---

	FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
		Digest Janitor: janitor@hbd.org
		Many thanks to the Observer & Eccentric Newspapers of 
		Livonia, Michigan for sponsoring the Homebrew Digest.
				URL: http://www.oeonline.com


Contents:
  MCAB update . . . and a Plea for help! (Louis Bonham)
  America's Finest City Homebrew Competition ("Greg Lorton")
  Somewhat annual Request server reminders... (pbabcock)
  Re: Force Carbonation (Eric Dreher)
  water freezes, yeast in micros, msg for jethro.... (Joe Rolfe)
  re: B3 Kettles (Brent Dowell)
  Re: B3 Kettles (patrick finerty)
  Re: Beer Bullets ("Brian Rezac")
  Milled malt stability ("Steve Blanchard")
  Force Carbonating / Etymology of "Anal" ("Mark Riley")
  Great, supportive spouse (John Wilkinson)
  Road Trip ! (Kevin Miller)
  Re: use of copper in brewing (David Lamotte)
  Checking Instruments ("Stanley E. Prevost")
  Maximum Alcohol (Ted McIrvine)
  One-sided Adjustable mills vs. 6-roller mills/ malty breakfast ("George De Piro")
  Best of Brooklyn '99 Homebrew Competition ("George De Piro")
  beer bullet and other ammunition. (Rod Prather)
  Dispensing from kegs without a CO2 bottle (Rod Prather)
  High Alcohol contents (Rod Prather)
  Ranco Controller/Aroma Questions ("Gregg Soh")
  Italian Brewpots ("Doug Evans")
  RE:  No-Sparge Brewing (Randy Shreve)
  RE: Spousal Approval (David Houseman)
  re: HLT size (Alan McKay)
  Re: HopDevil homebrew ("Jim Busch")
  Re: Oxidation at bottling (Scott Murman)


Beer is our obsession and we're late for therapy!

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JANITORS on duty: Pat Babcock and Karl Lutzen (janitor@hbd.org)


----------------------------------------------------------------------


Date: Sat, 06 Feb 1999 07:56:53 -0600
From: Louis Bonham <lkbonham at hypercon.com>
Subject: MCAB update . . . and a Plea for help!

Hi folks:

Less than a week to go to the MCAB!!

To the long list of companies who will be providing prizes to the MCAB winners,
we now can add Biooriginal Malt and Briess Malting.  Thanks also go out to Dan
Listerman, Liquid Bread, Shipyard Brewery, Cindy Renfrow, and especially
Schreier Malting, Boondoggles Brewery, and Brewing Techniques Magazine for
providing lots of loot that we'll be raffling off at the MCAB.

I must, however, ask the HBD collective for its support . . . .

So that we can make the MCAB accessable to as many people as possible, we've not
charged entry fees and we're not going to charge for admission to any of the
MCAB events (except nominal charges for food and bus passes).  We've received
lots of in-kind donations for prizes and raffle items, but for the most part
those items are going directly to the MCAB winners.  As a result, financially
we're running the MCAB on a shoestring.

So how can you help?  Buy a T-shirt.  We have a load of MCAB T-shirts (heavy
grey cotton (size XL), with the soon-to-be unveiled new MCAB logo on front on
the front, and Pat Babcock's words of wisdom ("Beer is my obsession and I'm late
for therapy") overlaying a larger version of the logo on the back.  DeFalco's of
Houston (713-523-8154) has graciously offerred to handle mail order sales of
these for us, and of course they'll also be available for sale at the MCAB.
Cost: $15 plus S&H (about $2-3 to most places).   All proceeds go to the MCAB.

We also have a limited number of MCAB tap handles (white with the MCAB logo,
with removeable base) available.  (Thanks to Brewing Techniques Magazine, the
MCAB awards for 1st, 2d, and 3d in each category are gold, silver, and
copper-colored tap handles with the MCAB logo.)  Drop me an e-mail if you're
interested in one or more of these . . . .

Louis K. Bonham
Organizer, Masters Championship of Amateur Brewing
lkbonham at hbd.org


Note from Pat Babcock:

Normally the HBD frowns on articles touting the sale of merchandise. For
MCAB, I'm willing to make an exception. 

MCAB is born of the same spirit which drives the HBD: making home brewing
and its information as accessible as possible to as many people as
possible. Unlike other competitions of MCAB's nature, there are no fees
associated with entering the competition or with participating in its
events. It has been funded by donations from companies and individuals -
much like how the HBD server has been funded.

MCAB is a great idea, and promises to be a great event - as long as the
burden of financial shortfalls do not come upon the shoulders on the
individual organizing it. Please consider a tee-shirt, tap handle or even
a donation to help ensure MCAB has the necessary funding for this year's
even - and, perhaps a kick-start to next year's.

Thank you.

Pat Babcock
HBD Janitor


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Date: Fri, 5 Feb 1999 08:38:29 -0800
From: "Greg Lorton" <glorton at cts.com>
Subject: America's Finest City Homebrew Competition

Jonathan Nail's question about America's Finest City Homebrew Competition in
HBD #2946 was pretty timely, so here goes.  (Jonathan nailed the bitter
category last year with a Best Bitter... Ouch!  I'm sorry!!!)

