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	FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
		Digest Janitor: pbabcock at hbd.org


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Contents:
  Re: Sight Glass Material (Scott Alfter)
  Re: Hop Storage (Scott Alfter)
  Re.Sight Glass ("Martin Ammon")
  festbier base malt help (Richard Seyler)
  Re.Site Glass ("Martin Ammon")
  Re: Faro? (Ed Westemeier)
  Pumping (Disappearing) Iodophor - Copper loves Iodine... (Robert S Wallace)
  RE: Hop Storage ("Rich Beecher")
  Brewing Equipment Review - PhilMill ("Dave Hopf")
  Vittles Vault Stackable 60 ("Doug Moyer")
  Sight glass material ("Doug Moyer")
  Sight glass - shipping ("Doug Moyer")


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Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 10:55:59 -0700
From: Scott Alfter <scott at alfter.us>
Subject: Re: Sight Glass Material

Bob Tower wrote:
> Does anyone have any ideas for an ELEGANT way of marking the volumes  
> on the sight glass?

I have a handheld label maker that I use to mark bottle caps, kegs, carboys,
etc. with their contents.  You can get clear label stock for these that would
be perfect for marking a sight glass.  They're fairly durable and easy to read.
 Print out a label with gallon markings and an arrow or other pointer, fill
your container a gallon at a time, and stick a label on wherever it stops.  (I
recalibrated a 5-imperial-gallon fermenter to read up to 7 US gallons this way.)

  _/_  Scott Alfter
 / v \ Visit the SNAFU website today!
(IIGS( http://snafu.alfter.us/      Top-posting!
 \_^_/ rm -rf /bin/laden            >What's the most annoying thing on Usenet?



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Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 10:47:25 -0700
From: Scott Alfter <scott at alfter.us>
Subject: Re: Hop Storage

Stephen Johnson wrote:
> I just saw an ad for a new Glad food storage product: Press and Seal
> Freezer Wrap sheets that are designed to store food products in the
> freezer. They are sheets of wrap that can be laid flat and the food item
> placed in between, followed by pressing action that seals the two sheets
> together. Has anyone tried these for use with storing hops that have
> been opened from original packaging? Just curious as to how oxygen
> permeable they might be...

I can't say that I've tried these, but I recently made a beer with some
year-old hops that had been vacuum-packed with a FoodSaver and frozen.  It's a
California common made with whole-leaf Northern Brewer, and it has plenty of
woody hop flavor and aroma.  Bags sold for vacuum packing should be a sure bet
for keeping oxygen out, as a bag that lets air in would be useless for that
purpose.

(Vacuum packing also does a good job of compressing whole hops so they'll take
less space in the freezer.)

  _/_  Scott Alfter
 / v \ Visit the SNAFU website today!
(IIGS( http://snafu.alfter.us/      Top-posting!
 \_^_/ rm -rf /bin/laden            >What's the most annoying thing on Usenet?




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Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 10:01:19 -0500
From: "Martin Ammon" <SURFSUPKS at KC.RR.COM>
Subject: Re.Sight Glass 

Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 08:11:33 -0500
From: "Martin Ammon" <SURFSUPKS at KC.RR.COM>
Subject: Re.Sight Glass

I make a scale that hangs behind the sight glass from a piece of alum. flat
stock 1/8 x 1.  I support the top of the sight and hang the scale from that.
I stamp in numbers  for each gallon and a cross bar stamp at each gallon.
Spray paint and than polish it the paint stays in the numbers and cross
bars.  I use glass tubing and have tried polycarbonate.  The polycarbonate
is not bad but has a problem that it wants to warp from heat and also
scratch from the cleaning brush.  I use oil galley brushes to clean the
tubes.
I have a source for both here in Kansas City T.G. Rankin they will cut and
ship what you need the glass I buy 1/2, the poly. they have only in 5/8.  I
use a 90 degree  compression x 1/4 male pipe with an O ring for the
fittings and a 1/4 pipe coupler that is welded into the tanks. T.G. Rankin
can be reached a 816-421-4646 ask for Bob Allen.  Hope this helps.

