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	FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
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Contents:
  Lagering Under Pressure ("Dave Larsen")
  Lagering in a Corny ("Doug A Moller")
  Various topics ("Bridges, Scott")
  RE: Beer on Planes ("Jodie Davis")
  RE: caffiene in beer (Michael Hartsock)
  Brewery Names (John Ferens)
  Doc Crock's Brewery, and the age of brewers (Michael Hartsock)
  Airplanes and Beer (John Ferens)
  brewery names (Marc Sedam)
  RE: Brewery name, drinking habit,  beers (Michael Hetzel)
  RE: brewery names (Brian Lundeen)
  lagering, cornies, airlocks ("Todd M. Snyder")
  Re: Iron in cornmeal (Christopher Swingley)
  Faucet on keg ("Todd M. Snyder")
  Beers Around the Country ("Hedglin, Nils A")
  Seattle brewpubs (beerbuddy)
  New Brewing Lager Beer ("Dave Larsen")
  Wyeast Roeselare 3763 ("John Misrahi")
  Subject: RE: burton water - waiting... (RiedelD)
  Zero length ("Jay Spies")
  NHC fallout (Jeff Renner)
  Brewery names/ Lagering in cornies/ Lager primary in plastic/ RIMS (jon scott)


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Date: Wed, 02 Jul 2003 06:05:03 +0000
From: "Dave Larsen" <hunahpumonkey at hotmail.com>
Subject: Lagering Under Pressure

First thing I have to say is thanks for all the good posts and personal 
replies to my post about lagering in a corny.  There are far too many for me 
to respond to them all in a reasonable amount of time.  However, there were 
a lot of great ideas given, and I thought I'd give a blanket thanks to 
everyone.

Second, following up on my own post, I found the quote in the Gregory Noonan 
book about lagering under pressure.  Well, there are actually two.  They 
come from his 1986 book, Brewing Lager Beer (Sorry I do not have the updated 
1996 version, New Brewing Lager Beer).

The first reads, "Where fermenter construction permits, it is common to 
lager the beer under +.2 to -.3 atmospheres (4.4 lbs/sq. in.) of pressure, 
after the fermenter is purged of the atmosphere in the headspace."  This 
comes from page 164, in the section on lagering in Chapter 13: Secondary 
Fermentation.

The second reads, "Do not lager under pressure in a glass carboy; use a 
Cornelius keg or the like.  Do not lager at above five pounds per square 
inch."   This comes from page 202, in the lagering section in Chapter 15: 
Brewing Procedure.  He never seems to give a reason why, though.

Anyway, I thought I'd throw that out for anybody who was interested.

Dave
Tucson, AZ



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Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2003 06:18:44 -0500
From: "Doug A Moller" <damoller at intergate.com>
Subject: Lagering in a Corny 

I use a spring that releases at 5 psi so I don't have to watch it. I just
change out the pressure relief valve when I transfer to the serving keg. I
also have some old style lids that I had no safety valve and had holes
drilled in the center for a air lock!

Doug



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Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2003 08:47:40 -0400 
From: "Bridges, Scott" <ScottBridges at sc.slr.com>
Subject: Various topics


OK, I'm catching up on old topics like everyone else....

Arsenal Hill Brewing Company.  It was the working name of my aborted attempt
at opening a micro with my brother in '95.  Arsenal Hill refers to the hill
in downtown Columbia (SC) where the governor's mansion now sits.  At one
time (1800's) the location housed an arsenal and military college.  Our logo
is/was a civil war era cannon.  I always thought that it was a very cool
name, and would have worked well for a commercial beer.

Not drinking much beer these days.  Maybe 1-2 on average depending on how
often I get out on my boat.  My SO and I seem to be drinking more wine than
beer these days.    

Latest beers are a medium body, session type pale ale, around 1.045 and a
spiced winter ale, around 1.050.

Demographics:  44, professional in electronics mfg biz, balding, beard.
Yes, I fit the profile.  Except I work out a lot and watch my diet, so I'm
lacking the beer belly of many of my peers.  I went to the AHA fest in
Baltimore a few years ago and my brother really got a kick out of the fact
that everyone there looked just like me.  

