HOMEBREW Digest #3907 Fri 05 April 2002

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  The Jethro Gump Report ("Rob Moline")
  Sankey spelling ("Mike Dixon")
  rye ale questions ("Chris Bersted")
  Rye ("Dan Listermann")
  Clear Wheat Beers ("Dennis Waltman")
  Grain Mill ("Jon & Megan Sandlin")
  Chilling CCF (Aaron Gallaway)
  PID Controllers ("Houseman, David L")
  Re: Rye Ale questions (Jeff Renner)
  hazelnut extract ("homebrew at alabrew.com")
  Re: Rye Ale questions (Denny Conn)
  Hazelnut (Phil Wilcox)
  Re: Where to buy beer online (Spencer W Thomas)
  Re: Sankey kegs (Phil Wilcox)
  Saving Yeast ("Hedglin, Nils A")
  Pilsner plans (RiedelD)
  Povidone/Iodine Solution ("Galen Brelie")
  Schlitz Porter Recipe ("Scott D. Braker-Abene")
  Rye APA (Jeff & Ellen)
  Re: RIMS temperature control (Ronald La Borde)

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---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 3 Apr 2002 23:31:58 -0600 From: "Rob Moline" <jethrogump at mchsi.com> Subject: The Jethro Gump Report The Jethro Gump Report Auto Radiators.... Lonzo McLaughlin considers using an auto radiator for chilling...It would work, but I believe these have a reputation for lead welds...and for being a contributing factor in moonshine op's contributing toxins to the ethanol drinker. I wouldn't use it. A stainless or copper coil in the same application would do the job, perhaps not as efficiently though. Ethylene/Propylene Glycol... Someone recently commented on ethylene/propylene glycols.....though I can't find the exact post right now. Please let me emphasize that propylene gylcol is used in food applications, as ethylene glycol (the stuff in your car) may cause problems should your chiller leak into the product. Like poisoning your friends/customers/yourself..... Chemists please advise, but I believe that propylene glycol is actually even used as an ingredient in some foods? It is what I use in my chilling applications, not just for its coolant properties, but also for the fact that it won't subject my company to huge liabilities, should a pin-hole leak occur, across the coolant/product barrier. >From: Jim Busch <jim at victorybeer.com> >Subject: Jethros CCF >Mr Moline has done a wonderful job of >describing the exact CCF I had made at a .brewery tank supplier in Maine. Only addition I >would suggest is two ports on the top of the >CCF, one for filling and CIP at 1" size, the >other 1/2" for blowoff/CO2 pressure gauge >attachment. Now, I know 'FER' a fact that Jim would rather fill any vessel from the bottom up...so, he has clearly made a mistake when he proposes a filling from the top.... I KNOW he's not wrong...it's just a mistake, y'all....'cos I know that he knows one can utilize the same device, i.e., a one inch blow off tube, stainless, of course, for all these purposes, sans filling.... A 1 inch stainless tube, attached to the top, CIP fitting, can be followed down the vessel, where a pressure gauge can be fitted, tangential to the tube, below which a TC clamp fitting can exist, which can be fitted with a valve, if one wishes to spundig the brew....(something I never do...relying on force carbing through sintered steel in serving....) And CIP pumps can be similarly attached, as can blow off buckets, to this same down tube.... Let's see...one tube...that allows CIP.... gas collection/blow-off observation.....spundig carbonation/CO2 pressure reading....or...2 tubes? The second of which requires a secondary cleaning step??? Not having much smarts...I have to rely on "Keep It Simple Stupid," GUMP principles...! One tube is better than 2.......Just a mistake... Heat Generation During Fermentation.... >Is there a formula for BTUs given off during >fermentation? from Lonzo....a fella with an inquisitive mind... Will see if I can remember to find out... ;^) but know that some temp un-controlled gasahol palnts in South America generate 100C, post pitching.... Cheers! Gump 515-282-2739 CABCO 515-450-0243 cell "The More I Know About Beer, The More I Realize I Need To Know More About Beer!" New Address- jethrogump at mchsi.com Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 4 Apr 2002 07:30:12 -0500 From: "Mike Dixon" <mpdixon at ipass.net> Subject: Sankey spelling > From: bdk at srl.caltech.edu > > So I am now assuming that these things are Sankey kegs because GKN Sankey > came up with the valve design. Can anybody confirm / deny / shed light > on this? Or on why a company