HOMEBREW Digest #4304 Wed 23 July 2003

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  Barrels and (Roasted) Barley (Michael)
  RE: Kids and Beer ("tOM Trottier")
  Re: Beer Culture ... (David Radwin)
  Anheuser World Select ("Mark Tumarkin")
  O'fest mash // New survey topic: Are you a Malt Nazi? (Grant Family)
  Re: Norse Beer ("Travis Miller")
  RE: Beer Culture in Scandinavia (Jonathan Royce)
  RE: Norse beers (Jonathan Royce)
  RE: Kids and Beer (Michael Hartsock)
  RE: Anheuser Lager (Michael Hartsock)
  Pisen (homebre973)
  RE: barrel evaporation (Brian Lundeen)
  re:   "Anheuser lager"? (asemok)
  RE:Anheuser lager ("Reddy, Pat")
  Re: "Anheuser lager"? (R.A.)" <rbarrett at ford.com>
  Re: AB Lager ("Richard S. Sloan")
  Re: "Anheuser lager"? ("Rich Medina")
  Re: Anheuser Lager (Chuck Doucette)
  Hopfenbitter ("Patricia Beckwith")
  brew software, misc tools ("John Sarette")
  Savannah Pub Crawl ("Mark Tumarkin")
  Re: Maximum strength ("-S")
  Re: "Anheuser lager"? (Jeff Renner)

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---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2003 23:37:14 -0500 From: Michael <grice at binc.net> Subject: Barrels and (Roasted) Barley Mike Sharp wrote in response to A.J. deLange's question: > > 1) Has anyone else here had experiences which tend to confirm or deny my > suspicion? > > > I posted recently an anecdotal story about this, but I'll briefly repeat it > here. A winery client made a Pinot Noir vin gris, and the grapes had very > high sugars that year. It finished over 14% (the tax boundary), and so they > left it in oak for a while until the alchohol dropped to 13.9%. I think > alcohol evaporation is fairly well known in the wine industry. They keep > the barrels topped up, and so the alcohol must escape through the pores in > the oak...the process is much slower than what you described in your beaker > test. I wish I could remember the exact time that the wine spent in the > barrel to drop a given percent, but alas, I was more concerned with bottling > lines at the time! >From what I remember, oak barrels have three benefits for wines: oak flavor (depending on how old the barrel is, etc.), controlled oxygenation, and concentration of the wine through evaporation of both alcohol and water. This is why you must reserve some must in order to top up. You do, however, have some control over which evaporates more quickly. In a sufficiently humid environment, a higher percentage of alcohol will evaporate, and the overall alcohol percentage will go down. In a dry environment, more water water will evaporate the and overall alcohol percentage will increase. (Or so I've read. I've made a little wine, but I'm not ready for a barrel yet.) On a completely unrelated note, I've seen a number of sources which describe how to roast your own grains. I've been thinking I'd try this, and I'm curious as to how many of you actually do this. Is it most worthwhile for those grains which are not available commercially, or does it have any benefits/pitfalls for commonly available specialty grains? Which types of specialty grains are the best for home roasters to try? Michael Middleton, WI Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 01:39:31 -0400 From: "tOM Trottier" <Tom at Abacurial.com> Subject: RE: Kids and Beer I've offered my kids (now 21 and 17) beer and wine to taste, or even to drink a few oz/cl whenever they asked. While I feared they might like the taste of one or another concoction excessively, my fears proved unfounded. Since adolescence is the age of rebellion, I think generally it's best for the parents to offer alcohol to taste before and during this age. Then they can rebel against it.... tOM---- Abacurial Information Management Consultants ---- Tom A. Trottier, President http://abacurial.com 758 Albert St, Ottawa ON Canada K1R 7V8 N45.412 W75.714 +1 613 860-6633 fax:+1 775 307-4133 "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." -- Benjamin Franklin Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 01:03:04 -0700 From: David Radwin <dradwin at sbcglobal.net> Subject: Re: Beer Culture ... > Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2003 12:52:48 -0400 > From: "-S" <-s at adelphia.net> > One of the Scandanvian countries (which ?) has a rather severe tax on > alcohol and so there are regular binge drinking episodes by adults on > cruises and out-of-country trips. Apparently treating adults or > adolescents like children causes them to act accordingly. Sweden, Norway, and Finland are all relatively restrictive, but I think Sweden takes the cake. Vodka is taxed at 87.1% and "strong beer" is taxed at 45.2%. If I recall correctly, the only kind of alcohol available in supermarkets is 3% abv or so beer. Everything else must be purchased at the state-owned liquor monopoly (http://www.systembolaget.se/english). I