FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
		Rob Gardner, Digest Coordinator


Contents:
  Re: Cider yeasts (Andy Phillips)
  trip to london (DBA-CRI)" <CRIPRT at RULMVS.LEIDENUNIV.NL>
  Priming with honey, growing hops, beer on draft (J.N.) Avery <JAVERY at BNR.CA>
  S. Delbrueckii (KENYON)
  dogs, fleas & beer (wasn't that a folk group?) (Sean J. Caron)
  Discolorization of Primary (Stuart Siegler)
  Good and bad malt, fittings (Jim Griggers)
  Advanced brewing advantages? ("Joe Dalsin")
  Japanese Beetles (mpl)
  Re: King Cooker Modification (Michael L. Hall)
  FREE! software for searching Homebrew Digest (Tom Kaltenbach)
  re: PET bottles (R.B.) Buckingham <BRETTB at BNR.CA>
  Removing carbon from pot bottoms (Jeff Copeland)
  Buffalo Confusion (C.R. Saikley)
  St Arnouldus vs St. Gambrinus (Jay Hersh)
  Great Taste Breweries & Kegs (John Freeborg)
  Re: Priming with honey (Alan Edwards)
  gorman's lack of tact (ZLPAJGN)
  Los Angeles Brew Pubs (RMOREAUX)
  MICROMASHING (Jack Schmidling)
  World's Greatest Generic Ale (chris campanelli)
  Re: Priming with honey (Mark N. Davis)
  Re: Sterile yeast starters (Mark N. Davis)
  scrumpy (Neal A Raisman)


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----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 92 8:41 GMT
From: Andy Phillips <PHILLIPSA at LARS.AFRC.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Cider yeasts

My statement about yeast "falling from the heavens" in cider
making was, of course, complete nonsense, as Jay Hersh pointed
out. The unreliable source was a book about the history of
Somerset cider. I've now gone and read the scientific reports of
the old Microbiology Department here at Long Ashton Research
Station, which state that cider yeasts came originally from the
surface of the fruit, but are now usually introduced from
culture. The reports do point out, however, that in a cider
factory with a continuous brewing process (and the customary poor
sanitation), the local flora in the factory is at least as a
source of yeasts as the apples themselves, particularly as the
factory yeasts have been acclimatized to the conditions.

Continuing on this theme, Jack S. says he plans to culture yeast
from the apples for making cider. This is probably not a simple
task, since there will be many different yeast species on the
surface of the fruit, some of which may produce a very
unpalatable drink if used to ferment the juice. The Long Ashton
Report of 1971 describes eight different yeasts isolated from
apples, including varieties of S. cerevisiae, S. uvarum and members
of other genera (ie. not Saccharomyces). The standard yeast used
in the cider brewery here is an isolate of S. uvarum. The authors
also tested the effects of inoculating apple juice with a mixture
of S. uvarum or S. cerevisiae with one of the other 'wild' yeasts
(e.g Candida pulcherrima*). They concluded that the resulting
cider had in many cases a 'more full flavour' than with the
single Saccharomyces yeast alone (which explains why cider
produced using a single cultured yeast is inferior to that
produced from yeasts present naturally on the apples), but that
some combinations were unpleasant, with acetic or sulphurous
tastes. If you culture from apples without a knowledge of
yeast identification, chances are you'll get a very different
drink from that made with a commercial yeast, or with the natural
mix of yeasts on the apples.

Incidentally, you can probably buy cultures of all these wild and
cultivated yeasts, at a price, from your national yeast
collection. Over here, a single dried ampoule costs 19 pounds from the
National Collection of Yeast Cultures in Norwich.

* N.B. These scientific names may have changed since 1971:
taxonomists like to change the names every few years to convince
themselves that they're at the cutting edge of science and to
confuse the rest of us.

Andy

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Date:    Fri, 24 Jul 92 13:49 CET
From: "R.P.M. Tebarts (DBA-CRI)" <CRIPRT at RULMVS.LEIDENUNIV.NL>
Subject: trip to london

Hello,

Next week I will be going to London for a few day's.
I would like sugestions on where to drink in the center of
London. (Pub name and underground station please).

And any sugestions about what beers to drink are very welcome.
I don't have much drinking experience with ale's so a
taste description would be nice.

In anticipation thanks.



