---

	FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
		Digest Janitor: janitor@hbd.org
		Many thanks to the Observer & Eccentric Newspapers of 
		Livonia, Michigan for sponsoring the Homebrew Digest.
				URL: http://www.oeonline.com


Contents:
  Re: Fining in the kettle with Irish moss (Alan Edwards)
  More fridge, sanitation (AllDey)
  RE:Fresh Hops ("Marc Battreall")
  The New Brewer (Some Guy)
  Door heaters & defrosting (fridge)
  Chlorine (AJ)
  Wyeast 3068 - LONG Fermentation (Mike Beatty)
  Food Grade O-Ring for Keg Lid or "What's That Taste" ("Arthur McGregor")
  A thank you (WALT.CROWDER)
  Re:  Paul Gatza ("Mark Nelson")
  Re: BREW DAY FROM HELL (Cookie Monster)
  Pat's Observations ("Mike Allred")
  Diacetyl in Sam Smiths / Diastatic cost / Unknowns at AHA (George_De_Piro)
  percentage by extract, not weight (Michael Rose)
  maple syrup (Dan McLaughlin & Christine Griffith)
  Re: cerveza y limon ("Tidmarsh Major")
  Re: (Lou Heavner)
  Re: New AHA Nameless/Faceless Figurehead Announced! (ThE GrEaT BrEwHoLiO)
  Correction... (ThE GrEaT BrEwHoLiO)
  Safe aeration; AHA administrator; chlorine; chilling; starters (Samuel Mize)
  Re: hot weather wort chilling (David Cato)
  AB Infomercial/ Redundant/ Worms ("RANDY ERICKSON")
  REPORT: LoDo Beer, Wine, Food & Fun Fest (BrewsTraveler)
  Who is this man? ("Schroeder, Curt")
  Using Slaked lime - Where do I find it ? (James Tomlinson)
  RE: Recipe comments ("Rich, Charles")


Have you entered a MCAB qualifier yet?


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----------------------------------------------------------------------


Date: Thu, 9 Jul 1998 14:50:15 -0700 (PDT)
From: Alan Edwards <ale at cisco.com>
Subject: Re: Fining in the kettle with Irish moss

| Dave Humes writes:
| | The last time I used Irish moss in the kettle I swore I'd never use
| | it again.  Now I remember why.  I made an America Pale Ale this
| | weekend and used 4 tsp of Irish moss in an 11 gallon batch.
|
I replied:
| That is probably too much.  I use 1.5 tsp for a five gallon batch.  But
| I'm not sure what using "too much" does besides wasting some of your
| Irish moss.

DOH!!  Math error!  4tsp for 11 gallons should be fine, not too much.
1.5 * 11/5 = 3.3

 -Alan


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Date: Thu, 9 Jul 1998 22:29:25 EDT
From: AllDey at aol.com
Subject: More fridge, sanitation

I asked about my fridge running constantly

Forrest Duddles - FridgeGuy Responded
> Keep in mind when shopping for a used fridge that one more than 
>10 years old will probably cost enough more in energy cost to pay 
>monthly payments on a new fridge. 

Dave Hinrichs added
>Also don't forget to contact your local utility to see if they have rebates
>for replacing old fridges and incentives for purchasing a high efficiency
>replacement. Many also will come and take your old fridge away for
>recycling, for free

The local rumor I've heard is that you must pay to dispose of a fridge around
these parts.  But I'll try the local utility (seems they'd want me to keep it
as I'm putting somebodies' kids through college with all the kW hrs I must be
burning).  I like the idea of getting a new fridge - no frets about unknown
leaks in a new used unit and better efficiency.  I've a new one upstairs and
another 10+ yr old lagering fridge in addition to the mad humming monster
cradling my ales.

Before acting harshly and making my wife cringe by drilling holes for faucets
and gas line in a brand new fridge, someone please help me with some math to
help sell the idea.  As I sit here, the fridge is running about 2-3 minutes
off and 2-3 minutes on.  Its maintaining a temp of 47 via an external temp
controller with a 1 degree window. Ambient is 78.  The fridge thermostat is
set as cold as it goes.  Looking on the motor I see a number 150AT which may
suggest 150 amps.  Is this enough info to estimate monthly energy consumption?
For the curious, my total electric use (all household appliances, etc.) was
784 KWH in June and 690 KWH in May.

To reduce evaporation, I also fairly recently switched to veg. oil in the cup
in which the ext. temp controller probe resides. Seems like a red herring, but
Sam Mize in personal communication suggests this may have an influence.
Thoughts?
- ---------------------------------------------------------
Hmmm, beer stuff.  Oh, the remarks about sanitation goofs not resulting in
discernible effects.  My own experience backs up the remarks on probability I
believe Al made.  I brewed 48 batches without infection notes of any kind. I
became more and more lazy. I moved to a new place.  The environment here
didn't allow that sort of laziness and I had several infections I've since
traced to multiple sources (mostly starters). After correcting these, my
infection odds per batch have gone way down and I've brewed another 300+
gallons without infection (except for a recent "experiment" in which I pitched
half a batch with an obviously infected starter).  Also, a lot of the problems
I hear about in beers on this forum sound like infections and I've judged
numerous beers that were in the early stages or throes (ughh) of infection.
It often truly is the difference between a score in the high 20's and
something much better (at least for a beer that was only midly infected early
or is in the early stages of a wild yeast infection).  So, don't be ashamed of
those rituals you go through to feel comfortable that you're beating back the
microflora.

