HOMEBREW Digest #1248 Fri 15 October 1993

Digest #1247 Digest #1249

		Rob Gardner, Digest Coordinator

  Stuck Fermentation? (Chris Seiders)
  Beer in Anaheim, CA (JIM MCNUTT)
  Fast, Cool Sparges and Malt Charactor (larryba)
  rotten egg smell in fermentation (Tony Babinec 312 329-3570)
  GABF Size (npyle)
  Re: William Younger's No. 3 (andrewb6)
  Re: flaked Maize (TSAURET)
  beware of glycogen depletion (Tony Babinec 312 329-3570)
  filters (Chuck Mryglot X6024)
  Re: William Younger #3 (Paul Jasper)
  Alcohol Percentages ("Moore, Brian")
  carboy disasters ("Goodman, John")
  Addresses for COPS (Kieran O'Connor)
  Re: low O.G. readings and boiling wort question ("Robert K. Toutkoushian")
  Re: counter pressure filler (was Kegging systems) (jay marshall)
  request (robl)
  Handles for 6.5 gal carboys (Hal Laurent)
  Hard Cider Recipe? ("Pamela J. Day 7560")
  Chris Seiders' article (Kevin O'Connor)
  Chullhee C Cho  cho at MINERVA.cis.yale.edu (Mike Zentner)
  Mini Kegs (Josh Stillerman)
  COPS and AHA (Russ Gelinas)
  RE:iodophor & yuppies (Jim Busch)
  Idophor question (Eric M. Mrozek)
  Brewpub review ("Mark S. Nelson")
  The Great Boogy Conundrum (ROWLEY)
  More on the GABF ("CANNON_TOM")
  Subject: Mashout revisited and pH (Ulick Stafford)
  gravity change for 1 pound dme in 6 gallons (Mark Garti)
  Mashout revisited and pH (Ulick Stafford)
  Eisbock (Scott Stihler (USGS analyst))
  Re: Beer Drinks (Shawn Nunley)
  mashout (chris campanelli)
  re: William Younger's No.3 (again) (andrewb6)
  hemlock and cranberries (David Atkins)

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---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1993 09:25 -0600 (MDT) From: Chris Seiders <SEIDERS at HANDI.MED.UTAH.EDU> Subject: Stuck Fermentation? ICAgICBTaW5jZSB0aGlzIGlzIG15IGZpcnN0IHBvc3QgdG8gdGhpcyBsaXN0LCBw bGVhc2UgYmVhciB3aXRoIG1lLiAgSSBhbSBuZXcNCmF0IGJyZXdpbmcsIGFuZCBo YXZlIHJlY2VudGx5IHN0YXJ0ZWQgbXkgc2Vjb25kIGJhdGNoIG9mIGJyZXcuICBJ IGhhdmUNCmVuY291bnRlcmVkIHNvbWUgdGhpbmdzIHdoaWNoIEkgaGF2ZW4ndCBl bmNvdW50ZXJlZCBiZWZvcmUgKG5vdCBzdXJwcmlzaW5nIG9uDQpvbmx5IHRoZSBz ZWNvbmQgYmF0Y2gpIGFuZCBhbSBsb29raW5nIGZvciBzb21lIHdvcmRzIG9mIGFk dmljZS9lbmNvdXJhZ2VtZW50Lg0KSSBzdGFydGVkIGFuIGFsbC1leHRyYWN0IEJy b3duIE51dCBBbGUgb24gU2F0LiBBZnRlciBib2lsaW5nIHRoZSBleHRyYWN0IGZv cg0KMSBociBJIGFkZGVkIGl0IHRvIG15IDUgZ2FsbG9uIGdsYXNzIGNhcmJveSBh bmQgYnJvdWdodCBpdCB1cCB0byA1IGdhbGxvbnMNCndpdGggd2F0ZXIuICBJIHRo ZW4gY29vbGVkIHRoZSBjYXJib3kgaW4gYSB3YXRlci9pY2UgYmF0aCB1bnRpbCBp dCBjb29sZWQgdG8NCjc2+EYgYXQgd2hpY2ggcG9pbnQgSSBoeWRyYXRlZCB0aGUg d29ydCBieSByb2xsaW5nIHRoZSBjYXJib3kgYWxvbmcgdGhlDQpraXRjaGVuIGZs b29yIGFsb25nIHdpdGggc29tZSBtYW51YWwgc2hha2luZy4gIEkgdGhlbiByZWh5 ZHJhdGVkIG15IHllYXN0DQooMTRnKSBpbiAxLzIgY3VwIG9mIDkw+EYgd2F0ZXIg Zm9yIDE1IG1pbiBiZWZvcmUgYWRkaW5nIHRvIHRoZSB3b3J0Lg0KRmVybWVudGF0 aW9uIGJlZ2FuIHF1aWNrbHkgKHdpdGhpbiAzIGhvdXJzKSBhbmQgYWxvdCBvZiBj cmFwIGJsZXcgb3V0IG9mIG15DQoxIiBibG93b2ZmIHR1YmUgKGFwcHJveCAyIHF1 YXJ0cyBibG93b2ZmKS4NCg0KTm93IHRoZSBwcm9ibGVtOg0KICAgICBJIG5vdGlj ZWQgdGhhdCB0aGUgYmxvd29mZiBzdGFnZSBoYWQgcHJldHR5IG11Y2ggc3RvcHBl ZCBhcyBvZiBsYXN0DQpuaWdodCAoTW9uLikuIEkgcmVwbGFjZWQgdGhlIGJsb3dv ZmYgdHViZSB3aXRoIGEgZmVybWVudGF0aW9uIGxvY2ssIGJ1dCBpdA0Kbm93IGFw cGVhcnMgYXMgaWYgZmVybWVudGF0aW9uIGhhcyBzdG9wcGVkIGNvbXBsZXRlbHks IGllIEkgZG9uJ3Qgc2VlIGJ1YmJsZXMNCmNvbWluZyB0aHJvdWdoIHRoZSBsb2Nr LiAgTXkgcHJldmlvdXMgYmF0Y2ggd2FzIGEgc3RvdXQga2l0IGFuZCBmZXJtZW50 YXRpb24NCnNlZW1lZCB0byBjb250aW51ZSB0aHJvdWdoIHRoZSBsb2NrIGZvciBh dCBsZWFzdCBhIGdvb2Qgd2VlayBhZnRlciByZW1vdmluZw0KdGhlIGJsb3dvZmYu IE15IGNhcmJveSBpcyBsb2NhdGVkIGluIGEgY2xvc2V0IHdoaWNoIGtlZXBzIGl0 IGF0IGFib3V0IDc0+EYuDQpJcyB0aGlzIG5vcm1hbD8gIFNob3VsZCBJIHdhaXQg YmVmb3JlIGJvdHRsaW5nIG9yIGdvIGFoZWFkIGlmIHRoZQ0KZmVybWVudGF0aW9u IGhhcyBzdG9wcGVkPyAgQWZ0ZXIgb25seSAzIGRheXM/ICBQbGVhc2UsIG9oIHZl dGVyYW5zIG9mDQpob21lYnJldywgcGFzcyBkb3duIGFueSB3aXNkb20geW91IG1h eSBoYXZlIG9uIHRoaXMgc3ViamVjdC4gSSBhbSBiZWNvbWluZw0KcXVpdGUgY29u ZnVzZWQvZnJ1c3RyYXRlZCBzaW5jZSBJIGZlZWwgbGlrZSBJIGFtIHN0aWxsIHNo b290aW5nIGluIHRoZSBkYXJrDQp3aXRoIGVhY2ggc3RlcC4gVGhhbmtzIQ0KDQpD aHJpcyBTZWlkZXJzIChTRUlERVJTQEhBTkRJLk1FRC5VVEFILkVEVSkNCg0K Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 13 Oct 93 11:19:41 EST From: JIM MCNUTT <INJM%MCGILLB.BITNET at VM1.MCGILL.CA> Subject: Beer in Anaheim, CA I'll be attending a conference in Anaheim, CA during the middle of November. Does anyone have any suggestions for brew-pubs or good types of beer for that area. Please email directly to my email address. Thanks. Jim McNutt Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 13 Oct 93 11:29:09 -0400 From: polstra!larryba at uunet.UU.NET Subject: Fast, Cool Sparges and Malt Charactor Folks following my postings (sparse as they are) will note that I am a proponant of fast sparges. I always let my sparges run as fast as they can and I typically get very good extract yields from my mashes. My second to last batch was 20 min for 11 gal at ~34 pt/lb/gal I also typically skip mash out maybe heating the mash to 158-162 just to maintain a mash bed temp of 140-150 and to force conversion if the iodine test is not negative after 20-30 minutes. Once, a year or two ago, I asked the forums if there were any negative issues w/regard to fast sparges. I got no responses. Well, at the last Seattle Brews Brothers meeting I was talking with a brewer about malt charactor and mashing techniques. Many brew brothers do decotion and modified decotion mashing claiming improved malt charactor. This guy's claim was that fast, cool sparges produce low malt