FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
		Rob Gardner, Digest Janitor


Contents:
  Re: HBD 1559, Assorted Stuff & comments (Matthew J. Harper)
  centennial hops history? (Frank J. Leers)
  hot yeast/stove crud (RONALD DWELLE)
  Re: Yeast Starters- revisited (Spencer.W.Thomas)
  Re: Are AHA guidelines a joke? (Spencer.W.Thomas)
  Mittelfrueh available *now* (CGEDEN)
  Large Scale Wort Chillin-Follow Up ("Jeff Dudley, S29711 at 22681.utrcgw.utc.com")
  re: Insulated cooler use (David Elm)
  Re:  Yeast Starter and Agar Recipes (Dan Strahs)
  large fermenters (Btalk)
  Honey and Cinamon (Ken Schroeder)
  Engineering / Judging (Jeff Frane)
  GABF 1994 Winners (James Spence/AHA/BJCP)
  Re: Growing hops (Jeff Benjamin)
  PT Lumber - You gotta go sometime (Randy Erickson)
  Bread from Beer (Aaron Walls)
  Coleman 10 gallon ("Jim Robinson")
  Open primary ferment in brew pot? ("Hapke, Jeff")
  Re: Yeast Starter & Kitchen hints (Jim Grady)
  Culturing Stoudt's Belgian (Timothy Staiano)
  SA Hops - SALE!SALE!SALE! - Ha! ("William F. Cook")
  Root Beer (Gary S. Kuyat)
  Source for HIGH TEMPERATURE PUMPS (Philip DiFalco)
  Corn and Rice Techniques in Brewing (Lowell Hart)
  videos re homebrew (David Carson)
  Berliner Weiss (Daniel Forester)
  Fermentap (Ray Sullivan)



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----------------------------------------------------------------------


Date: Mon, 24 Oct 94 09:37:08 EDT
From: matth at bedford.progress.COM (Matthew J. Harper)
Subject: Re: HBD 1559, Assorted Stuff & comments

Greetings to all!

Have *you* brewed your holiday ale yet?  :-)

One question/issue and two statements:


I've got a batch that appears to be over-carbonated in the bottle.  Random
check shows it's prevelant across all bottles.  Doesn't appear to be an
infection
and batches I made before and after it are fine which kinda' points to it
*not* being an infection problem.  I made two batches the day this one was
made and the other has been greedily devoured by family & friends this weekend.

I've watched postings come & go from people regarding bleeding off the pressure
from the bottles by chiling cold & popping the cap (lucky for me it's all
Grolsch & Fisher bottles).

How effective is it?  For a severe case (which I think I have on my hands) how
many chill/pop cycles did it take you to get it corrected?

Thanks for any and ALL info!

Statements:

1) Regarding the foil on the stove to prevent brown burns:  It does not matter
   which side goes up.  They're both reflective to the same degree.  (Don't
   believe me if you don't want to but this was tested by some lab that had
   nothing better to do in the 80's.)

2) Re. PT lunber & Arsenic & Cromium leaching into the soil.    Not to cast
   doubt on the magazine or start anything, but this has been soooo overstated
   it's not funny.  *Extensive* lab tests with *human* lab members touching the
   wood itself & licking their fingers for hours showed only the tracest
   amounts, sometimes not at all, of the chemicals in their urine.

   Yes, over years and years some may leach into the soil, but it only does it
   for a few inches next to the wood and it too is in the tracest of amounts.

   PT lumber is fine to use around gardens & flower beds (and childrend play
   yards).  The alternatives are rather costly too.


 -Matth

- -- 
Matthew J. Harper      |           Quality Architect           | {disclaimer.i}
Progress Software Corp.|               DoD #1149               |   EGfc #0xed
    God created heaven and earth to grow barley and hops. Now he homebrews.

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Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 06:38:46 -0700
From: fjl at dpci.sannet.gov (Frank J. Leers)
Subject: centennial hops history?


Have any of the hop gurus out there heard this bit of news?  I was told
recently that the centennial variety, the 'supercharged' cascade would
no longer be produced.  I have grown quite fond of centennial for aroma - 
especially dry hopping in my american pales....Say it aint so!

 -Frank


- --
  Frank J. Leers                        San Diego Data Processing Corp.      
  fjl at dpci.sannet.gov                   Engineering Applications Group      

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Date: Mon, 24 Oct 94 09:38:12 EST
From: dweller at GVSU.EDU (RONALD DWELLE)
Subject: hot yeast/stove crud

     Yeast Question: Last spring I was brewing a "steam beer" using Yeast 
     Lab California Lager Yeast (L-35). Had some hot-flashes weather-wise, 
     and an overheat in the house (closed tight window in the brew space 
     for a long hot absent weekend) and the wort temperature got real high 
     during the ferment, in the mid 70s. The beer turned out drinkable, but 
     not great, a bit off from the high-temp ferment, I think. I saved the 
     yeast (standard yeast-faq washing procedure).
     
     Question: is the yeast somehow changed by the high temp, or is it just 
     the beer? In other words, can I use my saved California Lager Yeast in 
     a new batch at the right temperature and expect good results. Or is 
     the yeast perverted for all time? I guess I wonder this generally 
     about ale yeasts, too, since I often ferment them too cold during the 
     winter.
     
