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	FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
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Contents:
  yeast question ("greg man")
  Newbie Introduction (Teresa Knezek)
  Burton Ale Yeast - good for higher temps ("John Maylone")
  Hansen Style Keg Post (HQ BIC)" <dmiller at hq.dcma.mil>
  Re: Min / Max time for starters (Martin_Brungard)
  Re: Newbie Questions (Fred L Johnson)
   ("Nichols, Josh")
  Re: Newbie questions (Matt Comstock)
  Beer in Anchorage? (KevinBailey)
  Re: Newbie questions ("Mike Sharp")
  RE: Newbie questions ("Mark BitzMart") ("Hedglin, Nils A")
  High Final Gravity ("Hedglin, Nils A")
  Newbie Questions ("Beer Guy")
  Mark's Newbie questions (LJ Vitt)
  RE: Questions on suggestions for improving beer. ("Doug Hurst")
  RE: Rock Bottom Mug Club Cards, at your service! ("Erin Fay")
  Re: Newbie questionis ("Kent Fletcher")
  Stupid Carboy Tricks ("Mark E. Hogenmiller")
  unpredictable brew schedule (Jeff & Ellen)
  Preservatives in Spices (Mr john mcdonald)
  Good Beer in LA (tarzana)? (Steven S)
  Re: Too much wort aeration and too much yeast not good? (Dion Hollenbeck)


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Date: Mon, 04 Nov 2002 01:48:16 -0500
From: "greg man" <dropthebeer at hotmail.com>
Subject: yeast question


Some one mentioned something about rousing the yeast after a week or so even 
possibly in the second fermenter? Provided of course that there is only co2 
in the fermenter and not oxegen.

They claimed the added benefits were to get the yeast back in suspension to 
clear up the left over haze (if there is any) and also to further the 
attenuation?
My questions are, has anyone else tried this technique? Does it work?

The reason I ask is that this sounds similar to some old english brewers who 
used to go out an "walk the keg" rolling it around on the ground to rouse 
the yeast. I've read a little about it but was wondering if we could debate 
the possible pro's an con's to using this trick?

I would think that you would want to make sure that there was no oxygen 
present unless that was your intention as some have stated about a few  
professional breweries. Any way opinions? comments? guesses? But most of all 
I'm hoping to hear from any who have done it an studied the results,
thanks...............Gregory A. Getman




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Date: Sun, 3 Nov 2002 22:11:16 -0900
From: Teresa Knezek <teresa at mivox.com>
Subject: Newbie Introduction

Hi! I've been lurking on the list for about a week, and just thought
I would introduce myself... My name is Teresa and I live up in
Fairbanks, Alaska. Homebrewing seemed like a great winter hobby, and
after spending a week in England drinking cellar-temperature,
non-CO2'ed "real ale", the thought of being stuck with cold, fizzy
American beer was just more than I could bear. So I ran out and bought a
homebrewing starter kit the week after I got back.

I just bottled my first batch of homebrew... I "doctored" a Brewers'
Best Irish Stout kit (added some fresh-brewed espresso, and used
molasses for priming sugar...), and now I have to sit and wait and
wait and wait to see how it turned out. (Do you ever get used to the
waiting part, or is it torture after every batch?)

I was going to name it something to do with Thanksgiving, since I
figure that's about when it will be really ready to drink... but then
we had a 7.9 magnitude earthquake about 80 miles from my house today,
so if the batch turns out worth naming, I'm going to call it "Seismic
Stout." :-)

Just curious though... after lurking a bit, I get the impression I'm
one of -- if not the only -- female on this list... lol. Are "girl
brewers" really such a rare breed, or have the others just not found
occasion to speak up this last week?
- -- 
:: Teresa ::
http://rant.mivox.com/

"It is amazing what you can accomplish if you do not care who
gets the credit."
	-- Harry S. Truman


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Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2002 01:10:02 -0800
From: "John Maylone" <mrkoala at netptc.net>
Subject: Burton Ale Yeast - good for higher temps

    
I thought I'd post an endorsement for White Labs' pitchable Burton Ale
Yeast, WLP023.

I live near the central California Valley and it gets oppressively hot
here in the summer.  This summer I brewed several 5 gallon batches from
extracts while playing around with my own recipes.  I am impressed by the
performance of the Burton Ale yeast.  My batches were fermenting at
around 78 degrees in the peak of the heat and this yeast produced nothing
that I would consider to be an off flavor..........on the contrary, I
came up with a "keeper" recipe under these conditions.

In the same environment I also tried some Williams 1335 British Ale II
yeast and it did very poorly in the same temperature range.

