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	FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
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Contents:
  Motorizing a PhilMill ("Gordon Strong")
  Cheap goodies (David)
  Pellets, Flowers & Kettle drains ("Mike Maag")
  re: Corny keg lids ("Michel J. Brown")
  re: strange fermentation - HELP ("Michel J. Brown")
  re: Where to cut kegs for kettles? ("Michel J. Brown")
  re: Kettle Braid ("Michel J. Brown")
  Reculturing yeast from previous bottled brews (Oisin Boydell)
  Re: Current events + lager temps (Jeff Renner)
  RE: Motorizing a Philmill ("Pat Babcock")


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Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2005 08:28:58 -0400
From: "Gordon Strong" <strongg at speakeasy.net>
Subject: Motorizing a PhilMill

I'm not sure why a hacksaw is necessary for motorizing a PhilMill.  Dan 
sells little drill adapters to replace the handle.  I use mine with a 1/2" 
Porter-Cable drill and it works like a champ.  Also, rather than using a 2L 
pop bottle, I mounted an inverted 5-gallon plastic water jug (like the kind 
you see at water coolers, or you use to buy RO water) with the base cut off 
on mine.  It holds about 20-22 lb of grain, good enough for most 5 gallon 
batches of beer.  With a corded drill and a big grain hopper, it's 
fire-and-forget at milling time.  Run the output into a big grain bucket (I 
use metallic dryer vent hose to move the grain from the mill to the bucket 
to keep dust down) and you can then easily move it to your mash tun.

Gordon Strong
"A Happy Phil Mill I Customer Since 1997" 




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Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2005 08:47:50 -0700
From: David <jdlcr at flash.netdex.com>
Subject: Cheap goodies

   For Randy Pressly...I bought the drill adapter for my Philmill through
Williams Brewing. Works like a charm for about $5.
   Speaking of cheap purchases I was wondering if the HBDrs out there might
wish to share similiar inexpensive purchases that have made their brewing so
much easier. Here's one: Beverage People (Santa Rosa, CA) has a siphon
starter for $4 or so that is just a large syringe that starts flow
faithfully. Anyone else?
David Brandt
Cloverdale, CA 



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Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2005 20:50:44 -0500
From: "Mike Maag" <maagm at rica.net>
Subject: Pellets, Flowers & Kettle drains

Rowan:
>>I feel that a simple wire mesh screen tube works just as well, albeit not
>>for pellets as they will plug a screen right away...[snip]

>Therein lies my problem - I almost exclusively use pellets.  I note that, 
>at
>least within this digest, opinions tend to vary about the risk of blockages
>with braided hose - some do, some don't.  Anyway, I'll give it a go and see
>what happens, but I'm not looking forward to a worst case scenario of 
>having
>to clean out a CFWC!!

I have found, what you need to do is let the wort sit (or set) for about 1 
hour after
chilling, before you start to drain the kettle.
Wirlpool, cover, and let the wort sit for at least 1 hour..
Don't use Irish Moss!!  It gunks up's the trub too much.. you don't need it.
As long as you let the wort settle out, the pellet stuff will be settled out 
too.
  It helps to have a ounce of flower hops in the boil.  Just a handfull
of homegrown hops will help keep the trub in a nice pile in the middle
of the kettle.
My system has a copper pipe circle with hacksaw cuts every 1/4 inch on
 the bottom.  But the main point is to let the stuff settle before you start
to drain.
Otherwise, the pellet stuff in the wort can clog the screen (or whatever)
as the wort drains.
Hope this helps,
Mike Maag




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Date: Sun, 24 Apr 2005 09:04:54 -0700
From: "Michel J. Brown" <zymurgyst at comcast.net>
Subject: re: Corny keg lids

>About a couple years ago I questioned the HBD about cleaning Corny
>kegs. I wondered how does Coke clean the kegs.

The same way most people clean them in the industry, either with hot caustic 
soda, or hot glacial acetic acid, followed by a live steam bath.  I 
recommend using an acidic peroxide blend, like Oxyclean for a CIP cleaner. 
Email me for a price on my own line of CIP cleaner for homebrewers.

>Still waiting to find out just how does Pepsi clean their kegs.

Never did see their plant, but Imagine it would be similar, as food handling 
processes vary little by industry.  When I worked as a Food Tech, we used 
caustic on SS, and glacial on tile, worked like a charm, especially followed 
by either live steam, or hot (180'F) water.

>I hear people talking about marking and keeping the lid with each keg.
>Hmm, do you think Coke keeps a database on each lid??? It would seem
>that the lids should be able to migrate at will to any compatible keg.
>Would anyone in their right mind design anything differently?

Fwiw, from my own personal experience (YMMV), even though the hole is 
similar in size and shape, different lids will not seal as well in other 
kegs.  That's why I make mine with my wife's nail polish (not a flavor to be 
found in my beer) so I don't accidentally mix them up.