charactor. He said that he always runs a very hot sparge (180 or higher) because that husky graininess makes for more malt charactor. This guy also suggested an experiment for me to do to test out his ideas: next time I begin to lauter a 10 gal batch, to set aside 2 gallons of mash and bring it to a rolling boil before adding it back into the lauter tun. I guess this a way of simulating a decotion mash and the carmelization that occurs during the boils. He claimed that the change in malt and physical charactoristics of the mash would be obvious as I brought the 2 gallons to a boil. The question: What do folks think of this theory and the experiment? Am I likely to just end up with a bad starch haze and a puckery beer? Will I be safe from a starch haze due to the low temps of my lauter and the fact that I rarely mash for more than 40-50 minutes (two/three step infusion mash) there should be plenty of enzyme activity in the mash? - Larry Barello Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1993 10:39:38 -0500 (CDT) From: tony at spss.com (Tony Babinec 312 329-3570) Subject: rotten egg smell in fermentation This is approaching Frequently Asked Question statuts on HBD, so here's a brief explanation. The rotten egg smell is hydrogen sulfide -- H2S. Just-fermented green beer contains detectable levels of hydrogen sulfide, and the threshold value for this compound in beer is in the 5 - 10 ppb range. Hydrogen sulfide is present in wort, but is driven off during the kettle boil. Sulfur-containing volatiles, including hydrogen sulfide, are formed by some strains of yeast during primary fermentation. The level of hydrogen sulfide is reduced during beer maturation, and is presumed to take place as a result of the scrubbing action of carbon dioxide bubbles when produced in a beer fermentation. In conclusion, reduction of H2S occurs during secondary fermentation, and is therefore one reason among many to consider doing a secondary fermentation. Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 13 Oct 93 9:40:38 MDT From: npyle at n33.stortek.com Subject: GABF Size Chris asks whether the GABF equates to the AHA nationals for the pros. I don't know that much about the AHA, but I think the GABF is open to all professional brewers, regardless of affiliations. Many brewers there are Institute for Brewing Studies members, but not anywhere near all of them. This thing has gotten so big, though that it is difficult to get any idea of what's available. I would like to see several regional ABF's and have the GABF an invitation-only affair. The invites would go to the regional winners in each category. That way the regionals would be of a more reasonable size and so would the GABF (used as a national run-off competition). I went to the Saturday afternoon tasting and back again Saturday night, and I don't think I made a dent in the total number of beers there (nor would I try). Does anyone else think this thing is a leviathan? Dr. Fix, I believe you had one of the judging jobs, which should give you some insight into the organization. Is my idea feasible, possible, or a pipe dream? norm Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 13 Oct 93 12:16:00 EDT From: andrewb6 at aol.com Subject: Re: William Younger's No. 3 Ah, that brew of brews, that nectar of nectars, that heavenly concoction worthy of any man's affection. No. 3 is the beer for which I yearn. You're right it is an British brew, made by William Younger which is part of the Scottish and Newcastle group. I believe it is still made in Edinburgh, Scotland, and is typically consumed only in Scotland and the North of England. I must admit in my younger days (not too long ago) I consumed a cask or two of this beer, but as is typical of so many Britons, we spent many hours enjoying the brew and little time analyzing and pondering it's complexity. In other words I can't give you too much in the way of a description. Commonly thought of as a bitter, it's somewhere between a bitter and a brown ale. At first glance it looks black, and when served properly it's topped by a thin layer of dense creamy head. However when held up to the light (even in it's customary pint glass) it reveals a beautiful rich, ruby red color. It is certainly malty, but not sweet, and is balanced well by bitterness. As I recall it has an OG of about 1058. Michael Jackson gave it a poor review in his last book, and mentioned that it had a cult following. This last fact I can certainly attest to. Event the casual mention of it's name would cause a seasoned beer drinker to salivate and become glassy eyed (much as I am now). IMHO it's a fine beer and compliments William Younger's Scotch Ale and IPA. As far as alcohol content goes, maybe Jackson's book will tell you, but I can't put a number to it (but from experience, nine pints of No. 3 and you're really under the table). I'm not so sure about your comments on "Lager Louts". This beer is as far from being a lager as budlite is from being full-bodied. But if a football hooligan did take to drinking this beer, I would have to consider it his one redeeming feature. As far as finding it on this side of the pond--good luck. Unless things have changed in the last couple of years, No. 3 is only produced in cask form, and they don't ship it very far (in fact I've never seen it in the south of England). If you find out otherwise, let me know at all-speed. If you need to know more I'll gladly research it for you :-) --I'm going back home for Christmas. Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1993 13:00:39 EST5EDT From: TSAURET at Hermes.GC.PeachNet.EDU Subject: Re: flaked Maize Recently a I tried to add flaked maize to my wort, but I was unable to get the maize to pass the iodine test. I followed the instructions from THE JOY OF HOME BREWING, but after two hours gave up trying to pass the iodine test. The beer has been in the bottles a week now and evrything appears fine. Has anyone else run into this problem? What did I do wrong? Thanks, Tom Sauret Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1993 14:08:21 -0500 (CDT) From: tony at spss.com (Tony Babinec 312 329-3570) Subject: beware of glycogen depletion Intermittent posts to hbd have called attention to yeast pitching rate and the consequences of underpitching. A perhaps more serious concern is yeast vitality as measured by yeast glycogen content. Glycogen depletion is a consequence of long storage times, warm storage temperatures, and number of other causes. Pitching glycogen-depleted yeast can result in problems with the primary fermentation and the finished beer: - sluggish fermentation - slow attenuation - higher terminal gravity - poor flocculation - poor alcohol production - high diacetyl - high SO2 - high acetaldehyde - less flavor stability and shelf life. All the more reason to build up yeast in some starter wort before pitching into your beer. Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 13 Oct 93 15:38:25 EDT From: cmryglot at disney.CV.COM (Chuck Mryglot X6024) Subject: filters To those who filter: Is a 5 micron filter small enough to bother with? 5 micron filters are ease to find but I can't seem to find any that are smaller. Sears has 5 micron filters for $4.00 each. Is it best to use the fiber filter or the resin, or does it matter? Also, does filtering have any effect on carbonation? Thanks for your help. cmryglot at aecmail.cv.com Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1993 12:53:23 -0700 From: paul at rational.com (Paul Jasper) Subject: Re: William Younger #3 On 12 Oct, 9:51, Todd Jennings wrote: > Subject: William Younger #3 > > I have heard of a brew by the name of WILLIAM YOUNGER #3; read about it > in a soccer magazine, actually. In the mag article, the brew is > described as "the ruin of a good many young men". The article goes on to > refer to the beer as the preferred brew of LAGER LOUTS, the British > football hooligans we hear so much about. > > Is there anyone who can tell me what the story is with this apparently > British beer, i.e. what is the style, and where can one get it here in > the States(if anywhere)? I assume it's a bitter ale, but perhaps I am > off the track here. Can't wait to find out!! > >-- End of excerpt from Todd Jennings It doesn't seem very likely that "Lager Louts" would drink Youngers No. 3 (no # sign, since this meaning does not extend to the UK), it being a dark ale. Football hooligans in general would be hard pressed to find it outside of certain areas. It's made in Edinburgh by Scottish & Newcastle, one of the large national brewers, but isn't commonly available in their pubs. S&N are the brewers of McEwans Export, widely available in the US, but I doubt that they export a keg version of No. 3 (especially as I've only seen it in cask-conditioned form). No. 3 is fairly rich, a little stronger than ordinary ales at OG 1043, and if served with a head keeps it pretty well. In good condition it can be quite delicious. I'm not sure what style I would attribute to it - it's too strong for a dark mild and not as strongly flavored as a porter. Bass have a range of strong canned Scottish beers popular with certain types of soccer fan. They include Tennants Super (such beers are often named like grades of gasoline), also known colloquially as "Doom". Since this is also favored by drunks and winos as a quick and cheap way to get blitzed, I wouldn't really recommend it as a fashionable new trend with which to associate oneself. :^) - -- - -- Paul Jasper - -- RATIONAL - -- Object-Oriented Products - -- Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 13 Oct 93 15:40:00 PDT From: "Moore, Brian" <Moorebw at hvsmtp1.mdc.com> Subject: Alcohol Percentages Hello out there, I've got a question not really about homebrew, but about beer in general. This originally started with my desire to get more exciting microbrewed beers here in the beer wasteland of Alabama. About the most exotic thing we can currently buy is the Samuel Adams Boston Lager. Figuring this was a (good) starting point, I called the local distributor and asked if they were planning to bring in any of the other Sam Adams beers. The distributor said they were working on getting another, the Octoberfest, but that there were some that they could never get (the Double Bock). According to the distributor, all beers in the state of Alabama must be less than 4 percent alcohol (I'm not sure if this was buy weight or volume). We have Guinness, Bass, Hofbrau, etc. I thought that Guinness and some of the others would be higher than 4 percent. This leads me to wonder if brewers brew different versions of beer for different states. Does anyone out there in HBD-land have any knowledge on this subject? Brian Moore Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 13 Oct 93 15:47:00 PDT From: "Goodman, John" <Goodmjo at hvsmtp1.mdc.com> Subject: carboy disasters Dick Dunn's summary of carboy handle experiences prompted me to send a warning/bit of painful advice to all of you brewers: > - A full carboy