Brewing w/ kids:  I started brewing just before my kids were born (son '90,
daughter '92).  I actually brewed a lot when they were very small, but no so
much any more.  My ex- worked weekends a lot, so I watched the kids and
brewed.  Now, they are older and involved in activities that require weekend
time.  I had to drop out of our brew club due to my son's Boy Scout meetings
conflicting with club night.  Did I mention that I am now a single parent?
Plus, my boating hobby tends to keep me away from the house on weekends that
I otherwise would be brewing.

Brewing (infrequently) in Columbia, SC
Scott



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Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2003 08:51:33 -0400
From: "Jodie Davis" <JodieDavis at adelphia.net>
Subject: RE: Beer on Planes

Last night I shared beer I'd picked up in NYC a few weeks ago with my
brew club, carried home safely in my suitcase. One of the perks of
traveling for work is bringing home beer I can't get here in Georgia.
Not wanting to lug beer through the terminal I always put it in my
checked baggage, packing it carefully in clothes and shoes, and making
sure it's not near the edges of a hard sided suitcase.

(Ahem! My husband packed my homebrew to take to my family in Florida
last year--in plastic bags wedging the bottles in at the outside of a
hard suitcase. When we arrived at the 5-star Boca Hotel for the formal
business dinner that evening he discovered that his packing technique
left much to be desired. Fortunately my dress etc. was fine and we had a
car and knew that Nordstrom was close by. He needed a new tie and shirt
anyway...)

Other than that--knock on wood--I've never had a problem.

Regarding locking baggage, until one of my last trips I also thought we
couldn't lock suitcases anymore. At least at Air Tran where they have
people manning scanning machines I was told as long as I deliver the
baggage there I can lock it after they have the opportunity to inspect
it. Of course, if it goes on the belt at the ticket counter or is
checked outside you're out of luck.


Jodie Davis
Canton, Georgia



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Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2003 06:18:12 -0700 (PDT)
From: Michael Hartsock <xd_haze at yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: caffiene in beer

Rich,

I wouldn't use a natural source of caffiene, I think
it would taste really off.  Tea is very high in
Tannin, and enough coffee in beer to contribute and
appreciable amount of caffiene would devastate head
retention, not even to mention how it would taste!

I've thought about this, and I think you have a couple
of options.  You could crush up no doze into a fine
powder and add it when you take it off the heat (I
don't know what boiling would do).  

I also think you could use a certain amount of that
"water Joe" stuff, which is just caffinated water,
that I think is supposed to be tasteless and
debittered.  This would be expensive but would proably
be the best option.

mike

=====
"May those who love us, love us.
And those that don't love us,
May God turn their hearts.
And if he doesn't turn their hearts,
may he turn their ankles
So we'll know them
by their limping."



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Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2003 09:25:20 -0400 
From: John Ferens <john.ferens at ansys.com>
Subject: Brewery Names

I love water and sailing downwind: "Free Sail Brewing"

John.


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Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2003 06:29:44 -0700 (PDT)
From: Michael Hartsock <xd_haze at yahoo.com>
Subject: Doc Crock's Brewery, and the age of brewers

On the age issue, I'm 24.  While I don't know many
brewers here in Mid Missouri, I think I'm one of the
youngest.  But I never go to a party without homebrew,
so I think I'm ramping up interest when I meet new
people!

As for Doc Crock's brewery, where'dya steal the
general chemistry equipment?  Hope you washed it well
after you smuggled it out in your backpacks!

Michael
Columbia, MO
"One eye brewing"

=====
"May those who love us, love us.
And those that don't love us,
May God turn their hearts.
And if he doesn't turn their hearts,
may he turn their ankles
So we'll know them
by their limping."



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Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2003 09:33:38 -0400 
From: John Ferens <john.ferens at ansys.com>
Subject: Airplanes and Beer

Depends on the airline.  I used AirTran (I think it was them) once to/from
Chicago and they wouldn't allow my case of Goose Island Oatmeal Stout on
board as carryon; they apparently had experience in the past of someone
drinking the beer they were carrying.  I very reluctantly allowed them to
check it as luggage, sure I would lose it to either breakage or consumption
by someone other than myself.  To my great relief and surprise, the case
arrived unscathed and without an ounce missing.