Its never too early only late
M. Ammon
aka KANSAS SWAGMAN




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Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 10:58:35 -0400
From: Richard Seyler <rseyler at gmail.com>
Subject: festbier base malt help

In anticipation of brewing an Octoberfest, I bought a bag of
Weissheimer Munich at a recent club bulk buy.  My plan was to use this
and Dingeman Pilsner malts in percentages to yield a dark orange
(9-11L) color.  Now, in reading the Fixs' Classic BeerStyle Series
text on this style, they state that that vienna and munich malts are
not good choices due to a grainy harshness they impart (even the
well-regarded European varieties) (pp.35-36), and their recipies call
for a Moravian Pilsner base (75%) with german crystal, english
caramel, and other dark malts making up the balance to a 9-12L color. 
Other style guidelines suggest the use of munich/viennas exclusively
for this style.  Because the Fix book is 14 years old, I am wondering
whether there has been a change in these malts that make them more
appropriate, now.  George and Laurie suggest that 19th century
high-kilned base malts were of better quality than the 21st century
versions.  I have used the munich to good effect (but in smaller
portions) in an IIPA where a harsh graininess from this malt might not
be noticed anyway.  Perhaps, a low- or no-sparge approach would help. 
Or should I go with the Fix suggestions?

Anythoughts?  I plan to brew in two days, so I would appreciate any
feed back be copied to tad at vt.edu to avoid any delays in being qeued
on the digest.  Thanks for any insight!  --Tad



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Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 08:11:33 -0500
From: "Martin Ammon" <SURFSUPKS at KC.RR.COM>
Subject: Re.Site Glass 

I make a scale that hangs behind the sight glass from a piece of alum. flat
stock 1/8 x 1.  I support the top of the site and hang the scale from that.
I stamp in numbers  for each gallon and a cross bar stamp at each gallon.
Spray paint and than polish it the paint stays in the numbers and cross
bars.  I use glass tubing and have tried polycarbonate.  The polycarbonate
is not bad but has a problem that it wants to warp from heat and also
scratch from the cleaning brush.  I use oil galley brushes to clean the
tubes.
I have a source for both here in Kansas City T.G. Rankin they will cut and
ship what you need the glass I buy 1/2, the poly. they have only in 5/8.  I
use a 90 degree  compression x 1/4 male pipe with an O ring for the
fittings and a 1/4 pipe coupler that is welded into the tanks. T.G. Rankin
can be reached a 816-421-4646 ask for Bob Allen.  Hope this helps.

Its never too early only late
M. Ammon
aka KANSAS SWAGMAN




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Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 06:58:19 -0400
From: Ed Westemeier <hopfen at malz.com>
Subject: Re: Faro?


On May 24, 2005, leavitdg at plattsburgh.edu wrote:
>
> Anybody made "Faro"?  It is apparently a Lambic that is sweetened  
> with candi
> sugar?

Just a word of caution on this.
When I spoke to Jean van Roy at Cantillon a couple of years ago, he  
said they no longer made faro except on special order, and they give  
the buyer very strict guidance on delivery time.

It seems that people were ordering cases of faro for special events  
like weddings, and getting them months in advance as part of the  
planning process. By the time the wedding rolled around, they had  
glass grenades that were beginning to explode (even in the heavy  
Cantillon bottles).

The sugar added at bottling, coupled with the appetites of the wee  
beasties in the lambic, will produce a great deal of bottle  
refermentation (with the associated carbon dioxide), given enough time.

Now, Cantillon insists that the faro must be consumed within a month  
of delivery.

Good stuff, but since homebrewers are likely to use bottles of lesser  
strength, this is a factoid you may want to keep in mind.

Ed Westemeier




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Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 03:33:02 -0500
From: Robert S Wallace <rwallace at iastate.edu>
Subject: Pumping (Disappearing) Iodophor - Copper loves Iodine...

At 10:07 PM 5/24/2005, John Peed wrote:
>Date: Tue, 24 May 2005 09:08:46 -0700
>From: "Peed, John" <jpeed at elotouch.com>
>Subject: Pumping iodophor
>
>
>No, it's not a new workout video, it's yet another way to strip iodophor
>of its power.  You know how heat and sunlight will cause an iodophor
>solution to lose its color (and its ability to sanitize)?  Well, I've
>been pumping it through a convoluted counterflow chiller and, lo and
>behold, it turns clear in a matter of minutes.  I replace with new
>iodophor solution every ten to fifteen minutes and it just turns clear
>again each time.  Anyone know what's up with that?  I'm using a BBB pump
>and convoluted copper chiller.  Water is no more than 70 degrees and the
>whole assembly is in the shade.
>
>John Peed
>Oak Ridge, TN

Light probably isn't a factor, as the inside of your counterflow chiller is
likely fairly dark (!)