weighs a bunch; *any* sharp shock--regardless of whether > a handle is involved--can break it. They are sturdy but not indestruc- > tible, so be careful but not paranoid. ABSOLUTELY!! When a carboy breaks, it tends to form some pretty large shards of glass that are capable of slashing through skin to the underlying bone quickly and quite painlessly. Unfortunately, the repair (Read: Numerous stitches and probing for glass slivers) involves quite a bit of pain and downtime of the limb. I never used a carboy handle or anything similar until after my accident a few weeks ago. Luckily, no beer was lost - just a 5 gal carboy. Since then, I have kept my carboys in plastic milk crates - great for transporting the full ones around (especially when wet), and they fit nicely in my wetbulb container and chest freezer. Be careful, don't regress to plastic if you break one, and above all - NEVER SHOW FEAR TOWARDS THE BEER. John Goodman Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1993 17:08:44 -0400 (EDT) From: Kieran O'Connor <koconnor at mailbox.syr.edu> Subject: Addresses for COPS Here are addresses for COPS--one for the program creator, and one for the local affiliate in Syracuse, NY COPS c/o STF Productions P.O. Box 900 Beverly Hills, CA 90213 Jeryl Jonza Program Director, WSYT - Channel 68 1000 James St. Syracuse, NY 13203 Thanks for the info--Rick Kieran O'Connor E-Mail Address: koconnor at mailbox.syr.edu Syracuse, N.Y. USA Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1993 16:16:07 -0500 (CDT) From: "Robert K. Toutkoushian" <TOUTKOUS at vx.cis.umn.edu> Subject: Re: low O.G. readings and boiling wort question Hello again: Thanks to everyone for the great suggestions concerning how to properly add extracts to water when boiling, and reasons why the O.G. readings I have been getting might be lower than expected. Let me pass along what I have learned: I had a problem with adding extracts to my boil, in that I have been getting some of the extracts sticking to the bottom, despite stirring. Several people have suggested that one should (1) bring the water to a boil, (2) remove from heat, (3) add extracts, and (4) put back on high heat and bring to a boil once the extracts have dissolved. It is important to then keep on a high boil in order to bring out the proper flavors of the hops, etc. Previously, I had been bringing the water to a boil, and adding the extracts directly to the boiling water while the pot was still on the stove, hence the scorching and the "gunk". Concerning the low O.G. readings, someone pointed out that if I was doing a partial boil, where I add the wort (extracts + 1.5 gallons water) to 3.5 gallons of water, then it is probable that the specific gravity of the wort at the top of the fermenter will be lower than the sepcific gravity at the bottom if the extracts settle to the bottom. (er, that word was supposed to be "specific"). Anyway, thanks to all again...I really appreciate the continued great advice of the subscribers here! Rob Toutkoushian University of Minnesota INTERNET: toutkous at vx.cis.umn.edu Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 13 Oct 93 17:33:38 CDT From: jay marshall <marshall at pat.mdc.com> Subject: Re: counter pressure filler (was Kegging systems) Don asked about counter pressure fillers: I got a counter pressure filler from Benjamine Machine Products that seems to work well. I posted the same question to the net, also asking for comments on the Foxx CPF. The general consensus was that the Foxx product was not well made, and that the BMP CPF was a good buy. I got one, used it, and had a problem with it leaking when the liquid valve was closed. Made for quite a mess until I got the process down. I called BMP and asked about it, and the guy said it was unusual, but not unheard of, to have a problem with the valve seat. He said to take it off, send it back, and if there was a problem with it he would replace it. When I went to take it off I found that it was loose to start with. I'm thinking that this may have caused the problem, but I won't have a chance to check it out until next week. BTW, the BMP CPF was supposedly designed by Micah Millspaw who, if you are a long time reader of the HBD, you recognize his name. If you don't, he was the source of some very good information and is now the head brewer at some place in California (I think). BMP has ads in most (including the latest) issues of Zymurgy. If you don't have access to it, let me know and I'll dig it up for you. Price was about $55 with shipping. BTW Don, I tried to email directly to you, but my mailer daemon doesn't recognize all those !'s in your address. If you have an address that is in internet format you might add it to your signature. - -- Jay marshall at pat.mdc.com Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1993 21:02:41 -0700 From: robl <ROBL at outside.com> Subject: request homebrew-request%hpfcmr at hplabs.hp.com robl at outside.com ================ Robert Linder phone 206-487-3656 fax 206-487-3773 ================ Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 13 Oct 93 09:31:03 EDT From: Hal Laurent <laurent at tamrc.ENET.dec.com> Subject: Handles for 6.5 gal carboys >From: rcd at raven.eklektix.com (Dick Dunn) > > I have to qualify that slightly: I did hear from one person who had put a > carboy handle on a 25-liter (6.5 gallon) carboy, and had seen some (my > interpretation) crazing around the neck. It didn't actually break off, but > he was (justifiably) scared away from using it. The reason I discount this > one data point is that the carboy handles are not designed to fit that size > of carboy. Obviously they weigh more, but the main issue is that the neck > diameter is different. Does anyone make carboy handles big enough to fit the 6.5 gallon carboys? I would definitely buy one if I could find one. Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1993 07:48:00 EST From: "Pamela J. Day 7560" <DAY at A1.TCH.HARVARD.EDU> Subject: Hard Cider Recipe? Hello All, Does anyone out there have a good recipe for Hard Cider? A bunch of my homebrewing cohorts and I are going to make some (40 or so gallons between us) next weekend, if we live through the New England Brewer's Fall Festival that is. We plan on making the cider ourselves, as I have access to a cider press, so we don't have to worry about watered-down commercial cider. Any suggestions would be welcome. Oh, BTW for all of you involved in the bogeyman/boogie man controversy, look up piss-ant in the dictionary. (hint: it has something to do with splitting hairs!) Cheers! Pam Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1993 08:43:51 -0400 From: Kevin O'Connor <kocon at ctp.com> Subject: Chris Seiders' article This was Chris Seiders' article. It was base-64 encoded (a MIME encoding format). As he says, please bear with him. Chris, try to tell your mail package to send mail to the digest in clear form. The message: - ------------------------------------------- Since this is my first post to this list, please bear with me. I am new at brewing, and have recently started my second batch of brew. I have encountered some things which I haven't encountered before (not surprising on only the second batch) and am looking for some words of advice/encouragement. I started an all-extract Brown Nut Ale on Sat. After boiling the extract for 1 hr I added it to my 5 gallon glass carboy and brought it up to 5 gallons with water. I then cooled the carboy in a water/ice bath until it cooled to 76xF at which point I hydrated the wort by rolling the carboy along the kitchen floor along with some manual shaking. I then rehydrated my yeast (14g) in 1/2 cup of 90xF water for 15 min before adding to the wort. Fermentation began quickly (within 3 hours) and alot of crap blew out of my 1" blowoff tube (approx 2 quarts blowoff). Now the problem: I noticed that the blowoff stage had pretty much stopped as of last night (Mon.). I replaced the blowoff tube with a fermentation lock, but it now appears as if fermentation has stopped completely, ie I don't see bubbles coming through the lock. My previous batch was a stout kit and fermentation seemed to continue through the lock for at least a good week after removing the blowoff. My carboy is located in a closet which keeps it at about 74xF. Is this normal? Should I wait before bottling or go ahead if the fermentation has stopped? After only 3 days? Please, oh veterans of homebrew, pass down any wisdom you may have on this subject. I am becoming quite confused/frustrated since I feel like I am still shooting in the dark with each step. Thanks! Chris Seiders (SEIDERS at HANDI.MED.UTAH.EDU) - ---------------------------------------------- I have had an experience like this myself with an unbelievably fast (seeming) fermentation. Actually mine may have even been faster, 2 days if memory serves me. Check your specific gravity. If you are down around 1010 or so for a brown ale, I would go ahead and bottle. It won't hurt to let it sit a bit too as long as there is still CO2 in the head space between the top of the carboy and the top of the fermenting beer. The batch that fermented fast on me was good drinking, so hopefully yours will be too. Good luck! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ | | Why we are here: Kevin G. O'Connor | /\/\ | To tremble at the terrible beauty Cambridge Technology Partners | / /_.\ | of the stars, to shed a tear at kocon at ctp.com | \ /./ | the perfection of Beethoven's +1 617-374-8286 | \/\/ | symphonies, and to crack a cold | | one now and then. - D. Letterman ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 14 Oct 93 07:59:06 -0500 From: zentner at ecn.purdue.edu (Mike Zentner) Subject: Chullhee C Cho cho at MINERVA.cis.yale.edu I tried to send you chiller plans, but your mail keeps bouncing with unknown QM user if you want these, send me your real email address. Mike Zentner zentner at ecn.purdue.edu Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1993 9:10:34 -0400 (EDT) From: Josh Stillerman <JAS at HARPO.PFC.MIT.EDU> Subject: Mini Kegs Someone gave me a 5 Liter Co2 charged mini Keg recently. Only it did not come with any directions. (Like how full to make it, how to tap it, how to adjust the Co2, etc...) Has anyone used one of these beasts? Any sugestions would be greatly appreciated. josh Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1993 10:03:23 -0400 (EDT) From: R_GELINAS at UNHH.UNH.EDU (Russ Gelinas) Subject: COPS and AHA For you AHA people out there: Did your organization ever contact the producers of COPS, Fox channel 25, or the police department "featured" in that infamous homebrewing issue of the COPS show? Seems to me that the defense of the hobby of homebrewing, and the education of the general public about the hobby, should be among the highest of the AHA's priorities. Certainly the fact that the AHA's president's book (Complete Joy of Homebrewing) was shown in an extremely negative light on national television should warrant(!) some sort of