On other occasions, I've packed upwards of a six pack in my carryon bags
without trouble.

A buddy of mine also packs beer, very carefully, in a gun carrying case and
has no problem checking that.

John.


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Date: Wed, 02 Jul 2003 10:14:33 -0400
From: Marc Sedam <marc_sedam at unc.edu>
Subject: brewery names

I used "Huisbrouwerij Zuytdam" for a while.  It's Dutch for "Sedam 
Homebrewery".  Not very clever, I know, but nobody gives props to the 
Dutch anymore.  A few people on the list at one time actually thought it 
was a real brewery.  

Over the past few years I've been sticking with "Alechemist (tm) 
Brewing."  And no...that's not a typo.  I'm a biochemist (or was...at 
one point in life) and I dig brewing ales.  Hence "Ale-chemist".  I'm 
working with a friend on registering trademark as someday I'll use this 
for real.  

Besides, I don't see much difference between turning iron into gold 
(alchemy) or turning cereal grains into beer (alechemy).  Now when I can 
turn grain into beer into gold then I'll really be living large.

Cheers!
Marc

- -- 

Marc Sedam
Chapel Hill, NC




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Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2003 07:20:26 -0700 (PDT)
From: Michael Hetzel <hetzelnc at yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: Brewery name, drinking habit,  beers

My brewery name used to be related to the street on which I lived, but
2 yrs ago officially became Hetzel Brewins in honor of my favorite
team, the Boston Bruins.  The cool part of the name is the logo, which
resembles the spoked B of the Bruins, but instead is an H. Looks great
on my kegerator. Watching the B's and drinking homebrew.. thats my idea
of a religious experience.

Consumption:
typically 2 drinks per day. Usually homebrew or Harpoon beers, but can
get supplemented by the top shelf hard stuff. Side note: Harpoon IPA
cask conditioned is my hands-down favorite beer.

Last 3 beers:
Uncle Mikey's Kaitlyn Stout (6-7% ABV)
  -house beer. Almost always on tap.
Mousetrap Porter (6%)
Knot's Pacific Chocolate Ale (5%)
  -a mistake actually, when I kegged the wrong beer (anchor steam
clone)with chocolate. Lesson learned: label the carboys. It went
fantastic with the stout though.

Mike Hetzel
Hetzel Brewins, Waltham MA



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Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2003 09:39:37 -0500 
From: Brian Lundeen <BLundeen at rrc.mb.ca>
Subject: RE: brewery names

Al Korzonas writes:

> I've called my homebrewery various names over the years, none very
officially.  

I've also called my brewery various names over the years, none of which
would make it through Pat's filters. ;-) It's just not a brew day without
something causing me grief. Now, this past weekend's Wit brew would have
been one of those rare trouble free brew days but for the fact that I asked
my "assistant brewer" to wash up my sparge pot which I had used for boiling
the wheat. Well, she did a great job, got off all the scorched stuff stuck
to the bottom (note: use more water, stir always) and I happily filled it up
with my sparge water and got the heating underway. Pulled the lid off to
check on the progress, steam starting to come off, and... Sniff, sniff. What
the... It smells like...

"Sweetie, did you have sunscreen on your hands when you washed the pot"?

"Um, yes. But I gave it a good rinsing".

Sigh. Dump, scrub, rinse. Now to pick up another carboy of RO water. Of
course, it's Sunday, the market doesn't open till noon, about the time the
mash is scheduled to end. Oh well, guess the brew day will be a little
longer than planned. 

Cheers
Brian, in Winnipeg


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Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2003 10:46:01 -0400
From: "Todd M. Snyder" <tmsnyder at buffalo.edu>
Subject: lagering, cornies, airlocks

> There seems to be a whole group of brewers who ferment in corny kegs.   My
> question to this is: how do you rig up the air lock?
> If I lager in a corny, do I just remove one of the posts on the corny and
> hook up the air lock there?  In that case, how do you seal the hole around
> the air lock?  Do they make drilled stoppers that small?  If they do, will
> it seal against the threads.

