FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
		Rob Gardner, Digest Coordinator


Contents:
   (Jack Schmidling)
  ZIMA alert (Jim Doyle)
  SCRATCHES ("Dan Z. Johnson")
  pH and Brewing History (Larry Meyer)
  "America's Finest City" AHA Contest (x-4378)" <Simpson at po2.rb.unisys.com>
  Aging without yeast ("DEV::SJK")
  German Malt ("Dan Z. Johnson")
  UNYHA annual contest (kaltenbach)
  Homebrew (Jim Overstreet)
  Mead-lovers digest (bteditor)
  Sweetening meads (Tony_Quinn)
  Re: Kolsch Yeast ("Roger Deschner  ")
  pronunciations (btalk)
  You blew it, folks (a general & specific flame) ("Phillip Seitz")
  wood, bark and fungus beers ("Daniel F McConnell")
  No more portmanteau messages? (Spencer.W.Thomas)
  First Lager Questions ("Mark S. Woods")
  Daytona Beach Area (LPD1002)
  Help! Danish Beers (Jeffrey E Christensen)
  Beer of the Month Clubs (thomas ciccateri)
  Re:Ebenezer's puny pint (Marc Hugentobler)
  Enough!/Chiller Useage (npyle)
  Cream Ale - Zymurgy S.I. 1991 (dmorey)
  Need help priming with wort... (Spencer.W.Thomas)
  maple ale (Jonathan G Knight)
  decoction mashing (James Gallagher)
  Young's Winter Warmer & Sparkalloid ("Anderso_A")
  Why we homebrew (Jeff Benjamin)
  Re: Woman-Only Brewoffs (Ed Hitchcock)
  Ginger ale recipe (Jeff Benjamin)
  Women and Beer (REGINAH)
  Queens of Beer (/R=HERLVX/R=AM/U=KLIGERMAN/FFN=KLIGERMAN/)
  Beer, the Magazine (WKODAMA)


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For "Cat's Meow" information, send mail to lutzen at novell.physics.umr.edu



----------------------------------------------------------------------


Date: Tue, 8 Feb 1994 16:14:34 -0600 (CST)
From: arf at mcs.com (Jack Schmidling)
Subject:  

kiness' is not a characteristic of English IPA,
      although the beer was and sometimes still is aged in wood.
      You see, English oak is very different from its American
      cousin, and imparts little or no flavor to beer stored in
      casks made from it.....
 
 
 Perhaps the real answer is even simpler.  It has been my understanding that
 barrels used for beer were coated with tar to prevent evaporation.  If this 
 is true, one could get the "charasteristic" by coating a glass carboy with 
 tar or even pouring some in the beer.   Not as far fetched as it sounds.  
 Just ponder the Greek, retsina wine.
 
 js
 


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Date: Tue, 8 Feb 1994 14:38:12 -0700
From: Jim Doyle <jgdoyle at uci.edu>
Subject: ZIMA alert

I have noticed several postings about ZIMA lately, and thought I'd throw in
my two cents...

ZIMA has been sold here in California for over a year, and I tried it
once...a friend bought me one at a bar when they first became available.  I
drank about half of it and left it sitting on the bar when he wasn't
looking.

It has very little taste, sort of like an old vodka tonic from the night
before (watered down from the ice and all...).  My ex-roomate drinks it,
and says it is good for a buzz.

It is basically considered a "girlie drink" by most of the folks I know.

Here's to more new tasty beers instead!!

jgdoyle at uci.edu


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Date: 08 Feb 94 18:19:40 EST
From: "Dan Z. Johnson" <75430.3532 at CompuServe.COM>
Subject: SCRATCHES

Esslinger is brewed by The Lion in Wilkes-Barre, brewers of Stegmaier (sp?) and
other light classics. The bottles are scratched on the outside, not the inside.
If the scratches still bother you, you are the perfect person for competitions.
You should do very well.


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Date: Tue, 08 Feb 1994 16:38:43 -0700
From: Larry Meyer <Meyer at msscc.med.utah.edu>
Subject: pH and Brewing History

The origion of the "p" in pH is from the German "potenz" for exponent, or
the power of 10. As has been pointed out, pH is the log base 10 of the
hydrogen ion concentration. In 1909, Henderson developed the simple
equation relating the concentrations of disolved CO2 and bicabonate:
        [H+] = 24 x [P CO2] / [HCO3-]
which was transformed in1910 into the commonly used Henderson-Hasselbach
equation:
        pH = 6.1 + log ( [HCO3-] / (0.3 x [P CO2])).

The origion of pH, however, was also in 1909 in a thrilling 174 page paper
by S. P. L. Sorenson (Uber die Messung und die Bedeutung der
Wassstoffionenkonzentration bei enzymatischen Prozessen, Biochemesche
Zeitschrift 1909; 21:131). So who cares?

Sorenson worked in the Carlsburg Brewery in Copenhagen. The acid-base
relationship commonly used by physiologists dealing with CO2 buffers is as
valid for brew as for blood.

Fortunately, Sorenson's alternative name for this unit never took hold:
Wasserstoffionenexponent.

Finally, a note on temperature correction of pH. Common organic buffers
(for example beer) will change their dissociation constant with
temperature. What this means in practice is even though your expensive pH
meter or cheap pH paper correctly measures the pH at boiling, the pH may be
distinctly different at room temperature or when chilled. This may also
vary between different beers. One way around this is to remove a small
sample, chill to about room temperature, and then check.