Regards,

John Maylone
Tollhouse, CA



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Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2002 08:53:44 -0500 
From: "Miller, Donald (HQ BIC)" <dmiller at hq.dcma.mil>
Subject: Hansen Style Keg Post

Last year I purchased a handful of 3-gallon kegs from a source in Texas.
While the kegs were in pretty good shape, my kegging "smarts" are not.  I
decided to tear the kegs down and give them a very thorough cleaning.  That
is the point at which my kegging knowledge was lacking.  I didn't realize
that the parts were not easily interchangeable.  The end result was a mixed
batched of poplets with plugs with different kegs.  After getting advice
from an local expert, I now know that I have three kegs that use "Cornelius"
style poplets with posts and three kegs that use "Hansen" style poplets and
posts.  The crux of my problem is that I need to buy some Hansen poplets for
my posts but I'm having trouble locating a source.  Does anyone have an idea
of a retailer?  E-mail replies are always welcome.

Thanks in advance.

Don Miller
Manassas, VA



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Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2002 09:27:46 -0500
From: Martin_Brungard at URSCorp.com
Subject: Re: Min / Max time for starters

I am a strong believer in using a good starter.  The argument of not having
the time to create a starter doesn't really pass muster with me.   I may
not know when I'm going to brew again, but I do have an indication of what
beer style or yeast I'll be using with the next batch.  That enables me to
get my starter going well in advance.

I have been stepping up the commercial liquid yeast packs using two
successive 700 ml wort additions for a 5 gal ale batch.  The second wort
addition is added after the first has completed its activity.  Of course
I've been oxygenating for each step up.  A good ale starter usually takes
me about 4 days to mature.  I usually put the starter in the refrigerator
to settle out, allowing me to decant the poor-quality starter beer off.

The minimum time required for an adequate starter will probably be
highlighted by several people on the list.  All kinds of factors are
involved.

The maximum time that you can hold a starter doesn't really have to be a
factor though.   Since I keep my starter in the refrigerator after its
through its active phase, it will keep relatively fresh for several weeks.
But, if I couldn't use the starter within a couple of weeks, I would decant
the starter beer off the yeast cake and add another dose of fresh wort.
But this time, I keep the starter in the refrigerator to reduce the ferment
activity.  The idea here is to nourish the yeast and keep them healthy, not
grow more cells.  With this approach, I'm betting that you could get a
month or more of viable storage.

The most important point here is that you probably know what yeast you're
going to use for the next beer.  Why not go ahead and get the starter going
well before you need it.  A few weeks or a month is not too long in advance
to get your starter going.

Martin Brungard
Tallahassee, FL




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Date: Mon, 04 Nov 2002 07:43:17 -0500
From: Fred L Johnson <FLJohnson at portbridge.com>
Subject: Re: Newbie Questions

Regarding Mark Baich recent newbie questions, I offer the following:

> 1. I sanitized the bottle caps by boiling them.  Can I re-boil boiled
> but unused caps next time?  I just don't know how viable the seals
> are and don't want to bother if they degrade with an additional
> 5 min boil.

You can reboil your caps to resanitize them.

If you use the caps with the oxygen scavenger seals, don't boil these, as
this destroys or at least decreases their ability to scavenge oxygen,
although it wouldn't harm their ability to seal the bottle.

I sanitize my caps with Iodophor just before they are used. Don't store caps
in iodophor, because it degrades rubber.  Some (many, most?) folks,
including commercial brewers, don't sanitize caps at all, especially if the
caps are coming straight out of the original packaging and haven't been
collecting dust. 
 
> 2. My starter kit included a twin lever hand capper.  When I capped
> the bottles, I noticed that some of them had a circular indentation
> in the inner ring probably because I exerted extra pressure when
> pressing down.  It looked like it provided a better seal so I made
> sure that all of them had this inner ring by reapplying the capper.
> Is this inner ring desired?

The indentation is normal and will be variable in depth depending upon the
bottle's opening.  If you are using a mixture of bottles, you will see some
variability.  With highly carbonated brews, such as hefeweizen, the "inny"
often becomes an "outy".   If the bottle develops an "outy" on a beer that
is not supposed to be highly carbonated, BEWARE!  It may be the result of
bottling too soon or of an infections and may be on the verge of exploding.

> 3. When I started to bottle I had trouble with air in the tubing
> until the second or third bottle.  Any advice on how to avoid this
> problem?

When I bottle, I use a wand with a spring valve at the end of the wand.  The
tubing and wand have been in iodophor, so I always "purge" the tubing at
full throttle with the first ounce or so of the first beer into a sanitized
bottle and discard.   This gets most/all of the air out of the tubing and
any residual iodophor.  You may still get some air if it was hung up in the
tubing or other paraphernalia (valves, connectors) between the container and
the bottle, but this really isn't something to worry about.  If you are
concerned about these few bottles (or any bottles that didn't bottle
"smoothly"), just put a rubber band around these as a reminder to drink
these first. 