The 6th Annual America's Finest City Homebrew Competition will be held on
Saturday, March 6.  The official entry window is February 15 to 26, but I
suspect if you deliver the entries early, they won't be refused.  If you are
in the San Diego area, you can drop them off at any of the major homebrew
supply shops (i.e., Beer Crafts in San Marcos, Beer & Wine Crafts in El
Cajon, American Homebrewing Supply in Sorrento Valley, Home Brew Mart in
Linda Vista, or U of Brew).  We will be picking up the entries early on
Saturday, February 27 to begin the entry processing, so please get them in
by February 26.  We want two bottles per entry.  (normal AHA rules about
10-14 oz bottles, no raised lettering, plain caps, etc.)

Entries may be shipped to AleSmith Brewing Company, 9368 Cabot Drive, San
Diego, CA 92126.  All of the entries will be stored at AleSmith from
February 27 until judgement day on Saturday, March 6.

Depending on how many judges and entries we get, we may judge some of the
smaller categories on Friday evening, March 5.

AHA 1998 Style Guidelines will be used, but we have added our own category
(Ancient, Medieval, and Indigenous Beers) to be judged under the auspices of
Peter Zien and several other creatively anachronistic beer geeks.  (Sorry,
Peter! :-)

Entry packets are in stock at the homebrew shops listed above.  If you'd
like a mailed hard copy of the entry packet, e-mail or call (760) 635-0528.
However, the best way to enter is online.  (It's less work for you and us!)
The competition website is located at www.softbrew.com/afchbc.  The website
includes rules, style guidelines, general info, online entry, online judge
registration, etc.

We are also still looking for BJCP judges!  We currently are about 60% of
the way to our goal of 50 judges.  We're planning for about 300 entries.  We
had exactly 300 entries last year.  Judging will not be open to the public
due to limited space and the desire that judging be free of distractions
(i.e., contestants peering over the judges' shoulders), however, we are
looking for stewards.

Greg Lorton
AFCHBC Organizer and QUAFF Newsletter Editor
Carlsbad, CA
glorton at cts.com




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Date: Fri, 5 Feb 1999 12:07:25 -0500 (EST)
From: pbabcock <pbabcock at mail.oeonline.com>
Subject: Somewhat annual Request server reminders...

Greetings, Beerlings! Take me to your lager...

We have named the request server. It is now called the Kompletely
Automatic Response Launcher, or simply: KARL. Be advised that with this
naming, KARL seems to have become sentient and is developing a
personality. 

Using a spam-proofed reply-to address prevents KARL from reaching you when
you post a message, and also prevents KARL from handling your
subscription-related requests. This really pisses KARL off. Don't do it.
He'll hate you.

KARL also dislikes people who abandon their ISPs before unsubscribing from
the HBD. This causes KARL to call the janitors names when we help these
unfortunate people to correct their errors. (He doesn't mind it when you
can't unsubscribe because your ISP has disappeared, though. Be sure to
tell him if that's the case. But don't lie. Liars never prosper.)

KARL also doesn't like MIME-encoded posts, HTML, dumb subject lines or
lines longer than 80 characters - though he tries to fix those sometimes.

All in all, KARL seems to be a pretty OK guy. As long as you don't step on
his toes, that is. Keep KARL in mind when dealing with the server.
Following KARL's rules (posted at the top of each and every Digest) can
only make his (and our) existence more pleasant!

Oh, and don't send KARL virus warnings. Most of these are hoaxes, and KARL
really only wants to pass along beer and brewing information. And be
careful to which address you send things. KARL wants to put things sent to
post@hbd.org into the Posting Allocation Tank (PAT, for short). Sometimes
he can't tell the difference between a misdirected subscription-related
request and an article, and passes bad info to PAT. Other times, info that
should go to PAT has been erroneously sent to req at hbd.org and ends up
going to KARL's Big Repository of Artificial INtelligence (BRAIN) for
handling as if it were a request.  This confuses KARL's BRAIN and causes
him to send insidious notes to the Janitors. So be careful which address
you're using when mailing KARL.

Following these simple guidelines will prevent all involved from labelling
you an Admittedly Stupid Sot (ASS) - and no-one wants to be thought an
ASS, do they? 

KARL thanks you from the bottom of his -um- "Kernal". I suppose PAT does,
too - I mean he would if he had a personality.

See ya!

Pat Babcock in SE Michigan         pbabcock at oeonline.com
Home Brew Digest Janitor           janitor@hbd.org
HBD Web Site                       http://hbd.org   
The Home Brew Page                 http://oeonline.com/~pbabcock/brew.html
   "Just a cyber-shadow of his former brewing self..."



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Date: Fri, 05 Feb 1999 11:17:34 -0600
From: Eric Dreher <ericd at reliantdata.com>
Subject: Re: Force Carbonation


Drewmeister writes:

> I have had a huge foaming problem of
> late and want to know what mosat people are doing to force carbonate.
> I kegged this beer in a 3 gal corny, cranked the pressure up to 40
lbs,
> rocked it till it quited (sounds like a baby huh??), then put it in
> the fridge.  I took it out cold the next day and rocked it some more
> until it stopped then put it back.  I left the pressure on it for 2
days, the
> relieved it, dropped the gas pressure to around 15, and served. FOAM,
> FOAM, and nothing but FOAM.  The foam eventually turns into beer.
> But the beer is nearly flat.  IS this due to the highly carbonated
beer
> losing it's CO2 in solution as it drops in pressure going through the
gas
> line (which is rather long).  Should I just decrease the length of my
gas
> line, or does something else in the process sound funny???