Larry Meyer



 


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Date: Tue, 08 Feb 94 16:06:00 PST
From: "SIMPSON, Mark (x-4378)" <Simpson at po2.rb.unisys.com>
Subject: "America's Finest City" AHA Contest


Hey BrewGuys/Gals!!!

The first annual "America's Finest City Homebrew Contest", scheduled for 
March 12, 1994, is just around
the corner!!!  I hope that you guys are brewing like crazy and getting your 
brews packaged for shipment!!!
The entry window is March 1st through the 9th.

1)  The entry fee is $5.00 for the first entry and $3.00 for the remaining 
entries.  You can enter one brew
per sub-category and as many classes as you wish.

2)  Send 2 (two) bottles per entry as we are also having a "Best Of  Show" 
contest.

3)  Indicate (by arrow or other obvious sign) which side is "up" so we may 
store your packages properly.

4)  Mail all entries to:  Beer and Wine Crafts
              450 Fletcher Parkway
              Suite 112
                            El Cajon, CA 92020

I have an entry packet ready to send to anyone who plans to enter the 
contest.  Contact either Mark
Simpson:  (619) 578-2627 or Skip Virgilio:  (619) 566-7061.  I can be 
e-mailed at:
simpson at rb.unisys.com.

So, GET BREWING NOW!!!

Cheers!

Mark Simpson;  VP of QUAFF in San Diego









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Date: 8 Feb 94 19:23:00 CST
From: "DEV::SJK" <SJK%DEV.decnet at mdcgwy.mdc.com>
Subject: Aging without yeast


   I keg and force-carbonate my beer but I have the occasional need for a
few bottles of the stuff for gifts, competitions, longer-term storage, etc.

   I currently use either a variation of Norm's (HBD #1340) method of
filling a few bottles (Simply fill a bottle from the keg at low pressure. 
Ah, LOW pressure.  I was super-chilling in the freezer.  Thanks, Norm.) or
I take a stab at the volume of corn sugar necessary to prime 3 or 7 or
whatever bottles.  Both methods have merit in that they are cheap and
simple, but I'd like something a little more accurate and predictable.

   Enter CP filling.  The main advantage of this for me would be that I
could then eliminate guesswork and regulate carbonation (OK, real reason: 
I have YET to make a sparkling mead and I'm going to resort to brute
force.)  This in turn led me to thinking about filtering to eliminate
settling constraints and thus, my question:  What is the effect of
filtering out nearly all yeast (5 microns?) on aging of beer and mead?

   I've read here and elsewhere that yeast in the bottle increases the
stability and shelf-life of beer, but how important is yeast in the aging
process?  Is it required, does it just help, or is it optional?  Is there
something else in there that settles/mellows/blends without the help of
friendly fungus?  And if not, is it therefore pointless to store de-yeasted
mead for several months so that it will get even tastier?  Lastly, I've
treated beer and mead as if they were interchangeable here, but is THIS
correct?  Seems to me that they are two different animals, but I've yet to
brew a beer that didn't benefit from at least a little time in the keg or
bottle and the same is obviously true to a much greater extent for meads. 
Perhaps just a matter of degree.

   Hmm...


   Scott Kaczorowski
   sjk%c17fcs.decnet at mdcgwy.mdc.com



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Date: 08 Feb 94 20:51:27 EST
From: "Dan Z. Johnson" <75430.3532 at CompuServe.COM>
Subject: German Malt

 Lee Menegoni  lmenegoni at nectech.com writes:
>>Subject: german malt
My local HB shop has some German Vienna malt from  a company
pronounced "Durst" sp? .  Has any one heard of them? is the stuff any good?
how does it compare to Ireks?<<

After not being able to get a bag of HDM pilsner malt, I settled for a bag of
Durst Pilsen. It is a very pale, fresh smelling malt. The crushes were good with
little flour and the extract rate has been very good. No tastings to date, but I
think I will do a duplicate batch with Ireks. it was a good bit cheaper than
ireks, but we know that that may mean little or nothing.
I'd be interested to know how the Vienna works out. I like mthe idea of brewing
a vienna-style with vienna malt, not with pils and darker malt for color.

Dan Z. Johnson
While Drinking A Honey Double Mai-Bock


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Date: Tue, 08 Feb 94 21:52:55 EST
From: kaltenbach at aol.com
Subject: UNYHA annual contest

It's time to get brewing for the UNYHA annual contest!  (And time to start 
studying for the BJCP exam, being held the day before the contest!)
_______________________________________________________________________

                Upstate New York Homebrewers Association
           16th Annual Competition and 5th Empire State Open

                        Saturday, April 16, 1994
                 McGinnity's Restaurant and Party House
                          534 West Ridge Road
                          Rochester, New York

             Doors open at 6 PM  --  Judging begins at 7 PM
                           Admission:  $5.00

     Come & join the fun!  Enjoy complimentary samples of homebrew!
_______________________________________________________________________

12 HOMEBREW STYLES WILL BE JUDGED:

     British Ale              Light Lager              Porter
     North American Ale       Amber Lager              Stout        
     Brown Ale                Dark Lager               Specialty
     Belgian        Looks Like "Saranac Black & Tan"   Mead

               No entries will be accepted after April 6.

Contest entries may be entered at homebrew shops in Rochester, Buffalo, 
Syracuse, Utica, Ithaca, Binghamton, and the Hudson Valley -or- they may 
be shipped.  Send email request to address below for more information.