> 4. I plan to create labels for the bottles and read that
> self-adhesive style printer labels would be difficult to remove.
> Will plain inkjet paper secured with glue sticks be adequate?
> And is sealing the label with hair spray the way to go to prevent
> the ink from running?

There are a gazillion ways to label your bottles, and you may get tons of
opinions.

I gave up putting labels on bottles long ago unless they were for gifts. I
label the storage crate with a single label to identify the batch. For
individual bottles being removed from the crate,  I print small cardstock
labels (4 per 4" x 6" card), punch a hole near one edge of the label, and
attach the label as a flag to the bottle neck.  I only label those bottles
that are leaving the crate and going into the fridge.  Eight labels last me
an entire 5 gallon batch: one label for each of two crates applied with a
glue stick and 6 labels for the bottles, reusing the labels until the batch
is consumed.

> 5. The wife and kids gave me dirty looks when they came back from
> shopping and smelled the wort.  With Thanksgiving right around the
> corner, turkey fryers are going to be on sale, and I plan to
> purchase one so they will be "thankful" when I start my concoction
> outside.  What are the ideal attributes when purchasing such a
> device?

If the pot you buy came with the burner, the pot will likely be stable on
the burner--VERY IMPORTANT.  If you intend to use a different pot on the
burner, you will want to be very sure that it sits securely on the burner.
Some burners have a raised rim which may or may not accommodate your pot.
What stabilizes one pot may destabilize another.

I prefer the low-to-the-ground burners over the ones I've seen that come
with the turkey fryers.  Think of lifting a full pot of wort, especially if
you're brewing in a very deep pot like a converted keg--very heavy even with
only 7 gallons of wort and very tall.

- --
Fred L. Johnson
Apex, North Carolina, USA



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Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2002 08:51:26 -0600 
From: "Nichols, Josh" <Josh.Nichols at us.gambro.com>
Subject: 

I normally brew/boil wort in a stainless pot.  Is there any problem with
using an
aluminum pot.  I have found one that has a spigot built into the side.  


Return to table of contents


Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2002 07:14:04 -0800 (PST)
From: Matt Comstock <mccomstock at yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Newbie questions

Mark asked about several new brewer topics:

Caps -
I don't boil them for any length of time as I'm
worried about the seal.  Just like in food
canning, the way I sanitize them is to heat the
caps in a pot of water until the water JUST
starts to boil, then I cover the pot and remove
it from the heat.  I've reheated caps that I've
treated this way with no ill effects/poor seals.

Don't know about the capper indentation.  I've
seen the indentation you mention but I don't
worry too much - as long as the cap stays on. 
Never had a problem with loose caps.

Air in the tubing-
I run beer through the tubing (about half a
bottle's worth) until the air pocket is gone.  If
I start with a hose full of water before I attach
it to the spigot, that helps.  If a pocket of
"air" develops during bottling, it may actually
be CO2 escaping the beer.  No worries there.  O2
is a problem, CO2 is not.

Turkey Cooker -
The best thing I ever did (well, brewing-wise)
was to move to the propane burner / turkey fryer.
 While moving outside also moved the wonderful!
smells outside, the best thing about it is not
that you're outside.  You can really speed up
your brew day with a good burner.  I can boil 7
gallons of water in 10-20 minutes.  Try that on
an electric stove.  We use the burner for our
canning escapades too, for the same reason. 
SPEED.

But with the burner, you are a few short steps to
going all-grain!  Extract brewing is fine and you
can make beer that tasts just as good as
all-grain beer (although many may argue that). 
But all-grain is rewarding.  You control your
beer to a greater extent.  Kind of like
carpentry: you can buy ready-cut kits to make a
bookshelf and put together a really nice well
made bookshelf.  But when you start from the
lumber, you have more freedom in design, and for
me, the process is more satisfying.

Key attributes?  Big burner.  Propane tank.  Big
kettle.  If it sounds like a jet engine when you
fire it up, it'll do the trick!

Labels - 
I've used inkjet paper/glue stick successfully. 
I hate trying to remove labels later.  The glue
stick glue comes off with water.  That's a
problem if you put bottles in a cooler and want
the labels to stay on.  But inkjet ink bleeds
anyway, so any labels made that way are shot when
immersed in water.  I've never tried the hair
spray trick.  My wife uses gel.

Gook luck and have fun and don't sweat the small
stuff (too much).

Matt in Cincinnati



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Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2002 09:48:45 -0600
From: KevinBailey at Contractor.BC.com
Subject: Beer in Anchorage?

