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	FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
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Contents:
  Maturex/Theakstons ("A. J. delange")
  Ringwood yeast and Middle Ages Brewery ("Pete Calinski")
  Min / Max time for starters ("Michael O'Donnell")
  Too much wort aeration and too much yeast not good? (G C)
  Cocoa Beans ("David Craft")
  Roll-around cart for CO2 cylinder (David Towson)
  Newbie questions ("Mark BitzMart")


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Date: Sat, 02 Nov 2002 12:42:29 +0000
From: "A. J. delange" <ajdel at mindspring.com>
Subject: Maturex/Theakstons

Let me rephrase the question. Who will be the first homebrewer in the US 
to try this stuff? I can't say I remember Andy's posts on this but that 
was years ago.

In response to a couple of other comments - I doubt that we'll see it 
(Maturex) any time soon on homebrew supply shop shelves so I'm guessing 
the experimenters will be those with a close relationship with a 
commercial brewery i.e. one that will "lend" a homebrewere a couple of 
cc (I think the dose is 7 cc/bbl). And no, it should have no power to 
remove diacetyl - only to prevent its formation.

* * * * * * * * * * * * *

Paul mentioned the proximity of Theakstons and Black Sheep and the 
similarities in their processes. The similarity in process goes beyond 
proximity: Black Sheep was started by members of the Theakston family. 
Unfortunately, Theakstons has been purchased by one of the Big Five and, 
as is so often the case under these circumstances, the beer has 
suffered. O.P. was a truely world class beer a few years back. A visit 
to those environs about a year and a half ago revealed an O.P. that was 
a ghost of its former self. On a more recent visit it seemed to have 
come back part way but still wasn't what it used to be. I'm hoping the 
trend will continue. Note that the bottled stuff they export never was a 
good representation of the draught product.

Cheers, A.J.



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Date: Sat, 2 Nov 2002 10:01:36 -0500
From: "Pete Calinski" <pjcalinski at adelphia.net>
Subject: Ringwood yeast and Middle Ages Brewery

Peter A. Ensminger said, "I never would have guessed that McDuff's uses the
same yeast as Middle Ages."

A few years ago I was talking to one of the brewers from Middle Ages
Brewery. (I was trying to "siphon off" his recipe for Impale Ale.) For what
it is worth, he said that his Ringwood yeast was not the same as the
commercial Ringwood yeast.

Pete Calinski
East Amherst NY
Near Buffalo NY


***********************************************************
*My goal:
*      Go through life and never drink the same beer twice.
*     (As long as it doesn't mean I have to skip a beer.)
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Date: Sat, 02 Nov 2002 09:33:20 -0800
From: "Michael O'Donnell" <mooseo at stanford.edu>
Subject: Min / Max time for starters

At the urging of this list, I am beginning to make yeast 
starters.  Unfortunately, I find that it is rarely convenient to do so; I 
usually don't know that I will have time to brew until the night before or 
morning of brew day.

My questions: how long can I keep a, say, 1 quart starter if I make it and 
then realize I won't be able to brew when I thought?  How soon before 
brewing is too late to bother with a starter?  If I realize 12 hours before 
that I will be brewing the next day, will that help at all?

thanks,
mike
Monterey, CA



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Date: Sat, 2 Nov 2002 12:13:53 -0800 (PST)
From: G C <gsd4lyf at yahoo.com>
Subject: Too much wort aeration and too much yeast not good? 

I've read opinions here and other places indicating
that pitching a lot of yeast and aerating the wort as
much as possible are both ways to improve beer
quality, but I haven't seen much data given. When
using pure oxygen, isn't it possible to over-aerate?
Can't too much yeast have a negative impact?    

I mention this because in the October BYO, Ashton
Lewis, master brewer of Springfield Brewing Company
and former brewing science instructor at UC Davis,
says this: 

  "Ideal oxygen levels are between eight to ten parts
per million. However, when you use pure oxygen you can
get oxygen levels exceeding 20 ppm. This means that
you can overdo it if you don't have the tools to
measure oxygen flow and oxygen content. Since most
homebrewers lack these instruments, I recommend taking
good notes when using pure oxygen and determining by
trial and error what works well."  Note: This isn't a
concern when using air via an aquarium pump for
aeration. 