Prizes:

  * Prizes are awarded for 1st, 2nd, and 3rd places in all categories
  * For all categories (except Looks Like):  Malt extract or other brewing 
    supplies
  * For Looks Like "Saranac Black & Tan":  Prizes awarded by F.X. Matt's 
    Brewery

Prizes For Best of Show:

  1st Prize -- Complete home kegging system from ADM Amalgamation
  2nd Prize -- $50 gift certificate for homebrew supplies from The Wine 
               Press & Hops
  3rd Prize -- $25 gift certificate for homebrew supplies from Cottage 
               Brewing

(All categories except Mead and Looks Like "Saranac Black & Tan" compete 
for best of show.)

Drawing for a gift certificate from Rohrbach Brewing Company included in 
admission;  there will be chances to win other beer-related prizes.  
We'll provide free snacks & samples of homebrew.

*** Contest Sanctioned by the American Homebrewers Association ***

For more info about our competition, or about the BJCP exam being held 
on Friday, April 15, contact me at the address below:

Tom Kaltenbach
Member, Upstate New York Homebrewers Association
Rochester, New York, USA
Internet:  kaltenbach at aol.com

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Date: 08 Feb 94 19:00:12 -0500
From: Jim.Overstreet at p5.f1.n396.z1.fidonet.org (Jim Overstreet)
Subject: Homebrew

I would like to inform you about the upcoming Crescent City
Competition III, to be held April 23, 1994 in New Orleans.
Entry deadline is April 19, 1994.  Contact Wayne Rodrigue at
504-468-9273 or Doug Lindley, 504-277-2770, for brochures and
information.  Competition will be held during JAZZFEST weekend,
at Deutsches Haus, 200 South Galvez Street.  There will be
23 categories, and last years competition drew 185 entries.
Anyone interested in sponsoring a category should contact
Wayne at the above number.  Some sponsors will be Dixie
Brewing Company, Abita Brewing Company, and Crescent
City Brewhouse.  Address all correspondence to:

       Crescent City Competition III
       c/o Wayne Rodrigue
       4233 Alabama Ave.
       Kenner, LA 70065

CCC III is an AHA sanctioned event.  We are soliciting 
certified or recognized judges, and also stewards.  Anyone
interested in participating please contact Raymond Diament,
at 504-486-3409 or the above address.

- ---

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Date: Wed, 09 Feb 94 01:50:06 EST
From: bteditor at aol.com
Subject: Mead-lovers digest

Based on second-hand information I tried contacting the mead-lovers digest at
the following address:

mead-lovers-request@ telford.nsa.hp.com

I keep getting bounced.  Can anyone verify/correct this address for me?

Thanks

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Date: Tue,  8 Feb 94 14:33:54 -0800
From: Tony_Quinn at f1004.n202.z1.fidonet.org
Subject: Sweetening meads


There are several possible ways to sweeten a "too dry" mead that come
to mind.
 
    Add boiled/pasteurized honey/water mixture on a recurring basis
until such time as the little yeastie beasties keel over and stop
fermenting - sort of liking madeira.
 
    Use a less alcohol tolerant yeast - i.e. a white wine vice a
champagne 
yeast.
 
    Treat with potassium sorbate and add sugar.  Theoretically, at 
least, if the potassium sorbate is added to a completed fermentation
and then additional sugar is added, no further fermemtations will
start.
 
    Add lactose?
 
    Add sorbitol or some other artificial sweetener.
 
    Start the fermentation in the ranges where no hydrometer has ever 
gone before. <over 3lbs honey per gallon????>
 
Other than those, I suppose you could do the tequila trick and suck on
a lemon just prior to drinking your mead <grin>
 
Tony Quinn

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Date: Wed, 9 Feb 1994 08:02:44 CST
From: "Roger Deschner " <U52983%UICVM at UIC.EDU>
Subject: Re: Kolsch Yeast

Dear Confused: Wyeast 1007 "German Ale"; just do it. Better yet, try the
new "Wyeast Kolsch" strain in the new packaging without built-in starter.
You want to attenuate fairly fully, and true Alt yeasts such as 1338 will
not do that. Relax, don't worry about all those different temperatures;
these yeasts have been dealing with THAT for centuries.

Next time you visit your local homebrew store, buy the reprint of the
Zymurgy special yeast issue. You'll be less confused.

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Date: Wed, 09 Feb 94 09:26:25 EST
From: btalk at aol.com
Subject: pronunciations

Dumb question, but...
How do you say SAAZ. soft as in SOT or harder like in SAT?
How about FUGGLES . is it like the u in RUG, or u in USE?
 I've heard them all but don't know which is correct.
This should bring some guffaws ;)
Bob Talkiewicz, Binghamton, NY

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Date: Wed, 09 Feb 94 10:05:34 -0400
From: "Phillip Seitz" <p00644 at psilink.com>
Subject: You blew it, folks (a general & specific flame)

There has been a lot of debate recently about the declining quality and 
mushrooming quantity of "information" on HBD.  I'd like you to know 
that due to some infantile contributors you've all lost a major opportunity.

About a month ago a friend introduced me to a very nice guy who works 
in a major Belgian brewing school.  He was kind enough to give me a 
tour, during which I learned that he was linked to Internet.  I told 
him about HBD, Lambic Digest, etc., and he was quite interested.  
Knowing that he had an outstanding knowledge of brewing chemistry and 
other suds-related topics, I thought that his participation would be 
quite welcome, and the information that he could share quite valuable.

Shortly after my return he signed up for HBD, and even posted an introductory 
message.  Rather than treat this guy with even a modicum of respect, 
some sophmoric dick-head (yes, you heard me right) wrote to ask if he 
could use pot instead of hops in lambics, and, given Belgium's 
proximity to Amsterdam, whether this guy might be of assistance in 
obtaining any.  Well, the guy at the school figured he had more 
important things to do than answer asshole questions like this--I 
agree--and signed off.

