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	FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
		Rob Gardner, Digest Coordinator


Contents:
  Re: A possible cheap brew kettle? (Tom Longstaff)
  RE: spruce essence (mage!lou)
  Samuel Smith Ales (Marc San Soucie)
  Primary fermenter (Todd Koumrian)
  Brewing Equipment (Greg Beary)
  Spruce Beer (Norm Hardy)
  Gelatin Finings & Edme (Martin A. Lodahl)
  Wort Chillers and Fusel Alcohol (Mike Charlton)
  Spruce Essence (Mike Zentner)


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Date: Tue, 3 Jul 90 00:34:53 PDT
From: longstaf at serval.llnl.gov (Tom Longstaff)
Subject: Re: A possible cheap brew kettle?

BTW, as a side note on the "keg as a boiler" discussion, a couple of
us just went to the local Liquor Barn and simply paid the deposit for
an empty keg.  Had a sort of hard time trying to convince them that
we were serious though...  For a $15 deposit we got out keg, and didn't
even have to drink 'ol Bud.  Now does anyone know where we can get an
old water heater?

My first batch is almost ready for bottling... Very much like 'ol
peculiar as it's a heavy ginger and molasses porter (Tumultuous
Porter)... I love this hobby already!

Tom Longstaff		"Relaxing for the first time since my Dissertation!"

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Date: Tue, 3 Jul 90 08:57:25 MDT
From: hplabs!mage!lou
Subject: RE: spruce essence

In HBD #451 Gary Benson asks about spruce essence in beer.

I made a spruce beer about a year ago using the same spruce essence.  The
following recipe for 6.5 gallons is based (loosely) on `Kumdis Island Spruce
Beer' (TCJoHB, p.183):

boil 1 hour:
	6.6 lb. Munton & Fison dark extract
	3 lb. dry dark extract
	3 oz. Cascade hops (4.3% alpha)
	3 tsp. gypsum
add for the last 10 min.:
	1 oz. Cascade hops
	0.5 tsp. flaked Irish Moss
add for the last 2 min.:
	0.5 oz. spruce essence
pitched Leigh & Williams Beer & Stout yeast  at 72F
O.G. 1.040
F.G. 1.018

My only tasting notes on this say that at 2.5 months after bottling it was
"fair".  This tells me that I was remarkably unimpressed with this beer.  My
recollection of it is that it was drinkable but unexciting.  Perhaps the dark
extract overwhelmed the spruce and more spruce essence should have been used.
Where the bottle says "Sufficient for eight galons of spruce beer they may mean
for a somewhat lighter beer.

Louis Clark


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Date: Tue, 3 Jul 90 09:32:48 PDT
From: marcs at SLC.COM (Marc San Soucie)
Subject: Samuel Smith Ales

RussG writes:

> Gary wanted to know about Oatmeal Stout, specifically Samuel Smith. I've
> been fortunate enough to live near a store that is selling cases of all
> types of Sam Smith ales for ~$18.00 US. I've seen them elsewhere for $12.00
> a SIX-PACK! So needless to say, I've had *alot* of SS ales lately, and yes
> the oatmeal stout is tremendous; lightly sweet and VERY smooth. It is
> exceeded only by the amazing Nut Brown Ale, IMHO of course.

A few years back I was fortunate enough to be travelling in England with the
now-wife and a beer-loving friend (aw heck, I dragged them both along, but
where beer's concerned, who cares?), and I insisted, to their not particularly
great dismay, on driving through Yorkshire for what was for me Yet Another
Visit to the Samuel Smith brewery in Tadcaster, which among other things boasts
still-working brewery equipment from the back in the days of Mozart, and a tour
of the premises which lasts over two hours. Yeah, that's a recommendation.
But this time, we missed out on the tour, so we were forced to eat a
gut-stuffing roast beef dinner at the Angel & White Horse next door, quaffing
Sammys left and right, washing the beef down with hot fudge cake and strong
stout. How could life be better? Well, strolling to the shop next door, we
found lovely English pint bottles of Samuel Smith beers, several of them styles
not sold in the U.S., in bottles as clear and carved and elegant as the smaller
12-ounce jobs we get over here, but holding the full English pint. The beers I
had space to bring home included their Old Brewery Bitter, a Strong Brown Ale
which may as well have been the Nut Brown, and my favorite, the Nourishing
Strong Stout, whose label will forever adorn my lagering fridge. Needless to
say, these gorgeous bottles are the prize of the collection, and are always
kept full of proper homebrewed English-style ales. A stiff Dogbolter is due
next, I believe. Still fermenting...