that makes helicopters and auto components > would be designing kegs? This might help clear it up some (get the whole link) http://www.localhistory.scit.wlv.ac.uk/Museum/metalware/sankeys/sankey01.htm So while the correct spelling is most likely Sankey, I still prefer Sanke... Cheers, Mike Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 4 Apr 2002 07:13:00 -0600 From: "Chris Bersted" <ctb967f at smsu.edu> Subject: rye ale questions Several have commented on John's question on rye ale. I frequent a brewpub where they make an interesting rye ale. They use a chocolate rye and dark wheat, amongst other ingredients. The chocolate rye and dark wheat are each less than 10% of the grain bill, and even with about the same amount of flaked oats, the runoff is no problem. Makes a nice roasty brew! Chris in MO Somewhere in Rennarian space Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 4 Apr 2002 09:02:42 -0500 From: "Dan Listermann" <dan at listermann.com> Subject: Rye < "Parker Dutro" <ezekiel128 at edwardwadsworth.com> >Hey John, I would like to brew a rye ale soon too, so I may just graph >myself into your thread, here. The only help I can give is that I believe >to use malted rye would be easier, as you could use it in the mash. >However, it is probably undermodified, meaning only that in order to bring >out the enzyme potential, you would be better off doing a decoction with at >least a protein rest at 122F. I don't know the degree of ryemalt's modification, but when I have used it, it seems to convert faster than barley malt. Rye malt appears to be crawling with enzymes. <If you use flaked rye, (and again, I am only <partially sure of this) you would need to boil it for a bit separately and <then add the whole soupy mix to the mash. Flaked adjuncts are pre gelatinized and do not need boiling. They can be added directly to the mash at striking. Raw adjuncts frequently need boiling depending on the temperature they gelatinize. Dan Listermann Check out our E-tail site at http://www.listermann.com Take a look at the anti-telemarketer forum. It is my new hobby! Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 04 Apr 2002 09:26:56 -0500 From: "Dennis Waltman" <PDWALTMAN at sablaw.com> Subject: Clear Wheat Beers Twice now, my brew partner and I have made wheat beers with as much as 70% non-barley malt (in the case of the Wit it included unmalted wheat, unmalted rye, unmalted oats) only to find in the final pour that we have a clear product, not the hazy item most consider needed for a wheat bear. I know there is German style of clear wheat (krystalweisse?) but these were American wheat and Belgian wit. We didn't add Irish Moss in the boil, or clarifiers of any type in fermenters. In the case of the American Wheat, it was a first runnings batch wheat beer that was fermented at the same time, with the same yeast and temp as a seconds runnings batch (my brew partner and I brew parti-gyle all the time; no sparge) that was split later for the addition of spice and fruit. All beers were bottle conditioned in the same conditioning area. The Spice and Fruit versions are cloudy as expected, yet the American Wheat first runnings is clear. We use a 10 gallon Gott cooler as mash tun; did single step infusion mashes for these beers (decoctions are saved for special beers); and don't sparge. Any ideas what might be happening so I can a) make sure I do that on the beers I want clear (which doesn't always happen) or b) so I can avoid doing it on wheat bears. Thanks for your help, Dennis Waltman - --------------------------------------------------- The information contained in this message from Sutherland Asbill & Brennan LLP and any attachments is confidential and intended only for the named recipient(s). If you have received this message in error, you are prohibited from copying, distributing or using the information. Please contact the sender immediately by return email and delete the original message. Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 4 Apr 2002 06:51:35 -0800 From: "Jon & Megan Sandlin" <sandlin at bendcable.com> Subject: Grain Mill I have put some money aside to purchase a grain mill (finally!) and would like to ask the collective what features I should look for in a grain mill. Any suggest brands/models would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance for your help. Jon Sandlin Bend, OR Return to table of contents