I'll be spending a couple of days in Anchorage
next week and was wondering if there are any
can't miss brewpubs to experience while I'm there.
TIA

Kevin Bailey
DeRidder, LA


Return to table of contents


Date: Mon, 04 Nov 2002 08:41:14 -0800
From: "Mike Sharp" <rdcpro at hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Newbie questions

Mark asks some basic questions:

>1. I sanitized the bottle caps by boiling them.  Can I re-boil boiled
>but unused caps next time?  I just don't know how viable the seals
>are and don't want to bother if they degrade with an additional
>5 min boil.

Don't boil your caps.  If you're really concerned about sanitation (as in 
the case where the caps were stored someplace unsanitary), you can use a 
sanitizer like Star San, or Idophor.  I don't sanitize my caps at all.

I've heard that if you're using oxygen scavenging caps (they have a metal 
polymerized getter in the plastic) then don't even get them wet...not too 
sure about that advice, though, as I can't imagine how liquid activates 
something that's embedded into the plastic, away from the liquid.  All the 
getters I know of are activated with heat or chemically with hydrogen, or 
else they respire.

>
>2. My starter kit included a twin lever hand capper.  When I capped
>the bottles, I noticed that some of them had a circular indentation
>in the inner ring probably because I exerted extra pressure when
>pressing down.  It looked like it provided a better seal so I made
>sure that all of them had this inner ring by reapplying the capper.
>Is this inner ring desired?
>

I doubt it it's desired, but it's also not really a worry either.  My old 
prohibition capper does the same thing, but I believe it originally had a 
small magnet in there to hold the cap in place.  Once the cap is sealed, it 
should be fine.

>3. When I started to bottle I had trouble with air in the tubing
>until the second or third bottle.  Any advice on how to avoid this
>problem?


Not sure what the problem is, but a pinch valve close to the end of the 
tubing will help you maintain your siphon between bottles.  If you use a 
bottling bucket, with a spigot in the bottom, it's hard do see how you'd 
have problems.

>
>4. I plan to create labels for the bottles and read that
>self-adhesive style printer labels would be difficult to remove.
>Will plain inkjet paper secured with glue sticks be adequate?
>And is sealing the label with hair spray the way to go to prevent
>the ink from running?
>

Hair spray _helps_, but does not eliminate the running.  Artist fixative 
spray also works, maybe better than hairspray.  But I don't bother with 
either.  Actually, lately I've been only labeling a few, and I use a laser 
printer to print them, and color by hand.  This is a great job for kids, 
too!

Glue sticks are ok, but I prefer using a little milk as the adhesive.  Use a 
small paintbrush, and brush a tiny amount on the back of the label.  Apply 
it to the bottle.  You shouldn't be using so much milk that it wets through 
the paper, or causes the ink to run.  The labels wash off cleanly, but stay 
firmly attached.

>5. The wife and kids gave me dirty looks when they came back from
>shopping and smelled the wort.  With Thanksgiving right around the
>corner, turkey fryers are going to be on sale, and I plan to
>purchase one so they will be "thankful" when I start my concoction
>outside.  What are the ideal attributes when purchasing such a
>device?

Don't get the "jet" style.  These are identified by the apparent lack of a 
burner.  There is a pipe inside sticking up, and an orifice blasts propane 
into it.  They are loud, and not very efficient, producing lots of carbon 
monoxide, soot and who knows what else.  You also have very poor flame 
control.  It's important to get the water boiling, but at least as 
important, if not more, to be able to turn the flame down to control the 
boiling rate once it is boiling.

So, the kind you want will have a "ring" burner, looking either like a sort 
of cone shaped thing with a second piece fitted into it, with row of notches 
that let the gas/flames out, or it will be a single piece of cast iron with 
numerous holes around the top.  The latter is preferable, but either will 
work.

Finally, make sure the fryer has at _least_ a 30 quart pot.  32 is better.  
You want to be able to easily boil 6.5 gallons in order to be able to end up 
with 5.25 to 5.5 in the fermenter.

I brew in my garage, using a pretty efficient propane two burner stove, and 
I love the smell of wort filling the air.  But even so, it ends up in the 
house, too, and my wife rolls her eyes.  But she doesn't complain too much, 
because she likes the result.  If you brew indoors (like in a shed or 
garage) with propane, be cautious about carbon monoxide, leaky propane, 
oxygen consumption, etc.  The turkey fryers use a lot of oxgen, and they can 
produce a tremendous amount of CO, because of their poor efficiency.

Regards,
Mike Sharp





Return to table of contents


Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2002 08:43:29 -0800
From: "Hedglin, Nils A" <nils.a.hedglin at intel.com>
Subject: RE: Newbie questions ("Mark BitzMart")

Hi Mark & welcome to the fun & exicing world of brewing.