Rob Tebarts

E-mail : CRIPRT at RULMVS.LEIDENUNIV.NL

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Date:       24 Jul 92 08:45:00 EDT
From: Joel (J.N.) Avery <JAVERY at BNR.CA>
Subject:    Priming with honey, growing hops, beer on draft

I prime exclusively with honey, mostly because I have it in the
house, and corn sugar is forbidden to go near my beer.  I add about
3.5 ounces for a slightly less than 20 litre batch (my carboys are
19.8 litres, which is 5 US gallons I believe).  Never having primed
with corn sugar, I can't give any advice about what the equivalent
amount of sugar would be.  A recent mead thread indicated that honey
was very fermentable (so is corn sugar), so amounts might be very
close.

As for technique, I boil the honey up with some water, to sanitize
the honey.  That started a discussion about whether or not the boiling
was required, and the digest turned really scientific about whether
any nasties could live in honey.  And, as Bones might say, "Dammit Jim,
I'm a computer scientistic, not a biologist".  I still boil it, but
just to be anal.  I can't remember the final verdict.

I'm not sure if it matters, but I am a cake mix brewer.

While I have your attention, I planted hops this year.  One vine I
fed the the local bunny rabbit, and the other is about 6 or 7 feet,
and seems to be growing about one inch a day.  I'm in Ottawa, Canada,
and I am wondering if this is typical, slow, or what.  No signs of
flowers.

Maybe you can help me with my house renovations as well.  I am
currently in the later stages of planning my new kitchen, and I figure
to incorporate beer into the plan.  I want to build a cold room in
the basement under part of the kitchen to store beer and wine, and
maybe some food, but the food isn't important here, just the beer.
I plan to convert to kegging, and keep the kegs in here, and run
lines up to the kitchen so that I can have two kinds of beer on
draft by the kitchen sink.  I brew mostly bitters, and brown ales,
and figure that this room will be about 12 degrees Celcuis in
the summer - perfect for my beer style.

Has anyone tackled this in the past?  I figure that the beer lines
once they leave the cold room should be of narrow diameter to minimize
the amount of beer that could get warm.  Should I leave the kegs under
constant CO2 pressure, or should I control the CO2 from the kitchen?
What other design considerations should I consider?

Joel Avery   <javery at bnr.ca>
Manager, Distributed File Systems Evolution
Bell-Northern Research,
P.O. Box 3511 Station C,
Ottawa, Ontario, CANADA K1Y 4H7
Phone (613) 765-4638  ESN 395-4638
Fax   (613) 765-2854  ESN 395-2854


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Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1992 09:40 EDT
From: KENYON%1235%erevax.BITNET at pucc.Princeton.EDU
Subject: S. Delbrueckii


Thanks for the quick responses wrt my #3056 culturing question.

To Eric Urquhart - I'm not at Princeton, that's just the Internet router that
our system uses to connect to the rest of the world.  I can check the local
library, but am a bit skeptical that I'd find the reference you posted.

You were absolutely right about not being able to detect the difference with
the naked eye.  Several HBD posts had mentioned that two types of colonies
would be present, and that the larger would be S. Delbrueckii.  Well, I've got
some large and some small, but it seems that the sizes could be related to the
either of the following phenomena:

1.  The proximity of the colonies to one another on the plate, i.e. - ALL the
colonies from the initial streak are smaller than those from subsequent
streaks (2-4).  If there is less food per colony, the colonies will be
smaller, no?

2.  Two different strains of different sizes (or replication rates) which show
up as differently sized colonies on the plates.


I believe Option 2 is the more commonly held opinion by Digesters.  In its
defense, there do seem to be a number of colonies which appear to have come
from a single cell (They look round from the top, and like little yeast
mountains from the side), I just wish I could tell the difference by some
means other than diameter and height of mountain.  I do have an old toy
microscope which can enlarge to 600x.  Will this help?  I don't think its got
any slides or covers, does anyone know where I can pick some up?

As always, thanks for any and all help.

 -Chuck-


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Date: Fri, 24 Jul 92 09:55:26 EDT
From: Sean J. Caron <CARONS at TBOSCH.dnet.ge.com>
Subject: dogs, fleas & beer (wasn't that a folk group?)

hi folks!

  i've been a little behind in reading my HBD's, so i dont know if this
  has been done to death, but...

  my 3yr old dalmatian has been taking brewers yeast/garlic pills all
  summer long for the past three summers. He's had a total of about
  20 fleas in his lifetime (usually after he comes home from the kenel). 
  My vet claims it's bunk, but i'm sticking with what works!

  Funny, though, he's never been especially enamoured of beer (mine or
  anybody else's). Hard to figure - he must take after my wife ....


