HOMEBREW Digest #804 Fri 17 January 1992

Digest #803 Digest #805


	FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
		Rob Gardner, Digest Coordinator


Contents:
  when to pitch (chip upsal)
  expensive brew (reprinted from new England Beer Club digest)  (card)
  Random thoughts on carboy handles, grain mill rollers (Thomas Manteufel 5-4257)
  Yeast separation measures (Al Richer)
  Oldest Brewery (Greg Neill)
  RIMS Temperature Controller? (Alan Gerhardt)
  Additives, Travel, and Banana Esters (BOEGE)
  New Yeast Strains (fwd) (Tony Babinec)
  Doubling batch size after Primary in SS Boiling Pot. (KENYON)
  Re: Dry-malting (korz)
  Re: weizen/weisse -- beer lore (aed - jeff mizener)
  Re:  Homebrew Digest #794 (January 03, 1992) (John Bates)
  Homebrew Digest #794 (January 03, 1992)
  Re: Homebrew Digest #803 (January 16, 1992) (Jeff Roberts)
  Sour Foghorn? (Chris Shenton)
  UV (korz)
  Re: Calcium Chloride (John Dilley)
  Re:  oldest brewery (Brew Free or Die!  16-Jan-1992 1304)
  Re: Clorination... Seattle water (larryba)
  Lite Salt (D_DAVIDSON)
  Air infusion, UV, pH pens, etc. (Jim Griggers)
  Motor info. for Corona (brew)
  Re:  'Dry-malting' (Brew Free or Die!  16-Jan-1992 1309)
  Lauter Tun Design (GEOFF REEVES)
  Brewing Water, Malt, Aeration (Jack Schmidling)
  DIOXIN ("KATMAN.WNETS385")
  Re: Microwave Sanitizer (Arun Welch)
  Unmalted rye in brewing (Glenn Tinseth)
  Don't Microwave Metals (GEOFF REEVES)
  Don't Microwave Metals (GEOFF REEVES)
  CABA EVENTS (MIKE LIGAS)
  Re: Trihalomethanes and brewing water (Richard Foulk)
  Re: Repair crack in keg? (Richard Foulk)

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---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 16 Jan 92 07:17:11 EST From: chip upsal <70731.3556 at compuserve.com> Subject: when to pitch martin wilde writes: >I recently read somewhere that most commercial brewers have their >yeast in the fermenter (the hungry beasties ready to go) prior >to filling it with cooled wort. They say the beasties start working >as soon as the fermenter starts filling. This is probably very convient for large brewerys where it may take over an hour to fill the fermenter >I have been using this procedure (put the yeast starter in the fermenter >before filling with chilled wort) for some time now. I have heard >rumors that the little beasties (the yeast) would take longer to >start re-production since they are "buried" under the weight of the >wort and it is harder to make their way to the top. I am no yeast expert but I find that hard to beleve Chip Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 92 08:46:44 EST From: card at apollo.hp.com Subject: expensive brew (reprinted from new England Beer Club digest) >>>Issue #219 Thu, Jan 16 1992 >>> The New England Beer Club >>> >>>Contents: >>> Homebrew Costs (Michael Benveniste) >>> >>>Date: Wed, 15 Jan 92 17:27:15 EST >>>From: uunet!intdata.com!michael (Michael Benveniste) >>>Subject: Homebrew Costs >>> >>> >>>I would like to put in my bid for the world's most expensive batch of >>>homebrew. On 2-Jan-92, I was driving to pick up 3/4 pound of grain and >>>a hop bag. On the way to the supply store, someone turned left directly >>>in front of my car. >>> >>>Fortunately, the insurance company has ruled the other driver is 100% at >>>fault, because the damages to my car alone are $5800. >>> >>>In the proud spirit of the hobby, after filling out the accident reports >>>and watching my car leave on a hook, I walked to the store and completed >>>the errand. Counting the damage to the other car, my guess is that this >>>5 gallons of brown ale will cost over $10,000. >>> >>>Boy I hope it's good beer. >>> Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 92 08:01:08 CST From: tomm at pet.med.ge.com (Thomas Manteufel 5-4257) Subject: Random thoughts on carboy handles, grain mill rollers Someone, I don't remember who, and it was a long time ago, posted the suggestion to use a plastic milk crate to hold the carboy. I have a plastic milk crate and it does work well. The carboy is a little smaller than the crate, so there is room to slid my fingers into the handles. The weight of the full carboy rests on its base, and doesn't hang from the neck like it would from a handle. The plastic absorbs some of the shock when I set it down on a hard cement floor. Legal cheapo milk crates may be purchasd for a few bucks. Illegal ones are cheaper. To be fair, carboy handles may be better when holding a full wet carboy sideways to dump out the sanitizing water. I can rest the carboy on the side of the laundry tub (still in the handy crate) when I empty it, so supporting it is no problem. All this talk of knurling and scoring grain mill rollers to grab the grain has me wondering: Why not coat the rollers with some sort of rubber, like a stick-on sheet, or hot dipping, to grip the grain. If the rubber is thin enough, or hard enough, the grain should get crushed just fine. Has anyone ever done this? Or is a silly idea for some reason I haven't thought of? Thomas Manteufel IOFB Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 92 08:49:52 EST From: richer at ionic.HQ.Ileaf.COM (Al Richer) Subject: Yeast separation measures To the gentlemen who wrote the excellent missive on freezing yeast: Please do write on the subject of streaking out yeast on a culture medium. I (and many others, I'm sure) would love to hear from somebody who actually does this type of thing for a living.... Awaiting your further correspondence, ajr Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 92 14:42:11 GMT From: Greg Neill <ynecgan at cid.aes.doe.CA> Subject: Oldest Brewery Full-Name: Greg Neill I seem to recall having read somewhere that Molson Breweries in Montreal was the first established brewery in North America. But I'll bet there were plenty of home brewers before that! - -- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Greg Neill, | HNSX Supercomputers, Inc.