>3. When I started to bottle I had trouble with air in the tubing
>until the second or third bottle.  Any advice on how to avoid this
>problem?

I usually allow any overly aerated wort to drain into a bowl, then only 
bottle the wort once the tube is full.  Also, if you're getting a bubble 
at the join between the plastic racking cane & the plastic tube, pinch 
the tube just below the cane for a second.  I don't understand why it works,
 but pinching it will force the bubble down the tube & the joint section 
will fill with wort.

>4. I plan to create labels for the bottles and read that
>self-adhesive style printer labels would be difficult to remove.
>Will plain inkjet paper secured with glue sticks be adequate?
>And is sealing the label with hair spray the way to go to prevent
>the ink from running?

I've used glue sticks with good results.  Easy to apply, easy to remove 
the labels afterwards.  Haven't tried sealing the ink.  But if the label 
is getting wet to cause the ink to run, it moisture might cause the label 
to peel off anyway.

>5. The wife and kids gave me dirty looks when they came back from
>shopping and smelled the wort.  With Thanksgiving right around the
>corner, turkey fryers are going to be on sale, and I plan to
>purchase one so they will be "thankful" when I start my concoction
>outside.  What are the ideal attributes when purchasing such a
>device?

A sturdy stand is a must.  You may be having up to 75 lbs on the burner, 
so look for one with legs made out of wide metal bands instead of rods or 
extendable metal piping.  I'd think the extendable piping is probably worse 
than the rods since the whole weight of the kettle will be resting solely 
on the screws used to extend the legs.  I spent a lot of time trying to find 
the highest BTU burner, but now realize that the one I got may be overkill.  
It certainly does heat up the water fast, but once it's boiling, I have to 
turn it WAY down so it doesn't boil off too much.  For me (being 6'3"), 
finding the tallest burner was also important.  The next burner upgrade 
I may do is to add an electric ignition as outlined in a Brew Your Own 
article a few months ago.

Hope that helps & let us know how it turns out.

Nils Hedglin
Sacramento, CA
[1978.7, 275.3] Apparent Rennerian


Return to table of contents


Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2002 08:53:44 -0800
From: "Hedglin, Nils A" <nils.a.hedglin at intel.com>
Subject: High Final Gravity

Hi,
  I brewed a batch last weekend & racked it to secondary yesterday.  
I was able to keep the fermentation within the recommended range 
(66-68 deg), but it was done in 2 days.  It started out with an OG 
of 1.046, but when I racked it yesterday, it had a gravity of 1.020.  
It's a Northern English Brown Ale & supposed have an FG of 1.010-
1.013.  I'm assuming that it's not going to ferment much more since 
it was completely still for 5 days.  Any idea of why the fermentation 
went so fast, but seems not to have fully attenuated?  I used a 1 gal 
starter of White Labs English Ale yeast (WLP002).

Thanks

Nils Hedglin
Sacramento, CA
[1978.7, 275.3] Apparent Rennerian
(anxiously awaiting my BJCP results)





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Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2002 12:30:40 -0500
From: "Beer Guy" <beerguy at 1gallon.com>
Subject: Newbie Questions

Mark from Buffalo Grove has questions.
I could reach right out and give you big sloppy kiss. After subscribing to
the list for over a year and getting a lot of great feedback to *my* newbie
questions, even to the point of having list members come over to my house
and help me fashion equipment, I can finally give a little back.

 1.  Can I re-boil boiled but unused caps next time?

Sure. The main thing to watch out for is that you died them out after
boiling them and storing them. Otherwise you can get some rust developing,
which only makes you worry, in violation of the First Rule of Homebrewing.

2.  I exerted extra pressure when
pressing down.  It looked like it provided a better seal so I made
sure that all of them had this inner ring by reapplying the capper.
Is this inner ring desired?

You haven't snapped any necks off yet, have you? When the edges are down,
the bottle is capped. All you're doing with the extra pressure is pushing
the magnet against the cap. But you also might push down too hard and bust
off the neck of the bottle, so be careful if you like that 'look'. I'd also
suggest not doing it, since it makes the top of the cap uneven, so I have a
hard time putting the initials of the style on with a Sharpie, an easy and
cheap way to keep your batches separate.

3. When I started to bottle I had trouble with air in the tubing
until the second or third bottle.  Any advice on how to avoid this
problem?

No, still happens to me. I imagine you could run the start of your batch
into a bottle until the air is purged, then toss out the aerated beer and
start filling from then on. As a novice homebrewer, you probably will not
(asbestos suit being put on) notice the difference in the one bottle that
had bubbles going into it (actually two, since it always seems to happen to
me on the last bottle, too. Maybe the solution is to fill the first until
the tubing is purged, then set that aside until it's the last bottle filled,
so all the air is in one bottle (Christmas present for your brother-in-law
who always seems to want to taste *your* homebrew, but never brings any beer
himself?)