                                                           sean

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Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1992 11:51 EST
From: Stuart Siegler <BAP$SS at LANDO.HNS.COM>
Subject: Discolorization of Primary

After Brewing my 1st beer (Continental Extra-Ultra Light) I noticed that my
plastic primary (the unit that came with my starter kit ) 
was stained a light yellow-green.  No amount of cleaning seems to help.  I have
tried clorox (soaked for a few hours in hot water) and B-Brite, also for a 
coupla hours.

As a new-brewer, I am quit concerned with sanitation (this was highly stressed) 

Any ideas on how to get rid of these stains?  Are the bad for the brewing beer 
just a normal result of brewing process?

 -Stuart Siegler (SSIEGLER at JABBA.HNS.COM or SCHWEEM at AOL.COM)

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Date: Fri, 24 Jul 92 9:33:31 EDT
From: ncrcae!brew at devine.ColumbiaSC.NCR.COM (Jim Griggers)
Subject: Good and bad malt, fittings



In HBD 926 gummitch at techbook.com (Jeff Frane) writes:

 ->It may also have something to do with the quality of the wheat
 ->malt.  I wouldn't be surprised to hear that he uses the stuff from
 ->Briess, which I wouldn't feed to the ducks.  I've used either the
 ->British or the German wheat malts to excellent effect; both are big
 ->fat grains (with no barley mixed in as has been the case in the past
 ->with Briess).

Which brings me to a question about malt quality in general and Briess
malt in particular.  How good or bad is Briess barley malt compared to
other brands of malt?  How many brands of domestic malts are available?
I am aware of Great Western Malting and Briess; how many others?

Alternative Beverage in Charlotte, NC only carries Briess, and I doubt it
is worth the expense of having 50# of malt shipped clear across the country
just to have a slightly better quality malt.

Another topic:  Not only is South Carolina a beer wasteland, but a hardware
wasteland as well.  After searching most of the hardware stores and home
improvement warehouses, I am still looking for a fitting that will connect
a 3/4" FPT to a 1/4" vinyl hose.  This is for connecting my 1/4" beer lines
to a filter housing that has 3/4" connections.  I was hoping to save some
money over the filter kit offered by The Filter Store Plus, and besides, the
fitting shown in their ad looks larger than 1/4".  My Supervinyl hose from
Superior won't stretch much bigger that 1/4".

     Jim Griggers                    * * * * * 
     brew at devine.ColumbiaSC.NCR.COM   *     *
     408 Timber Ridge Dr.              *   *
     West Columbia, SC                * * *
     29169                           *   * 


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Date: Fri, 24 Jul 92 11:06:21 CDT
From: "Joe Dalsin" <joed at mozart.cbs.umn.edu>
Subject: Advanced brewing advantages?


Subject: Advanced brewing (NON-EXTRACT) worth it? 
Sender: joed at mozart.cbs.umn.edu 
Organization: U of MN Herbarium

Here's the scoop.  I've been brewing now with extracts for about a year and
a half.  I've made a dozen or so batches of many tasty styles of brew.
I've recently been thinking of getting more involved and move on to
all grain brewing but I'm not really sure if it's worth the effort.  I'll
need lots of new equipment, more time dedication, etc.  Those may even be
advantages as I like the process and care of brewing but how much can I expect 
the quality of the beer to increase assuming it's properly done?  

Also, what are some good sources (books) to get started.  I have been brewing
exclusively from Papazian and a little self experimentation.

Thanks in advanced for all opinions, experiences, flames, biases, 
misinformation and advice.

Joe Dalsin
University of Minnesota - Plant Biology
joed at mozart.cbs.umn.edu

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Date: 24 Jul 92 16:03:00 GMT
From: mpl at pegasus.attmail.com
Subject: Japanese Beetles

My grapes used to suffer terribly from Japanese Beetles feasting
on them.  I bought one of those traps, and it stopped most of the
problem, but I hated changing the bags full of dead beetles (which
I had to do almost every day).  I eventually wound up putting down
a japanese beetle killing bacteria (made by Ringer, I think, although
there are several brands available).  It's non-toxic (only kill the
japanese beetles), and, since it's a living organism, you only have
to put it down ONCE (unless you put down something that kills it).

I sprinkled it on the lawn around the grape vine and watered it in.
In the 2 years since, I've seen maybe 2 or 3 japanese beetles on my
grape vine.  I have no messy bags to change, and I'm putting no
chemicals on the grapes (or into the environment).  This was one of
the best $10 I ever spent.  If you have japanese beetles bothering
your hops, I highly recommend this stuff (I guess the downside is
you have to put it down a year before it becomes effective - it kills
the grubs over the winter, not the beetles in the summer).

