HOMEBREW Digest #4317 Thu 07 August 2003

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  Re: All RIMS'ers and those who use pumps (David Towson)
  Stale Brew in Mini-Kegs (Bob Hall)
  Re: Pink residue ("Steven S.")
  RE:  Pink residue ("Houseman, David L")
  re madison brew pubs ("Hofmann, Chris")
  Re: All RIMS'ers and those who use pumps (Jeff Renner)
  Mixed gas == flat beer! (Jim Busch)
  full flavored mild ("Hofmann, Chris")
  raise-lower pH/Alt grainbill/21-yr brew/2-gauge/head killers (BrewInfo)
  Please help with first all-grain brew (Stephen T. Kajdasz)
  Lallemandian Origins ("Rob Moline")

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---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 06 Aug 2003 07:56:39 -0400 From: David Towson <dtowson at comcast.net> Subject: Re: All RIMS'ers and those who use pumps In HBD 4316, Parker Dutro asks about pump noises. In my experience, pump rattle is a sign of cavitation, which is a turbulent and inefficient flow through the pump. If the liquid being pumped is at a temperature near the normal atmospheric pressure boiling point (say 190 - 200 degrees F), the pump suction can lower the pressure on the hot liquid enough to permit boiling inside the pump. This usually takes a few minutes to build up, and is less likely with high-gravity worts, as their boiling point is higher. It can be stopped temporarily by stopping the pump and letting the pump-head refill with liquid (if it will - depends on layout). In my experience, doing this almost always results in a burst of bubbles being released on either the suction side or the discharge side, again depending on the layout. I think of it as "burping the pump". You can also throttle the output of the pump by partially closing the discharge valve (assuming we're talking about a centrifugal pump), and that will raise the pressure on the suction side to stop the liquid from boiling inside the pump. But there is a tradeoff here, as throttling the pump reduces the flow. Letting the rattle continue without attention is rather hard on the pump, particularly if it has cheap plastic parts, as mine do. And the flow is substantially reduced during cavitation. Dave Towson Bel Air, MD Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 06 Aug 2003 07:44:30 -0400 From: Bob Hall <rallenhall at toast.net> Subject: Stale Brew in Mini-Kegs I've worked away from home much of the summer, and began using mini-kegs as a more convenient way of transporting homebrew. I've kept kegs on tap both at home and at my apartment. I've noticed that the brew tastes very good when the initially tapped, but over time the beer tastes stale and perhaps oxidized even when under pressure. This is especially noticable with the kegs at home, which I only taste on a weekly basis. Has anyone experienced this .... is the life of mini-kegged beer actually that short even with CO2 applied? Also, my wife says that she can pick up a metallic taste and wants me to return to bottles. I haven't picked that up, having destroyed too many taste buds with jalapenos over the years. Has anyone with a more discriminating palate noticed any off flavors associated with metal mini-kegs? Bob Hall, Napoleon, OH Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 6 Aug 2003 09:40:01 -0400 (EDT) From: "Steven S." <steven at 403forbidden.net> Subject: Re: Pink residue Here in Atlanta we get a pink residue also, around shower heads and any place water will run down and sit. Our water supply comes from a large lake just to the northeast of town. I spent sometime trying to figure out what this is when I finally talked to the local water management folk. In my case it is basically a mostly harmless bacterium that feeds on the flora in the lake itself. In the summer water levels drop and they get increased algae blooms and the bacteria gets well fed. This gets into the water and I assume it is not killed by cholorine levels in the water. If your water supply is lake fed then you will probably notice the pink stuff dissipears towards winter. An odd side note, since I moved I no longer get the pink bacteria but i'm still on the same basic water supply. Steven St.Laurent :: www.403forbidden.net [580.2,181.4] Rennerian :: steven at 403forbidden.net Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 6 Aug 2003 08:26:54 -0500 From: "Houseman, David L" <David.Houseman at unisys.com> Subject: RE: Pink residue Dave Burley suggests that the pink residue from evaporated water is a yeast similar to that which occurs in showers. Yes, my shower occasionally gets a pinkish wild