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	FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
		Digest Janitor: pbabcock at hbd.org


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Contents:
  Uerige Sticke recipe ("Doug Moyer")
  response to Fredrik and question about WLP005 (Kurt Thorn)
  Dry Hopping ("PAUL SMITH")
  true London yeast: mixture of powdery and flocculant strains (Cindy & Geoff Harrison)
  Vote for the HBD! ("Bill Smith")
  Sea Water? (Alexandre Enkerli)
  Re: Dry Hopping Questions (Tony Brown)
  Beer and Pretzels ("Chris \"Pacman\" Ingermann")


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Date: Mon, 3 Jan 2005 00:29:10 -0500
From: "Doug Moyer" <shyzaboy at yahoo.com>
Subject: Uerige Sticke recipe

Today I had a bottle of Uerige Sticke. (And, no, I'm not interested in
hearing how much better it is fresh at the brewery. Good for you.)

Anyone with a reasonably good recipe?

p.s. cool bottle!

Brew on!

Doug Moyer
Troutville, VA

Star City Brewers Guild: http://www.starcitybrewers.org

Shzabrau Homebrewery: http://users.adelphia.net/~shyzaboy/homebrewery.html




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Date: Mon, 3 Jan 2005 21:41:40 -0500 
From: Kurt Thorn <Kthorn at CGR.Harvard.edu>
Subject: response to Fredrik and question about WLP005

First, in response to Fredrik's comments about yeast viability and yeast
shape:

As far as the viability counts go, I feel like you're probably doing pretty
well if your results from staining and cfus agree to within a factor of two.
Some of the more flocculant brewing strains are probably so clumpy as to
make either method somewhat suspect (although when I looked at WLP007, which
is quite flocculant, under the scope it doesn't look clumpy at all).  In
general, when I do cell counts in my professional life, I assume that
anything that could be a budded yeast or two cells stuck together I count as
one cell.  If I see three little spheres stuck together I assume its two
cells (one budded and one unbudded).  I saw a clever correction for sticking
in one of Lee Hartwells classic cell cycle genetics papers, but I don't
remember it now.  If you're really serious, you can try and reduce clumping
by vigorous shaking or sonication, or you can try adding EDTA, but these
often don't help that much.
Also in the 'really serious' department - molecular probes makes a nice
yeast viability staining kit
(http://www.probes.com/servlets/product?item=7009) but it requires a
fluorescence microscope.
In general, it's not clear to me why a two-fold difference in cell counting
is going to matter much in brewing.

As for the rod-shaped cells, it's entirely possible that they're normal
yeast.  Some yeast mutants have trouble controlling their shape, and I see
no reason why some brewing strains might not have the same problem.  If you
send me a photo I can let you know if I think they look like yeast or not.

Now, on to a new question:
I brewed a batch of an English-style pale ale two weeks ago, and fermented
it with White Labs WLP005 British Ale Yeast.  It has a pronounced estery
nose that I wasn't expecting.  It seems to be mellowing with age, but does
anyone have any experience with this?  I thought at first that it might have
been fermented too warm, but the temperature was probably between 66 F and
70 F, and mostly at the lower end, I expect.

Finally, thanks for all the recommendations for books on mashing.  I have
some reading to do!

Kurt
kthorn at cgr.harvard.edu


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Date: Tue, 4 Jan 2005 06:54:17 -0500
From: "PAUL SMITH" <pksmith_morin1 at msn.com>
Subject: Dry Hopping

"Date: Thu, 30 Dec 2004 08:55:56 -0500
From: "Doug Moyer" <shyzaboy at yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: Dry Hopping Questions

Tony asks about the green hop gunk floating in his fermentor after he dry
hopped with pellets.

I like to use pellets for dry hopping. (I use whole hops exclusively in the
boil.) Since I ferment in carboys, it is a royal pain to put whole hops into
the secondary. (Unless you get plugs, which you can cut in half, but I
haven't seen a good assortment in plugs.)

I usually rouse the beer once or twice a day. This causes the floating hop
pieces to sink partially. After a week of rousing, the hop bits gradually
settle to the bottom.

If the beer is still too full of bits, I'll transfer to a tertiary fermentor
for additional settling. (To stop the dry hopping - don't want one
dimensional beer, or rotting hops...)

