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	FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
		Rob Gardner, Digest Coordinator


Contents:
  frozen homebrew- What to Do? (Duane Smith)
  yard usage. (JBAUER)
  Some Thoughts on Extract Efficiency (Todd Enders - WD0BCI )
  note (Drew Lawson)
  Re: It;s too cold! (hp-lsd.cos.hp.com!att!drutx!homer)
  Re:  Homebrew Digest #564 (January 10, 1991) (Bob Clark - Sun Engineering)
  Barley Wine Ale (Max Newman x6689)
  extract recipies please (MIKBRO)
  pH meters (George Bragg)
  Rinsing Bottles (Norm Hardy)
  New reader..and weird problem... (Speaker-To-Bankers)
  Sam Adams the Maltster? (Norm Hardy)
  Low OG question ("R. J. Pals")


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Send requests to homebrew-request%hpfcmr at hplabs.hp.com
[Please do not send me requests for back issues]
Archives are available from netlib at mthvax.cs.miami.edu


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Date: Wed, 9 Jan 91 11:51:19 PST
From: uunet!tc.fluke.COM!gamebird at uunet.UU.NET (Duane Smith)
Subject: frozen homebrew- What to Do?


	Several weeks ago we had several days of below freezing
	temperatures and some of my  homebrew, bottled only a week,
	froze in my refridgerator which was in my garage. Several
	bottles broke, but the rest froze up. I've since gradually
	thawed out and is sitting in my basement waiting for a 
	solution as to what to do from the net.

	I've tasted the beer and it tastes okay but is poorly
	carbonated, I mean POORLY. The beer is now aged 4 weeks in the
	bottle and little to no carbonation.

	Did the yeast get killed? Is there any way to recarbonate the
	beer ? Anything else I can Do? 

	If it matters, the beer was a lager type malt extract and I
	was using red star dry lager yeast.

	Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

						Duane Smith

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Date: 10 Jan 91 08:44:51 EST
From: JBAUER at bat.bates.edu
Subject: yard usage.

> Date: Tue, 8 Jan 91 13:54:10 EST
> From: tony g <giannone at BBN.COM>
> Subject: Yard Glass usage/etiquette
>
>
> Any yard glass gurus out there? I got one for Christmas and was wondering
> if there's any etiquette that goes along with it. That is, do you just fill
> it, tip it, and take a beer bath :-) Or is there some set of rules that apply
> to yard glass drinking (a friend mentioned turning the glass as you're
> drinking)?
>
> anxious to quaff,
> tony (giannone at bbn.com)
> The Sparging Flocculaters (Allover, Ma)

Having used a yard many a time both in pubs and at home the homebrew motto
holds true.  Sit back, Relax, and have a Homebrew. (or 2).

Jim Bauer
JBauer at Bat.Bates.EDU
Director - Computing Support Services
Bates College
Lewiston, Maine  04240
(207) 786-6371
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++


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Date: Thu, 10 Jan 91 07:45:40 -0600
From: Todd Enders - WD0BCI <enders at plains.NoDak.edu>
Subject: Some Thoughts on Extract Efficiency


     Since this seems to be a popular topic these
days, I thought I'd throw my 2 cents into the fire,
and make a few conjectures as to what may be going
on with poor extraction efficency.

     First, my normal extraction rate is pretty
close to 30 SG points/gal/lb with a low of 29.3 and
a high of 31.4 over the last 10 batches.  I use the
'classic' 2 bucket lauter tun (inner bucket has 1/8
inch holes on 1/4 inch centers, as per TCHoHB), with
sparge times running 90 to 110 minutes, depending 
on grain bed depth (i.e. amount of grain/batch).

     I crush my malt rather on the fine side, with
the largest bits of endosperm (the starchy white part)
being on the order of coarse corn meal, sizewise.
No whole or half grains, but lots of large husk
pieces.

     Now, why can't some people get better extraction
rates than the 10-20 points/lb they get now?  The
lautering equipment is usually very much the same,
so where is the loss comming from?

     1.  Mash too cold.  You have to get the mash
         temp. above 149F to gelatinize the starches
         so they might be converted.  If you are
         mashing at 150F, you'll want to be sure 
         your thermometer is well calibrated.  A
         few degrees of overshoot on the initial 
         boost to starch conversion may be a good
         thing.

     2.  Malt ground too coarsly.  This hurts on
         two fronts.  Larger bits of endosperm
         longer to gelatinize, locking starch 
         away from the enzymes, and not holding
         the sparge water in contact with the 
         mash long enough to wash out the sugars
         efficiently.  We do have to comprimise,
         since grinding *too* fine introduces
         problems with set mashes, husk tannins,
         etc.  The ideal malt mill would powder
         the endosperm, leaving the husk in 2 or
         3 large pieces.  Idealy, sparging should
         take *at least* 90 mins with a 2 bucket
         lauter tun.