understand that many states in the US have rules about what sorts of alcohol you can buy at particular times and places. Here in CA it's pretty liberal--you can buy almost anything in any liquor store or supermarket at any time except 2-6 AM. Also, bars cannot serve after 2 AM. One consequence of this high tax is that duty-free shopping is quite popular, as I witnessed on a cruise from Sweden to Finland. The on-board duty-free shop even sold luggage carts to carry your cases of beer home. I did not notice any binge drinking on the ship, but there was plenty of "binge buying." David in Berkeley CA news at removethispart.davidradwin.com Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 06:31:21 -0400 From: "Mark Tumarkin" <mark_t at ix.netcom.com> Subject: Anheuser World Select Jeff, You mention the sign you saw in California that said, - "Ten Brewmasters. Four Continents. One Beer." This is the slogan for Anheuser World Select, a recently announced product. You were correct in observing that the green bottle signifies an intention to compete with the premium imports. Their Bare Knuckle brand is also part of this attempt to compete with better quality brews. I haven't had the opportunity to try either of these products. http://www.industrypages.com/artman/publish/Industry_News_2707.stm Mark Tumarkin Hogtown Brewers Gainesville, FL Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 22:19:50 +1000 From: Grant Family <grants at netspace.net.au> Subject: O'fest mash // New survey topic: Are you a Malt Nazi? G'day I'm conducting my vewwy first partial mash (3.3 lb. grain) soon. It's for an O'fest (with 6.6 lb. extract + the grain) and my question is, what method should I use? I'd like to keep it simple, obviously, but have been advised that Oktoberfests benefit from decoction mashing (which is still an ominous enigma to me). Secondly, in reading Fix & Fix's O'fest book - which stressed the importance of authentic ingredients - I developed a dislike for recipes that subscribe to this Malt Nazism. Why must people insist on Moravian malts, noble hops etc... What is everyone's experiences with "authentic" vs. local ingredients? Are you a Malt Nazi, or a sacraligious heretic (like me)...? But, more than that, what makes you go authentic or local. For my part, I'm relatively isolated, and a (poor) student meaning that I can't afford authentic. Does anyone choose local deliberately in anachistic (or pioneering) fervour? Hmm, so stick that in your mash and brew it ... and respond please. This should be interesting... Stuart Grant Breaking traditions in Hobart, Tasmania, Australia Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 07:51:51 -0600 From: "Travis Miller" <travismiller at comcast.net> Subject: Re: Norse Beer > I am looking for information on the types of beer that the ancient Norse > drank. There is a themed party being planed for a few months from now. What > should I be looking at in terms of alcohol color flavor hoping levels other > spices used yeast character I need information both on ingredients to use > and the desired final result. Information on the types of mead they made > would also be appreciated. This is a difficult subject because when you start looking for recipes from the Viking age (the era between the late 8th century and 1066) you won't find any. Basically what I believe to be a likely idea of what an ale from pre-conversion Scandinavia would have been is this. A fairly smoky dark malt, with a variety of different herbs such as juniper berries, mugwort, spruce, sage, yarrow and maybe wormwood. It would have been fairly sweet and maybe medicinal tasting from the herbs. Any bittering would have come from the herbs, mugwort and wormwood most likely. Hops were not widely used until the 16th century and grudgingly so then. Alcohol content is anyone's guess because fermentation was not understood until relatively recently. Wild yeast strains would have been utilized. If you can find a copy through your library you might read Odd Nordland's book "Beer and Brewing Traditions in Norway". There are some brewing methods in this book that would make most modern brewers cringe. There is another problem when discussing this particular interest. Which Vikings are we talking about. The Danes? The Rus? The Swedes? The Icelanders? What were the Vikings in Orkney drinking while the Rus were down on the Volga drinking what was available to them? As far as mead is concerned I would imagine that it was pretty varied. If there were some sort of berries, herbs, or something else laying about and would be good they probably threw it in.. I doubt they let it clear or age and it was cloyingly sweet. It is likely that wild honey would have been used and the entire hive, angry bees and all would have been tossed into the fermentation vessel. One must remember that these beverages