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	FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
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Contents:
  Keg spear update ("pddey")
  War of the Worts Results ("Alan Folsom")
  Re: Avoid excess fusels by skipping the yeast nutrient? (Bob Tower)
  Re: My well water analysis (Calvin Perilloux)
  Advanced Homebrewing Course ("Lemcke, Keith")
  Online stores ("Rick Weber")
  Water Analysis (Dan Jeska)
  re: Do yeast consume ethanol? & more ("steve.alexander")
  More on aerobic yeast starters (Fred L Johnson)
  Re: Do yeast consume ethanol? ("Greg 'groggy' Lehey")
  Breaking News ("Hans Mora")


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JANITORs on duty: Pat Babcock (pbabcock at hbd dot org), Jason Henning,
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Date: Mon, 20 Feb 2006 21:33:49 -0700
From: "pddey" <pddey at netzero.net>
Subject: Keg spear update

I received some helpful tips earlier in the month when I queryed method and 
technique for re-installing the spear in a sanke keg for transferring beer 
from primary to secondary.  I report now that I am pleased with the ease and 
utility of racking with this method.  I rec'd my Kegman >insert propietary 
symbol here I 'spose< kit and was dismayed to realize that after $17 (S&H 
costs as much as the kit) the kit is nothing more than a snap ring and a 
replacement 0-ring for the spear.  But, overall I'm pleased (and not 
affiliated).  The snap ring is heavy duty; it should last a lifetime under 
moderate abuse. The kit includes very thorough instructions - obviously 
avoiding litigation.  I followed a tip in the instructions and got myself a 
good pair of ring pliers and can now manipulate the ring with ease.

Before inserting the spear in my keg of done-fermenting IPA, I practiced 
installing it through a cut-out keg top (my lid for my kettle, perched atop 
my boil kettle).  This was a bit more challenging than the main event on the 
real keg but it allowed me to find the right combination of socket size and 
push board for depressing the spear.

I cleaned the spear with a soak in TSP and a brush, then boiled it to 
sanitize. The spear seated smoothly in the fermenter sanke but I still had 
to use a few light taps on the snap ring to move it a few final millimeters 
to get it entirely seated in the groove above the spear.  Moving beer was a 
breeze.  When done, I remembered to tilt the emptied keg before venting off 
the pressure; spraying those luscious yeasties around the brewery would be 
downright rude. No, they had more work to do - a quick dose of low gravity 
wort to re-vitalize them and a fresh batch of wort the next day.

One tip in the kegman instructions that seemed to work quite well: go to the 
junk drawer and find one of those plastic safety prongs used to keep 
childrens fingers/prying implements out of the electrical outlets.  Or rip 
it out of the nursery.  Use it to jam the ball open on the spear when 
installing or removing (and hence avoid pressure differential).  To repeat 
the warning you hear whenever someone starts talking sanke kegs: make dam at  
sure you relieve the keg pressure before attempting removal of the spear! 
As the brewers safety video advises, treat every keg as though its loaded 
and never point it anything you don't want to....oh wait, that's getting 
into a different lesson lost on the VP.

I'll be adding additional sankes to the brewery...someday.

 -paul in Cheyenne
[1077, 273]  Apparent Rennerian


 




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Date: Tue, 21 Feb 2006 09:31:23 -0500
From: "Alan Folsom" <alan at folsoms.net>
Subject: War of the Worts Results

The 11th Annual War of the Worts is now history.  The Keystone
Hops would like to thank the 123 entrants who contributed 322 tasty 
brews, and the 40+ judges who made the event a success.

Congratulations to Russ Hobaugh for his Best of Show Wiezen, and
to Ed Walkowski for his BOS Mead, a Black Currant Melomel.
Congratulations also to all the other ribbon winners, spread across 
nine states.

Full results can be accessed from the Keystone Hops webpage,
http://www.keystonehops.org.

Al Folsom



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Date: Tue, 21 Feb 2006 08:30:20 -0800
From: Bob Tower <bob at constructotower.com>
Subject: Re: Avoid excess fusels by skipping the yeast nutrient?

Matt warns of the overuse of yeast nutrients in all grain wort  
production and possible creation of excess fusels as a consequence.

My question for Matt or anyone else knowledgeable in such matters is  
how does a brewer determine the level of amino acids in a given wort?  
What are acceptable levels?

I use Yeastex in all my brews and haven't noticed an increase in  
fusels (and I am very sensitive to that flavor/aroma). However, I am  
not a big fan of high gravity beers so I might only brew a 1.070+  
brew once a year. For brews that are in the 1.040-1.060 range I use  
about 5 grams of Yeastex for a 24 gallon volume. If the brew has  
adjuncts I may boost the dose to 7-8 grams. I also oxygenate heavily,  
though I am unsure if that has any impact on fusel production.

