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	FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
		Digest Janitor: janitor@hbd.org


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Contents:
  RE: Screen usage ("Michael R. Brzezowski")
  Re: Grain bed depth and Gott cooler (Brian Levetzow)
  conical fermenters ("Keller, Steven W.")
  further abuses ("Dr. Pivo")
  Kettle Screens ("Joe Newcomer")
  Washing machine motors? (Paul Kensler)
  Grain Bed Depth in a Gott Cooler. ("Dan Listermann")
  Turbo Extra (Michael Marshburn)
  extraction efficiency ("Ronnie Anderson")
  Still Alive And Kicking ("Phil Yates")
  RE: Converting extract to all grain ("Steven Parfitt")
  Maple Charlie Brown ("John Gubbins")
  3068 (AJ)
  Converting Extract Recipes to All Grain (Al Klein)
  GSPS and Beer (Allen W Senear)
  MCAB4 - Hotel discount deadline (shick)
  AHA Big Brew ("Mike Pensinger")
  Some Positive Bazooka FeedBack ("Scott D. Braker-Abene")


*
* Drunk Monk Challenge Entry Deadline is 3/16/02!
* http://www.sgu.net/ukg/dmc/ for more information
*
* Maltose Falcons 2002 Mayfaire Competition 
* Entries accepted 4/1/02 - 4/11/02
* http://www.maltosefalcons.com for details
*
* Show your HBD pride! Wear an HBD Badge! 
* http://hbd.org/cgi-bin/shopping
*
* MCAB-IV - April 12-13, 2002 - Cleveland Ohio
* See http://www.hbd.org/mcab for more info
*
* Beer is our obsession and we're late for therapy!
*

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Date: Sat, 09 Mar 2002 01:51:24 -0500
From: "Michael R. Brzezowski" <mrb at dedham.k12.me.us>
Subject: RE: Screen usage

I am fairly new to brewing, so maybe this is just obvious but I will say it
anyway.  I use something that looks like a really fine meshed hair net.  I
put it over my fermenter (plastic, not a carboy).  Then I have someone hold
it just to make sure it doesn't fall in, and I pour the wort through it.

Works fine, but that is with a nice wide 6.8gallon bucket.

 - Mike




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Date: Sat, 09 Mar 2002 09:05:10 -0500
From: Brian Levetzow <levetzowbt at comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Grain bed depth and Gott cooler

Brian Schar wrote about Zymurgy article and stuck mashes:

>The author suggests that the grain bed should be no more than
>4 inches deep, and in no event more than 8 inches deep.  However, in a 
>Gott cooler, I can't believe I could get enough grain in there to make 
>5 gallons of beer (much less 10 gallons) and still maintain a grain bed 
>under 8 inches in depth.  Is the author correct?  Or overly conservative? 
>How deep is your grain piled in the Gott cooler mash tun?  Does it really 
>matter?  I am curious to get some feedback on this before I commit to a 
>cooler.

Bung.

I use a 5 gal Gott, but have had 14 lbs. of grain in it, filling it to
the 
brim with grain and mash water.  That's a touch more than 8 inches deep, 
more like 16 while 'floating'.  This drops to ~12 inches when drained.
I have never had a stuck sparge due to grain bed thickness.  Now, when
that grain gets under my phalse bottom, that's a different issue...

- -- 
+++++++++++++++
Brian Levetzow
~
Laurel, MD
[425.7, 118.5] Apparent Rennerian


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Date: Sat, 9 Mar 2002 11:03:53 -0600
From: "Keller, Steven W." <KellerS at missouri.edu>
Subject: conical fermenters

I was hoping to get some input on experiences with plastic or stainless
 conical fermenters.  Are they worth it?  Is one type signifcantly
  better than another?  I have looked at BBMB (stianless), Sabco (keg 
conversion), and discountbrew.com (plastic).  Any comments from the gurus
 would be greatly appreciated.

Brew on, Brew well,

Steve


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Date: Sat, 09 Mar 2002 18:12:15 +0100
From: "Dr. Pivo" <dp at pivo.w.se>
Subject: further abuses

Pat Casey suggests some serious treatment for not only yeast, but
brewing abuse.