response. Perhaps you could ask your membership for donations to be used for a 30 second TV ad: "Hi, I'm Charlie Papazian, president of AHA and author of TCJOH. Perhaps you've seen my book featured in the back seat of a police car on the show COPS. While the AHA in no way condones any illegal activity, making beer and wine for personal comsumption is legal is all 50 states. (ed. true yet?) As in all hobbies, the advanced homebrewer requires specific equipment, much of which looks similar to that used in the illegal process of distillation. The AHA does not condone the production of distilled liquors. It is illegal and dangerous. But once again, the homebrewing of *beer and wine* *is* legal. Homebrewing is an enjoyable and creative hobby...founding fathers brewed.. helps the economy....personal freedoms...for more info call..." You get the idea. Russell Gelinas esp/opal unh Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1993 10:31:02 -0500 (EDT) From: Jim Busch <busch at daacdev1.stx.com> Subject: RE:iodophor & yuppies In the last digest: <Date: Tue, 12 Oct 93 20:29:28 -0400 From: Eric M. Mrozek <mrozek at horowitz.eecs.umich.edu> Subject: Idophor question <> I just finished a batch of spiced ale. Actually it started as a Belgian Brown > ale, but I used Idophor(sp?) to clean with and found that I can not tolerat Watch those line lengths... Iodophor is not to blame for a flavor defect in the beer. Look for changes in your technique. 1 oz iodophor per 10 gallons. I rinse my kegs even at this concentration. I do not rinse and rinse and rinse..just once or twice. Some dont rinse. I personnaly like using Iodophor. <Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1993 17:15:12 -0700 (PDT) From: "Mark S. Nelson" <mnelson at eis.calstate.edu> Subject: Brewpub review <The rise in popularity of microbrewing and specifically brewpubs is beginning to develope and ugly side, and I have recently seen this side in the form of the Belmont Brewing Company of Belmont Shores, California. <I guess it should come as no suprise that as brewpubs are becoming more and more trendy, there will be some designed especially to appeal to the yuppy set. While I can be critical of many breweries and dont object to Mark being critical of the beers at this brewery, I do feel Mark is being a bit naive in his critisim of any establishment targeting certain individuals/ groups of consumers. This is after all a buisness. This buisness requires a hefty capital investment. People expect a reasonable return on investment, in a reasonable timeframe. Is it really suprising that a brewpub in southern California is targeting the yuppy audience? Whats wrong with this? Dont these people have the liquid assets to pay off the breweries debt? How many other towns have brewpubs oriented to this segment of society? Gorden Biersch is one of the most successful brewpubs ever and the Palo Alto location has consistently been bashed for this "yuppy thing". As Dan prepares to open his fourth brewery, he's laughing all the way to the bank. Good brewing, Jim Busch Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1993 09:26:44 -0500 (UTC -05:00) From: ROWLEY at kuhub.cc.ukans.edu Subject: The Great Boogy Conundrum Ulrich, korz and arf commnet on the correct spelling of [boogy]. Well, the sociolinguist side of me wants to say that all dialectical variants are equally valid, but the frosted wheat side agrees with the idea that you all should consult a _good_ dictionary. The use of American Heritage and Webster's should be avoided at all times. Both of these companies are so popular because of cheapness and self-censorship. They both got contracts in primary and secondary schools nation-wide by kow-towing to "concerned parents' groups" which objected to inclusion of certain words and ideas. Instead get ye to an OED, an Oxford unabridged or a Random House. After seven years in the book biz, I should know. Let's leave it at that and get back to some brewing :*) (Tip O'Neil nose) Matthew Rowley Dept of Anthropology University of kansas rowley at kuhub.cc.ukans.edu Return to table of contents
Date: 14 Oct 93 10:10:00 EST From: "CANNON_TOM" <CANNON_TOM at hq.navsea.navy.mil> Subject: More on the GABF Message Creation Date was at 14-OCT-1993 10:10:00 I just got back from my first trip to Denver and my first GABF. First, let me say it was a great experience. I went to all three sessions, and despite the crowds on Friday and Saturday nights, I got to taste any beer I wanted with minimal difficulty. Concur completely with the Alaskan Brewing Company's Smoked Porter and the Vermont Pub and Brewery's Tartan Wee Heavy. Both deserved their gold medals. Also, any visitor to Denver must spend adequate time at The Wynkoop (adequate means as much time as possible). Great beer, great brewpub. That said, I was wondering if anybody out there who doesn't live in eastern Colorado is happy about the GABF always being held in Denver? This includes brewers and potential attendees. Why not move the thing around the country so more people have the chance to go to and participate in the event? I'm sure Denver is convenient to the guys who run the festival, but there are beer lovers across the country who deserve a chance to try the beers. It is, after all, the Great AMERICAN Beer Festival, so let's send it all over America. I'm sure Charlie P. will appreciate any input. Tom Cannon DH Brewery Fairfax/Annandale VA Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 14 Oct 93 10:15:48 EST From: Ulick