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	FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
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Contents:
  Basement brewery ideas ("Don Anderson")
  Loathing the water in Las Vegas ("Jeffrey Rankert")
  link of the week Nov 29, 2003 (Bob Devine)
  Palm Sync? (Alexandre Enkerli)
  Re: Vegas Water...last post ("Andy and Tina Bailey")
  Plambic fermentation ("John D. Misrahi")
  re: digital thermometers (David Radwin)
  Grain mills (David Passaretti)


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Date: Fri, 28 Nov 2003 21:42:47 -0800
From: "Don Anderson" <beer_guy at comcast.net>
Subject: Basement brewery ideas

Greetings all,

I have just moved into a new house and I now have some space I can dedicate
just to brewing.  I have searched the archive and searched the web (google
is your friend) looking for ideas on just how to lay things out.  I was
wondering if anyone with a basement brewery would be so kind as to pass
along any lessons they have learned from doing something similar.  Things I
already have planned are:
A large sink and counter space.
Tiled floor with drain.
Some type of fixed stands for my HERMS rig that's under construction.
Storage shelves or cabinets.
The room was built for a gas fireplace so it already has gas plumbing and a
metal chimney. I am going to change over from propane to a gas burner and
get some type of hood to connect to the chimney.  There is also a large
window in this room that I can open if needed.

Safety gear: CO2 detector, fire detector, fire extinguisher, GFI wall
sockets.

Thanks for any feedback.
 -Don




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Date: Sat, 29 Nov 2003 10:22:42 -0500
From: "Jeffrey Rankert" <jrankert at msn.com>
Subject: Loathing the water in Las Vegas

Martin Brungard writes-

>I would have expected a lower degree of mineralization for
>a surface water source, but I guess its a long river!

If you see what it flows through, you would not be surprised at the mineral 
content.

All of the Red Rock in Utah is sandstone bound together with calcium 
carbonate, which dissolves into the river.  In the vicinity of Moab Utah, 
there are 'Salt Valleys' that are caused by the collapse of the overlying 
rock when the underlying salt is dissolved by the Colorado river.  Oil 
exploration wells have found that some of the salt layers are 6000 feet 
deep.

On a raft trip on the river, the guide pointed out Gypsum Canyon on the 
south side of the river, and you could see a gray layer at river level of - 
you guessed it - gypsum.

Near Moab there is a Potash plant, where water is pumped into the ground and 
the solution is then dried in ponds.  No one has ever mention this going 
into the river, though.

The last mineral I will mention is a legacy of the cold war.  The tailing 
pile from Atlas minerals is just about across the road from the entrance to 
Arches National Park (the mill was removed as a Superfund site).  It leeches 
into the river.  Radioactive Red Rock Red Ale could be used as a name by 
someone who uses Colorado River water for brewing.

Jeff Rankert -AABG
Milford MI 


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Date: Sat, 29 Nov 2003 20:00:42 -0700
From: Bob Devine <bob.devine at worldnet.att.net>
Subject: link of the week Nov 29, 2003

The US's Prohibition has affected beers and brewing in
innumerable ways in the past 3/4 century.  Companies died;
beer styles changed; and many a story of grandads with
kitchen crock beers have been told.

So how much do you know about it?

Here is a good overview:
  http://prohibition.history.ohio-state.edu/

Here is more than you probably want to know about Prohibition!
  http://www.drugtext.org/library/reports/nc/nc2a.htm

Take a look at the mortality and alcholic disease totals near
the end of the article.  While Prohibition is now widely viewed
as a vast over-reaching of "Big Mother" government, the facts
are that some lives were saved (but much more social destruction
happened in other areas).

Bob Devine


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Date: Sun, 30 Nov 2003 00:29:24 -0500
From: Alexandre Enkerli <aenkerli at indiana.edu>
Subject: Palm Sync?

The more I think about it, the more I feel the killer app for brewing 
tools would be a recipe manager which actually synchronizes with Palm 
devices. There's a number of Palm brewing tools available from 
PalmGear.com (search for "brew") and a few dedicated calculators from 
ProMash.com, but so far I haven't seen a program which would even 
import recipes from desktop programs.
I don't even need full two-way synchronization but I "need" to transfer 
"recipes" from my laptop to a Palm device and then log specifics on the 
Palm.
With the number of beer geeks out there, there must be *someone* who 
could do this.

Alex (aka Ale-X), in Montreal
[555.1km, 62.8] Apparent Rennerian



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Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2003 05:43:07 -0800
From: "Andy and Tina Bailey" <atmlobailey at cox.net>
Subject: Re: Vegas Water...last post

I also sent my original Las Vegas water question to a few top notch brewers
in my local Homebrew Club (SNAFU) and they echoed many of the responses I
got here, that starting with a blank slate of RO water is best. I also got
some other information in one of the local responses that  I thought I would
share with you, because it is really good information. Here it is:

"You also want to be aware, if you aren't already, that the published water
analysis of major brewing areas aren't necessarily what they are brewing
with. Sure, it helped to define the styles, but most are involved in
refining their water to get the best of all tastes of  their products. This
is why brewing books also publish the ranges for each of the ions for
brewing. The one BIG area of disagreement on these was brought up by Dr Fix
on Sodium. A lot of books publish the range as 0-150 ppm, but Fix found that
anything in excess of 75 ppm is bad for beers. This is further stated by
Noonan that brewers stay below 50 ppm, especially in beers where softness is
part of the flavor structure."

Thanks again for the marvelous help (as usual) on the HBD.

Andy Bailey in Las Vegas



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Date: Sun, 30 Nov 2003 11:12:16 -0500
From: "John D. Misrahi" <lmoukhin at sprint.ca>
Subject: Plambic fermentation

I racked a plambic on top of some sour cherries yesterday, and it doesnt
appear to have started fermenting them yet. How long should it take? Is =
the
pH inhibiting fermentation? What should i do (or just be patient, and
RDWHAHB?)


Also, I'd like to invite people to join my plambic digest. It's a bit =
quiet at the moment, but maybe we can change that. The old lambic digest =
had some pretty good discussion from time to time. Just go to this link =
and fill in the form
https://secure.neap.net/mailman/listinfo/plambic

john


John Misrahi,
Montreal, Canada





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Date: Sun, 30 Nov 2003 16:39:41 -0800 (PST)
From: David Radwin <dradwin at yahoo.com>
Subject: re: digital thermometers

I've purchased two detachable probe-type thermometers
in the last several years. One is by Taylor, about $20
at Target, and the other by Polder, about $25 at
amazon.com. Neither one lasted more than a couple of
years, and I even tried covering the wire with
silicone tubing and caulk. However, you can easily buy
a replacement probe for the Polder at amazon (but next
time I'll try the oven trick!).

Although the Taylor's interface is easier to use,
particularly the timer function, only the Polder has
an alarm for the temperature DROPPING to a certain
point, which is really useful for monitoring wort
chilling.

David in Berkeley CA

=====
This email forwards to trash. Please respond to news at remove.davidradwin.com.



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Date: Sun, 30 Nov 2003 17:43:40 -0800 (PST)
From: David Passaretti <dpassaretti at yahoo.com>
Subject: Grain mills

I am thinking of purchasing a grain mill. Does anyone
have any experience with the three roller mills
availabel form cramkandstein. They seem really nice
but perhaps two roller mills work just as well. Any
and all thoughts welcome.


Thanks
David



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