Parenthetically,
Paul (in Cheyenne)
p.s. what to do with 4.5 gal. of lactic infected cal. common? I'm not about to
make 100 g of Guiness Stout or traditional porter to mix.  Ain't never dumped,
won't start now. Suggestions? 


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Date: Fri, 10 Jul 1998 01:21:01 -0400
From: "Marc Battreall" <batman at terranova.net>
Subject: RE:Fresh Hops

Fred asks in HBD2762 about his hops for an IPA:

>O.K. I'm getting ready to brew that great IPA, I open my nitrogen
>purged 02 barrier bag of whole flower cascade that I bought after
>hearing raves about this supplier, I stick my nose in for that
>big cascade aroma but... it's not there. I open my little plastic
>bag of cascade pellets bought from the local homebrew shop 6
>months ago... now that's aroma.
>What should I do? Is the great aroma hiding in those whole hops?
>Should I use them or the pellets?

Fred,

Don't know where you got the hops or who your supplier is but that's not
important now because you "have them". Sorry that the aroma was not what you
expected. I get my hops (the whole ones anyway) from HopTech (not
affiliated) and I have yet to be disappointed. The last batch of Cascades
that I got from them were superlative!

As far as your aroma "hiding" in the hops I doubt that is the case. Hops are
pretty much like any other flower as far as aroma is concerned. If its not
there when its fresh, it probably won't appear later. The alpha acids are a
different story. Chances are that the needed acids for bittering are still
present in your hops and I would use them for sure if I were you. maybe for
your own peace of mind, switch the schedule and use the whole hops for
bittering and the pellets for finishing aroma hops. That's what I would do.

Good Luck

Marc
=======================
Captain Marc Battreall
Backcountry Brewhouse
Islamorada, Florida
batman at terranova.net
captainbrew at hotmail.com



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Date: Fri, 10 Jul 1998 02:17:09 -0400 (EDT)
From: Some Guy <pbabcock at oeonline.com>
Subject: The New Brewer

No, I mean literally; not the magazine! Kenneth Gerard Babcock was was 
hired by the Drinkur Purdee Pico Brewery at 11:12 pm 7/9/98. He weighed 
in at 8 lbs, 3 ozs and is 21 inches long! Both mom and future brewmaster 
are doing fine!

Watch http://oeonline.com/~pbabcock/kenny for pictures some time today!

See ya!

Pat Babcock in SE Michigan         pbabcock at oeonline.com
Home Brew Digest Janitor           janitor@hbd.org
HBD Web Site                       http://hbd.org   
The Home Brew Page                 http://oeonline.com/~pbabcock/brew.html
   "Just a cyber-shadow of his former brewing self..."



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Date: Fri, 10 Jul 1998 06:05:46 -0400
From: fridge at Imbecile.kzoo.edu
Subject: Door heaters & defrosting

Greetings folks,

 Randy Miner asks about removing the center divider in 
his side-by-side fridge, among other things...

 Although it should be no trouble to remove the divider, It 
seems advantageous to leave it if you wish to ferment and 
serve in the same fridge.

 There are indeed strip heaters behind the door gaskets in 
many fridges to prevent condensation in humid 
environments, (like central Florida :-)). It may be possible 
to disable them, and have no condensation problems when 
the fridge is set for higher than normal cabinet 
temperatures. Drilling through a heater is not a good idea. 
They are generally made of high resistance wire with a 
rubber insulation, and run on 120v. 

 Defrosting may or may not be needed when running the 
fridge at elevated temps. You will need to experiment with 
this.

 Operating costs can be significant. I once had a 14 
cu.ft.Tappan that cost $80 per month to run - indoors. I 
replaced it with a new (in 1988) 20 cu. ft. Amana that 
costs about $15 per month to run. 

 Adding rigid insulation may help significantly, but will not 
make up for other system efficiency problems. Add 
insulation to the exterior for the best results, but be careful 
not to block any air vents, grilles, etc. You'll have an ugly 
monster, but it'll cost less to run.
Hope this helps!

Forrest Duddles - FridgeGuy in Kalamazoo
fridge at Imbecile.kzoo.edu


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Date: Fri, 10 Jul 1998 08:09:38 -0400
From: AJ <ajdel at mindspring.com>
Subject: Chlorine

Mr. Sammy wrote:

>I recently found out that my town's water supply does not add chlorine
to
>the water. What effect, if any, does this have on a homebrew?  I would
think
>that this is a positive.

The devil you know may be better than the devil you don't know. If
chlorine is not being used it is likely that chloramine is. Find this
out. While evidence continues to mount that chloramine can, at least in
some cases, be removed by boiling it does not seem to escape by aeration
as fast as chlorine. Does the water smell of chlorine? Chloramines
actually have a stronger chlorine odor than chlorine so if they are
present you should know it. It is unlikely that the water is put into
distribution unprotected from organisms i.e. if chlorine isn't being
used I'd expect that something else is.