were not just for getting intoxicated. These beverages were sacred and holy things to those who raised the drinking horn to Odin and his children. They were used for medicinal and nutritional purposes and most definitely for ritual and religious purposes. The holiest of oaths were spoken over the mead horn in a form of ritual drinking and toasting called sumble. Three rounds are what appear most often in the available literature. The first to the Gods, the second to the ancestors and land spirits, and the third was for boasting and the making of oaths. Such a thing was considered to be very important to the luck and continued existence of the clan. Should one get too deep into his cups and mis-speak in sumble he could potentially harm all who sat in the mead hall. If one spoke of their deeds and held to the oaths made in the mead hall then all who were present would be seen as lucky (a very important concept in the Scandinavian cosmology) and favored by the Gods. To break an oath spoken in the mead hall could get one banished or killed. That is how serious the northmen were about their ale. It was also very important to pour libations to the Gods and Goddesses. This was seen as being a form of gift giving between men and their deities. The horn was "loaded" with the strength of the Gods and the final portion in the horn was poured out to the Gods as a gift in return for their favor. I could go on for a while about this but I think you get the point. To sum up: no one really knows what the Vikings drank and I don't believe that there has been much in the way of archeological evidence that will help determine it either. The best anyone can do is to look to what is done in rural Scandinavia today. They mash in oak tuns with grain that is grown and malted on the property- the lautering is done in a container that is lined with juniper branches that make up the "false bottom" of the lautering vessel. The yeast comes from birch sticks that were in the fermenter with the last batch and hung up to dry until the new batch is ready for fermentation. This makes me think that brewing in the Viking age was probably very hit and miss. You might check out some of the SCA websites. They have some sources that are quite informational. Some of them have done some historical brewing experiments but from what I understand the beer has been mostly undrinkable by today's standards. Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 05:14:49 -0700 From: Jonathan Royce <jonathan at woodburybrewingco.com> Subject: RE: Beer Culture in Scandinavia Steve wrote: "I would like to point out Alexandre, that binge drinking is not a new American phenomena, but is ascribed to far northern Europeans some 18 centuries ago - modern Scandinavia, Denmark, UK, Ireland where drinking to excess was part of certain annual festivals." It is true that in modern Scandinavia (which, BTW, includes Denmark so there is no need to list them separately), celebrations such as Midsummer, Christmas and the autumn crayfish parties all involve elevated consumption of beer, wine and snaps (a 35-40% spirit that one typically drinks as a shot). However, IMO, it is a serious mistake to compare these events to the pre-21 year old phenomenon of "binge drinking". In my experience, students on American college campuses often drink with a goal in mind of getting drunk. It is not uncommon to overhear a conversation among students that takes the basic form of Q. "What are you doing tonight?" A. "Getting wasted". On the other hand, the drunkenness that often occurs at a Swedish Midsummer party is a byproduct of the social setting in which the party takes place, but it is not the goal. The point of the day is to celebrate a particular occasion with friends and family, not to serve alcohol. Yes, alcohol is served and imbibed in larger-than-normal quantities, but that is not the sole intention of the festival. In fact, likening such an event to what occurs on a weekly basis on college campuses is similar to likening an American wedding reception to a fraternity party. I think that the issue of the "context" of drinking is an important one that needs to be considered when talking about consumption, especially in those that are younger than 21. IMO, it is a very big part of the distinction between what others have coined the "American" and "European" attitudes towards alcohol. For example, in the year that I lived in France and the 3 months that I lived in Scandinavia, I was drunk many times. However, these times of inebriation were always the result of extended outings with friends that eventually resulted in me being drunk-the goal was never the state of being drunk, but rather to socialize with friends. Conversely, in my 4 years at an American university, I was drunk many times as the result of a lost game of a$$hole or beer pong, sometimes played