I was having the same problems last year for quite a long time.  Every
beer came out mostly foam, yet the beer (once settled) was flat.  I
tried replacing all my lines and every piece I could think of, but
eventually I read a "Ask the Wizard" article in BYO.  From the article,
I concluded that I was putting way too much CO2 pressure on the beer,
usually 20-30 psi, shaking as much as I could stand.  The Wizard's
recommendation for carbonation included deciding what cabonation level
and temperature the beer should have (Now I don't know where/how you
decide this, but I used his example to give me a good starting point)
His example consisted of pressurizing a keg at ~12-14 PSI and store at
38 F.  Pressurize it and keep at the temperature for a couple of days,
shaking once or twice a day.  I have found this now works for me, as I
think I had been going in the opposite direction I should have been
(putting more pressure)  All my beers have been nicely carbonated since
starting this procedure.  (QDA)  I think if the temperatures are lower
you need even less pressure.  Note, I did replace all of those parts and

such, so maybe that helped out too. (Changing a lot of variables at the
same time)

Eric Dreher
Austin, TX






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Date: Fri, 05 Feb 1999 12:37:23 -0500
From: Joe Rolfe <rolfe at sky.sky.com>
Subject: water freezes, yeast in micros, msg for jethro....

WATER FREEZING..
Does it really matter if water freezes faster if warm or cold...All I
wanted to do was make ice cubes. I just know some Dr did a PHD paper
on it...If it takes too long I'd buy another fridge or take the glycol
out of your water supply.  

BEER BULLETS:
Here is a beer bullet for ya, My wife hates the smell, does not drink
it and here is the kicker - was the president of our small commercial
brewery. She sure could sell beer tho.

Andrew Smith asked about micros 'making' proprietary yeast:
I did this in my brewery a few others that I know of do the same
thing, buy it once and do inhouse yeast management.  Eventually, the
yeast will 'modify', itself (for good or bad) and give a unique house
character (btw you dont get that with the repurchase of dry every few
brews). Depending on the fermentation conditions and equipment used ,
after each reuse you can select the more flocc (at the bottom of a
conical tank) the average (the middles) or the less flocc (top of the
cone). For the most part you need to be able to separate them and
doing it in a corny or carboy is a tough job. Process control and wort
composition are other items that need to be watched. The bottom line
for my tests was to limit the number of other variables.

The resultant beers may (more than likely) have a flavor drift that
can kill a micro but this can be overcome by blending. Alot of
breweries out there limit the amount of repitch and go back to the
'mother cells'. This keeps the yeasts contribution to the flavor
profile more consistent, than continuous reptiching.  
  
Stability of the original strain is one issue, is the strain prone to
mutation over the duration of the repitch. Mutation as to is the
flavor/aroma/performance going to go down hill. This is where you
would want to have a taste panel. That requires alot of time and
effort to set up properly. My efforts - had we survived the personal
hell we had when we closed - was to ready the yeast for continuous
fermentation. But hell took over.  

Once you select these you can run tests on the yeast, most easily done
by the average brewers are just controlled lab fermentations. A few
things I monitored where rate of fermentation (how quick to get to the
bottom), acidifcation power (how quick to drop the ph), and growth
rate (by weight). There is another test you can do  - I did not have
the cash to do this - sugar profiles (which sugars can it eat). I
would not doubt that you could get into heavy microbio works (DNA
mucking) but would no doubt be expensive and is way beyond my means.
Someone with more info may be able to chime in here...Once you isolate
the subcultured strain and it proves in your controlled tests - store
it away under the media of your choice, dont lose it - you really have
something unique. that is some of my .02cents worth....


to jethro - you dont annoy me with your comments, but if the finacial
shoe fits wear it. the comment was not uncalled for, you stated it
yourself...and again learn to read, stop twisting words
around.....sorry to the rest of the crowd - I am done now...jethro if
we have anything else to say let us take it off line we are wasting
bandwidth for no good reason and I dont think anyone cares to hear it.


Good Luck and Great Brewing (and yeast play)
Joe Rolfe


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Date: Fri, 05 Feb 1999 17:55:53 GMT
From: bdowell at crl.com (Brent Dowell)
Subject: re: B3 Kettles

 
Hmm,  Was just at B3 the last couple of weekends and notice that the
kettles were the same, or looked very nearly the same, as the one I
have that I got from another vendor.  Okay, I'm pretty darn sure they
are the same as the have the same 100 liter volume lines sticker
running up the outside.

(I'm not a plumber, but this is what I remember about mine, and hey,
since this is the HBD, I may be wrong!)  On mine, It came with a
stainless ball valve with 1/2 male NPT threads.  This goes into a 1/2
inch some kind of non-tapered standard thread type thing welded at the
bottom of the kettle.  It works, but I use one of those round rubber
O-ring type hose washers to keep wort from leaking out.

Now I've used two methods of attaching a manifold or dip tube to the
inside of the kettle.  The first was to use a 1/2 threaded copper
thing that has a 1/2 copper pipe connector on the other side.  There
are just enough threads on the ball valve stick through to maintain a
connection, although it's probably only 1 to 1.5 turns worth.