I think that's all I need to say.  If you want to flame me back, go 
right ahead.  I don't get angry often, but this did it.  I'm not 
necessarily nostalgic for the old days of the digest, since I wasn't 
here, but I can say that there is a point at which free and open 
discussion degenerates into useless noise.  We've just about hit that 
level if you ask me.

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Date: 9 Feb 1994 09:40:50 -0500
From: "Daniel F McConnell" <Daniel_F_McConnell at mailgw.surg.med.umich.edu>
Subject: wood, bark and fungus beers

Subject:  wood, bark and fungus beers


In response to quite a few questions about deviant oaking/nutting/
mushrooming behavior (there appears to be a rather large group of 
psychobrewers out there), I am posting the details.  WARNING, these 
practices are not AHA approved.

Oak:  Use American white, NOT red.  White  oak is sweet smelling and 
the material that barrels are made from.  Red oak is the common furniture
variety and smells vaguely musty and sour.  I run it through a jointer to 
make fine chips.  The same treatment is used for other wood such as 
chestnut or pecan.  Alternately you can purchase white oak chips in a 
homebrew/winemaking supply shop.  The toasted ones are nice.  No 
treatment needed, just throw them in the boil with the hops for an hour. 
Looking back at my notes (36 batches were treated this way, most 
between 1987 and 1990).   20-30 gr/5 gal is about right for a pale 
beer and 35-40 gr/5 gal for a darker beer.  I have used as much as 60 
grams.  Once I put 28 grams in a keg of a stout.  What started off 
unnoticeable, became intense and then overwhelming by the time the 
keg was empty.  Lately I've only treated Milds and oddballs like Bier 
de Guarde.  Low gravity milds work well with 30 grams.

Nutshells: pecan shells MUST have all of the unpleasant, bitter, dark 
red material removed.  Just crush. 25-30 gr/5 gal is good.

Mushrooms: morels are great, but you REALLY have to like the earthy 
flavor.  It goes very well with game and rustic food.  You must also pick 
them yourself, unless you can convince a 'schroomer to part with a quart 
(right, but trades are always possible).  The dried Chinese variety are 
good in a pinch, but less interesting.  Soak them in enough vodka to cover 
for a week or so, strain and add the liquid at bottling, then take the 
mushroom and make someone a mutant martini.  I have only tried this 
with a pale ale that was underhopped and needed fixing, and used as 
many morels as I could get my hands on which was a little more than 3/4 
quart in a pint of vodka.

Nutmeats:  Pecans are great.  4-5 oz ground and soaked in vodka as with 
the mushrooms, but beware the oils will kill the beer's head.  

Have Fun, Brew where others fear to tread,  
DanMcC  




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Date: Wed, 9 Feb 94 09:50:52 EST
From: Spencer.W.Thomas at med.umich.edu
Subject: No more portmanteau messages?

Since I put together my thread-searches-via-WWW script, I've been
using it a lot to pull out old stuff from the HBD.  On thing that
annoys me is finding that a search for "A and B" pulls up a message
that has nothing to do with what I'm searching for, but instead
includes the two terms in separate replies to different messages.

An example: I was looking for a posting I thought I had seen last
summer relating chewing hops to failing a drug test, so I searched for
"hop and drug".  It pulled out several messages discussing the COPS
show and that mentioned drugs, that happened to be together with a
reply to some totally different query about hops.  Foo!

So, this is a plea to keep each message short and to a single point.
It makes it a lot easier to save messages on a single topic, and to
follow old threads in the archives. 

(Now, to climb into my asbestos suit....)
=S

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Date: Wed, 9 Feb 1994 09:00:20 -0600 (CST)
From: "Mark S. Woods" <woodsman at genesis.mcs.com>
Subject: First Lager Questions

I've got some questions about a lager I started back on 12/28. It has
been lagering for about a month now, but still doesn't seem quite ready
to bottle. It still has a slight sulphur odor and a corresponding
flavor. At least it is smooth! This is my first lager and I'm not quite
sure how to proceed. It seems to me that I should wait until the odor
clears before I bottle. If I do that, how long should I expect to wait
and at what point do I have to worry about losing the yeast?

The lager was brewed from extract using Coopers unhopped light malt
extract and 3 lbs of M&F light. I pitched a Wyeast California Lager and
had a very (very) slow ferment over 11 days. The beer was in an area of
my basement that is consistently 50F on the ground. Due to a frozen sump
I had to move the carboy a couple times during the lagering stage. It
probably got up to about 60F for a total of three days.

On to another batch. Two weeks ago I brewed Papazian's "The Sun Has Set On
Time..." using Laaglander and Wyeast California Lager. I ran into a
problem with starters and didn't get yeast pitched until six days after
I brewed (yikes). I guess things must be clean because I didn't see any
bacterial ferment activity. I fermented this at about 65F. Tonight I
racked the beer to a secondary. The SG was 1.027 (normal for Laaglander
I guess) and the stuff had an awful taste and a sweet syrupy odor. I can
only describe the taste as gasoline like. I'm lagering this in my
basement at about 50F. Is this bad taste to be expected? I did rack the
beer prior to pitching just to get it off the trub. I'll wait it out for
a few weeks to see what happens, but I'd like to know what to expect.