with people that I didn't even know! Of course, in my experience the "American" attitude quickly morphs into something resembling the "European" attitude shortly after one's 21st birthday. At 27, I certainly don't have any friends who still want to get wasted because they think it's fun to be out-of-control. (Although I do still know some guys that have beer pong tables, so I guess the change is never complete.) Anyway, if Steve meant for his comments to be read in the very strict context that binge drinking is "the consumption of 5 or more alcoholic beverages in a row", then he is right: binge drinking happens during certain Scandinavian holidays (as it does in the US at Christmas, Thanksgiving and 4th of July barbecues). However, if one takes a broader view and considers the context (or social setting) of these events, then clearly they don't fit with the popular notion of "binge drinking" among American college students. Best regards, Jonathan Woodbury Brewing Co. www.woodburybrewingco.com Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 05:22:20 -0700 From: Jonathan Royce <jonathan at woodburybrewingco.com> Subject: RE: Norse beers Edwards asked about Norse beers. On January 23 of this year, I posted some info about Swedish beers and translated a recipe for Gotlands dricka, which I haven't tried but am still very intrigued by. My father-in-law's mother was from Gotland and he knew of this beverage, but had never tried it himself. http://hbd.org/hbd/archive/4153.html#4153-8 Hope this is (at the very least) informative, if not useful. Good luck and skal, Jonathan Woodbury Brewing Co. www.woodburybrewingco.com Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 06:29:07 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Hartsock <xd_haze at yahoo.com> Subject: RE: Kids and Beer I couldn't agree with C.D. Pritchard and Dennis Lewis more. I have to chime in on a different level. I'm 24, and not too far out of college. When I was 18 and went to college, I had hardly been around alcohol; it was demonized by my mother in my house. My parents never drank in front of me, and my mother did nothing but harp on the evils of alcohol. She wasn't wrong about the evils she spoke of, indeed, those evils exist. She didn't tell the whole story. When I went to college, I "discovered" alcohol, and saw that it could be fun, social, and tasty. I was left with a false dillema. The issue of alcohol in my upbringing was presented as black and white. I took the opposite stance on alcohol and drank. And drank. And binged. And partied. And binged (did I mention that?). In contrast, my wife grew up with alcohol; her parents drank, and she could if she wanted to. While she went to parties in college and drank (and on occasion, binged), such abuse was infrequent. Rarely would she overindulge, whereas, I would drink IN ORDER TO get drunk. I digress, but I think I've made my point. This is not a scientific study, but I think it is safe to say that rebellion against prohibition-minded parents is a non-specific marker for abusive drinking (but so is following in the footsteps of parents who can't control their drinking). My wife and I are looking to have children in the near future - armed with the knowledge of my own experiences - I hope that I will be able to raise childern with a responsible perspective on alcohol. Primarily, it is my hope that they will not drink budlight by the case or mix bourbon with coke. Mike Columbia, MO ===== "May those who love us, love us. And those that don't love us, May God turn their hearts. And if he doesn't turn their hearts, may he turn their ankles So we'll know them by their limping." Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 06:48:12 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Hartsock <xd_haze at yahoo.com> Subject: RE: Anheuser Lager Jeff (and anyone else interested) - Anheuser lager is a new product by AB (I'm suprised that you couldn't find a link to it). Go to www.anheuser.com. I'm from mid-missouri, and Osage Beach at Lake of the Ozarks is a testing ground for new AB products. We had Mic Ultra before anyone else in the country. Yippie. (sarcasm included). Anyway, it is a light lager, no suprise there. It is sold in green glass, and was a bit light struck, so it was hard to evaluate the flavor. At $7.00 a six pack (from a gas station) it certainly wasn't worth the price, but it wasn't bad. It had subtle noble hop flavor and aroma - unprecedented by any other AB style. It had much better body and mouth feel than any other AB product (in that it HAD body and mouth feel), but it was quite light. The kicker is that it is ALL MALT. I actually think that it would be quite good, if I could find it not having been exposed to flourescent lights. It's made from noble hops, munich and lager malt. According the the website, it is available in Atlanta, Denver, Las