  "Just as too little oxygen can be bad, too much
oxygen can also have a negative impact on the
beer--especially if you pitch too much yeast. What
could happen, essentially, is you'll end up with beer
that has very little character.  There are flavors
produced when yeast is growing, but if you start with
a large quantity of yeast and excessive oxygen, the
yeast will not need to struggle and multiply to
ferment out the sugars in the wort. In this case, they
will not impart important flavors and aroma to the
beer." 

I'm not sure what specific flavors and aroma he is
referring to, but he does mention that some brewers
intentionally limit aeration when they want more
esters, and conversely, they reduce ester production
through "good aeration practices."    

Does anybody have any data related to this/these
subject(s), and/or source(s) they would recommend,
especially specific amounts of yeast that are 
considered too great for x batch size, etc.?

Guy
Los Gatos, CA




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Date: Sat, 2 Nov 2002 19:57:36 -0500
From: "David Craft" <chsyhkr at bellsouth.net>
Subject: Cocoa Beans

Greetings,

I would use Cocoa Powder from the grocery and avoid the cocoa butter (oil)
that is in the beans or baking chocolate.

Brewing on,

David B. Craft
Battleground Brewers Homebrew Club
Crow Hill Brewery and Meadery
Greensboro, NC



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Date: Sat, 02 Nov 2002 22:16:27 -0500
From: David Towson <dtowson at comcast.net>
Subject: Roll-around cart for CO2 cylinder

For some while, I have been trying to find a convenient way to move my CO2 
cylinder around.  Sometimes I need it to pressurize a keg at one of the two 
refrigerators in the garage, sometimes I need it near the work table when 
I'm bottling, and sometimes I have to purge a water-filled keg in the 
laundry room.  My cylinder holds 20 pounds of gas, and weighs a little over 
60 pounds when full.  Carrying the thing around by the valve is doable, but 
darned uncomfortable.  A couple weeks ago, I was in a second-hand store and 
saw one of those folding luggage carts people use to roll their suitcases 
around in airports.  It looked like just the thing I needed, so I bought 
it.  And having used it for a while, I am delighted with how well it fills 
my requirement.  After I bent the sides of the suitcase support frame apart 
just a bit, the cylinder fits nicely between them, and rests on two steel 
rods underneath.  The bungee cord that comes with the unit does a nice job 
of holding the cylinder in place.  In the "parked" position, the assembly 
is quite stable, and has no tendency to tip over.

      Since it came from a second-hand store and has no markings, I have no 
idea who made the cart I purchased.  But after searching the web for a 
while, I found one that is almost identical, and has the two steel rods 
needed to support the cylinder.  You can see a picture at 
http://www.etravelergear.com/travsmarfoll.html .  Prices for these carts 
vary over a wide range, so it's well worth the effort to shop around.  The 
one just noted sells for $25 plus shipping.  Designs also vary quite a bit, 
and some have just an open rectangular frame that would not support a 
cylinder.  So if you're interested in pursuing this solution, be sure to 
take that into consideration.

Dave Towson
Bel Air, MD



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Date: Sun, 3 Nov 2002 12:19:43 -0600
From: "Mark BitzMart" <mark at bitzmart.com>
Subject: Newbie questions

First time brewer here with a few questions from my notes after
bottling my first batch.  I have read the first 40 pages of
Papazian's book, looked at howtobrew.com (and a few other sites)
and googled this list, but could not find answers to the following:

1. I sanitized the bottle caps by boiling them.  Can I re-boil boiled
but unused caps next time?  I just don't know how viable the seals
are and don't want to bother if they degrade with an additional
5 min boil.

2. My starter kit included a twin lever hand capper.  When I capped
the bottles, I noticed that some of them had a circular indentation
in the inner ring probably because I exerted extra pressure when
pressing down.  It looked like it provided a better seal so I made
sure that all of them had this inner ring by reapplying the capper.
Is this inner ring desired?

3. When I started to bottle I had trouble with air in the tubing
until the second or third bottle.  Any advice on how to avoid this
problem?

4. I plan to create labels for the bottles and read that
self-adhesive style printer labels would be difficult to remove.
Will plain inkjet paper secured with glue sticks be adequate?
And is sealing the label with hair spray the way to go to prevent
the ink from running?

5. The wife and kids gave me dirty looks when they came back from
shopping and smelled the wort.  With Thanksgiving right around the
corner, turkey fryers are going to be on sale, and I plan to
purchase one so they will be "thankful" when I start my concoction
outside.  What are the ideal attributes when purchasing such a
device?

I look forward to your advice.

Mark Baich
Buffalo Grove, IL



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