> Phil's Phlogger, the perfect device for
> dealing with brewing deviants and miscreants. It would probably also
> prove popular in Townsville where they enjoy this sort of thing anyway.
>

The reference to Townsville seems to be entirely appropriate, as Graham
Sanders recently wrote:

> Pride of Ringwood is essential, get it!!!!!!! Its an Aus signature
> to all our beers. Use it also in the flavour of the beer, 10 grams
> at 10 minutes. It actually a good flavour hops, highly under-rated.
>

I seem to recall that "Pried Off Ringworm" was a 60's product when the
hop growing world took a simplistic view that alpha acid was
everything.  In this sense the 'ol ringworm was an unparallelled
breeding success , giving yields in excess of 10 percent.

I mention this because this hop variety carried along with its high
alpha,  a very distinct taste signature.... one that I find absolutely
disgusting.

Not that my personal taste is of any value here, but just to caution
those who've not encountered the ringworm before.... a little will go a
long way, and it is not a flavour that you can hide amongst others....
in a sense somewhat like a hop like "Bullion" where even small ammounts
will inevitably show their face, but where Bullion gives an interesting
"Black Currant" flavour, The "Pride" has always struck me as "metallic"
tasting...  or perhaps it really is "pried off ringworm".

Now, if you've been buttering your tongue with "Vegemite" your entire
life, while parking yourself in front of an open oven in the tropical
heat, you may find this flavour quite appealing.... If not, some
judicious usage upon first encounter may be advisable.

Dr. Pivo



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Date: Sat, 9 Mar 2002 11:02:19 -0700
From: "Joe Newcomer" <joencmr at zianet.com>
Subject: Kettle Screens

For years I used an Easy Masher (no affiliation) in my kettle to filter the
hops and trub, and it worked great with whole hops.  Very clear runoff.  But
I was afraid to use it with pellet hops for fear of a clogged runoff.

So I removed the stainless steel hose clamp from the Easy Masher, slid a
nylon hop bag over the screen, and installed the hose clamp back over it.
Works perfectly with pellet hops.

Joe Newcomer
Las Cruces, New Mexico



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Date: Sat, 09 Mar 2002 13:12:08 -0500
From: Paul Kensler <pkensler at comcast.net>
Subject: Washing machine motors?

I checked the archives and couldn't find anything...  but I swore I've seen
this discussed before.

Does anyone have any experience or recommendations on using a washing
machine motor to motorize a malt mill?



Thanks,

Paul Kensler
Gaithersburg, MD




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Date: Sat, 9 Mar 2002 18:05:19 -0500
From: "Dan Listermann" <dan at listermann.com>
Subject: Grain Bed Depth in a Gott Cooler.

<Date: Fri, 8 Mar 2002 09:11:11 -0800
<From: "Brian Schar" <schar at vimedical.com>
<Subject: Grain bed depth and Gott cooler

< I am leaning toward the 10-gallon Gott cooler as my
<mash tun, based on a lot of comments I have read here on HBD and elsewhere,
<and on discussions with other homebrewers.  However, I am rethinking this
in
<light of an article in the recent Zymurgy that discusses 10 ways to prevent
<stuck mashes.  The author suggests that the grain bed should be no more
than
<4 inches deep, and in no event more than 8 inches deep.

I can't imagine where someone might get the idea that a grain bed more than
8" in a Gott cooler would be any problem.  I have been mashing in these
coolers for years and I doubt that I have ever had a grain bed under 8".
The other week I lautered 30.5 lbs ( mashed in two coolers for space
reasons) in a 10 gallon Gott where the grain bed was about 18" over a Phil's
Phalse Bottom.  The lauter was uneventful.  It looks as if someone had other
problems and missassigned blame to the depth of the grain bed.

 Dan Listermann

Check out our E-tail site at http://www.listermann.com

Take a look at the anti-telemarketer forum.  It is my new hobby!




