HOMEBREW Digest #4078 Mon 28 October 2002

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  Scottish Yeast...more (darrell.leavitt)
  Water chemistry question (David Towson)
  Beer in Niagara Falls ("Ed Dorn")
  RE: Secondary fermentation (Kevin Crouch)
  RE: 2 questions..Belgian Abby / Candi Sugar (Kevin Crouch)
  Re: Bottle Labels or Label Glue for Home Brew ("Jonathan Royce")
  Re: Bottle Labels or Label Glue for Home Brew ("Dave and Joan King")
  Re: Water heater element for RIMS (Dion Hollenbeck)
  label glue (carlos benitez)
  Turkey fryer cleanup (Audie Kennedy)
  RE:Bottle Labels or Label Glue for Home Brew (Rob Hanson and Kate Keplinger)
  RE: Bottle labels or Label glue ("Doug Hurst")

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---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2002 08:02:25 -0400 From: darrell.leavitt at plattsburgh.edu Subject: Scottish Yeast...more there were several personal mail messages to me regarding my questions about the WLP028 Edinburgh yeast...but I can report that the taste has subsided a good deal, and I personally think that there was a good deal of yeast left suspended and that that was what (in part) I was tasting. Peter E, from Syracuse, may wish to add his observations...sorry Peter, but I don't have them.,...but they seemed to make sense to me as well... Sorry to not have more definitive answers..... I reused this yeast in a darker brew, then again in a Christmas ale (the spices may hide the flavor...if it is still there) and I will report the flavors here, as best I can...with my untrained, and absolutely amateur and subjective pallate and perspective/s... ..Darrell Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2002 10:33:57 -0400 From: David Towson <dtowson at comcast.net> Subject: Water chemistry question As I prepared to brew a pale ale this morning, I measured the pH of my mash and sparge water, and noted a significant difference prior to adjustment. The mash water measured 6.8 while the sparge water measured 7.8. Measurements were made using a Hanna "Piccolo" meter. Both vessels were filled from the same water source within minutes of each other, and the water in both was pre-boiled last night. The water here has enough calcium carbonate in it to leave a good scum on the side of a vessel in which it is boiled. The main difference I can see between the mash and sparge vessels is that the latter has a 47-foot HERMS coil in it made of 1/2-inch copper tubing. Both vessels are stainless steel. Would the presence of the copper coil account for the higher pH of the sparge water? If not, what then? Perhaps I didn't boil the sparge water hard enough to drop out the chalk? Dave in Bel Air, MD Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2002 11:21:03 -0400 From: "Ed Dorn" <edorn at cox.net> Subject: Beer in Niagara Falls My wife and I will be visiting Niagara Falls next weekend. Where's the good beer? Thanks in advance for any advice. Ed Dorn, Va Beach, VA Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2002 08:42:01 -0700 (PDT) From: Kevin Crouch <kcrouching at yahoo.com> Subject: RE: Secondary fermentation On the following points that Graham makes... >>primary fermentation is an expression that generally refers >>to the process of fermenting wort to a desired final or >>finishing gravity. At this point, you often have to do >>something to stop fermentation. Commercially,this is >>generally done by cooling the fermenting wort to about 12C >>over a period of about 30 hours or more. >>thepurpose of Secondary Fermentation is only to produce >>Condition and not, perse, to drop the gravity of the beer any >>more than necessary Graham, yes, your explanation is quite different than most homebrew books present it, but then again, we are talking about homebrewing, a pursuit in which few of us have consistent control over the variables that might allow a fermentation schedule as you have suggested. In addition, as you stated, some yeasts behave quite differently than others, and we often use a different yeast for every batch. All of these factors combine to make such a discreet schedule as you have suggested more of a fantasy than a reality. I mean not to say that we can't, or shouldn't attempt to acheive such a sweet fermentation, but my experiences over the last 10 years support most of the homebrewing texts that I've read regarding fermentation on a small scale. In my reading of homebrew texts, one point seems fairly well addressed with regard to the typical homebrewing system. The SECONDARY fermentation in homebrewing serves 2 purposes; it removes the beer from the trub sediment after the vigorous primary has subsided, and allows for full completion of the ferment before the beer is sealed in glass bottles. This is necessary for *most* homebrewers because we often don't have a sound means of removing the wort from the break in the kettle, and bottle conditioning is normally done by adding a measure of priming sugar rather than simply letting the residual dextrins contribute to beer conditioning. Unless the beer is fully attenuated, or drunk quickly, overcarbonation is highly probable. Even if one can produce a wort with a minimum of break and other sediments in the fermentor, the homebrewer might choose to "drop" his or her beer if a good blowoff is not achieved, or if head skimming is not an option, as in a closed glass fermentation. Dropping is the practice of siphoning the beer from beneath the head, which contains those nasy hop-headache resins and other fermentation by-products that are more desirable in a drain than in a glass. Dropping is usually executed just as the primary starts to slow, before the head subsides, at around 2/3 attenuation. Unless I'm mistaken, The