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	FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
		Rob Gardner, Digest Coordinator


Contents:
  Bottle fillers (CRF)
  Champagne Bottles and Plastic Corks (Steve Anthony)
  Sterilizing Lids (Eric Pepke)
  steeping hops (RUSSG)
  RE: Homebrew Digest #436 (June 11, 1990)  ("Dave Resch DTN:523-2780")
  Lager Fermentation Temperature (Len Reed)
  Slug Beer (Len Reed)
  How long have hops steeped? (Chain is useless 'gainst false Cupid)
  Irish Moss--when does it work? (florianb)
  vanilla extract (mage!lou)


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Date: Mon, 11 Jun 90 08:17 EST
From: CRF at PINE.CIRCA.UFL.EDU
Subject: Bottle fillers

Hi there!


Regarding spring-loaded bottle fillers:  I tried 'em.  Several of 'em.  And 
the same thing happened to every one:  after bottling a couple of batches, the 
spring went "SPROING!!" and flew off, never more to be seen.

Now I use a piece of plastic racking tubing ("Tygon" to you science types :-), 
which I boil up with my siphon tubing.  Once my wort's in the priming bucket 
and ready to bottle, I slip the tubing over the end of the spigot.  This lets 
me fill from the bottom of the bottle.  I control the flow with a pinch clamp, 
but it could also be done by opening and closing the spigot.

Something else which occurred to me recently, and which may prove to be a 
statement of the obvious.  If so, please bear with me.

When cleaning plastic equipment such as a priming bucket, use a sponge, and  a 
sponge _only_.  Do not use the nylon side of a Rescue pad, or the like.  That 
sort of thing is great for causing those troublesome scratches which are in 
turn a great place for contaminants to breed.


                         Yours in Carbonation,

                                      Cher 


"God save you from a bad neighbor and from a beginner on the fiddle." --
   Italian proverb
=============================================================================

	Cheryl Feinstein              INTERNET:  CRF at PINE.CIRCA.UFL.EDU
	Univ. of Fla.                 BITNET:  CRF at UFPINE
	Gainesville, FL

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Date: Mon, 11 Jun 90 09:02:49 EDT
From: Steve Anthony <steveo at Think.COM>
Subject: Champagne Bottles and Plastic Corks

This past weekend, I was opening a bottle of my favorite brew and had a
potentially dangerous event occur. I thought I'd pass along the warning.

I had bottled the beer in a champagne bottle and capped with one of those
plastic champagne corks. I also tied the cork down with one of those wire
bails. Well, when openning the bottle, after about three twists at the bail
(the bail wasn't completely untwisted), the cork shot out of the bottle
nailing me in the forehead (about an inch from my right eye). The force was
quite powerful, and I had a small bump on my forehead to help me remember
the event.

So the moral of the story is to stand back when openning a bottle, 'lest
your beer get renamed "Blind Man's Beer". 

Steveo

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Date:    Mon, 11 Jun 1990 10:25:13 EDT
From: PEPKE at scri1.scri.fsu.edu (Eric Pepke)
Subject: Sterilizing Lids

Lids have lips on them, right?  So turn the lid upside-down, put it on a flat
surface, and pour sterilizing solution into it until it is filled to the lip. 
If there's a hole with a grommet, put an airlock in the wrong way to plug it
up.  After the wretched beasties have been killed, pick it up by the edges and
invert it to dump out the solution.

Eric Pepke                                     INTERNET: pepke at gw.scri.fsu.edu
Supercomputer Computations Research Institute  MFENET:   pepke at fsu
Florida State University                       SPAN:     scri::pepke
Tallahassee, FL 32306-4052                     BITNET:   pepke at fsu

Disclaimer: My employers seldom even LISTEN to my opinions.
Meta-disclaimer: Any society that needs disclaimers has too many lawyers.

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Date:     Mon, 11 Jun 90 11:08 EST
From: <R_GELINA%UNHH.BITNET at mitvma.mit.edu> (RUSSG)
Subject:  steeping hops

Suurb's version of steeping hops is slighly different from mine.  He lets the
hops sit in the wort as he chills it, resulting in a ~1/2 hour steep time. I
put the hops in a grain bag, and steep it like a tea bag for less than 5
minutes in the (just below boiling temp.) wort.  The effect may be virtually
the same, though, as Suurb's cooled wort may not be as efficient at pulling
out the goodies from the hops, but the longer steeping time compensates.