To ferment in a ball lock corny keg, you can remove the 'guts' of the gas-in
connector (the spring poppet thingy), and reattach it to the keg. Then slide
a 1/2 inch copper sweat union over the outside of the gas-in connector; it
will seal perfectly to the o-ring on the outside of the connector.  Then use
a regular airlock and beer bottle size drilled stopper which will fit into
the other half of the copper union.

To lager in a corny keg, just seal the keg with CO2 pressure and throw it in
a refrigerator for a couple months.

To add to the database of homebrew consumption, my average beer consumption
is 1 homebrew per week, and that estimate is probably high.   On
fishing/camping/bluegrass trips my consumption spikes up to 1/3 corny keg
per day.  :-)

Cheers!
Todd Snyder
Buffalo, NY




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Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2003 07:13:26 -0800
From: Christopher Swingley <cswingle at iarc.uaf.edu>
Subject: Re: Iron in cornmeal

* Jeff Renner <jeffrenner at comcast.net> [2003-Jul-01 06:00 AKDT]:
> > I'm planning on brewing a cream ale this weekend, and am wondering 
> > about the "Enriched and Degermed" cornmeal I have in the cabinet.  
> 
> This has been a concern of mine as well, but it is hard to avoid.

I figured this would probably be the case.  I'm sure the bins of corn 
meal at my local Fred Meyer, err Kroger, are probably just as fortified, 
and we no longer have a natural foods store in town.

> It may be merely theoretical, but I already have some iron in my 
> water, so I avoid it by buying unenriched cornmeal from a bakery 
> supplier in 50 lb. bags.

Yes, that was my worry too.  My water is good for brewing, but my 
in-ground tank is rusting, so I do have some iron in the water.  The 
whole-house filter does slowly turn reddish, so I suspect iron, but it 
could also be silt from the tank.

Given what you're saying (the iron in corn meal is a problem, but 
probably not significant unless the iron in your water is already 
marginally a problem), maybe I'll try brewing with water from the local 
spring.  It's similar water to what I get delivered, but without the 
rusty tank.

> Raw polenta is a possible alternative, but you could just go ahead and 
> brew with what you have and see.  Based on the fact that I have some 
> iron in my water and don't have a fermentation problem, I think that 
> with a good amount of healthy yeast you should do fine.

Sounds good.  Thanks!

> I trust you are going to do a cereal mash with about 30% malt with the 
> corn.

Yep.  You must have a file with this in it, so you can simply cut and 
patse it into your email whenever anyone asks about corn meal mashing!  
Re-reading all those posts about various types of corn made me realize 
how many times you've helped everyone through the process over the 
years.

Thanks!  I'll give it a try and see what happens.

Chris
- -- 
Christopher S. Swingley          email: cswingle at iarc.uaf.edu
IARC -- Frontier Program         Please use encryption.  GPG key at:
University of Alaska Fairbanks   www.frontier.iarc.uaf.edu/~cswingle/



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Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2003 11:15:33 -0400
From: "Todd M. Snyder" <tmsnyder at buffalo.edu>
Subject: Faucet on keg

Hi James,

<The faucet I have found while web-searching
attaches directly to a liquid-out ball-lock connector (with
an adaptor).  Now, I admit that I may have been in "page-down"
mode for the past few years of keg line discussions ... but
_nobody_ suggested that ZERO length was appropriate.  Any
idea how (or how well?) the "direct-connect" faucet works?>

They work well when you bleed off almost all the CO2 pressure needed to
properly carbonate the beer and serve it under almost zero pressure while
your beer goes flat.  To get around this, you could just make a 4 foot long
cobra dispenser from 3/16 ID tubing and just leave the whole thing coiled up
in the fridge with the keg.

I would also avoid the little cartridge CO2 dispensor.  I did the math once
upon a time and it would take 5.5 16g CO2 bulbs or 11 8g bulbs to force
carbonate a 5 gallon corny. Then to dispense at a normal keg pressure of 10
psi it would take 4.6 more 16g bulbs or 9.2 more 8g bulbs.  The total number
of bulbs to force carbonate to 2.0 volumes and serve at 10psi would be
10-16g bulbs or 20-8g bulbs! What a PITA!

