---

	FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
		Rob Gardner, Digest Coordinator


Contents:
  gingered ale (Dick Dunn)
  Dutch Trappist Ales (DAVID)
  Un p'tit rien (Eric Rose)
  Grolsch bottles (Mahan_Stephen)
  homebrewers picnic (Stephen Russell)
  Black patent in wheat beers (mcnally)
  We wuz HAD!  A Cautionary Tale ... (Martin A. Lodahl)
  hops measurement question (Steve Bagley)
  Recipe Book (lutzen)
  Barm and Rye (BAUGHMANKR)
  Re: mead ferment times (HBD#637) (David Lim)
  Clarification (C.R. Saikley)
  Re: Archives out of date ("a.e.mossberg")
  Strange hoplike herbs (hersh)
  re re sanitation (Chip Hitchcock)
  Re: mead ferment times (Steve Dempsey)
  Honey Lager (kjohnson)
  Indiana Univ. & BEER ("Schnabel,Eric S")
  Miller's book (Norm Hardy)


Send submissions to homebrew%hpfcmi at hplabs.hp.com
Send requests to homebrew-request%hpfcmi at hplabs.hp.com
[Please do not send me requests for back issues]
Archives are available from netlib at mthvax.cs.miami.edu


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: 15 May 91 02:19:36 MDT (Wed)
From: ico.isc.com!rcd at raven.eklektix.com (Dick Dunn)
Subject: gingered ale

hersh at expo.lcs.mit.edu claims:

> And a warning to all planning to attend the AHA conference. I am brewing up a
> batch of my soon to be infamous Gingered Pale Ale (4 oz chopped ginger, 2oz
> Eroica + some Sticklbract), talk about a beer with a bite. Look for it at the
> AHA club night or the Wort Processors Courtesy Suite.

Hmmm...have things gone so far downhill at the conference that a gingered
ale is once again a threat?   Especially with only 4 oz ginger, a mere
pittance!...or was this only a 2-gallon batch?!?  (In '84, our amber
gingered ale took a first in Specialty.  We used 9.5 oz ginger in 5 gal.
Try it; you'll like it.)

Seriously...I wish Jay the best, and I wish more people would try ginger
for specialty beers.  It's a wonderful addition.  In particular, the combi-
nation of a gingered, well-hopped pale ale with good Chinese food (Hunan/
Szechuan), or with barbecue, is a match made in heaven.
 ---
Dick Dunn    rcd at raven.eklektix.com   -or-   raven!rcd


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Date: Wed, 15 MAY 91 12:54:47 BST
From: GAINS at vax.lse.ac.uk

Having recieved a *considerable* number of requests for recipes for
Bishops Tipple and Old Peculier, I have decided to send the recipes
and quoted method to HBD. This is quite a lengthy message and I
apologise to those who have the book. For those who haven't,
however, the details are:

    Brewing Beers like those you buy
                   - David Line
                     ISBN 0 900841 51 6

It is/was published in GB by The Standard Press (Andover) Ltd.,
South St, Andover, Hants, England and is an Amateur Winemaker
publication. I don't think it has been released in the states.

It contains *many* recipes for Lagers, Light Ales, Pale Ales, Keg
Beers, Brown Ales, Stouts, Barley Wines and Strong Ales. Most beers
included are British, although there is a section on Beers of the
World, including Chimay, Pilsner Urquell, Grolsch etc. Best though,
is the Real Ale section with *43* recipes - many of which are
authentic, that is to say they have been adapted from the true
recipe and techniques used by the brewery. I have brewed several of
the Real Ales, and can verify in most cases that results are good,
and occasionally better than the original:-) Most are all-grain
brews.
 
Old Peculier - Theakstons, Masham, N Yorks (Approx 6% Alcohol)

   15     Litres of water treated for 'brown ale' brewing (although 
          it is not a Brown Ale!) 
   2000g  Dark malt extract
   250g   Crushed roast Barley
   250g   Crushed crystal malt
   1000g  Soft dark brown sugar
   60g    Fuggles hops (or extract)
   5      Saccharin tablets
   60g    Brewers Yeast
   100g   Black treacle ;-)

Boil extract, malt grains + hops in water for 45mins. Strain into
bin and sparge the grain and hops with hot water.  Dissolve sugar
in hot water and add to bin. Top up to *25* litres with cold water.
When at room temp, pitch in yeast and saccharin. Ferment until
activity dies down and rack into secondary. Fit airlock. After 7
days rack into a barrel primed with treacle. After seven days
conditioning it should be ready to sample:-)