The other way is with a little 1/2 copper pipe that I sanded down so
that it would jam into the inside of the ball valve.  Using a 45
degree fitting and another small piece of copper pipe, this works very
effectively for getting all the liquid out of the kettle.  BTW, I
didn't think this up, Regan at B3 showed it to me.  I believe he
called it their super sucker.  It seems to work like a champ.

Don't know if this helps, But just thought I would share.

Brent
Lone Unknown Brewing
Antioch CA







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Date: Fri, 5 Feb 1999 12:57:58 -0500 (EST)
From: patrick finerty <zinc at zifi.psf.sickkids.on.ca>
Subject: Re: B3 Kettles

Jay Spies replied to my query regarding B3 brewpots. 

after receiving several responses (thanks everyone!), i'm currently
leaning towards a pot from Brewers Resource (www.brewtek.com). this is
primarily because the kettle is constructed from a heavier guage
stainless steel. it costs a little more and is about .5 gal smaller
(13.5 vs 14 gal) but still comes with a spigot installed (KT-60S).

patrick in toronto

On February 4, 1999, Spies, Jay wrote:

 > Patrick Finerty asked about opinions of Beer Beer & More Beer's kettles.
 > 
 > Since Santa didn't bring me a shiny new brewpot for Xmas, I'm off on my own
 > search.  I spoke with a B3 rep, and they said that the kettles are Italian
 > and have an Easymasher-esque (my language) ball valve / spigot assembly
 > welded to the pot wall.  There are no inside threads, and the valve is not
 > removable, so you're pretty much stuck with what you get.  
 > 
 > They can customize, but that somewhat defeats the purpose of the good price,
 > now don't it ??

- -- 
       "There is only one aim in life and that is to live it."
 Karl Shapiro,(1959) from an essay on Henry Miller's Tropic of Cancer
	      finger pfinerty at nyx10.nyx.net for PGP key
		 http://abragam.med.utoronto.ca/~zinc


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Date: Fri, 5 Feb 1999 11:33:15 -0700
From: "Brian Rezac" <brian at aob.org>
Subject: Re: Beer Bullets

Thomas Murray, <ThomasM923 at aol.com>, wrote:
>Subject: Oh, now I get it...
>
>Thanks to all who replied with definitions of the terms "beer
bullets" and
>"momily".
>I actually have a beer bullet ...

Ah, but Thomas, you never actually KNOW if you have a beer bullet.
Beer bullets can be fleeting.  You might be aware of when you're
earning beer bullets.  But, you never really know the bottom line of
the "special" accounting method used to tally them.  And very rarely
do you know when your beer bullet magazine has been reloaded.  Many
times, you don't find out that you didn't have a beer bullet until
after you've returned from the beer-related activity.

The moral of this story is:  there is no moral.  We are just aware
that beer bullets exist and it gives us something to talk about at the
end of our homebrew club meetings.  The other members of my club, The
TRIBE, often accuse me of having an unlimited supply of beer bullets
because I can always use the rationale, "But, Honey it's work-related.
It's my job."  Trust me, there is no such thing as an unlimited
supply.  But their comments have led me to think of a potentially
great AHA benefit.  What if the AHA could issue beer bullets?  Then
every AHA member could turn to their significant other and say, "But,
Honey it's work-related.  I'm representing the AHA."

It probably wouldn't work and I can just imagine the barrage of phone
calls to the AHA, but it's nice to dream.

Brian Rezac
AHA Director of Vice
brian at aob.org



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Date: Fri, 05 Feb 1999 11:01:24 PST
From: "Steve Blanchard" <steve_blanchard at hotmail.com>
Subject: Milled malt stability

Everything I have read or gleaned from HBD talks about freshly milled 
malt.  My next piece of equipment will be a malt mill but that is still 
a ways off.  My question concerns the stability of milled malt.  How 
long will the milled malt remain "fresh"---days, weeks, months???  
Secondly, what happens to the grain after it is milled that  
deteriorates as opposed to unmilled malt which has a long shelf life 
(properly stored)??  Is there a loss in yield and or/ flavor??

Please ignore the attached commercial message which follows.

Thanks, Steve

______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com


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Date: Fri, 5 Feb 1999 11:44:56 -0800
From: "Mark Riley" <markril at jps.net>
Subject: Force Carbonating / Etymology of "Anal"

Drewmeister:

You don't want to use 40 psi for longer than the 15 minutes
or so it takes you to initially shake, rattle, and roll that keg
(especially if the beer is cold).  If you plan on putting the keg
under pressure for longer periods (several hours or more),
use one of the force carbonation charts floating around
the net:

  http://hbd.org/~mriley/brew.cgi/co2.html

As an example, if you wanted the fairly typical carbonation
level of 2.5 volumes and your beer was at 45F, then set
your regulator to 15 psi and wait a couple days (actually,
you might want to shoot for 2.0 volumes or less, depending
upon your dispensing setup).  Also, you may have to
reduce the pressure while dispensing, unless your system
is "balanced" - you'll find plenty of discussion about this
in the HBD archives.

BTW, I don't recommend shaking after you've got
your beer initially carbonated because this dislodges
the sediment that falls out while your beer is resting
peacefully in the beer fridge.  You'll get clearer beer
by leaving it be and just applying pressure.

- ---

Jay Spies humorously writes:

>I'm not advocating extreme anal-retentive surgical glove industrial
>autoclave pseudo-sterility, but just a little careful attention to
>sanitation can dramatically reduce your chances of disaster.

