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	FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
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Contents:
  Speed of Sound in CO2 (Andrew Nix)
  Re: two things ("greg man")
  Setting the grain bed ("Steve Alexander")
  re: HSA and batch sparging ("Steve Alexander")
  re: Speed of Sound in CO2 ("Steve Alexander")
  RIMS water heater element grounding ("Lou King")
  temperature (tun) (Darrell.Leavitt)
  Competition Ethics... (Bev Blackwood II)
  RE:The Ethics of Homebrew Competition ("Sven Pfitt")
  Re:  Relax and have a homebrew ("Dennis Collins")
  Are we mice or men (Sean McDonald)
  RE: Best Vacuum Sealers and Digital Scales (Kevin McDonough)
  re: DCL, the MoB and the number 42 ("Drew Avis")
  Temperature variability in mash ("Bill Frazier")
  The Ethics of Homebrew Competition? ("Dennis Collins")
  Chest Freezer Drilling (hollen)
  Moving Brews or Pump Part (Tony Verhulst)
  Competition Ethics ("Eric R. Theiner")
  Update: "No Krausen" ("Ian Watson")
  Removing Organic Deposits from Plastic Parts ("Martin Brungard")
  Home made mill (espels06.consultant)
  Water ("Ian Watson")
  re:speed of sound in co2 ("Jerry Barkley")
  Here we go again... (Pat Babcock)


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Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2003 00:22:33 -0500
From: Andrew Nix <anix at vt.edu>
Subject: Speed of Sound in CO2

Darwin,

This looks correct to me.  The value of R for CO2 is 0.1889 KJ/KG-K.  Gamma 
at low temperature in the range we use CO2 is 1.289.

So the speed of sound in CO2 by my calcs is 15.604*sqrt(T(K)) m/s, very 
close to what you got.  By the way, the constant gamma is called the 
specific heat ratio (Cp/Cv).  I've never heard it called the "adiabatic 
constant", but that doesn't mean you aren't correct in this terminology.

As for the dependence on pressure.  CO2 is an "ideal gas", so the specific 
heats (Cp and Cv) are a function of gas temperature only.  Since both R and 
gamma are both functions of the specific heats (gamma=Cp/Cv and R=Cp-Cv), 
then the speed of sound is dependent only on temperature, except at very 
low vacuum pressures where CO2 may no longer be assumed to be an ideal gas.

Now the question is, why on Earth are you trying to calculate the speed of 
sound in CO2 (LOL).

Andrew Nix
Research Associate
Transonic Turbine Cascade Heat Transfer Group
Department of Mechanical Engineering
Virginia Tech
100B Randolph Hall
(540) 231-6939



Return to table of contents


Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2003 00:57:57 -0500
From: "greg man" <dropthebeer at hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: two things


1st a curios question that will no doubt be hard to answer. Where do you 
suppose the first yeast came from? I believe that yeast is classified as a 
fungi, right? So does that mean the first brewers threw in different 
mushrooms to the wort in order to ferment? Which leads me to another 
question. How many people do you suppose died tying that first beer made 
with poison mushrooms? How many times would you have to do that until they 
found a no-toxic mushroom? ok that's just silly but really does any body 
know? I have read that the family's passed down magic barrels, or paddles? 
But where do you suppose it started with all these different strains we 
have..............hmmmmmmmmm

2nd here's a greg blooper that worked out in my favor. I was brewing an 
october-fest when at the end I got kind of lazy an did'nt clean my funnel. 
Well I figured that after the whirl-pool that most of the hops an break 
would stay in the center of the pot. Big mistake!!
I would guess about a 1/4 of an ounce of whole hop cones got sucked right 
into the glass fermenter. I thought to my self how much harm could they 
really do? Well surprisingly enough while my beer weighed in at 1.056 an was 
only hopped at 22 IBU's, an one bittering addition.
The beer came out with this power full hop aroma an flavor. It's almost over 
powering because sazz was chosen as I was thinking it would be something "a 
little different".
The beer is really good but not what I had planned........I wondered has 
anyone ever experienced this phenomenon before? I was thinking for my next 
bitter I would only have to use about 1/2 ounce in the fermenter to get a 
flavor an aroma addition with out (the according to normal calculations) 
what would be like 1.5-2 ounce hop additions at 30 an knock out.