It sounds like the iodine ions (and/or carrier molecules) are binding to
the inside surfaces copper metal of your chiller.  If one does a Google
search on 'copper iodide' [ CuI ], you can see a variety of sites and
papers devoted to the reaction of copper with iodine, which forms a whitish
or off-white precipitate (probably has changed the color of the copper
surfaces contacting the inside of your chiller), a form of chemical
"tarnishing".  Iodine, being one of the halide elements, is highly reactive
with metal (and other) ions.  I can remember doing a simple 'solution
chemistry' experiment (back in the Pleistocene era) using copper and iodide
ions to form a characteristic precipitate.....  the iodophor carries iodine
ions in solution to deliver them to the surfaces to be sanitized -
including the copper surface of your chiller.

          You can do the 'kitchen chemistry experiment" (or more
appropriately, 'brewery experiment") by taking a piece of solid copper wire
(such as that used for house wiring), brighten the surface of the wire with
some steel wool (to assure a clean copper metal surface), and immerse in
your iodophor solution. Note any color change on the metal surface - this
is what likely is happening in your counterflow chiller, relevant to your
"disappearing" iodophor solution; the iodine is being bound to the copper
in your chiller.

          Perhaps a chemist can suggest a benign treatment method to remove
the surface copper iodide that will be minimally destructive to the
chiller's "innerds"... use of strong inorganic acids (sulfuric, nitric) 
that would
destroy the CuI, would also make short work of dissolving the chiller itself.

          Cheers,

          Rob Wallace


Robert S. Wallace, Ph.D.
Associate Professor of Botany
Department of Ecology, Evolution, and Organismal Biology
Iowa State University
Ames, Iowa 50011-1020  U.S.A.




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Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 03:37:14 -0400
From: "Rich Beecher" <rbeecher at hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: Hop Storage

25 May

    A question was raised about the use of plastic storage bags for hops. I 
recommend the use of glass "canning jars" with the metal canning lids. I use 
them for my hop pellets, and store them in the freezer. Most grocery stores 
will carry canning jars.

Rich Beecher
Chattanooga, TN
CSA




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Date: Tue, 24 May 2005 21:57:58 -0700
From: "Dave Hopf" <hopfbrau at quetzalloca.com>
Subject: Brewing Equipment Review - PhilMill

PhilMill Grain mill (Listermann Manufacturing)
Price: $117.90  ($109.95 + $7.95 for the drill adapter)
Pros: Best crush you could ever hope to get
Cons: Slower than other roller mills
Recommended: YES
 
I purchased the PhilMill a couple of months ago and have been using it
ever since.  I knew it was slow, so I planned to power it from the
start. In fact, I have yet to use the hand crank.
 
It came bolted to a small oak board with j-hooks wing nuts for clamping
to a table top.  Though functional, I did not care for this arrangement.

Modifications were in order.
 
This is going to be hard to describe, so bear with me.  You know how
plastic buckets fit inside one another until they hit the external ring
that the handle connects to?  Well, I took one new bucket and cut the
bottom off about 2 inches below this ring.  I threw the bottom half away
and used the top part to mount the mill.
 
I mounted the mill on a 6" wide oak board. This board was cut to fit
horizontally on the inside of the bucket, flush with the top of the
bucket and is held in place with screws. The shaft protrudes out a hole
drilled in the side.  There is enough room on the sides of the board to
reach in and grab a sample or adjust the gap.
 
Now I have something that works. I simply place the bucket top on an
empty bucket and mill away.  When finished, I set the mill aside and
proceed to the mash tun with my bucket of milled grain.
 
This mill produces an absolutely beautiful crush. When powered by the
drill motor, the speed is satisfactory. Furthermore, the mill is easily
powered with my 3/8" drill motor. The torque requirements actually drop
as the motor spins faster.  I usually mill at around less than half
speed because it doesn't mill much faster at full speed.
 
I suppose that it takes less than 5 minutes to fill a five gallon bucket
to the brim with milled grain.  Since I only have a 10 gallon mash ton,
I am perfectly happy to sacrifice speed for a better crush.  You might
consider something faster when you are regularly milling more than 50
pounds of grain at a time.
 