Mike (I have no connection with any bug killing product outside of
	software bugs) Lindner
mikel at attmail.att.com

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Date: Fri, 24 Jul 92 10:19:40 MDT
From: mlh at cygnus.ta52.lanl.gov (Michael L. Hall)
Subject: Re: King Cooker Modification


John Cotterill writes:

>I use a propane powered King Kooker for my boils.  The unit is great at getting
>the water to the boiling point (10-15 min for 10 gallons).  The problem that
>I have, however, is once boiling, the heat needs to be reduced to prevent an
>extremely vigorous boil.  At low settings, the flame burns to rich and produces
>lots of carbon on my boiler which is a pain to clean and very messy.  I would
>like to add a small burner ring to the cooker for low settings.  Does anyone
>know where I could locate a small ring (without buying a stove attached to 
>it)?  Any other suggestions?

I don't know anything about smaller burner rings, but here's a suggestion from
my days as a Boy Scout: 

Coat the bottom of the brewpot with liquid soap (dishwashing liquid) before
you brew. It will dry on the surface, and not cause any problems during cooking.
The black soot will still accumulate on the pot, but the clean-up afterwards
will be trivial. Water will dissolve the soap and the black soot will come off
easily. Bar soap works okay, too, if you make sure that you rub a good coating
over the whole bottom.

Mike Hall
Almost-Eagle Scout (no project :-( )

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Date: Fri, 24 Jul 92 13:06 EDT
From: tom at kalten.bach1.sai.com (Tom Kaltenbach)
Subject: FREE! software for searching Homebrew Digest


     Over the past couple of weeks, I've written a PC program that might 
be of interest to homebrewers.  The program is called THREAD, and its 
purpose is to search the back issues of the Homebrew Digest and extract 
those messages that follow a certain "thread" of conversation.  THREAD 
attempts to do this by extracting all messages that contain specified 
key words; as a consequence, the program also functions as a general 
subject-searching program.  For example, if you wanted to search for all 
messages related to kegging, you might use "kegging" as a key word (as I 
recently did).  Logical combinations are also possible; for example, if 
you wanted all of the recent references to Jack Schmidling's MALT MILL, 
you could search for "malt" AND "mill" NOT "miller" (the NOT "miller" 
excludes the many references to Dave Miller's books).  The key words are 
not limited to a single word, for example, you can search for messages 
mentioning "dave miller" OR "dave line".  Up to 10 key word specifiers 
are allowed.

     THREAD operates on IBM PC or compatible 8088/80286/80386/80486 
microcomputers running MS-DOS, so it does require that the digests are 
stored as ASCII text files in a directory on the PC hard disk.  The 
program has been uploaded to the archives at sierra.stanford.edu, where it 
can be found in the /pub/homebrew directory.  The files are listed below.
Note that all the files are in ASCII format except for the binary executable,
so you must set the file type appropriately in when transferring with ftp.  

  thread.exe    binary file, MS-DOS program executable
  thread.pas    source code, written in Turbo Pascal 5.5/6.0 
  thread.uue    uuencoded version of thread.exe, for those without ftp
  thread.doc    documentation and program description

     Any comments, questions, or suggestions can be sent to me at the 
address below.  If there is enough interest in a VAX/VMS version of the 
program, I may try to convert the source code into a VMS PASCAL version. 

Tom Kaltenbach
tom at kalten.bach1.sai.com


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Date:       24 Jul 92 13:03:00 EDT
From: Brett (R.B.) Buckingham <BRETTB at BNR.CA>
Subject:    re: PET bottles

I used both 500mL and 1L PET bottles a few years ago with very good
results.  Although they may not be as appealing as a tall, proud
beer bottle, they have a number of unique advantages.  When you use
a bottling wand to fill a PET bottle, the tip of the wand sits nicely
in the dimples at the bottom.  The flowing beer quickly fills the dimple
and covers the tip of the wand, thereby helping to reduce aeration.
Capping is a breeze; just twist them on snugly.  Just before capping,
I'd squeeze the bottle until the level of the beer was at the top
of the bottle, then secure the cap.  This left the bottle initially
dimpled, but the headspace was purged of air.  Checking the level
of carbonation later on was as simple as squeezing the bottle.
The dimples also served to hold the yeast sediment when the beer is
decanted.  Furthermore, plastic is safer than glass.