| Tinsel: Mirrors for snakes. ynecgan at cid.aes.doe.ca | - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 14 Jan 92 13:37:02 CDT From: agerhardt at ttsi.lonestar.org (Alan Gerhardt) Subject: RIMS Temperature Controller? I have been using a RIMS unit ( a la R. Morris ) for a while with good results. I built the temperature controller he used per his diagram posted on Compuserve, and could not get it to work. ( Yes, I checked and quadruple- checked the wiring, and replaced parts, and all that ) I suspect device parametric differences, such as drive current, etc. In any case, it doesn't work. I have a 100K NTC thermistor encapsulated and positioned in the wort flow. I have plotted the resistance curve and presently read the resistance to determine temperature, while turning on the heating element to get to the desired temperature. This hasn't been so bad, because once you get the mash to the desired temperature, it tends to stay there for a while, and it still beats the stir/scorch/cuss/scramble method. I still would like to have real temperature control though. Does anybody have a tried and true temperature controller circuit which would work for something like this? I'm in the process of upgrading the system by using a "mash tun from hell" similar to the one described in the digest some time ago in place of the cooler. If there is any interest, I'll post some of my contruction details and/or experiences. Cheers, Alan Gerhardt Return to table of contents
iterature says you can go 6-7 generations, but out of fear of mutations, etc., I have always stopped at 3. Since I usually prepare about 10-15 tubes at a time, my $3.50 pouch of Wyeast goes a long way, and each tube ends up costing me 25-30 cents, mostly because of the cost of the solution. Cheers, Alan Gerhardt Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 92 09:56 EDT From: <BOEGE%UORHEP.bitnet at CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU> Subject: Additives, Travel, and Banana Esters Greetings, Lately, fragments of postings have dealt with the use of chemicals to foster Yeast colonies. Would someone please address this topic in detail, comparing and contrasting the various Yeast Nutrients, Yeast Energizers, and Brewing salts? I flew from Rochester, NY to Minneapolis, MN a couple of weeks ago with a full case of home brew. It fit neatly under my seat. I had no trouble bringing it past the security inspection point. I had only one mishap, the straps of the duffle bag which contained the case tore off while I was boarding in Rochester so when I switched planes in Detroit I ended up walking a fair piece with the bag cradled in my arms like a newborn baby... Sipping a bottle of my brew the other day, I noticed a hint of banana. I wonder if somehow esters were formed. Being something of a novice, I don't doubt that my lousy technique is at fault. Does anyone know which parameter(s) the beer considered when deciding to ester or not to ester? Cheers, Steven J. Boege "In April when your barge sailed through I fell in love with you Alas, my paramour, alack You're a stranger to me 'til the test comes back" Boiled In Lead The Microorganism Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 92 9:15:39 CST From: tony at spss.com (Tony Babinec) Subject: New Yeast Strains (fwd) Jeff Frane kindly responded to my query offline, and I think it is of general interest, so his note follows. By "information," I meant the stuff posted in the past on the other wyeast strains, such as optimal temperature for ferment, apparent attentuation, flavors in the resultant beers, and so on. Jeff Beta-tested the Belgian strain, and his comments appear below. Forwarded message: > From sequent!techbook!gummitch at uunet.uu.net Wed Jan 15 18:02:35 1992 > Message-Id: <m0l4Jvs-0000CpC at techbook.com> > From: sequent!techbook.com!gummitch at uunet.uu.net (Jeff Frane) > Subject: New Yeast Strains To: tony at spss.com Date: Wed, 15 Jan 92 15:22:02 PST X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL32] In today's Digest, you ask if anyone has information about two new WYeast strains. What, specifically, do you want to know? I've brewed with the Belgian strain, as a sort of Beta site for WYeast. Haven't talked with Dave about my results yet, but I will say that if you use it, I would strongly recommend holding the fermentation temperature down below 60F. (This on advice of Martin Lodahl.) I kept it at 65F and resulting beer was VERY estery; this is in line with Martin's experience with Chimay yeast. Luckily, my wife loves all that fruit, but it's not what I had in mind. On the positive side, it took a 1.072 wort down to 1.012 in about a week, maybe less. It has taken quite a while to clear in the bottle; or anyway, longer than I'm used to with Sierra ale yeast. The "California lager" yeast is a genuine, st**m b**r yeast. If that's the kind of beer you're interested in, this is probably your best choice. If I learn anything more, I'll post. I believe the yeasts are in the stores now; there was a considerable delay because the package manufacturer failed to deliver on time. Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 1992 10:17 EDT From: KENYON at MOE.ERE-NET.COM Subject: Doubling batch size after Primary in SS Boiling Pot. Hey all, I've got a hyperthetical question for ya' ... Suppose you had a SS pot capable of boiling and fermenting 10 gallons of wort. S'pose also, that what you really wanted was 15 gallons of beer. Presuming that we designed our 10 gallon batch to have an OG 1.5 times higher than our 15 gallon would have been (wiollhaven!?), is it possible to add the extra 5 gallons of water (boiled of course!) after primary fermentation without adversely affecting the finished product? A few subquestions on this subject: 1) Would it be best to aerate the extra 5 gallons of water and carefully rack the wort onto it for secondary fermentation? Or would the oxygen added during this "secondary" aeration tend to oxidize the beer? 2) Will the ensuing secondary fermentation be vigorous or turbulent enough to thoroughly mix the beer and ensure a good blending of the various flavoring and aromatic components? 3) Has anybody tried this and with what results? -C- ************************************************* ***** Homebrewers do it on Malt Beds !! ***** ************************************************* Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 92 10:44 CST From: korz at ihlpl.att.com Subject: Re: Dry-malting Perry writes: >I plan on trying it with my next batch; a pound or so of malted 2-row in the >secondary. I don't know if this is a good idea. You had better be sure you've sanitized the grain -- steam maybe? A common source of bacterial infection is grinding the grain in the same room you fill the fermenter. The grain dust carries a lot of bacteria. Al. Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 92 10:58:34 EST From: avalon!jm at siemens.siemens.com (aed - jeff mizener) Subject: Re: weizen/weisse -- beer lore Tony Babinec says that Jackson's Book says: >>In south Germany, Weisse and Weizen are used interchangeably, although >>Jackson's column heading refers to the south German style as Weizen. With all due respect to the esteemed Mr. Jackson, I beg to differ: In southern Germany (Bavaria or better, Bayern), use of the term Weisse anywhere but on the label is rare. The people ("Volksmund") do not refer to their Weissbier as Weisse or as Weissbier: they call it Weizen. If you ask for a Weisse in Nuernberg or Munich you'll get a funny look. If you ask for Weizen, they'll ask "Hefe oder Kristall?" meaning with or without yeast. Real Weizen drinkers drink Hefeweizen, carefully pouring it by putting the bottle completely into the glass holding both at a 30' angle (from the table) and allowing the foam to be sucked into the bottle. The bottle is slowly pulled from the glass keeping the mouth 1-2cm from the level of the beer as the glass is raised to vertical. This does take practice, and is best tried for the first time outside or over a sink. A small amount of head left in the bottle is allowed to 'condense' back into beer, and then is swirled around to pick up the yeast -- this is then poured into the glass, causing what is locally known as 'the snowstorm effect'. Living in Bavaria is living in Beer Heaven. There are lots of different Weizens to try many of which are wonderful (Erdinger is excellent, Schneider is good, Kitzmann and Tucher are nothing to write home about). My 2pf worth. Jeff Ignore the header, reply to the address below. ======================================================== Jeff Mizener / Siemens Energy & Automation / Raleigh NC jm at sead.siemens.com / Intelligent SwitchGear Systems ======================================================== Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 92 09:51:26 MST From: bates at bjerknes.Colorado.EDU (John Bates) Subject: Re: Homebrew Digest #794 (January 03, 1992) >From rdg at hpfcmi.fc.hp.com Fri Jan 3 01:15:37 1992 Return-Path: <rdg at hpfcmi.fc.hp.com> Received: from hpfcla.fc.hp.com by rossby.colorado.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA02283; Fri, 3 Jan 92 01:15:29 MST Errors-To: homebrew-request@ hpfcmi.fc.hp.com Received: from hpfcrdg.fc.hp.com by hpfcla.fc.hp.com with SMTP (15.11.1.6/15.5+IOS 3.20) id AA26044; Fri, 3 Jan 92 01:14:29 -0700 Received: by hpfcmi.fc.hp.com (15.11/15.5+IOS 3.22) id AA11426; Fri, 3 Jan 92 01:00:09 mst Date: Fri, 3 Jan 92 01:00:09 mst Message-Id: <9201030800.AA11426 at hpfcmi.fc.hp.com> To: homebrew at hpfcmi.fc.hp.com From: homebrew-request@ hpfcmi.fc.hp.com (Verify address before sending) Reply-To: homebrew at hpfcmi.fc.hp.com (CHANGE THIS IF NECESSARY) Errors-To: homebrew-request@ hpfcmi.fc.hp.com Precedence: bulk Subject: Homebrew Digest #794 (January 03, 1992) Status: RO Merci, John Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 92 09:27:57 PST From: Jeff.Roberts at Eng.Sun.COM (Jeff Roberts) Subject: Re: Homebrew Digest #803 (January 16, 1992) Please remove me from the homebrew alias. Jeff Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 92 09:20:06 PST From: css at boa.CCSF.Caltech.EDU (Chris Shenton) Subject: Sour Foghorn? I had some Anchor Foghorn on draft the other night in Pasadena and it tasted quite tart, not too unlike some of the Belgian styles, but not what I expected. When I've had it on tap in DC (where I live) I don't recall any tartness at all, but heavy, rich, sweet, alcoholic elixer. I complained to our waitron who told me ``It's supposed to taste like that.'' So, what's the scoop: does Foghorn lose it's tartness on its travels to the East, or was this keg contaminated? Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 92 11:08 CST From: korz at ihlpl.att.com Subject: UV I've read that UV lights are especially dangerous because your eyes' pupils do not constrict because of it. Be careful! Al. P.S. I've also read that regular glass blocks a significant portion of UV. Strange at it may sound, some of the acid carboys may actually be quartz. I recall that Hydrofloric (sp?) acid, for one, needs to be stored in quartz not glass. If your carboy says Hinkley & Schmitt, you can bet it's not quartz ;^). Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 92 10:07:12 -0800 From: John Dilley <jad at aspen.iag.hp.com> Subject: Re: Calcium Chloride > !Correct me if I'm wrong (like it had to be said), but > isn't Morton's Lite salt (or sumpsing like that) made > with Calcium chloride instead of Sodium Chloride?? Morton's lite salt is made from potassium chloride (along with some sodium chloride; I believe it's a 50%/50% blend). Potassium is directly underneath sodium in the periodic table: it has the same valence, similar properties, etc. Calcium is next to potassium; it has an extra electron in its outer shell (8-8-2 vs. 8-8-1), so it combines with two chlorine atoms to form CaCl2. -- jad -- Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 92 10:07:44 PST From: Brew Free or Die! 16-Jan-1992 1304 <hall at buffa.enet.dec.com> Subject: Re: oldest brewery Dan Feldman writes: >On a recent trip to New Hampshire, I tried "Frank Jones Indian Pale Ale". >The Frank Jones Brewry (Portsmouth, Maine)claimed to be the oldest brewry >in the US (I have forgotten the date they were established). The brewry >closed their doors during prohibition, and reopened a few years ago. They >claim that the recipes they are using are the origial, authentic recipes >used when established, or was it when they closed their doors? Good >Indian Pale. To correct a few minor nits: The beer is actually called Frank Jones Portsmouth Ale, and it is in the style of an India Pale Ale. The Frank Jones Brewery in Portsmouth, New Hampshire, not Maine, isn't yet on-line, so its beers are still being contract brewed at Catamount Brewing Company in White River Junction, Vermont. I've never heard of Frank Jones claiming to have been the oldest U.S. brewery, but he did claim to be the world's largest, though it's thought that he was using a bit of license making that claim. The original brewery did take up much real estate in Portsmouth around the turn of the century, and Jones had a brewery in Boston at one point too. The current Frank Jones brewery is owned by partners Don Jones and Lee Ann Lombardi. Don is a relative of Frank's, great-grandson I think. There are presently two Frank Jones beers: Portsmouth Ale is a hoppy, bitter India Pale Ale, and Frank Jones Special Reserve is a high-gravity, high-alcohol, delicious ale that is similar in style to Sierra Nevada Pale Ale. The Special Reserve is currently only available in NH state liquor stores, due to arcane state regulations regarding the alcohol content of beer in NH. Normally beer is sold in supermarkets and variety stores in NH. Frank Jones Ale is available on tap in several locations around Portsmouth, and one of them, The Rusty Hammer, has many pieces of original Frank Jones breweriana. Check it out if in the area, and look for the brewery to open soon. And get some Special Reserve, it's a winner! The oldest (established) brewery in America? I think it's Molson, which dates back to 1786? Dan Hall Digital Equipment Corporation MKO1-2/H10 Merrimack, NH 03054 hall at buffa.enet.dec.com ....!decwrl!buffa.dec.com!hall "Persons intoxicated with wine pass out lying on their faces, while those drunk with beer invariably lie on their backs" --Aristotle Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 92 10:01:18 PST From: larryba at microsoft.com Subject: Re: Clorination... Seattle water Just an FYI for all out there responding to my query about chlorine and hot tap water. Seattle water is surface run off from protected mountain valleys. There is little treatment other than settling ponds, a coarse filter and CL2 injection at the main intake and at each reservoir. I believe that about ten years ago Seattle started treating the water with a little lime to protect the water pipes in older houses (a little coating of lime to prevent corrosion and leaching of lead). The net result is very soft water with just a tad of calcium carbonate hardness (20ppm or so). - Larry Barello Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 1992 13:42 EST From: D_DAVIDSON%UVMVAX.BITNET at mitvma.mit.edu Subject: Lite Salt My obscure sources said low-sodium replacements are Potassium Chloride (with optional Sodium Chloride). Never heard of CaCl in them. This included Morton Lite-salt. Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 92 10:08:06 EST From: ncrcae!brew at devine.ColumbiaSC.NCR.COM (Jim Griggers) Subject: Air infusion, UV, pH pens, etc. [C.R. Saikley talks about a pH pen] >I bought one of these from Edmund Scientific a couple of years back. It >lasted only about 7-8 months (15 or so batches) before it died, even though >I followed all of the maintenance instructions. It's a cute addition to the >brewery, but I haven't felt a need to replace it. > >CR That was the problem that most disturbed me about one of those pH pens. The probe part of the instrument is not replaceable, but pH probes do wear out. I built a pH meter which uses a Digital Volt Meter (DVM) for the readout, and use a low cost ($35) pH probe I bought from Cole-Parmer. The accuracy is much better, and all I replace is the probe, not the entire instrument. pH probes are perishable and there is not much that can be done about it. [dave ballard asks about 1" tubing] >Hey now- > >I need help locating 1" i.d. plastic tubing. >[...] Even _The Home Depot_ doesn't have it! > >thanks >dab I got mine from the local ACE Hardware store. I don't think home improvement places would carry the large stuff. [Tom Quinn asks about date coding on Sierra Nevada] >What caught my eye was the selection of Sierra Nevada brews, including >their Pale Ale, Stout, and Celebration Ale. [...] > >[...] I wasn't able to find any date code on the >bottles (is there one?) [...] > >Thanks, > >Tom The date code is in little notches on the edge of the label. The wide notch is an index, with last digit of the year, day and month encoded. Check the homebrew archives. I have a little card I carry in my wallet so that I can check the date codes of Sierra Nevada. [martin wilde talks about an air infusion systems] >I have been thinking of ways to build an Air Injection System >for my "garage" brewery. > >[diagram of aquarium pump] > >The only problem I can think of is how to I get "clean" air >into the air pump? > >Thanks, martin I am going to use this method on my next batch. I found an item that is similar to an airstone, but is a smooth porous ceramic tube with rubber end grommets. This will fit perfectly on the end of a 2 ft. piece of 10mm. glass tubing. The plastic tubing connects the air pump to the glass tubing. Both tubing and diffuser are easy to sanitize with boiling water. I am not going to worry (!) about the bacteria that may be present. I think that the amount present would be small. I thought of enclosing the air pump in a small box with a quartz UV tube that I have, but I am not sure I want to blow ozone through my beer either. (Talk about oxidized beer) You can buy filters from Cole-Parmer that will filter the bacteria from the air, but I didn't want to spend over $100 for a package of 100 filters. Maybe we could split the package 20 ways? On the subject of UV lamps for sterilization, does anyone have any reference books that deal with exposure time and penetration of UV radiation at 254nm? I checked a local electrical distributor and I can get a 15 watt, 18 inch germicidal tube ($22) that will fit my undercounter light in the kitchen. I want to use this for area sterilization while I am doing my yeast culturing. I know this wavelength UV will burn skin and eyes, so I WILL be wearing protective clothing and eyewear. Jim Griggers * * * * * brew at devine.ColumbiaSC.NCR.COM * * 408 Timber Ridge Dr. * * West Columbia, SC * * * 29169 * * Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 92 12:41:54 EST From: ncrcae!brew at devine.ColumbiaSC.NCR.COM Subject: Motor info. for Corona I was thinking of buying a gearhead motor to drive my Corona grain mill and was wondering what speed would be ideal. Would 105 RPM be too fast, and would 30 in-lb. be sufficient? Jim Griggers * * * * * brew at devine.ColumbiaSC.NCR.COM * * 408 Timber Ridge Dr. * * West Columbia, SC * * * 29169 * * Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 92 10:59:48 PST From: Brew Free or Die! 16-Jan-1992 1309 <hall at buffa.enet.dec.com> Subject: Re: 'Dry-malting' Perry Donham writes: >I had an ale produced by the Boulder brewing company recently at a club meeting. >It was delicious, but what most intrigued me was the nose...it smelled like >fresh, malted grain, just like sticking your head into a feed bag. > >Some of us thought that this might be a result of 'dry-malting', an analog to >dry-hopping. Anyone have any information on this? > >I plan on trying it with my next batch; a pound or so of malted 2-row in the >secondary. Tanker Ale is the name of the beer Perry is describing, if that will help anyone answer Perry's question. I've drunk Tanker Ale on three occasions, and have always been very impressed by the amount of fresh grain aroma in it. Actually, the one Perry tried on Saturday may have been a little old, because it was less impressive than the other two I've had. Still good though. If anyone knows how Boulder Brewing Company does it, I'd like to hear. Curiously, when I see printed mention of BBC's products, Tanker Ale is never mentioned. Dan Hall Digital Equipment Corporation MKO1-2/H10 Merrimack, NH 03054 hall at buffa.enet.dec.com ....!decwrl!buffa.dec.com!hall "Persons intoxicated with wine pass out lying on their faces, while those drunk with beer invariably lie on their backs" --Aristotle Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 92 12:25:24 -0700 From: 105277 at essdp1.lanl.gov (GEOFF REEVES) Subject: Lauter Tun Design > > I've read that some people don't like the two-plastic-bucket lauter tun > design put forth by Papazian, but from what I've read and what I've heard > from friends, it's the only way I can go at this point in my