stage of fermenation after dropping and before bottling, kegging, or casking, can be called a secondary as well. In my experience, this usually lasts anywhere from 5 - 10 days, again, because there are forces at work in my small system and with my yeast that I don't yet truly control or understand, nor will I ever in all likelihood. Kevin Crouch Vancouver, WA Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2002 09:34:45 -0700 (PDT) From: Kevin Crouch <kcrouching at yahoo.com> Subject: RE: 2 questions..Belgian Abby / Candi Sugar "greg man" is diving into Abbey brewing head-first. >>First what was the answer given to the guy about the 028 white labs >>yeast? He was saying something about the flavor produced being earthy? I have used this yeast quite a bit and never considered it earthy. It behaved poorly once when I accidentally raised the temperature 10 degrees on it (55-65) rather quickly, and gave off some pretty undesireable higher alcohols. >>I know It doesn't ferment well below 62'f which is strange for an >>authentic >>Scottish style yeast? They usually like the colder temps... I have experienced slow, but steady fermentations down to 58 degrees with this yeast, assuming a healthy starter, as usual. It was pretty alcohol tolerant too, fermenting nicely from 1070 to 1018 or so. >>Second an this is the tough one, Can you add sugar to a secondary >>fermenter? You can do anything you want, as long as your yeast isn't sick. I brewed a Double style abby or trapist 2 weeks ago this was it...... All grain Belgian DWC 10 lbs pilsner malt 1 lb aromatic malt 1/4lb special B 1 lb light candy sugar >>(should have used dark candy sugar) But I was wondering could I do that now? After the >>beers been fermenting? Would I have to add more yeast? {I culture so that's a >>possibility} ;) That's great that you have the ability to culture fresh yeast, but I'm not so sure this will get you anywhere. Dark Candi sugar works well in the kettle with a high-gravity boil to promote the maillard reaction that darkens your wort, but I don't think it has sufficient color to darken it now. I say just enjoy the beer as is right now without ruining it, maybe call it a "Special", yeah that's the ticket. Some tips for next time would be to reduce the percentage of pilsener malt and add more Munich malt. This is pretty much your call, but you can go from 50 - 100% munich, especially the Belgian Munich at 8 L. The Special B is probably about right, but I am on the wary side when it comes to any type of crystal malt. >>my beer came out with >>an intense caramel flavor which is wonderful (dec.)an from the special b I >>think, However in most of what is written about abby's I have found >>that the majority say the special b provides that raisin, plum flavor in the >>beers an not the yeast? >>But This beer did not have those flavors, an so perhaps the dark candy sugar >>will do it?, I'll let you know.One writer said special B can be over used, so i only put in a >>1/4 lb? Maybe if you use more you'll get that flavor that i'm looking for......(plumy >>ness) I feel your pride in creating a rich, caramelly abbey ale, but you should be a bit wary about assuming that one ingredient, such as Special B, will create that certain flavor on it's own. This might be true about some flavoring adjuncts, but with most ingredients, brewing with them is more akin to sorcery than to a simple flavor infusion. It is the combination of the grains, the water, the yeast, and the hops brewed in a certain way, fermented in a certain way, and handled a certain way that work together to create the flavors we love. Kevin Crouch Vancouver, WA Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2002 13:30:27 -0400 From: "Jonathan Royce" <jtroyce at directvinternet.com> Subject: Re: Bottle Labels or Label Glue for Home Brew Paul Romanowsky asks: "...has anyone found a good glue/adhesive that when used on home printed labels on plain paper will allow easy removal of labels?" Yes. I use wheat paste, which is a tip that I found while reading through the hbd archives one slow day at work. Here is the recipe that I use: Wheat paste Prepare 1 cup (2.4 dl) of very hot water. Make a thin mixture of 3 tablespoons (45 ml) of white flour and cold water. Pour the cold mixture slowly into the hot water while stirring constantly. Bring to a boil. When it thickens, allow to cool. Smear on like any other glue. For slightly better strength, add 1 tablespoon (15 ml) of sugar after the glue is thickened. After using a portion, reheat the remaining in a covered jar or container to sterilize it for storage or keep refrigerated. If wheat flour is not available, other flours will work. As for stock, I print labels on an inkjet on a master sheet, then photocopy the master because toner won't run like ink. When I do color labels, I bring the master sheet to Staples and have color photocopies made, but this is expensive ($1.09/8 labels) and I only do it for special beers (like this year's Xmas beer). I find that regular photocopy paper is OK, but it tends to disintegrate after soaking, which sometimes require careful rinsing. A slightly better option (but again, more expensive) is the heavy weight inkjet paper that companies like HP market. I guess it is about twice as thick as regular copy paper, and it definitely holds together better when soaking wet. As for application, after I make up the paste, I use a regular rubber spatula. I've found this to be the fastest method and it provides a very uniform coating of the paste. Well, that's probably more than you bargained for, but I hope you find it helpful. Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2002 13:38:44 -0400 From: "Dave and Joan King" <dking3 at stny.rr.com> Subject: Re: Bottle Labels or Label Glue for Home Brew I make bottle labels on my PC, and apply them with diluted plain old white paper glue (Elmer's or similar), cut about 50% with tap water, then use an old tooth brush to apply it, just enough to barely get it wet. It dries quickly, and a short soak gets them off. The only down side is that you can't put the bottles in a cooler with ice, and get them wet, but then my printer's ink will run, too. Dave the Hop Head (BIER) [396.1, 89.1] Apparent Rennerian Return to table of contents