Stafford <ulick at michaelangelo.helios.nd.edu> Subject: Subject: Mashout revisited and pH After reading all the accounts of mash out free sparges, and in need of doing a quick lager batch so I'd have krausen for 2 batches that had been hanging around for a while I tried a quickie brew - not my usual decoction effort. I mashed in at 124 (still nervous about Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 14 Oct 93 11:30:29 EDT From: garti at mrg.xyplex.com (Mark Garti) Subject: gravity change for 1 pound dme in 6 gallons to what extent will 1 pound of dme change the gravity of 6 gallons of water (or 1032 wort at 65C-70C). mrgarti at eng.xyplex.com Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 14 Oct 93 10:37:39 EST From: Ulick Stafford <ulick at michaelangelo.helios.nd.edu> Subject: Mashout revisited and pH After reading all the accounts of mash out free sparges, and in need of doing a quick lager batch so I'd have krausen for 2 batches that had been hanging around for a while I tried a quickie brew - not my usual decoction effort. I mashed in at 124 (still nervous about ommitting the protein rest) by adding the grain (9lb 2 row, 1/2 Cara, 1/2 crystal) to 136F water in my cooler with copper manifold false bottom. After 1/2 hour infused boiling water to 146, and after another 1/2 hour infused water to 155. After an hour total I attempted a runoff with no mashout and ran into difficulites. Part of the problem was stuff coming through somehow - maybe due to mashing in the lauter tun, but it wasn't long before the runoff died a death. Naturally I cursed all those on hbd who said mashout weren't necessary, and cursed my bad judgement against going against a procedure that worked well for me. Eventually I started to sparge after recuirculating much cloudy reheated runoff, and managed to free up the sparge with a knife quite well so that the total time was only slightly longer than it would have been if I'd mashed out and sparged. It would be fair to note that the problem hay have been a very thin mash (after all the infusions) which compacted the bed. I may try again sometime, but in meantime will stick to tried and trusted procedures. Ken Miller incorrectly states that the amount of acid to be added is dependent on the pH. It is dependent on the buffering capacity of the water - basically the amount of carbonates. A water with a very high pH >9 may be so because it is so soft, and may require no acid for a mash to reach the right range. If the water is fairly hard acid is needed except for the blackest stouts and porters. I suggest the original questioner get pH papers and add conservatively the first time till the right range is reached. Thereafter it is much easier. I am sure it would be possible to do it without indication by getting a water analysis and working out stoiciometrically how much acid is needed to neutralize most of the carbonate and then carefully measuring out that correct amount of acid - carefully noting the concentration and density of the acid when doing so. A micropipetter would be needed unless the acid was diluted, and in the absense of an accurate guage conversion factors to tablespoons would be needed. It probably wouldn't be too gruesome, and I may even do it as an excercise some time - for 100 ppm carbonate per 5 gallon add 2 tablespoons of lactic acid diluted 1-10, unless there is chocolate malt in the grist, add 2.3 that amount and when the moon is full... __________________________________________________________________________ 'Heineken!?! ... F#$% that s at &* ... | Ulick Stafford, Dept of Chem. Eng. Pabst Blue Ribbon!' | Notre Dame IN 46556 | ulick at darwin.cc.nd.edu Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1993 23:43:49 -0800 From: scott at fm.gi.alaska.edu (Scott Stihler (USGS analyst)) Subject: Eisbock Greetings, Living in Fairbanks, Alaska what could be a better beer to brew than an Eisbock. Does anybody out there have experience making Eisbocks? If so can you give me some advice? What is the best way to rack the beer off once ice crystals form? In terms of IBU's what range is appropriate to the style? I know from Micheal Jackson's book that the original gravity should be around 1.096 but that's about all I know. If anybody has more information regarding this style I'd like to check it out. Cheers, Scott Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1993 08:57:02 -0700 (PDT) From: Shawn_Nunley at Novell.COM (Shawn Nunley) Subject: Re: Beer Drinks Sean Taylor asked about Beer Drinks, so here is one that can be fun... Flaming Dr. Pepper from Hell This drink requires a shot glass and a tumbler style glass. Fill the shot glass with Amerretto (sp?) and the tumbler half full with beer. The idea is to have just enough beer to cover the shot glass when you drop it in the tumbler. Now, light the Ameretto (2nd try at spelling) and let it get pretty warm, not too hot. When the time is right, drop the shot glass in the tumbler. That's right, drop the whole shot glass in the tumbler so that it is standing up on the bottom of the glass. Now drink the whole thing as fast as you can. The Ameretto will pour out with the beer yet will remain kind of seperated. The resulting taste is remarkably close to a Dr. Pepper. This is a fast drunk, BTW. Hangover City too. Shawn Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 14 Oct 93 10:14 CDT From: akcs.chrisc at vpnet.chi.il.us (chris campanelli) Subject: mashout Tallying the responses from both HBD and email, it appears that there