FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
		Rob Gardner, Digest Coordinator


Contents:
  Cleaning Brewheat Boiler (Brett Shorten)
  Re: Hop Pellets for Dry Hopping  (gkushmer)
  alt (Russ Gelinas)
  Sanitizing & wort priming from Micah Millspaw (BOB JONES)
  Re: Advanced Brewing (NON-EXTRACT) worth it? (Richard Stueven)
  Re: Question on racking after chilling (Larry Barello)
  Siphoning and Wort Chillers (Thomas D. Feller)
  Wyeast strains (Raymond Taylor)
  Re: Bottling with yeast (korz)
  Re: Advanced Brewing (NON-EXTRACT) worth it? (Ken Johnson)
  Cooler Lauter Tuns (Ruth Mazo Karras)
  Re: Connecting copper filter pipe to cooler-mashtun (P. Couch)
  sparging and time (PGRAHAME)


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Date: Wed, 29 Jul 92 18:02:58 EST
From: Brett Shorten <s05bas at cc.uow.edu.au>
Subject: Cleaning Brewheat Boiler

  I recently purchased a Cordon Brew brand Bruheat Boiler for mashing and
boiling my beers. I dont know if it is sold in the US, but basically it is a
plastic brew bucket fitted with thermostatically controlled heating element.
I am quite happy with it so far (2 batches), but have one small problem. I
cant seem to clean it very well, in particular the heating element, which
already has quite a deposit of blackened malt (I assume) adhered to it. I
would appreciate any tips on how to clean this piece of equipment.
Thanks
Brett Shorten

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Date: Wed, 29 Jul 92 9:00:27 EDT
From: gkushmer at Jade.Tufts.EDU
Subject: Re: Hop Pellets for Dry Hopping 


>From: Mark N. Davis <mndavis at pbhya.PacBell.COM>

>Finally, I tried a hop bag with pellets. Don't bother! The pellets are ground
>fine enough to float right out of the hop bag and the results are simila to
>pellets by themselves, except you get to go on a fishing expedition for the
>empty hop bag.

Using this method, I've dry hopped a few times and haven't really had
this trouble of which you speak.  Some of the ground hops might have
gotten out of the bag, but the majority of them were definitely in
there when I took out the bag. 

As for getting out the bag, I took the string part and jammed it between
the rubber stopper and the carboy lip.  This made two things easy - to
remove the bag I just pull, and to remove the stopper I just pull.  I
used to worry about possible infection from this, but when you figure 
that there is a good deal of alcohol plus the level of hops in all this, the
risk seems rather nominal.  After all, I was more worried about the risk
of infection from the hop pellets, unsterilized, being thrown in the wort.

But through all of this, I've never seen my siphon clogged with hops
from dry hopping.  Maybe I'm lucky, or maybe I'm too relaxed to notice
:-)

- --gk


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Date:    Wed, 29 Jul 1992 10:14:00 -0400 (EDT)
From: R_GELINAS at UNHH.UNH.EDU (Russ Gelinas)
Subject: alt

   St.Stans contest calls for Alt entries.  After tasting a Dab Alt on
tap at the Sunset in Boston, I've been searching for an Alt recipe.
It's unique malt flavor is what I remember most.  It was also creamy.
Anyone got an all-grain recipe for an Alt?

  On a similar note, I had some bottled Dab lager, light and dark, which had 
the same creamy effect, but without the malt kick.  If I'm not mistaken, Dab 
is not revered in Germany; they're sort of a mass producer.  But, in a side-
by-side with Beck's (I did it), the Beck's comes out as the thin insipid 
mostly bland product it really is.  YMMV,FWIW,IMHO.....

RussG

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Date: Wed, 29 Jul 1992 07:48 PDT
From: BOB JONES <BJONES at NOVAX.llnl.gov>
Subject: Sanitizing & wort priming from Micah Millspaw


	I've recently come across some cleaning solutions for my
stainless equipment. The first is K O dyne it is an iodaphor type 
sanitzer and will work on all homebrewing type equipment, it kills
just about everything that could screw up beer with a two minute 
contact time at 12 1/2 ppm and is FDA approved. The best part is
that it is cheap, about $14 per gallon. The other cleaneris an MSR
this is strictly for cleaning the stainless it contains phosphoric
acid and is great for removing beer stone from your fermenters it
sells for about $10 per gallon. I got this info and the stuff from a
local dairy supply place, since the dairy people face similar problems
as do brewers they are very knowledgable able SS equipment. So 
find a dairy supplier and pick their brains it may be worth the
effort.
=======================================================================
	Wort priming, I have been freezing in a plastic jug some
of the sweet wort from my mash to use for priming and or making
up for fermentation losses. When I use the wort I thaw it out,boil
it then add it into the secondary fermenter, seal the fermenter and
let it carbonate. Its cheap easy and doesn't effect the flavour 
profile of the beer.  


