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	FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
		Digest Janitor: pbabcock at hbd.org


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Contents:
  ring around fermenter (leavitdg)
  RE: Yeast Flavor / Aeration ("Thomas T. Veldhouse")
  Re: Yeast Flavor / Aeration (Scott Alfter)
  Aeration ("Peed, John")
  re: ring around my fermenter, and effect of raspberries (RI_homebrewer)


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Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 06:27:08 -0400
From: leavitdg at plattsburgh.edu
Subject: ring around fermenter

I would leave it alone, and not open too often.  My sense is that the bigger 
potential problem is not that but the risk of infection if you open and mess 
with it too much...

Happy Brewing!

 ..Darrell




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Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 07:23:18 -0500
From: "Thomas T. Veldhouse" <veldy at veldy.net>
Subject: RE: Yeast Flavor / Aeration

Bill,

Aeriation serves only one purpose.  It allows the yeast to multiply 
faster than they would in an [free] oxygen free environment.  If the 
initial batch was not as good as subsequent batches, I suspect that the 
initial batch is under pitched and/or under aeriated; the yeast count 
was not high enough for the first batch.  With subsequent batches, the 
yeast will have grown into a sufficienty large population. 

So, would an aeriation kit be a waste of money?  Absolutely not.  It 
does a wonderful job of putting free oxygen into your wort so that your 
yeast can multiply in an environment read made for procreation.

Tom Veldhouse



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Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 09:47:39 -0700
From: Scott Alfter <scott at alfter.us>
Subject: Re: Yeast Flavor / Aeration

gornicwm at earthlink.net wrote:
> First, has anyone ever had experience brewing with generations of
> yeast in which the first generation tastes good and subsequent batches,
> using the slurry of past batches, tastes better.
> 
> I have heard some homebrewers, even some pros, state that subsequent
> generations often have a better flavor signature than earlier batches.
> 
> Is this a myth or is it just the fact of utilizing a greater number of cells
> in subsequent batches.  I have heard this was especially true of wheat 
> yeasts.

I don't yet have direct experience with this, having just made my first batch
with yeast harvested from a previous batch, but I ran across something this
morning that would support the idea that pitching a different amount of yeast
(as you most likely would if you're reusing yeast) can have an effect on flavor:

http://www.whitelabs.com/faq.html

Scroll down to the bottom:

  One thing that contributes to flavor contribution in beer is yeast growth. If
  less yeast is pitched into beer, more yeast growth takes place, so more
  flavor compounds such as esters are produced. Depending on the amount
  produced, this is how pitching rates can have a direct effect on flavor
  profile. If 5 to 10 billion cells are pitched into wort, this definitely has
  a negative flavor impact in terms of higher ester levels and potential for
  bacterial contamination. But does a pint starter worth of yeast (30-50
  billion cells) pitched into beer tasted different then 2 liters worth of
  yeast (250 billion cells)? Sounds like more homebrew has to be made to get to
  the bottom of this! Your feedback is appreciated.

For styles that depend on esters for part of their flavor profile (like abbey
ales and weizens), it'd be interesting to compare batches made with different
pitching rates.

  _/_  Scott Alfter
 / v \ Visit the SNAFU website today!
(IIGS( http://snafu.alfter.us/      Top-posting!
 \_^_/ rm -rf /bin/laden            >What's the most annoying thing on Usenet?



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Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 09:53:49 -0700
From: "Peed, John" <jpeed at elotouch.com>
Subject: Aeration


Bill asks about flavor and repitching, and aeration.  I repitch yeast up
to three times, but I must admit that I've never noticed an improvement
of flavor due to using repitched yeast.  It sure does start fast though!


The best things ever to come down the pike for aerating yeast starters
are the 3 liter Pyrex flask, the foam stopper and the stir plate.  None
of this stuff is cheap, except that you should be able to pick up a used
stir plate on ebay at reasonable expense.  Williams Brewing has the
flask and foam stoppers.  You boil the wort in the flask (the steam
escaping through the foam sanitizes the stopper), then chill it in cold
water.  I sanitize the stir rod separately, along with the funnel,
thermometer and scissors to cut the smack pack open.  You could
boil-sanitize the Teflon-coated stir rod, but it acts as a nucleation
site for bubbles and tends to promote boilovers.  I also mix the DME
into the water in a separate pan, then add it to the flask to avoid
getting stray DME in the flask.  After cooling and adding the yeast and
stir rod, the flask goes on the stir plate.  The stirring action pulls
air through the foam stopper - Williams claims the stopper sanitizes any
air that comes in, and that has proven to be true - as well as agitating
the yeast, both of which promote fast, vigorous yeast growth.  A 1500 mL
starter should be ready in one to two days, and will have nearly double
the yeast that a non-stirred starter will.  I no longer "re-juice"
starters to get even more yeast because I think the additional handling
is undesirable and often the second addition is so active that it foams
out of the flask.  You might be able to get by with a 2 liter flask, but
I think you can make bigger, better starts with a 3 liter one.  My
standard starter is 1500 mL.  And if you go the stir plate route, be
sure to get extra stir bars because you WILL pour them into the
fermenter from time to time!

I've always used a stainless aeration stone and hardware store bottled
oxygen for aerating the wort at pitching time.  Wort aeration and
healthy yeast starters have improved the flavor of my beer immensely,
and I highly recommend both.

John Peed
Oak Ridge, TN



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Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 18:02:31 -0700 (PDT)
From: RI_homebrewer <ri_homebrewer at yahoo.com>
Subject: re: ring around my fermenter, and effect of raspberries

Hi All,

  In HBD #4835 Jason asked about the ring around the inside of
his fermenter at the end of the fermentation.

  This ring is mostly yeast, trub, and hop resins.  You don't
want to add this back into the beer.  Just rack the beer out
of the fermenter and leave it behind.  Make sure you clean it
off the fermenter shortly afterwards though, if it dries on
there it will be difficult to remove.

  Also in HBD #4835, Mike asked about the effect on %ABV of
his addition of raspberries.

  If I remember correctly, raspberries are about 20% sugar by
weight.  Since you added 5 lbs of berries, you effectively
added 1 lb of sugar.  In a 6 gallon batch, that would have
raised your OG by about 7 points.  Assuming all the sugar went
into the beer and was fermented by the yeast, your %ABV is a
little less than %1 higher due to the raspberries.

  Raspberries are fairly acidic.  That's probably where the
tartness you noticed came from.  It's probably not going to
mellow much as the beer ages in the bottle.


Jeff McNally
Tiverton, RI
(652.2 miles, 90.0 deg) A.R.
South Shore Brew Club


		


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