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	FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
		Digest Janitor: pbabcock at hbd.org


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Contents:
  Thanks ("Ben Dooley")
  Strawberry Yoghurt ("Jeremy Bergsman")
  Lovibund vs SRM vs EBC ("Peter A. Ensminger")
  Great British Beer Festival ("Ant Hayes")
  SRM to EBC (Signalbox Brewery)
  Re: de la anima... (leavitdg)
  what is this? (leavitdg)
  SRM/EBC ("A.J deLange")
  thanks and scottsdale water question (Matt Smith)
  Re: monitoring mash temps ("Pete Calinski")



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JANITORs on duty: Pat Babcock (pbabcock at hbd dot org), Jason Henning,
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Date: Fri, 7 Jul 2006 23:38:51 -0400
From: "Ben Dooley" <bendooley at gmail.com>
Subject: Thanks

Jeff et al,

Thanks for the input. Much more complicated than I had anticipated,
but then so many things are. I'll look into the JS Maltmill.

Greg, I can't believe you're bimes are already 20'! Mine seem to have
stalled out at a paltry 12, and no hops cones in site. A bit of a
dissapointment, particularly when you consider how much warmer
Virginia is than Illinois.

Best,
Ben Dooley


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Date: Fri, 7 Jul 2006 23:59:07 -0400
From: "Jeremy Bergsman" <jeremy.bergsman at gmail.com>
Subject: Strawberry Yoghurt

> Some beers, especially served from brewpub taps, display an awkward
> flavour and aroma profile reminiscent of strawberry yogurt.
> So, is it at all possible that this "strawberry yogurt" profile comes
> from reaction between diacetyl and some spoiling agent?

One off flavor that I experience on occaision could be described as
strawberry yoghurt (it is in no way sour).  I'm pretty good with
diacetyl, and I don't think it is that; however, from a few beers of
my own that had it, I believe it is associated with low temperature
ale ferments (that might be slightly incomplete), so perhaps diacetyl
is not out of the question.  Of course this would argue that Jeff's
aceteldehyde could be right too.  Having played around with doctoring
beers with acetalehyde I know I am not very sensitive to it, but I
don't get this character when I use a lot of it.

I was once tasting a few beers that had this flavor with a pro brewer.
 He described it as "pencil lead". I feel that there is a character
somewhere between mineral (calcium) and a soft metallic that makes up
the dairy part of the strawberry yoghurt.  This may be his pencil
lead.

Hope this is helpful, but probably you are scratching your head
wondering what I'm on about.
- -- 
Jeremy Bergsman
jeremy at bergsman.org
http://bergsman.org


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Date: Sat, 08 Jul 2006 00:23:43 -0400
From: "Peter A. Ensminger" <ensmingr at twcny.rr.com>
Subject: Lovibund vs SRM vs EBC

Hi Fred,

Another great topic to stimulate HBD discussion!

Geeky types who are interested in Lovibund/SRM/EBC may be interested in 
this publication:
J. van Strien and B. W. Drost, 1979, Photometric Determination of Beer 
and Wort Colors, ASBC Journal, 
www.asbcnet.org/journal/pdfs/backissues/37-0084.pdf

Can't give much of an exegesis, as I am headed to Puerto Rico early 
Saturday (June 8-16). Will report back to the HBD on the San Juan 
Brewpub: http://www.oldharborbrewery.com/

Cheerio!
Peter A. Ensminger
Syracuse, NY
Apparent Rennerian: [394, 79.9]



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Date: Sat, 8 Jul 2006 08:14:44 +0100
From: "Ant Hayes" <anthayes at btinternet.com>
Subject: Great British Beer Festival

Is anyone coming over for the GBBF?

Ant Hayes
Winchester



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Date: Sat, 08 Jul 2006 08:54:43 +0100
From: Signalbox Brewery <signalbox.brewery at ntlworld.com>
Subject: SRM to EBC

Fred asks why there are two different formulae.
The EBC changed the way it measured colour;
divide by 1.97 reflects the newer method which
is similar to the way SRM is measured

Promash help adds:
"While the new methods were put into place in 1992,
very few (if any) European malsters and/or brewers
have adopted the new measurement guidelines as
of the year 2000. For this reason the default is for the
traditional EBC color values."

I'm afraid I don't know to what extent that has changed
in the last six years.