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Date: Fri, 10 Jul 1998 08:00:17 +0000
From: Mike Beatty <mbeatty at ols.net>
Subject: Wyeast 3068 - LONG Fermentation

Hello all-

I pitched a package of Wyeast 3068 into a 6 gal batch of wheat beer. I
had let the package incubate as per instructions - it took about 2 days
to kick in, but was bubbling away by 6/20/98. It worked feverishly for
about a week, then slowed. As of today (7/10), it is still working - but
very slowly. I don't know how to gauge a fermentation rate, but a bubble
passes through the airlock about every 5 minutes.

Should I let the fermentation continue? Should I stop it and go ahead
and rack? This is the first time that I have used a top fermenting yeast
(that I remember) - is this a trait of the top fermenting yeasts?

Any other advice? I want to get this stuff ready to drink before the end
of the summer...

Thanks!
- -- 
Mike Beatty
Intelligent Business Solutions
________________________________________________
Adopt a Collie! Check out: <http://www.collie.net/~pcc>
________________________________________________
Do you believe in Macintosh? <http://www.evangelist.macaddict.com/>


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Date: Fri, 10 Jul 1998 08:06:08 -0400
From: "Arthur McGregor" <MCGREGAP at acq.osd.mil>
Subject: Food Grade O-Ring for Keg Lid or "What's That Taste"

Hi All,

     Been a long time since my last post, so I'll try to keep it brief.  I
just bought some o-rings (mail order) for my Keg lids of my Cornelius Kegs.
They are advertised as slightly larger, and softer than those normally used
on corney kegs, so they need less pressure to get a good seal.  Well when
they arrived, I became suspicious that they were not food grade due to
their appearance, and slight rubber smell.  So I licked one to see if they
had any taste, and it did!  YUCK !

     Next I cleaned one of the o-rings with dish detergent, and a nylon
scrubby pad, rinsed, and repeated.  Next I soaked the o-ring in iodophors
for 15 minutes, rinsed, and put in a container of tap water over night, and
tasted it the next day after work.  The water tasted like rubber !

     Naturally I'm concerned that my beer will pick up that same taste.  I
know my keg o-ring will not normally be in direct, continuous contact with
the beer, since the keg stands upright, but I still concerned, and would
hate to waste a batch of beer to find out.  Any comments, or experience.
(BTW, the o-rings came from the homebrew mail order store in California
with the Bears on the cover.  No affiliation, yada yada ya). TIA

Hoppy Brewing :^)
Art McGregor  Lorton, Virginia (near D.C.)
day:  mcgregap at acq.osd.mil    night:  apmcgregor at digizen.net




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Date: Fri, 10 Jul 1998 08:00:18 -0400
From: WALT.CROWDER at gsnetworks.gensig.com
Subject: A thank you

Hello to the collective,

    I want to thank Geoffrey McNally, Monika Schultz, Greg Lorton, and Gary
(NAZELROD) for answers to my softened water question.  Having read this for as
long as I have now, I should have known to check the archives (I did last
night).  I will be using the pre softened water (boiled before use) and have
that same water tested.  Then I'll be back for some input on my water profile. 
Many thanks!
Walt Crowder  Southern New Jersey


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Date: Fri, 10 Jul 1998 09:22:45 -0400
From: "Mark Nelson" <menelson at mindspring.com>
Subject: Re:  Paul Gatza

Some Guy Named pbabcock wrote in with:

>I have but one question: Who the hell is Paul Gatza? How is it that the
>AHA always manages to find these faceless, nameless people to take the
>scapegoat - er - "directorship"?  (OK, sorry: that was actually two
>questions...)

Another similar question comes to mind:  Why doesn't the AHA get someone who
has experience running large organizations and has good management skills.
As opposed to a retail shop owner who wins medals and writes for Zymurgy.  I
would suggest that the skills needed to be director of the AHA and the
skills needed to be a good shop owner/homebrewer are vastly different, and
further that the AHA is setting itself up for more trouble.

That being said, I don't know Paul's background and skills, and hope that he
is very successful in his new post.  Paul if you see this:  Congratulations
and Good Luck.  I'm pulling for you despite the questions my post asks.




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Date: Fri, 10 Jul 1998 08:42:47 -0500 (CDT)
From: Cookie Monster <snewton at io.com>
Subject: Re: BREW DAY FROM HELL

>Date: Wed, 8 Jul 1998 14:04:26 -0400
>From: "Thomas Kramer" <tkramer at monad.net>

>glass carboy, carried down to the basement, and I was shacking it up with a
>solid rubber stopper in.  My worst night mare happen it slipped right out of
>my hands, in the few seconds as my would be beer and carboy headed towards

A carboy fits quite snugly in a milk crate, which you can acquire either
by buying them at your local storage equipment superstore or from friends
graduating from college and throwing away their 'furniture'.  You can often
see them sitting on the loading docks of stores and dairies, but at least
in Texas they are all printed with a large note indicating that they are
private property and unauthorized use can result in a fine of up to $200.
How much did that hospital visit cost you?

cm
- -- 
 The world is so full
  Of a number of things
 I'm sure they will all
  Pass away like smoke rings.


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Date: Fri, 10 Jul 1998 08:00:00 -0700
From: "Mike Allred" <mike.allred at malnove.com>
Subject: Pat's Observations


>I have but one question: Who the hell is Paul Gatza? How is it that the
>AHA always manages to find these faceless, nameless people to take the
>scapegoat - er - "directorship"?  (OK, sorry: that was actually two
>questions...)