     On the brown stove crud and p-o-ed wife, I got lots of private 
     answers. General agreement:
     1) My stove was dirty in the first place which caused the problem (you 
     can imagine how pleased my wife was when I told her that!). Solution: 
     clean the stove first, veeerrry thoroughly.
     2) Brown crud was from burning gas being deflected abnormally by big 
     stainless pot, either getting incomplete combustion (soot) or just 
     plain scorching. Solution: Lay tinfoil all over the place.
     3) Get a cajun cooker.... Nice idea, but....
     I'll definitely try the first two. Thanks to all.
     Cheers
     Ron Dwelle (dweller at gvsu.edu)

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Date: Mon, 24 Oct 94 10:14:39 EDT
From: Spencer.W.Thomas at med.umich.edu
Subject: Re: Yeast Starters- revisited

I make starters in bulk.  1 lb per gallon gives about 1.040.  Easy to
remember, easy to make, especially if I buy 1 lb bags :-)  I cook it
up in a big pot (so I can stir the lumps out), throw in a few pellets
of old, tired hops, and pour it into pint canning jars about 2/3 full.
These go into the pressure canner for 15 minutes at 15 lbs, then into
the cellar until I want to grow some yeast.

=S

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Date: Mon, 24 Oct 94 10:22:01 EDT
From: Spencer.W.Thomas at med.umich.edu
Subject: Re: Are AHA guidelines a joke?

I wrote this letter to Zymurgy and James Spence on October 4.  I hope
to see it published in Zymurgy (although I'm not holding my breath).

Dear Zymurgy and James Spence,

While looking at the Winners Circle from this year's National Homebrew
Competition, I was shocked to find that the winning beer in the
Scottish Ale category had a starting gravity more than twice the
category guideline.  It was entered as a Scottish Heavy (category 8b),
which should have a gravity in the range 1.035-1.040.  According to
the recipe, its actual OG was 1.086!  It looks as if it would have
been more appropriately entered as a Strong Scotch Ale (category 10b),
with an OG in the range 1.072-1.085.

As a BJCP Certified judge, I am shocked and disappointed that none of
the judges in either round apparently found this beer out of style.
To quote one of the judges, "Recipe formulation, alcohol, sweetness,
balance all fine."  How can the alcohol be "fine" at about 7.5%, when
it should be 3.5-4%?  How can the sweetness be "fine" with a final
gravity of 1.030?  Once you take into account SG depression from the
alcohol, this beer has as much sugar in it AFTER fermentation as it
should have had BEFORE fermentation.  I have to wonder whether any of
these judges have ever tasted a commercial Scottish Heavy (70
shilling) beer.

As a judge who sat on the Scottish Ale flight at the Chicago first
round, I know that there were some very good Scottish Heavy ales in
that round.  Although I don't know the "numbers" for those beers, I am
confident that they were much closer to the style definition than the
winner can possibly be.

As a brewer who endeavors to make these lighter styles, true to the
style, I know that it is not necessary to "pump up" the gravity to get
good flavor.  I am upset that, had I entered this category, my efforts
would have been in vain, as the judges plumped for the biggest beer in
the category.

As a contest entrant, I try to make sure that my beers are at least
close to the style I'm entering them as.  I am surprised that Mr.
Byers, who is, according to his biographical sketch, a BJCP Certified
judge and a graduate of the Siebel Institute, would enter a beer that
is so far out of the style definition, especially when there is a
style that would fit it much better.

Finally, I don't want anybody to get the impression that I am implying
that Mr. Byers' beer was not a good beer.  I am just saying that it is
not a Scottish Heavy.  I hope that the judges who placed it first will
consider some "remedial" beer tasting before their next competition,
so that they don't make the same mistake again.

Sincerely,

Spencer W. Thomas
1418 Golden Ave.
Ann Arbor, MI 48104
Spencer.Thomas at med.umich.edu


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Date:         Mon, 24 Oct 94 10:47:20 EDT
From: CGEDEN at NERVM.NERDC.UFL.EDU
Subject:      Mittelfrueh available *now*

FWIW, "The Home Brewery" stores are already selling Mittelfrueh hops,
according to a mailing that they sent out last week.  THB is a "chain"
of about seven stores around the country.  The quality of their products
and service is excellent.  Their best-known product is Yellow Dog malt
extract.  I think that they do most of their sales through mail-order,
but their retail stores are very nice too (at least the two in Florida are).
No affiliation etc.

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Date: 24 Oct 1994 11:34:08 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Jeff Dudley, S29711 at 22681.utrcgw.utc.com" <S29711%22681 at utrcgw.utc.com>
Subject: Large Scale Wort Chillin-Follow Up

Many thanks to all who responded to my large scale wort chilling question,
(Glenn, Alan, Brian, Dion, Jim, and Spencer).  I'm sure most of you read the
posts, so I don't feel the need to summarize.  Private E-mail please if you'd
like a package of responses.

I was glad to discover that re-cycling of heat and therefore energy is
considered in the chilling process.  Not only is it good for the environment,
it makes dollars sense too!

I'm going off now to play with some thermo equations and find out how much
water it will take to cool the wort.  I should be able to figure out how much
heat energy the water+chilled glycol combination will need to carry away from
the wort, and the most efficient ratio.  This is the best part of homebrewing!

For the thermo-adept: how much of the heat will be lost in overnight storage,
assuming a single wall SS tank, or another configuration (your spec).
  
TIA,
jeff
S29711 at 22681.utrcgw.utc.com


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Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 08:54:34 -0400 (EDT)
From: David Elm <delm at hookup.net>
Subject: re: Insulated cooler use

Seth L. Betaharon writes:

>     I've been brewing extract beers for about two years now and have
>decided that it is finally time to switch to all grain brewing.  I've read
>every source I could get my hands on and think that I have a pretty good
>idea of what is involved.  After considering all the information that 
>I've read, I think my best bet is to buy an insulated 10gal water jug, 
>place a false bottom in it, and then use this as a mash-tun and as a 
>lauter-tun.  I would raise the temperature of the mash as necessary by 
>adding boiling water and would use the false bottom to drain off the 
>liquid and leave the spent grains behind.  

>So, I have the following questions:  What kind of results should I expect 
>from such a setup?