    Marc San Soucie
    Portland, Oregon
    marcs at servio.slc.com

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Date: Tue, 3 Jul 1990 10:04:32 PDT
From: todd at NISC.SRI.COM (Todd Koumrian)
Subject: Primary fermenter

I'm getting ready to gear up, and am considering just going ahead and
setting up for 2 stage fermentation.  I am unclear from what I've read
whether it is desireable to use a food-grade plastic pail or regular
glass carboy for my primary fermenter (secondary will be a glass carboy
for sure).  The glass fermenter would be more durable, but is there some
reason why I've sort of been led to believe I might want to use a
covered food-grade plastic pail with a fermentation lock on it for the primary?

Thanks in advance to anyone who responds!

Todd Koumrian
todd at nisc.sri.com

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Date: Tue, 3 Jul 90 16:35:39 MDT
From: Greg Beary <gbeary at uswat.uswest.com>
Subject: Brewing Equipment

I'm interested in the thread of late on using Stainless Kegs as brew-pots.	
I was going to use the ones I had to cask my beer (I still haven't made any,,,,
I want to get the gear setup first) but  was fortunate to come into foour
Cornellius Kegs. I now need to get the correct taps for these barrels (Coca-colaa
type connectors with "pins"). 	

My question involves using the Stainless Kegs for brew-pots/primary fermenters.
As I understand it, sanitation and contamination are the big issues in
homebrewing. Why shouldn't I cut the top of the keg (7.5 gallons) so that I can
use a LARGE stopper in the hole (assuming I can get one sized very large). 
Then when I brewed beer, I boil it in the barrel, blow some CO2 into the keg to
displace air, stuff in my stopper with an airlock, cool to desired tempartature,
add yeast quickly, restopper, and let ferment. It would seem that I'd have the
advantage of a real clean fermenter, not much air exposure and one less vessel
to clean. Am I nuts. I was also thinking that you could use some stainless
piping for a wort cooler. You'd add the piping during the boil, have both ends
of the piping come through the large stopper, and then circulate water through
the piping to cool the wort. Again, trying to keep air exposure to a minimum. 

One last question, any tips for using used Soda kegs for homebrew. I emptied
the syrup and hosed them down with hot water at the local do-it-yourself car
wash. I then, or rather my wife since she could get her arm into the barrel,
scrubed the barrels and filled them with a bleach and water solution. I have th   
them sitting in my garage with the bleach/water sitting in them. Should I get
new rubber seals for the barrels? Are there any problems I should be aware of?
I didn't remove the connections on top, or the long pipe inside. Does this need
to be done to clean the barrels or am I ok as is?

Thanks,
Greg

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Date: Mon, 2 Jul 90 21:21:22 PDT
From: hplabs!polstra!norm (Norm Hardy)
Subject: Spruce Beer

Gary Benson enquired about using essence of spruce in a beer.  I believe
that Charlie Papazian discusses it in his bible "The Complete Joy of Home
Brewing."  You probably will have to explore the effects of spruce on your
own as very few brewers have ever tried the stuff.

Speaking of the Cellar in Seattle, I would encourage you to keep after them
as they are usually quite knowledgable about homebrewing.  Bruce seems the
best of the three, but Joe and Ron are always helpful to me.  They probably
have not had much exposure to spruce essence.