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Date: Sat, 9 Mar 2002 15:13:44 -0800 (PST)
From: Michael Marshburn <mikem4851 at yahoo.com>
Subject: Turbo Extra

Hey All
I was searching through eBay and typed in "Yeast" to
see what popped up. I ran across an auction for a 220
gram sachet of Turbo Extra Yeast. It was advertised
for making alcohol for distillers using 9kgs dextrose
and 25 liters water. I was curious if anyone had any
experience using this yeast for barley wine, imperial
stout, meade or some other high gravity brew. Since
this was auctioned by a shop in Canada, a brewer from
there might have given it a try??

Mike M



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Date: Sat, 9 Mar 2002 18:25:34 -0500 (EST)
From: "Ronnie Anderson" <lerxst at webmages.com>
Subject: extraction efficiency

Brewed my first 10 gallon all grain batch today (3rd all grain
overall). I hit my target OG on the nose, but unfortunately was about
1.5 gallons short. Since I've just started with all grain, I'm sure
there can be improvements in my process to bump up the efficiency, but
I don't know what they would be. Here's what happened today:

10.5 lbs german wheat
9.5 lbs belgian 2-row
8 oz munich
1 oz whole leaf hallertau (4.1 aau)

10 gallon gott cooler
SS false bottom (morebeer.com)
converted keg as boil kettle
single infusion mash

 -strike water 180
 -mash at 151 ~1:15
 -sparged with ~8 gallons of 170 water split 3 times in a bottling
bucket-checked mash temp after the first 10 mins and it was at ~155
 -heated sparge water up to ~185 (bucket doesn't hold heat well), which
brought the mash up to about ~164.
 -stopped sparge when runoff was 1.007, about 45 mins later
 -60 min boil
 -OG 1.053

I didn't want to try to risk extracting any more from the grains since
the gravity was already below 1.010, but had only collected about 9
gallons.

So, other than the sparge water losing it's temperature too fast, does
anyone see any room for improvement?

TIA,
Ronnie




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Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2002 10:54:47 +1100
From: "Phil Yates" <yates at acenet.com.au>
Subject: Still Alive And Kicking

The recent reappearance of Graham Sanders on HBD throws up some interesting
considerations. Seems the crocodiles didn't get him after all. Though from
what Graham tells us, they are still busy eating people. Judging by Graham's
ranting, when he posts in here I imagine he would be lucky to walk, let
alone run from a crocodile. Lucky for Graham he doesn't live near a river
bank.

Graham seems to be celebrating the demise of Ansett Airlines in this country
and the loss of some 17000 jobs. Even with my weird sense of humour, I'm not
sure what he thinks is funny about that.

The last six months in particular has taken me away from my full mash
brewing. I've kept my supplies going using wort kits. I really am very
impressed with these but it's high time I fired up the kettle, cranked up
the grain mill and started churning out some serious beers again. Jill has
been screaming for another rice lager (along with all the other ladies of
the billiard room). With winter coming on here in Oz, I'm thinking a full
bodied Scottish Ale might be the go.

I have to thank Wes Smith once again for his contribution to Australian
brewing. Thanks to Wes, we now have a huge range of brewing malts available
where once there were hardly any. This is great news for homebrewers, not to
mention the micro brewing industry which seems to be gathering momentum at
an increasing rate here in Australia.

One wonders why an awareness of good brewing and good beers has taken so
long to occur in this country. It's been all the rage in the USA for many
years. New Zealand has been well into it for a long time. I think Ozzies
have been so used to thinking of beer as nothing but swill, and raving about
our wines, serious beer brewing has been overlooked.

But all of that is changing, and changing fast. The big breweries have
realised a major shift in people's tastes is occuring. The micro brewing
industry in Australia is taking up the void.

Graham is right. He'll likely not see me in Townsville for a long time.
Circumstances in Australia have pretty much finished my flying career. But
this is not the end of the world. I'm looking forward to pursueing my other
passion, brewing good beer and learning more about it. Keeping the bills at
bay is going to be a challenge, but you never know where I might bob up.

Though I won't be seen in Townsville, I can assure Graham I am very much
alive and kicking.

