helpful A.J. deLange posted the ASBC method for
hydrometer correction, based on gravities measured in degrees Plato.
A.J., what's the best way to convert my answer from Plato back into SG,
given that I've also used your formula for SG to Plato (from HBD 3204):
P = -616.989 + 1111.488*SG - 630.606*SG^2 + 136.10305*SG^3 ?
Thanks again for the great info!
Drew
- --
Drew Avis, Merrickville, Ontario
Visit Strange Brew with Drew: http://www.geocities.com/andrew_avis/
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 14:27:10 EDT
From: GASNER at aol.com
Subject: Re: Cold room problem
The air coming out of any typical (?) air conditioning cooling unit is near
to 100% saturated at the temp. of 'that' air. It mixes with the lower
humidity, higher temp air in your house (or cold room). If the coil temp ever
gets below 32deg then the water freezes and eventually the whole unit freezes
up. (Just run the fan then with the thermostat turned up and it will melt and
drain off and you will be back in business.)
By the time your particular cold room walls and contents are cooled to the
thermostat temp, the air is near 100% humidity. Hmmm.
I assume that you are draining off the condensed water as you speak of
putting a trap in the drain line to prevent entry of room air.
1. This may sound silly, but you 'could' buy a small dehumidifier unit and
place it into the cold room. Run the drain line out of the room. You might
have trouble with it freezing up as it will not have been designed to work at
such a low temp. If you happen to have one, or have a friend who has one, try
it!
2. You could also try duct-taping a piece of cardboard over 1/2 to 3/4 of
your cooling unit. (or taping shut some of the louvers). This will make it
less efficient. That is the goal!!! Instead of having a large volume of,
say, "60 deg 100% satd. air" flowing through it, you will have a small volume
of, say, "40 deg air 100% satd. air" flowing through. When the 100% saturated
40 deg air mixes and warms up to 60 deg, the humidity will drop.
Method 2 would probably be the easiest to try, should probably work, and
shouldn't cause any trouble. With the insulation that you have in place, it
won't be running all that much so I wouldn't worry about 'loss of efficiency'.
Earl L. Gasner
gasner at aol.com
>Date: Sat, 25 Aug 2001 06:08:39 -0500
>From: John Wilkinson <jandjwilkins at earthlink.net>
>Subject: Cold room problem
>I have been putting together a brew house using a 14X28 storage
>building. One end, about 7 feet, is walled off to form a cold room.
The walls are double with two layers of R13 insulation. The attic has
blown in insulation and the floor has R19 insulation. I used vapor
barrier insulation in the walls and floor and additionally have plastic
sheet under the floor insulation to hold it in and perhaps provide more
vapor barrier. The floor is plywood with heavy commercial tile on it.
The walls are "green rock" gypsum board with bathroom type slick wall
board glued to that. The seams are caulked and the edge against the
floor is caulked. The ceiling is a layer of ceiling tiles stapled to
furring strips with a layer of 1/4 inch plywood on top of that and
another layer of ceiling tiles. The reason for two layers of ceiling
tiles is the weight of the insulation was making the original ceiling
sag. So much from assurances from Lowe's that the ceiling would be
strong enough to support the insulation. The seam between the walls and
the ceiling is not caulked. Anyway, there is no vapor barrier in the
ceiling as my understanding was there should not be. The attic is
vented at each end.
>A professional refrigeration unit provides the cooling with the
evaporator unit hanging from the ceiling. These are common in cold
rooms. Anyway, my problem is with humidity. I have been fighting mold
and found the humidity to run from about 85 to 90 percent. I can't
figure out why. I checked the drain pan of the evaporator unit and it
does not have standing water. I put a trap in the drain pipe to prevent
humid air from outside entering. The insulated door seems to seal
tightly judging from closing it against air pressure. This room must be
much more sealed from outside air than a house and the house maintains
50 percent humidity. I can't see why the refrigeration cycles don't
draw the excess humidity out of the air. I have tried temperatures from
70 to 55 F with the same results. Is it too tightly sealed? Not
tightly enough? I am stumped.
>John Wilkinson
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 14:32:41 +0000
From: "Jim Busch" <jim at victorybeer.com>
Subject: Munich Musts
<Going to Munich for O'fest from Sept 30th to Oct 8th. Other than the
<Tents and my favorite Klosterbrauerei Andechs, are there any other
<"must sees" ?