I do believe that Paul Gatza is the mystery man that has been brewing   
Charlie's beer for him lately.

P.S.    you made a mistake   dictatorship is not spelled that way  ;)  



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Date: Fri, 10 Jul 1998 10:12:10 -0700
From: George_De_Piro at berlex.com
Subject: Diacetyl in Sam Smiths / Diastatic cost / Unknowns at AHA

     Hi all,
     
     Fred talks a bit about the character of Sam Smiths beers, noting the 
     large diacetyl (buttery) component.  He wonders how they get it, and 
     if it has anything to do with the famous Yorkshire Squares they 
     ferment in.
     
     While the fermenter geometry may play a role in yeast behavior, the 
     strain they use and how they treat it are probably more critical.  
     Specifically, they use a yeast that flocculates so well that they feel 
     it needs to be roused during the fermentation.  They accomplish this 
     by pumping the fermenting beer from the bottom of the fermenter up 
     into the air (a fountain of sorts).  This treatment aerates the heck 
     out of the young beer.  This causes a large increase in the diacetyl 
     level in the finished beer.  An unwanted side effect of this process 
     is the dramatic decrease in the beer's shelf life.  Sam Smiths beers 
     don't make the trip across the ocean very well.
     ------------------------------------
     Charles Rich writes about English ales, and talks about the use of 
     certain ingredients in them:
     
     "Make sure your Crystal+Maize amounts to less than
     15% of your base grain by weight so it'll convert.  I wouldn't add
     wheat, your head will be fine and you can use the diastatic cost in 
     more flavorful adjuncts."
     
     I take exception to some of this.  You can brew with over 50% 
     nondiastatic adjuncts when using high-enzyme malts.  The megabrewers 
     do this regularly (without having to add extra amylase; reference 
     Siebel Short Course notes, Paul Smith lecture on cereal adjuncts).  
     Good pale malts, especially 6-row varieties, will be able to convert a 
     lot of starch.
     
     The comment about wheat is odd, too.  Some homebrewing books (notably 
     Dave Miller's _Complete Handbook of Homebrewing_) do imply that wheat 
     malt is diastatically feeble.  This is far from true.  Fermentable 
     worts can be produced from 100% wheat malt.  Bavarian-style Weizen is 
     expected to be brewed with at least 50% wheat malt, and sometimes more 
     is used.
     --------------------------------------
     Our esteemed janitor, Pat, composed the following:
     
     "Who the hell is Paul Gatza? How is it that the AHA always manages to 
     find these faceless, nameless people to take the scapegoat - er - 
     "directorship"?"
     
     While I cannot answer the first question, I can comment about the 
     second.  He has a name.  It is Paul.  I bet he has a face, too (unless 
     he was laughing at Charlie X...)
     
     More seriously, what well-known brewing authority would take a job for 
     less than $25K per year?  I can't imagine that one could live very 
     well in Boulder for so little.
     
     Have fun!
     
     George De Piro  (Nyack, NY)


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Date: Fri, 10 Jul 1998 07:34:33 -0700
From: Michael Rose <mrose at ucr.campus.mci.net>
Subject: percentage by extract, not weight

> Jeff writes (quoting me and was kind enough to Cc: me):
> 
> >>Unless otherwise specified, recipes specify the percentages of the >grist
> >>by the weight of the malt.

	I orginally posted this question and shortly after posting found the
answer in Ray Danials book DGB---It's by the extract, not the weight.
Don't have the book in front of me so I can't quote it.

        Michael Rose   Riverside, CA    mrose at ucr.campus.mci.net


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Date: Fri, 10 Jul 1998 11:21:10 -0400
From: Dan McLaughlin & Christine Griffith <danchris.mcl at erols.com>
Subject: maple syrup

>hey now,
>
>i'm getting ready to do an all grain 11 gallon batch of maple porter...any
>ideas on how much real vermont maple syrup to use? i've got 1 gallon in the
>fridge...i'm thinking of using it all. what i'm looking for is a good maple
>flavor but not a dominating one. i've seached the web and cat's meow but
>haven't really found a definitive answer. i'm looking for something along the
>line of Saranac's maple porter.

Jonathan,
	I have also searched around about the use of maple syrup, the real
stuff, in beer and have found virtually none. I've been making a maple
porter myself for a few years and have managed some decent results. The
light smokiness of the syrup works wonderfully with a porter but it will
take some experimentation fto find what you like.
	My process is to use about 1/2 cup of pure maple syrup per 5 gallon
batch of porter. I would add this in place of some of the priming sugar.
An extra 1/4 of DME or corn sugar makes up the rest. I've tried adding
the maple syrup in to the wort and boiling but I find that it tends to
disappear and leave no detectable residual flavor or aroma.
	If you force carbonate, you could try boiling a 1/2 cup of maple syrup
in a pint of water for 15 minutes and then adding that to the wort prior
to or even shortly after pitching the yeast and see what happens. (I
haven't tried this yet. Maybe next time)
	So, my suggestion would be to try a full cup of maple syrup with your
11? gallon batch and see if it comes out as strongly/prominently as you
like and adjust from there.
	Good luck and please, post your results of your brew. I'd like to hear
what you tried and the results.
	Dan


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Date: Fri, 10 Jul 1998 10:22:11 +0000
From: "Tidmarsh Major" <tidmarsh at pop.mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: cerveza y limon

On the subject of Mexican beer and lime, from _Jane Butel's Tex-Mex 
Cookbook_, New York: Crown Trade Paperbacks, 1980:

Native beer is generally drunk icy cold.  For a switch, try a 
technique from Guadalajara as served in Mariachi Square.  There, icy 
cold cans of beer (_cerveza fria_) are popularly garnished with a 
half of lime and coarse salt.  Generally the lime has been squeezed 
around the rim of the can and the salt dusted on top.  THe flavor 
combination is somewhat similar to a Margarita.  In fact, I've often 
called them a "poor man's Margarita."