Cheers
Phil



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Date: Sat, 09 Mar 2002 19:29:36 -0500
From: "Steven Parfitt" <the_gimp98 at hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: Converting extract to all grain

Easy way to do this is to get ProMash (NAYAYA). Enter your extract recipe.

Check your percentage for each ingredient, total IBU, OG, etc.

Substitute grain and adjust to the same percentages, OG, IBU, etc.

Done.

Steven, -75 XLCH- Ironhead Nano-Brewery, Under construction.
Johnson City, TN 5:47:38.9 S, 1:17:37.5 E Rennerian
http://albums.photopoint.com/j/AlbumIndex?u=241124&a=1791925

"Fools you are... who say you like to learn from your mistakes.... I prefer 
to learn from the mistakes of others and avoid the cost of my own." Otto von 
Bismarck




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Date: Sat, 9 Mar 2002 17:47:07 -0700
From: "John Gubbins" <n0vse at idcomm.com>
Subject: Maple Charlie Brown

Before the thread on maple flavored beers and maple wine started up, I
decided to make one. There was some leftover maple syrup in the fridge
that my sister brought over last Christmas. I'd meant to do something
with it but didn't know what. As it was taking up valuable
refrigerator space, I decided to dispose of it. In wort, of course. On
New Years Day of this year I concocted and made a fabulous Brown. I
wanted to make it again and perhaps tweak it a bit. So that is where I
put that maple syrup.
Maple syrup is weird stuff. The bottles had sugared out on the bottom.
I had to break up the precipitate by gently heating the stuff up. This
was a fairly low grade of syrup since it was pretty dark. It was not
the clear stuff you get in the East, this was good old Colorado
grocery store stuff. Below is my log entry:

Maple Charlie Brown (based on the New Year's Brown)
2.5 lb british 2 row
8 lb light LME
8 oz caramunich
1 lb brown malt
4 oz chocolate malt
~24 oz real maple syrup put in at 10 minutes to end of boil
2 oz domestic cluster (boil) AA 8.6
1 oz hallertou 4.8 aa 10 min
White Labs English Ale yeast

Made another mess. This stuff is hard to control! The first hot break
lasted about 10 minutes and then there was another small one towards
mid boil. There was another major break when I added the syrup. The
gravities turned out good and high. The wort temp was a bit high,
about 80 but I pitched anyway. This stuff should take off. I think
I'll put some yeast energizer in the secondary to try to ferment this
stuff way down.
OG 1.070 Pot alc 9.5
February 23, 2002
Racked to secondary Gravity 1.01 Pot Alc 1
Tastes good. Does not taste finished yet. There may be a hint of
woodiness to it that may be from the maple. I didn't put any energizer
in it as it looks like a good fermentation
March 2, 2002

Still fermenting.
March 8, 2002

Kegged. FG 1.01 pot alc 1 Don't know why it didn't drop more since the
fermentation went on so long. Bubbles were even in the lock so it was
done.
- ---
I kegged it last night. After drawing off the sediment I force
carbonated it. It is very good. There is a hint and only a hint of
maple flavor, but there is a woodiness in there that I've never tasted
in a beer. I hope it improves with age (if it can!) and if so it does
not lose this character.
I guess the thing I can say is try it, you'll like it. And I have a
gallon of the A maple syrup in the cupboard. This stuff is almost 20
years old and never opened. Probably sugared, but it can be
reconstituted.
John Gubbins
(1117,265,5) apparent Rennarian....




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Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2002 03:01:16 +0100
From: AJ <ajdel at mindspring.com>
Subject: 3068

I'm not much of a genetecist but the POF gene which lends the clove
flavor is heterozygotic (is that the right term?) I.E. its a single gene
 - not a pair) and thus is lost is succesive uses. You are not the first
to experience disappointment from repitching of these yeasts. The best
thing to do with this (and similar strains) is buy a new slap pack for
each batch or subculture a slap pack and use the subcultures to pitch
multiple batches. A lot of work to save $4 IMO.

A.J.



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Date: Sat, 09 Mar 2002 21:44:22 -0500
From: Al Klein <rukbat at optonline.net>
Subject: Converting Extract Recipes to All Grain

Larry Bristol said:

>And it gets even worse when the recipe calls for hopped extract. 