yeast/mold (never had it analyzed) that tends to grow on soap residue. But what RRodda may be seeing is the results of dissolved iron in the water which is no longer dissolved. I also had a severe iron problem which will turn a lot of things, include laundry, pinkish/reddish. A water softener fixed this problem for the most part. But some evaporated water may still leave a trace of iron. And I've found an iron residue in carboy's of iodophor solution; apparently the iodophor solution causes any residual iron to precipitate out. So besides wild yeast, unlikely to be in the water, but may grow in damp areas, such as evaporation pools, check the iron content of your water. Too much will give you a metallic taste to beer and in large quantities be toxic to yeast. Dave Houseman Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 6 Aug 2003 09:03:13 -0500 From: "Hofmann, Chris" <Chris.Hofmann at camtronics.com> Subject: re madison brew pubs Rob Beck asks about Madison brew pubs..... I think the Great Dane has to be one of the best brewpubs in the country. Great atmosphere in Historic Fess hotel, great location near our beautiful State Capitol building. Broad selection of beers to meet any beer snobs discerning palate. Several have won awards. There's a bar, and a Rathskeller in the basement. The dining area is pleasant and the food is good and consistent, portions ample. Also you can walk two blocks down W. Wilson and go to the Essen Haus, a great German restaurant and bar. Connected to the Essen Haus is the Come Back Inn. Excellent selection of beers on tap, including one of my favorites - Alpha King. No affiliation, etc. Have fun!! -Chris Hofmann Mukwonago, WI Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 6 Aug 2003 10:55:30 -0400 From: Jeff Renner <jeffrenner at comcast.net> Subject: Re: All RIMS'ers and those who use pumps "Parker Dutro" <pacman at edwardwadsworth.com> is worried about the noise his pump makes. Is this a new pump? I find that when mine gets dirty, it makes a squealing and chattering noise intermittently, and doesn't pump well. The impeller and the inside of the pump chamber get buildups of hard brown gunk (protein?). I take it apart and soak the parts, then scrape off the deposits after they are softened. If it's a new pump, then I don't know. Mine runs quietly unless I get air bubbles in it. Jeff - -- Jeff Renner in Ann Arbor, Michigan USA, JeffRenner at comcast.net "One never knows, do one?" Fats Waller, American Musician, 1904-1943 Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, Aug 6 2003 11:01:34 GMT-0400 From: Jim Busch <jim at victorybeer.com> Subject: Mixed gas == flat beer! Someone asked about using mixed gas, 60/40 and wondered why his already low carbonated beer ended up flat. Thats easy, its all due to partial pressures of gases in solution and their propensity to equalize. Bottom line is with mixed gas, you need to have fully carbonated beer and even then the 60-70% nitrogen fraction will reduce the CO2 saturation over time as the gas partial pressures will equalize. The same phenomenon will occur with 100% CO2 dispense too, but in this case over time you can get overcarbonated beer. This is the reason that multitaps (with slow turnover) tend to use mixed gas, it reduces losses due to fobbing with overcarbonated beer but the end result is most beers are undercarbonated overtime when pushed by mixed gas. What is happening inside the keg is the N2 is pushing the beer out of the keg but the CO2 fraction is decreasing. Overtime you end with lots of N2 but almost no CO2. If you must use mixed gas (and in general I despise the practice with all but slow pour Guinness), be sure to have your kegs fully carbonated to your desired levels and then try to empty the kegs ASAP. Cheers! Jim Busch Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 6 Aug 2003 13:41:48 -0500 From: "Hofmann, Chris" <Chris.Hofmann at camtronics.com> Subject: full flavored mild Colleagues, Never have brewed a mild (intentionally). But as someone once posted here, brewing a full flavored mild is one of the great challenges in brewing. My house brew is a malty (1.050-1.055, with lots of Munich, Crystal), hoppy ( ~ 60 IBU) APAish concoction. I would like to brew a smaller (less ABV) version. If I want to scale it down to say 1.038, should I just cut everything proportionally? I know it may not technically be a mild, but is this the right approach? With appreciation, Chris Hofmann Mukwonago, WI Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 6 Aug 2003 14:12:30 -0500 (CDT) From: brewinfo at