Russ Gelinas          R_GELINA at UNHH.BITNET

Disclaimer: I have no disclaimer.

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Date: Mon, 11 Jun 90 09:49:23 PDT
From: "Dave Resch DTN:523-2780" <resch at cookie.enet.dec.com>
Subject: RE: Homebrew Digest #436 (June 11, 1990) 

 
>	Various people have posted that they have found a
>cheap source of kegs by buying them from soda distributors. I
>called every soda distributor in San Diego county and couldn't
>find one willing to part with a keg.

I got the kegs that I am using at a flee market here in Colorado Springs, but 
I also saw a bunch of them (5 gal. Cornelius) for sale at the restaurant supply
place where I bought the pieces and parts to construct my kegging system.  He 
was selling them for $20.00/keg.

You might give some restaurant supply places a call.  They tend to sell a lot
of used equipment that they go in and buy when a restaurant goes out of
business; Cornelius kegs are often part of that equipment.

Dave

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Date: Mon, 11 Jun 90 14:38:15 EDT
From: holos0!lbr at gatech.edu (Len Reed)
Subject: Lager Fermentation Temperature

At what temperature do you ferment your lager beer?  I have found
that Wyeast lager yeasts--I've tried Danish, St. Louis, New Ulm,
and Bavarian--quit working below 51 degrees F.  If you drop them
too low, they stop; subsequently raising the temperature into the
mid fifties revives them, but the fermentation proceeds slowly,
taking 3-4 weeks.  Pitching active yeast (I use a starter) and
holding 53-55 degrees allows fermentation to take less than 10 days.

Many authorities, in particular Greg Noonan, suggest lowering
the temperature below 50 after high kraesen but before the fermentation
is completed.

I am measuring the temperature of the wort, and maybe this is the
"problem."  My fridge is as much as 5 degrees higher than the
wort during high kraesen.  (The wort is giving off heat.)  As
fermentation slows, the ambient and wort temperatures come
together.  I suspect that many recipes that indicate temperatures
in the high 40's mean ambient temperature and not wort
temperature.

For my part, I do not intend to go below 53 degrees (wort) for
any lager until the beer falls below about 1.016.  I'll then
slowly lower the temperature, and then lager in the 30's.

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Date: Mon, 11 Jun 90 14:39:41 EDT
From: holos0!lbr at gatech.edu (Len Reed)
Subject: Slug Beer

I gave a third of a batch of one of my finest beers to the garden
slugs.  Deliberately!  I poured it into saucers and the pests
climbed in and drank themselves to a happy death.

What kind of moron pours homebrew for slugs?  And not just any
homebrew.  This stuff was a Munich dark, all grain (lager malt
and chocolate malt), German Hallertauer leaf hops, and liquid
yeast (Wyeast Danish lager).  Yet, I was convinced the beer was
forever undrinkable.

I brewed this stuff January 15, 1989.  The mash session went
well, and I got an excellent extract.  I put the inverted carboy
(Brewcap system, which I've since abandoned) in a place that I
hoped would be cool enough during the winter for lager.

The fermentation started well, but the ambient temperature varied
from 45-60 degrees F.  Starting from 1.050, it was down to only
1.036 after two weeks.  The temperature variations made the yeast
go practically dormant.  My Brewcap system was leaking air into
the wort, so I siphoned to another carboy, this time upright.

On February 11, I made a starter from a bottle of Pilsner (same
yeast) and some home canned wort and added it to the carboy. 
After a few days it was fermenting; the temperature was in the
low 60s.

This stuff fell to 1.019 and then very slowly fell to 1.0128.  I
bottled it on May 12; it was four months old, and had had no
lagering!  With no fining, it was crystal clear.

My final log entry notes in June 1989 that the stuff was
terrible.  I remember opening bottles, tasting the beer, and
dumping the beer down the sink throughout the summer.  Sometime
during the summer I poured beer for the slugs: I was convinced
that the beer had so much buttery smell (diacetyl), was probably
over hopped, was not made from proper Munich malt, and had
undergone such an eccentric fermentation that it would never be
drinkable.

The beer was stored at up to 85 degrees throughout the summer. 
By autumn it had an easier life.  Every once in a while I'd try a
bottle, but it was never any good.

