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	FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
		Digest Janitor: pbabcock at hbd.org


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Contents:
  Ringwood and Mighty Yeast (Alexandre Enkerli)
  Re: monitoring mash temps (Oogie Wa Wa)
  Re:what is it (Paul Waters)
  Traffic, IBUs, SRM, etc. ("Greg Brewer")
  Re: monitoring mash temps (stencil)
  Re: monitoring mash temps (Denny Conn)
  AHA rally at Goose Island ("Lemcke, Keith")
  Darrell's  whatizzit? ("Peed, John")
  Strawberry Yogurt Taste from Diacetyl? (Alexandre Enkerli)
  Cardamon in Secondary (Leo Vitt)
  re: Foamy beer (RI_homebrewer)
  Re: Strawberry Yogurt Taste from Diacetyl? Perhaps acetaldehyde is the culprit... ("Pat Babcock")
  Re: Oslo (Brian Millan)
  re: what is this? (stencil)


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Date: Fri, 07 Jul 2006 01:43:38 -0400
From: Alexandre Enkerli <enkerli at gmail.com>
Subject: Ringwood and Mighty Yeast

Brewers,

On the MontreAlers mailing-list, we were just discussing a Ringwood
brewery from Montreal and making comparisons of Ringwood with Carlsberg
yeast. Some (including myself) are under the impression that by
comparison with the Ringwood strain, the original S. carlsbergensis (now
S. uvarum) is "wimpy" in that it requires more care and nurturing.
Others are saying Ringwood is the "wimpy" one. It probably won't result
in taunts of "my yeast can beat up your yeast anytime" but it might be a
nice occasion to talk about powerful yeast strains.
In some circles, SafAle S-04 is known as the mighty yeast and it does
seem to ferment quite vigorously. In my experience, the Chouffe yeast
(if that is the origin for Wyeast 3522 Belgian Ardennes) is also quite
vigorous and sustains high fermentation temperatures.
There's a lot of information about yeast out there but, overall, what's
your favourite "tough" yeast? Whitbread? Fuller's? Sierra Nevada?
Rodenbach? Nottingham?

Cheers!

Alexandre in Northampton, MA (soon moving back to Montreal, Qc)
http://enkerli.wordpress.com/




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Date: Fri, 07 Jul 2006 05:27:03 -0400
From: Oogie Wa Wa <oogiewawa at verizon.net>
Subject: Re: monitoring mash temps

Welcome to all-grain, Matt; he asked about his mash temps varying.

Ha, when I had one thermometer I always knew what my temperature was; I 
got another and I've never been sure since!

Same thing here, it varies all over the place.  Basically taking your 
best guess average is all you can do.  Keep the tips of the thermometers 
in the mash when moving them about vs taking them out and back in, it 
prevents cooling between readings; let the probe equalize for a few 
seconds before believing anything.

Its the old Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle; you can't measure 
something without impacting it.  Thicker thermometers take longer to 
equalize and impact the temperature of what you're measuring because of 
their mass.  The liquid probably has a higher specific heat than grain 
so is more likely to be less impacted by the differences, for what 
that's worth.

Heh, throw in the fact that a lot of metal tun systems I see posted have 
no insulation on the mash tun sides and that recirc flow in most 
RIMS/HEARMS systems is probably far from even and its sometimes a wonder 
any of this stuff works at all!!!  Still, a lot of people make a lot of 
really good homebrew, so...

Regards,
Nate Wahl
Oak Harbor, OH,  64.3, 145.8


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Date: Fri, 7 Jul 2006 06:02:20 -0700 (PDT)
From: Paul Waters <pwaters3 at yahoo.com>
Subject: Re:what is it

I'll take a stab at it, 

A Malty Beer! :D

My $0.02 is a Sam Adams Lager Clone, My usual friday
night at the pub beer 

Paul
Mad Cow Brewing


> Subject: what is this?
> 
> Ok, the traffic has been light, so indulge me.
> 
> What would you  call this:
> 
> 9.5 lb Vienna Malt
>  .25 lb Caramel 60L
>  .25 lb Aromatic
> 
> 1 oz Fuggles  at 120 min
> 1.25 oz Fuggles  at  30
> 
> 5th use of a Czech Pils yeast.
> 
> og was 1.050
> 
> It is bubbling wildly in the fridge.
> 
> What is it?
> 
>  -Darrell




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Date: Fri, 7 Jul 2006 08:53:14 -0500
From: "Greg Brewer" <gbrewer1 at gmail.com>
Subject: Traffic, IBUs, SRM, etc.

I have monitored the HBD for nine years now and this is the slowest I
have ever seen it!  Are there finally enough other web resources that
the HBD has become obsolete?  Or has homebrewing interest waned
tremendously with our current preponderance of available microbrews?
Or is it simply an amplified summer lull?

As have others, I will chime in on a few topics since the traffic is so light.