It cracks me up how us homebrewers have come to take
the words "anal" and "sterile" to mean almost the same
thing.  Ask anyone else and they'd surely say they were
antonyms.

A quick peek at the dictionary tells us:

  anal:  1. of, pertaining to, involving, or near the anus.

I mean, when you think "sterile", one's anus
doesn't immediately come to mind...

Sorry,

Mark Riley





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Date: Fri, 5 Feb 1999 15:50:25 -0600
From: John.Wilkinson at aud.alcatel.com (John Wilkinson)
Subject: Great, supportive spouse

O.K., I wasn't going to join in the love fest over spouses supportive of
our brewing but our esteemed (or is that steamed, as in clams) janitor has
thrown down the gauntlet with:

>So: Ha! says I! Be jealous! There is none to compare to MY brewing
>partner! 

Sorry, Pat, I have to trump all of you.  My wife rarely drinks beer but
fully supports my brewing.  She loves the smell of cooking wort and only
comments about the time my brewing takes me away from her.  I spend all day
Saturday at my barn when brewing.  Partially because of that she has
encouraged me to build a brew house and bought me a Brew Magic RIMS system
for my last birthday.  She looks through Brewing Techniques to find things
I might want for her to buy me.  I am currently building a brewhouse near
the house with her full support and encouragement.  Her one beef if I let my
brew schedule run into time for our dinner together.  Her hobby is gourmet
cooking, great Italian, Cajun, and other things.  As I said before, she rarely
drinks beer and doesn't like the styles I like but she does drink wine.  I
made wine she liked and she wants me to start brewing that for her.  I have
put a cool room on one end of the brew house for storing beer and wine in,
mainly wine since it has to age so long.  A small effort on my part to include
her in the hobby.  Modesty prevents me from explaining why she loves me so
much.  Actually I haven't a clue why.  Of course we have only been married 38
years so it may not last.  Oh yeah, over the years she has given me a couple
of 35mm cameras and several guns.  Even encouraged me to go Elk hunting. I
should mention, in all honesty, that she loves the taste of Elk.

John Wilkinson - Grapevine, Texas


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Date: Fri, 05 Feb 1999 17:11:21 -0500
From: Kevin Miller <Kmiller at teamllv.com>
Subject: Road Trip !

I am planing a business trip Feb. 11,12 to Columbus OH, and while in the
area would like to visit any local Brew Pubs that come highly
recommended.  Does any one have any suggestions ??



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Date: Sat, 06 Feb 1999 10:53:54 +1100
From: David Lamotte <lamotted at ozemail.com.au>
Subject: Re: use of copper in brewing

John Palmer has reassured Ryan McCammon of the safety of using copper
in our breweries, but some other contributors have provided examples
of the taste of Beer, Katsup and Bourbon deteriorating with the
replacement of copper vessels and pipes by stainless steel.

I can think of two factors that could account for the observed
changes.

Firstly, if a copper pot, still or boiler is replaced with SS, the
nature of the heat transfer from the vessel to the liquid will
change.  Copper is easily 'wetted' by wort.  This means that the
liquid's surface tension is low, so it has a good contact with the
heated surface.  SS on the other hand is poorly wetted by wort and so
any gases coming out as the liquid is heated can 'force' the liquid
surface away from the metal surface.  This leads to localized
overheating which allows small amounts of wort to boil/burn etc i.e.
small scale scorching.  Hence subtle flavour changes are possible.

The second factor is hydrogen sulphide removal.  This occurs due to a
chemical reaction which is described by Dr Bryce Rankine (BSc MSc DSc)
in "Making Good Wine" - p41:

"In fact, a little brass or bronze contact with the wine is not
undesirable, since it reduces or removes hydrogen sulphide, which has
become more prevalent since the introduction of stainless steel.  Such
copper containing fittings become black inside with use, due to
deposition of copper sulphide ... This deposit is insoluble and helps
remove hydrogen sulphide from the wine."

So, as long as you de-lead the surface of any brass fittings, it is a
good thing to mix brass and stainless in the brewery.  At least that
is what I tell myself when budget constraints influence my materials
selection.

Have fun ...

David Lamotte
Brewing with stainless and brass in Newcastle, N.S.W. Australia



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Date: Sat, 6 Feb 1999 00:01:49 -0600
From: "Stanley E. Prevost" <sprevost at ro.com>
Subject: Checking Instruments

Jim DiPalma advises Dave Riedel:

Dave, I second the advice someone else gave, check your hydrometer
first. It should read 1.000 when placed in distilled water at 60F. Check
your thermometer as well.

- -----------------

Good advice, but unfortunately it is not sufficient to check only at 1.000.
I "got bit" doing that.
See http://ro.com/~sprevost/beerwine

Stan




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Date: Sat, 06 Feb 1999 01:39:01 -0800
From: Ted McIrvine <McIrvine at ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Maximum Alcohol

If one wanted to do this experientially, perhaps one should brew a beer
that begins above .150 gravity.  Those snooty wild yeasts from the
Champagne region aren't aware of the limitations described below. 
Unfortunately I once got one of their cousins in a carboy of
barleywine.  I had brewed a Barleywine with OG 125 and a Framboise
before leaving for a sabbatical in the midwest.  Upon returning to NYC
six months later, I mistook the barleywine for the Framboise (at least
until I tasted my hydrometer sample) because the former had dropped to
an 0.019 gravity and the latter had lost its pellicule.

