FORUM ON BEER, HOMEBREWING, AND RELATED ISSUES
		Rob Gardner, Digest Coordinator


Contents:
  Avoiding Disaster, The BEEB, Sparging (Jack Schmidling)
  Electronic weighing scale (Larry Barello)
  Boston Beer Blah... (Jay Hersh)
  Re: Beechwood Aging (jay marshall 283-5903)
  Mega Batch (HELP) :*) (Warren Kiefer)
  scale up ("Brett Lindenbach")
  Yeast, Pumps, Propane and Festivals (Jeff Copeland)
  Source for maple syrup (Mark J. Easter)
  The post about the Boston Brewing Co. (yoost)
  Homebrewing in France (Mark Hadwen x4449)
  Plugs vs. pellets (James Dipalma)
  Boston Beer Company Law Suit (Greg_Habel)
  pin vs ball-lock (Dan Watson)
  Beechwood Fining (Josh Grosse)
  Glass Airlocks... (Nick Cuccia)


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----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 May 92 21:36 CDT
From: arf at ddsw1.mcs.com (Jack Schmidling)
Subject: Avoiding Disaster, The BEEB, Sparging

 
 To: Homebrew Digest
 Fm: Jack Schmidling
 
 >From: fjdobner at ihlpb.att.com
 
 
 >I have a rather large ten gallon brewpot that was a gift from my father in
 which I brew everything including extract and all grain. When I am doing
 all grain brews however, I must lug this thing with about 5-7 gallons of
 boiling hot liquid through my kitchen, living room, down a flight of stairs,
 across my basement to my workshop which is where I have an area cool enough
 (unfinished part of the basement) to ferment anytype of ale or lager.
 
 The most obvious step would be to chill the wort in the kitchen before moving 
 it downstairs.
 
 If your are going to ferment in the kettle, all you need is enough gal jugs 
 to hold the wort till you get it cleaned out and moved downstairs.  If you 
 have a separate fermenter, you only need one.  The aeration it gets being 
 glugged from the jug into the fermenter is also useful for oxyginating the 
 wort prior to pitching.
 
 Personally, I would never carry boiling stuff around.  You are just asking 
 for trouble.
 
 >From: Jay Hersh <hersh at expo.lcs.mit.edu>
 
 
 >I just got off the phone with someone at the BBC.
  
 >They said they have to do this in order to protect
 their trademark, and their product integrity (i.e. if the BBW brews bad beer
 they don't want it getting confused with the BBC)
 
 I suppose I am being sucked into another ... duhhhh
 
 But I listen to the BBC every night and just do not see how one confuse their 
 excellent programming with bad beer.
 
 >From: Darren Evans-Young <DARREN at ua1vm.ua.edu>
 >Subject:      All-Grain questions
 
 >I got no responses to my inquiry about sparge water level in the
 grain bed. Perhaps you all-grain brewers will send me mail indicating
 whether your sparge water level is above or below the top of the
 grain bed..also, if you have any reasons why you choose that method.
 I'll post a summary of the responses I receive.
 
 Now I suppose tomorrow's Digest will be flooded with answers.  I assumed 
 there would be no shortage of responses.
 
 Here's the word from the World's Greatet Brewery, the home of ARF Generic 
 Ale......
 
 Unless you can spray the sparge water, evenly over the entire surface for the 
 total sparge time, it is most efficient to keep the water level above the 
 grain top.  This keeps the whole mess in solution until you are into the 
 dregs.
 
 >Sparge water amount:
 
 >I'm planning a brew using 15lbs of pale malt.  Using 1 qt/lb of grain,
 I'll be using 4 gallons of water in the mash.
 
 Sounds a little stiff.  But the important point is that you have a nice 
 creamy "dough-in".  It should be about the consistancy of runny oatmeal.  I 
 use 3.5 gals with 10 lbs malt.
 
 > Do I still sparge with 5  gallons?  Less?  More?
 
 You sparge till the gravity gets below 1.010.  Depending on lots of variables 
 you should get 10 to 15 gals of wort from 15 lbs.  You can quit anytime you 
 want but you are just throwing away good beer.
 
 
js

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Date: Tue, 19 May 92 07:16:05 PDT
From: polstra!larryba at uunet.UU.NET (Larry Barello)
Subject: Electronic weighing scale

On page C9 of the 5/19 Wall Street Journal there is an ad for an electronic
weighing scale.  It claims 1gm resolution (no mention of accuracy) and a
range > 5lb or 2kg.  THe price is $49.00, incl shipping.  Sounds like 
a good deal since nice, spring loaded scales (e.g. braun, etc) cost $20-
$30.  It has selectable Oz, Gm display and a taring function.