5.   What are the ideal attributes when purchasing such a
device? (Turkey Fryer)

Mark, These are basically brewkettles co-opted into a life as a  friar by
poultry farmers and their marketing minions. They work great, except that
you can boil much faster with them, so you have less time to read, "The
complete Joy of Homebrewing" while you're waiting for your wort to boil on
that hot plate in the garage. I'd suggest buying the largest size available,
preferably over 5 gal capacity, so you can continue to use this if you make
the transition to all-grain. And don't loan it to that brother-in-law, who
without a doubt will fry a turkey in it.

You've started a great hobby, Mark. And isn't it amazing how tasty the beer
is that YOU made? This is something that many of us forget, that sense of
wonder when you first find out that you can make WONDERFUL beer, in your
garage, basement or kitchen. Welcome to brewing.

Henry in Portage MI
http://www.1Gallon.com
http://www.DormBrew.com



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Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2002 10:27:28 -0800 (PST)
From: LJ Vitt <lvitt4 at yahoo.com>
Subject: Mark's Newbie questions

In HBD#4084, Mark askes some questions:


>First time brewer here with a few questions from my notes after
>bottling my first batch.  I have read the first 40 pages of
>Papazian's book, looked at howtobrew.com (and a few other sites)
>and googled this list, but could not find answers to the following:
 
>1. I sanitized the bottle caps by boiling them.  Can I re-boil boiled
>but unused caps next time?  I just don't know how viable the seals
>are and don't want to bother if they degrade with an additional
>5 min boil.
 
I consistantly hear recommendations not to boil your caps.  The claim
I remember is the liner can come out.  I never tried boiling myself.
I sanitize with the same sanitizer I use on fermenters, bottles, 
racking tubes - Iodophor.  Use whatever you are using as your sanitizer.
Soem people don't sanitize caps.  They are trusting them to be OK.

>2. My starter kit included a twin lever hand capper.  When I capped
>the bottles, I noticed that some of them had a circular indentation
>in the inner ring probably because I exerted extra pressure when
>pressing down.  It looked like it provided a better seal so I made
>sure that all of them had this inner ring by reapplying the capper.
>Is this inner ring desired?

It depends on the capper.  Some do this and others don't.
There is not a problem with having the dimples.

 
>3. When I started to bottle I had trouble with air in the tubing
>until the second or third bottle.  Any advice on how to avoid this
>problem?

I would start the syphen over if you have a lot of air in the
racking tube.  One way to get the air out (I think it is easier
to demonstrate than to describe in e-mail).  When you are 
starting the syphen, make sure the liquid keeps going up hill.
Air will stay above the liquid.  As you suck the air out of the
tube, lower the flexible tube into an S shape.  Keep sucking air
and lowering the tube.  Sanitation issue: I start syphens by 
inserting a short 6 inch tube into the hose, that I can suck on, 
and remove after the hose is full of liquid.  
 
>4. I plan to create labels for the bottles and read that
>self-adhesive style printer labels would be difficult to remove.
>Will plain inkjet paper secured with glue sticks be adequate?
>And is sealing the label with hair spray the way to go to prevent
>the ink from running?

>From what I read, glue sticks are fine.  I quit labeling bottles,
because it creates more work.  Get them delabeled and leave them
that way -- Yes, I do make exceptions.  When I label, I use milk.
 
>5. The wife and kids gave me dirty looks when they came back from
>shopping and smelled the wort.  With Thanksgiving right around the
>corner, turkey fryers are going to be on sale, and I plan to
>purchase one so they will be "thankful" when I start my concoction
>outside.  What are the ideal attributes when purchasing such a
>device?

If you ever want to have a kettle made out of a keg, it is helpful
if the burner can support it.
Suggestion: Have a seperate kettle for deep frying.
Someone else asked about issues of cleaning after frying to make
beer with the same kettle - Don't.
 


=====
Leo Vitt
Rochester MN



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Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2002 12:43:39 -0600
From: "Doug Hurst" <DougH at theshowdept.com>
Subject: RE: Questions on suggestions for improving beer.

Adrian Levi asked some questions in HBD #4083.  No one has responded so
I thought I'd try to address his concerns.  


"On boiling the wort:
After dissolving the contents of the tin in water you boil the whole
lot, then add the make up water, cool (by immersion) and add yeast when
it returns to an acceptable temperature.  Or dissolve contents of tin
into full volume of water, Boil, Cool, etc?"