Date: Wed, 03 Apr 2002 22:18:13 -0800 From: Aaron Gallaway <baseball_junkie at hotmail.com> Subject: Chilling CCF For those who remember me HI! I am confused here perhaps. I here everyone pondering on how to chill their CCF's. While I don't have one yet(shipping to here is OUTRAGEOUS) I fully intend to go through TMS and build two 12.2's when I return to The Empire to REpatriate myself next spring. Upon my decision to eventually make brewing a career(I hope) I fully committed myself to the idea of using CCF's. I did as much CYBER homework as I could and found the most reasonable option(If you are gadgtet-oriented) is to go through TMS for a hopper and lid and then modify it locally through somebody willing to subsidize some of the work for homebrew. After making this decision I mulled over the chilling options and it just seemed LOGICAL to me to have to extra "connection" holes cut with nipples of some sort welded facilitate some coiled copper(or if you can afford it stainless) tubing through cold H2O can be pumped. The water can be refrigerated in a small refrigerator in a 3 GAL Corny(I have a bunch) and circulated with a small inexpensive pump. This system would be cheap, clean, easy, and safe if all your connections are tight. To check connections just pump some idophor "brown" solution into a fermenter full of clean water and watch. Now this is TRUELY NOT an attempt to belittle or put anybody down, this PURELY an attempt to find out if I have missed something in my design plans. Thanks any and everybody for your replies. LASTLY, Dion Hollenbeck, Did you get my mail about the completion of my PID gear?? Aaron in Japan(with just under a year to go...) Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 4 Apr 2002 10:38:40 -0500 From: "Houseman, David L" <David.Houseman at unisys.com> Subject: PID Controllers All this talk of PID controllers takes me back to my undergraduate electrical engineering days, way before PIDs BTW. Since then my engineering took new directions and I haven't built such devices since EE 401. I do have a RIMS but the controller was a POS and the company that built it went belly up apparently. So I just control my pump and heater manually at this point. The old saw about draining the swamp and alligators comes to mind when I tell you that I'm not particularly interested in spending my time building a PID controller, but rather to brew, judge, referee and spend time with the kids. Soooo, if any of you who do end up building a fairly generic RIMS controller that would work with a my system, and you'd like to build another for $$, contact me off-list and we can discuss. Dave Houseman Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 04 Apr 2002 10:52:55 -0500 From: Jeff Renner <JeffRenner at comcast.net> Subject: Re: Rye Ale questions "Parker Dutro" <ezekiel128 at edwardwadsworth.com> makes some suggestions for John Misrahi <Lmoukhin at sprint.ca> about rye ale: >The only help I can give is that I believe >to use malted rye would be easier, as you could use it in the mash. I agree that malted rye would probably work better, but not because "you could use it in the mash." Flaked rye starch will gelatinize at mash temperatures. >However, it is probably undermodified, meaning only that in order to bring >out the enzyme potential, you would be better off doing a decoction with at >least a protein rest at 122F. Actually it is well modified, or at least Briess' is. From the Briess page at http://www.briess.com/Products/rm.htm // TYPICAL ANALYTICAL SPECIFICATIONS: Growth 95+ Plump 50 % minimum Thin 8 % maximum Moisture 4.0 +/-0.3 % Extract, f.g., d.b. 76 % minimum Color* 3.5-4.0 L Diastatic Power (Lintner) 20-50 Alpha Amylase, D.U. 22.0-30.0 Total Protein, d.b. 12.5 % S/T Protein 44.0 +/-2.0 % ADVANTAGES: * Rye Malt is used to produce rye beer, called Roggen Bier in Germany. * The malt is fully modified. It performs well in a single temperature infusion mash if used at less than 20 % of total grist. Over 20 %, a slow lautering time may be experienced. * The malt yields a very deep red color and a pronounced rye flavor. APPLICATIONS: * For rye beer, use up to 20% rye malt; however, because of its unusual and pronounced flavor, it is suggested to pilot brew with 5 % increments and gradually increase the amount until the desired flavor is obtained. // The soluble/total protein value of 44% indicates well modified malt. Note the low enzyme levels, BTW, less than even Munich malt. A potential problem is the gums, however. A low rest may help