	I have been using a Coleman cooler with a matrix of 1/2"
copper tubing (with cuts on the underside for wort entry) that is connected
to the drain plug and have experienced the following:
	- yields of 77% of theoretical
	- keep fluid volumes as low as possible since the main control for
	  raising temperature is by adding boiling water.  If this fails,
	  recycled heated wort will have to be used.
	- sparging takes about 1 hour.

- -- 
     David Elm             delm at hookup.net       (416)-293-1568
     47 Chartland Blvd S, Scarborough, Ontario, Canada, M1S 2R5


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Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 11:47:37 -0500 (EST)
From: Dan Strahs <STRAHS at msvax.mssm.edu>
Subject: Re:  Yeast Starter and Agar Recipes


Dion Hollenbeck (hollen at megatek.com) writes:

>Pretty much the same for agar recipes.  Only one book and the FAQ give
>a recipe.  The book says to use yeast nutrient as well as malt
>extract, the FAQ, just extract.  One source which provides agar does
>not say to use any malt extract, just agar and water.  Another "kit"
>source provides premade slants and plates and these definitely look
>like they have malt extract in them

	My understanding of the subject is thus: Malt extract should have
enough nutrients for yeast to survive on without any extra suplements.  Yeast
nutrient is only used in nutrient-poor fermentations/culturing where the
fermentable carbohydrates are out of proportion with the nitrogen/phosphorus
sources, as would(might) occur if you were making hard cider for example. On
the other hand, there is nothing too harmful in your average nutrient mix,
so if you feel compelled to include it, RDWHAHB.

	When culturing yeast that you intend to keep/use, you don't want them
mutating on you. Now, the carboydrates that we use in fermenting are just one
of a variety of energy sources yeast can grow on.  In addition, these yeasties
have multiple copies of maltose-utilizing loci in their genome.  If you start
culturing yeast under conditions where they have no selective advantage to 
maintain these MAL loci, you will create a situation where a certain percentage
of your yeast will mutate and/or lose their ability to ferment maltose through
recombination and selection.  Since I presume you're interested in culturing
yeast for beer use, I would strongly recommend that all your yeast cultures
contain malt extract, both in plates and starter cultures.  

	BTW, I learned my sterile technique working with bacteria. I picked
up the yeast info from postdocs/grad students in the labs of J. Marmur and
I. Willis, who work with yeast genes, and , in the case of the former, the 
MAL loci.  Incidentally, I got them interested in brewing.  They suggested
using plates with 10 -15% malt extract for culture work.

						Dan Strahs


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Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 11:49:41 -0400
From: Btalk at aol.com
Subject: large fermenters

Cliff asks about large volume fermenters.

I just got a catalog from Presque Isle Wine Cellars, North  East, Pa. (this
is actually near Erie).  As you would guess, they are wine oriented, but the
offer a lot of 'crossover' stuff.
they offer stainless tanks with floating lids. The lids have built in airlock
and an inflatable gasket that fits the lid tightly to the tank.  Tank has
threaded opening near bottom.  21 gal for $205 (US), 26 gal for $249. sizes
up to 132 gallons.
They also have poly tanks 200 gal($540) to 4500 gal. The hdpe meets FDA reg
177.1520, what ever that means. No measureable oxygen diffusion,nor plastic
odors, etc.
Oh yeah,they have a bunch of chemicals,including 30% phosphoric acid (16oz
 for $4.20).
Overall the selection and pricing seem pretty good.
This place was recommended to me as THE place for winemaking
equipment/supplies.
No affiliation,etc. Jeez, I haven't even bought anything from these folks
yet!
Almost forgot the phone is 814-725-1314 or fax 814-725-2092.
Regards,
Bob Talkiewicz,Binghamton, NY<btalk at aol.com>


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Date: Mon, 24 Oct 94 08:54:37 PDT
From: kens at lan.nsc.com (Ken Schroeder)
Subject: Honey and Cinamon

I'm brewing the first batch of holiday ale this weekend and have
a couple of questions about honey and cinamon. What is the "expected"
gravity yield from honey? When during the boil is the honey added? I have 
a hard time determining how much cinamon to use. All the recepts I have 
seen have wildly different amounts. I am striving for a "heavy"
cinamon character to the ale, which is basically a deep pale ale
with honey and cinamon added (ala last year's Sierra Nevada Christmas Ale). 
So, how much is yeilds an average cinamon character? When is the cinamon 
added to the boil? Since I'm still formulating a recept, any other spices 
anyone could sugest (except nutmeg)? Private email is preferred.

For those who have requested the results from my Liberty Ale clone
research, I have a recept that still needs to be typed up. Some time
this week, provided the wife hasn't scheduled all my time for me.

Hoppy Honey Brewing (steve!)

Ken Schroeder
Sequoia Brewing
kens at lan.nsc.com

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Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 09:16:07 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jeff Frane <gummitch at teleport.com>
Subject: Engineering / Judging

Gary Bell writes:

> 
> 
> Jeff Frane writes:
> 
> >I specifically recommended using the smallest possible 
> >bit and drilling teeny, tiny holes in the under-surface 
> >of the loop. 
> 
> God, I hate it when things get this technical. Would that
> English or Metric?
> 

Actually, it's Etruscan.  To really understand it, however, it must be
studied with the accompanying hand gestures and eyebrow twitches.

The modern, technical response to your ?Question? is that the
construction should be done with the smallest drill bits you can find
that will go through soft copper without breaking more than once every
twelve or twenty holes on a Sunday afternoon in time for a beer.