Unlike other mills, this mill has a single knurled roller that crushes
the grain against a curved plate that wraps around the roller. Instead
of pinching the grain between 2 rollers like the other mills, the grain
is crushed as it is pulled between the roller and the plate. This
results in a slower and gentler crush. Even when crushed to the
equivalent of coarse corn meal, the husks appear to be left mostly
intact.
 
A 2-liter plastic pop bottle is used for the hopper.  Someday I may
build a larger hopper with a larger opening to feed more grain to the
mill. But this is not a pressing need as the pop-bottle gets the job
done at my current capacity.
 
On the downside, the drill attachment was shipped bent. I found this out
the first time I used the mill. It shook terribly, but got the job done.
Afterwards, I contacted Dan Listermann and he promptly sent a
replacement. After installing the replacement shaft, most of the
vibration went away but not all. I suspect that the smaller shoulder
bolt on the other side of the roller is also slightly bent.  I've never
bothered to report this other issue but I have no doubt that it would
get it resolved if I did. A little vibration causes the grain to flow
better anyway.
 
All in all I am very happy with my PhilMill. I think that it is a
brilliant design that flies in the face of more expensive 2 and 3 roller
mills. I am afraid that its simplicity escapes a lot of people who tend
to think "bigger is better" and "faster is better" and even "more
expensive is better". Let them think whatever they want.
 
 -= Dave 
Issaquah, WA



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Date: Tue, 24 May 2005 23:23:30 -0400
From: "Doug Moyer" <shyzaboy at yahoo.com>
Subject: Vittles Vault Stackable 60

Brewers,

For some time, I've been meaning to look for a good source for the Gamma 
Plastics Vittles Vault 60 lb. stackable storage bins.

http://www.gammaplastics.com/pages/GPplist.html

(Last item on the page.)

While searching through US Plastics website (for polycarbonate tubes), I 
remembered my quest. So, I went googling.

The best price that I found was at:

http://www.kvvet.com/

(Search on item number 81692)

They were $34.95 each, with shipping (to VA) of $3.19 each. (I bought four.) 
I found several sites with cheaper unit prices, but much higher shipping 
(some almost $20 each!).

If anyone is looking, this is much better than buying them at PetsMart for 
$55....

Brew on!
Doug Moyer

Troutville, VA

p.s. if you found a cheaper source, I DON'T want to know about it!




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Date: Tue, 24 May 2005 22:53:11 -0400
From: "Doug Moyer" <shyzaboy at yahoo.com>
Subject: Sight glass material

"Dave Hopf" <hopfbrau at quetzalloca.com> suggests Cynmar's borosilicate
tubes. But, Dave, they only go up to 12 mm. I am looking for 5/8" OD (16
mm).

Fred Johnson <FLJohnson at portbridge.com> laments that you have to cut
holes in your kegs to install sight glasses. Already done. Valve installed.
Just awaiting the sight glass itself. I'm currently using a very cheap clear
plastic hose (from Lowe's) in my boil kettle. It is too floppy to stand up
on its own, so inside is the stainless steel tube that used to (mostly)
surround the piece of (a prohibited word meaning poop) sight glass that I 
bought from St. Pats (and I got absolutely no support from that useless 
place).

Despite Fred's concern about the sight glass losing its tumescence under
heat, I will give the polycarbonate a try. But, I think I'll go with
McMaster-Carr instead of US Plastics so I can get the 1/8" wall versus the
1/16" wall. Sure it is 3x more expensive, but I'm not gentle with my kettle
when I'm cleaning it.... (Plus, the thicker wall might hold up better to the
heat. Maybe?)

Now, how do I cut it to length without breaking it?

Too bad acrylic can't handle the heat. A flourescent pink sight glass on the
HLT and a flourescent green sight glass on the kettle would be groovy, baby!

Thanks!

Brew on!
Doug Moyer

Troutville, VA 



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Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 17:37:52 -0400
From: "Doug Moyer" <shyzaboy at yahoo.com>
Subject: Sight glass - shipping

I mentioned in a previous post that I would order the sight glass from 
McMaster-Carr. When ordering from their website, you don't know the cost of 
shipping until after the order is complete and the confirmation is sent. So, 
for anyone that might be interested...

Polycarbonate Hollow Rod 5/8" Od, 3/8" Id

Part number: 8585K53
Unit price: $1.88 per foot
(minimum order - 8 feet)

Subtotal        $15.04
Shipping        $18.25
Total             $33.29


Brew on!
Doug Moyer

Troutville, VA 



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