Tidmarsh Major, Birmingham, Alabama
tidmarsh at mindspring.com
"Bot we must drynk as we brew,
   And that is bot reson."
    -The Wakefield Master, Second Shepherds' Play


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Date: Fri, 10 Jul 1998 09:34:28 -0500
From: lheavner at tcmail.frco.com (Lou Heavner)
Subject: Re: 

     From: Randy Miner <rdm07993 at pegasus.cc.ucf.edu>
     
     {snip}
     
     Last question: Any suggestions on chilling when the tap water is 82F ? 
     Maybe a chiller in an ice bath then into the wort?  Not a problem now 
     with
     extract as I put my small boil volume into a carboy half full of icey 
     water.  What can I do when I start all-grain batches though?  
     Personally, I
     would rather not let it sit all night (and don't want that thread 
     started
     again).  Ice bath isn't an option with a 3 tier system is it?  Ice 
     water in
     the HLT and run through chiller in wort?  Would need a recirc. pump 
     too
     this for long enough time...  What do other people with hot tap water 
     do?
     
     Randy,
     
     When I made my wort chiller, I got 50' of copper tubing at the Home 
     Depot.  I cut it into 2 pieces - 30' for the wort and 20' for an 
     icebath.  They are connected with 6' or so of siphon tubing.  I use my 
     old enameled kettle as my ice bath.  I put the coil in and pack with 
     ice.  In the beginning of the chill, your warm tap water will be 
     sufficient for cooling.  Also, the ice and copper transfer heat poorly 
     until the ice begins to melt.  So towards the end of your cooling, the 
     melting ice really begins to have more of an affect.  I usually use an 
     8# bag of ice and still have a few unmelted pieces floating when the 
     chilling is done.  I normally drop my wort to about 65 DegF.  Takes 
     about 45 min unattended.  I can do better if I move the wort chiller in 
     the wort.  I'm thinking of attaching some kind of vibrator to enhance 
     cooling with minimal attention.  In a typical brewday, I feed/bathe the 
     kids while the wort is chilling.  Helps me maintain a healthy stock of 
     beer bullets.
     
     Also, Kyle asks about the flavor contribution of starters.
     I have also wondered about this.  Now that I build up a starter in 
     more than one stage, I cool and decant the last stage.  Then I add and 
     swirl a little wort to stir up the settled yeast and pitch.  With a 1 
     Pt starter, I really never noticed much of a problem with dumping the 
     whole starter into the wort.
     Cheers!
     
     Lou - Austin where the forecast is 101 DegF and clear skies


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Date: Fri, 10 Jul 1998 10:31:45 -0500
From: ThE GrEaT BrEwHoLiO <skotrat at wwa.com>
Subject: Re: New AHA Nameless/Faceless Figurehead Announced! 


>"We are very excited to have Paul Joining the AHA team," says Cathy Ewing,
>vice president of the AHA's parent organization, the Association of Brewers.

and in two months she will be saying:

"We are sorry to see Paul go but he wanted a pay check for working here and we 
are just a small organization that can't afford to pay everyone"


>"Paul brings a unique combination of non-profit experience, homebrew retailing 
>experience and award-winning homebrewing experience with him. He will be an
>excellent ambassador for the hobby because he understands brewing and has
>worked with homebrewers for many years."

Doesn't this really mean that he will work really long thankless hours for
no pay
while cathy and charlie take home all the profits from the so called
Member-based
Organization?

Doesn't this really mean. He will do whatever cathy tells him and if he doesn't
then he will be replaced like all the others that have been before him?

Doesn't this really mean that he will take all the heat from all the
homebrewers while
cathy and charlie p sit back and laugh and make excuses? 

Doesn't this mean that yet again the aha has hired someone that no one has
ever heard
of?

>In other AHA news, fans of Zymurgy magazine will be glad to hear it's going
>bimonthly. 

Perhaps zymurgy should just accept advertisements at this point and stop
publishing
articles all together. I took a look at some zymurgies from '92 they are
jammed with 
articles and useful info... these days they are just full of bottle openers,
ads and crap!

The good articles and far and few between and there are just not enough
articles 
about the Spice Girls or Hanson (My 9 year old daughter was quick to poin
that out).


>I have but one question: Who the hell is Paul Gatza? 

Hmmm Someone that no one will miss when the AHA cans his ass the first time
he tries to 
make a real change. Someone that will scurry about under the mighty facist
dictator like 
cathy ewing doing all of her little deeds to help the poor helpless under
educated home 
brewers that she has been qouted saying "Would be no where with Charles books".