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Date: Wed, 9 Feb 94 08:07:27 -0700
From: LPD1002%NYSHESCV.bitnet at UACSC2.ALBANY.EDU
Subject:  Daytona Beach Area

Thankfully, I will be leaving this frozen wasteland of upstate
New York for a bit and heading down to the Daytona Beach Florida
area.  The standard questions apply.  Does anyone know of any
brewpubs in the area or even in Orlando.  Also, does anyone know
of any good beverage stores in Daytona.  At least the fridge
can be well stocked.
Private E-mail please.  The digest's been pretty crowded lately.
Thanks.

    Steve Septer
    LPD1002 at NYSHESCV.BITNET at UACS2.ALBANY.EDU


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Date: Wed, 09 Feb 94 09:15 CDT
From: Jeffrey E Christensen <JECHRIST at macc.wisc.edu>
Subject: Help! Danish Beers

Hello!,
 
I have a group of friends from Denmark visiting soon and we will be consuming a
wide variety of homebrew and microbrew, but I would also like to provide them
with the finest beer of their "Homeland" available to us in "The States".  I
would appreciate any and all suggestions/brief descriptions/regions of
availability of such beers sent to my address: jechrist at macc.wisc.edu
 
Secondary, but important, does anyone have any info on the availability of the
Spanish Peaks (Bozeman?, Montana) products to the Midwest?  I live in Madison,
Wisconsin, but make at least a few trips a year to Minneapolis and Chicago.  I
had several "tastes" of the Black Dog Ale and luscious porter from their
microbrewy at an annual tasting in Madison last summer.  Is it possible I can
have a truckload sent to my home?
 
		I tip my glass to you,
 
			Jeffrey E. Christensen
			jechrist at macc.wisc.edu
 

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Date: Wed, 9 Feb 1994 08:21:57 -0700 (MST)
From: thomas ciccateri <tciccate at carina.unm.edu>
Subject: Beer of the Month Clubs

   Based on the numerous requests, I`ll post the summary info on Beer Of
The Month Clubs from the Dec/Jan Celabrator Beer News and from Beer, The
Magazine vol 2 no 1.

Beers 2 You $12.95/$14.95, (800)323-BEER, (414)223-4181
Beer Across America, $14.95/$22, (800)854-BEER, (708)639-2337
Brew to You, $20/$22, (800)800-BREW
Gourmet Beer Society, $7.95/$14.95, (800)777-0740, (909)676-2337
International Beer Club, $20, (800)854-4903
Micro Brew Express, $15.95 + S&H, (415)493-2992
Microbrew to You, $21.95 +, (800)347-8532, (408)379-0500

Drinkers in North Dakota, Texas and Washing may have trouble participating.

Check out the sources:
	BEER: THE MAGAZINE, Box 717, Hayward, CA. 94543, (800)646-2701
		$15/$24 per Year, 5 issues, covers beer-related news.
	CELEBRATOR BEER NEWS, Box 375, Hayward, CA 94543, (800)430-BEER
		$14.95/$26.95 6/12 issues, covers micro-brewing scene.

Salud,

Tom Ciccateri
University of New Mexico - Hitchhiker on the Information Superhighway
Training and Learning Technologies Div.
tciccate at carina.unm.edu


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Date: Wed, 09 Feb 1994 09:13 -0600 (MDT)
From: Marc Hugentobler <MARHUG at TELECOM.USU.EDU>
Subject: Re:Ebenezer's puny pint

Just a quick note

Kelly Jones writes:

:-<There's a brewpub in Logan, Utah called Ebenezer's.
                        ^^^^^
Sorry to say, but being a longtime resident of Logan, Utah I have never once
run across said brewpub. The very thought of such a thing in an environment
of a painfully MORAL town is right now causing the founding fathers of this
town to soil their shorts.:<

I have however heard(not patronized) of an establishment in Ogden, Utah
called Ebenezer's but know nothing of their pint parameters. Yes you should
report them immediately to the National association of brewsters bad on puny
pints.

Just had to clear that up, knowing the only good pints served here in logan
are served by crusty old buggers like myself.

Adios
Marc        

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Date: Wed, 9 Feb 94 9:21:45 MST
From: npyle at n33.stortek.com
Subject: Enough!/Chiller Useage

OK, I think we're all in agreement.  We won't use that gluteus maximus stuff.
Enough already?

**

Pete Geib writes:

>......................  Ten minutes before the end of the boil, I set my
>chiller in the five gallon SS pot.  Five minutes later, I drop in
>another couple ounces of hop pellets.  At the end of the boil, I turn
>off the fire and start the cold water flowing.
>
>.......
>
>My first problem is what is this cold break, what does it look like, and
>how much wort do I leave in the pot to avoid it?  Problem two: How do I
>siphon with all of that hop "mush" floating around?

If you can't see the cold break, you aren't letting it settle out enough.
I suggest that after chilling, you whirlpool the wort really well with a
spoon.  Let it settle for another 15 minutes, and start your siphon from the
side of the kettle.  Also, use a hop bag, and remove it before whirling.
This will take care of the mush.

>Finally, should I worry about the chiller eventually oxidizing, and
>putting off flavors into the beer?

No.