Brewing this week end an I just can't wait...................gregman










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Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 01:59:56 -0500
From: "Steve Alexander" <steve-alexander at worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Setting the grain bed

Bill Tobler says ...,

>Hi everyone.  I've been having a discussion offline with a friend on
>building a HERMS and how we brew in general.  The question came up on
>whether it was wise to circulate the grain bed before the scarification
rest
>was finished.

Personally I'd separate brewing and scarification rituals altogether.

As for when to recirculate ... there is a difference between a continuously
recirculated  system (typical of many RIMS designs) and an unrecirculated
false bottom system.   Under a FB you only get a little enzyme and starch
diffusion and activity.

>If you compact the grain bed early on, how does this allow for adequate
>water/grist ratio. I know the same amount of water is in the mash but I
>can't see where the enzymes have the freedom to do their job correctly.

Misconception there.   The grist bed is NOT the hub of enzyme activity in
the mash !  The enzymes and some (abt 30% of normal extraction) starch
immediately get extracted dissolved, suspended into the 1st wort.    The
remaining 70% of the starch granules get out pretty fast (minutes) with a
minor amount of enzyme activity - mostly alpha-amylase, proteinases and some
of the glucanases.  The main event in mashing is the extraction of starch
from the granules which are substantially in suspension and the conversion
of the starch to dextrins and sugars. This happens primarily in the 1st
wort, not the grist bed.

Beta-amylase(BA) is always in short supply and is mostly responsible for
increased fermentability, but target non-reducing ends that BA will act on
are mostly in suspension, not in the grits bed.

If you recirculate then the enzymes & suspended starch are roughly evenly
mixed.  If you use a false-bottom and don't recirc, then only little of the
starch & enzymes make their way under the plate and you have more dilute
conditions and slower hydrolysis there.  Stirring will help but the FB plate
is still a restriction.

I was always concerned that the shear forces of the pump would denature
enzymes and so you might not want to pump so actively.   RIMSers have
demonstrated that this is not a problem.

>Having a hard time
>sleeping tonight, got sunburned at the golf course today. :>)

Where you live Bill it's lucky you didn't get a hydrazine burn at the golf
course !

 -S



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Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 02:20:38 -0500
From: "Steve Alexander" <steve-alexander at worldnet.att.net>
Subject: re: HSA and batch sparging

Michael Grice  asks,

>While obviously skipping sparging would reduce the number of fatty acids
>extracted, what effect do you suppose batch sparging would have on
>extraction of fatty acids?

Batch vs continuous ?   Hard to say.   Pressings are very high in lipids as
are last runnings form large commercial lauters.    Perhaps batch is
inferior to continuous in this regard, or perhaps it makes little difference
in small HB sized lauters.

Dunno !
 -S



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Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 03:33:44 -0500
From: "Steve Alexander" <steve-alexander at worldnet.att.net>
Subject: re: Speed of Sound in CO2

Darwin Airola" asks ...,

>I am trying to determine the speed of sound in the CO2 gas of a beer keg
>versus the pressure of the gas. Does anyone known how to go about this?

Yeah ..

>The equation that I was going to use was square root of the adiabatic
>gas constant (gamma) times the gas constant (R) times the absolute
>temperature (T) divided the molecular mass of the gas. Thus, if the
>adiabatic constant of CO2 is 1.3, to calculate the speed of sound in the
>CO2 gas of a beer keg, I would use the following equation:
>
>v = sqrt( gamma * R * T / M ) = sqrt( 1.3 * 8.314 J/mol-K * T / 0.043999
>kg/mol ) = 15.673 * sqrt(T) m/s
>
>Does this analysis seem correct? Is the only dependence of the speed of
>sound upon temperature (with no need to directly consider the pressure
>that the CO2 in the keg is under)?