I share in Peter's amusement about arguments over appropriate hops
utilization formulae.  At best all we can predict is an approximate
value.  Yes, my scale measures to 0.01 ounces, but I could probably
measure in half-handfuls and still achieve a similar level of
repeatability when it comes to overall results.  There are simply too
many uncontrolled variables in our homebrew efforts to precisely
repeat our own recipes, let alone someone else's recipes.  That said,
when reviewing a recipe, I like seeing a target IBU level and the
actual hopping schedule, which gives me enough information to come
close.

On a related note, Matt finds that his temperature varies in his mash.
 It sounds like Matt was in an acceptable range of his target mash
temperature, pretty good for his first time.  Matt, focus on hitting
your target OG at your target volumes consistently before you start
tweaking your process.  A perfectly uniform temperature is optimal but
essentially impossible.  Mash temperature gradients are unavoidable
and just another lack of precision we must accept as homebrewers.
Insulate your tun if possible and resist cracking the lid more than
necessary.

Another measurement question was posed by Fred, regarding the
conversion of SRM to EBC.  I have seen the SRM*1.97 formula several
times, but never the other.  Personally, I use SRM*2...

Darrell, your recipe looks like a Vienna to me, although maybe a bit
dark for the style.  I will bet it turns out delicious.

My hops bines are 25 feet tall and loaded with well-formed cones
already.  I do not brew in the summer but watching the hops grow has
me looking forward to the cooler months when I start back up again.

Brew on!

Greg in Chicago


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Date: Fri, 07 Jul 2006 10:15:37 -0400
From: stencil <etcs.ret at verizon.net>
Subject: Re: monitoring mash temps

On Fri, 07 Jul 2006 00:42:03 -0400, 
in Homebrew Digest #5027 (July 06, 2006)
Matt Smith  wrote:

> should the temperature be
>uniform in the mash?  Am I just taking the temp in the
>wrong places?

*My* take is that the temperature should be uniform and that this will be
achieved if and only if the mash is continuously agitated, using a regime that
does not establish a constant flow pattern.  I use a VSR electric drill to
drive the impeller and vary the speed every few minutes.  Using a shaft-driven
agitator rather than a paddle permits running it while the mash remains
covered, which reduces the likelihood of air takeup.
I monitor temps with a pair of manure thermometers, one within a half inch of
the tun wall, the other dead center (the propellor is off-centered) and both
at about half the tun depth.  

stencil sends



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Date: Fri, 07 Jul 2006 08:16:45 -0800
From: Denny Conn <denny at projectoneaudio.com>
Subject: Re: monitoring mash temps

Mark, there's an easy solution to your problem of varying mash temps in 
your tune...KEEP STIRRING!  It takes me a good 3-5 minutes of stirring to 
equalize temps.  Just keep at it until you get the same reading anywhere in 
the tun, at any depth.  I've found that it's really helpful to stir from 
bottom to top as well as around the circumference of the tun.

	---------------->Denny



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Date: Fri, 7 Jul 2006 11:35:56 -0400
From: "Lemcke, Keith" <klemcke at siebelinstitute.com>
Subject: AHA rally at Goose Island

If you are in/around Chicago on July 15th (or are looking for a good
excuse to come to Chicago) don't forget there is an American Homebrewers
Association Rally going on at Goose Island's Clybourn St. Brewpub.  If
you have never been to Goose Island before, their brewer Wil Turner
creates some damn wonderful beer on site, and of course they get the
full range of Goose Island brewed at their big brewery. Their food is
always great as well. The event is going to be a blast. The info is on
the AHA website at
http://www.beertown.org/email/aha/membership_drive/gooseisland.html . 

Keith Lemcke




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Date: Fri, 7 Jul 2006 09:53:48 -0700
From: "Peed, John" <jpeed at elotouch.com>
Subject: Darrell's  whatizzit?


Darrell asks what his Vienna malt-based beer with English hops is.  It
looks very close to a Vienna Lager, with a British twist.  Here are some
marketing ideas:

"Vienna Pride" Not-So-Bitter Special Lager
"What the Fuggles, Over?" Viennish Lager
"Austro-Anglo Tango" Extra Special Vienna Lager

John Peed
Oak Ridge, TN
Peed's Wicket Alery




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Date: Fri, 07 Jul 2006 14:51:03 -0400
From: Alexandre Enkerli <enkerli at gmail.com>
Subject: Strawberry Yogurt Taste from Diacetyl?

[Sorry to post twice in the same digest...]

Some beers, especially served from brewpub taps, display an awkward
flavour and aroma profile reminiscent of strawberry yogurt. It's a very
prominent profile and makes it difficult to enjoy the beer. And, no,
it's not *just* my imagination (though part of it might be recognition
from prior experience).
If you've never encountered this profile, be thankful!

Did other people encounter the same issue? If so, what do you think
causes it?
My first guess was that it was the result of a slight infection
("yogurt" from lactic, lactic from lactobacillus, lacto. from
insufficient sanitation of the beer lines). Some of the most prominent
examples were beers which display a lot of diacetyl when this
"strawberry yogurt" profile is absent.

So, is it at all possible that this "strawberry yogurt" profile comes
from reaction between diacetyl and some spoiling agent?