Norm

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Date: Wed, 9 Feb 94 10:30:11 -0600
From: dmorey at iastate.edu
Subject: Cream Ale - Zymurgy S.I. 1991

Greeting beer lovers and brewers,

	In HBD#1346, Ronald Dwelle aks about cream ale.  This day I
just happened to have the 1991 Zymurgy Beer Styles special issue with
me.  According to this issue, cream ale was first an attempt to
reproduce Bohemian pilsners with ale yeast.  Later, people began to
use lager yeasts.
	In the origanal way, the wort would be fermented with a ale
yeast in a temperature range of 58 to 70 F.  This would be followed by
a long, cold lagering period ~ 33 F for two to four months.
	The later method used newly availible, stable, (to the US) 
bottom fermenting lager yeast.  These beers were called *lively ale*
or *sparkling lager ale*.  Using the lager yeast, the beer was
fermented at ale temperatures (sounds like steam to me), followed by a long
cold lagering period.
	So, the summary for both methods/yeasts is:  Ferment at ale
temperatures and then lager at cold temperatures for a long time.
This beer *should* be brewed from very pale malts, have minimal
hopping and hop nose.  In other words, very close to American standard
lagers.
	One final note.  According to the article, beers made with the
lager yeast are called *American ale*???? and those with the ale yeast
*Cream ale*.  But, I wouldn't get hung up on this.  Just try to
mimmick some of the commercial varieties:  Little Kings Cream Ale,
Molson ale, Labatt's 50 ale, ....

Keep on brewing,

==========================================================================
 Dan A. Morey		|   Wine is proof that God loves us and wants to
 dmorey at iastate.edu	|   see us happy.  - B. Franklin
 Agricultural Process 	|
 Engineer		|   The same is true for BEER!  - Me
==========================================================================




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Date: Wed, 9 Feb 94 11:30:57 EST
From: Spencer.W.Thomas at med.umich.edu
Subject: Need help priming with wort...

Back of the envelope calculation:

You want about a .002 rise in SG for priming.  This is 1/2% sugar by
weight, leading to 1/4%CO2 by weight if it all fermented.  1/4% by
weight is 2.5g/kg, or about 2.5g/liter.  2.5g of CO2 is roughly 1.25
liters at STP (if I'm remembering my gas constant right), so you're
getting 1.25 "volumes" of carbonation.  With 75% attenuation (typical
for most yeast/wort combos), you'll get just under 1 volume.)  If you
want higher carbonation, add more.

Now, how to get .002 rise?  With corn sugar, you'd add about 4 ounces
(at 45pt-gal/lb, 4 ounces in 5 gallons is 45 * .25 / 5 = 2.25).  With
dry malt extract, at 40pt-gal/lb, you'd add about the same.  Put it in
enough water to dissolve it.

If you've already got wort, you can figure the dilution (e.g. 1.040
wort needs to be diluted 20:1, so 1 quart in 5 gallons is right).

=S

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Date: Wed, 09 Feb 1994 11:10:03 -0500 (cdt)
From: Jonathan G Knight <KNIGHTJ at AC.GRIN.EDU>
Subject: maple ale


My thoughts are turning toward a brew which has been on my mental drawing 
board for some time and which I shall probably get around to attempting 
within the next six months.  I want to make an extract-based ale using maple 
syrup, and I am thinking along these lines:

4 lb. Alexanders Sun Country light M.E. syrup
1 lb. light amber maple syrup (made by my cousin in New Hampshire)

Alexander is my choice for malt extract because it is so light and neutral, I 
think it will let the maple shine through nicely.  I am having trouble, 
however, deciding on yeast strain and hop variety.

For yeast, I am thinking probably Wyeast "German" or "American."

For hops, I am leaning toward a "lager" hop such as Saaz or Hallertau, 
although there's always Cascade or possibly Willamette.  I am also leaning 
toward hopping more in the middle and end of the boil, possibly leaving out 
any hops until then.

Any thoughts or opinions regarding choice of yeast and hops for this 
adventure would be appreciated.  TIA!

Jonathan Knight
Grinnell, Iowa

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Date: Wed, 9 Feb 94 12:28:39 EST
From: jimg at dcz.gso.uri.edu (James Gallagher)
Subject: decoction mashing

I would like a pointer to a good source of information on decoction mashing.

Some quetions I have about the process: Does it produce different flavors
that `temperature controlled' mashing? Should I separate the grain from the
liquid before boiling? If not, then won't that extract lots of tannings?
Also, won't boiling a fraction of the mash kill off the enzymes in that
partion of the mash? Does that matter?

Lots of questions, I guess - thanks in advance.

James Gallagher
jimg at dcz.gso.uri.edu

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Date: 9 Feb 94 12:06:00 EST
From: "Anderso_A" <Anderso_A at hq.navsea.navy.mil>
Subject: Young's Winter Warmer & Sparkalloid

The following attachments were included with this message:
__________________________________________________________________
TYPE     : FILE
NAME     : HBD
__________________________________________________________________


           Greetings,
                I'm in a bit of a quandry.  I'm planning a late-winter
           or early-spring trip to London, but I want to make sure that
           I don't miss out on Young's Winter Warmer - it's definitely
           one of my 3 favorite British real-ales.  However, London
           winters are dark, wet, and cold (maybe that's why I like
           the Winter Warmer so much!).  So, I'd like to show up during
           the last week or two of the Winter Warmer being served.  Do
           any of the HBD British readers or CAMRA members have any
           info to help me out?
                
                Also, I've another question.  I brew beer but I also 
                occasionally dabble in meads.  In my last mead I used
                some SPARLALLOID as a fining agent.  The stuff worked
                great!  Incredibly clear within a couple of days.  The
                obvious question then arises: "What happens if I use
                this stuff in a beer?"
                                      
                Much Appreciated
           Andy A  -  Sorry, no silly band-width-wasting messages ...