Bishops Tipple - Gibb Mew, Salisbury (OG 1066)

   3500g Crushed pale malt
   500g  Crushed crystal malt
   15g   Crushed black malt
   15    Litres of water treated for 'strong ale' brewing
   5ml   Irish moss
   750g  Golden syrup
   60g   Molasses
   100g  Goldings hops
   5     Saccharin tablets
   60g   Brewers yeast
   15g   Gelatine
   60g   White Sugar (for priming)

Raise water to 60C and stir in crushed malt. Stir continuously
raise temp to 66C, retain at this temp for 1.5 hrs. Contain mashed
grain in a grain bag to retrieve sweet :-) wort. Sparge grains with
hot (~70C) water to collect 20 litres of extract. Boil extract with
hops for 1.5 hrs. Dissolve molasses and sugar in some hot water and
add during boil. Pitch Irish moss. Strain clear wort into bin and
top up to *20* litres with cold water. When cool add yeast and
saccharin. Ferment until sg 1020, rack into secondary, add
gelatine, and fit airlock. After 10 days rack into primed barrel.
Sample after 10 days.

These are Lines recipes and method, not mine, and *should* be
experimented with, for example to capture cold break or to replace
unavailable ingredients. Suggested improvements would be welcomed.

I would appreciate hearing from anyone who has a go at these
recipes, and will answer brief queries. Much arm-twisting would be
required, though, if I am to release any more recipes. I am,
however, compiling a recipe and method database and will send to
anyone interested. Contributions of course are welcome.

Finally I am glad to hear of your healthy loathing of American Bud.


Ade

[ Obvious disclaimer on above! ]

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Date:    Wed, 15 May 1991 8:08:21 EDT
From: POORE at SCRI1.SCRI.FSU.EDU (DAVID)
Subject: Dutch Trappist Ales

I got some good advice on Beligian beers available in France to have my 
mother get for me this summer (thanks Martin!). However, no word on Dutch 
Trappist Ales. One of the Beer Hunter episodes had a bit about these brews 
and breweries which left me in a bad state: rolling around on the floor 
drooling. Most unattrative. Can any one help me out? What brand Dutch 
Trappist Ales (if any) would be available in Paris?

Also, re: the cantilever cappers. I also ditched mine in favor of a bench 
capper. Broken bottles etc. The problem I had with it is that it wouldn't 
work on all bottle types (even with the adjustable collar) and it didn't 
mash the caps on completely. The bench capper works on everything and is 
much fast and safer. They can be had cheaply and easily by haunting a 
couple flea markets or garage sales.

David Poore
poore at gw.scri.fsu.edu

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Date: Wed, 15 May 91 9:45:22 EDT
From: Eric Rose <rose at aecom.yu.edu>
Subject: Un p'tit rien



For every wound, a balm
For every sorrow, cheer
For every storm, a calm
For every thirst, a beer

                ----Kwoted in Geo. Herriman's "Krazy Kat" komic strip, 1918

- -- 

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Date: Wed, 15 May 91 08:45:00 CST
From: Mahan_Stephen at lanmail.ncsc.navy.mil
Subject: Grolsch bottles


Lee Katman asked about the suitibility of Grolsch bottles.  They work
great.  Check the gaskets before starting bottling and replace those 
that are questionable.

     I usually bottle using both 12 oz. (IBC root beer) and 16 oz. 
(Grolsch) bottles.  The 12 oz. bottles are good for giveaways, as my 
family consumes enough root beer to keep up the supply.  The Grolsch 
bottles are MINE.  I can bottle in Grolsch by myself in one pass, 
running the bottle filler with one hand, and capping and filling the 
case with the other hand.  Conventional capping usually needs a helper 
or two passes, putting caps on as I fill and then crimping after all 
bottles are filled.

On the same topic:

>I like to use the Grolsch re-sealable bottles for bottling.  The are
>16 ounces and they are re-sealable.  Capping is a breeze!  The problem
>however, is getting them.  Does anyone know where I could get a lot at
>a reasonable price?  I know I can get the gaskets, but the bottles?
>Or similar ones?