Date: 26 Oct 2002 11:32:06 -0700 From: Dion Hollenbeck <hollen at woodsprite.com> Subject: Re: Water heater element for RIMS >> Scott writes: Scott> Hello! I just acquired 5 water heater elements new, 4500W at Scott> 240V, but the element is not doubled over. The total length of Scott> the u shaped element (if it were straightened out), is 22", or Scott> in other words the overall element length is 11" Scott> Question is will this be ok to use for RIMS? Should I be Scott> concerned about scorching my wort? Scott> The tag indicates Incoloy.....suitable for RIMS? As far as the alloy is concerned, yes, absolutely suitable. These are the ones I would recommend. However, your final watt density is going to come out about 3 times higher than I would recommend. If anyone out there has used watt densities higher than 15 watts per sq. in. please chime in. I would love to see how far the envelopy can be pushed without scorching. However, I like to stay on the safe side and stay with somewhere around 1500 wpsi. Here are the calculations for your element : Heater Element Watt Density Calculations Ovarall Length (inches) 22 Number of Folds 1 (one loop = 1) Element Diameter (dec inches) 0.3750 Watts at 240v 4500 Calculated Watts at 120V 1125 Calc. Cross sectional area 1.178097 Calculated Area 25.91814 Calculated watt density in watts per sq. in 43.40589 regards, dion - -- Dion Hollenbeck Email: hollen at woodsprite.com Home Page: http://www.woodsprite.com Brewing Page: http://hbd.org/hollen Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2002 12:10:30 -0700 (PDT) From: carlos benitez <greenmonsterbrewing at yahoo.com> Subject: label glue HI All! Paul Romanowsky is searching for the perfect glue - I have found my 6 year old's glue sticks from school are fantastic - I print out a page full of labels on any old paper (colors are nice!) then I cut them out with corrugated scisors from the craft store (DO NOT USE SWMBO'S PINKING SHEARS - that is one surefire way to p/o the wife!!!) this leaves a fancy edge to the labels - then I use a glue stick on the back and try to line it up on the bottles so it is straight (no sampling the brew prior to attempting this...) these stay on well and come off with rinsing or very slight soaking - good luck! ===== BIBIDI ! Brew It Bottle It Drink It Carlos Benitez - Green Monster Brewing Bainbridge, PA, U.S.A. Return to table of contents
Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2002 17:50:17 -0700 (PDT) From: Audie Kennedy <audie_24293 at yahoo.com> Subject: Turkey fryer cleanup I just bought one of those turkey deep-fryers with a 32 qt. kettle. For the time being, it will have to double as a brewpot/deep fryer. I am concerned about getting all of the oil out of it before I brew. Has anyone else been using one for both? How have you cleaned the pot? I know it would be better to have a dedicated brewpot, but I don't for now, and have been brewing for quite some time in a 3 gallon and 5 gallon enamel "canning" pots, using both, so the fryer pot is an improvement in that respect. Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 15:33:26 -0400 From: Rob Hanson and Kate Keplinger <katerob at erols.com> Subject: RE:Bottle Labels or Label Glue for Home Brew Paul, I make a lot of labels for special beers, and my favorite method is to print the label on my inkjet in a sheet of 5-9 (depending on bottle size), take them to my local Kinko's and use the self-serve color copier (I've found that the money-taker doesn't distinguish well between 8.5"x11" and 11"x17" paper...sshhhh...), cut the copied sheets into individual labels, and adhere to bottles with any old glue stick. They come off easily under warm water (but don't preserve well with this method -- save one or two from the copier job for framing), and are of equivalent water-resistancy to laser printed stuff. Hope this helps. - --Rob Hanson the Closet Brewery Cheverly, MD 'post tenebras lux' - ------- He that drinks strong beer and goes to bed mellow, Lives as he outhg to live and dies a hearty fellow. - 17th c English drinking song Return to table of contents
Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 21:46:49 -0600 From: "Doug Hurst" <DougH at theshowdept.com> Subject: RE: Bottle labels or Label glue Paul writes: "Has anyone found a real good source for label stock, that when used to create home printed labels for beer bottles, will come off easily when soaked?? Or has anyone found a good glue/adhesive that when used on home printed labels on plain paper will allow easy removal of labels." I occasionally make labels for gift beers. I print them on heavy white paper with an ink jet printer. The best adhesive I've found is glue stick. It's a pasty type of paper glue which comes in a cylindrical container. A few wipes of glue stick on the back of the label and they stick to the bottle quite well. They come off after about a ten second soak in water. I have noticed that the labels do fall off if the bottles are stored for a long time (>6months) in the refrigerator, but for most purposes glue stick works great. Hope this helps, Doug Hurst Chicago, IL Return to table of contents
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