Yeah.  I'd sure like to find out just which hops are used in Munton's
Hopped Amber LME.  I made a nice ale with it but I can't duplicate it
with unhopped malt and my own hops.
- ---
[Apparent Rennerian 567.7, 95.9] 
Al - rukbat at optonline dot net


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Date: Sat, 09 Mar 2002 19:14:06 -0800
From: Allen W Senear <senear at seanet.com>
Subject: GSPS and Beer

>From the Seattle Times, Saturday March 9:

Two beer-loving British entrepeneurs have come up with a computerized
global-positioning device that starps on the wrist and directs the
wearer to the nearest pub.

No word on whether Jeff Renner's co-ordinates are included.

Allen Senear
Big Water Brewing
Seattle


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Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2002 17:33:03 -0500
From: shick <shick at jcu.edu>
Subject: MCAB4 - Hotel discount deadline

Hi all,

Just a quick reminder for those thinking
about attending MCAB4 in Cleveland, April
12 and 13:  the deadline for getting the
special AOB rate at the Renaissance Hotel
is Tuesday, March 12. After that, the
(much higher) regular rates will be in 
effect.  Check the MCAB4 page (advertised
in the header of this HBD issue -- thanks
Pat!) for details.

                Briefly yours,
                Paul Shick
                Cleveland Hts, OH




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Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2002 19:43:57 -0500
From: "Mike Pensinger" <Beermkr at bellatlantic.net>
Subject: AHA Big Brew

Has anyone else seen the recipes for Big Brew this year?  I couldn't find
anything that said we had to brew those recipes.  My club wants to
participate but franly the two recipes they have provided are way out of
most brewers tastes and league.  28.5 pounds of grain is beyond anyone in
the clubs mash tun capacity and the lagar presents its own problems in a
predominately Ale brewing club.

Does anyone now if we HAVE to brew the recipes they provide to participate?

Mike Pensinger
beermkr at bellatlantic.net
http://members.bellatlantic.net/~beermkr/
President - Hampton Roads Brewing & Tasting Society
http://hrbts.tripod.com
Norfolk Virginia - [551.4, 132.9] Rennerian




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Date: Sun, 10 Mar 2002 17:00:00 -0800 (PST)
From: "Scott D. Braker-Abene" <skotrat at yahoo.com>
Subject: Some Positive Bazooka FeedBack

Hi all, 

With all the negatives I have to come in with some positives. 

I have recently switched over from my 6 year old false bottom systems to
Zymie's Bazooka screens. 

I have at least 6 vessels equipped with various configs of bazookas. I use
mostly leaf and occasionally pellets. I have had no issues with them clogging.
I did have an original prototype bazooka screens weld go out and Z promptly
replaced it. He even patronized me with free shipping. 

I am not an immersion chiller user. I am a MAXI CHILLER user. I believe that
most clogging issues are due to the immersion chiller causing the gunk to
harden in the boiler. 

I brew between 15.5 and 45 gallons at a time and the bazooka has always done
well.

I recently even mashed 100 pounds of grain with a single screen and achieved
just under 80% eff. 

http://www.skotrat.com/skot/equipment/Feb_22_BW

I am a chronic Do-It-Yourselfer and rarely buy brewing equipment. Z's stuff is
almost always better than what I could make for myself. 

Hats off to companies like Zymico, Schmidling, EasYeast, PBS for taking the
time to market great products. 

Let's not blame "user error" on the companies that supply us with good sturdy
products. 

These guys do not have to sell us their stuff... They could just keep it to
themselves. 

Thanks Guys!

C'ya!

 -Scott

Other brew equipment pics for those bored at work...

http://www.skotrat.com/skot/equipment/Brew_Rig_Pics
http://www.skotrat.com/skot/equipment

=====
"Heh, hey Von you see me steppin on these leprechauns? 
 It gotta be acid cause the X is gone "
 -D12

http://www.skotrat.com/skotrat - Skotrats Beer Page
http://www.brewrats.org - BrewRats HomeBrew Club



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