Well the velocity of sound should equal ..

v = sqrt( gamma * gas pressure / gas density) and that's equal to
v = sqrt( gamma * k * T / m) [ boltzmann const and molecular mass]
v = sqrt(gamma * R*T/ M)  [ gas const and molar mass ]

It's 259 m/sec at 0C according to tables, and that's what I calculate too.

>Does this analysis seem correct? Is the only dependence of the speed of
>sound upon temperature (with no need to directly consider the pressure
>that the CO2 in the keg is under)?

Yes, your eqn works until the mean free path of the molecules get to the
same order as the wavelength (frequency & pressure dependent) , then you
must start considering heat flow as the adiabatic rule breaks down.

Basically the eqn says that speed of sound is sqrt(gamma) times greater than
the RMS molecular velocity.

So what's it got to do with beer ?   Gonna measure the headspace gases by
reflectometry or something ?

 -S



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Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 05:26:31 -0500
From: "Lou King" <lking at pobox.com>
Subject: RIMS water heater element grounding

I continue to build my RIMS system, and am reaching the home stretch.
One question I have is: how do I ground my water heater element?

Should I solder something onto the hex edge, which normally screws into
the water heater, and put a ground screw into that?

I would just ground the heater chamber itself, but there is a need to
use teflon tape to keep the wort from leaking out the bushings, etc, so
it isn't all electrically connected to the male threads of the water
heater element.

Everything else within the control box will be grounded together to the
house ground.

Lou King
Ijamsville, MD



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Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 07:31:14 -0500
From: Darrell.Leavitt at esc.edu
Subject: temperature (tun)

Ross Potter <BurningBrite at charter.net>  speaks of temperature questions in
conversion.

  I am not sure about the floating thermometer issue/s in that I ditched
  mine forever when I
broke it into the mash and had to toss the whole batch out..

 But I too have noticed temperature gradients.  I use a Polarware 10 gal
  mash/lauter tun,
which has the analogue thermometer connected.  Well, I used to just judge
 the temp
from that point, until I noticed that a digital thermometer with probe
revealed
  as much
as 10 degree differential throughout the mash...IF I did not keep mixing it
up.

So my question is: have others found a similar differential in mash
temperature
, ie
temperature gradients, and how often do you mix the mash?

 ..Darrell






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Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 06:50:49 -0600
From: Bev Blackwood II <bdb2 at bdb2.com>
Subject: Competition Ethics...

> Am I in a minority when I think the entry should be
> original and not from, say, Clonebrews?  Why or why
> not?

I believe you are.  I share all my recipes, since no other person brews 
(or abuses) their beer the same way I do.  I have also heard this 
argument from our local microbrewery.  They willingly share their 
recipes for their beer.  They have the added advantage of "house" 
yeast, which further insulates them from having their beer cloned.  
Yes, I formulate my own recipes.  I also try to re-brew them and am 
often amused at how close I can come, but will any one ever be the 
exact duplicate of the last?  Not a chance.  Thus every beer of mine, 
whether I have brewed it before or not, I consider to be unique.  That 
difference can only increase as another brewer adds his methods to the 
mix.

 -BDB2

Bev D. Blackwood II
http://www.bdb2.com



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Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2003 08:32:43 -0500
From: "Sven Pfitt" <the_gimp98 at hotmail.com>
Subject: RE:The Ethics of Homebrew Competition

Greg ponders Comp Entries:

>Ok, first off a little background information...  I
>entered my first homebrew competition last July.  I
>was only in my 4th month of homebrewing when I decided
>to give the competition a shot and I started brewing 2
>months before the final entry date. Needless to say, I
>didn't have a lot of batches under my belt.
>
>When it came time to pick a recipe, it just seemed
>wrong to me to choose one that I got from a book,
>magazine, internet, etc. and I decided to make one up
>- probably not the best idea due to lack of
>experience.  I did it anyway.
 .... snip .....
>Am I in a minority when I think the entry should be
>original and not from, say, Clonebrews?  Why or why
>not?

When YOU brew it, it is YOUR beer.
Enter it.