Bob Tower / Los Angeles, CA


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Date: Tue, 21 Feb 2006 09:15:44 -0800 (PST)
From: Calvin Perilloux <calvinperilloux at yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: My well water analysis

Larry Kress reports on his well water in the previous HBD;       
a selection of the major water components is this:               
                                                                 
Alkalinity as CaCO3 - 271 mg/L                                   
Hardness as CaCO3 - 295 mg/L                                     
Chloride  - 48 mg/L                                              
Sulphate - 24 mg/L                                               
Ion Balance - 0.91                                               
Calcium - 67 mg/L                                                
Magnesium - 31 mg/L                                              
Potassium - 1 mg/L                                               
Sodium - 17 mg/L                                                 
pH - 7.75                                                        
                                                                 
What's puzzling me here is a lot of apparent carbonate hardness  
in the water, which would make for a high negative ion count from
the inferred (high) carbonate level, but I'm not seeing enough on
the positive ion side.  Hmmmm?  Perhaps a water chemistry pro    
could pipe in here, but maybe this is an example of a big ion     
imbalance that we see on some water reports. Still...             
                                                                  
Working with the numbers as stated, you have low sulphate         
water, and so if you're looking to brew Bitter/Pale Ale, you'll   
be needing some substantial doses of gypsum (CaSO4) to get your   
water to the Burton-on-Trent levels, something on the order of    
0.75 to 0.9 grams/liter.  (Roughly half an ounce for 5 gallons)    
                                                                  
Also, if your carbonates are indeed as high as it seems to me,    
you should consider distilled water dilutions (or boil-and-aerate
then-decant treatment) of your brewing water for some low-carbonate    
styles like Bohemian Pilsner.                                     
                                                                  
In fact, high carbonate and middling calcium might be a problem   
for various very pale brews.  Would one of the mash buffer        
products be of use?  Perhaps.  ("5.2" maybe, which might maybe    
be calcium phosphate and other stuff -- just guessing)  Otherwise,
you're probably perfectly fine with most styles using darker  
malts, and to be honest, you might be OK enough with your     
average pale ales anyway.                                     
                                                              
Calvin Perilloux                                              
Middletown, Maryland, USA                                     



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Date: Tue, 21 Feb 2006 12:45:10 -0500
From: "Lemcke, Keith" <klemcke at siebelinstitute.com>
Subject: Advanced Homebrewing Course

I have been getting e-mails from folks who have heard about the Siebel
Institute Advanced Homebrewing Course but don't know where to find the
full info on the course. The best place for more details is on the web
page at http://www.siebelinstitute.com/course_desc/homebrewing.html ,
where you will find an overview of the course and an outline of the
daily content. Please drop me a line at klemcke at siebelinstitute.com with
any questions about the course & content, and for questions about
registration, housing options, and the amazing Durango area, please send
an e-mail to Monique Monson at Fort Lewis College (our partner in the
course) at monson_m at fortlewis.edu . 

By the way, though the course does not start until July 24th, it is
already 1/3 full. As last year's course sold out well in advance of the
start date, you should contact us soon if you want to guarantee a place
in the class. Affordable on-campus housing is also limited, so don't
wait too long to register. If you want to make sure you hear about the
Homebrewing course in the future, sign up for our Siebel Institute
newsletter at
http://www.siebelinstitute.com/introduction/newsletter-signup.html . 

Keith Lemcke
Siebel Institute of Technology



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Date: Tue, 21 Feb 2006 12:28:50 -0600
From: "Rick Weber" <rick.weber05 at gmail.com>
Subject: Online stores

Howdy,

I've been looking at a few online retailers (ebrew.com morebeer.com
and beer-wine.com) and I was wondering if any of y'all have had any
luck with them or any other homebrew retailers online.

Cheers!
Rick



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Date: Tue, 21 Feb 2006 17:26:19 -0500
From: Dan Jeska <dan at kzoolf.org>
Subject: Water Analysis

Seems to be quite a few postings recently on water analysis for brewing.

I got a sample of my well water tested by Ward Laboratories in
Nebraska, $15 for a household mineral test.

Here's the well water analysis for the brewing water I use. If you
have some ideas on how suitable this water is for brewing, I'd love to
hear your comments.