My only concern with these bottles is that they are green, and if
green plastic equates with green glass, this may result in light-
struck (skunky) beer.  I've also heard that oxygen can penetrate
the plastic, but I don't buy it because of the pressure inside.

Give them a try; they worked great for me.


R. Brett Buckingham    Hpsos development group       Any opinions expressed
brettb at bnr.ca          Bell-Northern Research Ltd.   are my own.
(613)763-7273          P.O. Box 3511, Station "C"
                       Ottawa, Ontario K1Y 4H7


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Date: Fri, 24 Jul 92 12:15:19 -0600
From: copeland at calypso.atmos.colostate.edu (Jeff Copeland)
Subject: Removing carbon from pot bottoms

As John Cotterill wrote in HBD 932

>I use a propane powered King Kooker for my boils.  
>At low settings, the flame burns to rich and produces
>lots of carbon on my boiler which is a pain to clean and very messy.

An old camping trick to make blackened pots easy to clean is to coat the
outsides with liquid dish soap before use.  The carbon then rinses off.

Jeff Copeland  copeland at calypso.atmos.colostate.edu
Atmospheric Science
Colorado State University
Ft Collins, CO  80523

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Date: Fri, 24 Jul 92 11:18:26 PDT
From: grumpy!cr at uunet.UU.NET (C.R. Saikley)
Subject: Buffalo Confusion


From: gak at wrs.com (Richard Stueven)

>Mike McNally said:

>> All I can say is that the Hefeweizen from Twenty Tank was
>> even worse.

>Everything that Twenty Tank makes is even worse.

>Bill Owens may deserve credit for getting the California microbrewing
>industry off the ground, but his brewpubs make uniformly bad beer.

Well, I hope that I'm not the 20th person to point this out, but......

There seems to be some confusion here. Bill Owens is not connected to 
20 Tank. He has founded 3 brewpubs.

	1. Buffalo Bill's in Hayward. The second brewpub in CA, third in the
	US since prohibition. Bert Grant in Yakima was first, and Mendocino
	in Hopland was second. Buffalo Bill's is still under Bill's control.

	2. Brewpub on the Green in Fremont. Co-founded by Bill and John
	Rennels. Problems developed between Bill and John, and Bill left.
	John went thru several brewers, and the pub had its ups & downs.
	The investors flip flopped, and John is out and Bill is back.
	BP on the G is now under Bill's control again.

	3. Bison Brewing in Berkeley. Bill ran Bison very poorly, things
	were in a dismal state. The brewery was on the verge of closing
	in April 1990, when Bill was ousted. Eric Frietag and Scott De Oca
	took over. Their beers are unusual, but the business is doing quite
	well now.


Two brothers named John and Reid Martin have also founded three brewpubs.

	1. Triple Rock in Berkeley. One of the first, very popular with
	the UC Crowd. A success from day one.

	2. Big Time in Seattle. Spurred by the success of Triple Rock, one
	of the brothers founded a sister pub to the north. The two pubs
	are nearly identical in decor. Similarly, Big Time is popular with
	UW students.

	3. Twenty Tank in San Francisco. Quite different from the other two.
	Urban industrial warehouse atmosphere, South of Market nightclubby
	crowd. Wear black.


CR

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Date: Fri, 24 Jul 92 15:02:57 EDT
From: Jay Hersh <hersh at expo.lcs.mit.edu>
Subject: St Arnouldus vs St. Gambrinus



Ahem, not to refute your thoroughly interesting article on the breweries
of Bruge, C.R., but the Czech name Gambrinus as the patron saint of brewers.

Anyone got the low down, will the REAL patron saint of brewers please
stand up???


	JaH


- ------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hopfen und Malz, Gott erhalts

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Date: Fri, 24 Jul 92 14:12:45 CDT
From: johnf at persoft.com (John Freeborg)
Subject: Great Taste Breweries & Kegs


I've gottten several requests for a listing of the brewers that are coming
to the Great Taste of the Midwest Beer Festival on August 22nd in Madison, WI.
If you missed the last "press release" posting about it, just email me
and I can throw it out again (wanted to save bandwidth here).

Appleton Brewing Co.
Boulevard Brewing Co.
Broad Ripple Brewing Co.
Cherryland Brewing Co.
Detroit & Mackinac Brewing Co.
Fox Classic Brewing Co.
Goose Island Brewing Co.
James Page Brewing Co.
Kalamazoo Brewing Co.
Leinenkugles Brewing Co.
Pavichevich Brewing Co.
Summit Brewing Co.
August Schell Brewing Co.
Brewmasters Pub
Capital Brewing Co.
Chicago Brewing Co.
Fitzpatrick Brewing Co.
Frankenmuth Brewing Co.
Great Lakes Brewing Co.
Joe's Brewing Co.
Lakefront Brewing Co.
Midcoast Brewing Co.
Sprecher Brewing Co.
Water Street Brewing Co.