Since that adventure, I've used massive quantities of bleach on anything
that gets near my house strain lambic yeast.  I've found other (new and
imaginative) ways of making bad beer.

Ted
McIrvine at Ix.Netcom.Com

> From Eric Dreher <ericd at reliantdata.com>
> 
> >I read somewhere that a fermented drink can only produce a maximum of
> >13-15% alcohol  (without the futher distillation or such).  I don't know
> >for fact that this is true, but thinking of the strongest beers in the
> >world, they're around that level.

> From Jeff Renner <nerenner at umich.edu>
>
> Your 13-15% limit is probably a little low, but right under most
> circumstances.  Wines can regularly reach this level (provided the juice
> had enough sugar).  Twenty-five years ago I had a white wine (very ripe
> Aurora [Seibel 5279] grapes) that started at 28 deg. Brix and fermented out
> completely dry (per Clinit*st) using some dry yeast of .  I think that
> figures to nearly 17% alcohol!  (_American Wines and Wine-Making_, Wagner,


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Date: Sat, 06 Feb 99 02:10:18 PST
From: "George De Piro" <gdepiro at fcc.net>
Subject: One-sided Adjustable mills vs. 6-roller mills/ malty breakfast


Hi all,

Alan asks about Jack's claim that his adjustable mill mimics a
6-roller mill:

" One final point on adjustable mills is worth putting on the
 table.  It is frequently suggested that the one sided
 adjustability of the MM is a limitation when in fact, this
 is actually the key to the so called "text book crush".

 If you look at the oft published drawing of a six roller
 mill, you will note that the roller spacings are about
 .050", .030" and .012" from top to bottom.  It just so
 happens that, when an adjustable MM is set to near contact
 at the adjustable end, one gets those same numbers at the
 fixed end, center and adjustable end respectively.   The end
 rusult is that the random distrubution of grain across the
 length of the rollers provides about the same grist
 distribution as a six roll mill."

Back to me:

The above is incorrect.  A 6-roller mill does indeed have 3
different gap sizes, but it also has screens between each set of
rollers to separate particles based on size.  In this way, the husk
remains largely intact while the endosperm gets ground pretty fine.

A mill with skewed rollers will not mimic this.  In this
situation, some kernels will be unscathed while others will be
obliterated.  This is not the key to a textbook crush.
- -------------------------------------------------------------------
My friend BR Rolya writes about spruce beer and malty breakfast
ideas:

"For a quick breakfast malt fix, I use malt extract to sweeten my 
oatmeal.
Health food shops sell resealable jars of it, so you don't have to deal
with a big can from the homebrew shop.  It's also tasty in coffee, tea, 
and
on ice cream."

I've achieved good breakfast results by mashing 100% wheat malt for 20
min. at saccharification temperature, boiling, then serving.  Talk about 
sweet!
I have a sweet tooth that won't quit but that cereal was close to the 
limit.
Some may find it a bit much.

Have fun!

George de Piro  (Nyack, NY)


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Date: Sat, 06 Feb 99 02:28:51 PST
From: "George De Piro" <gdepiro at fcc.net>
Subject: Best of Brooklyn '99 Homebrew Competition

Hi all,

Just another quick note to announce the second annual

***BEST OF BROOKLYN HOMEBREW COMPETITION!!!***
Of special interest to brewers of period beers is our all new, completely
exciting "Experimental" category.  Continue reading for more details:

The *Malted Barley Appreciation Society* and *Brooklyn Brewery*
are once again joining forces to bring you one heck of a homebrew
contest! The event will be held on Sat., Feb. 27, 1999 at the
Brooklyn Brewery (79 North 11th Street in Brooklyn, NY).  Entries
must be received by Friday, Feb. 19.  Volunteers may carry in entries
ONLY if they are pre-registered by the entry deadline!

Last year over 50 judges and stewards worked hard evaluating over
260 entries.  All of them went home with gifts to reward their
efforts, and over $2000 worth of prizes were awarded to the
brewers of winning beers!  Check out some of the prizes we are
awarding this year:

A custom-made Brooklyn Brewery leather jacket (valued at $400!)

40 qt. Polar Ware brewpot with spigot & thermometer (Wow!)

"A Textbook of Brewing" by Jean de Clerck (courtesy of
the Siebel Institute)

BEER (and lots of it!)

Beer apparel (including t-shirts, sweatshirts, sweaters, long-sleeve work
shirts)

A variety of books on beer and brewing

Gift Certificates for drinks and dinners at local (and not so local)
establishments

Brewing ingredients and paraphernalia

The ubiquitous Beer Glasses

The Association of Brewers president, Charlie Papazian, will be
on hand and will be the guest of honor at a beer dinner following
the contest at nearby *Mug's Ale House*.  This is a great
opportunity to meet Charlie and discuss important brewing issues
with him!  (Actually, the dinner is already sold out, but you can
still meet him at the Brooklyn Brewery during the contest).

Aside from the standard BJCP categories, there are two new beer
categories in this year's BoB:

1.  The "First Time Entrants" Category.  There is no need to be
intimidated by contest veterans!  As well as being judged in
their respective categories, "first time entrants" will compete
in a special category that will be judged by a panel that
includes Charlie Papazian!