>How is it that the
>AHA always manages to find these faceless, nameless people to take the
>scapegoat - er - "directorship"?  (OK, sorry: that was actually two 
>questions...)

Come on Pat... I have talked to you... passed email back and forth with
you.. Got you to 
save the HBD when cathy and charlie were destroying almost 10 years of a
good thing. 

I know that you are a good brewer and a great friend to home brewing.. 

You know as well as I do that this new guy is a scapegoat. You know that
they (cathy, charlie)
manage to find these guys just so they can shove them into the spotlight
right before the
firing squad starts to shoot.. You know that all these guys they choose are
merely decoys 
to give the american homebrewing public some glimmer of hope that this money
oriented 
so called organization is actually concerned with brewing... 

I personally can't get the mental picture of Jabba the Hut (charlie) sitting
fat and bloated
from raping us while that little weazle thing (cathy) scurries about from
shoulder to shoulder
laughing. 

C'ya!

 -Scott "Don't like my post? well then scroll past it" Abene
################################################################
#                     ThE-HoMe-BrEw-RaT                        #
#                Scott Abene <skotrat at wwa.com>                 #
# http://www.wwa.com/~skotrat (the Homebrew "Beer Slut" page)  #
#                                                              #
#                                                              #
# "The More I know About Cathy Ewing, The More The AHA SUCKS"  #
################################################################



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Date: Fri, 10 Jul 1998 10:39:53 -0500
From: ThE GrEaT BrEwHoLiO <skotrat at wwa.com>
Subject: Correction...

Correction... 

This line:

"Would be no where with Charles books".

Should read:

 "Would be no where without charlies books".

Guess I got a little freudian there.

 -Scott
################################################################
#                     ThE-HoMe-BrEw-RaT                        #
#                Scott Abene <skotrat at wwa.com>                 #
# http://www.wwa.com/~skotrat (the Homebrew "Beer Slut" page)  #
#                                                              #
#                                                              #
# "The More I know About Cathy Ewing, The More The AHA SUCKS"  #
################################################################



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Date: Fri, 10 Jul 1998 11:34:53 -0500 (CDT)
From: Samuel Mize <smize at mail.imagin.net>
Subject: Safe aeration; AHA administrator; chlorine; chilling; starters

Thomas Kramer dropped and busted a carboy, injuring himself and losing 5gal
of new beer.  Thomas, my great sympathies.

Anyone who shakes a carboy to aerate it, I'd strongly suggest that you
switch methods. Rocking it is less likely to injure you, but (even on a pad
like a folded towel) it can still cause enough stress to crack the carboy.

This is just a risk, of course -- you won't break a carboy every time, or
every year.  When it happens, though, it can send you to the emergency room
like Thomas.  It could cripple your hands or kill you.

If you use a carboy, but not an aeration pump, I'd suggest aerating BEFORE
your wort is in the carboy.

You can aerate in your kettle (if you chill in the kettle) or transfer
through a counter-flow chiller to a plastic food-grade bucket to aerate.

With a sanitized pan or pitcher, dip up some (chilled) wort, and pour it
back in from a couple of feet up.  Repeat until you get a fair head of
foam.  If you have a good back, you can pour back and forth between two
buckets.

Also, pouring through a strainer breaks up the flow and aerates it.

If you transfer through a counter-flow chiller direct to a glass carboy,
you can run it into a strainer set in a funnel, even if you don't need to
strain the wort.  That should aerate it.

I would expect all of these methods to be at LEAST as effective as shaking
a carboy, and they're much safer.

 - - - - - - - - - -
Pat passes on a news release, "Paul Gatza Named New AHA Director," and asks

> How is it that the
> AHA always manages to find these faceless, nameless people to take the
> scapegoat - er - "directorship"?

If you were hiring someone for a corporate administrative post, would you
look for a famous beer expert or a good administrator who also has a
knowledge of beer?  That's a theory, anyway, let's hope it's true.

 - - - - - - - - - -
> From: "30hollywood" <30hollywood at email.msn.com>
> Subject: Chlorine in water
>
> I recently found out that my town's water supply does not add chlorine to
> the water. What effect, if any, does this have on a homebrew?  I would think
> that this is a positive.

I guess that depends on how many microbes live in it, and what kind.  I
suspect some spoilage organisms won't hurt you to drink.  So, your town may
not treat for kinds or amounts of bacteria that can grow in your wort and
cause off flavors, but would be safe to drink from the tap.

I'd find out if they do something else to sanitize the water.  If not, I'd
boil all the water going into my beer.

Where does this info come from?  Might your informant have meant that they
don't use plain chlorine, they use chloramines?  If so, you have to do MORE
work, not less, to get rid of the chlorine (activated charcoal filtration).
You might double-check with the town water authority.

 - - - - - - - - - -
> From: Randy Miner <rdm07993 at pegasus.cc.ucf.edu>
> Subject: Refridgerator, glass airlocks, wort chilling

> Last question: Any suggestions on chilling when the tap water is 82F ?
> Maybe a chiller in an ice bath then into the wort?

Some people do that.  I spend a buck on two small bags of ice, and use them
to chill my wort.  Well, I don't just dump them in -- I float a flat pan on
the surface of the wort, put in some ice, and replace it as it melts.  (I
use a foil roasting pan.  I crimped the corners for greater strength, five
batches and no visible weakening.)  Since I'm cooling the top layer,
convection carries the warmer wort up to the floating pan (as with a
planispiral immersion chiller).  This chills five gallons to about 90F
within an hour.  Also, the floating pan blocks air access, so I believe
this reduces HSA during cooling [1].