One specific question I have is: should I make calcium additions to
the brewing water in the form of gypsum or chalk? I understand that
calcium is very important in mash chemistry to control pH and
stabilization of amylase activity. The reference material I have says
that 50 mg/L are required in the mash. Does the grain contribute some
of the Ca++ ions needed?

Thanks,
Dan Jeska


Total Alkalinity, CaCO3, 170 mg/L
Conductivity, 0.51 mmho/cm
pH, 7.9
Total hardness, CaCO3, 9 mg/L
Calcium, Ca, 2 mg/L
Sulfate, SO4-S, 10 mg/L
Sodium, Na, 112 mg/L
Bicarbonate, HCO3, 208 mg/L
Chloride, Cl, 8 mg/L
Nitrate, NO3-N, 7.6 mg/L
Magnesium, Mg, <1 mg/L
Potassium, K, <1 mg/L
Carbonate, CO3, <1 mg/L

 

 

 

 

 



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Date: Tue, 21 Feb 2006 18:56:06 -0500
From: "steve.alexander" <-s at adelphia.net>
Subject: re: Do yeast consume ethanol? & more

Fred Johnson asks with notable brevity, "Do yeast consume ethanol?".

Yes !  Some do.  Most brewing yeast I suspect.

I'm out the door in an hour, so I won't be able to supply the level of
detail or followup but ...

I was was reading my copy of 'Science and Technology of Whiskies",
by Piggot, Duncan et al ((extreme thanks to Glen Raudins of Raudins
Publishing for helping me obtain a copy of this excellent text)) last
week.  It states that the Scotch Whisky industry propagates yeast
(lager, ale & proprietary distilling yeasts) using an Alko Ltd method.
This method involves several steps, but after building up a good size
starter at 3-4% alcohol in a low air environment,  they dilute this starter
by a factor of 5 and bubble clean air through the mix and the yeast mass
multiplies by a factor of 10X in 17 hours.  The text notes that the
ethanol drops from 0.7% (after dilution) to 0.01%  as the yeast mass
increases.  Yes, yeast consume the ethanol as an oxidative carbon
source.

Another of Piggott's books ("Whisky Flavor Technology" I think) notes that
whisky distillers only ferment for ~48 hours before distilling because if
the ferment goes longer (note distillers use open fermenters) then there
is a n economic loss of ethanol amounting to several percent.

For a concrete example follow this link:
http://www.ncyc.co.uk/search.php#brew
Then select <NCYC number "equals" "1322">.  This selects a commercial
Irish lager strain.  Then select "Aerobic utilisation and growth".  This
gives a list of potential oxidative (aerobic) carbon sources.  The "+" sign
next to ethanol means this yeast will use ethanol oxidatively.  Most have
ethanol marked "Unknown".  NCYC 1026 is a UK ale yeast that also
consumes ethanol.  Please note that there is not very complete information
on which strains use ethanol.

==============
Matt Baum writes  ,,,,
re: Avoid excess fusels by skipping the yeast nutrient?

> The point: I have read several academic papers which found that adding
> AAs to a test wort led to HIGHER final fusel levels.  I have read zero
> that found the opposite.   
>

Right - all-malt wort typically has more than enough FAN to avoid the
excessive synthetic pathway fusel production.   12P all-malt wort seems
to typically  have 240-280ppm of FAN and it appears that levels as low
as 150ppm at 12P  doesn't significantly increase fusels levels overall.

Having said this, be aware of /Fredrik's comments that yeast consume aminos
in a sequence and so yeast can be synthesizing one amino while catabolizing
another, and so producing one fusel by the synthetic route and another 
by the
catabolic route.  IOW we really can't talk about the general case of "FAN"
or "FUSEL" with much meaning.  To make much sense we have to delve
beneath the general notion of FAN and FUSEL to the specific ones. but time
doesn't permit me to go there.

You should look harder, Matt. There are many papers dating back to the 
1960s
which clearly show that adding an amino acid to a ferment almost completely
halts the synthetic pathway for the corresponding fusel.

> The message is that the addition of nutrients may be a significant
> factor that CAUSES excess fusels.  And the "dilution" of all-grain wort
> by using sugar seems to decrease fusels, even for large fractions of
> sugar.

That's a pretty broad generalization and I can't completely agree.   Yeah,
adding more FAN to a all-malt wort is probably generally negative wrt
fusels.  And at normal gravity, you can add about 30% of extract as
FAN-free adjunct and still hit the 150ppm FAN minimum.  OTOH certain
amino acids have an osmoprotectant role in hi-grav fermentation and
perhaps for this reason a higher level of FAN is usually recommended
for hi-grav brewing.