You could prime and carbonate in the keg, but then you have to deal with
getting the keg to seal without leaking out all your natural CO2, and the
sludge left in the bottom of the keg.  Unexpected flat beer from kegs that
never sealed themselves during natural carbonation, cloudy pours, and hard
keg cleanings, more PITA's!

So there's four good reasons to tell SWMBO why you need to buy a nice little
5 lb CO2 tank.  You'll actually be _saving_ money in the long run!  And you
can put it right in the fridge with the kegs, out of sight, easy to store =
happy SWMBO.

Cheers!
Todd
Buffalo, NY



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Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2003 08:37:40 -0700
From: "Hedglin, Nils A" <nils.a.hedglin at intel.com>
Subject: Beers Around the Country

Hi,
  My wife came up with a Beers Around the World party idea, but I'm 
thinking of localizing it to the US in celebration of American Beer
Month.  
What do you think are the country's major areas of craft brewing & what
are 
the (readily available) beers should be tried from each?  Being from 
California, I obviously have to have Sierra Nevada & Anchor Steam.


Nils Hedglin
Sacramento, CA
[1978.7, 275.3] Apparent Rennerian
In Heaven there is no beer, that's why we drink it here,
And when we're gone from here, our friends will be drinking all the
beer.


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Date: Wed, 02 Jul 2003 16:43:44 +0000
From: beerbuddy at comcast.net
Subject: Seattle brewpubs

Lou King asked for brewpubs in Seattle. I'm partial to Pike brewery at 1st and 
Union (one block from my parking garage) ;)  They have a few great brews, my 
favorite is the Kilt Lifter Scotch style (a mild version, easy on the peat). 
Pyramid has an alehouse by Safeco Field (the Mariners' ballpark) and they have 
a great seasonal right now called Curve Ball, a Kolsch style. Red Hook has a 
brewery about 25 miles east of the city in Woodinville, although their food 
isn't the greatest, try their ESB if you like bitters. Also, if you are on the 
east side there is the Issaquah Brewery in Issaquah (about 15 miles east of 
the city), they are a part of Rogue and have all of Rogue's brews plus a 
couple of their own (usually about 20 styles on tap). Don't miss the 
Snoqualmie brews either, although you'll have to find those at a restaurant, 
their taproom isn't open for a few more months (if remember the show Twin 
Peaks, that was filmed in Snoqualmie and North Bend, about 25-30 miles east of 
the city, and the diner in the show (Twede's in real life) is in North Bend 
and carries Snoqualmie brew, it's a great greasy spoon). 

There's also a Rock Bottom in the city and one in Bellevue, if you want 
consistency. For variety there is a place called the Tap Room in Bellevue, 
advertising 160 beers on tap, although the past few times we have been there 
we have been unhappy with the number of dry taps and a staff that lacks some 
knowledge. 

Now do you understand why you got so many hits on the search engine? I love 
Seattle!

Timothy


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Date: Wed, 02 Jul 2003 17:33:00 +0000
From: "Dave Larsen" <hunahpumonkey at hotmail.com>
Subject: New Brewing Lager Beer

In my last two posts, I mentioned the books Brewing Lager Beer (1986) and 
the updated edition New Brewing Lager Beer (1996) by Gregory Noonan.  If 
anybody is lucky enough to have one of those in their brewing library, they 
are a lucky man indeed.  Really, it is THE text on brewing lagers.  Just 
about every brewing book since and any magazine articles on the subject 
makes reference to this book.

Unfortunately, they are out of print and are becoming harder and harder to 
find.   I was lucky enough to find the 1986 edition at a brew shop in New 
York, which claimed it was their last and only copy for sale.

Well, I was over at Amazon the other day and I noticed that New Brewing 
Lager Beer is marked as soon to be released and has a publish date of 
September 2003.  I don't know if that means that there is another update to 
the book or it is simply a reprint of the 1996 book.  Either way, if you 
don't have it, I'd definitely pick it up when it comes out in a few months.  
I'm definitely going to pick up the newer edition.