I found a German bar locally that saves them for me.  I get about a case 
every week or two at no charge.  I'm currently stocking up for myself 
and two or three brewing friends.  Zymurgy usually has an ad from some 
people that sell Grolsch-like bottles (at an unknown price).  They are:

E.Z.Cap Bottle Distrubutors
4224 Chippewa Road N.W.
Calgary, Alberta, Cananda T2L 1A3
phone:  403 282-5972

I see the Grolsch bottles occasionally at the flea markets in small 
quantities, but the asking price is around $1.00 per bottle.  You could 
also make the sacrifice and buy and drink a few cases of Grolsch beer.

steve
mahan_stephen at lanmail.ncsc.navy.mil

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Date: Wed, 15 May 91 11:49:19 EDT
From: srussell at snoopy.msc.cornell.edu (Stephen Russell)
Subject: homebrewers picnic

Hi folks,

For those of you in the Central or Western New York areas, there's a home-
brewers' picnic in Trumansburg, NY, this Sunday from 1 to 4 pm.  Trumansburg
is about 10 miles NNW of Ithaca and not too far from Rochester, Syracuse, and
Binghamton.  Guests are requested to bring homebrew and/or a dish-to-pass, 
plus lawn chairs, a drinking glass, frisbees, musical instruments, children, 
small farm animals....wait a minute!  There'll be some interesting homebrews,
including Nettle Beer, various Belgian beers, plus fruit juice for the kids. 

Please e-mail directly to me for directions, srussell at snoopy.msc.cornell.edu

Happy fermentations,

Steve



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Date: Wed, 15 May 91 08:26:51 -0700
From: mcnally at wsl.dec.com
Subject: Black patent in wheat beers


I'm not a purist, so I have no moral indignation at putting black patent
in a wheat beer.  However, it is almost certainly not what German 
brewers do to make Dunkelweizenbier.  More probably, they use a Vienna
malt.  Dunkelweizens are generally pretty sweet, with no tannic bite.

One of the best dark wheat beers I've ever had was a Weizenbock called
"Aventinus".  I had it in Munich.  It's produced by a brewer that's
relatively big but unknown in the states; I don't remember the name.
Aventinus is really a fabulous beer, and it's served in the niftiest
weissbier glasses I've ever seen.

- --------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mike McNally                                           mcnally at wsl.dec.com
Digital Equipment Corporation
Western Software Lab

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Date: Wed, 15 May 91 8:53:55 PDT
From: Martin A. Lodahl <pbmoss!malodah at PacBell.COM>
Subject: We wuz HAD!  A Cautionary Tale ...

I'm passing on an experience our club had last night, to put you all
on your guard against being duped as we were.  The observations and
opinions that follow are mine and mine alone, and don't necessarily
represent those of even a single other member of my brewclub.  And
please forgive the length, but I believe this to be important.

A long-time member (and local pub brewer) contacted another
long-time member and past President (and M. D.) to give a talk to
the club about responsible drinking and the effects of alcohol.  So
far, so good.  Part of the talk was to be the ritual demonstration
of getting a few "designated drunks" plastered, after assuring they
wouldn't be driving, to demonstrate the effects of various levels of
blood alcohol content.  To provide a consistent means of testing
this, and to "sharpen the point" of the demonstration, a
representative of the California Highway Patrol was invited.  I
don't know who invited Channel 13 News.

The lead story on the 11PM newscast was on DUI (it must have been a
slow news day), the anchorperson fairly trembling with indignation
and righteousness, and our club serving as unwitting shill for
neoprohibitionist extremism in an amazingly crude form.  Certainly
none of us had ever imagined the footage would be used in this way.
Fortunately, the name of the club was never mentioned, nor was
anything said about its being a gathering of homebrewers;  it's
possible the "reporter" (who stood very much aloof, at the meeting)
was unaware of the type of gathering the CHP officer was addressing.

We are under attack, and must be very careful of the image we present,
how we present it, and to whom.

= Martin A. Lodahl   			  Pacific*Bell Staff Analyst =
= malodah at pbmoss.Pacbell.COM       Sacramento, CA       916.972.4821 =
= If it's good for ancient Druids, runnin' nekkid through the wuids, =
= Drinkin' strange fermented fluids, it's good enough for me!  8-)   =


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Date: 	Wed, 15 May 1991 09:29:29 PDT
From: Steve Bagley <bagley at parc.xerox.com>
Subject: hops measurement question

Hi.  I'm wondering about the difference between leaf and pellet hops.  Is
one type the "standard"?  If a recipe says "2 oz. Cascade", which type are
they referring to?  Assuming that I can figure out which type they intended
how much of the other type should I substitute?