Vegas, L.A., New York City, New Port, Lake of the Ozarks, Jersey Shore, Hawaii, London, and Hong Kong. I'll never understand why AB picked Lake of the Ozarks to launch new products and not St. Louis! The website also claims that the bottles are thicker (true) to reduce the effects of light, but I still noticed adverse effects. All in all, its not a bad product, and I look forward to tasting it out of a box before it has been hit by store lights. I wish they made it at the St. Louis brewery, so I could taste it in its unadulterated form! Michael Columbia, MO ===== "May those who love us, love us. And those that don't love us, May God turn their hearts. And if he doesn't turn their hearts, may he turn their ankles So we'll know them by their limping." Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 10:28:54 -0400 (EDT) From: homebre973 at mindspring.com Subject: Pisen I wanted to make a good all grain pilsen similar to Budvar or Urequel. Is a decocotion mash necessary, a step-infusion mash necessary, or can I use a single infusion mash? I was planning to use just pilsen malt and some carapils. Any other suggestions would be appreciated. Andy from Hillsborough, NC Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 09:32:09 -0500 From: Brian Lundeen <BLundeen at rrc.mb.ca> Subject: RE: barrel evaporation Mike Sharp writes: A winery client made a Pinot Noir vin gris, and the grapes had very high sugars that year. It finished over 14% (the tax boundary), and so they left it in oak for a while until the alchohol dropped to 13.9%. I think alcohol evaporation is fairly well known in the wine industry. They keep the barrels topped up, and so the alcohol must escape through the pores in the oak Me: Just to add to this, both water and alcohol evaporate from the barrels. Ambient humidity determines the relative amounts that get lost. The higher the humidity, the more alcohol gets lost in relation to the water. Something to keep in mind if you're making wine or lambics in your basement. Cheers Brian, in Winnipeg Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 10:35:04 -0400 From: asemok at mac.com Subject: re: "Anheuser lager"? Mon, 21 Jul 2003 15:19:27 -0400, Jeff Renner <jeffrenner at comcast.net> wrote: >..."Anheuser Lager."...It appeared to be a new sign. I've never >heard of this beer...Any idea what this beer might be? =============== I was working in Hollywood a couple weeks ago and spotted this one as well. Seems to be a test market product. Now, I'm not a big fan of A/B, but do have an open mind... especially since when some time ago I tasted the Anheuser Busch Pale Ale and found it remarkably good. So my curiosity got the best of me and I picked up a bottle of the Anheuser Lager. It was clean tasting, certainly drinkable, but I would say largely unremarkable unfortunately (I was hoping for more, but got what I expected). It had decent body and balance, as well as a hint of that odd tang that Heineken usually has (slight skunk??). All in all, an ok effort...it is a notch better than many microbrews I've tasted lately (horrors!!! Did he really say that???) but not as good as some others. If it had a touch more hop character I think it would get better grades! Just my 2 cents worth... cheers, all... AL Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 10:41:47 -0500 From: "Reddy, Pat" <Pat.Reddy at mavtech.cc> Subject: RE:Anheuser lager I had the opportunity to consume copious amounts of this new brew a few weeks ago. It's being test marketed in Houston I believe and how I came up with several cases of the stuff in St. Louis, well, I probably shouldn't say. Anyway, you're right, it's AB's answer to imported lager and is essentially a Heineken-like Grolsche-wanna-be with a slightly sweeter edge to it. Not bad, and hoppier than I would have expected. Pat Reddy pat.reddy at mavtech.cc Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 11:42:11 -0400 From: "Barrett, Bob (R.A.)" <rbarrett at ford.com> Subject: Re: "Anheuser lager"? Jeff Renner said: While strolling the Venice beach, I spotted a large sign on a building that said: Anheuser Lager Ten Brewmasters Four Continents One Beer With a large picture of a green bottle labeled "Anheuser Lager." Any idea what this beer might be? I've never heard of this beer, and a google search turned up only one broken link which was something about marketing "Anheuser lager and ale." Well Jeff, I searched for "Ten Brewmasters" and got this link: http://www.anheuser-busch.com/news/anheuserselect.htm Looks like AB is doing some serious promoting. The new beer is called Anheuser World Select, a continental pilsner that is available today. We make the beer we drink!! Bob Barrett (2.8, 103.6) rennerian. He's BACK!!!!!!! July is American Beer Month Drink American Beer!!! Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 09:01:54 -0700 From: "Richard S. Sloan" <rssloan at household.com> Subject: Re: AB Lager >>Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2003 15:19:27 -0400 >>From: Jeff Renner <jeffrenner at comcast.net> >>Subject: "Anheuser lager"? >> >>Anheuser Lager >>Ten Brewmasters >>Four Continents >>One Beer >> >>With a large picture of a green bottle labeled "Anheuser Lager." >> >>It appeared to be a new sign. I've never heard of this beer, and a >>google search turned up only one broken link which was something >>about marketing "Anheuser lager and ale." Jeff, This is AB's way of trying to take a piece of the import pie. The name of the beer is "World Select". Here is a link to a news story about it. http://www.delawareonline.com/newsjournal/ business/2003/06/08buschofferingbo.html (link had to be split into two lines to get past the 80 character line limit) Richard Sloan Grosse Hund Brauerei San Diego, CA Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 12:17:25 -0400 From: "Rich Medina" <gothambrewer at att.net> Subject: Re: "Anheuser lager"? The Honorable Jeff Renner asks,"...Any idea what this beer might be? I assume it's an A/B product, but it's hard to imagine what they mean by "one beer." Is it a test market? The green bottle made me think they were looking for the import market." I read about this not too long ago in a realbeer.com newsletter. Apparently 10 A-B brewmasters teamed up to produce a 'continental pilsner' and as Jeff suspected they are test marketing it in various cities here in the US and abroad. Here's the link (you may have to cut&paste) for more info: http://www.realbeer.com/news/articles/news-001932.php Cheers, Rich Medina Gothambrewery Jamaica Estates, NY gothambrewer at att.com You can observe alot just by watching - Yogi Berra Disclaimer: I am not a BMC fan, just a satisfied non-customer! Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 13:59:15 -0700 (PDT) From: Chuck Doucette <cdoucette61 at yahoo.com> Subject: Re: Anheuser Lager Jeff R. asks about Anheuser Lager. I have seen this beer on a recent trip to the Ozarks in Missouri. I found that curious, being from the St. Louis area. It must be a test marketing of this product. I was curious, but not intrigued enough to buy any at $7.50/six pack (!). Most of the beer I buy, such as Snake Dog IPA, Schlafley Pale Ale, etc are around $5.99/six pack. Not a lot more, but then, my expectations for AB products are not high. I have yet to see it on tap, or even in the bottle here at home. Not even when I went to the AB brewery for a tour recently. Perhaps someone else out there has tasted it and can tell us how it tastes. Chuck Doucette O'Fallon, IL. Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 17:56:49 -0700 From: "Patricia Beckwith" <beckwith at gwtc.net> Subject: Hopfenbitter >Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2003 11:23:06 -0400 >From: David Harsh <dharsh at fuse.net> >Subject: What is "hopfenbitter"? >Greetings- >While traveling in Germany last month, I purchased a bottle of >"Hopfenbitter" at a roadside stand outside of Tettnang.<snip> According to http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~topkiwi/alcohol.html "Hopfenbitter - A German brandy with added hop buds to make it slightly bitter" Hope this helps. Patricia Beckwith Murdo, South Dakota, USA Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 18:04:54 -0500 From: "John Sarette" <j2saret at peoplepc.com> Subject: brew software, misc tools Its summer, I thought I'd try another corn mash and brew a CAP (shades of my Titanic disaster ale just a July ago) Anyway I was checking out the malt mill on beer tools and I used the site designed a CAP based on what I had on hand or thought I could get. The numbers for it were: Original Gravity: 1.049 Color: 4.80 SRM Bitterness: 32.5 IBU When I was ready to brew (today) I used what I actually had on hand and ran the numbers on both pro-mash and q-brew. pro mash says: 1.046 og. srm 5.7 IBU 31.9 q brew says:1.055 og. srm 8 IBU 28 It is obvious that qbrew's author(s)mash and sparge with higher efficiency than I do. I hope to achieve such someday. What I don't understand is the discrepancy in colour and bitterness. (BTW I just checked the mash and thanks to all of Jeff's explaining and re-explaining it has converted perfectly in the expected time. On another subject I saw an add for a Pocket Infra Red Thermometer by extech. Its temp range far exceeds the mashing, brewing and pitching temps needed for homebrew. It sells for $60.00 USD. Is it worth purchasing? I use true brew floating thermometers now for mashing and stick on liquid crystal strips for pitching and fermenting. Or would I be better off getting a real malt mill for my 5 gal batches and staying with the old measuring tech? Thanks John S. Duluth Mn (a little north west of the prime brewridian) "Labor is prior to, and independent