>With soda, the pressure is certainly more than the 10-12 PSI we use
>for beer, so I think that would cause the large lid seal O-ring to
>seal nicely. Perhaps the answer is the larger, softer O-ring available
>from certain sources.

That sounds like an interesting idea, perhaps I'll try that sometime.  But 
in the meanwhile, I'm still using the original O ring as supplied, and it 
seems to work just fine.  Try silicone sealer if you think you may have 
leakage problems with the lid ring.

>Ron

Prost!

Michel

Somewhere in the unfashionable eastern end of Mutter's Spiral in the Milky 
Way 



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Date: Sun, 24 Apr 2005 09:17:48 -0700
From: "Michel J. Brown" <zymurgyst at comcast.net>
Subject: re: strange fermentation - HELP

>I don't have a wort chiller yet and just usually let the wort cool in the 6 
>gal carboy (sealed) till the >next day when I pitch the yeast... Well this 
>time I waited 2+ days... I also switched from store >bought "spring" water 
>to well water run through a new whole house filter (in-line on the hose 
> >outside... its a rental house).

Delayed cooling is the single most detrimental cause of bad fermentations 
IMHO.  Get your SO to buy you a chiller, or make one yourself!  2+ days is 
like playing Russian Roulette with your wort.


>Well the fermentation did a very little, no active blow off as before on 
>day 2 or 3... After 5 days I >again pitched more yeast (thinking I had 
>killed or weakened somehow the initial batch) and after >12+ hours just a 
>little bit more activity than before.

This sounds more like something in the water, IMHO.  The only change besides 
your cooling and pitching times is the water you are using.  Have you 
checked the filter?  Also, do you know the water's composition vs. your 
previous water?  Try the same recipe again, this time using bottled water 
and see if the results change.  May just well be that your household water 
is the culprit.

>Sean McCabe
>Greenfield Mills, Maryland
>
Prost!

Michel

Somewhere in the unfashionable eastern end of Mutter's Spiral in the Milky 
Way



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Date: Sun, 24 Apr 2005 09:24:41 -0700
From: "Michel J. Brown" <zymurgyst at comcast.net>
Subject: re: Where to cut kegs for kettles?

>Getting ready to have kegs cut for use as brew kettles.  Is there any 
>consensus on what size >opening to cut?
>
Anything from a 12" to a 15" hole is fine.  I've used 12" with great success 
in the past.
>
>Should we find lids first and cut after measuring for lids?
>
Why bother?  Simply take the 12" section that you cut out, and wrap a 37.7" 
length of high temp silicone tubing, and slice it open along the inside of 
the curl, and wrap it around the diameter of the cutout top.  Presto! You 
now have a lid for the cost of about 3 feet of tubing.

>Any info or suggestions would be appreciated. Mike
>
Not a problem, Mike, good luck, and God Bless!
Prost!

Michel

Somewhere in the unfashionable eastern end of Mutter's Spiral in the Milky 
Way 



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Date: Sun, 24 Apr 2005 09:49:27 -0700
From: "Michel J. Brown" <zymurgyst at comcast.net>
Subject: re: Kettle Braid

>Does the whirlpool lift the pellet debris into the centre of the kettle or 
>is it the case that pellet >residue is too light and simply settles where 
>it sees fit after the whirlpool?
>
The centrifugal force applied results in the (relatively) higher weight 
(mass) particles to go to the sides and bottom, while the lighter ones stay 
on top.  I prefer to let gravity have its way with my system, and let the 
whole leaf hops ( one inch plugs are also fine) drop to the bottom, and let 
the hot break form on top of the hop mass.  This results in a very clear 
wort, that when pulled through the hopback, looks very clean.
>
>Therein lies my problem - I almost exclusively use pellets.
>
Hopefully that won't be an issue with the braided SS hose.  It works for my 
buddy, who uses a similar setup with six feet of spiraled flat (like a rope 
on board ships) braided SS hose.
>
>I note that, at least within this digest, opinions tend to vary about the 
>risk of blockages with >braided hose - some do, some don't.
>
Sounds like different manufacturer's or different sizes of hose to me.  I 
trust in my modified EZ masher tube screen. But then again, I use whole hop 
flowers, and not pellets, and the odd plug or two upon occasion.
>
>Anyway, I'll give it a go and see what happens, but I'm not looking forward 
>to a worst case >scenario of having to clean out a CFWC!!
>
Easy to clean, IMHO.  Just put 1/4 cup of acidic peroxide blend, like the 
one I sell, in 3-5 gallons of hot (mash hot temp is fine) water, and draw 
through your CFWC until its all gone, then flush with equal amount of 
similar temp hot water.  Guaranteed to clean out even the most stubborn 
CFWC's.
>
Prost!

Michel

Somewhere in the unfashionable eastern end of Mutter's Spiral in the Milky 
Way 



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Date: Sun, 24 Apr 2005 21:23:12 +0100
From: Oisin Boydell <oisinboydell at gmail.com>
Subject: Reculturing yeast from previous bottled brews

I am relatively new to brewing and I have the following question which
may be obvious to more experienced brewers...