The place is:   Nam Tai Electonics Ltd.
		#B101-4185
		Still Creek Drive
		Burnaby, B.C., V5C 6G9
		Canada

		1-800-661-8831

They take visa.  The model number is CR-111

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Date: Tue, 19 May 92 11:14:43 EDT
From: Jay Hersh <hersh at expo.lcs.mit.edu>
Subject: Boston Beer Blah...


Sorry this was a cc of a message to a local discussion group.

BBC is Boston Beer Co. makers of Sam Adams products.
BBW is Boston Beer Works, a respectable new brewpub that just opened 
across the street from Fenway Park.

Seems the BBC waited until after the BBW had opened (i.e. purchased signage, 
did lots of interior decorating with the BBW name, printed stuff like
coasters, menus, napkins, etc....)  and then decided to sue them over the
name (they have trademarked Boston Beer Co and claim the BBW name is too
similar, and thus must enforce or lose their trademark).

Since everyone else around here knew for months before hand what the name of
the place was gonna be, we find it hard to believe that the Sam Adams folks 
could have missed it. Also since they market their stuff under the Sam Adams
name (and few buyers actualy know the real name of the company, i.e. BBC)
many are dubious of the claim that the BBW name intereferes or threatens the
BBCs product. Most of us feel like the Sam Adams people if they had a gripe
should have engaged in discussion up front and come to some reasonable solution.


Don't want to take up any more bandwidth, but if you want to call and gripe, 
the number is 617-522-3400 I think an address is on the side of the bottles,
there is none in the phone book and i don't know off hand (well it I think the
bottles say The Brewery, Germania St., Boston, Ma... zip=?????)

 -JaH

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Date: Tue, 19 May 92 11:19:25 CDT
From: jay marshall 283-5903 <marshall at sweetpea.jsc.nasa.gov>
Subject: Re: Beechwood Aging

 michael at wupsych.wustl.edu (Michael Biondo) writes:


>I know AB makes a big deal of their "Beechwood Aged" process and in fact
>have actually seen the large collander-like trollies full of chips that are
>inserted into the lagering tanks, and also the special washing machines the
>chips are washed in prior to reuse. (I think the chips are reused 5 times)
>But until reading the above caption from Jackson (Woo! nice rhyme...), I
>never realized that the beechwood was actually used as a fining agent.

The A-B Asst. Brewmeister that came to our brewclub meeting told us
that the beechwood chips are used to provide more surface area for
the yeast.  He didn't mention anything about fining.  We are going on
a personalized tour of the Houston facility sometime soon, so I'll have to
ask about that.

Jay
marshall at sweetpea.jsc.nasa.gov



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Date: Tue, 19 May 1992 10:27:50 MDT
From: oopwk at terra.oscs.montana.edu (Warren Kiefer)
Subject: Mega Batch (HELP) :*)


Howdy All,

	This is it, my brew buddy and I are ready to take the plunge into
some larger batches, we have aquired a nice 40-45 gal. stainless steel vat 
from a nearby dairy, even has a stirring wand in it !! We have a nice pump
to help do the sparge and as of this moment we have four 10 gal. milk cans
to be used for something ??  We also have a Creole Cook'r and a 100lb. 
propane tank. So I would really like some input from all of you on how 
much grain, hops and so forth we would need for a batch of this size.
	As of now we are still doing 5 gal. batches, so we use 1.33 qts.
of water per lb. of grain, if we use 10 lbs. of grain we mash with approx. 
11 qts. and use around 5 gals. of water to sparge with. So if we want to make
30 gals. of beer do we just use 6 times as much of everything ??
Say 60lbs. grain, 20 gals, of mash water and 15 gals. to sparge with ???
        So if there is anyone out there who has experience doing the mega 
batches, could you please help us out, maybe a recipe ???  Any ideas on
how to crush the grain ??  We've got some cleaning to do so we probably won't
try it for another couple of weeks or so. Any suggestions would be greatly
appreciated !!  I can honestly say I've never REALLY worried about any of 
the 5 gal. batches before, but I am getting a tad worried about 30 gals. of
brew, I'm sure once I see and smell 30 gals. of black as night stout, I WILL
relax :*)
	Yes I can hear it now :

              Me:  How many pounds of Northern Brewer do you have ??

Homebrew Supply :  Do you mean pounds or ounces ??

	      Me:  You heard me right, I mean pounds !!

Homebrew Supply :  Uh, okay, let me check !!

	      Me:  Great, you don't happen to have a pallet of grain !!


   

                                  Keep on Brewin'  we're gettin there..

- ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|~~~|_     "A mug a day             Warren R. Kiefer    
|ale|_)     keeps the DOC away !"   BITnet: oopwk at mtsunix1
|___|                               INTERnet: oopwk at terra.oscs.montana.edu  
                                    MSU Computing Center
"All opinions are definitely mine"  
_____________________________________________________________________________


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Date: 19 May 1992 11:09:18 -0600
From: "Brett Lindenbach" <Brett_Lindenbach at qms1.life.uiuc.edu>
Subject: scale up

                       Subject:                              
Time:11:08 AM
  OFFICE MEMO          scale up                              
Date:5/19/92
js writes>> all the extra stages.  I can't believe the yeast cares
whether it is in a 
	>> gallon of wort or an ounce.

bb replies>I don't agreee with this statement...i.e., If you dilute 
	>yeast too much, they seem to slow down
 	>more than proportionately.

While on this topic, I thought I'd bring up my experience. First, I
bring up active 
cultures from single colonies (see my "too-scientific" yeast primer
from a few issues
ago). I have found that it is best to scale up gradually (ie. single
colony --> small 
culture--> large culture, etc.). The reason is purely from the
perspective of
avoiding contamination. If you inoculate a medium with 1% active cells,
it has
a greater chance of outcompeting anything in that other 99% than if you
inoculate
with only .001%. This is a well established fact that is exploited by
people who
run fermentations (including non-alcoholic ones). Also consider that
most home-
brewers do not sterilize, but only sanitize their wort through boiling.
Thus, you
will be doing your yeast a favor if you give them a numerical advantage
over other
organisms. The bottom line: SCALING UP PRESERVES CULTURE INTEGRITY.
Hope this clears things up. Cheers!
 -BDL





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Date: Tue, 19 May 92 10:27:53 -0600
From: copeland at calypso.atmos.colostate.edu (Jeff Copeland)
Subject: Yeast, Pumps, Propane and Festivals


Got about 8cents to put in:

	1)  Jeff Mizener was asking about siphoning:  I would think some
            sort of fluid pump for indoor fountains would do the trick
            I'm not sure what flow rate to use, obviously greater that
            natural flow but at higher rates one runs the risk of sucking
            out trub and/or sediment.  I just stick the tubes into the hose
            VERY tight fit, try finding hose with a smaller inner diameter.

	2)  I'ld second Brian Bliss's comments on yeast population.  
            Qualitatively,  I figure yeast grow exponentially limited
            by the amount of food and alcohol content.  When you pitch
            into starter then a day later into the wort you're introducing
            orders more yeast cells than pitching directly into the wort.
            What have the micro-bio's have to say?

	3)  The problem with cookers indoors (ie: basements) is that
            propane is heavier than air and if you have a leak or incomplete
            combustion, the propane will collect on the floor running the risk
            of explosion (static electric discharge is enough to trigger)
            hence the need to use them outdoors or with an industrial,
            NOT a kitchen ventilation hood.

Finally 4)  Since we've had postings on East and West Coast brew fests
            Fort Collins, Colorado is having its 3rd Annual Colorado
            Brewer's Festival Saturday June 27.  About 20 Colorado
            commercial brewers (over 20 if you count Coors and A.B.)
            will be pouring in the Old Town area, bands and food too.

===============================================================================

	Jeffrey H Copeland                        _______       _______
	Atmospheric Science                             /      /
        Colorado State University                      /______/
        Fort Collins, Colorado                        /      /
        copeland at calypso.atmos.colostate.edu   ______/      /_______

===============================================================================

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Date: Tue, 19 May 92 10:39:39 PDT
From: Mark J. Easter <easterm at ccmail.orst.edu>
Subject: Source for maple syrup

          I've been reading with interest the submissions on brewing
          with maple syrup.  Being a former Vermonter, I've come
          to learn that maple syrup is overpriced in most locations,
          and you don't *have* to brew with the grade A light amber
          that is usually offered in the shiny little tins.  Our local
          food cooperative sells grade A dark amber for about $2.40
          per pound, which is comparable to buying quality malt
          extract or extremely good honey.  I have seen bulk maple
          syrup for sale by the pound for similar prices in many food
          cooperatives and natural food stores.  Check it out!

          Another option is to purchase Canadian maple syrup (from
          Quebec and Ontario).  It is typically less than $2.00 per
          pound and the quality is fine.


          Mark Easter
          easter at ccmail.orst.edu


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Date: Tue, 19 May 92 13:10:19 -0500
From: yoost at judy.indstate.edu
Subject: The post about the Boston Brewing Co.


I am interested in what is going on at The Boston Brewing Co. but the

recent post from someone at MIT I feel like I came in in the middle of

the conversation.  How About a REPOST without ALL the Abreviations.

THANKS.

John Yoost

By the way 

The manager of operations there informs me that the "Foxy Ladys" serving the 

pitchers of beer at the competitions ......