Someone on the net posted recently about BCI (Bev-Con International) in
Bristol, Tennesse (800-284-9410).  I ordered several items from them and
am very impressed.  I got a brand new dual-gauge regulator made by
Cornelius Inc. for $36.50 from them.  Plastic pinlock disconnects were
$2.85.  A thumb picnic tap ("cobra tap") was $4.85.  They don't take
MC/Visa however, but they do COD and will even accept a personal check
for the COD via UPS.  I live in Wisconsin and the stuff came in 2 days.
They have lots of neat keg sizes and CO2 tanks cheap.

 - John
- -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
John Freeborg          Software Engineer         Persoft
johnf at persoft.com                                465 Science Dr.
608-273-6000                                     Madison, WI 53711

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Date: Fri, 24 Jul 92 13:03:35 PDT
From: rush at xanadu.llnl.gov (Alan Edwards)
Subject: Re: Priming with honey

I have heard a lot of people say they would like to use honey as a priming
agent.  I really don't see the advantage in this, for two reasons:

1) Honey takes an very long time to complete fermentation.

2) The amount of honey that you will need for priming will not significantly
   affect the flavor of the finished beer, unless you are making a very
   light beer.

The object of priming, is to get a consistent carbonation level.  And,
in my case, I want this phase to complete as quickly as possible!  If
you prime with honey, you're carbonation level will change very slowly
with time.  If you correct for what you think is a low carbonation level
(say after a week or so in the bottle) by adding more honey next time,
you will have overcarbonated bottles if you wait several weeks to drink
the beer.

My suggestion is to just prime with glucose (the REAL name for corn
sugar--Dextrose is a trade name).  You will not negatively affect the
flavor of the beer by using sugar in such small quantities.  I'm risking
getting flamed here, but I would also say that using gyle (wort) instead
of sugar for priming is a waste of time--for purists only.  You won't be
able to taste the difference.  (If you've done a subjective, side-by-side
comparison on the same batch of beer and and found out otherwise, please
post your results--I'd be very interested.)

If you want a honey/mead-like flavor in your beer, then add a significant
amount to the primary.  (That "significant" amount will vary greatly
depending upon the recipe and who you talk to.)  Expect it to take several
weeks to complete fermentation.

These are, of course, just my humble opinions.
By all means, experiment; and have fun.

 -Alan
 .------------------------------------.
 | Alan Edwards: rush at xanadu.llnl.gov |         Ren & Stimpy in '92!
 |     or: alan-edwards at llnl.gov      | (No other REAL candidates are running!)
 `------------------------------------'

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Date:    Fri, 24 Jul 92 15:02 CDT
From: ZLPAJGN%LUCCPUA.bitnet at UICVM.UIC.EDU
Subject: gorman's lack of tact

Dear Brewers

While I'm not usually given to jumping on someone for stating their
opinions, I must STRONGLY OBJECT to the type of attack levied by Bob
Gorman against Jack in the last HBD.  Aside from the fact that Mr.
Gorman has exposed himself as a pompas ass, he has also unwittingly
joined the ranks of the very brewers he criticizes by assuming that
his taste buds are the final athority on the issue of what qualifies
someone else's homebrew as good or bad.  Worse, his level of attack
(note that I did not use the word, "criticism," Bob) is at best
sophomoric.

Much can be said about Jack - indeed, much has!!  But with responses
like Gorman's, I as a novice homebrewer, will remain reluctant to
share my products with fellow brewers for their "criticism" for fear
that my efforts too will be deemed equivalent to excrement.

No one, Bob, NO ONE! deserves that sort of comment, regardless of
the quality of their efforts.  Who deid and left you Brew Master?

Sincerely,

John G. Norton
ZLPAJGN at LUCCPUA.EDU

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Date:         24 Jul 92 15:46:24 CDT
From: RMOREAUX at oz.umb.ksu.edu
Subject:      Los Angeles Brew Pubs

I will be visiting the San Fernando Valley in Los Angeles the first
week in August. I would like information on some good brew pubs (if
there are any in that area.

Also if any body knows of any brew pubs in the Manhattan, Kansas area
or Topeka, kansas area, the information would be greatly appreciated.