I have read about re-culturing yeast from bottled commercial beers.
Are there any major problems with doing the same from previous beers
that I have brewed and bottled?

Recently I brewed a English bitter ale using Wyeast 1098 British Ale
yeast which I bottled. If I re-culture yeast from one of these bottles
will it have the same viability and performance as from the original
smack-pack?

I have heard of storing yeast between brews in the fridge using
various mediums etc. but it would seem to me far easier just to
re-culture the yeast from a bottle of the previous brew, especially
since I am not able to brew very often.


Thanks,
Oisin.



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Date: Sun, 24 Apr 2005 18:52:52 -0400
From: Jeff Renner <jeffrenner at comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Current events + lager temps

"Jason Gross" <jrgross at hotmail.com> writes from Mandan, ND

>The U.S. Department of Agriculture is projecting North Dakota production to
>be 1.2 million acres, only three-fourths the size of the 2004 crop and the
>lowest level in recorded history..."

Jason - we count on you guys up there in ND to keep an eye on things 
and head off trouble before it becomes a crisis!  You've been 
spending too much time on those brewing fridges and have forgotten to 
do rain dances and seed the clouds.  How very selfish of you not to 
think of the rest of us.

>Also heard on the radio this morning that the hops in Washington and Oregon
>(80+% of US crop) are starting to feel the effects of draught.  This year's
>harvest isn't looking good.

Yeah, I saw that, too.

>I'm looking forward to turning Jeff Renner's CACA into CAP.  Sounds biblical.

It's even better as a lager!  I've got one on now that is top notch. 
Driest I've ever made - it fermented out from 1.050 to 1.008, for 84% 
apparent attenuation, and is hopped to mid to upper 30's IBUs. 
Really nice.  Quite different from the ones that have fermented out 
low 70s%.

What I did differently this time, aside from mashing for full 
attenuation, was to lazily leave it at 48F for five weeks because it 
just kept slowly fermenting.  It was so pale and relatively clear 
that I could see bubbles rising in it like in a freshly poured glass 
of beer.  Then I lagered it for an additional two weeks at ~32F, then 
raised it to ~40F for dispensing.

Not necessarily a recommended procedure, but it seems to have worked. 
Normally, I rack to a keg when the fermentation slows and seal it, 
then drop the temperature to lagering and let the last few points 
ferment out at lagering temperature - close to freezing.

>Now, the yeasts' optimal fermentation temp is 48 F.  I've got the Ranco set
>to turn on at 53 F and off at 46 F, where the temperature is measured in the
>enclosed air.  Is this OK?  What's an acceptable temp swing?

There is a big thermal mass in your beer, so I am quite sure that 
with those settings, the beer will not vary much at all.

>What about when I ease it down to lagering temps?

A common rule is to drop it slowly - 3-5 degrees F per day, to keep 
from harming the yeast.  I don't bother dropping the setting each 
day, figuring that the thermal mass in 7.75 gallons of beer will slow 
the drop in temperature.  I'll set the fridge to 40F for a few days, 
then drop it to about 32F.  But I do find that you can be rather 
sloppy in this and things turn out fine.

>I'd like to increase the range, so I
>don't burn out the compressor in one season.  Any objections?  The fridge is
>in a soon-to-be hot garage.  What are good settings?  My thoughts are 31-39;
>but that sounds kind of warm on the high end, although it probably won't be
>there too long.

I like to lager at ~32F or so, so you could set it to 28-36F.  But if 
you feel that that would be too much energy for the hot garage, then 
you will certainly get good results with your suggested range.

I hope we get hot garages here soon - we've had a spring snow storm 
over the last 20 hours or so.  About 5" /13 cm of snow accumulated, 
with more forecast for this evening.  Probably more has fallen, but 
with temperatures hovering at around freezing, some has melted and/or 
compacted.

Jeff
- -- 
Jeff Renner in Ann Arbor, Michigan USA, JeffRenner at comcast.net
"One never knows, do one?"  Fats Waller, American Musician, 1904-1943


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Date: Sun, 24 Apr 2005 21:00:35 -0400
From: "Pat Babcock" <pbabcock at hbd.org>
Subject: RE: Motorizing a Philmill

Greetings, Beerlings! Take me to your (unused) lager...

I return from a refreshing, if unsuccessful, weekend of turkey hunting to find
that Dan has written...

> Randy Pressley writes,"I'm curious as to why there is a warning in the
> manual about not motorizing the Phil's mill?  "  I am not sure where he got
> this idea 

I think he's mistookenly quoting what the archives may have to say about the 
Schmidling MaltMill. Don't know if it is still true, but the paperwork 
received with the beast back in the day used to admonished the buyer against
doing so, lest the winged beasts of Warranty would come fly over and void upon
you. Or something like that.

- --

See ya!

Pat Babcock in SE Michigan
Chief of HBD Janitorial Services
http://hbd.org
pbabcock at hbd.org



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