     3.  Not sparging enough water.  For a five
         gallon batch and a relatively thick mash
         (1.3 - 1.5 qt/lb), You should have to sparge
         around 5-5.5 gal.  If you are sparging so
         as to collect total runnoff of 5 gal.,
         you're probably throwing extract away.

     This is all for what it's worth, and I'm sure
some of you will take me to task on as few points,
but hey, it works for me! :-)

===============================================================================

Todd Enders - WD0BCI                  ARPA: enders at plains.nodak.edu
Computer Center                       UUCP: ...!uunet!plains!enders
Minot State University                  or: ...!hplabs!hp-lsd!plains!enders
Minot, ND  58701                     Bitnet: enders at plains

     "The present would be full of all possible futures,
      if the past had not already projected a pattern upon it" - Andre' Gide

===============================================================================



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Date: Thu, 10 Jan 91 09:15:10 -0500
From: dlawson at grebyn.com (Drew Lawson)
Subject: note

+-------------------------------------------------------------------------+
| If you aren't part of the solution,           | Drew Lawson             |
| you are part of the precipitate.              | dlawson at grebyn.com      |
+-------------------------------------------------------------------------+

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er homebrew
nor distilation related.  The people involved put together
a home made holiday punch.  The exact ingredients were not clear,
but one of them was windshield wiper fluid.

+-------------------------------------------------------------------------+
| If you aren't part of the solution,           | Drew Lawson             |
| you are part of the precipitate.              | dlawson at grebyn.com      |
+-------------------------------------------------------------------------+

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Date: Thu, 10 Jan 91 08:52:14 mst
From: hplabs!hp-lsd.cos.hp.com!att!drutx!homer
Subject: Re: It;s too cold!


>From: mrmike at uigelf.ece.uiuc.edu (Michael J. McCaughey)
>Anybody know a *cheap* source of a temperature strip-chart recorder? 

You might conisder a min/max thermometer.  They show the current temp
and the highest and lowest, since the last reset.  The hardware store
near me has several models, in the range of $12 to $20.  Jensen Tools
(602) 968-6231 used to have one in their catalog.

Jim Homer
att!drutx!homer


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Date: Thu, 10 Jan 91 09:05:38 PST
From: bobc at Eng.Sun.COM (Bob Clark - Sun Engineering)
Subject: Re:  Homebrew Digest #564 (January 10, 1991)

>> From: jpaul at lccsd.sd.locus.com (James Hensley)
>> Subject: Hop Rhizomes
>> 
>> I'm looking for a source of hop rhizomes.  Fresh Hops in OR is out for the 
>> year.  Any help will be appreciated.

Another source is:
	Nichols Garden Nursery
	1190 North Pacific Highway
	Albany, OR 97321
	(503) 928-9280

This year's catalog has: Tettnanger, Willamette, Cascade, Nuggett
	each $3.75, 4 for $13.75

Bob C.

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Date: Tue, 8 Jan 91 09:34:46 PST
From: mailrus!umich!samsung!uunet!intermec.com!maxn at gatech.edu (Max Newman x6689)
Subject: Barley Wine Ale

I am looking for extract based barley wine ale recipes.
Does anyone out there have a recipe that they would be
willing to share?
maxn at intermec.com

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Date:    Thu, 10 Jan 1991 13:33:34 MST
From: MIKBRO at zen.radiology.arizona.edu
Subject: extract recipies please

Hi,
I have brewed 3 batches of beer and am interested in obtaining any recipies
for extract-based beers which also use specialty grains.  Please e-mail me
any recipies which you particularly enjoy bearing in mind that I 1) am a novice
brewer 2) am not interested in getting into all-grain mashing (yet)
3)am interested in brewing "unusual" beers 4)already own TCJOHB and thus
already have C.P.'s recipies at my disposal and 5)am not a real hop fiend
and tend to enjoy less-hopped varieties of beer.
Thanks,
Mike Browne
(mikbro at zen.radiology.arizona.edu)

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Date: Thu, 10 Jan 91 20:34 EST
From: George Bragg <George_Bragg at carleton.ca>
Subject: pH meters


My understanding of the matter is, the bottom of the electrode is a very
thin glass layer, permeable to hydrogen and very few other cations
(positive particles, for those who don't know).  Inside is a little pool
of an acid (hydrochloric?) and reference wires.  The pool of acid's
concentration of hydrogen ions changes by concentration gradients when
placed in substances of varying ph's, and the reference wires pick this
concentration change up and register it as a potential difference on the
meter, which is interpreted as pH by us who don't know better :-).
The tip of the electrode, if not kept wet, will allow the little H+ ions
in the electrode pass out through the electrode, and the acid will dry up,
meaning there is no reference point for the wires.
 