this, but as noted, if you keep the rye malt to under 20%, this should not be a problem. >If you use flaked rye, (and again, I am only >partially sure of this) you would need to boil it for a bit seperately and >then add the whole soupy mix to the mash. Again, the rye starch will gelatinize at mash temperatures, so this separate cereal mash is unnecessary. >This boiling would break down the alpha's and beta's and make the >rye usable to the yeast. Not sure what you mean here. Alpha and beta amylases? Those are in malt, but not in flakes, and boiling will destroy them. Do you mean that it will break down starches and make them available to the yeast? There are no alpha or beta starches, but there are starch chains that alpha amylase will break down into sugars, and others that beta amylase will break down, making them available to yeast. I suspect that this is what you meant. But, again, mash temperatures will do this for rye. Now specifically to John's concern. Since you are going to do a partial mash, it is going to be hard to get much rye into your beer and still keep the portion in your mini-mash to under 20%. I would certainly opt for the rye malt as it is going to be more broken down (especially gums) than flakes. You may want to prepare yourself for a slow runoff or even a stuck mash. Jeff - -- ***Please note my new address*** Jeff Renner in Ann Arbor, Michigan USA, JeffRenner at comcast.net "One never knows, do one?" Fats Waller, American Musician, 1904-1943 Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 04 Apr 2002 10:13:32 -0600 From: "homebrew at alabrew.com" <homebrew at alabrew.com> Subject: hazelnut extract We use a bottle of Hazelnut Liqueur Extract at bottling in our Hazelnut Brown Ale Kit. - -- Kim and Sun Ae Thomson ALABREW Homebrewing Supplies 8916a Parkway East Birmingham, AL 35206 (205) 833-1716 http://www.alabrew.com mailto: homebrew at alabrew.com Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 04 Apr 2002 08:30:07 -0800 From: Denny Conn <denny at projectoneaudio.com> Subject: Re: Rye Ale questions Parker, I use rye quite frequently, mostly in a rye IPA. I use rye malt for that, but I just made the "Hop Rod Rye" recipe from the current issue of Zymurgy, which calls for both flaked and malted rye. With malted rye, I find a single infusion mash to be fine...no protein rest seems to be necessary. For the Hop Rod Rye, I simply added the flaked rye to the mash with everything else. No pre-boiling. Worked great! At 12:23 AM 4/4/02 -0500, Parker Dutro wrote: >Hey John, I would like to brew a rye ale soon too, so I may just grapht >myself into your thread, here. The only help I can give is that I believe >to use malted rye would be easier, as you could use it in the mash. >However, it is probably undermodified, meaning only that in order to bring >out the enzyme potential, you would be better off doing a decoction with at >least a protein rest at 122F. If you use flaked rye, (and again, I am only >partially sure of this) you would need to boil it for a bit seperately and >then add the whole soupy mix to the mash. This boiling would break down the >alpha's and beta's and make the rye usable to the yeast. You would want to >be careful and monitor the temp. and add it to the mash when it's the same >temp. as the mash. This may be simpler than decoction. Hope this sheds >some light. >Parker Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 04 Apr 2002 11:48:51 -0500 From: Phil Wilcox <pjwilcox at cmsenergy.com> Subject: Hazelnut Niel, I played with this back in 96' for my first all-grain batch. The Parkers used the 1 oz T-Nior Hazelnut flavoring extract you can get at homebrew shops. And they used TWO bottles in a 5 gal batch. I Found this to be WAY to much. So I set about as scientifically as possible doping 2 oz samples of Newcastle brown ale with a diluted solution of extract from a graduated pipette. I eventually found a level that 4 out of 5 people in the room and enjoyed. I then started cranking out the numbers. 45 min. later it came out to EXACTLY one ounce. 