> None of this is helped by the fact that the suggested amounts for some
> nutrients are for essentially AA-free wine or mead, and not beer.

It's a tangent, but wine must carries ~100-150ppm  of FAN and often
another ~20-40ppm of nitrogen in ions accessible to yeast.  That's
not enough for wine fermentation, but a long way from zero(AA-free).

> What I am wondering is "what am I missing here?"

If your only choice is to add a mix of FAN to the fermenter at pitching 
then I agree.

OTOH if you could add specific depleted aminos, say the group A aminos, 
or even
a general mix of FAN later in the fermentation to stall the synthetic 
route ...
then  you may have an advantage.  The levels of the various aminos is 
not fixed
over  time and neither is the production of fusels.

If the Maxwell Magic Membrane is ever invented we could use it's osmosis to
remove some of the FAN from the initial wort, then as fermentation 
progresses
we'd slowly re-introduce FAN.  This should keep the fusels under control.
OTOH we  should note that fusels aren't 100% bad.  Certain ones are awful in
quantity, but the modest heady-rough-bitter note is not always 
unwelcome.  They
become seriously problematic in hi-grav, hi-temp ferments with unhealthy 
yeast
membranes.


> Caveats:
> 1. We are told that extract often is nutrient-deficient, and may
> require AA additions.
> 2. Lack of nutrients can be a growth-limiting factor for yeast, and
> lead to higher ester levels or even incomplete attenuation.  So there
> has to be a balance.  But the results seem to apply to all-grain beer
> over a wide range of conditions.


The argument about extract I think applies to the bad-old days when
dried malt extract often was adulterated with sucrose.  Right FAN
is seldoma reason for growth limitation, but I might be concerned
w/ very high grav and repitching.

If you want to brew a barleywine with 20% adjunct I think you'd be
wise to read, and re-read the past two decades of articles on commercial
hi-grav (15-16P) brewing and the tricks developed.

- -- 
Bill Velek asks about peltier junctions ...
I've used peltiers in a (non-beer)system design and they require a low 
voltage,
high current, are inefficient and do not have a very good lifespan 
before the
junction failure.   They do keep the Kyoto treaty types at bay off your 
back
when you throw them in the rubbish ..  When my mind turns toward
perpetual motion machines and other less practical stuff the idea of 
cooling
things with a Hilsch vortex tube often arises.  Not terribly efficient 
but the
bragging rights to refrigeration with no moving parts - hey that's as sexy
a Brazilian Victoria's Secret model (if you ignore the moving parts).

Here is a repro of one of the old 'Stong' SciAmer "amateur scientists"
columns on HVT.  http://www.visi.com/~darus/hilsch/

late, run, bye,
 -S




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Date: Tue, 21 Feb 2006 19:09:42 -0500
From: Fred L Johnson <FLJohnson52 at nc.rr.com>
Subject: More on aerobic yeast starters

As Steve Alexander and others have helped confirm for me that brewing 
yeast (at least some, and probably most, if not all) will utilize 
ethanol as an energy source if provided oxygen, I ask the following:

Why should we not produce fully aerobic yeast starters, allowing the 
yeast to grow by providing them a constant supply of oxygen (air) and 
allowing them time to consume the ethanol?

The yeast mass produced in such a starter would certainly be much 
greater than yeast grown anaerobically. Is there any reason to believe 
that such yeast would be less appropriate for pitching than would yeast 
produced anerobically?

Fred L Johnson
Apex, North Carolina, USA



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Date: Tue, 21 Feb 2006 14:42:21 +1030
From: "Greg 'groggy' Lehey" <grog at lemis.com>
Subject: Re: Do yeast consume ethanol?

[resend: I got a note that my previous message wasn't accurate enough]

On Sunday, 19 February 2006 at 22:56:59 -0500, Fred L Johnson wrote:
> Will/can brewing yeast use ethanol as an energy source for growth in
> the presence of abundant oxygen?

No.  Yeast produces ethanol, it don't consume it.

You do understand that ethanol is the new name for what we generally
call "alcohol", right?  The press use it when they want to hide the
fact that it's really alcohol.

For the pedantic: yes, "alcohol" is a generic name for a series of
compounds of aliphatic hydrocarbons, created by replacing one of the
hydrogen atoms with a hydroxyl group.  But in common use, "alcohol"
means the prime alcohol in "alcoholic" drinks, which is related to
ethane, C2H5OH, and now called ethanol.  This is the alcohol referred
to on the packaging of commercial beers, e.g.  "4.5% ALC/VOL".

Greg
- --
Finger grog at lemis.com for PGP public key.
See complete headers for address and phone numbers.



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