As to filtering, any filter material you use will clog immediately if it is
fine enough to filter out the yeast. Not a worry. You might try a hop bag
(properly sterilized) attached to the end of your racking cane.



Brew on!

Doug Moyer
Troutville, VA"

You might also try crash cooling.  On day 2 or 3 of your dry hop, crash your 
ferment to just above freezing.  This is commercial practice and works 
beautifully to bring the hop slurry down, pulling a good deal of break with 
it.

Paul 


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Date: Tue, 04 Jan 2005 11:39:54 -0500
From: Cindy & Geoff Harrison <gharriso at up.net>
Subject: true London yeast: mixture of powdery and flocculant strains

Regarding mixed strains of English yeasts: in my rather fallible memory
banks, I recall that Worthington White Shield, for a long time the last
regular production bottle conditioned beer in England, was famous for using
a mixed strain, one which was a fast starter and another which perked along
and then flocculated, I think. Traditional White Shield was from
Burton-Upon-Trent. Otherwise, I've read about traditional English yeasts
being of mixed strains in a general sense, in that they hadn't been purified.

I don't ever remember reading anything about London breweries specifically,
or characteristically and purposefully using mixed strains?

Geoff Harrison
Kraueuseners
Houghton, MI
The Harrisons
1120 E. 7th Ave.
Houghton, MI
49931


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Date: Tue, 04 Jan 2005 17:24:22 +0000
From: "Bill Smith" <billsmith11 at hotmail.com>
Subject: Vote for the HBD!

Chef 2 Chef is a web site for food, chefs, restaurants, wine and beer. They 
have a popularity contest where you can vote for your favorite web sites and 
they have a favorite beer web site category. I nominated The HBD. There's 
some great hb links in the list including The Brewery, ProMash and 
SkotRat's.

You can go to http://chef2chef.net/rank/beersites.shtml and vote. You 
probably won't find HBD on the first page right away so click on the 
"[26-50] [51-75] [76-100]" links to find it. You can only vote once a day so 
be sure to come back everyday!

You can also go and vote for your favorite beers at 
http://chef2chef.net/rank/beers.shtml. There certainly are some Red Hook 
homers running up the score.

Hoppy New Beer,
Bill Smith




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Date: Tue, 4 Jan 2005 12:37:50 -0500
From: Alexandre Enkerli <aenkerli at indiana.edu>
Subject: Sea Water?

A friend sent some info about a French brewery which brews using sea 
water. They claim some iodine aroma in their brews so they probably 
don't treat the water much.
Here's the brewery's website (in French):
http://perso.wanadoo.fr/morbraz/

Given the importance of brewing water, it'd be interesting to know the 
effect of sea water on brewing.
By any chance, did any HBDer try a sea water beer? If so, was there any 
head retention? Was the bitterness very sharp?
If you brewed one, how was conversion? Was the mash blue?? ;-)

Sante'!

AleX in Montreal
[555.1km, 62.8] ApparentRennerianCoordinates



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Date: Tue, 4 Jan 2005 18:09:10 -0500
From: Tony Brown <speleobopper at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Dry Hopping Questions

I just opened my first bottle and it is very tasty! 

What I did was...boiled a filter bag and placed it in the bottling
bucket.  When I racked into the bottling bucket all of the beer went
through the filter bag.  I made sure to keep the hose below the
surface of the beer in the bucket to prevent aeration.  This
apparently let the yeast in and the hop sediment out.  It only took 4
days to carbonate.  Yum!

Thanks to everyone for their help!


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Date: Tue, 4 Jan 2005 19:08:18 -0800 (PST)
From: "Chris \"Pacman\" Ingermann" <maltmasher at yahoo.com>
Subject: Beer and Pretzels

Mmm mmm mmm...

I came across Jeff Renner's pretzel recipe I had printed out a
long time ago and decided to finally give them a try tonight.
Man o man are they good. I've got a little work to do on making
them look a little better but the taste is phenomenal. 

Have a look at them: 

http://www.ingermann.com/images/food/Pretzels-1.jpg

Thanks Jeff!



=====
Chris "Pacman" Ingermann
Damn Brewing's Fun!!!!
Muncie, Indiana
http://www.ingermann.com


		


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