3 hours of painstaking maticulas work only to confirm my original suspicion that Half of what they used would be fine... Eh. Bien! Included below is what I found in my files. Somewhere I had more info because I tracked down one of the brewers from Sam Adams through a contact in the Boston Wort Processors and had a good phone conversation with him about it. You might be able to search the HBD archievs of 1996 for more of results... Phil Wilcox "Recently, Greg Moore asked for the Long Shot Hazelnut recipe. I have the hazelnut recipe right here from the bottom of the 6 pack, and it is an inspiring, wonderfull beer. This is it verbatum: Longshot Hazelnut - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Ingredients for 5 Gallons 9# Pale malt 8 oz. Munich malt 7 oz. Caramel malt 4 oz. Chocolate malt 3 oz. Victory malt 4 oz. Carapils malt 2 oz. Fuggles hops .5 teaspoon Gypsum added to mash Ale yeast (1056?) Procedure: Mash in at 155'F, rest for one hour. Sparge and fill kettle. Boil 90 minutes adding hops as follows: At kettle full: 1.5 oz. At KF + 85 mins: .5 oz. Cool to 65' F and pitch ale yeast Ferment at 65 - 70'F Add hazelnut flavoring before bottling - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - I've heard that this is a recipe that the Boston Wort Processors (HB Club) have made and is not exactly the real deal. I'd imagine it would be close though. My questions are What yeast? Wyeast 1056? Also, where do you get hazelnut flavoring?????? Frogshot Hazelnut Batch number:1 Batch size: 5.3 Brewer: Phil Wilcox Style: Brown Ale Date Gravity Plato Brewing: 11/29/96 1.041 10.2 Racking: Bottling: Alcohol: 0.0% (w/w) Alcohol: 0.0% (v/v) Batchprice:$15.19 Bottle price: $0.27 Ingredients: 2 Row 9.3 pounds 1.03 S.G. 3.5 RM 60 min mash $9. 0 Victory 3.4 ounces 1.00 S.G. 1.0 RM 60 min mash $0. 1 Munich 1.0 pounds 1.00 S.G. 1.0 RM 60 min mash $1. 0 Cara Pils 2.9 ounces 1.001 S.G. 0.1 SRM 60 min mash $0.18 Chocolate 0.5 pounds 1.000 S.G. 37.7 SRM 60 min mash $0.00 Extraction efficiency: 56 % Boil size: 6.5 Gallons Fermentation Primary fermentation: Secondary Fermentation: Primed with: PURE CO2!!!!! Force Carbonated, Counterpressure Bottled Filled Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 04 Apr 2002 15:23:08 -0500 From: Spencer W Thomas <spencer at engin.umich.edu> Subject: Re: Where to buy beer online Besides the places mentioned by a couple of others, the realbeer.com "rare beer store" has some interesting beers that you may not be able to find locally. They're a bit pricy, but as a member of two of their three clubs ("Real Beer Tour" and "Great Beers of Belgium") I can honestly say that I've never had a bad beer from them. (My only connection is as a satisfied customer.) They have made arrangements to ship beer legally to a bunch of states (most of the beers listed on the site have a list of states to which they can ship it, usually AZ, CA, CO, CT, FL, IL, IN, MI, MO, NJ, NM, NY, VA, WI, and WA). One consequence of this arrangement is that they ship the beer once per month, so you may have to wait a while to get what you order. If you're looking to expand your beer horizons, you could do much worse than subscribing to their new "Beer Club International." This club gives you, each month, 4 bottles of the "Real Beer Tour" beer, 4 bottles of the "Great Beers of Belgium" beer, and 2 bottles each of the two "American Brewpub Club" beers. It's a bit pricy at $40 per month, but if you consider all the traveling you'd have to do to find some of these beers, it's cheap. :-) :-) Good luck in your beer hunting! =Spencer Thomas in Ann Arbor, MI (spencer at umich.edu) Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 04 Apr 2002 16:29:40 -0500 From: Phil Wilcox <pjwilcox at cmsenergy.com> Subject: Re: Sankey kegs BDK asks "Or on why a company that makes helicopters and auto components would be designing kegs?" Did'nt bob klein answer that question with a stunning piece of beer trivia from February 11th? Some Airforce General paided someone some money to invent kegs for clear beer? ;<) Phil Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 4 Apr 2002 13:54:56 -0800 From: "Hedglin, Nils A" <nils.a.hedglin at intel.com> Subject: Saving Yeast Hi all, Is there a way to save the yeast left over after a batch is done? It seems that the yeast is one of the single most expesive parts of a batch. I know you can start another batch on top of the yeast from a batch that's just finished & I've done that before. But I don't brew frequently enough to have batches queued up like that (yes, I know, I'm a slacker). I'm not interested in making yeast slants or anything like that. I'd like to be able to collect some of the yeast as I'm dumping out the carboy & save it for a month or two. Is something like that possible? I'd assume it would need to be refrigerated. Would keeping it in a near vacuum help? I have one of