Ulick Stafford writes:

> 
> I have complained in the past about the AHA guidelines being a little off
> in their hopping and color numbers, but few can measure these anyway.
> However, I do agree, more or less, with the gravity recommendations.
> Come on, Judges, give brewers of everyday session beers at normal
> strengths a chance.  While I have no doubt that these two winning beers
> were the best beers judged in class, it is not right to give the award to 
> them if they are obviously not to style.  I do assume that National
> judges are as capable of telling the approximate alcohol and og of a beer 
> as they are of telling whether the bottle has illegal raised lettering.
> __________________________________________________________________________


I think this is a legitimate complaint, and Ulick is not the first
person to note that BIG beers win in competitions.  I think the problem
isn't lame judges, though, but fatigued judges.  It's an unfortunate
truth that, since beer judges need to swallow to really taste, they tend
to wear their palates down rather quickly.  Alcohol will do that, you
know.  So will hops, in their way.  By the time the judges get to beer
number six, subtleties tend to get lost, and beers need to be big and
flavorful in order to make an impression.

That said, it's true that a 1.070 beer has no business winning the
bitter category.  *But*... when I judged bitter in the final round in
Portland two years ago, there were definitely beers that made it there
that didn't belong, beers which were clearly hopped with Cascades for
example, or just wildly out of style.  One was an excellent beer, and
would have cleaned house as an American pale ale.  But British?  Uh uh.
If we'd come up with a beer that was delicious, tasted British, and had
more alcohol than an ESB ought to it would have been very difficult to
withhold honors to it.

Judging is harder than it looks.

>  'Heineken!?! ... F#$% that s at &* ...  | Ulick Stafford, Dept of Chem. Eng.  
>     Pabst Blue Ribbon!'               | Notre Dame IN 46556

By the way, I had a Heineken wheat bock last night, out of curiosity.
Not too very bad.

- --Jeff



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Date: 24 Oct 94 12:51:20 EDT
From: James Spence/AHA/BJCP <70740.1107 at compuserve.com>
Subject: GABF 1994 Winners

Winners of the
1994 Great American Beer Festival
Denver, Colo.
Oct. 21 & 22, 1994.

English Brown Ale
 Gold Saras Brown Ale, Yegua Creek Brewing Co. - Dallas, TX
 Silver Ironwood Dark, Redwood Coast Brewing - Mtn. View, CA
 Bronze Holy Cow! Red Ale, Holy Cow! Casino, Cafe & Brewery - Las Vegas, NV

American Brown Ale
 Silver Oregon Trail Brown Ale, Oregon Trail Brewery - Corvallis, OR
 Bronze Tut Brown Ale, Oasis Brewery - Boulder, CO

Classic English Pale Ale
 Gold El Toro Oro Golden Ale, El Toro Brewing Company - Morgan Hill, CA
 Silver Pullman Pale Ale, Riverside Brewing Company - Riverside, CA

India Pale Ale
 Gold Vail Pale Ale, Hubcap Brewery And Kitchen - Vail, CO
 Silver Sierra Nevada Celebration Ale, Sierra Nevada Bewing Co. - Chico, CA

American Pale Ale
 Gold Mirror Pond Pale Ale, Deschutes Brewery, Inc. - Bend, OR
 Silver Pier Pale Ale, Huntington Beach Beer Co. - Huntington Beach, CA
 Bronze Post Road Pale Ale, Old Marlborough Co. - Framingham, MA

American Amber Ale
 Gold Alaskan Autumn Ale, Alaskan Brewing Co. - Juneau, AK
 Silver Capstone ESB, Oasis Brewery - Boulder, CO
 Bronze DeLaveaga Red Ale, Seabright Brewery Pub & Restaurant - Santa Cruz, CA

Traditional Bitter
 Gold Sawtooth Ale, Left Hand Brewing Co. - Longmont, CO
 Silver Four Horsemen Ale, Mishawaka Brewing Company - Mishawaka, IN
 Bronze E.S.B., Stoddard's Brewhouse & Eatery - Sunnyvale, CA

Scottish Ales
 Gold Victoria Ave Amber Ale, Riverside Brewing Company - Riverside, CA
 Silver Steamboat Scottish, Heavenly Daze Brewery - Steamboat Springs, CO
 Bronze Laughing Lab Scottish Ale, Bristol Brewing Company - Co. Springs, CO

Blonde Ale
 Bronze Big Nose Blond, McNeill's Brewery - Brattleboro, VT

Porter
 Gold Mountain Valley Porter, Mountain Valley Brewpub - Suffern, NY
 Silver Noah's Dark, Pacific Tap and Grill - San Rafael, CA
 Bronze Black Jack Porter, Left Hand Brewing Co. - Longmont, CO

Dry Stouts
 Gold Out of Bounds Stout, Avery Brewing Co. - Boulder, CO
 Silver Zonker Stout, Snake River Brewing Co., Jackson Wy - Jackson, WY
 Bronze 7th Street Stout, Riverside Brewing Company - Riverside, CA

Specialty Stouts 
 Gold Oatmeal Stout, Gray Brewing Co. - Janesville, WI
 Silver Boulder Stout, Rockies Brewing Co. - Boulder, CO
 Bronze Zoser Stout, Oasis Brewery - Boulder, CO

Strong Ale
 Gold Belk's Extra Special Bitter, Anderson Valley Brewing Co. - Boonville, CA
 Silver Untouchable Scotch Ale, Martha's Exchange Rest. & Brew. Co. - Nashua,
NH
 Bronze Mogul Madness, Rogue Ales - Newport, OR

Barley Wine
 Gold Hercules Strong Ale, Boston Beer Works - Boston, MA
 Silver White Lightnin', Bardo Rodeo - Arlington, VA
 Bronze Old Boneyards Barley Wine, Pizza Port / Solona Beach Brewery - Solona
Beach, CA

Belgian-Style Ale
 Gold Belgian Strong Ale, Pacific Beach Brewhouse - San Diego, CA
 Silver Celis White, Celis Brewery, Inc. - Austin, TX
 Bronze Triple, Pacific Coast Brewing Co. - Oakland, CA