If you prefer to use more water to gain some speed, you could use an
immersion chiller to drop the temperature to about 120, then use the
floating ice pan to drop down to 80/90F.

  [1] No triangle-tested statisticially analyzed six-sigma supporting
      experimental data, it just makes sense to me.

 - - - - - - - - - -
> From: Kyle Druey <druey at ibm.net>
> Subject: Yeast Starter

> We are admonished to make large starters, up to 1 gallon at times, then
> pitch this into the wort.  Maybe your starter's are different, but my
> starters taste like [bleep]

I generally let a starter settle and pour off the liquid.  This may cause
me to pitch at less-than-optimum glyco-whatsit levels but it seems to be a
good compromise: lots of yeast, very little yucky starter fluid.

Best,
Sam Mize

- -- 
Samuel Mize -- smize at imagin.net (home email) -- Team Ada
Fight Spam: see http://www.cauce.org/ \\\ Smert Spamonam


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Date: Fri, 10 Jul 1998 12:02:42 -0500
From: David Cato <dcato at peter.bmc.com>
Subject: Re: hot weather wort chilling

In HBD 2764, Randy Miner asks:

> Last question: Any suggestions on chilling when the tap water is 82F ?
> Maybe a chiller in an ice bath then into the wort?

Like you, my tap water in the summer is over 80F, which makes it hard to
sufficiently chill the wort.  I don't want to even think about how long
it would take for 5 gallons of hot wort to cool down on its own when the
nighttime temps hover near 80F.

I use an immersion chiller and augmented it with a pre chiller in an ice
bath for several batches.  It helped to drop the wort temp to around 75F,
which is a definite improvement over what the tap water alone could do.
To improve the chilling, I switched to running ice water thru the chiller.
This makes it much easier to drop the wort temperature quickly.

My procedure is to use tap water until the wort drops to around 100F.
While the hot wort chills down, I fill my 10 gallon Gott cooler to the 4
or 5 gallon mark with ice (after dumping out the mash, obviously), put it
on a ladder to get it above the boil kettle, and top up with water.  Once
the wort temp drops to about 100F, I switch the chiller's input from the
garden hose to the cooler to finish chilling the wort.

I can usually drop the wort to the mid 50's (I've gotten as low as 45F in
cooler weather, but 2 weeks ago I only managed 62F) allowing me to chill
my lagers close to fermenting temps.

The first time I tried this, I attempted to use a sump pump I had but the
restriction of the 3/8 inch chiller tubing was too great and the pump
wouldn't run for more than a few minutes before it overheated.  A lower
flow pump would certainly work better, but I've decided to stick with the
gravity feed setup for now.

- -- 
David Cato
Houston, TX


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Date: Fri, 10 Jul 1998 10:25:11 -0700
From: "RANDY ERICKSON" <RANDYE at MID.ORG>
Subject: AB Infomercial/ Redundant/ Worms

Gotta get this into the queue before Burley catches up on reading
and starts posting:

Jethro Sez....
While one wonders  at  the career development of Mr. Cheskin, it
seems a fair bet that the AB program will air, sooner or later.<snip)

I heard about this on a satellite TV/radio program last Friday:  As I
recall, the program will still air this weekend, but will be in the wee
hours.  Check local listings, and set the VCR.  I can't remember if
it was supposed to be on TLC or sister-network Discovery, so
check around.
******************************************************
Pat Babcock passes on this gem from Cruella, er Cathy Ewing:

"Paul brings a unique combination of non-profit experience [and]
homebrew retailing experience [snip]":

Isn't that redundant?  And damn ironic coming from an
organization hell-bent on making sure it is!

*******************************************************
And from Dave in Indy:

I don't know about the rest of you, but I wish Charlie lived
somewhere closer to me than CA....Charlie, you must be fun to
talk/do brewing with!!  How about a 60g (more?) batch of worm
ale??

I've brewed once with Charley (and dozens more, 200+ gallons
on National HB Day) and I've got dibs on that earthworm batch.

I wish Charley lived closer too, even though his house is only 100
miles away and work is perhaps 50 from me.  He's a heck of a guy
and is indeed a lot of fun (and a dead ringer for Colin Hay, IMO).

He's a pretty good brewer too, despite some of his ingredients,
as evidenced by his BOS Dopplebock at the '98 California State
Fair.  I judged with a guy last night who judged this beer at State
Fair who confirmed its greatness.  Good job, Charley!


Randy in Modesto 


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Date: Fri, 10 Jul 1998 11:48:58 -0600 (MDT)
From: BrewsTraveler at adamsco-inc.com
Subject: REPORT: LoDo Beer, Wine, Food & Fun Fest



                   The LoDo Beer, Wine, Food, & Fun Fest


   This is the fourth version of the original, each having their own
   different name and each attempting to better the previous.  Attending
   the festival with members of Broomfield's Keg Ran Out Club, I enjoyed
   a Belgian White with Cheyenne Mountain's brewer Alan Stiles, saw some
   old beer drinking companions, and chatted with a beer lover from abroad.
   The weather was less than perfect but we managed to have a good time
   despite the conditions and sampled fine Colorado brews.