Steven, -75 XLCH- Ironhead Nano-Brewery  http://thegimp.8k.com
Johnson City, TN [422.7, 169.2] Rennerian

"Fools you are... who say you like to learn from your mistakes.... I prefer 
to learn from the mistakes of others and avoid the cost of my own." Otto von 
Bismarck






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Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 09:50:58 -0500
From: "Dennis Collins" <dcollins at drain-all.com>
Subject: Re:  Relax and have a homebrew

We've all been where Dave Larsen was in his Keystone Cops debacle with his
keg.  Those are always good to read once in a while so that we can all relax
and realize we are not alone in the world of "stupid brewer tricks".  No
offense Dave.  That story was hilarious.  Some day I'll recount my story why
it's a good idea to put the "out" hose on your keg connector before putting
it on a pressurized keg of Porter in your church clothes.

But - when Dave said he wanted to look to see how much beer was left in his
keg and went to the trouble of removing the lid - which gave rise to the
funniest part of his story - I was reminded of something I discovered rather
serendipitously.  If you take a chilled keg and set it out at room temp for
about 5 minutes, condensation will form on the outside surface of the keg
where the liquid is in contact with the metal and form a very distinct line
where the liquid level is.  Just a thought to pass on.....

Dennis Collins
Knoxville, TN
http://sdcollins.home.mindspring.com

"In theory, theory and practice are the same, but not in practice".




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Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2003 09:08:58 -0600
From: Sean McDonald <seanmc at irga.com>
Subject: Are we mice or men

Not sure about the gentleman Mr. Kolb is referring too (I'm guessing
that he want's to stay HAPPILY married), but judging from the sound of
Mr. Kolb's situation (i.e. divorced twice), I don't believe he has any
pants left to wear.

Happy brewing,
Sean McDonald





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Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2003 10:08:29 -0500
From: Kevin McDonough <kmcdonou at nmu.edu>
Subject: RE: Best Vacuum Sealers and Digital Scales

I had one of the FoodVac vacuum sealers made by Tilia.  This is the most 
common sealer you will find.  I found it finicky.  Sometimes it the heat 
bar would seal, sometimes it wouldn't. Also, the seal on the bags sometimes 
came undone in the freezer after a while.  The other problem with the 
FoodVacs is that they require their own special channel/patterned bags, 
which cost a lot more than other vacuum sealed bags.

After looking around for while, I decided on the VS280 from Sorbent Systems 
<www.sorbentsystems.com/sinbosealer.html>. It is priced about the same as 
the Tilia and the best part is you can use any type of vacuum bags with 
it.  I bought the unit along with some clear and mylar (oxygen barrier) 
bags.  I used the mylar bags for my hops and the clear bags for some of my 
grains.  I have found it has worked wonderfully.

Because you have to tip the bags toward the vacuum tube when they are being 
sealed, this unit is not good for sealing items with liquid in them (like 
soup).



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Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 10:09:17 -0500
From: "Drew Avis" <andrew_avis at hotmail.com>
Subject: re: DCL, the MoB and the number 42

Steve Alexander sez:
"DCL has several new dry yeasts in the works btw."

Cool!  Any hints on what they might be?

About Joseph Gerteis' original request for a review of the DCL line - I
posted something like this a few months ago:
http://hubris.engin.umich.edu/Beer/Threads/HBD/2003/4124

Is that what you were thinking of?

Drew Avis, Member of Barleyment for Merrickville, Ontario ~
http://barleyment.neap.net/


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Date: Sun, 2 Feb 2003 15:52:04 -0600
From: "Bill Frazier" <billfrazier at worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Temperature variability in mash

Ross Potter wonders about temperature variability in his
mash.  

I'll let others discuss the reasons for your observations but
I can offer a little bit from my experience that will help your
all-grain brewing.   Buy a laboratory-grade glass thermometer
and use it to measure the temperature in your mash, or at
least use it to calibrate a metal or digital thermometer.