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Date: Wed, 9 Feb 94 10:53:45 MST
From: Jeff Benjamin <benji at hpfcbug.fc.hp.com>
Subject: Why we homebrew

Paul Beard wrote:
> ...once you examine the flavor profile, it seems a real beer lover
> would want to emulate/modify an enjoyable flavor (in homage and tribute,
> of course).  And who gets into a hobby to save money over buying a mass
> produced product?

In fact, discounting labor & equipment costs (which is closer to $100
than $1000), it *is* cheaper to make homebrew than buy beer.  An average
batch might cost me $12 for 5gal -- that's $6 a case.  There aren't many
commercial beers that are that cheap, and I haven't drunk any of those
since college :-).  If I culture my own yeast and grow my own hops, I
could get the cost down to $5 for 5 gal -- $2.50 a case, less than a
"pint" in most bars.  Cost is the least of it, though.

Homebrewing also taught me finer appreciation of commercial beers.  Now
I know what various kinds of umprocessed malt, hops, and yeast (as well
as sanitizers, oxidation, and infections) smell and taste like, so I can
identify those characteristics in commercial brews as well.  It's a
great incentive, IMHO, to move up from kits, and then to all-grain.

Derek Montgomery wrote:
> From reading the postings in the Digest I realize that this is "not just
> a hobby"

That's right.  It's a way of life.  You have to eat to survive, so therefore
you must cook, right?  Brewing is the same way for some of us (who, me?).

"Full measure, barkeep!"

- --
Jeff Benjamin                               benji at hpfcla.fc.hp.com
Hewlett Packard Co.                         Fort Collins, Colorado	
"Midnight shakes the memory as a madman shakes a dead geranium."
					    - T.S. Eliot

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Date: Wed, 09 Feb 1994 12:12:30 -0400
From: Ed Hitchcock <ECH at ac.dal.ca>
Subject: Re: Woman-Only Brewoffs

I found this in HBD1346:

>"Does this strike anyone else as quite sexist and self defeating."
>
>Yes, I am 100% in agreement with your analysis on both counts.
>
>"In this era of eliminating the differences between the sexes this
> seems to be several steps backwards."
>
>Kind of brain-dead ... sort of a 'tit for tat' tactic, more meant
>to compel men to suffer the feeling of being left out that some
>women might experience, than to generate feelings of equality, if
>I understand it correctly.
>
>"In fact there would be quite an outcry if there we a male only
> competition.  Or can you even imagine a "white" only competition!?!"
>
>Bias is perfectly OK, so long as you are biased against the right
>group of scapegoats. Mark, you're getting dangerously out of step
>with consensus reality, here, and I *insist* that you stop thinking
>for yourself and accept mindless politically correct pap, like the
>rest of us ... or else the Thought Police will seek you out.

	Oh, grow up!  
	There are two separate reasons why this sort of ranting is crap.  
First off, a women-only competition is NOT about excluding men, it is about 
encouraging women.  It is not, as you put it, a tit for tat tactic to get 
back at men.  as for "In this era of eliminating the differences between 
the sexes this seems to be several steps backwards" I ask you, how is 
encouraging women (just over 50% of the population) to partake in a 
community which is dominated (over 90%) by men not a step forward in 
closing the gap between men and women?  We can't just start saying "Okay, 
everyone is on equal footing now" when most activities are still male 
dominated.  We have to actually reach an equal footing before we can start 
behaving that way.  
	Secondly, if you MUST feel that you are being intentionally left 
out, do you have any objection to club-only competitions?  School-only 
competitions?  Ale-only competitions?  All of these exclude people on 
biased grounds.  I haven't heard anyone shouting because the Brewnosers 
club competition is "Regionalist", or that a Bock Is Best competition is 
"Yeastist" or "Stylist".

	Flames to: ignoramus at 19thcentury.attitude

____________   
Ed Hitchcock	ech at ac.dal.ca	| Oxymoron:  Draft beer in bottles. |
Anatomy & Neurobiology		| Pleonasm:  Draft beer on tap.     |
Dalhousie University, Halifax	|___________________________________|


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Date: Wed, 9 Feb 94 11:04:21 MST
From: Jeff Benjamin <benji at hpfcbug.fc.hp.com>
Subject: Ginger ale recipe

There's been a lot of interest in brewing soda pop lately, and I got
reqests to post my ginger ale recipe to the digest.

This is my basic recipe, made succesfully many times with only a few
gushers and no exploding bottles.  You could certainly use the same
fermetation method with extracts, or modify the flavoring ingredients
(e.g., use citrus fruit like lime and tangerine instead of/in addition
to ginger).

You could also skip the fermentation and force-carbonate if you have a
kegging setup, although you might want to adjust the amount of sugar to
get the right level of sweetness.

Using yeast to ferment/carbonate will result in a small amount of
alcohol (around 1%, by my guess).  It's usually not enough for an adult
to notice, and probably not enough that you should worry about the kids.
Do be aware, though, that it will not be completely alcohol-free.
 ......

Ginger Ale

1 gallon water
1 pound white sugar (either granulated or corn will do)
1/2 oz cream of tartar
1 oz grated ginger
1 lemon
your favorite ale yeast

Boil water, stir in sugar, cream of tartar, ginger, and zest of lemon
(yellow part of peel).  Cool to pitching temperature (<75F), add juice
of lemon.  Transfer the whole mess to a sanitized fermentation vessel,
pitch yeast, and cap with an airlock.

Bottle after 48 hours, using strong bottles (champagne or 2l soda pop
bottles work well).  Let condition at room temperature for 2-3 days,
then refrigerate.
 ......