Norm Hardy, Seattle


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Date: Tue, 3 Jul 90 8:43:17 PDT
From: Martin A. Lodahl <hplabs!pbmoss!mal>
Subject: Gelatin Finings & Edme

In HOMEBREW Digest #452, Ken Weiss observed:

"I opened the first of my Ginger Pale Ale last night ...
"
"This was the first time I added gelatin finings to the beer at bottling
"time, and I have a few questions for anyone experienced in such matters.
"I was impressed by the clarity of the beer. However, I got really
"large amounts of sediment, like 1/8 - 1/4 inch instead of the thin layer
"I usually see. Is this normal?		 [...]
"
"		... Finally, for the first
"time I saw what appeared to be yeast adhering to the sides of the bottles.
"Could this be a function of the gelatin, or more likely the yeast
"(Edme Ale yeast, dry)?

I usually add the finings somewhat earlier, and have only once tried
it at bottling time.  It was not a notable success, in that I ended
up with clumps of gelatin that I couldn't seem to avoid pouring into
the glass.  If that's my choice, I'll take the yeast.  When I fine
about 5 days before bottling, the gelatin and (most of) the yeast
sediment out, and when I rack to the lauter tun before bottling I
leave them both behind.  That's probably why I've never seen as much
sediment as you report:  the surplus yeast never reached the bottle.
And the adhering Edme yeast puzzles me:  one of its virtues seems to
be its readiness to sediment out, leaving the beer clear & attractive.
My most recent batch, in contrast, is still cloudy 4 weeks after
bottling (Wyeast 1007).

"	... it's technically maybe my best brew yet ...

Wow!  That's saying a lot!  The smoke beer, especially, was right tasty!

= Martin A. Lodahl    Pac*Bell Minicomputer Operations Support Staff =
= pacbell!pbmoss!mal  -or-  mal at pbmoss.Pacbell.COM      916.972.4821 =
= If it's good for ancient Druids, runnin' nekkid through the wuids, =
= Drinkin' strange fermented fluids, it's good enough for me!  8-)   =



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Date:  3 Jul 90 19:55 -0500
From: Mike Charlton <umcharl3 at ccu.umanitoba.ca>
Subject: Wort Chillers and Fusel Alcohol

  Hi there.  My brewing partner and I have just finished brewing a batch of
pale ale.  Partly because we have had alot of trouble with fusel alcohol, we
used a wort chiller this time.  According to Miller, one of the nice things
about a wort chiller is that it lets you more easily separate the trub from
the wort.  This should let you cut down on the amount of fusel alcohol
produced.  He suggests in his book to let the wort sit overnight and then
rack off the trub before you pitch the yeast.  He maintains that since the
wort is below 80 degrees F, contamination is not a real problem.  We decided
to pitch the yeast immediately (more for time reasons than for worrying) so
we were not able to rack off the trub.  I have two questions (finally).
Despite the fact that we were unable to rack off the trub, will using a
wort chiller result in lower production of fusel alcohol?  Secondly, we used
WYeast American Ale yeast for the first time (as opposed to the Doric and
Red Star that we were forced to use before).  Will the use of this better
yeast culture reduce the amount of fusel alcohol.  Note that I'm NOT worrying;
I'm sure our beer will be quite good.  I'm just curious to see if anyone else
has looked into this problem and has some insight.
                   Thanks,
                        Mike

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Date: Tue, 3 Jul 90 09:23:37 -0500
From: hpfcla!hplabs!gatech!ee.ecn.purdue.edu!zentner (Mike Zentner)
Subject: Spruce Essence


I used spruce essence somewhere in the middle of the boil.  Here's why
I'd be hesitant to add it at the end:  The bottle I had smelled strongly
of alcohol.  When I poured it in the boil, there was a very strong (not 
good) smell, which smelled just like when you dump brandy in stew, or
whatever.  I assume it was alcohol.  Anyway, I figured that I wouldn't
want to add alcohol to my beer before brewing it, so I just let it boil.
It probably would have boiled off as the wort cooled at the end of the
boil as well, but I was following Papazians recipe for Tumultuous
Porter, so I boiled it.  Anyway, I hope I didn't boil away too much
of the essence.  Next time, I think I'll try to track down some
spruce trimmings and do it naturally for comparison.

Tasted great at bottling about 2 weeks ago.  Can't wait to taste it this
weekend.

Mike Zentner

PS.  Does anybody else out there like the taste (or ever had) Xingu
Black Beer from Brazil?


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End of HOMEBREW Digest #453, 07/04/90
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