One is Jim Koch's personal secretary and another is a Sales Manager.

See you guys think he hired them for the show !!!!!

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Date: Tue, 19 May 92 13:23:09 EDT
From: mhadwen at ourgang.Prime.COM (Mark Hadwen x4449)
Subject: Homebrewing in France

I have a friend in France who has expressed an interest in
Home Brewing.  Does anyone know of the regulations for Home
Brewing in France?  Where one can get supplies? and if there
are any clubs or organizations for the French Home Brewer?

Mark

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Date: Tue, 19 May 92 17:17:01 EDT
From: dipalma at banshee.sw.stratus.com (James Dipalma)
Subject: Plugs vs. pellets


	I am considering switching from pellets to plugs, and I have a
	couple of questions.
	I have heard that plugs are superior to pellets with regard to
	aromatic qualities, that they are close to whole hops in this
	regard. True or false?
	What is the relative utilization rate of plugs versus pellets?
	I know pellets yield a slightly higher utilization rate than
	whole hops, because they are more resistant to oxidation.
	Where do plugs fit in this picture?

	I'll post a summary of any responses I recieve.

				Jim

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Date: Tue, 19 May 92 18:20:08 edt
From: Greg_Habel at DGC.ceo.dg.com
Subject: Boston Beer Company Law Suit


The following address is for the Boston Beer Company.  If you wish to 
send your gripes regarding Boston Beer Company's sueing of the new 
brew pub in Boston called Boston Beer Works, please do so.  I think 
most of us would agree that a new pub may not survive a law suit by 
BBC. 
                         Boston Beer Company
                          30 Germania Street
                           Boston, MA 02130
                         Attn Nancy Parrillo
 
Now its back to my wheat beer!




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Date: Tue, 19 May 92 16:25:15 MST
From: dwatson at as.arizona.edu (Dan Watson)
Subject: pin vs ball-lock

Greetings fellow Brewophiles!  
Just wanted to say that I enjoy the discussion here very much, and it
is a useful and happy education for me.  I recently was given a soft
drink type Stainless steel keg (Firestone brand), and want to use it
for beer.  I noticed that in the beer equipment catalogs they offer
kegs and hoses with "ball-lock" and "pin-lock" disconnects.  Are the
soft-drink disconnects Pin-lock?  Does anyone have opions on the
relative merits of the two types of disconnects?  Thanks for the info,
and have a cool one on Me.
                                     Dan M. Watson
                                     dwatson at crater.as.arizona.edu

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Date: Tue, 19 May 92 21:45:47 EDT
From: jdg at grex.ann-arbor.mi.us (Josh Grosse)
Subject: Beechwood Fining

In 883, Michael Biondo asked about using Beechwood slats or chips as fining
agents as used by A-B and as Jackson says, it's "an old method still used by
some Bavarian Brewers to clarify beer."

My understanding (from Miller or Papazian, I can't recall) is that the wood
acts as an aid to flocculation.  The yeast clings to the wood and
flocculation is enhanced.  I also understand that metal slats are used in
some breweries because the wood is expensive (in time, materials) to
sanitize than metal.

I can't recall if ionization plays a major role here or not.  Likely, it
does, as us homebrewers use clarifiers like polyclar that are quite
effective as aids to flocculation and settling of yeast cells.

- -----------------------------------------------------------------
Josh Grosse                              jdg at grex.ann-arbor.mi.us


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Date: Tue, 19 May 92 20:11:09 -0700
From: Nick Cuccia <cuccia at eris.berkeley.edu>
Subject: Glass Airlocks...

A perusal through my stack of catalogs shows that glass airlocks can be found
at:

	US Brewing Supply
	815 Madison Ave
	Albany, NY 12208
	+1 800 383 9303
	P/N 7022
	$5.25

	Semplex of USA
	4159 Thomas Av. North
	Minneapolis, MN 55412
	+1 612 522 0500
	$5.98

	The Malt Shop
	3211 N Highway S
	Cascade, WI 53011
	+1 800 235 0026
	P/N T-3
	$6.95

	Barleymalt and Vine
	4 Corey St.
	West Roxbury, MA 02134
	+1 800 66 7026
	P/N 103130
	$6.95

	Great Fermentations of Marin
	87 Larkspur St.
	San Rafael, CA 94901
	+1 415 459 2520
	$6.95

	Bacchus and Barleycorn, Ltd.
	8725 Johnson Drive
	Merriam, KS 66202
	+1 913 262 4243
	P/N 12080
	$6.99

	Wine Hobby USA
	2306 West Newport Pike
	Stanton, DE 19804
	+1 302 998 8303
	$7.50

Hope this helps those of you who are looking for the beasties...

- --Nick

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End of HOMEBREW Digest #885, 05/20/92