No brew, like a homebrew!
+--------------------------------+----------------------------------+
| Richard Moreaux     :-)        |    rmoreaux at oz.umb.ksu.edu       |
| computer consultant            |     moreaux at ksuvm.ksu.edu        |
| Computer systems office        |                                  |
| Kansas State University        |                                  |
+--------------------------------+----------------------------------+

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Date: Fri, 24 Jul 92 13:08 CDT
From: arf at ddsw1.mcs.com (Jack Schmidling)
Subject: MICROMASHING

 
 To: Homebrew Digest
 Fm: Jack Schmidling
 
 Subj: MICROMASHING
 
 In my tireless crusade to convert extract brewers to all grain "real 
 brewers", I have developed a "Mr Wizard" type approach that not only teaches 
 the fundamentals in a way a child can handle but provides a simple and easy 
 way for "master brewers" to test new ideas and disprove old "momilies".
 
 MICROMASHING scales down a batch of beer to a size that can be handled in 
 sauce pans, measuring cups and the kitchen stove.
 
 I have used the system to optimize the spacing between the rollers of the 
 MALTMILL. I have used it to convince myself that decoction contributes zippo 
 to extraction yield and to experiment with different infusion temperatures 
 and adjunct contributions.  As it only takes about an hour to do a "batch", 
 several experiments can be conducted in single afternoon.
 
 Equipment required"
    
     small saucepan   (500 ml beaker)
     funnel
     two inch diameter piece of window screen
     graduated measuring cup
     thermometer (100-200 F range)
     hydrometer (optional)
     balance (optional)
 
 The piece of window screen is pressed into the bottom of the funnel to create 
 our lauter tun.
 
 The batch size is a scaled down from 10 lbs grain to produce 6 gallons of 
 wort at a gravity of about 1.050.  This comes to 60 gr. (2 oz) of malt and 
 300 ml of wort.  If you don't have a balance, 60 gr of uncrushed pale malt is 
 about 1/2 cup.
 
 We start by crushing the malt.  You can use a blender, rolling pin, hammer, 
 maltmill or do nothing at all as I did in one experiment.  The yield from 
 uncrushed malt was 1.005.  I just had to do it.
 
 Pour the crushed malt in the saucepan or beaker and add 200 ml (1/2 cup) warm 
 water.  Stir this gently till thoroughly mixed.  This is know as "doughing 
 in".  Heat this slowly to 155F, stirring constantly.  The smaller the pan, 
 the easier it is to control the temperature.  Maintain this temperature for 
 15 minutes and stir frequently to distribute the heat.  I use a beaker and 
 drop it into a styrofoam block with a hole in it but only because I am trying 
 to control it precisely.  This step is know as "saccharification" and is the 
 period during which enzymes are converting starch into sugar.
 
 If you want to add a touch of science here, put a drop of wort in a spoon and 
 add a drop of iodine.  After doughin, it turns black.  After 
 saccharification, it remains the same color as the iodine.  This indicates 
 that the starch has been converted.
 
 The next step is called "mashout".  After 15 min at 155F, raise the 
 temperature to 175F.  Place the funnel in a tumbler or graduated cylinder.  
 Stir the mash and dump it into the funnel.
 
 In your saucepan, bring 2 cups of water to a boil and add this to the mash in 
 funnel as the level drops.  Keep the water level above the grain level. This 
 step is know as "sparging".  You can stir gently to speed things up.  When 
 you have collected exactly 400 ml (1 1/2 cup) of wort, stop sparging.  (When 
 I say "exactly" I am referring to controlled experiments but if you are just 
 trying to learn the process, nothing is critical.)   If you simply want to 
 know what you have done, cool the wort to room temp and measure the gravity.  
 It should be around 1.040.  If you don't have a hydrometer, a taste will 
 leave no doubt about what you have done.  
 
 You have just made your own malt extract.  You are now an all grain brewer.
 
 To complete the task, the 400 ml should be boiled down to 300 ml to get the 
 proper proportion.  You can add a few hops pellets to get the full ambience 
 if you like and there is nothing to keep you from adding yeast and fermenting 
 it out.
 
 From a practical standpoint, you can save the wort and use it as starter for 
 yeast or add to your next extract batch.  You can also mix it back up with 
 the spent grain, add some flour and yeast and bake a few loaves of beer 
 bread.
 