2.  The "Experimental" category.  Do you make a lovely recreation
of a historical beer style but fear entering it into contests
because there are no appropriate categories?  Do you make a great
Brettanomyces black pilsner but have nowhere to enter it?  This
is the category for you!

Check out our website at
http://members.aol.com/MaltyDog/bob99.html or contact Bob
Weyersberg at 212-989-4545 or triage at mindspring.com for more info
about the contest and the dinner.

We need judges and stewards!!!  You can register electronically
at the above website or contact Bob for more info!  You must
register to judge or steward by Feb. 19.  Preference will be
given to people that are active in the Beer Judge Certification
Program.  You will be notified of your category assignment the
week prior to the contest.

Good luck and have fun!

George de Piro  (Nyack, NY)


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Date: Sat, 06 Feb 1999 02:43:30 -0500
From: Rod Prather <rodpr at iquest.net>
Subject: beer bullet and other ammunition.

Don't forget!!!  Though many a male has doubted its call, it has been told
that the toll of the marriage bell brings unfortold attacks on the armory
that was formally full to overflowing of beer bullet.  It is the same thief
come stealing that finds his way to the store of sex bullets.

"NAH!"   "That'll never happen to me", he says as the rest of the betrothed
male world laughs knowingly.    MUHA HA HA!!!!!!

> after notifying her of an upcoming Saturday
> all-day into-the-night brewery tour with Bawlmer's own Cross Street
> Irregulars Brew Club (hon), she said "honey, you know you've got a
> bottomless bullet magazine with me".
>



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Date: Sat, 06 Feb 1999 03:18:02 -0500
From: Rod Prather <rodpr at iquest.net>
Subject: Dispensing from kegs without a CO2 bottle

There have been numerous posts lately about trying to dispense from a keg
using charge pressure from the carbonating fermentation.  The problem of
course is that the head space in the keg will not hold enough gas under
pressure for the continued dispensing of the beer.

Here's a crazy idea.  The answer would be a gas accumulator.  A second or
even a third EMPTY keg connected to the first to give a large head space for
the gas to accumulate.  Ideally accumulators have a rubber inflatable body
inside and the backside of the accumulator is filled with a pressure of half
the working pressure of the accumulator. This might not be necessary and
would be difficult to accomplish.  I have not tried this but it might work.
You  also might want to monitor the pressure of the tank or even have
regulator after pressurization.

Or, another way?  Just hook the other side of the keg up to a large
innertube or an auto tire outside the cooler and inflate it with excess
charging gases.  That might add some odd flavors to the beer.  Then again,
it just might work.....

Any of you math geniuses have a suggestion for the charging sugar to put a
13-16 psi charge on an extra one, two or three keg accumulator?  Or enough
gas to inflate an old innertube for that matter.  "Can't give you a beer,
Charlie, had a blowout last night".





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Date: Sat, 06 Feb 1999 03:41:52 -0500
From: Rod Prather <rodpr at iquest.net>
Subject: High Alcohol contents

Jeff, I think about 13 to 15 percent is a typical maximum for alcohol except
in special circumstances. I have made dry wines in the 14 1/2 percent
range.   Most common wines in the 20 percent range are fortified. Sherry and
Sake both attain higher alcohol contents up to 20% by using an ability of
the yeast to accomodate.   Sherry is made by slowly adding more sugars to
the wine during fermentation.  Sake has a similar process but the
aspergillis fungus that converts the rice to sugar continues into the
fermentation process increasing the sugars as the fermentation advances.
For some reason that I am not clear on, the yeast that are coaxed in this
way will accomodate higher alcohol levels.  A chemist friend said it might
be due to some yeast being shocked by the initial introduction to the high
sugar medium and that starting them in a low sugar medium affected the long
term action of the yeast.   I have wondered if it would be possible to
produce a 20% beer by introducing wort concentrate into beer by slowly
dripping it into a fermenting wort.

Jeff Renner said about max alcohol

> Your 13-15% limit is probably a little low, but right under most
> circumstances.  Wines can regularly reach this level (provided the juice
> had enough sugar).
>



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Date: Sat, 06 Feb 1999 02:19:57 PST
From: "Gregg Soh" <greggos at hotmail.com>
Subject: Ranco Controller/Aroma Questions

Dear HBD collective,

Thanks to all who emailed and posted help regarding a source for the 
Ranco controller. I have since put in an order for one. However, I have 
a question about a recent batch of beer. I had brewed an all-grain 100 
percent Weyermann Pilsner Malt beer with Tettnang bittering and 
Hallertau armoma hops. Yeast was......Nottingham, yes Nottingham, just 
for the heck of it. I fermented at 59F for seven or so days, then 
brought it down to almost freezing over a course of 4 days. Now having 
never used this new packet of hops and this yeast before (first try with 
a dry yeast), it is pretty hard for me to draw conlcusions as to the 
cause of a strange new aroma to me. The beer has a tea like, slightly 
jasmine aroma. The flavour is very clean, squeeky clean if compared to 
my usual English Ales and to my formally untrained palate has no off 
flavours, except for this aroma. I wonder, is it the hops, the yeast or 
an infection? Has anyone ever had a tea like, slightly jasmine aroma in 
a beer?

TIA,
Gregory Soh.

______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com


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Date: Sat, 6 Feb 1999 09:06:39 -0500
From: "Doug Evans" <Devans at greenapple.com>
Subject: Italian Brewpots

www.portagehills.com has 100 litre brewpots with a burner for two hundred I
think....