Either way works.  You can boil a concentrated wort and add top-off or
make-up water to get to the final volume.  You can also boil the full
volume.  Most authorities suggest doing a full volume boil because it
allows for less darkening of the beer due to the Mailard reaction.


"On aerating:
Aeration during fermentation with an aquarium air pump, presumably
without "Air rock" attached. The air rock would be hard to sanitize by
my way of thinking. Aerate for about 10 mins after fermentation has
started to slow?"

Yikes.  If you can't sanitize the air rock, you'd never be able to use
it, because it's always used in cooled, unfermented wort.  I don't use
one, but I think the standard way to sanitize them is by boiling in
water for a few minutes.  More importantly is the fact that you should
NOT be aerating at the end of fermentation.  This will oxidized your
beer and create off flavors.  Aeration should only be done after cooling
the wort and before (or, I suppose, right after) pitching the yeast.


Hope this helps,

Doug Hurst
Chicago, IL
[215, 264.5] Apparent Rennerian


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Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2002 13:21:02 -0700
From: "Erin Fay" <erin at aob.org>
Subject: RE: Rock Bottom Mug Club Cards, at your service!


Thanks for your comments and posts regarding your AHA Rock Bottom Mug Club
cards. I've recently talked with the Rock Bottom Folks and here is the
skinny:  The first time your card is used, it must be activated through
their system by filling out a short form, where the card is then magnetized
through the system and the tracking can begin for your mug club points and
the subsequent prizes.  If your server isn't sure what to do with your card
when you present it - you *may* just want to mention that it should be
activated like any other Mug Club card.

Then you're ready to eat, drink and save money!

This was a very generous contribution from the Rock Bottom Restaurants and
we are glad you all are giving them your support! Please keep using your
discount so the Rock Bottom staff gets used to seeing them and you keep
saving!  Also remember to tip on the pre-discounted amount.

Thank you for all of your feedback.  You may contact Mark Snyder if you have
questions at 888-822-6273 x 137, or email Marks at aob.org.

Cheers!

Erin Fay
Membership Coordinator, Association of Brewers
American Homebrewers Association
Institute for Brewing Studies
PO Box 1679 Boulder, CO 80306
(303) 447-0816 x 135 phone
(303) 447-2825 fax
erin at aob.org
http://www.beertown.org









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Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2002 13:52:09 -0800
From: "Kent Fletcher" <kfletcher at socal.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Newbie questionis

Mark had a few questions
(snip)
"1. I sanitized the bottle caps by boiling them.  Can I re-boil boiled
but unused caps next time?  I just don't know how viable the seals
are and don't want to bother if they degrade with an additional
5 min boil."

I have given up on boiling or otherwise sanitizing crown caps.  It's the
only part of the process that I'm not super careful about.  I stopped
after seeing some of my boiled caps rust on the edges, leaving
rust on the mouth of the bottle.  I have it on good authority that
commercial brewers do not sanitze their caps, either.

"2. My starter kit included a twin lever hand capper.  When I capped
the bottles, I noticed that some of them had a circular indentation
in the inner ring probably because I exerted extra pressure when
pressing down.  It looked like it provided a better seal so I made
sure that all of them had this inner ring by reapplying the capper.
Is this inner ring desired?"

You'll get that indent with a butterfly capper.  The bench cappers I've
used won't leave one.  With a butterfly, if you don't get that ring you
can't be sure that you've got a good crimp.

"3. When I started to bottle I had trouble with air in the tubing
until the second or third bottle.  Any advice on how to avoid this
problem?"

I assume you're using tubing on a spigot (bottling bucket).
Lift the end of the tubing above the level of the beer in the bucket
BEFORE you open the spigot.  The beer will fill the tubing, purging
the air.  Operate the spring valve on the bottiling wand and lower
the end until beer just starts to run out, then let the valve close.

"4. I plan to create labels for the bottles and read that
self-adhesive style printer labels would be difficult to remove.
Will plain inkjet paper secured with glue sticks be adequate?
And is sealing the label with hair spray the way to go to prevent
the ink from running?"

Glue stick is fine most of the time, but labels may come
off if the bottles are immersed.  Hair spray may work, worth
a try, but spray the labels BEFORE putting them on the
bottles.

"5. The wife and kids gave me dirty looks when they came back from
shopping and smelled the wort.  With Thanksgiving right around the
corner, turkey fryers are going to be on sale, and I plan to
purchase one so they will be "thankful" when I start my concoction
outside.  What are the ideal attributes when purchasing such a
device?"

Get one with a cast burner.  Some of the cookers use a "jet" burner - high
BTU's but a very concentrated flame, which can lead to scorching wort.  If
you can find a kit with a SS pot at a good price, so much the better.