This, of course, is a simple explanation - I learned it just today in
analytical chemistry, and I could be misinterpreting a couple of facts,
but it does sound right...
 
Disclaimer:  Do not try this at home.  We are trained idiots.

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Date: Thu, 10 Jan 91 19:30:00 PST
From: polstra!norm at uunet.UU.NET (Norm Hardy)
Subject: Rinsing Bottles

Not yet owning a dishwasher, my method for cleaning bottles has stabalized
into the following steps:

(1) Rinse real good after using, drain upside-down.
(2) Since our present sink (until the wife puts in the smaller one to
    make room for the dishwasher) is large enough for 52 bottles (12 oz)
    or 40 bottles (17 oz), I soak the bottles in a bleach bath (2% or so)
    for a couple of hours.  This removes the layers of film that accumulate.
(3) Upon rinsing with the bottle jet sprayer and hanging on a bottle tree,
    I usually go the extra mile and bake the bottles at 300f for 60 minutes.
    Cool down takes awhile so I usually do the baking late at night or
    early in the day.  Very few broken bottles, by the way.

Oh, I remove all labels and foil before any of this.  A large 10 gallon
plastic bucket outside does the job holding the liquid and bottles.

Norm Hardy


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Date: Fri, 11 Jan 91 16:35:06 EDT
From: cmorford at umbio.med.miami.edu (Speaker-To-Bankers)
Subject: New reader..and weird problem...

Hi,

I'm a new reader of the mailing list and thought I'd introduce myself.
(I've finally figured out VI!!)
My name's Chuck Morford, I live in Miami (Somebody has to...) and I've been
brewing for 2 years...Mostly sweet stouts since those are my favorites, but
I've brewed an occasional lager for my friends...

Someone earlier mentioned a homebrew warehouse in Florida, could you please
post an address?

Also, I have a strange problem with the last batch I brewed. It was an
American lager, and it had a haze when at room temp, but, when chilled it
was crystal clear. Now, I've had the opposite problem before and I know how to
cure that. But what can I do about it? The beer tastes fine at room temp and
at 50 degrees, so I'm pretty sure it's not yeast...Maybe I should just "Relax".




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Date: Fri, 11 Jan 91 18:24:54 PST
From: polstra!norm at uunet.UU.NET (Norm Hardy)
Subject: Sam Adams the Maltster?

I checked out a book from the library called "Brewed in America" by Stanley
Baron, copyright 1962 by Little, Brown, and Company.  It is a VERY detailed
study of USA brewing from the earliest settlers on. 

On page 75 I came across the following that might interest you:  "In spite
of what most historians have said, however, it appears that [Samuel Adams]
was exclusively a maltster and not a brewer.  It was a traditional trade in
the family."

He was born in 1722, graduated from Harvard in 1740 and made efforts to enter
the practice of law.  But he tried instead to start his own business with a
1000 pound loan from his father, who owned a malting establishment.  Sam
loaned half of it to a friend who never repaid.  Soon after the "default",
Sam joined his father's business.

Sam Adams, Sr. died in 1748, leaving Sam, Jr in charge.  The malthouse was
gone in 1763 as Sam Adams had by then become an active and dynamic politician.

What is so interesting about all this is the hype that Jim Koch continually
throws out in his marketing of the Sam Adams beers.  The beers are fine,
very good actually; so why the hype?  Anyway, inquiring minds want to know.

Norm Hardy


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Date: Sat, 12 Jan 91 18:35:44 CST
From: "R. J. Pals" <uunet!inland.com!pals at uunet.UU.NET>
Subject: Low OG question

I'm a beginning homebrewer, and have been reading the digest for a few
months now.  I just started my first batch, a porter recipe from a mail
order supplier.  I'm using a blow-off system.  The ingredients were 4
lbs of (liquid) hopped malt extract and 3 lbs of dried malt extract,
plus some black patent malt and flaked barley which I put in grain bags
and removed from the wort when boiling began.  

Anyway, the recipe says that OG should be 1.054 to 1.067.  I only
measured 1.033 at 84F, which corrects to around 1.040.  Any ideas what
went wrong?  It seems like there should be little variance from the
normal numbers - that is, X lbs of malt extract and Y gallons of water
should produce an OG of Z - case closed, right?  Is it possible that
I didn't "stir" the carboy enough after putting the wort in and 
filling with water, i.e. could the liquid have been dense at the bottom
and less so at the top where I sampled?   I also checked the hydrometer
in 60F water and it reads very close to 1.000.  I'm trying not to worry
about this....

Randy Pals

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End of HOMEBREW Digest #565, 01/14/91
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