Alexandre in NoHo, MA (soon to be in Mtl, Qc)
http://enkerli.wordpress.com/



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Date: Fri, 7 Jul 2006 11:51:33 -0700 (PDT)
From: Leo Vitt <leo_vitt at yahoo.com>
Subject: Cardamon in Secondary


I planned a wit with corriander, bitter orange peel and cardamon. 
Between the night before preping and the brewing, I misplaced the
cardamon.  I made the beer without it.  The spices were boiled 15 min. 
The cardamon plan was 1/4 oz.

Now that I did that, I am considering adding cardamon to the secondary.
I know that works for spices like cloves, allspice.  

Does anyone have experience with using cardamon in secondary?  And what
did you think of the results.

 

Leo Vitt
Sidney, NE



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Date: Fri, 7 Jul 2006 12:03:43 -0700 (PDT)
From: RI_homebrewer <ri_homebrewer at yahoo.com>
Subject: re: Foamy beer

Hi All,

  In HBD #5027 Ben Dooley asked about avoiding foamy beer out of a keg.

  This is a common problem for new keggers, and you'll find lots of
info in the archives on this subject.

  There are two items that are key to avoiding foamy beer: setting the
correct CO2 pressure for the serving temperature, and having a gradual
pressure drop between the keg and the glass.

  The correct CO2 pressure can be found in CO2 charts on the web that
list pressures at various temperatures given the desired carbonation
level (stated as volumes of CO2).  A good starting point for average
fridge temps is about 12 psi.

  Getting a gradual pressure drop between the keg and glass can be
achieved by using small diameter tubing for the beer line between the
keg and the tap.  Most homebrewers seem to use 3/16" ID tubing. 
Lengths vary from a few feet up to about 10 or 12 feet, depending on
your particular setup and desired carbonation levels.

  You'll find lots of info in the archives, or on the web, about
balancing pressure in kegging systems.  You'll see various numbers for
the pressure drop per foot of beer line tubing.  These can be used to
calculate the length of beer line tubing needed to get a desired
pressure drop.  However, one thing that is not usually (ever?) stated
is that these pressure drops per foot assume a given flow rate (which
may be different than what you want).

  As far as the question about the two grain mills, I have an
adjustable JSP Maltmill and love it.

  Check out the links for kegging, carbonation, and mills here:

  http://brewery.org/brewery/Library.html

  Hope this helps.


Jeff McNally
Tiverton, RI
(652.2 miles, 90.0 deg) A.R.
South Shore Brew Club



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Date: Fri, 7 Jul 2006 16:55:22 -0400
From: "Pat Babcock" <pbabcock at hbd.org>
Subject: Re: Strawberry Yogurt Taste from Diacetyl? Perhaps acetaldehyde is the culprit...

Greetings, Beerlings! Take me to your acetaldehyde and diacetyl-laden lager...

On Fri, 07 Jul 2006 14:51:03 give or take 4 hours, 
Alexandre Enkerli <enkerli at gmail.com> wrote ..

> [Sorry to post twice in the same digest...]

Shoot! If that were a cime, I'd have already seen the gallows a bazillion 
times over! No apologies required.

> Some beers, especially served from brewpub taps, display an awkward
> flavour and aroma profile reminiscent of strawberry yogurt. It's a very
> prominent profile and makes it difficult to enjoy the beer. And, no,
> it's not *just* my imagination (though part of it might be recognition
> from prior experience).

No, it is not your imagination.

> what do you think
> causes it?

Well, I perceive acetaldehyde as "strawberry jam" (Yeah, I know it's 
supposed to be green apples, but it is what it is...) Perhaps you are
picking this up along with something to lend the "smoothness" (perhaps
diacetyl) and "tartness" (lacto-, pedio-, or acetobacter) of yogurt?

It boggles the mind, it do!

Been a long time between posts. Feels gooooooood. OK. Back to reality...

- --
See ya!
Pat Babcock
Chief Cook and Bottlewasher
The Home Brew Digest


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Date: Fri, 7 Jul 2006 17:10:12 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
From: Brian Millan <ernurse at ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Oslo

Chad asks about homebrewing in Oslo......

Not sure about homebrew, but you might try this place....

http://www.omb.no/
I am planning on hitting it when I get there in September.

You might find something interesting here as well....
http://ohhh.myhead.org/links.html



Brian






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Date: Fri, 07 Jul 2006 18:53:55 -0400
From: stencil <etcs.ret at verizon.net>
Subject: re: what is this?

On Fri, 07 Jul 2006 00:42:03 -0400, 
in Homebrew Digest #5027 (July 06, 2006)
Darrell  wrote:

>
>What would you  call this:
>
>9.5 lb Vienna Malt
> .25 lb Caramel 60L
> .25 lb Aromatic
>
>1 oz Fuggles  at 120 min
>1.25 oz Fuggles  at  30
>
>5th use of a Czech Pils yeast.
>
>og was 1.050
>

Noche Sombra de la Anima?

It also unfortunately brings to mind the joke that included the line, "and she
said, 'In two weeks you will experience a rash and...' "

stencil sends




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