 Have fun,
 
 js
 
 
 

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Date: Fri, 24 Jul 92 16:31 CDT
From: akcs.chrisc at vpnet.chi.il.us (chris campanelli)
Subject: World's Greatest Generic Ale

     Funny, I tried some of the WORLD'S GREATEST GENERIC ALE.  Granted,
it was somewhat astringent/unbalanced due to a heavy-handed hop addition,
but I detected no infection.  Bitter?  Yes.  Infected?  No.

chris

It's hard to interact in groups when you're omnipotent.
          "Q"  Star Trek, Next Generation

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Date: Fri, 24 Jul 92 18:02:37 PDT
From: Mark N. Davis <mndavis at pbhya.PacBell.COM>
Subject: Re: Priming with honey

Steve Boege asks:
 
> 	I am intersted in using honey as priming sugar.  It seems to me that
> this was discussed here recently.  How much honey should be used to prime a
> five gallon batch of beer?  How should it be prepared?

>From what I understand, honey is considered virtually 100% fermentable sugar.
Given that fact, I assume that you would use equal quantities as you would
corn sugar. As for preparation, same story as corn sugar. Just boil it up in
a quart or so of water to sterilize it and dump it in. If for some reason, you
don't feel that there are enough yeast nutrients left in your beer, then you
might want to add a bit to supplement at this point, but its probaly not 
necessary for this small quantity of honey.

                            Good luck and good drinking,
                                     Mark
  


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Date: Fri, 24 Jul 92 18:20:32 PDT
From: Mark N. Davis <mndavis at pbhya.PacBell.COM>
Subject: Re: Sterile yeast starters


Bob was discussing the creation of sterile wort for use as a yeast starter:

> On the advice of a friend, I got a case of quart mason jars, boiled up 3 
> gallons (in the end) of generic wort (3# liquid malt extract), and then 
> canned them in a pressure cooker.  voila - several months (depending on 
> usage) pre-supply of sterile wort.

What I've used as a standard yeast starter for the past 10  or so batches
is much simpler, and apparently equally efficient.

I just boil up 1 quart of water with 3 tablespoons corn sugar and 1/4 teaspoon
of yeast nutrient, cool to 80'F, and pitch my dried yeast in a 1 gallon apple
cider bottle. My airlock is nothing more than the metal bottle cap with a hole
poked in it and some tin foil wrapped around it. My assumption is that there
will be enough CO2 output from the start to ensure a one way airflow out of
the bottle. The tinfoil just keeps airborne particles from falling through the
hole, but is loose enough to allow CO2 to escape.
Anyway, the results have been excellent. All of my brews are actively bubbling
away by the morning after I pitch the yeast (which inevitably always occurs
sometime past midnight, occasionally I miss extract brewing >:-), and I've
never had an infection problem. It just seems to me that its not worth the
hassle or expense of making sterile wort when I spend 10 minutes the day 
previous to brewing to make my quick starter.
What I'm wondering is does anyone see a problem with my methodology? Am I
just consistently lucky when it comes to lack of infection? Is my beer karma
running short?

                           Mark


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Date: 24 Jul 1992 22:24:42 -0400 (EDT)
From: Neal.Raisman at UC.Edu (Neal A Raisman)
Subject: scrumpy

  This is a recipe for a strong British cider called scrumpy.
  It is really strong.  One glass and the world begins to glow.
  A second glass, makes it all go.

  12# of mixed apples.  Be sure they are clean and with no
        belmishes
  1/2# raisins 
  1/2# raw meat
  1 gal. water at 70 degrees
    tradition calls for bakers yeast but I recommend a
     champagne yeast 

  Chop all ingredients.  Then grind the apples and raisins. A
  food processor is helpful.  Toss the ingredients into the
  water and stir.  Add the yeast and seal the brew bucket with
  an airlock.  Each day, stir the ingredients by swirling the
  ingredients in the closed bucket.  After the first fermenta-
  tion slows, about 8-10 days, move to a secondary fermenter.
  If you like a dry cider, add a second dose of yeast to the
  secondary fermenter.  Seal with an airlock.  Let sit until it
  the fermentation slows to a very slow, almost imperceptable
  bubble.  Move to a carboy to get out more of the particulates.
   Let it sit for about a week and bottle.

  The scrumpy will need to mature for about four months before
  you will want to even try it since it will give off a strong
D unpleasant smell and almost vinegary taste.  The longer it is
  allowed to mature, the better, smoother and drier it will get.

  It is wonderful served cold when mature.  I have let it sit
  for a year and it is quqite fine.

   No fancy sign off here.  Neal Raisman raismana at ucunix.san.uc.edu
D
  and unpleasant smell and have an almost vinegary staste

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End of HOMEBREW Digest #933, 07/25/92