Speaking of Andechs, I understand they now have an outlet downtown
near the Hofbrauhaus.....anyone know the actual location? Yummm,
I can almost taste those sweinenhaxn now!
I would highly recommend a trip on the S Bahn to Perlach, to visit
the wonderful Forschungsbrauerei. They produce one of the best
biers in Bavaria, St Jocobus Blonder Bock served in earthen
Masskrugs. Also, whenever the weather is good I actually prefer the
quiet beirgaardens to the Ofest. Augustiners outlets at Arnulf Str
just off of Hackerbrucke and also at the Hirschgarden are well
worth a visit as is the original Stube just south of Hackerbrucke.
There are also several biergaardens throughout the Englishergardens
that are worth a visit. I picked up a nice pocket guide to the
biergardens in and around Munich last time I was in town which is an
excellent resource, keep an eye out for this type of thing in the
book stores or brewery outlets.
Prost!
Jim Busch
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 15:17:04 -0400
From: "Jeff Beinhaur" <beinhaur at email.msn.com>
Subject: Brewer or Zymurgists?
How about instead of those two, "Minister of Divine Fermentation".
Yes you to can become an ordained minister in the Beer Church. Check out
www.beerchurch.com
Not affiliated, yada, yada, yada..... Just found it to be fun.
Jeff Beinhaur, Camp Hill, PA
Home of the Yellow Breeches Brewery
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 14:00:46 -0700
From: John Palmer <jjpalmer at gte.net>
Subject: Re: Infusion Calcs / How To Brew Hardcopy Available
Hi Group:
Matt asked where to find Infusion Calculations.
You can find them at www.howtobrew.com/section3/chapter16-3.html
These are the same as those found in Promash, with the exception of a
heatloss term for the lauter tun. I specify preheating the cooler with
boiling water to minimize heatloss, while Jeff incorporates a term in the
equation to account for it. Either way, you get nearly the same answer, +/-
a degree.
***
Speaking of How To Brew...
(Drumroll please....okay, that's enough)
My book, How To Brew, is finally available in hardcopy! Yes, the 2nd
edition, containing a bit more info than the first, is now available from
several retailers and online at the following:
Brewer's Rendezvous www.bobbrews.com
The Homebrewery of California www.homebrewery.net
and at Promash www.promash.com
The books just arrived last week, coinciding with the arrival of our third
child, so the distribution is just getting off the ground. I am sure you
will see it in more brewshops later this year.
Um, let's see, it's 400 pages, with lots of illustrations, and the cover
price is $16.95
Thank you.
John Palmer
Monrovia, CA
homepage
http://www.realbeer.com/jjpalmer
How To Brew - the online book
http://www.howtobrew.com/sitemap.html
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 21:24:22 -0700
From: "Susan Ruud" <susan_ruud at ndsu.nodak.edu>
Subject: Hoppy Halloween Challenge
Call for Entries
4th Annual Hoppy Halloween Challenge - 2001
BJCP/AHA Sanctioned Homebrew Competition
The Prairie Homebrewing Companions are hosting the Hoppy
Halloween Challenge Homebrew Competition for its 4th year.
We accept beers in all 26 BJCP/AHA styles
including meads and cider. We've added a special category for a
Halloween Theme beer with a worthy prize.
The PHC invites you to send your beer to Fargo, to
participate in the Hoppy Halloween, compete against some of
the best beers in the country and perhaps win one (or a
bunch!) of our wonderful prizes.
3 twelve ounces bottles per entry) of beer or use ours:
Send your beer so it gets to our Registrar between Sept 22
and Oct 5 at this address:
The PHC % Dave Trautmann
1914 10th St N
Fargo, ND 58102
(701) 237-0756
Oh, we must ask you to include a little money to cover our
costs. The first four beers you enter are $7.50/each and
all entries after that are $5.00/each.
For additional questions and all the details, visit:
http://www.linkup.net/users/dtrautmann/phc2001.html
If you're in Fargo, ND around Oct 27 be sure to join us for
the Best-of-Show ceremonies, always a great time!
Competition Coordinator,
Karl Gunderson
E-mail: kgunders at microsoft.com
Home: 701-282-4966
Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 21:19:42 -0500
From: "Jack Schmidling" <arf at mc.net>
Subject: Wish I had thought of this
Must reading.... stick it out to the end.
http://www.asciimation.co.nz/beer/
js
ASTROPHOTO OF THE WEEK http://user.mc.net/arf/weekly.htm
Home Page:Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Sausage, Videos http://user.mc.net/arf
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