                                 Micah Millspaw  7/27/92

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Date: Wed, 29 Jul 92 09:44:45 PDT
From: gak at wrs.com (Richard Stueven)
Subject: Re: Advanced Brewing (NON-EXTRACT) worth it?

In HBD #937, Walter Gude (whg at tellabs.com) speculates:

> As of yet I'm still doing partial (1/3 of
> sugars) mashes. I wouldn't be at all surprised if when I take the final
> plunge (next fall?) that initially the quality of my brews goes down.

Here's a data point:  I brewed my first all-grain batch after brewing
21 extract batches.  It was the best beer I had brewed up to that
point, and they keep getting better (IMHO).

> Given the same process from the point of the boil on, I've always felt
> there are a lot of things you can screw up in the mash/sparge process
> (bad crush, poor temp control, oversparging) that could potentially give
> you a sorry wort. [...]
> There's a lot of variable to get right.

No arguing that.  On the other hand, look at the amount of control you
gain when you mash.  You don't know what's in the extracts...corn
sugar, cane sugar, hop varieties and amounts...who knows.  With a full
mash, you know exactly what's in your beer because it's all right in
front of you.

You and many others refer to the mashing process as "Advanced
Brewing".  In my opinion, that perpetuates the myth that mashing is an
arcane and difficult process that novice brewers can't possibly do
right.  That's simply not true...ANYBODY can do it!  All you need are a
couple of extra plastic buckets* and maybe another 1.5 to 2 hours of
brewing time, and you're set.  (Oops...bad choice of words...you know
what I mean. :-)

Take the plunge!

have fun
gak
107/H/3&4


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Date: Wed, 29 Jul 92 08:01:59 PDT
From: polstra!larryba at uunet.UU.NET (Larry Barello)
Subject: Re: Question on racking after chilling

In HBD #937, Al Korz writes:
>>  One other question that occurs to me. What is the recommended procedure
>>for dry-hopping in the secondary with pellet hops?. Are they added as is, or
>>'dissolved' first?
>
>If you can get fresh leaf hops, use them.  Leaf hops will float a lot longer
>than pelletized hops and then allow you to siphon out from under them.  In
>either case, just toss the hops into the secondary (I just toss them into
>the primary seven days or so before bottling for single-stage ferments).

Siphoning under the floating leaf hops sounds like a drag to me.  I use 
pellets with great success.  I know when fermentation is *complete* when
the pellet crud sinks to the bottom.  Occasional agitation of the carboy
(about once a day) will encourage the stuff to sink.  Then I just rack 
in the normal way.  Also, pellets are much easier to get into and out of 
the secondary.

Cheers!
- -- 
- -----
Larry Barello			uunet!polstra!larryba

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Date: Wed, 29 Jul 92 10:48:20 PDT
From: thomasf at deschutes.ico.tek.com (Thomas D. Feller)
Subject: Siphoning and Wort Chillers

Thanks to everyone how sent me mail about my Cooler Lauter Tun. Once
I get the thing built I will post what I learned.

Now for my on the the subject,

Due to water restriction here in Portland I decided to change the way I used 
my Wort chiller. Instead of putting the copper coils in the hot wort and passing
cold water inside the chiller I put the chiller in a bucket of ice water and 
run the hot wort inside the chiller. I made a siphon rod out of 3/8 copper pipe
with a cap in the end and a hole drilled about 3/4 in above the end so I would 
not pick up too much stuff off the bottom of the pot. Here the problem I got the
siphon started OK but it never had a good flow. Yes I did pick up some hops but
I stoped and cleaned everything out and still had bad flow. It took almost a 
hour to siphon about 4 gal.(I pour the rest in through a funnel and screen).

Does anyone use this method? Does anyone have any ideas on how to make it flow
better? Any better ideas on how the cool wort with the least amount of wasted
water?


Thanks

Tom Feller

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Date:         Wed, 29 Jul 92 12:59:51 CDT
From: Raymond Taylor <NU028463 at VM1.NoDak.EDU>
Subject:      Wyeast strains

I've been using Wyeast liquid yeast cultures for a number of years and my
brews have really improved as a result. They're great!

I was wondering if anyone could give me an answer to a question that has
been on my mind ever since I started brewing with Wyeast strains.

Williams Brewing sells liquid yeast cultures that are produced by Wyeast
but these are not identified by the standard Wyeast name or code number.
What exactly is Williams Burton Ale Yeast? Is it Wyeast British Ale #1098? Is
it Wyeast London Ale #1028? Could Burton Ale Yeast actually be a different
"proprietary strain" produced by Wyeast exclusively for Williams Brewing?.

I think Williams also sells a Wyeast produced English Ale... I have the same
questions as above for this one.

I have used the Burton Ale many times and really like this strain.

THANKS IN ADVANCE!!