Doug Evans
VinBrew Supply
Carroll, Ohio
(740)756-4314
Devans at Greenapple.com


>Spies (#2946-30) says that the rep at B3 tells him they are of
>Italian manufacture and have a spigot welded in.  A few years back I
>bought a several of the 100 litre (~26 gal) SS brewpots (also of italian
>manufacture) from Hoptech (Std. Discl.) for about $215 US.  At that
>time they were also selling 50 litre pots of similar design.  These
>came with a spigot which srewed into a 1/2" NPT female half coupling
>which is welded into the bottom of the kettle.  I have been very



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Date: Sat, 06 Feb 1999 09:38:28 -0500
From: Randy Shreve <rashreve at interpath.com>
Subject: RE:  No-Sparge Brewing


In response to Bob's post about no-sparge brewing:

As I understand it, "no-sparge brewing" technically refers to adding
extra malt to the grain bill to compensate for not sparging at all.
George Fix has an article about this at "The Brewery" site in the
library section (http://hbd.org/brewery/library/YMltGF92.html), where he
advocates this method to intensify maltiness for special beers.  First
runnings only are taken from the mash tun, and boil volume in the kettle
is adjusted to the desired end result.

What you described in your post sounds more like batch sparging to me.

Instead of trickle sparging, I split my sparge water into two batches.
After the mash is done, I drain the first runnings into the brewpot.
Then I add the first sparge water batch, stir, let sit for 15 minutes,
recirculate, and drain.  I then add the last sparge water batch without
stirring, and drain until the brewpot volume is where I want it to be.

Using this method, I have always come very close to the gravity I was
looking for (as long as the mash worked properly).

This is *just* the way I do it.  Everybody uses their own twist (the
essence of the homebrewing spirit), but I personally think this saves
lots of time, and is much easier than trickle sparging in my opinion.

Peace and Long Life

Randy in Salisbury, NC




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Date: Sat, 6 Feb 1999 10:32:32 -0500 (EST)
From: David Houseman <dhousema at cccbi.org>
Subject: RE: Spousal Approval

Crispy275 at aol.com says "My wife does not drink beer and hates the smell of
the stuff (particularly...She has her own passion (a horse), and used to
look at me with those eyes when she went to the barn for the day,..."

Perhaps you can combine your wife's hobby with horses and your own brewing
by making Lambics?  She just may love that wonderful horsey aroma of
Brettomyces yeast. ;-))

Dave Houseman



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Date: Sat, 06 Feb 1999 14:15:22 -0500
From: Alan McKay <amckay at magma.ca>
Subject: re: HLT size

In HBD 2947 Dave Hinrichs asks abot HLT size.  IMO a 10 gallon
should be just fine, especially if it is fired.  I have a 17 gal
(65 litre) brewpot and a 10 gallon gott mash/lauter tun.  All
of my water gets heated up in the 17g pot, then I mash in, and
my hot liquor then goes into an insulated 7.5g (circa 30 l)
white bucket, with some left over for a 5 gallon gott.  This,
of course, becomes my sparge water.

A 10 gallon HLT won't likely be able to heat all your water
at once (mash and sparge water combined), but you'll be just 
fine if it's fired because you can heat more sparge water 
during the mash.  No big deal.

cheers,
 -Alan

- --
   "Brewers make wort, yeast makes beer"
    - Dave Miller's Homebrewing Guide
http://www.magma.ca/~bodnsatz/brew/tips/


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Date: Sat, 6 Feb 1999 14:31:35 +0000
From: "Jim Busch" <jim at victorybeer.com>
Subject: Re: HopDevil homebrew


> Hops:
> 21.00	g.	Centennial     	11.0%	60 min
> 14.00	g.	Centennial     	11.0%	30 min
> 42.00	g.	Cascade        	 7.0%	 1 min
> 
> Mash Temperature: 152F
> Wyeast 1056
> 5.5 gal  at  1.052

HopDevil IPA is 1.064 OG.  6.4% ABV and over 60 BUs.  If
I plug in the above to Glenn's Hop Bitterness Calc I get roughly
41 BUs.  The above recipe looks like a fine pale ale and I brew
beers like this too, it just wont be as big as our beloved 'Devil.

Prost!

Jim Busch



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Date: Sat, 6 Feb 1999 11:40:33 -0800 (PST)
From: Scott Murman <smurman at best.com>
Subject: Re: Oxidation at bottling

Stephen Alexander wrote:
>
> Bottle conditioning a couple bottles at 80% fill with air vs CO2
> in the headspace should give you a pretty good idea of what you are up
> against.

While this is an interesting experiment, it's not very pertinent to
the question.  That air has a detrimental effect on finished beer is
well documented.  Rather than having 20% of the volume air, what is
the effect if less than 5% of the volume is headspace (in 22 oz. and
12 oz. sizes), i.e. what is the effect in a typical fill level?  Are
the effects noticable in a "typical" well-filled, bottle-conditioned
homebrew?  I would guess "no", else all of us would be kegging
exclusively, but can only speculate since I don't have the means to
perform the experiment.

Fix and Fix, in Analysis of B.T. note that air levels in bottled beer
(not noting whether sans yeast - but I'm not allowed to criticize) are
important, but the effect of storage temperature out-weighs it by a
goodly amount.

 -SM-


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---