Thanks.

- --Steve


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Date: Wed, 15 May 91 11:36:36 CDT
From: lutzen at phys1.physics.umr.edu (lutzen)
Subject: Recipe Book


Are you tired of searching through the Homebrew Archives trying to
find just the right recipe?  Have you ever wanted to have a nicely 
formatted book of recipes from the Homebrew Archives?  Well, then
keep reading, because Mark Stevens and Karl Lutzen are proud to 
announce the release of their Homebrewing Recipe book, 'The Cat's Meow'.
In it you will find a collection of recipes taken from the Homebrew Digest
archives.  After many hours of filtering through the archives, many
more hours of editing, the book is now ready for public consumption.
Rush right out via FTP to the homebrew archives, mthvax.cs.miami.edu,
and change directories to homebrew/recipe-book.  Here you will find
the 15 parts of the book in compressed format.  Please do not forget
to set type binary before transferring the files!  After the files 
in your machine and are uncompressed, you will have PostScript 
formatted files ready to go directly to your Laser printer.  (Please
note: A plain ascii version will be available upon an email request to 
Karl Lutzen at lutzen at apollo.physics.umr.edu.  It should be ready in about
2 weeks). 

So rush right out and get your copy of 'The Cat's Meow' today!

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Date: Wed, 15 May 1991 11:49 EST
From: BAUGHMANKR at CONRAD.APPSTATE.EDU
Subject: Barm and Rye

Various and sundry comments:

Dr. John:
I always thought that 'barm' was the clean, 'hot', recently deposited
yeast in the secondary.

Florian:
A cautionary note.  I've been told to be wary of grains bought in feed
stores.  Being fit for animal consumption doesn't mean being
FDA approved for human consumption.  They have all sorts of
fertilizers, chemicals, etc. floating around in the air in those
warehouses for one thing.  For another, they spray all sorts of
fertilizers and chemicals on grains while they're growing.  They may
or may not clean them if they're destined for the grain hopper in a
barn somewhere.

There's no advantage to laying beer bottles on their side as I see it.
It's necessary to keep corks damp in order to insure an air tight
seal.  The crimping of the crown around the upper neck of a bottle
does the job for capped beer.

Cheers!

Kinney


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Date: Wed, 15 May 91 11:08:38 MDT
From: David Lim <limd at sulu.Colorado.EDU>
Subject: Re: mead ferment times (HBD#637)

Ken Johnson asks about mead fermentation times...

Ah, the mysterious world of mead.  I've made three batches of mead, and I've
yet to discover what *really* makes them tick.  The first batch was a plain
still mead (no fruit or stuff.)  I used a little acid blend (to get pH around
3.5) a little yeast nutrient (about 2/3 tsp for 5gal) and some Lalvin K-1
wine yeast.  The K-1 yeast is one of the so-called "killer" strains which
produces a substance (enzymes, i believe?) which kills off, or at least inhibits
the growth of other competing micro-organisms.  This batch took a few months
to ferment from an OG of abut 1.100.  It stalled at about two weeks at about
1.060.  I added some more nutrient and some more yeast - this time a more
attenuative strain of S. Bayanus made by Lalvin.  I wasn't sure if this yeast
would take hold since there was the K-1 killer yeast already in the fermenter.
However, it did go to completion (about 1.002 on my hydrometer) in a few months.
My guess at why it took so long to ferment was that I didn't aerate the
mixture enough prior to pitching.

My second batch, a raspberry mead, had only a slightly lower OG (1.090) and
was aerated *thoroughly* prior to pitching.  Same S. Bayanus yeast, no
yeast nutrient or acid blend (I figure the raspberries would take care
of this for me.)  This batch had a very active fermentation - I had to 
attach a blow-off tube to the fermenter!  This was *not* the classic lazy
mead fermentation.  The mead reached a final gravity of 1.000 in  1 1/2 weeks!
It's still a beautiful deep red!  Can't wait until it's a year or so old
in the bottle.