life. > I once put a hole in a 7 gal bucket in order to install a spigot. I used > a hole saw, but it was tough cutting! Much harder than I thought it would > be. I'm wondering it putting a bizzilion 1/8" holes in the bottom of one > of these things will take me much longer than 3 weeks!! Any comment on > how long it takes?? > > Secondly, I've seen it suggested that putting slots in the bottom of the > bucket -- using a hot knife to cut -- is a "better" way to go. I'd like > to know why, and I'd also like to know if it's any easier to construct. > It only took me about an hour to put a bizzilion holes in the bottom of one of those buckets. The problem is that you generally drill from the bottom and that little plastic curley-cues are left on the other side which, in this case, is the inside of the bucket. The curley-cues tend to partly block the holes. I took a single-edged razor blade and trimmed them off. Melting holes (or slots) is another alternative which might make globs but no curley-cues. I bet it's a lot slower though since you'll have to heat the knife for each hole/slot. With a power drill it's just bzzzzzt, bzzzzt, bzzzzt, ... Geoff Reeves Atomic City Ales Los Alamos New Mexico Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 92 08:38 CST From: arf at ddsw1.mcs.com (Jack Schmidling) Subject: Brewing Water, Malt, Aeration To: Homebrew Digest Fm: Jack Schmidling From: larryba at microsoft.com Subject: Re: Trihalomethanes and brewing water >If boiling supply water will drive off residual Cl and the reaction product, then boiling the wort should do the same, right? If so, then why bother boiling the supply water? Good question. I guess the only answer I can think of is, why make new poison just because you think it will go away? That's not a very good answer but that's because it was a very good question. I simply applied what makes sense for drinking water to brewing without thinking it through. >I have noticed that hot water from my tap usually comes out effervescent and never smells clorinated, unlike the cold water which sometimes smells clorinated - Usually near the end of summer when supplies are low. I noticed something else about hot tap water and did some experiments that convinced me that using cold water is a MOMILY. Fill a glass with hot tap water and one with cold and let them sit over night then taste them in the morning. In the case of Chicago water at least, the cold water usually has a very unpleasant taste after sitting out. I found this by accident because I frequently noted that water served by restaurants around Chicago had a very foreign taste. When I noted the same taste at restaurants IN Chicago, the scientist in me came out because I drink Chicago water at home and it never tastes that way, until I tasted some that was left out over night. Although I now boil my water to get more miles out of my nifty SS brewpot, I had been just keeping several pitchers out for for drinking water. I fill them from the hot water tap and generally sit for 24 hours before drinking. This does indeed get rid of the chlorine and other volatiles, just takes longer than boiling. From: "Spencer W. Thomas" <Spencer.W.Thomas at med.umich.edu> You write: This also happens to be the most efficient method of producing nitrosamines and even the hardliners like Breis, make crystal malt by the indirect process. That is, by kilning it in such a way that it is never exposed to the combustion products of a gas flame. This also led me to stop making malt in my kitchen oven. >Obvious solution: get an electric oven! My favorite cooking combo is gas range and electric oven. You can't dry things effectively in a gas oven because of the H2O in the combustion products (I learned this trying to make meringues). Good put but no help if one already has gas oven. Also, as it takes hours to cure, the economics would get out of hand. This of course, is why Breis is so reluctant to make the change and continues to claim that nitrosamines are not really a problem. From: 105277 at essdp1.lanl.gov (GEOFF REEVES) Subject: Pitching Wort ONTO Yeast >You still have to aerate your wort. So assuming you have plenty of turbulence when you siphon into the fermenter then the yeast won't get burried and you shouldn't have to worry. I have found a very simple way to aerate wort. I tap the chilled wort one gallon at a time and glug this into the fermenter after giving it a few shakes. The amount of aeration one gets this way is considerable. From: caitrin lynch <lyn6 at midway.uchicago.edu> Subject: Priming with Malt >After brewing several batches of reasonably good beer, I have noticed a strange aftertaste which diminishes over time. When you prime with malt you will find the opposite situation. After you add the malt solution, the beer takes on a raw malt taste that goes away with time. >How does one prime with malt? Boil about a cup in a litttle water and use just like sugar. According to a recent posting though, sugar won the taste test between malt and sugar. >When I brewed in Massachusetts I never had this problem with an identical setup and procedure. So maybe the problem is Chicago water and not the use of sugar, but then again the beer tastes great before bottling. > I am getting frustrated because prior to bottling I think I have made an ambrosia of the gods, but after priming in the bottle the taste alters considerably for the worse, although still