Fruit, Vegetable Beers
 Gold Pyramid Apricot Ale, Hart Brewing, Inc. - Kalama, WA
 Silver Passion Pale, Alameda Tied House - Alameda, CA
 Bronze Brewberry Pale, Pacific Tap and Grill - San Rafael, CA

Herb, Spice Beers
 Gold Cerveza Chilibeso, Great Basin Brewing Co. - Sparks, NV
 Silver Blue Mountain Heaven, Hubcap Brewery and Kitchen/Dallas - Dallas, TX
 Bronze Yule-Tied, Redwood Coast Brewing - Mtn. View, CA
 Honorable Mention, Juju Ginger Ale, Left Hand Brewing Co. - Longmont, CO

Specialty
 Gold Honey Ale, Gray Brewing Co. - Janesville, WI
 Silver Harvest Moon Pumpkin Ale, Sharky's Brewery - Omaha, NE
 Bronze Rye Bock, Steelhead Brewery & Cafe - Eugene, OR

Smoke-Flavored Beers
 Gold Alaskan Smoked Porter, Alaskan Brewing Co. - Juneau, AK
 Silver Zebulon's Peated Porter, Phantom Canyon Brewing Co. - Co. Springs, CO
 Bronze Dixie Holy Smoke, Dixie Brewing Company - New Orleans, LA

Bock
 Gold Samuel Adams Double Bock, The Boston Beer Company - Boston, MA
 Silver DeGroen's Doppelbock, Baltimore Brewing Company - Baltimore, MD
 Bronze Mai-Bock, Stoudt Brewing Company - Adamstown, PA

Amber Lager 
 Gold Sea Dog Oktoberfest, Sea Dog Brewing Co. - Camden, MA
 Silver Rhino Chasers Dark Lager, Rhino Chasers - Culver City, CA
 Bronze Texfest, Hubcap Brewery and Kitchen/Dallas - Dallas, TX

Dark Lager
 Gold Hefe Dunkel, Saxer Brewing Co. - Lake Oswego, OR
 Silver Michelob Classic Dark, Anheuser-Busch, Inc - St. Louis, MO
 Bronze Denargo Lager, Tabernash Brewing Company - Denver, CO

Munchener Helles and Export
 Gold Hubsch Lager, Sudwerk Privatbrauerei Hubsch - Davis, CA
 Silver Export Gold, Stoudt Brewing Company - Adamstown, PA
 Bronze Golden Spike Lager, Tabernash Brewing Company - Denver, CO

European Pilsner
 Gold Pilsener, Stoudt Brewing Company - Adamstown, PA
 Silver Friesian Pilsener, The Leavenworth Brewery - Leavenworth, WA
 Bronze Condor Lager, Irons Brewing Company - Lakewood, CO
 Honorable Mention, Hubsch Pilsner Sudwerk Privatbrauerei Hubsch - Davis, CA

American Lager
 Gold Grain Belt Premium, Minnesota Brewing Company - St. Paul, MN
 Silver Original Coors, Coors Brewing Co. - Golden, CO
 Bronze Lone Star, Lone Star Brewing Company, Inc. - San Antonio, TX

American Light Lager
 Gold Pabst Genuine Draft Light, Pabst Brewing Co.-Tumwater - Tumwater, WA
 Silver I.C. Light, Pittsburgh Brewing Company - Pittsburgh, PA
 Bronze Ice-Draft Light, Anheuser-Busch, Inc - St. Louis, MO

American Premium Lager
 Gold 1857, The Lion Inc. - Wilkes-Barre, PA
 Silver Signature, The Stroh Brewery Company - Detroit, MI
 Bronze Budweiser, Anheuser-Busch, Inc - St. Louis, MO

American Dry Lager
 Gold Lite Ice, Miller Brewing Company - Milwaukee, WI
 Silver Olympia Dry, Pabst Brewing Co.-Tumwater - Tumwater, WA
 Bronze Icehouse, Miller Brewing Company - Milwaukee, WI

American Malt Liquor
 Gold Olde English 800, Pabst Brewing Co.-Tumwater - Tumwater, WA
 Silver Pigs Eye ICE, Minnesota Brewing Company - St. Paul, MN
 Bronze Colt Ice, Carling National Brewing Co., Inc. - Baltimore, MD

Dusseldorf-style Altbier
 Gold Alt, Butterfield Brewing Co. - Fresno, CA
 Silver Centennial Alt, Boston Beer Works - Boston, MA
 Bronze Wild Horse Ale, Great Basin Brewing Co. - Sparks, NV

American Lager/Ale Cream Ale 
 Gold Liebotschaner Cream Ale, The Lion Inc. - Wilkes-Barre, PA
 Silver Genesee Cream Ale, Genesee Brewing Co.,Inc. - Rochester, NY
 Bronze Scrimshaw Beer, North Coast Brewing Co. - Fort Bragg, CA

German Wheat Ale
 Gold Tabernash Weiss, Tabernash Brewing Company - Denver, CO
 Silver DeGroen's Weizen Bock, Baltimore Brewing Company - Baltimore, MD
 Bronze Heavenly Hefe Weizen, Heavenly Daze Brewery - Steamboat Springs, CO

American Wheat Ale or Lager
 Gold Calistoga Wheat Ale, Napa Valley Brewing Co. - Calistoga, CA
 Silver Whitewater Wheat Ale, Great Divide Brewing Co. - Denver, CO
 Bronze Weizenbier, Coors Brewing Co. - Golden, CO

Non-Alcoholic Malt Beverages
 Gold Stroh's NA, The Stroh Brewery Company - Detroit, MI
 Silver O'Doul's, Anheuser-Busch, Inc - St. Louis, MO
 Bronze Keene's NA, Pittsburgh Brewing Company - Pittsburgh, PA



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Date: Mon, 24 Oct 94 10:54:40 MDT
From: Jeff Benjamin <benji at hpfcbug.fc.hp.com>
Subject: Re: Growing hops

In response to Pierre Jelenc's question about growing hop "bushes"
instead of training them up poles and wires:

It could certainly be done.  In fact, in my garden, the hops are planted
right next to a length of chicken-wire fence.  They grow on the fence in
the bush-like fashion you mentioned before reaching the wires I have
extended.  I can think of a couple of downsides to growning them this
way, though.  The first, I think, is the primary consideration; the
second is merely convenience.