Helpful Hints:
 -  You can use more ginger (up to 3-4 oz per gallon) to get spicier ginger
   ale.  The spicier batches take longer to age, but are tastier IMHO (but 
   then, I also have a huge hot sauce collection).
 -  The jury is still out on whether it is necessary to peel the ginger.
   I peel it simply because it's easier to grate that way.
 -  Don't second guess the fermentation time, and don't be worried if
   the air lock is still perking after 48 hrs.  If you let it go past
   48 hrs, you will probably end up with somewhat flat, not-very-sweet
   soda.
 -  Please don't use regular beer bottles.  Champagne bottles are much
   stronger.  2l PET bottles work very well because you can squeeze them
   to see how carbonated they are, and relieve pressure if you're worried.
 -  Make sure you store the ginger ale in the fridge.  This will help
   minimize any unwanted further fermentation.

- --
Jeff Benjamin                               benji at hpfcla.fc.hp.com
Hewlett Packard Co.                         Fort Collins, Colorado	
"Midnight shakes the memory as a madman shakes a dead geranium."
					    - T.S. Eliot

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Date:          Wed, 9 Feb 1994 13:00:06 EST5EDT
From: REGINAH at SOCIOLOGY.Lan.McGill.CA
Subject:       Women and Beer

Just to add another 2 cents to the subject:
I'm sure most of you are basically nice people, but fact is women are 
easily intimidated from entering into predominantly male forums such 
as the wonderful world of brewing.  If having one all-woman brewing 
event can give a bunch of women the confidence to join the larger 
brewing community, then that is a good thing.  The gender barrier is 
only reinforced by all the remarks about wives and girlfriends 
potentially forbidding brewing because their kitchens will be messy.  
I am a wife; I brew.  And I make my husband clean up his own messes.
This is not a flame, it's just one woman acting as informant.

New subject: in #1346, Mark A. Fryling asks about the Goose Island 
Brewery in Chicago.  Yes, it's good. Very good.  It's one of the 
things I miss the most about Chicago.  It tends a bit towards the 
yuppie side on weekend nights, but it's a great place to spend a 
Saturday afternoon.  It's in a mall complex at 1800 North Clybourn.  
Check out the local artist-designed mini golf course while you're 
there.  Happy drinking there, I'm envious!

**********************************************************************
*                                                                    *
*   Regina Harrison                        `A thing can be true and  *
*   Dept. of Anthropology                   still be desparate       *
*   McGill University                       folly, Hazel.'           *
*   Montreal, Quebec, Canada                            --Fiver      *
*   reginah at sociology.lan.mcgill.ca                                  *
*                                                                    *
**********************************************************************
    

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Date: Wed, 09 Feb 1994 13:07:14 -0500 (EST)
From: /R=HERLVX/R=AM/U=KLIGERMAN/FFN=KLIGERMAN/ at mr.rtpnc.epa.gov
Subject: Queens of Beer

I am forwarding this in response to the comments concerning
the "Queen of Beer" competition made by some unenlightened individuals. 
I showed the comments to my wife, who is not only an excellent
homebrewer, but had the good sense to marry an exceptional homebrewer and
all around great guy %^).  She gave me this post 
to pass on:
(From Lucy Adams): Oh dear!  And I thought homebrewing was supposed to 
be fun. I have been brewing beer for over 10 years now.  I have served 
as treasurer, V.P. and Pres. of my local homebrewing club.  As a group,
beer club members are enlightened and nonsexist in comparison to the
rest of the world.  I even married a fellow beer brewer (since he is 
typing this I need to mention that he is a really good brewer!).
I assume that most women that brew share similar experiences and observations.
Women are a minority in the brewing world; however, and it is always a 
kick to meet other women that share my hobby.  This all women competition
is a way to have fun and give women a chance to get to know one another.
I doubt that beer brewing is a political statement.  Most competitions are
as much social events as technical and learning events.  The political 
discrimination that concerns you implies exclusion from something that
you want to be included in.  Do you want to be "Queen of Beer"?  Do 
you absolutely enter every contest that is announced?  If not being able to
enter the contest limited your career, restricted your civil rights, and
implied that you are less of a person, then yes it would be sexist 
discrimination.  In reality, it is a friendly competition and social activity
for a special interest group of brewers.  

Rich, lighten up (or in homebrewing terms, use more corn sugar or less
flame unde the wort!).  If this really bugs you, enter your beers under 
a female name (Regina might be nice!).  If you win, then you can be 
"Queen of Beers"!
 
Transmitted by Andy Kligerman, the opinions above my not represent
the opinions of myself, but they do!



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Date: Wed, 09 Feb 1994 10:34:48 -0500
From: WKODAMA at aba.com
Subject:  Beer, the Magazine

>From #1346:

> Date: Tue, 8 Feb 1994 07:55:42 -0500
> From: paul.beard at gatekeeper.mis.tridom.com (Paul Beard)
> Subject: Beer, The Magazine

> The last page, "The Beer Baron," told the tale. Someone wrote
(snip)
> I guess you can tell I won't be subscribing. I can't see the
> appeal of a magazine about drinking beer without at least
> touching on homebrewing, because once you examine the flavor

My take on "The Beer Baron" is that it's purely tongue-in-cheek. 
I kind of enjoyed the irreverence, actually.  Also, I don't have
the mag in front of me, but I'm pretty sure I remember reading
one on-the-level article in there on homebrewing.

"I have no interest in or affiliation with "Beer the Magazine"
blah blah blah..."

My $.02
Wesman



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End of HOMEBREW Digest #1347, 02/11/94