much better than Bud etc. What is happening here? Anyone else have a similar problem. How was it solved? Help!!! My very similar problem went away when I started using Edme yeast. From: Dan Feldman <Feldman at GODZILLA.SCH.Symbolics.COM> Subject: ss ferment > Anyway, the important info is that the primary was done *in the brewpot*. I cooked it up, chilled it with an immersion chiller, pitched, covered, and moved it to the cool room. > It was a Rapids 10 gal. pot. I thought I was in untested waters when I fermented my last batch in my Rapids. As you said, it is a dream and having a spiggot on the bottom, no more syphoning. However, I was stuck with storing the wort until the "brewpot/fermentor was empty and celaned out. Enough of a pain to cause me to decide to go back to the old plastic fermentor. >I've been doing this for about a year now. It works great, and has freed up my old fermenter for use as a carboy. I can now brew approx twice as often as I used to. The question left is, is this extract beer or all grain? As there is considerably more and different residues from all grain, I am still reluctant to try fermenting on the boil crud till someone claims success. js Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 92 21:28 GMT From: "KATMAN.WNETS385" <6790753%356_WEST_58TH_5TH_FL%NEW_YORK_NY%WNET_6790753 at mcimail.com> Subject: DIOXIN Date: 16-Jan-92 Time: 04:28 PM Msg: EXT02680 Hi Brew-folk, Chip Hitchcock (cjh at vallance.hq.ileaf.com) said (in a note to me): (RE dioxins from chlorination) >what's your source for their coming from chlorination? they are NOT >trihalomethanes, but halophenol dimers, which are harder to come by >accidentally; usually happen only when you've already got lots of >halophenol (e.g., 245T is halophenol + acetate, tiny amount of halophenol >dimerizes to make 4Cl-dioxin; pentachlorophenol in transformer oils >(preservative) makes 8Cl-dioxin). I will find the reference and quote directly. Hey, I may be wrong, my source (an environmentally "correct" catalog) may be wrong, or I may just have forgotten the proper context. Toodles! Lee Katman == Thirteen/WNET == New York, NY Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 92 17:34:02 -0500 From: Arun Welch <welch at cis.ohio-state.edu> Subject: Re: Microwave Sanitizer While this has been discussed to death, here's one more data point. It is possible to sanitize stuff in a microwave, but only at low pressure. Essentially, the gases turn to plasma, which does a very good job of killing off everything in the container. Practical applications of this technology for medical sanitation are expected to be a year or two out, unfortunately. It has the added benefit of not getting too hot, so you can sanitize some of that plastic tubing, etc. :-). - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- - --- Arun Welch Lisp Hacker, Anzus Consulting welch at cis.ohio-state.edu Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 92 16:07:06 PST From: Glenn Tinseth <tinsethg at UCS.ORST.EDU> Subject: Unmalted rye in brewing Greetings, As I write this I'm roasting a pound of unmalted rye in my oven (375' F, 35 min. so far). The idea is to make the following take off on a stout. 7 lb. 2 row Klages 1 lb. carastan 1 lb. roasted unmalted rye 1 lb. flaked rye The procedure will include a 30 min. protein rest and a 60 min sacc. rest at appropriate temperatures and the right hopping for a semi-dry stout. My main question is, has anyone done this and if so is it good? Also if anyone has experience roasting grain, unmalted or not, I'd love to hear about it. I'm just tired of paying up to 5X what our friendly HB store owners are paying for grain. Yes I buy my 2 row in bulk and the carastan too ($0.30 and $0.37/lb.) but I don't use enough of the dark grains to justify 50 lb bags (I only wish). If there is interest in this and if I get some good roasting info I will gladly summarize in this august journal. Thanking you in advance, Glenn Tinseth tinsethg at ucs.orst.edu Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 92 17:45:10 -0700 From: 105277 at essdp1.lanl.gov (GEOFF REEVES) Subject: Don't Microwave Metals Both contain metal. If you don't already know how metal reacts in a microwave oven (and you are willing to risk breaking the oven) try putting a little piece of aluminum foil in and turning it on. Microwave (as Mike Hall pointed out) is electromagnetic radiation which is alternating electric and magnetic fields. Polar molecules will partly absorb them and heat in the process. Metals which are conductors will totally absorb them and heat a lot. If there are any irregularities they'll also develop localized charges and spark like crazy. Insulators like glass are virtually transparent to microwaves and don't really heat at all. I'd hate to think what would happen to a thermometer. By the way this is why most take-out Chinese food doesn't come in buckets with little metal handles any more. Geoff Reeves Atomic City Ales Los Alamos New Mexico Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 92 17:46:02 -0700 From: 105277 at essdp1.lanl.gov (GEOFF REEVES) Subject: Don't Microwave Metals > > After reading James Smith's post on using UV light to sanitize water, I've > decided to ask about something that I've been wondering about for a while. > Wouldn't a microwave make an effective equipment sanitizer? Of course I know > that there are size limitations, like your