Kent Fletcher
Brewing in So Cal



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Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2002 16:16:41 -0800 (PST)
From: "Mark E. Hogenmiller" <hogenmiller at yahoo.com>
Subject: Stupid Carboy Tricks

This one is compliments of the Naval Safety Center
Summary of Mishaps Message 31 October 2002:
"Now for the real Halloween highlight, and this one
needs no elaboration for sheer jaw-dropping,
flinch-inducing terror. The task at hand was to remove
a 1-inch stopper from a 5-gallon carboy, which in
regular English is a glass jug or bottle. The stopper
had gotten shoved down into the jug. The solution:
compressed air, of course. Insert the hose and start
pumping in some good old PSI's. The stopper lodges in
the neck. Does it pop out? Yes, but unfortunately, it
is accompanied by about a million pieces of glass from
the exploding carboy. Multiple lacerations to every
exposed square inch of leg, foot, arm, hand and face,
three hours of surgery, a day in the hospital, and 22
more days before getting back to work."

Mark Hogenmiller
BURP
Burke,VA




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Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2002 20:03:41 -0500
From: Jeff & Ellen <JeffNGladish at ij.net>
Subject: unpredictable brew schedule

Mike in Monterey wrote, "I usually don't know that I will have time to 
 brew until the night before or morning of brew day" and asked about  yeast 
starters.
Last Monday night I made a yeast starter for the weekend.  It was 
 completely finished and inactive after three days (Thursday night).  On 
 Friday night I stepped it up by pouring off the beer on top of the yeast 
and then adding some more boiled and cooled wort.  It was perfect by 
 Saturday afternoon.  Lots of active yeast.  My "Teach a Friend" brew had 
 a good kreusen four hours after knock out.
I think that if you made a starter and lost the opportunity to brew for a 
 week this would still be a good option.  A starter that is only a week or 
two old should be strong and healthy within 12 hours of re-starting.  Of 
course, make sure your sanitation is good.
Jeff Gladish, Tampa, FL




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Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2002 17:08:44 -0800 (PST)
From: Mr john mcdonald <freddytoliver at yahoo.com>
Subject: Preservatives in Spices


John Misrahi wrote, "Anyways, I boiled it for 20
minutes with some brown sugar and 2 tsp each of
nutmeg, cinnamon and ginger. Chilled it, and pitched
dry Danstar Windsor. Next day, no sign of life."
- ----------

I once read that brown spices like nutmeg and cinnamon
contain compounds that are fatal to yeast - use too
much in your bread or baking and it won't rise.  4 TSP
sounds like quite enough to do something like that.


Freddy Toliver
Streator, IL



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Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2002 21:43:24 -0500 (EST)
From: Steven S <steven at 403forbidden.net>
Subject: Good Beer in LA (tarzana)?


A good friend of mine is stuck in LA for sometime and is missing the good
beer selection we have in Atl GA. While I cant grasp the concept that our
beer selection is that great (sweetwater and dogwood do produce some good
beers) I am trying to find any beer stores in the Tarzana area with a
great selection or maybe some small out of the way brewpubs that might be
off the beaten path. Eateries with a good beer selection is also welcome.





Steven St.Laurent	403forbidden.net	[580.2,181.4] Rennerian



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Date: 04 Nov 2002 19:27:30 -0800
From: Dion Hollenbeck <hollen at woodsprite.com>
Subject: Re: Too much wort aeration and too much yeast not good?

>> G C writes:

GC> When using pure oxygen, isn't it possible to over-aerate?  

GC> I mention this because in the October BYO, Ashton Lewis, master
GC> brewer of Springfield Brewing Company and former brewing science
GC> instructor at UC Davis, says this:

GC> "Ideal oxygen levels are between eight to ten parts per
GC> million. However, when you use pure oxygen you can get oxygen
GC> levels exceeding 20 ppm. This means that you can overdo it if you
GC> don't have the tools to measure oxygen flow and oxygen
GC> content. 

I oxygenate using a carbonation stone inside of a corny keg (my
fermenter) and push it up to 20 psi over an hour.  I, too, wondered
about overdoing it, and posed this question several years ago on the
HBD.  George Fix answered it this way (I am paraphrasing).

Yes, it is possible, but not at normal atmospheric pressures.  He went
on to say that he had measured the DO level with a DO meter, and when
under pressure, it was possible to get beyond the 20 ppm levels.
However, he noted that when the pressure is released, the levels fall
way below 20 ppm in a very short time.

dion
- -- 
Dion Hollenbeck  Email:  hollen at woodsprite.com
Home Page:       http://www.woodsprite.com
Brewing Page:    http://hbd.org/hollen
'85 4runner    '86 4x4 PU


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