Dave
Tucson, AZ



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Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2003 14:26:30 -0400
From: "John Misrahi" <lmoukhin at sprint.ca>
Subject: Wyeast Roeselare 3763

Hi all,
Almost 2 weeks ago, I pitched an XL pack of this new yeast/bacteria blend
into ~20L of 1.065 wort. It began fermenting within 24 hours, worked *very*
violently for a few days, and calmed down. Yesterday I racked it to
secondary and it was at 1.035. However the racking seems to have roused it
and it is now down to 1.030 and still going. Does anyone have experience
with this stuff? Is it a slow fermenter? I had expected the bulk of the
fermenation (at least the 'normal' fermentation) to be over by now. On the
bright side it is developing a wonderful sour, tangy, perhaps slightly oaky
quality. I think it will be a good one..

John Misrahi
Montreal, Canada




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Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2003 16:52:49 -0400 
From: RiedelD at pac.dfo-mpo.gc.ca
Subject: Subject: RE: burton water - waiting...

Robin Griller  writes:

>I'm not sure if anyone else has found this, but when I've burtonised my
water, I've found that the resulting bitter has a 'tipping point'. That is,
the description of one-dimensionality and uninteresting character given by
A.J. holds for the first 4-5 weeks the beer is in keg, but at that point,
suddenly (and it does seem to happen from one day to the next, which I do
not understand) the beer loses that incredibly minerally character and
becomes a wonderful, complex beer with wonderful malt and hop character.

I've experienced the same thing.  Even for only 'half'-Burtonized water I
find that early on, the bitterness and the sulphate character is right up
front and disjointed from the malty, caramelly flavours.  I'm not sure I've
noticed the suddeness of the change you noted, but I certainly find that
after a few weeks the beer really shines.  Perhaps the fact that I don't add
the huge sulphate amount that the published Burton numbers have makes my
beers come around a little quicker than yours.

Makes me want to brew a bitter now...
Dave Riedel
Victoria, Canada


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Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2003 18:02:08 -0400
From: "Jay Spies" <jayspies at citywidehomeloans.com>
Subject: Zero length

All -

In #4286, James Keller asks:

>>>_nobody_ suggested that ZERO length was appropriate.  Any
idea how (or how well?) the "direct-connect" faucet works?<<<

Very well.  For *dispensing*.

Be aware that considering your proposed system (kegs in a fridge with
cartridge-based CO2) you'll have to do 1 of 2 things:  1) prime the kegs and
carbonate naturally or 2) buy stock in the CO2 cartridge company, 'cause
you'll go through them things like halloween candy.  I'd seriously consider
trying to sneak a little 5 lb CO2 tank in there instead - they're hardly
bigger than a 3 gallon corny.

Anyhoo, for dispensing with those little faucet adaptors that allow you to
click a regular faucet handle onto a ball lock out, you need to have fully
carbonated beer and then bleed off all the head pressure and use the
residual head pressure (1 to 2 psi, probably) to dispense through the
faucet.  Then, you just top off with CO2 from the cartridge as needed.
These are great if your whole keg is going to be used up at once (like at a
party), because the beer won't de-gas that fast.  For long term, letting the
beer sit for any extended time with no head pressure is going to drop the
CO2 volumes.  I don't suppose your homebrew consumption is 3 gallons a day.
So that would entail re-pressurizing to 12 or 13 psi when you're done for
the night and then bleeding off the pressure every time you want a beer.
Major PITA.

If you use one of these faucet thingys with normal carb pressure (12-13 psi)
without bleeding the headspace first, you'll get a beer foam shower.  Not
quite the thing for keeping SWMBO purring along (can't have IPA in the horse
doovers, now can we?)  So, to answer your question, for long-term dispense,
you can't use zero length.  Maybe that Dan Listermann contraption that
squeezes the dispense tube in the vise-thingy to provide resistance would
work, or you can just tightly coil about 6 feet of 3/16" hose (it's not that
bad, really) with a picnic tap on it.  Using zero length at carb pressure is
the rough equivalent of putting your mouth to the fire hydrant.