I've never found a floating thermometer (I have several) that
reads accurately at freezing and boiling temperatures.  
If it doesn't read accurately at these extremes then you can't
be sure of your mash temperature.  You should test all
thermometers in an ice bath and then in boiling water.
I hope yours performs better than the ones I've purchased
over the years but if not you can buy a proper thermometer.

Best regards,

Bill Frazier
Olathe, Kansas




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Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 10:14:36 -0500
From: "Dennis Collins" <dcollins at drain-all.com>
Subject: The Ethics of Homebrew Competition?

Someone (they forgot the name and town in their post) was asking about the
ethics of copying a recipe given in a book or someone else's recipe and
entering it in a competition.

I thought I would pass along the results of a little experiment that our
homebrew club did over the holidays.  Four of us decided to brew the same
beer and see what differences equipment and brewer techniques would make.
We bought all of the ingredients at the same time and one person (me)
weighed out all the ingredients on the same scale and accounted for the
efficiency on each brewers system using Promash.  This eliminated
ingredients as a variable.  The yeast was purchased from the same source in
the same form (WLP 005 British Ale Yeast in a pitchable tube).  Each brewer
was required to take the yeast home and make a starter with it.  The specs
for the recipe were clearly spelled out as far as mash temp, mash time,
original gravity, boil time, hop additions, etc.  In the end, the only
variables were the specific brewer techniques, equipment and practices.

The results were startling.  The four beers that were made, although
similar, had very different characteristics.  They were easily four
different beers if they were entered in the same category at a competition.

So, getting to the point - even with a very exacting recipe - it would be
extremely difficult to duplicate someone else's recipe on your own
equipment.  There are just too many variables even after you eliminate the
variables such as ingredients and recipe specs.  Sanitation practices,
fermentation temperatures, mash method, sparge method, yeast starter, etc.
all play a critical role in the characteristics of the finished beer.  It's
hard enough just to make the same beer twice on your own equipment (not
impossible, but it does take some practice and effort).  It would be
possible to start with someone's recipe, make a beer, taste it, tweak it,
taste it, tweak it, and then 6 months and 6 batches later have good
facsimile of the original, but after all that work - it's your recipe now
isn't it?  In my opinion, I don't see a problem at all with plagiarizing a
recipe for a competition - the odds of you actually making the same beer as
the original (at least on the first try) would almost be like winning the
lottery.

Dennis Collins
Knoxville, TN
http://sdcollins.home.mindspring.com

"In theory, theory and practice are the same, but not in practice".




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Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 10:16:00 -0500 (EST)
From: hollen at woodsprite.com
Subject: Chest Freezer Drilling


You don't have to drill either the lid or the sides of a Chest Freezer.
Remove the lid of the freezer by removing the hinges from the body of the
freezer.

Get yourself some clear heart redwood and make a couple of inch tall
extension that is the same dimensions as the freezer (two by four on edge
works well.  Drill any holes you need through this, even for your faucets.
Varnish or fiberglass well to prevent deterioration.  Attach to the top of
the freezer lip with epoxy.  When thoroughly cured, attach hinges to the
new extension.

dion

- --
Dion Hollenbeck  Email:  hollen at woodsprite.com
Home Page:       http://www.woodsprite.com
Brewing Page:    http://hbd.org/hollen



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Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2003 10:21:52 -0500
From: Tony Verhulst <tony.verhulst at hp.com>
Subject: Moving Brews or Pump Part


> Where else would I order the part?

If Grainger sells the pump, it'll also carry parts for it.
http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/rp_parts_home.jsp
I just got a new impeller (don't ask :-) for my Little Giant pump.

Tony V.
http://home.attbi.com/~verhulst/RIMS/rims.htm


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Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2003 09:46:45 -0500
From: "Eric R. Theiner" <rickdude02 at earthlink.net>
Subject: Competition Ethics

The question was posed whether or not it is acceptable to use someone 
else's recipe for a competition.  I say that it is completely ethical 
(there goes that word again!).