1.  Hops are fast-growing plants, and once established quickly overwhelm
    a small section of fence(unless the Japanese Beetles get to them
    first, I suppose).  The 5-feet wide by 3-feet high section of fence
    near my hops is completely covered in the first month of the growing
    season.  You would spend all summer cutting back the hops unless you
    have a really long fence.  This might adversely affect the plants
    and your harvest.

2.  It's more difficult to harvest the hops from a bush.  It's
    incredibly easy to harvest the hops from lines once they're brought
    down to near ground level.  Harvesting from the bushy portion of my
    plants involves digging through all the spiny, scratchy foliage to
    extract the hops from the inner portion of the bush.

Anyway, you might give it a try, and let folks know how it turns out.
I'm sure a lot of folks might grow hops if they didn't have to play
civil engineer to do it.

- --
Jeff Benjamin                               benji at fc.hp.com
Hewlett Packard Co.                         Fort Collins, Colorado	
"Midnight shakes the memory as a madman shakes a dead geranium."
					    - T.S. Eliot

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Date: 24 Oct 94 12:39:59 EDT
From: Randy Erickson <74763.2312 at compuserve.com>
Subject: PT Lumber - You gotta go sometime

In HBD 1559, JUKNALIS at arserrc.gov writes:

>Subject: PT lumber- DANGER

>     I recall an issue of Organic Gardening a few months ago that mentioned
>that pressure treated lumber is treated with ARSENIC and CHROMIUM.  It 
>is thus unsuitable for use in gardening applications because it leaches
>these into the surrounding soil.  Probably not the best stuff to grow hops on.

I used to subscribe to OG and one of the main reasons I quit was the
sanctimonious attitude of editor Mike McGrath took on this and other scientific
issues. 

Here's the short version (the guy devoted page after page over several issues to
this topic).
As I recall OG liked and supported one study that reported a certain amount of
chemicals leached out of treated wood and into certain types of plants (i.e.
potatoes) and took rabid offense to another study that found no evidence of
this.  Don't talk about scientific methods 'cause we don't like the results!
Never mind that different plants take different things out of the soil and there
are different ways of treating wood (i.e. YMMV).  Industry is bad and wants to
kill you; support the researchers toiling under tyranny; blah, blah, blah.

Now I'm not a botanist, or a spokesman for the forest products industry.  I'm
not an eco-freak or a earth-hating republican.  I just know that in the real
world where most things don't have pat answers, we need to weigh all the
information we can -- time permitting -- and make  rationed decisions based on
the facts and our own value systems.  This applies to pissed-off wives, wort
chilling, zap-paps, dry- hopping, shipping beer, and brewing with extract, IMHO.

When someone has to paint a white hat on one guy and swastikas on another to
sway (or dictate) my opinion, I have to ask myself why.

Flame shields up!

Randy Erickson				74763.2312 at Compuserve.com


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Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 10:59:41 -0700 (PDT)
From: Aaron Walls <awalls at u.washington.edu>
Subject: Bread from Beer

	Does anyone have a recipe for bread made from the grain left over 
after lautering?  A local bakery does it in conjunction with some local 
breweries and its real good.

aaron

Nothing is true, so hand me another brew.

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Date: Mon, 24 Oct 94 11:17:46 PST
From: "Jim Robinson" <Jim_Robinson at ccmailsmtp.ast.com>
Subject: Coleman 10 gallon


Seth Betaharon writes in HBD #1560 
>The Sports Authority sells a 10 gal insulated Coleman water jug 
>which has a tap that seems to just come out with the turn of a 
>nut (I didn't want to play with the display model too much and 
>break it.)  The price is only $30 - does anyone have experience 
>using one of these?

I guess Seth is going to make an honest man out of me.  About 9 
months ago I started using the Coleman 10 gallon "Industrial 
Model" cooler.  I said I would report back to the HBD with the 
results...  I'm a little late, so sue me!

Well, to answer the question put to HBD about a year ago about 
the Coleman warranty and its ability to handle heat.  NO PROBLEM. 
The Coleman has now handled 4 full mashes and the walls of the 
cooler are PERFECT.  Temp drop is less than 2 degrees in 90 
minutes.  The real problem with Cooler mashing, is resisting the 
urge to check the temperature every few minutes.

As to Seth's suggest to fit the cooler with a false bottom, it's 
a lot easier to make a "holey" copper manifold.  The Coleman has 
a funky shape, shaped like a rounded off cube of butter.  The 
manifold is shaped like an "H" with the inlet going into the side 
of the "H". Just put a riser tube in the middle.  The inlet 
should have a brass slip fitting that fits exactly over the 
spigot inlet. I've never had a stuck sparge, and I don't worry 
about floating the grain bed.  I can supply exact plans if 
needed. 