   Unfortunately someone in charge of the festival should ask the brewers
   to bring someone different from year-to-year.  Each brewery is only
   allowed to bring a single entry (why I dunno) and many of the breweries
   bring the same beer from year-to-year and festival-to-festival.

   Many of the beers I tried this year were good beers but trying to find a
   new beer that is better than the rest is what the festival is all about.
   This year my personal Best-of-Show goes to Cheyenne Mountain's White
   Ale, a Belgian-style Wit that was very satisfying if not slightly over
   the top.


   John "The Brews Traveler" Adams
   http://www.adamsco-inc.com/BrewsTraveler

   -----
 

   Fool's Gold Ale  		(2.5/4)
   Tommyknockers Brewery & Pub

   Correctly named, not a true Golden Ale but more of a Pyrite Ale.  
   Basically a middle of the road drink.  Slightly bitter, clean, and
   finishes a little dry and hoppy tasting.  Not a bad beer but good 
   enough to be a everyday brew.


   Pinstripe Red Ale	 (3/4)
   Ska Brewing Company
   
   A very nice and pleasant Red (we all know there is no such style) Ale.
   Slightly hoppy, malty, and very drinkable.  Stylistically very close to
   a English Special Bitter.


   Cheyenne Mountain White Ale (3.5/4--Best of Show)
   Cheyenne Mountain Brewing Company

   A very nice Coriander and Orange peel aroma first greets you (actually 
   probably too much for the style but it was pleasant never-the-less).
   Finishes fresh and floral.  A very well made Belgian White that is, in
   my honest opinion, a must buy for Wit lovers.


   Birdman Brown		(2/4)
   Alcatraz Brewing Company

   Nothing interesting, somewhat dry and a good malt balance but I am
   picking up what is possibly a sanitation problem.


   Blue Paddle Pilsner 	(3/4)
   New Belgium Brewery

   A very clean and satisfying drink, Jeff Lebesch crafts excellent beers
   and this is another fine example.  Reminds me more of a German Hefe-trub
   (a German unfiltered Pils) than a Belgian beer.  Very well balanced and
   real refreshing.


   Denver Pale Ale 		(2.5/4)
   Great Divide Brewing Company

   English ESB-style ale.  Hoppy, clean, and spicy finish.  The hops have
   an old musty taste, maybe this beer is past it prime.


- ---
Brews Traveler(tm)
Copyright 1998 by John Adams


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Date: Fri, 10 Jul 1998 12:18:10 -0600
From: "Schroeder, Curt" <cschroed at ball.com>
Subject: Who is this man?

SomeGuy Wrote
"I have but one question: Who the hell is Paul Gatza? How is it that the
AHA always manages to find these faceless, nameless people to take the
scapegoat - er - "directorship"?  (OK, sorry: that was actually two 
questions...)"

I can assure you that Paul has a name and a face (I have seen both).  He
is well known in the Boulder County area and has been helping
homebrewers, since the early 90's, at What's Brewing (an excellent
homebrew supply store).  He is knowledgeable, generous, humble and very
well connected to the homebrew community in these parts.  I'm sure he'll
do well.  Last year he brought a KEG of mighty fine blackberry mead to
the AHA Homebrew Day party.  I'll miss Paul at What's Brewing, and wish
him well at the AHA.

Curt Schroeder
Longmont, Colorado


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Date: Fri, 10 Jul 1998 15:24:41 -0400
From: James Tomlinson <red_beards at compuserve.com>
Subject: Using Slaked lime - Where do I find it ?

In all the talk about use of slaked lime for reduction of carbonates no
one gave a source for the lime. Is the standard stuff from the hardware
store acceptable or must I find a chemically pure version ? Other common
names ? I have extremely hard water and have carbonates so I'd love a
way to preciptate these without boiling.
- --
James Tomlinson

Give a man a beer, and he wastes an hour.
But teach a man how to brew, and he wastes a lifetime!
Muddy Waters Brewery






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Date: Fri, 10 Jul 1998 12:22:05 -0700
From: "Rich, Charles" <CRich at filenet.com>
Subject: RE: Recipe comments

Recently Geore DePiro noted:
> You can brew with over 50% nondiastatic adjuncts when using
high-enzyme malts.
> Fermentable worts can be produced from 100% wheat malt.

Thanks for keeping me honest George, I had made assumptions that weren't
spelled out.  Richard Parker had specified Maris Otter Pale in his
recipe and is brewing in the UK so I assumed UK malts, which I wouldn't
load above 15%.  North American 6-row sure, I'd go 50%, NA 2-row I'd go
30-35% but UK malts, not more than 15%.  Just rules of thumb, only the
batch spec sheet tells for certain.

You're right re: wheat malt, I'd overlooked his calling that out, and
assumed unmalted, torrified.

The beer Richard is pursuing has an intriguing character, in his private
description it sounds like an American West Coast Style Pale Ale but in
a British context.   Over here in Western Washington-Oregon our waters
are very different from York's, our mountain runoff has little mineral
content  I'd like to know what all you hardwater brewers out there run
into when a recipe calls out a big hop load?  Problems?  I know what the
books say, but anecdotes really bring it to life.

Cheers,
Charles Rich (Bothell, Washington)
 


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---