The reason for a competition is to improve your brewing skills and 
recipes.  The end result is for you to perfect that particular brew by 
paying attention to judge comments and so forth.  The fact of the matter is 
that ribbons and prizes are really incidental to the true purpose of our 
comps.  Even aside from the fact that if two people brewed the exact same 
recipe, you would still get noticeably different beers (due to a number of 
things which will add up in the finished product, ranging from BTU's of 
your burner/stove to the geometry and material of your fermenter), the goal 
is for YOU to brew the best approach to a style that you can-- the next time.

One example is Brian Cole (previous AHA HBoY).  He's (in)famous in these 
parts for sweeping many, many ribbons in our local competitions every time 
he enters.  Brian showed me his recipe book at a competition once and it 
was really something-- every style had it's own section with the base 
recipe, judge sheets, new recipe (adjusted according to judge comments), 
judge sheets, adjusted recipe, etc.  This is the best utilization of the 
competition program I have ever seen.  And it pays off (as any who have 
sampled Brian's beers know).

I'm sure he'll correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think Brian has any 
compunctions about where his initial recipe comes from, because it's his 
brewing style that will eventually make it into an award winner.  And 
that's really the goal.

Here's something else that the author of the ethics question might have 
some difficulty with-- is it okay to taste a beer to determine what style 
it fits rather than brew to style to begin with?  Again, I say this is 
fine.  An example of that is a dry stout I brewed that I actually entered 
as a foreign export stout.  Was I cheating?  No-- I thought it was a good 
example of a foreign stout, and if I want to brew a good example of a 
foreign stout, I'll use that recipe (it took second).  For a dry stout, 
though, I'll go back to the drawing board-- and that's something that I 
thought, but the competition confirmed for me.

So think about comps in terms of the information that you get from them, 
not in terms of the prizes and ribbons.

(Sorry for being long-winded)

Rick Theiner
LOGIC, Inc.




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Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 10:48:44 -0500
From: "Ian Watson" <realtor at niagara.com>
Subject: Update: "No Krausen"

Hello all

First of all, thanks to everyone who respond with possible solutions to my
quiet fermentation, both on and off the list.  I did get a new hydrometer
flask, and sure enough, the SG of my week-old brew is 1.008.  Another good
sign is that there was tons of foam in the SG flask, so I guess I didn't
ruin the protein either.

Thanks,

Ian Watson
St. Catharines, Ontario, Canada
(still trying to figure out the rennarian reference)



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Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 11:33:27 -0500
From: "Martin Brungard" <Martin.Brungard at trow.com>
Subject: Removing Organic Deposits from Plastic Parts 

Recently, I disassembled the pump on my RIMS for routine inspection.  The
pump is one of the high temp March pumps with a fiber-reinforced plastic pump
housing and impeller.  The coating I found on the plastic parts inside the
pump alarmed me.  

Here is some background on my care and treatment of my system.  I give my
entire RIMS and counter flow chiller system a hot PBW wash and hot water
rinse after every brew.  I consider this a pretty routine clean-in-place
procedure.  From my inspection, I could see that the interior surfaces of my
piping were clean upon disassembly.  But, there was a brown film on the
plastic interior surfaces of the pump.  I could scrape the film off with some
hard work with my fingernails.  But when I tried using my cleaning brush, it
clearly wasn't stiff enough to remove the deposits.  I don't think that the
manual scraping is the way to go though.  Its too much work and I don't think
that its going to provide 100 percent removal.

To my knowledge (and palate), I haven't had an infection problem with my
system.  As you can probably ascertain, I do use the pump to perform my
transfer and chilling, so there could be a possibility of infection.  I
figure that the combination of running hot wort through the pump during
mashing and then my procedure of running idophor solution through the chiller
and pump before transfer have probably limited the opportunity for infection.
But the presence of that film is still troubling.  As we all know, films and
deposits can allow bugs to hide from the cleansing action of heat and
sanitizers.  I would like to find a procedure that will occasionally rid the
system of these deposits.  

I figure that whatever soak that would remove the organic deposits from the
plastic may be too aggressive for my copper piping, so an occasional
dismantling and soaking is probably the way to go.  I need input from the
learned masses on HBD as to what sort of soak would remove the organic
deposits from this fiber reinforced plastic?