those food vacuum sealers. Thanks, Nils Hedglin Sacramento, CA Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 4 Apr 2002 17:17:32 -0500 From: RiedelD at pac.dfo-mpo.gc.ca Subject: Pilsner plans I plan to make a batch of Czech Pils mid-month. I will be using Beeston's Chariot Pils for the base malt. Does anyone have any thoughts on a good mash schedule? My initial plan was to mash in at 104F, pull a decoction, convert it at 158F, meanwhile raise the main mash to 140F (hold for about 15') then use the single decoction to raise the temperature from 140F to around 152F for conversion. However, I'm not certain that decocting is worth the effort. Anyone have a good Pils method? Cheers, Dave Victoria, Can. Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 4 Apr 2002 16:31:42 -0600 From: "Galen Brelie" <gmbaaa at ncis.com> Subject: Povidone/Iodine Solution I have recently come across several gallons of a Povidone/Iodine solution and am wondering if this would be OK to use for sanitizing purposes. According to the label it is intended for use as a wound disinfection and surgical preparation product. The price is right (free) and I hate to see it go to waste if it is usable; but if not appropriate for use as a brewing sanitizer I would pass. I currently use and like Iodophor sanitizer and use it for all my equipment; plastic fermenter, carboys, plastic tubing, airlocks, bottles and caps, etc. The label of this product is as follows: 10% Povidone/Iodine solution 1% available Iodine Water soluble Non-irritating Film forming Non-staining to skin and natural fabrics If anybody has any information or experience with such a product I would appreciate very much your input. Is this OK as a sanitizer? If yes, at what dilution or concentration should it be used? Would rinsing be advised? Any other coments? Thanks very much in advance for your help. Galen Brelie Mora, MN Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 4 Apr 2002 16:21:36 -0800 (PST) From: "Scott D. Braker-Abene" <skotrat at yahoo.com> Subject: Schlitz Porter Recipe hmmm, Bueller??? Bueller??? This beer has not been brewed for a long time. Anybody have any information? Thanks -Skotrat ===== "It's Mister Mischief with a trick up his sleeve... Roll up on you like Christopher Reeves" -D12 http://www.skotrat.com/skotrat - Skotrats Beer Page http://www.brewrats.org - BrewRats HomeBrew Club Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 4 Apr 2002 19:52:18 -0500 From: Jeff & Ellen <JeffNGladish at ij.net> Subject: Rye APA I have made several batches of rye ale, using a good recipe for an American Pale Ale and substituting a portion of the pale malt with flaked rye. Although I have not had any problems, some other area homebrewers have had difficulty with stuck sparges. It does tend to make the mash very gummy. I sparge very slowly and use more water in the mash than in my normal APA recipe. I have increased the portion of flaked rye over the last three batches to 21% to maximize the rye flavor. It provides a nice spiciness. Added directly to the mash without any pre-boiling, it produces about the same efficiency as pale malt in my system. One thing I've noticed is that it tends to soften the perception of hop bitterness in the finished beer. I've had to increase the kettle hop additions to compensate for the increase in rye. I'd be happy to share the recipe. Jeff Gladish, Tampa, FL Return to table of contents
Date: Thu, 4 Apr 2002 18:13:46 -0800 (PST) From: Ronald La Borde <pivoron at yahoo.com> Subject: Re: RIMS temperature control >From: mailto:hollen at woodsprite.com > >..Also, I laid out the circuit board to only >handle 15 amps on the existing traces, so even if I >went out and got a >larger triac that would fit the footprint on the PC >board, it may just >vaporize the traces the first time it turned on... True, but you can solder some large gauge copper wire directly across the traces, which will conduct the current and allow the board to be used. The larger gauge wire should have a lower resistance than the trace and will take up the largest share of the current. Just be sure to make good solder connections and use heavy wire, about number 12 copper will handle the 25 amps. Or, you can just cut the original trace, and use the heavy wire alone. ===== Ron Ronald J. La Borde -- Metairie, LA New Orleans is the suberb of Metairie, LA www.hbd.org/rlaborde Return to table of contents
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