are quite a few homebrewers out there who do not perform a mash-out. More so than I imagined. And of course, there were the traditionalists who tried to defend the mash-out ceremony. Homebrewing makes for strange bedfellows. > Chris mentioned one of the benefits of mashout (the debated > one), but failed to mention the one on which most of us agree, > namely mashing out raises the temperature of the mash much > quicker than simply pouring sparge water and therefore more > quickly decreases the viscosity of the runnings. Runnier > runnings mean faster sparging (without a loss of extract > efficiency), less chance of a set mash (stuck runoff) and more > efficient extraction of sugars. Remember, warm honey pours > easier than cold honey. > > Al Ok I'll bite. Where's the dividing line between "warm honey" and "cold honey" i.e. at what point do wort sugars flow and not flow? I skip the mash-out and sparge with 170-180 F water. I usually sparge 5 gallons of water in 30-45 minutes. My mashing efficiencies are consistently over 80%. Given these facts I think it's safe to assume that wort sugars flow without a mash-out. > I agree that the reasons you quoted are not very rationial > reasons for doing a mashout but there is one reason that I think > is a good one. By raising the whole mash 20 degrees or so, you > stand a far better chance of keeping it in the optimum range > during the lautering process. It's easy enough to do for those > who kettle mash but it is probably not worth the trouble for the > bucket infusers. > > js Ouch. An idol's dagger plunges the deepest. You assume that we all agree there is an optimum range and that thus there is a need to be within that range. I do not support such assumptions. I skip the mash-out and consistently get good yields. It should also be noted that I use a picnic cooler and never perform a protein rest (Belgian malts). I won't tell you how I grind my malt because I'll be forced to use the "C" word. Looks like Godzilla and Mothra have teamed-up to combat the onslaught from BOQAT. So far BOQAT remains unscathed. Can Tokyo withstand another melee? Tune in tomorrow. Egg rolls served during the matinee. chris campanelli Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 14 Oct 93 13:00:54 EDT From: andrewb6 at aol.com Subject: re: William Younger's No.3 (again) In 1247 re: Younger's No. 3, Tony Babinec writes: >In Scotland, McEwan's has an ale known as 80 Shilling or IPA, with a gravity of 1042. In England -- spotted in London in The Sun -- you'll find Younger No. 3, a cask-conditioned ale of SG 1043. Think of this as an example of AHA Scottish Export. In the US, you'll find the bottled counterparts to these two beers. The IPA goes by the same name, and I don't remember the name of the other beer, but it might be McEwan's Export. In some parts of the U.S. you might find McEwan's Scotch Ale, but at SG 1088, this is a much stronger beer. If anyone has access to the S cotch Ale, send me one :-). Perhaps I misinterpreted, but it seems that you're implying tha t McEwan's 80 shilling and/or IPA are the Scottish version of Younger's No. 3. Not True! Both t he 80 shilling (written 80/-, and often referred to as 80 bob) and Younger's are available in the north of England. While it is true that No.3 is a cask conditioned ale and 80/ is served from a keg with a higher level of carbonation, these are two separate beers (not the same beer dispensed differently). No. 3 is darker and to my recollection much more malty. In my earlier post (which will probably appear in this issue) I suggested that No.3 has a gravity in the 50's. I think perhaps my thirst was impairing my memory--1043 sounds right. Incidentally, S&N make scotch ales under the names of McEwan and Wm. Younger. Here again, Younger's is cask conditioned and McEwan's is not. As to wheth er they are the same beer masquerading in different containers, I can't really say, but I suspect not. I have not seen the IPA over here, but you are right that the 80/- is sold as McEwans Export. Incidentally, the canned version is sold under the name of McEwans Export in Britain, too -- but of course they're bigger cans : - ) Not a flame, just a clarification (I hope). ******************************************************************************* *Andrew Baird * A good pilot is one who's made the same number of * *AndrewB6 at aol.com * landings as take-offs! * ******************************************************************************* Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 14 Oct 93 12:21 CDT From: David Atkins <ATKINS at macc.wisc.edu> Subject: hemlock and cranberries Hello readers. I recall someone not wanting to use hemlock in a brew recipe. The hemlock mentioned in the recipe is not the weed that took Socrates out of circulation. The non-toxic hemlock is a coniferous tree and harmful only if it falls on you (confermation for an authority knowledgeable person would be appreciated). Of course, since I'm not a toxicologist or forestry prof. or Ewel Gibbons I don't condone or incourage the consumption of this or any other sylva. I had some spring water once that poured over the fallen trunk of a hemlock...if beer could ever taste that good. Also, I'm going to skin the cat's meow in search of extract recipes utilizing cranberries...'tis the cranberry season. If anyone has any other experiences/favorites, I would eagerly read them. Thanks, David Atkins atkins at macc.wisc.edu Return to table of contents
End of HOMEBREW Digest #1248, 10/15/93