And honestly, forget the cartridges for all but short-term dispense.  Just
get yourself a 5 lb CO2 tank and be done with it.  You'll thank yourself.
Really.

Jay Spies
Charm City Altobrewery
Baltimore, MD



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Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2003 21:17:49 -0400
From: Jeff Renner <jeffrenner at comcast.net>
Subject: NHC fallout

Brewers

Check out 
http://www.comics.com/creators/othercoast/archive/othercoast-20030702.html

I think we missed a few seminar topics.

Cheers

Jeff
- -- 
Jeff Renner in Ann Arbor, Michigan USA, JeffRenner at comcast.net
"One never knows, do one?"  Fats Waller, American Musician, 1904-1943


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Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2003 19:05:19 -0700 (PDT)
From: jon scott <wimpy48124 at yahoo.com>
Subject: Brewery names/ Lagering in cornies/ Lager primary in plastic/ RIMS 


       I don't know if anyone has a name anything like
the one I chose for my brewery: "The ThunderMug
Brewery".
BREWERY NAMES-
     It came about that I just liked the name. I was
at my grandma's and looking through some old stuff in
the basement and saw what I thought was a huge coffee
mug. I asked grandma if I could have it and she said
yeah, yeah, go ahead, what the hell did I want it for?
I think that I told that I'd probably use it for chili
or soup or something. She said fine, fine but don't
expect anyone to eat out of it. Being quite ignorant I
asked her why not? She told me most folks don't eat
out of thunder mugs. I asked her what the heck is a
thundermug? She told me that in the old days some
folks kept them under the beds so that they didn't
have to run out to the outhouse in the middle of the
night! I didn't take it home with me but I wish I
would have. It'd make a great conversation piece.
Hopefully my brews taste better than something out of
a real thundermug though!
LAGERING CORNIES -
       I have always secondaried and lagered in
cornies. I have always bled the pressure off each day
though. But the good thing with this forum is that you
always learn. I'm going to stop bleeding them but I
can't get myself to transfer them before the finish up
and then let them carbonate naturally ala Renner. I
don't want to muck around with it while it's still
active. I do transfer keg to Keg with a short jumper
that I saw years back in Zymurgy. Black fitting to
black fitting, then push through with 10 Lbs Co2. I
also use it when I sanitize [Iodofor or mostly
StarSan] I just push it through and it's sanitized and
purged at the same time. The only problem is that you
can't shorten the dip tube or you can't remove all the
sanitizer. I store my kegs this way with StarSan now.
I used to do 5 gallons of iodofor this way and just
keep the Iodofor going for severa lweeks this but read
on this forum that iodofor is hard on rubber gaskets.
Star San is the way I go now . 
PLASTIC LAGER PRIMARY- 
   I now primary in buckets now with no problems. I
was nervous about it at first though. I was given a
small fridge that I set up for fermenting [I lager in
a chest freezer] but I couldn't get two carboys in it.
I do 11.5/ 12 gallon batches. I started out usind a
1/2 barrel with a 6 inch hole cut out of the top and a
round piece of glass sitting on top in place of an
airlock.  I just pumped the wort into it, sanitized
the glass and waited for it to finish.No problems at
all except when I went to rack it. The weight of it
when filled with fermented beer is quite rough on the
back! Still in all, the best beer that I ever made
come out of that 1/2 barrel! now I use two buckets,
one stacked off center of the other with broken
airlock stems attached to blow off hoses in sanitizer.
There isn't enought room for the top bucket to have an
unbroken airlock.
RIMS- 
       I'm in the process of converting over to a
HERMs system. I have a Mashmate 1600 controller and
stainless steel heating chamber but I want to get a
little less technical. I might hook up the RIMS to my
10 gallon igloo and use it in the winter to keep up
temperatures while doing decoctions . It doesn't seem
to work well with ramping up temps when doing double
batches in the winter. I got it hoping that I could
get away from having a burner under my mash tun I've
seen. HERMs seems to do a better job on larger
batches.

All in all I like to think that what I brew is
acceptable for consumption seeing as it's coming out
of  a 'ThunderMug' !! Wish Grandma was here to try it!

Wimpy
ThunderMug Brewery
Dearborn, MI



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