So this additional cleaning is just one more addition to our already long
brew days.  As a data point, my brew day usually takes up to 6 hours from
start to complete cleanup.  My last brew was only 5 hours long, but this brew
had shorter mash and boil schedules.  I wish there were some real time
savings out there.  The only thing that I can see as an improvement for me
will be to cut off about a half hour by doing a system setup the day before.
I have to wait until my Man Room ( that's what my wife calls my new workshop)
construction is completed before I can incorporate that enhancement to the
brew day.

Martin Brungard
Tallahassee, FL


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Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 17:56:58 +0100
From: espels06.consultant at peoplesoft.com
Subject: Home made mill

Hello everybody from Madrid, Spain!

I would like to know if somebody could be so kind to give me some
guidelines as to buid a malt mill, or if it is always easier to buy one.
In that case I would have to order it by the Internet.. It is extremely
difficult to find one here in Spain.

How about home malting?. Is ist difficult? Is there a detailed guide to
find the right way to do it at home?

Thank you everyone...

Daniel Anegon





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Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 12:47:08 -0500
From: "Ian Watson" <realtor at niagara.com>
Subject: Water

Hi all

I use spring water from the grocery store to brew with, because I don't
drink our tap water, so why brew with it.  I was wondering if any water
expert could tell me what kind of beer it would be best suited for.  I know
I can add salts to it to make other styles, but I'm curious as to what it
would be good for in it's raw state.

The label says:

Dissolved mineral salts:  220 ppm
HCO3                         190   "
Ca                                46    "
Mg                               16    "
SO4                             12    "
Na                                 4    "
K                                   1    "
Cl                                  1    "

Thanks,

Ian Watson



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Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 20:51:48 -0500
From: "Jerry Barkley" <gbarkley at charter.net>
Subject: re:speed of sound in co2

 "Darwin Airola" <darwin at museplay.com> wrote in part:

"The equation that I was going to use was square root of the adiabatic
gas constant (gamma) times the gas constant (R) times the absolute
temperature (T) divided the molecular mass of the gas.

snip

Does this analysis seem correct? Is the only dependence of the speed of
sound upon temperature (with no need to directly consider the pressure
that the CO2 in the keg is under)?"

No, for a diatomic gas try

sqrt(gamma*pressure/density)=S

 now co2, you so correctly point out, is not a diatomic gas. So there is
surely another correction factor, but i have too many brewing books on the
shelf and had to take the rest of my physics texts back to the office,
sorry...

Cheers
Jerry Barkley
- --
http://webpages.charter.net/gbarkley/
- --
"It's not a popularity contest, it's beer!"
Mike Dixon
- --





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Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 22:10:15 -0500 (EST)
From: Pat Babcock <pbabcock at hbd.org>
Subject: Here we go again...

Greetings, Beerlings! Please, oh please take me to your lager...

Well, our new ISP promised we'd never ever go through what we
did when CAIS went belly up. Maybe they're right. Maybe
switching to Covad will not be so traumatic as switching to
NASOP was. In anycase, we've outlived yet another ISP.

I have just completed the preliminary process to start the
transfer. Within four days, I will be provided new IP
information, and then we will be moved to Covad. Expect a
(hopefully) brief outage while DNS record changes propagate
through the net. Of course, if the CAIS to NASOP transfer was
any indication, expect a longer one while we sort out the
router programming...)

On the plus side, Covad is the backbone that the other two went
bankrupt on, so I don't expect to have to move to another
provider any time soon. Note, however, that I have little to no
confidence in their solvency, either.

Wish me luck...

- -- 
 -
God bless America!

Pat Babcock in SE Michigan         pbabcock at hbd.org
Home Brew Digest Janitor           janitor@hbd.org
HBD Web Site                       http://hbd.org
The Home Brew Page                 http://hbd.org/pbabcock
[18, 92.1] Rennerian
"I don't want a pickle. I just wanna ride on my motorsickle"
                                   - Arlo Guthrie




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