carboy surely wouldn't fit. But for > quickly sanitizing your turkey-baster/wine-theif, thermometer, > fermentation-lock, etc., it might just work very well. I would guess that the > 'wave would cook the beejezus out of any little buggers on your stuff without > even heating up your delicate plastic equipment (at least not much). What's > the consensus? > > Chris McDermott, [homebrew, not just for breakfast anymore] > I'd say as far as the wine-theif, fermentation lock, etc go this should work but probably wouldn't be easy. You probably have to heat enough that the actual equipment gets hot. I don't think that the bacteria or yeast would have enough polar molecules (like water) to absorb much microwave so you'd have to rely on the heat from the surfaces to kill them. (To clarify, they may be 99% water but they have a very small cross-section.) In this case you might as well put them in the oven. Bleach is probably the quickest and most reliable. Since I obviously don't know a heck of a lot about it I'll move on to what I do know and the main reason for the post: DON'T PUT YOUR THERMOMETER IN THE MICROWAVE DON'T PUT YOUR HYDROMETER IN THE MICROWAVE Both contain metal. If you don't already know how metal reacts in a microwave oven (and you are willing to risk breaking the oven) try putting a little piece of aluminum foil in and turning it on. Microwave (as Mike Hall pointed out) is electromagnetic radiation which is alternating electric and magnetic fields. Polar molecules will partly absorb them and heat in the process. Metals which are conductors will totally absorb them and heat a lot. If there are any irregularities they'll also develop localized charges and spark like crazy. Insulators like glass are virtually transparent to microwaves and don't really heat at all. I'd hate to think what would happen to a thermometer. By the way this is why most take-out Chinese food doesn't come in buckets with little metal handles any more. Geoff Reeves Atomic City Ales Los Alamos New Mexico Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 1992 19:54 EDT From: MIKE LIGAS <LIGAS at SSCvax.CIS.McMaster.CA> Subject: CABA EVENTS Here's an update on some upcoming Canadian Amateur Brewers Association events. ****************************************************************************** "MARCH IN MONTREAL" Flavour Perception and Tasting Seminar and Homebrew Competition. March 7, 1992 Furama Hotel, Montreal, Quebec, Canada Entry deadline for homebrews: Feb. 15, 1992 5:00 pm "Gordon's Cave a Vin" 5785 Sherbrooke West Montreal, Quebec Canada, H4A 1X2 * for more information contact Paul Dickey (CABA President) at: 71601.3357 at compuserve.com or me (Mike Ligas) at: ligas at sscvax.cis.mcmaster.ca ****************************************************************************** ****************************************************************************** "EIGHTH ANNUAL GREAT CANADIAN HOMEBREW COMPETITION" and Spring Conference. May 22 and 23, 1992. Toronto, Ontario, Canada (stay tuned for further information on place and agenda) Entry Deadline: 5:00 pm, April 25, 1992 (location TBA) * for more information contact Paul or myself (see above). ****************************************************************************** Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 92 16:15:18 HST From: richard at pegasus.com (Richard Foulk) Subject: Re: Trihalomethanes and brewing water >I have heard that using Hot tap water is bad for brewing. However, >it looks to me that using hot tap water is the way to go since it gives you >much of the advantages of boiling w/o the time involved. Dave Miller, in his CHHB says: ``I draw my brewing and sparge water from the hot water tap at about 150'F; at this temperature, chloroform boils and chlorine gasses out in a few minutes.'' He also says that chloroform is another name for THM. - -- Richard Foulk richard at pegasus.com Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 92 19:54:59 HST From: richard at pegasus.com (Richard Foulk) Subject: Re: Repair crack in keg? > I have a Edme Brewcraft plastic pressure barrel which has developed > a small crack near the recessed handles used for lifting the keg. The > crack doesn't leak until I put it under pressure which causes the barrel > to expand and open up the crack and release beer or CO2. > > I tried using epoxy but when I went to test the seal the slight > expansion of the keg caused the brittle epoxy seal to fail. > > I am also concerned that the compound used for sealing has no ill > effects on the taste of my beer and/or my health. > There are all kinds of epoxies available. There are formulations available that don't become brittle and some that are approved for food containers. Sorry I can't recommend a specific brand. Read the labels carefully and check around. You can improve the bond by sanding around the crack to roughen it up so the epoxy will have more to hold onto. Most epoxies don't bond well to smooth surfaces. Also, covering the crack with some sort of strong synthetic cloth that you can permeate with epoxy will make the patch much stronger, and more flexible. Food grade epoxies can be very handy for building homebrew equipment. Be sure you give them plenty of time to cure so they lose all their volatile constituents before using them. Good luck. - -- Richard Foulk richard at pegasus.com Return to table of contents
End of HOMEBREW Digest #804, 01/17/92