xnet.com (BrewInfo) Subject: raise-lower pH/Alt grainbill/21-yr brew/2-gauge/head killers Jeff's right... I did mean to add calcium carbonate to RAISE the pH. I frequently make that mistake... more frequently at 1 or 2am... *** Jim writes: >Now, not that I want to be argumentative with Al, >but I used to agree with him about all munich malts >for Altbier, then I brewed up a series of 12 pilots >with vastly different malt profiles : 100% Munich, >touch of Carfa, down to 80% pils, some Munich, some >caramel, some carafa. Somewhat to my surprise, the >beers that employed over 50% pils malt as a base >seemed closest to me in flavor profile with the >holy grail, Zum Uerige. In fact read the label, >roast malz, pale malz, caramel malz, hopfen. I wish that I had some fresh Zum Uerige to perform that experiment, but I don't, nor do I have the time to do all those test batches in the near future. I'll have to take Jim's word for it, since I trust his palate and his brewing skills. Regarding the recipe on the bottle. I did bring back 8 or 12 bottles (it was one of those white carry-home cases from the brewery) of Zum Uerige when I was there in 1995 or 1996 and I'm pretty sure that there was no ingredient list on the bottles at the time. They were swing-top bottles and had a tiny little paper label that went over the bale release. I met with one of the brewmasters while I was there and although he spoke no English and I have but a cursory knowledge of German, I did understand that he *claimed* the malt bill was "dunkel malz" with a little (fingers about 2cm apart) "roast malz." I doubt that they would change the recipe, but maybe they did, or maybe I was a victim of the Belgian Waffle... we weren't that far from the Belgian border, don'cha know ;^). For those of you that aren't familiar, someone in homebrewing coined the phrase "Belgian Waffle" for the ever-changing story that one gets when one asks a Belgian brewmaster about their recipe. I've heard three *different* stories about the "secret ingredient" and two different stories about lactic acid vs. lactobacillus in Celis White... FROM PIERRE! *** Ironically, Jim also writes: >Regarding brewing for storage for about 18-21 yrs. >Ive been cellar aging strong Victory beers since >opened in 96 and have found that the best aging beer >we make is Storm King Imperial Stout. It holds up >better than our barleywine, and better than the Belgians. I have yet to taste Storm King, but as luck would have it, YESTERDAY, I finally ran across it at a local liquor store and bought some. I intend on tasting it tonight and since I'll be back by there next week I'll bet I pick up the rest! *** Calvin writes, quoting me: >> ...don't get a 2-gauge regulator. I, personally, >> think they are a waste of money. The second gauge goes >> on the high-pressure side of the regulator and tells you >> the pressure in the tank. For gasses like nitrogen or oxygen, >> where the tank is all gas, it might be useful, but for CO2, >> which is a liquid in our tanks, it really only begins to >> drop when all the liquid CO2 has become gas and that's >> just a few pints from empty. > >I hate to disagree with one of the Hall of Foam candidates (Al K), >but 2-gauge regulators ARE useful, or perhaps let's say that these >are useful if you have a large CO2 tank. Case in point: I too have a 20-lb tank and perhaps I was pretty sure that I got less than one keg worth of beer out of the tank after I noticed that the high-pressure gauge was dropping. At the time, I was running four kegs off one regulator and maybe there was a small leak in the lines, so that may have made it even worse for me. On my 5-lb tank, I'm certain you would agree with me, right? ;^) I still would contend that if someone was trying to get into kegging for the least amount of cost, I would forgo the second gauge. >The tank-pressure gauge on my 20-lb tank usually runs around >50-something atm. It stays in that range (depending on ambient >temp) so long as there is liquid inside. A week ago, I noticed >it was down to 38 atm. Yikes! Time for refill. But time Actually, if your gauge reads in atm, couldn't we actually figure out how much gas is in the tank? 1atm in a tank that holds, say, 10 liters of gas would be 10 liters. 2atm, would be 20 liters, right? 38atm would be 38 liters. Once there's some liquid CO2 in there, all bets are off. Both my gauges read in psi, so I hadn't thought of it that way. Furthermore, if we knew exactly the volume of the tank, we could probably calculate how many pints could be pushed out until the tank pressure dropped below the serving pressure... presuming you don't assemble your system with those cheap plastic hose clamps (duh!)... right? *** Rich asks what he can do about head-killing glassware. I can only suggest to try what I do. In a pinch, I use dishwashing detergent for washing glassware, but ideally, I like to use a percarbonate -based cleaner from 5Star. I think it's called PBW (powdered brewery wash or something like that). Any percarbonate-based cleaner without perfumes should be better than liquid dish soap. A good rule of thumb is: if it lathers, don't use it to wash brewing equipment or glassware. Al. Al Korzonas Homer Glen, IL www.brewinfo.com Return to table of contents