This leads nicely into the next comment about the fitting you 
were so careful not to break.  Don't worry about the little 
bugger, and certainly don't throw it away.  It's very tough and 
holds up to heat real well.  Ram the proper size tubing in the 
outlet hole (sorry, I'm at work and don't know the tube OD) and 
pinch it off until you need to drain off.  Had some HSA before I 
used the tube (Bonehead move #1).  I just opened the spigot and 
"let 'er rip!" (Picture Niagara Falls  at  170 degrees) 

About the $30.00 price, you MIGHT want to look around some more.  
Depends on what your times worth.  I got mine at Smart N' Final 
in El Toro CA.  Cost $22.00.  Make sure you clean it REALLY good 
before you use it.  I used boiling water to clean, (was also 
checking if it would work for heat, while it was still under 
warranty Heh Heh Heh) and the first batch tasted like 
PlasticoFantasticoBrew (TM Jack) for a fantastic Bonehead move 
#2.

Finally, I have a cooler idea I want to try, but I'm a little 
nervous about hacking up my Coleman.  I was thinking that a stem 
type thermometer, with a round dial, would work nicely if a hole 
was drilled into the side of the cooler.  I guess it could be 
sealed in with food grade silicon.  Temp issues??  If the tip is 
inserted into the grain bed it would certainly eliminate the need 
to open the lid to check the floating thermometer.  Now if that 
worked, how about a way to put in  the hot water without removing 
the lid?  Maybe run a tube into the lid?  Certainly would make 
the cooler more versatile for a number of mashing styles. 
Maybe I'll make a whole bunch of them, with paddles to stir the 
mash, and water heater elements, and a grain mill on the lid 
and... Naaaaahhhhh. 

At any rate Seth, the Coleman works just fine.  Don't really 
understand why everyone likes the Gott so much.  Seems to cost 
quite a bit more.  I guess Brewers like there vessels to be 
round! 

Jim

When I die, I'd like to go peacefully, in my sleep, like my 
grandfather did; Not screaming, like the passengers in his car 
were.      

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Date: Mon, 24 Oct 94 14:13:34 CDT
From: "Hapke, Jeff" <jhapke at usr.com>
Subject: Open primary ferment in brew pot?


     In my last batch of brew I tried something a little different, instead 
     of racking to a primary, I pitched into the brewpot.  I did this to 
     eliminate as much sterilizing, and handling as possible. I used an 
     immersion chiller (60' of copper chills FAST!), pitched, covered, and 
     placed in a cool dry place. Fermentation was going strong by morning, 
     and I racked to a carboy secondary 5 days later. My Question is, why 
     don't I hear of others doing this, do I need the aeration produced 
     when splashing into the primary, should I use an airstone or 
     something?  Thanks for your comments!

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Date: Mon, 24 Oct 94 15:51:01 EDT
From: Jim Grady <grady at hpangrt.an.hp.com>
Subject: Re: Yeast Starter & Kitchen hints

Coyote says "I'm actually usually pretty lazy about measuring, and just
put 4 to 8 tbsp into a liter flask."

To be even lazier, 4 Tbs = 1/4 cup so you can use the 1/4 cup or 1/2 cup
measuring cup in your kitchen.  I often make a funnel out of wax paper
to get it into the flask (whether I use the Tbs or the 1/2 cup measure).

This isn't strictly brewing related but I hope it is a helpful hint for
some.
- --
Jim Grady 
grady at hp-mpg.an.hp.com

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Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 15:49:48 -0400 (EDT)
From: Timothy Staiano <tstaiano at ultrix.ramapo.edu>
Subject: Culturing Stoudt's Belgian 

Greetings and salutations!

This past Friday, I purchased a bottle of Stoudt's 1000th beer, their 
Belgian Ale.  It's a good 'un IMOH (but I've yet to have a Chimay, flames 
to relax at not.rich).  I know that people have had problems culturing their 
stout yeast (as per sierra's yeast FAQ), but let me tell you something: 
pitched last 1/2 inch into 1qt 1.040 og hopped sterile wort in 1.5l wine 
jug about 10pm.  Some activity within 24 hours, nice krausen this 
morning.  I'm gonna bottle it up today and save it for when I can get my 
fiancee to put up with my first attempt at a partial mash (gotta use some 
belgian malts, right?).

On a side note, got an early result from the GABF for anyone in the 
northern NJ, southern Orange/Rockland Counties NY.  The Mountain Valley 
Brew Pub won a GOLD METAL for their porter.  Finally, a local east coast 
brew pub getting some recognition (watch out left-coasters).  Not an 
employee, just someone happy to see a young (2 years old) local place 
doin' fine.

Have a hoppy!
Tim
tstaiano at ultrix.ramapo.edu

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Date: 24 Oct 94 16:49:57 EDT
From: "William F. Cook" <71533.2750 at compuserve.com>
Subject: SA Hops - SALE!SALE!SALE! - Ha!

Al writes:

>Could this hop sale just be a ploy to get on good terms with homebrewers,
>a big market for his beer, one that contains quite a few (me included) that
>continue to spread the truth about his previous actions?  Is he done
>suing people?

My understanding was that BBC bought a very *LARGE* amount of Mittelfrueh
hops - like maybe the entire 93 crop - and received a very good price on them
because of this volume. If this is the case, than the hop sale is likely
motivated by a desire to get rid of excess 93 hops before the 94 models hit
the showroom. It _is_ that time of year, after all. The Jim Koch/Car salesman
analogy fits, anyway. It could also explain why some people had to wait more
than 2 months before getting their hops in the mail (I moved out of state
2 months after sending in the check and don't think I'll ever see the hops -
It's a lot of work to chase them down for $12)

Bill Cook


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Date: Mon, 24 Oct 94 17:00:56 EDT
From: Gary S. Kuyat <gsk at sagan.bellcore.com>
Subject: Root Beer
Full-Name: Gary S. Kuyat

Some time ago, the following receipe was posted for Root Beer.