Moral of the story: Aerate the cooled honey mixture!  I don't have enough
experience to make real scientific claims, but if you don't supply enough
oxygen for the yeast for the respiratory phase, it only makes sense that
the classic slow, possibly stalled fermentation could result.  It needs
enough O2 to form a large enough population to handle all that food.

Though aeration of a batch under fermentation is not a good thing (oxygen
is bad after in the anaerobic phase of the yeast life cycle), I did it anyways
with the first batch to see if I could kick start it.  It did eventually
go to completion and tastes fine. Not award-winning, but entirely enjoyable.

Good Luck!
 -Dave Lim (limd at sulu.colorado.edu)

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Date: Wed, 15 May 91 10:14:06 PDT
From: grumpy!cr at uunet.UU.NET (C.R. Saikley)
Subject: Clarification

From: "Dr. John" <JELJ at CORNELLA.cit.cornell.edu>


>C.R. are you sure you want to put roasted barley where you have?  Your chart
>implies that roasted barley is roasted flaked barley, and interesting concept
>but one which I have yet to encounter (all the roasted barley I've seen, and
>bought has been whole corns).  Perhaps the roasted barley should be on its own
>branch?

Sorry for the confusion. I didn't mean to imply that roasted barley was made
from flaked barley, but that neither roasted or flaked barley went through
the malting process.

If roasted flaked barley sounds interesting, you could try roasting it 
yourself. It would probably be most suited to a stout. Dave Miller talks
about roasting your own grains. He makes it sound very hard. The transcripts
from the 1990 AHA conference contain another discussion about roasting
grains. I think the talk was given by Randy Mosher. He makes it sound easy.

CR


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Date: Wed, 15 May 91 12:46:04 -0400
From: "a.e.mossberg" <aem at mthvax.cs.miami.edu>
Subject: Re: Archives out of date

In list.homebrew you write:

>Sorry to post this, but I got no response from -request.  Maybe somebody can
>answer this:

I have received no letters from you.

>Why has the archive not been updated since January?  I want to delete
>the digests I have saved but I won't do so until they show up in the
>archive.  I see that there are files called "9102.index", etc., but I
>can't read them.

All digests are available. The monthly digests have not been updated,
true, but all of the individual ones from the last monthly digest are
contained in ~ftp/pub/homebrew/incoming


aem
- -- 
aem at mthvax.cs.miami.edu .......................................................
If you crumple your money into little balls, it will never stick together.
							- David Byrne


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Date: Wed, 15 May 91 13:47:17 EDT
From: hersh at expo.lcs.mit.edu
Subject: Strange hoplike herbs



Well recently I was judging the fruit/herb beer category at the Southern New
England homebrewing competition. One of the beers was a chamomille/marigold
beer brewed by the very noteworthy Ron Paige. I personally didn't like it cause
of the marigold flavors, but it was a well brewed beer and many others liked it.

Ron is part owner/operator of the brewers of Atlantic Amber, I think they're
called the Connecticut Brewing Co. and are located in Norwalk Conn., though I'm
not 100% sure of the breweries name.

JaH


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Date: Wed, 15 May 91 13:50:52 EDT
From: cjh at diaspar.HQ.Ileaf.COM (Chip Hitchcock)
Subject: re re sanitation

>				If you are siphoning from the
> secondary, it will take longer for the bacteria to get started, but if
> you lager or age in the bottle for any length of time you *will* see an
> infection.  

Nonsense! I have been tasting bottles from last Fall and last Spring, all
siphoned by mouth-starting, and have had \\no// gushers---maybe your "any
length of time" is over a year? The bacteria in your mouth aren't wimps,
but they aren't guaranteed to get a foothold from the minimal contact of
mouth-starting, especially in finished beer and/or if you avoid sucking the
beer right into your mouth (I use a long enough tube that I can suck it
about half full, then work the air out of the rest of it by gravity).

You're right that it's not good to be casual about sanitation; you don't
know when something's around that's going to be a problem, and it would be
a shame to ruin a batch that's cost a lot of time. But there's a limit to
how fanatical you want to be; if you use water to start your siphon, do you
boil it? I sanitize everything (10-60 minutes in std bleach solution) and
have had only one spoiled batch, which had two vulnerable periods: >3-day
lag, probably from dead yeast (I repitched after ~2), and 1 day in closed
racking bucket because I found after racking that the spring in my filler
had been corroded by overexposure to bleach, and I couldn't replace it
immediately (as a dex 3 I didn't even consider trying to bottle with a
pinch siphon).