Date: 06 Aug 2003 20:27:17 EDT From: Stephen.T.Kajdasz at Dartmouth.EDU (Stephen T. Kajdasz) Subject: Please help with first all-grain brew So, I attempted my first all-grain brew last week, and the results were not pretty. My extraction efficiency was 47%. I am writing in the hopes that some of you can pin point my problem. The grain bill: 8.5lbs pale malt 1.0lbs crystal 40 0.5lbs dextrin 0.25lbs wheat My main problem is that I'm not sure exactly how much calcium and magnesium are in my water because the town does not give these values. My water is very soft. Part of the report is as follows: Alkalinity 21.8ppm Hardness (CaCo3) 19.4ppm Chlorine 4ppm Sulfate 6ppm Sodium 15.76 Chloride 18ppm pH 7.8 The engineer at the treatment facility said that magnesium is virtually absent, so I figured that from the hardness calcium had to be very low. I treated the water with sodium metabisulfite for the chlorine at about 700mg/20gallons, and with enough gypsum to add 60ppm calcium (I checked the calculations multiple times and am confident they are right). My set up is a 5gl round, Igloo cooler with a square, slotted manifold. I started the mash at 155F, and mashed for one hour stirring every 20 minutes or so with a ratio of 1.5quarts/1pound grain. I checked the pH with pH paper at room temperature and it seemed to be at about 5.2, but I find that the paper is hard to use. If 5.2 is accurate then the pH at mash temperature could have been too low. At the end of the hour it was about 152F. I recirculated the wort, and sparged with 170F water treated with gypsum (do people acidify their sparge water or is OK as is as long as the temperature is not too high?). I sparged until I had about 5.5gl over the course of about 45-1hr. I stopped because the runoff gravity was 1.010, and the wort gravity (which I checked twice) was showing an efficiency of only 47% (I made sure the wort was well mixed). I carefully removed the grain from the cooler to see if the manifold was intact, and it was. Not giving up, the next day I did another mash with the same grain ratio, but half the amount. This time I didn't add gypsum, but added calcium carbonate to the mash at about 60ppm carbonate. The pH at room temperature seemed to be about 5.5. My extraction efficiency was again 47%. All of you have helped me get this far, and I hope you can get me over this hurdle. I would appreciate any advice. Thanks. Steve Kajdasz Lebanon, New Hampshire Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 6 Aug 2003 21:24:43 -0500 From: "Rob Moline" <jethrogump at mchsi.com> Subject: Lallemandian Origins Lallemandian Origins >From: Robin Griller <rgriller at chass.utoronto.ca> >Subject: lallemandian origins >While we often debate the misty origins of the yeast strains available to >us, It surprised me to read Lallemand described by Rob Moline as 'the >American yeast company', given that Lallemand's corporate origin >and home is Montreal, Quebec, Canada. Robin, Sorry for my poor language....I meant that Dr. Cone was not only a consultant to Lallemand, but also to another organization...the American Yeast Company. Lallemand was founded in Montreal at the end of the nineteenth century by a young immigrant from Alsace, Fred "Lallemand". He built a plant in Montreal in 1915, and production of bakers yeast started there in 1923. The plant is still in use today and site of the Lallemand's administrative offices. Roland Chagnon acquired the Lallemand business in 1952 and his family is still the current owner. For more information on Lallemandian Origins, go to http://www.lallemand.com/Home/eng/History.shtm Cheers! Gump "The More I Know About Yeast, The More I Realize I Need To Ask Dr. Cone A Question!" - --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.507 / Virus Database: 304 - Release Date: 8/4/2003 Return to table of contents
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