David Edge, Derby UK



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Date: Sat, 08 Jul 2006 07:22:16 -0400
From: leavitdg at plattsburgh.edu
Subject: Re: de la anima...

yes..that is what I was trying to make...but a bit more in the direction of an
Oktoberfest!
Darrell

- ----- Message from stencil.sends at verizon.net ---------
    Date: Fri, 07 Jul 2006 18:51:31 -0400
    From: "<h.stencil at verizon.net>" <stencil.sends@verizon.net>
Reply-To: h.stencil at verizon.net
Subject: Re: de la anima...
      To: leavitdg at plattsburgh.edu


> On Fri, 07 Jul 2006 11:32:52 -0400, leavitdg at plattsburgh.edu wrote:
>
>> sorry, my spanish is almost non-existent...
>>
>> Please translate...
> ...the recipe looked vaguely like Fix's clone of Negra Modelo, a mexican
> vienna.  There's another, premium, mexican lager called Noche Buena
> that's made at Christmastime (NB for that "Good Night") so I thought
> "Dark Night of the Soul" would be cool.
>
> gds, stencil
>
>


- ----- End message from stencil.sends at verizon.net -----






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Date: Sat, 08 Jul 2006 07:49:00 -0400
From: leavitdg at plattsburgh.edu
Subject: what is this?

Yes, it is sort of a Vienna.  Actually, the recipe was from Miller's book, a
Vienna, but with a little dark grain that I thought wouild make it more like an
Oktoberfest.

Happy Brewing!
Darrell



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Date: Sat, 08 Jul 2006 12:27:11 +0000
From: "A.J deLange" <ajdel at cox.net>
Subject: SRM/EBC

The SRM method measures the absorbtion at 430 nm in a 1/2 inch cuvette 
(2.54/2 cm) and the result is multiplied by 10. I don't have Analytica 
but apparently the EBC uses a 1 cm cuvette and multiply the result by 
25. Thus the EBC reading should be (2.5)*(2/2.54) = 1.9685 times the SRM 
reading and that conversion (or 1.97 times) is seen frequently. The 
problem apparently is that while the SRM method was cooked up because it 
was recognized that it was hopelessly difficult to obtain consistent, 
repeatable readings with the Lovibond glasses and that, therefore, they 
should be replaced with an instrumental method, the EBC members never 
fully agreed that the instrumental method was valid so that some 
malsters and brewers still use the old methods (one can still buy 
Lovibond comparators). This is supposedly why some of the other 
conversions are still around.

The tendency today is to measure L*a*b (tristimulus) values but this 
method has (IMO) serious shortcomings e.g. a and b (the color values) 
depend on the thickness of the sample and thus the lab measurement does 
not predict what the consumer sees in his glass.

A.J.


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Date: Sat, 8 Jul 2006 10:53:30 -0700 (PDT)
From: Matt Smith <mattearlsmith at yahoo.com>
Subject: thanks and scottsdale water question

Thanks for all the input about mash temps.  I like
that the answers range from "your temps should be
uniform, and here's how to do it" to "uniformity would
be nice, but it's impossible - RDWHHB".  All answers
appreciated!

On to my water question: I live in Scottsdale AZ. 
I've been brewing with RO water, but the stuff that
comes out of my tap (after a run through a Brita
filter) tastes fine.  It's minerally, but after the
carbon filter, there's no chlorine odor.  Clearly it's
hard water, but many beers are brewed with hard water
profiles, including many of my favorite styles.  So, I
think it's time my beers got a touch of "local
character."  I know the tap water is rather hard
water, but I wonder how hard is it after a filtering. 
I've boiled a couple of quarts of tap water next to a
couple of quarts of Brita'd water.  There was more
mineral precipitation in the tap water, but the
filtered water also had precipitate.

So, here's the two part question: does anyone have a
water profile for Scottsdale AZ or Phoenix AZ?  And
how does a carbon filter alter this profile?

Thanks
Matt

Brewing in Scottsdale AZ
mattearlsmith at yahoo.com



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Date: Sun, 9 Jul 2006 11:49:17 -0400
From: "Pete Calinski" <pjcalinski at adelphia.net>
Subject: Re: monitoring mash temps 

I have found similar variations in mash temperature.  I even went to the
extent of building a motor driven mash mixer to keep the mash trashing the
whole time. I finally got sick of listening to the motor and storing the
damn thing.

So, now I just "relax and have a homebrew".  I live with the variation.  I
believe I am getting some average of the temperature I want across the tun.
Some places it is higher, some places lower.  In the end, it is some
average.

When I taste the final brew I try to make a judgment if I would have
preferred it if the mash was at some higher or lower temperature.  If so,
the next time I adjust the temperature to be higher or lower then the last
time .  I am careful to always position my thermometer at the same location
in the center of the tun, top to bottom and left to right, so the average
mash temperature is moved by the desired amount.

As far as I can tell, it works.

Hope this helps

Pete Calinski
East Amherst NY
Near Buffalo NY

http://hbd.org/pcalinsk


***********************************************************
*My goal:
*      Go through life and never drink the same beer twice.
*     (As long as it doesn't mean I have to skip a beer.)
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