of capital. Capital is only the fruit of labour and could never have existed if labor had not first existed. Labor is the superior of capital and deserves much the higher consideratiion." A. Lincoln (1st marxist er Republican president) Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 19:28:01 -0400 From: "Mark Tumarkin" <mark_t at ix.netcom.com> Subject: Savannah Pub Crawl Hey y'all, On August 2nd about 8-10 members of Hogtown Brewers are driving up to Savannah to do a pub crawl. We know about the Moon River brewpub (I believe the only one in town?), and also about some of the beer bars & pubs in town -including Churchill's Pub, Six Pence, O'Connell's, Kevin Barry's, and B&B Billiards. Anyone have any other suggestions to offer? Beer stores to check out? Any locals care to join us? Mark Tumarkin Hogtown Brewers Gainesville, FL Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 20:24:27 -0400 From: "-S" <-s at adelphia.net> Subject: Re: Maximum strength AJ writes .... > And I guess I'm skeptical that it's the diauxic feature of yeast > metabolism. Why would they start to munch alcohol when there was all > that sugar around? The ability of sugars to prevent respiration activity by Crabtee is very dependent on the sugar involved. After glucose, fructose and some maltose are cleared there is little impediment to respiration if O2 is present. I was suggesting open fermenters and late O2 additions could reduce ethanol content. > I have a vague recollection that the brewing strains > don't exhibit this behaviour but I may be thinking of something else. You are thinking of something else. In examining the NCYC website I believe that every brewing yeast that I've checked in this database which has been tested for ethanol as a substrate has tested POSITIVE. For example: http://www.ifrn.bbsrc.ac.uk/ncyc/yeasts/action.lasso Further there are several methods for yeast growth in the distilling and baking industries which involve yeast consuming ethanol as a primary or secondary substrate. Danged little critters have the full genetic mechanisms for gluconeogenesis from alcohol and glycerol too ! > The 5% loss in whisky making is interesting though. Commercially important as well. That info comes from "Distilled beverage flavour : recent developments / edited by J.R. Piggott and A. Paterson 1989" and I sadly don't have a copy handy. There are other references to delayed distillation causing economic inefficiency. > Now what really catches my eye is the glycerol. That might be the answer > (or part of the answer - I'm still convinced that evaporation has > something to do with it). I wouldn't disagree about the evaporation being part. Here is an interesting EPA document which supplies figures for ethanol as a VOC during whiskey fermentation. Perhaps you could 'ballpark' barleywine losses from this. http://www.epa.gov/ttn/chief/ap42/ch09/bgdocs/b9s12-3.pdf 182.2gmEtOH loss/m^3 in a 3-5 day fermentation, large open vats. There are also a lot of papers that analyze fermenter headspace gasses tho'I can't remember one w/ ethanol data. >I always thought it interesting that the > Germans converted their beer production facilities to the production of > glycerine [...] But you skipped the "interesting" part ! In WW2 the Brits cut off German supplies of glycerine(glycerol) for nitroglycerine and the Germans cut off the supply of acetone also for explosives. Germans used the yeast fermentation process above to produce glycerine while the Brits & Allies fermented wort w/ Clostridia to create acetone. Killing each other is one of mankind's cardinal achievements due to this sort of enthusiasm and impressive ingenuity we applied to the task. Make beer not war, I say .... but I digress. -S Return to table of contents
Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2003 21:23:13 -0400 From: Jeff Renner <jeffrenner at comcast.net> Subject: Re: "Anheuser lager"? Thanks to everyone who responded to my question about "Anheuser Lager." There were too many to respond to individually. Enough of them have cc'd HBD for the answer to be posted, so I won't repeat it. I do wonder why the billboard read "Anheuser Lager" rather than "World Select." Perhaps it was painted before the name was decided. Years ago I said to a beer class I was teaching that it was obvious that A/B could make beer better than anyone else in the world, and it they decided to make PU, they could. Sounds like they decided to make Heiniken instead. Too bad. I'll still look forward to tasting it. Our daughter is flying here next month from LAX. I'll ask here to pick up a fresh sixer. Thanks again, all. Great resource. Jeff - -- Jeff Renner in Ann Arbor, Michigan USA, JeffRenner at comcast.net "One never knows, do one?" Fats Waller, American Musician, 1904-1943 Return to table of contents
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