INGREDIENTS:
 5 qt water          			1/4 oz hops
 1/2 oz burdock root, dried 		1/2 oz yellow dock root, dried
 1/2 oz sarsaparilla root, dried	1/2 oz sassafras root, dried
 1/2 oz spikenard root, dried*		1 1/2 cup sugar
 1/8 tsp yeast, granulated

PROCEDURE:
 Simmer herbs in water for 30 minutes. Add sugar, stir to dissolve, and
 strain into a crock. Cool to lukewarm, add yeast, and stir well. Cover
 crock and leave to ferment for about an hour. Bottle and store in a cool
 place. Makes about one gallon.

 --- Don Rudolph, 76076.612 at CompuServe.COM ---

Don asked that results be posted.  First, a general observation: any receipe 
that calls for "hops" doesn't usually mean fresh, high alpha acid hops.  They
mean hops, not HOPS!  This receipe turned out a little too bitter for my taste.
Not Hoppy, just bitter, 30 minute boil doesn't leave that much hoppy character.
I ran this through a half micron filter, to cut some of the bitter, and that
helped.  I'd still half the hops, or leave them out altogether.  Make it half.
The hops do add a little "bite" that helps the root beer.  Root beer smell and
light brown color are good.

A word of warning, some of these roots may not be FDA approved for making
beverages.  Check them out, or take your chances...  Also think Colonial Root
Beer, not HIRES.  I prefer the taste of artificial root beer, but this stuff
can double as a pain releiver!
- --
 -Gary Kuyat
  gsk at sagan.bellcore.com
  (908)699-8422

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Date: Mon, 24 Oct 94 18:05:34 -0400
From: Philip DiFalco <sxupjd at fnma.COM>
Subject: Source for HIGH TEMPERATURE PUMPS


I need a HIGH TEMPERATURE PUMP for my tower system.
I understand that they can be ordered out of Grainger's catalog for about $75.
I called 800-555-1212 for their #, but they didn't have it.

If anyone has the phone number for Grainger's, or if you know of a better
source for High Temp Pumps, please post it or email me.
Thanks.

- ---
email: sxupjd at fnma.com (NeXT Mail Okay)
Philip DiFalco, SIS, Systems & Operation Management Development
FannieMae, 3900 Wisconsin Ave. NW, Washington, DC 20016  (202)752-2812

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Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 16:11:55 -0700
From: Lowell Hart <lhart at CATI.CSUFresno.EDU>
Subject: Corn and Rice Techniques in Brewing


I've enjoyed the latest special issue of Zymurgy detailing all manner
of things to put in your beer. I'm afraid it doesn't address my current
interests, however, and so I am addressing my questions to the 
prodigious wisdom of HBD.

I am looking at several old American beer recipes, notably the 
pre-prohibition lagers from George Fix's Brewing Techniques article,
and the Bushwick Pilsners by Ben Jankowski in the same magazine. Each
of the recipes involve the use of flaked maize as an adjunct. Being an
extremely cheap person (unemployment will do that to you) I am resisting
buying flaked maize from the local homebrew shop. Is there something else
that I can use? I heard tell of corn flakes being useful, with plain-wrap
brands coming in cheaper, but not by much. Can I use mexican Masa-type
corn flour? (Probably not, it has lime in it.) How about corn tortillas?
 How do I handle the oil in corn products? How much do I need?


Rice is an easier matter, being cheap and oiless. I realize the Zymurgy
article has a reference to a George Fix article in the '85 Special Issue,
but I don't have access to it. I know that I can cook up a bunch of sticky
rice and add it to the mash, but I have no info on how much rice gives
how much extract. 

I guess that my real problem is I need info on the handling of corn and
rice in brewing and how much of each material adds how much extract, body,
flavor and whatnot to my beer. The Zymurgy articles (in general) say,
'Here's info on this ingredient, and here's the recipe I put it in.' For
my case I already have recipes, I need to know how to put in the new
ingredients so that I will know what I'm going to get out. I don't
want to use rice extract (How much rice equals how much rice extract?
What's in rice extract besides mashed rice?) and I'm avoiding flaked
maize (same questions here). I'm also trying to avoid doing extensive
testing on techniques that obviously have already been heavily researched.
Can anybody help me here? Thanks.

Lowell Hart
San Joaquin WortHogs
Raketenflugplatz, Fresno
lhart at cati.CSUFresno.edu




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Date: Mon, 24 Oct 94 15:57 PDT
From: cha at cts.com (David Carson)
Subject: videos re homebrew

Most people don't know the following videos about home brewing and beer are
available or even exist, but a catalog describing these and many other
instructional, educational and how-to videos is yours free for the asking.
This is a small sample of the titles available:

Making Great Beer at Home with Robert Makuch; Enjoying Beer, with Spago's
chef Wolfgang Puck, among others.

To obtain a free catalog, email a request to cha at cts.com and include:
        subject line: "catalog request"
        body: name, mailing address, email address, name of this list so the
right info may be forwarded to you. 

I hope you find this info useful
cha at cts.com


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Date:        Mon, 24 Oct 94 22:02:02 EST
From: Daniel Forester <X6OT at MUSIC.STLAWU.EDU>
Subject: Berliner Weiss


    I have heard a lot about Berliner Weiss from people and books and I
think it would be interesting to make one. Before I do I would like to
make one. Does anyone know of a commercial one available in either NY or
NJ.

Posts on the HBD or e-mail would be great.

   Dan
   X6OT at Music.Stlawu.Edu

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Date: 24 Oct 94 22:05:17 EDT
From: Ray Sullivan <72760.2325 at compuserve.com>
Subject: Fermentap

I was a the GABF in Denver over the weekend, and I got a brochure on a gadget
called the Fermentap.  It is essentially a device used to invert your glass
carboy and have the yeast sediment collect in the neck.  A series of valves and
filters are used to transfer out your beer or yeast without siphoning.

Has anyone used this setup, and is it any good?  I appreciate the feedback.

Ray Sullivan    72760.2325 at compuserve.com


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End of HOMEBREW Digest #1561, 10/25/94