Ray "Liberty" Taylor

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Date: Wed, 29 Jul 92 14:02 CDT
From: korz at ihpubj.att.com
Subject: Re: Bottling with yeast

Two batches I've done recently, have been quite high in gravity and
I've had no problem with carbonation *without* adding yeast at bottling.
One was an Imperial Stout with a measured OG of 1090 made with the
yeast cultured from the dregs of Sierra Nevada Pale Ale and the other
was a Chimay clone with an OG of 1087 made with Wyeast Belgian Ale yeast.

Other yeasts, however, may not do as well.  I've read about adding yeast
at pitching when brewing lagers that were bulk lagered at 33F for 3 months,
but did not add yeast at bottling time to my 1074 OG Bock, but I only lagered
that for 1 month at 45F before bottling.  No problems with carbonation.
This bock was made with Wyeast #2308 (Munich Lager) yeast.

One *important* word of advice:  I fermented the Chimay clone at 68F and
it came out with a very pronounced banana aroma -- I strongly suggest
fermenting at a lower temperature, say, 60F.  Also, this yeast at 68F
fermented very quickly for two days and then took a long time (two weeks)
to finish.  It's behavior may be similar at 60F.

Al.

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Date: Wed, 29 Jul 92 15:35:05 PDT
From: kjohnson at argon.berkeley.edu (Ken Johnson)
Subject: Re: Advanced Brewing (NON-EXTRACT) worth it?

If your beer quality goes down when switching to full mash beers, then you
are lame.

kj

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Date: 29 Jul 92 18:41:59 EST
From: Ruth Mazo Karras <RKARRAS at PENNSAS.UPENN.EDU>
Subject: Cooler Lauter Tuns

I have been using the 5 gallon cylindrical Gott/Rubbermaid orange cooler as a
lautertun with apparent good results. Rather than use the slotted copper
tubing or window screen over a pipe to filter the wort from the grain, I have
been setting a stainless steel steamer (one of those odd kitchen items that
looks like a flower with petals that unfold to double the diameter and that
has little 1/2" legs). It is just the right size to fit in the bottom of the
cooler and when the grain is in a mesh nylon grain bag sitting on top of the
steamer I suspect that I get a better filtering action than with the slotted
tubes and with much less work/expense.

Has anyone else tried this, and with what effect?

Chris Karras (RKarras at PennSAS.UPenn.edu)

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Date: Wed, 29 Jul 92 15:13:21 PDT
From: ithaca!amber!phoebe at uunet.UU.NET (P. Couch)
Subject: Re: Connecting copper filter pipe to cooler-mashtun

I use faucet compression fittings on my cooler.
I removed the original faucet and left a 1/2' hole.
The false bottom was about 10 ft of slotted copper pipes and
it goes to a 3/8' to 1/2' brass (pipe joint? I forgot the name) inside
the cooler and on the outside, a 1/2' to 3/4' (pipe joint?) with a couple
washers in between(to cover the hole), on the outside a plastic
 faucet (3/4') I got from  Brewmasters (San Leandro),
 I didn't use a metal faucet because I didn't want to
burn my hand at 170 while sparging. And Teflon tape in between
All the pipes and joins and washers are from the hardware store under
plumbing and are for standard kitchen faucets.
I have used the mashtun a couple times and it doesn't leak.

As for Extract versus All-Grain, I find that my All-grain brews are
definitely cleaner, smoother with more complex chararacteristics. But
the precedures are also different. I think that the basic All-Grain
process (mash/sparge then hop at diferent time) makes better beer than
 the basic extract process (throw everything into the boil
 at different times), but with a little work, extract brewing can make
beer just as good.IMHO.

By the way, My Cascade(planted April 92) is full of giant cones and they are
 starting to smell good. The Nugget and the Mt Hood are coming along with
a few burrs, but the Williamette is doing nothing. 
Thanks for all the replies/help.
P.

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Date: Thu, 30 Jul 1992 00:23 EDT
From: PGRAHAME%BENTLEY.BITNET at mitvma.mit.edu
Subject: sparging and time

Brian Bliss, several digests back, writes that a normal sparge takes him
two hours.  My question for sparge adepts out there is this:  Two hours!?
It takes me no longer than 20 to 30 minutes to sparge 7 gallons of water
at 170 F through 7 lbs of grain.  I have followed Dave Line's instructions
closely, and have done this a half a dozen times with consistent results
and without any stuck or "set" sparges.  This time frame allows for a
very gentle and leisurely sprinkle, just enough to keep the water level
a tad above the grain bed.  So how can this process possibly take two hours?
I note there is a shared interest out there in improving the overall time
spent on all-grain brewing.  Currently my best time from starting the mash
to pitching the yeast is about ten hours.
Sage comments on sparge time, refinements, invited.
- --Peter

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End of HOMEBREW Digest #938, 07/30/92