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Date: Wed, 15 May 91 13:09:37 MST
From: Steve Dempsey <steved at longs.LANCE.ColoState.Edu>
Subject: Re: mead ferment times

In HBD #637 kjohnson at argon.berkeley.edu (Ken Johnson) writes:

> I bought 15 lb of honey for 5 gal.  It's been fermenting for about 5
> weeks right now.  OG 1100 SG 1060 right now.  If it will finish near 1000,
> how long is this going to take before I can bottle?  The yeast was Red Star
> Champagne, and the ingredients were water and honey.  Should I add some
> yeast nutrient next time?

Red Star Champagne is a pretty good yeast, highly attenuative.  But 15
pounds should have put your OG well above 1.100, probably closer to 1.120.
I have consistently had OG 1.100 using only 12 pounds, which usually works
out to exactly one gallon of honey per 5 gallons of mead.  Most champagne
yeasts will attenuate about 100 SG points before the alcohol kills them.
Using 15 pounds should finish above 1.000 in the medium-sweet range.

What temperature is your primary?  Unless you pitch a healthy quantity of
yeast and ferment fairly warm, things can go fairly slowly.  I know guys
who do meads at 80F and complete primary in 7-10 days.

Nutrients are important in meads because there's not much in honey except
sucrose/dextrose.  It's also very easy to overdo the nutrients and end up
with an unpleasant, bitter chemical mess.  I'm down to 2 tsp nutrient per
five gallons and have gotten rid of the nutrient flavors.  The aroma will
come through in some of the drier meads but I'm working towards medium
and sweet meads and this problem should work itself out.

Unless you want to wait 6 months for this thing to attenuate, my advice
would be to boil up 1 tsp nutrient in a cup of water throw it in.  Activity
should pick up for a while and maybe even complete.  If it slows down again,
another dose of 1/4 or 1/2 tsp nutrient may get it going once more.  Or just
relax and wait for it to finish on its own; as long as you can perceive that
it is still active, it should be just fine (some day).

 -Steve

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Date: Wed, 15 May 91 12:30:38 -0700
From: kjohnson at gold.berkeley.edu
Subject: Honey Lager

I want to try making an all grain honey lager.  I was just going to make a
regular batch and add some honey.  So what kind of malt/honey ratios work?
For a five gal batch with a normal starting gravity of 1050, how much honey
could I add?  One, two, five pounds?  I assume the fermentation will take a
very long time.  Any comments about honey beer experience very welcome.

kj

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Date: Wed, 15 May 91 23:09:12 cdt
From: "Schnabel,Eric S" <SCHNABEE%GRIN1.BITNET at CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU>
Subject: Indiana Univ. & BEER


   JUst finished some of YOUNG'S OLD NICKS and it is definately a winner. I
was just thinking if anyone out their knows of some brew clubs and suppliers
in the Bloomington Indiana area. I'm moving out within the next week and will
be going to grad school for a while. If anybody has any info I'ld sure
could use the help.

        Thanks,
        Eric Schnabee

ps. are their brewpubs in the area??

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Date: Wed, 15 May 91 21:45:01 PDT
From: polstra!norm at uunet.UU.NET (Norm Hardy)
Subject: Miller's book

Starting to brew in 1985 I read Papazian's book and was led by the hand by
the wit and knowledge of the author.  Even today the book is used as a
reference for some of the charts on mashing or style recipes.

I grew weary of the light-hearted banter, accentuated by similar recipes 
and articles in zymurgy.  It seemed that Charlie was intent on keeping the
extract makers in business and the *serious* homebrewers making mediocre
beer.  Still, I read the book and the articles.

What attracted me to Miller's book was the attention to detail and the
answers to many questions I had.  I find Miller to be a little too serious
at times and abit off at other times (like his stand on bleach for instance).
But, by and large, I picked up MANY tips to improve my homebrewing, and
they worked.  At the same time that liquid yeasts became easily available,
my brews took a quantum leap in quality.  

Now, being a bit jaded and a little burnt out, I brew less often (maybe
once a month) but make the best beer yet.  Miller's book was a definite
step upward for me.

Who wants to talk about Fix's book or Noonan's book?  Is it true that Noonan
now runs an ale brewery?

Norm Hardy

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End of HOMEBREW Digest #638, 05/16/91
*************************************
-------

---