By winter, due to a lack of brewing on my part, my beer fridge
(purchased too late for fermenting this batch) had idle space and
I moved the remaining bottles into it, though why I don't know. 
The beer was drinkable, but not particularly pleasant.  My wife
and I referred to it as "the slug beer."   The temperature in the
fridge varied from 35-55 degrees depending on the state of the
in-progress brew.  Sometime in February my wife drank one of
these beers and said it was "okay."  Since she doesn't much care
for dark beer, I didn't realize at the time that it might have
been quite good.

In June 1990, when the beer was 17 months old, I opened one.  It
was excellent.  Perfect dark color with a tiny hint of red. 
Perfectly clear.  Perfect malt/hop balance.  Perfect sweetness. 
It could have a little more malt aroma and a tiny bit less
carbonation, but I'm really nit-picking.  No off flavors.  Very
true to style.

Well, I've been drinking the stuff and I lament the loss of the
beer to the slugs and the sink.  But how could it have taken so
long to become good?  All-malt lagers take time, but 17 months? 
My guess is that the eccentric fermentation made so much diacetyl
that it took forever for the in-bottle yeast to absorb it.  I
also guess that lagering not only makes for better lager beer,
but may actually shorten the aging time.  (This beer did get
lagered, but the lagering was in the bottle after a very rough
summer.)

No other undrinkable beer I've made--I had several in the early
days--ever aged into anything good.  No other beer I've ever made
changed substantially after three months in the bottle.  This
stuff was known bad after six months in the bottle!

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Date: Mon, 11 Jun 90 15:05 CDT
From: Chain is useless 'gainst false Cupid <PTGARVIN at aardvark.ucs.uoknor.edu>
Subject: How long have hops steeped?

>That process takes about a half-hour.  So how long are the hops steeping
>really?  Some of the wort has the hops in it for only 2 minutes
>(that's the first wort through the chiller), but some of the wort has
>the hops steeping for a half-hour (the last wort through the chiller).
>The rest is obviously somewhere inbetween.  So is this a two-minute
>steep, a half-hour steep, or a fifteen-minute steep, or what?

Sounds like a Calculus problem to me.  8) (for the humor-impaired).

 - Ted, aka Badger on TinyHell
- --
"Strategic withdrawal is running away -- but with dignity." -- Tarrant
ptgarvin at aardvark.ucs.uoknor.edu / ptgarvin at uokmax.UUCP | Eris loves you.
in the Society: Padraig Cosfhota o hUlad / Barony of Namron, Ansteorra
Disclaimer:  Fragile.  Contents inflammable.  Do not use near open flame.

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Date: 11 Jun 90 13:10:02 PDT (Mon)
From: florianb at tekred.cna.tek.com
Subject: Irish Moss--when does it work?

In #436, the quote appears from Ken Weiss (love that name):

>Though I've seen postings to the contrary (from Florian B. if I recall correctl
>I saw a *marked* improvement in clarity when I began adding Irish moss during t
>last 5-10 minutes of boil. I don't know if it's a factor or not, but I also ski
>off the scum that forms on the surface of the boiling wort when the Irish moss 
>added.

Hmm.  It may be that the effectiveness of Irish moss is a function of pH.
I wonder what the scum is; I never skim it off.  The chill haze seems to be 
connected with the use of specialty grains.  I think crystal malt is a real
culprit.  I never get chill haze in my lagers.

Florian [The last name's "Bell"--as in "clear as."

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Date: Mon, 11 Jun 90 20:44:23 MDT
From: hplabs!mage!lou
Subject: vanilla extract

In HBD #436 Marty Albini writes:

>	On the subject of vanilla beans--when cooking with
>vanilla, the later you add it the stronger the taste. Either
>aromatics get driven off by heat, or the stuff breaks down, or
>something. Commercial vanilla extract is ~30% alcohol; maybe
>the flavors are extracted with it rather than heat.

Afriend of mine makes her own vanilla extract by soaking vanilla beans in a
mixture of Everclear and water for a few months (she claims the alcohol content
in commercial extracts are actually more than 35%).  I'll ask her for more
details if anyone is interested.

Louis Clark
reply to: mage!lou at ncar.ucar.edu


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End of HOMEBREW Digest #437, 06/12/90
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